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2017 Raiders - how's the 2018 draft looking? (2 Viewers)

I had a feeling they we're going CB. But I really thought they would go with White. And if they were going high risk/high reward, I was hoping they would target Sydney Jones, he was the top rated CB before his injury. Conley is kind of a shocker to me. I thought they would steer clear of him. They must know something the rest of us don't. 

 
joey said:
On 95.7 The Game yesterday, Greg Papa said this about the Raiders draft (paraphrasing of course)

- the Raiders would draft a slot corner at the #24 pick. 

- he's heard all the talk about ILB but thinks that Reggie believes he can find LB talent for cheaper than that. 

Papa's guess is probably as good as anyone's but, since he's the "voice of the Raiders", I thought I'd mention it here. Maybe his instincts from being around the team so much will prove him right. 

Personally, I want an explosive DT or ILB in the 1st but I guess I should trust this dude named Reggie who seems to know a thing or two about football...
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Papa nailed the position we drafted. 

but I can't say I'm psyched to take a dude with any questions surrounding him in the 1st round. 

 
Chadstroma said:
At what point do we look to move up to high 2nd to get Foster? Even with medical questions.... it is similar to last year with Jaylon Smith and Myles Jack, no? I would be more concerned with their medicals than Foster. Seems like a guy like him who falls for medical will go early 2nd. Do we make that move? Would go a long way to filling another hole of two on D.
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dafuk?

 
So apparently he rape allegation came from Conley asking the girl if she wanted to be part of a foursome, she declined but said she'd watch, and the witnesses are the other participants in the foursome?

I mean, wow.

As I understand it the cops had administered a rape kit and will have results Monday. We won't know if Conley is innocent or not until the full investigation is complete but there is already inconsistency in the accusers story.

Apparently it her report to police she said she first met Conley in an elevator, but video evidence shows her interacting with Conley at the club they were at prior. 

This doesn't prove anything about Conley's guilt or innocence. But her story starts with an inconsistency, and seems like the witnesses were in a position (ahem) to give credible testimony.

ETA: source http://www.12up.com/posts/4923885-footage-of-gareon-conley-at-bar-seems-to-contradict-cleveland-police-report

 
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Stompin' Tom Connors said:
This kind of scouting makes me feel slightly better.

http://www.elevenwarriors.com/ohio-state-football/2017/04/81788/making-the-case-that-gareon-conley-not-marshon-lattimore-is-the-top-cornerback-in-the-2017-nfl-draft
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So I wasn't in much of a position to post in detail last night, but this is the sentiment I wanted to bring.  I am a raging Buckeye fan and most of us believe this to be true, that Conley is actually going to be the better of the two.  He was a beast at times.  He plays all over the field and there was no one he couldn't cover.  Small/quick/twitch, big boys, zone, slot, press - it didn't matter, he was never getting beaten.  I like Lattimore a lot too, but the point is that Conley at 24 is theft.  Top 10 talent we just stole.  I'm not sure it was much of an actual need but that's for the coaches to figure out.  You need 3 CB in this league these days, and this will improve our CB2,CB3, and CB4 all at the same time.  Maybe Smith can play safety too, which would give us a lot of options.  God I love this pick.

 
Some guys I would like to see considered if they are there for Raiders pick:

Budda Baker

Malik McDowell

Zach Cunningham

Raekwon McMillan

 
You need three CBs. Whoever was playing slot was killing us for years. 

Foster would have made the fans happy, but has medical concerns, like most Alabama players.  

I could see a safety or tackle for us in this round, just looking at players available.  LB would be sweet, but I'm not interested in reaching for one.

 
Stompin' Tom Connors said:
So apparently he rape allegation came from Conley asking the girl if she wanted to be part of a foursome, she declined but said she'd watch, and the witnesses are the other participants in the foursome?

I mean, wow.

As I understand it the cops had administered a rape kit and will have results Monday. We won't know if Conley is innocent or not until the full investigation is complete but there is already inconsistency in the accusers story.

Apparently it her report to police she said she first met Conley in an elevator, but video evidence shows her interacting with Conley at the club they were at prior. 

This doesn't prove anything about Conley's guilt or innocence. But her story starts with an inconsistency, and seems like the witnesses were in a position (ahem) to give credible testimony.

ETA: source http://www.12up.com/posts/4923885-footage-of-gareon-conley-at-bar-seems-to-contradict-cleveland-police-report
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Taking BPA for the D was the absolute correct move by Reggie.  I am a little uneasy about Conley but Reggie knows more than any of us about this kid.  Reggie would not take a chance on a troubled player in the first round of the draft.  I hope this kid has learned a valuable lesson going through this and keeps far away from trouble in the future. 

 
My biggest concern with Conley was the rape allegation but the more I read into it then it is becoming more clear why the Raiders felt comfortable pulling the trigger. 

My other concern was not really a concern but a misconception on my part. He didn't seem to me like a slot kind of guy and Amerson and Smith certainly are not. However, doing more reading on him in scouting reports and his history at OSU- it is clear that he certainly can and has played the slot. In fact, he seems to be a Swiss Army knife kind of CB. Whatever the job is- he will do it. Which makes me like his long term value even more. He can easily take on the outside role as years move on or Smith/Amerson falter but then he also seems like the kind of CB who will make that later career move from CB to S and add another few years of value. 

The more I read up the more I love this pick. 

In Reggie we trust. 

 
Faust said:
Raiders GM 'comfortable' with drafting Gareon Conley
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If you want a positive "In Reggie We Trust" vibe, you'll find this quote in the above article. After talking about all the due diligence the Raiders went through and that they feel very comfortable with this pick, Reggie said:

"I haven't spoken to a lot of my peers, but that doesn't matter," McKenzie said. "The people who know me know that I'm a man of character. I have two daughters. I have two sons too ... I want the truth. I want the truth to show itself."

Love me some Reggie.

 
Best CB in the draft.  Better than Lattimore and he went 11.  Hell of a pick at 24 and the timidness of teams unwilling to take a risk bites them in the ### more often than not.  Yes, Hayden was a bit of a miss (not entirely useless but expected much more).  If the Raiders end up with a Talib type player, it's worth the miss on Hayden.  If first round picks are a nearly 50% proposition anyways, do you want to gamble on the 50% chance of a star or 50% chance of a role player?  Foster would have been nasty too, but 3 red flags vs 1 large orangeish flag...  I think Reggie nailed it.  BPA for a very big need and fits the scheme nearly perfectly.

Agree with MR's post an hour ago about the slot being the Achilles' heel last year.  Weak at LB?  Sure, but with this offense teams were not going to keep up by running it up the middle.  They exploited the weak link in our pass D and for as ordinary as Smith and Amerson played, whoever was in the slot was the automatic target.  Joseph with a year of experience and the addition of the Con Man in the slot will go a LONG ways for this D.  

If they manage to score an edge rusher and ILB in this draft as well, this will be a supremely well-rounded team.  I'd prefer an OT to ILB in order to help keep the O clicking, healthy and the D rested, but I LOVE the position this team is in and can really go for BPA from literally ANY position on O or D.  As often as teams will be passing to try to keep pace, ILB will likely only be on the field about 30-40% of the time anyways.

 
LawFitz said:
Really hope this guy falls to the Raiders in Rd 3 tonight:

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2017/profiles/dalvin-tomlinson?id=2557846
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Didn't realize his intelligence and the story. 

Tomlinson is no typical SEC defensive lineman. He could have gone to Harvard based on his academic abilities, but chose Alabama as a four-star recruit because of their success on the gridiron. Both of his parents have passed away, and is motivated by the words and action of his mother on a daily basis. Tomlinson was a three-time heavyweight wrestling champion in high school, and was a goalie on the soccer team. He tore his ACL playing soccer in his senior year, though, and had to redshirt his first year in Tuscaloosa. Finally on the field in 2013, he tore his other ACL in his only game (four tackles). Tomlinson played end in 14 games as a reserve in 2014 (22 tackles, 5.5 for loss, two sacks) and as the top back-up for the 2015 national champions (34 tackles, six pass breakups). He had his best season statistically for the Tide as a senior (62 stops, 5.5 TFL, three sacks, four PBU) as Nick Saban used him inside and outside on the team's multiple-look defense.

 
 
 
OVERVIEW


Obi Melifonwu (pronounced OH-bee mel-un-FON-woo) has been a four-year starter at UConn. The Massachusetts area high school star redshirted his first year with the Huskies, and became the team's starting free safety in 2013 (70 tackles, three tackles for loss, two interceptions, five pass breakups, two forced fumbles). He started 11 games the next season (75 stops, 3.5 TFL, three PBU), and 12 as a junior (88 tackles, two TFL, two INT, five PBU). Melifonwu was a first-team All-American Athletic Conference selection and his team's top tackler in 2016, making 118 hits, 2.5 for loss, leading the team with four interceptions and breaking up three other passes.


ANALYSIS



STRENGTHS

 Elite size with premium athletic traits that should show up at combine testing. Four-year starter. Sharp focus when ball is in the air. Takes path to the ball with undercut of the route at the last second. Plus hand-eye coordination to flip the field with interceptions. Former cornerback who has the athleticism to cover matchup tight ends and some big slots. Posted six interceptions over last two seasons. Uses big frame to body-up seam-runners and constrict their windows. Downhill tackling machine. Plus range with a wide net to bring runners down once he gets his arms into them. Body-up hitter. Drastically reduced penalties totals over junior and senior season.

WEAKNESSES

 Leggy and gets feet bundled up when asked to turn and sprint. Lacks desired instincts and will play with slow eyes at times. Has to see ball in the air before charging over to help on deep throws. Inconsistent with coverage responsibilities from high safety. Takes time to diagnose play-action. Rub routes found him near goal line. Can take inefficient paths to the ball that get him there a step too late. Would benefit from high-pointing rather than waiting on throws.

DRAFT PROJECTION

 Round 2

SOURCES TELL US

 "He's a freak. He's going to blow away the combine. He's fast and will post some of the best vertical and broad numbers at his position. He's going to get a lot better in the pros and he has that elite size that will get him overdrafted." -- AFC Pro Personnel Director

NFL COMPARISON

 George Iloka

BOTTOM LINE

 Big and athletic, he may lack the coverage qualities and instincts needed to work as a "last line of defense" player in a pass-happy division. Melifonwu is an effective downhill tackler who has the ability to match up against tight ends and make a living near the line of scrimmage. His football instincts aren't up to par, but the size and traits will be extremely enticing for teams who covet traits first.
 
Zach Cunningham was Right. There. 

Not sure I fully understand going safety in that situation.

ETA: at least not as baffling as what the Chiefs are doing in the draft so far 

 
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Stompin' Tom Connors said:
Zach Cunningham was Right. There. 

Not sure I fully understand going safety in that situation.

ETA: at least not as baffling as what the Chiefs are doing in the draft so far 
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Melifonwu could easily drop down and fill the same role Cunningham would have, he's the same size and twice the athlete.

 
2016. The 24th worst pass defense in the league. Gave up 8 yards per pass, tied for the worst. They (Smith) gave up the longest pass play of the season to Brandon Cooks, who by the way, we'll be seeing again this year in Mexico. The weakness of this team is pretty obvious. If Smith or Amerson goes down with injury, you want Antonio Hamilton or TJ Carrie out there? Because that's the extent of their depth pretty much. Shoring up the back end of the defense had to be the focus.

 
I like Jaleel Johnson DL Iowa in the third if still available.

For linebackers I like Anthony Walker jr., Kendall Beckwith, Duke Riley, and Alex Anzelone.

If looking at OT Julian Davenport, Dion Dawkins, Roderick Johnson.

 
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krsone21 said:
I like Jaleel Johnson DL Iowa in the third if still available.

For linebackers I like Anthony Walker jr., Kendall Beckwith, and Duke Riley.
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Would have liked Cunningham over the S, but I like the pick.  They need LBs badly.

Duke Riley  :thumbup:

 
Three guys I was hoping would fall to us in the 3rd for LB are gone. Anazalone, Riley and Williams. Not seeing a LB here now. DT? Jaleel Johnson?

 
Hankmoody said:
Melifonwu could easily drop down and fill the same role Cunningham would have, he's the same size and twice the athlete.
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I don't agree with the line of thinking that Obi could potentially help in a Mike spot or outside the way an actual linebacker like Cunningham can. Sounds like unrealistic justification.

Look, we can use an athletic freak in the middle backfield, you can't have too weak or deep of a secondary, and Obi still fills a need. 

But nowhere near the need a guy like Cunningham can fill for us. I guess I would have taken the combination of skill, need, and BPA at that spot without hesitation than a guy who is a bit more of a development project than Cunningham is.

Don't get me wrong, I don't hate the pick or the player, and any pick isn't going to make or break a draft or a team. 

But for me Cunningham was a no brainer there for us, and feel the drop off between him and the next group of LBs is steeper than the drop between Obi and the next group of dbacks.

 
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Rated as a five-star recruit from Auburn, California, Vanderdoes started his career with the Bruins like gangbusters. He played all 13 games, starting seven, in his first year at Westwood, garnering honorable mention All-Pac-12 and Freshman All-American honors (39 tackles, 4.5 for loss). Vanderdoes was an honorable mention pick again in 2014, starting 12 times and racking up 50 tackles, 5.5 for loss and two sacks. He was off to a great start as a junior, making eight tackles, two for loss, in the opener but suffered a torn left ACL during the game and had to redshirt. Vanderdoes returned to start 12 times in 2016, earning honorable mention All-Pac-12 recognition for the third time in his career (28 stops, 1.5 behind the line of scrimmage).


ANALYSIS



STRENGTHS

 His lone 2015 contest (vs. Virginia) showed off his enormous talent. His body type belies his surprising athleticism. Solid functional lateral movement and change of direction. Able to spin out of blocks with quick feet. Gives good chase along backside. Booming power in his hands to tilt rep in his favor after initial punch. Explodes hips into contact to dislodge blockers Has strength and ability to play nose tackle or three-technique. Can two-gap. Gets inside arm under and rag dolls move blocks to challenge cutback lanes. Grows roots against double teams and fights to split them rather than trying to survive. Brings toughness and edge to the workplace. Better rush potential than numbers indicate. Has strength to walk interior linemen back in the pocket.

WEAKNESSES

 Missed almost entire 2015 season with torn ACL and he didn't seem to bounce all the way back in 2016. Carries weight poorly in his upper body and especially midsection. Came into season with additional weight. Needs to eliminate 15-20 pounds to play at an optimal level. A little slow in reaction time off snap. Gets behind against move blocks and will often play from backside rather than play-side. Pad level rises after initial stages of rep. Needs to improve conditioning. Has to keep weight down and get full mobility back. Despite his ability, sack production has lagged behind.

DRAFT PROJECTION

 Rounds 3-4

SOURCES TELL US

 "He was a big-time recruit and he really looked the part in 2014 and in the one game he played in 2015. He flashed this year but he just wasn't the same guy. I want to project him as a healthy player but if he keeps playing this heavy we may never see the same player from before even if he is fully healthy." - AFC west coast scout

NFL COMPARISON

 Ahtyba Rubin

BOTTOM LINE

 Any evaluation of Vanderdoes is incomplete until studying 2014 and the Virginia game of 2015, but balancing that tape against his 2016 body of work will be the challenge. He's athletic and powerful, but his weight and health of his knee could be a concern. He has the talent to become a disruptive, productive starter if his body bounces back to his earlier form. If not, he's still a solid rotational defensive tackle.
 
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