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2021 BTSW (RIP) Summer of Love Discussion Thread..... (1 Viewer)

renesauz said:
Had L Murray high on my pre-draft list
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with Kamara on board...he fulfills a couple purposes...I only had three....backup RB's starting go...and he is a top one....gotta protect the #2 pick when you can in best ball and if it makes sense...especially one that has some stand alone value on occasion....other directions I wanted to go....but I would have been an idiot not to pull the trigger there...he wasn't making it back..

 
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FYI...I'll try to pre-draft, but will be hiking/backpacking Friday-Monday with limited service.  I've asked Ref to fill in for me as needed.

 
13.13 Denver D

14.02 Cleveland D

I actually preferred the Browns over the Broncos, but the Broncos start NYG, JAX, and NYJ.  Tampa starts Dallas, ATL, and LAR and I was concerned about those being high scoring games.  Denver and Tampa get the NFC Least, Cleveland draws the NFC Central.  Between the 3 of them, they face a lot of cupcakes.  Of course this usually never works as planned in hindsight as defense production fluctuates so much year to year.   I should be set here and end up with an advantage over 3/4s of the field at this position.

 
BassNBrew said:
13.13 Denver D

14.02 Cleveland D

I actually preferred the Browns over the Broncos, but the Broncos start NYG, JAX, and NYJ.  Tampa starts Dallas, ATL, and LAR and I was concerned about those being high scoring games.  Denver and Tampa get the NFC Least, Cleveland draws the NFC Central.  Between the 3 of them, they face a lot of cupcakes.  Of course this usually never works as planned in hindsight as defense production fluctuates so much year to year.   I should be set here and end up with an advantage over 3/4s of the field at this position.
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:shrug: I guessing around 2-3pts per week!

 
Had several targets at the last two picks and was really excited to add Jamaal Williams at RB48, I started out fairly strong there with D. Henry, Akers and Chris Carson in the first three rounds, so I ignored the RB position for a while and feel like I got bargains in James Conner at RB42 and Jam Williams now. Should be some flex play within this RB group.

I was hoping to add a third TE at 14.6 with only Hunter Henry and Trautman on board, but all my targets here (Gronk and Hooper before my Williams pick) and Ebron after, so I zagged over to DST. The scoring remains kind of high for the defenses and with nine already gone, I was still able to grab the Patriots who seem valuable here. With @BassNBrewforcing the pace on DST selections with three straight in rounds 12, 13 & 14, I expect a serious run here before my next pick and you really need quality defenses in this scoring system where you can flex. I think @BassNBrewwill definitely gain points on the field here and probably a bit more than the three projected by @OldMilwaukee.

Hoping that we can get in a couple more rounds before the weekend, where we really slow down and especially the upcoming one which will provide many with a three day weekend. With retirement, all my weekends are four day ones, so no biggie for me.

 
OldMilwaukee said:
:shrug: I guessing around 2-3pts per week!
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Maybe.  Looking at last year (excluding flex) Denver only added 2 points over Tampa/Clev and Clev added 19 points over Tampa/Denver.  I sure people with 3 middle of the road Ds saw better results.  As a group they posted 12 double digit scores and 7 double digit flex scores.  Looking back at last year I had a lot of single digit flex scores in the 2 flex leagues.  I'm having a hard time putting exact numbers on this.

 
91+ degrees in the shade here in the Poconos today......wave supposed to break later this evening around 8pm. We'll see. Said the same yesterday and it didn't happen. I moved north in Feb 2020 to get away from the freakin heat.....sheesh

 
Ruffrodys05 said:
91+ degrees in the shade here in the Poconos today......wave supposed to break later this evening around 8pm. We'll see. Said the same yesterday and it didn't happen. I moved north in Feb 2020 to get away from the freakin heat.....sheesh
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It's always been like that in the summer in that area.

 
Thankful to get Darnold at QB27 as my second behind Brady. I am rather heavily invested in him in these survivors. So I guess I need to ask, am I the only one that sees him as a steady floor player with potential to score six weeks or so in best ball?

 
just an fyi....we don't have a clock and we really aren't in any type of hurry....my thoughts are that after today and starting tomorrow (Friday) I am fine with kind of unofficially suspending the draft until Tuesday morning.....no pressure to make picks, no pressure to really even check in over the weekend....if you do, you do, and if you are up and want to pick, thats fine, if you don't and want to wait till Tuesday, that is fine too....so if somebody is on the clock for three days, so be it....enjoy the weekend boys..... :banned: :suds: :hifive: :drive: :pickle:

 
5.02    Dak Prescott DAL QB4 (7)
9.02    Trevor Lawrence JAC QB14 (7)
14.12   Ryan Fitzpatrick WAS QB26 (9)    

1.02    Alvin Kamara NOS RB2 (6)
3.02    Clyde Edwards-Helaire  KCC RB15 (12)
8.12    Gus Edwards BAL RB34 (8)
13.02   Latavius Murray  NOS RB47 (6)    

2.12    Michael Thomas NOS WR9  (6)
4.12    Robert Woods LAR WR19 (11)
7.02    Courtland Sutton DEN WR35 (11)
10.12  Marvin Jones JAC WR54 (7)
15.02  Terrace Marshall CAR WR69 (13)
    
6.12    Tyler Higbee LAR TE9 (11)    
11.02   Jonnu Smith NEP TE16    (14)
    
12.12    Washington WAS DST3 (9)

12.12     Washington WAS DST3 (9)
Wanted to get at least one top unit.  These guys are pretty nasty. Only other sniff here was Murray, I was taking him at this turn no matter what and with nittany’s stable of RB’s I felt he wouldn’t take Murray but he might take a DST and I wanted WAS. Round Twelve: so ryheaps gets the finger as I was planning on taking Everett in this draft, so I liked that pick, I also liked the Hardman and Davis picks at WR61/62.  I’m not a Tua fan but I can see why he went there, IMO I like Fitz better.  

13.02    Latavius Murray  NOS RB47 (6)    
No brainer as I mentioned above.  Thrilled he made it to this turn. No other real sniffs, but if Murray didn’t make it here I would have looked at another DST or Fitz.  Round 13: nothing really sticks out, I liked the G. Davis pick.

14.12 Ryan Fitzpatrick WAS QB26 (9)
So I may be out of my tree, but feels like he should have gone before QB26.  I think some still have a hangover from his recent “situations”.  This feels different to me, feels like he is the guy. There is no rookie here that the team is waiting to get on the field. He is not coming in half way through the season on his white horse.  I kept taking a look at him as the draft kept moving along and almost pulled the trigger earlier as I felt like some of the “stud QB early guys” that only had one on their roster were waiting like lions in the weeds and were going to pounce on him as he seemed like he would have been a perfect compliment/QB2 to some of you.  Again, maybe I am out of my tree, but I like him over several QB’s taken ahead of him and really kind of surprised he made it this far and somebody didn’t pounce. Plus he covers my other two QB's who share a week 7 bye.  Lot of upside/big games which you kind of want in this format from your QB2.  I guess the only real issue is that WAS defense may be so good, that he won’t need to “go big” , but either way, he should still have his moments. With 24 roster spots I am fine with burning a pick on a third QB, nittany had plenty of chances and kept passing, and it felt like I would be gift wrapping Fitz for him if I didn’t pull the trigger here.  Maybe he still would passed, cause he didn’t take one. Like Bass mentioned to me, it’s starting to get to where if you don’t have a backup, you may now have to take two to guarantee you have one. Round 14: Liked the Sanders and Ertz picks, especially if Ertz gets traded, that could be a steal. 

15.02      Terrace Marshall CAR WR69 (13)
Should play immediately with some upside.  Could score a few times for me. Thought I’d take a chance instead of some safer options. I took a big ol sniff of Mattison here and maybe should have gone that direction so in Round 15: I liked the Mattison pick. 
:banned:

 
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Stinkin Ref said:
just an fyi....we don't have a clock and we really aren't in any type of hurry....my thoughts are that after today and starting tomorrow (Friday) I am fine with kind of unofficially suspending the draft until Tuesday morning.....no pressure to make picks, no pressure to really even check in over the weekend....if you do, you do, and if you are up and want to pick, thats fine, if you don't and want to wait till Tuesday, that is fine too....so if somebody is on the clock for three days, so be it....enjoy the weekend boys..... :banned: :suds: :hifive: :drive: :pickle:
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We might as well just stop it here, at the start of round 16.    We will see you all Tuesday!

 
My curiosity as to why @OldMilwaukeemade only one pick at the turn is now satisfied.

hope that everyone enjoys their weekend holiday.

I hope that I do not forget my short list between now and then.

 
rzrback77 said:
Thankful to get Darnold at QB27 as my second behind Brady. I am rather heavily invested in him in these survivors. So I guess I need to ask, am I the only one that sees him as a steady floor player with potential to score six weeks or so in best ball?
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No, you are not. Considered him as my QB3, just decided on a tangent instead.

 
OldMilwaukee said:
We might as well just stop it here, at the start of round 16.    We will see you all Tuesday!
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rzrback77 said:
My curiosity as to why @OldMilwaukeemade only one pick at the turn is now satisfied.

hope that everyone enjoys their weekend holiday.

I hope that I do not forget my short list between now and then.
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For the sake of aesthetics, I was hoping we'd make it back to me, and I'd make this call. End of Round 16 is the 2/3 mark of the Draft. Struck me as an appropriate time for a holiday weekend pause.

@OldMilwaukee, if you come back and change your mind, I'm firmly committed to pausing things after I make the 16.13.

 
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Going into (and coming out of) the 10/11 turn (Pollard/Rondale) I was feeling sky high. Initial plan was to land QB/TE or TE/TE next go-round, unless something juicy slipped through the gauntlet of skilled drafters. After waiting on TE until 8/9 and landing Irv as my TE1 (TE13, last starter), felt I had gambled well there. In the ensuing 9/10, only Tonyan and JCook were selected, so I guess it made sense that another grouping might eventually go, but I had several targets to choose from that I thought might make it back. Also several QB2's I liked were still floating around. Only Lance (+) and Tua (-) went before it got back to me, so in theory, I felt in a good place. DIdn't fret Jonnu/Henry/Kmet in the 11th, but the 12th Round got me, as Jarwin, Trautman and Everett were taken. Did not expect Ryheaps to take Everett as his TE3 at 12.10. That left only 1 guy (Hurst) in my tier group, so taking him was somewhat forced, but at least I got one of 'my guys'. Had Everett/Troutman been available there, I would have skipped QB and doubled at TE from the Everett/Trautman/Hurst group. I'm of the mind that Pitts replaces Julio, and Hurst will have a big role as the traditional TE in Atl. Also in 11/12 the Defenses started to go off the board, so now I had another dilemma: take my QB2 from the sub-optimal remaining group, or get a premium D before having to wait 22 picks. With Ref taking the WFT D at 12.12, I gambled that taking my top remaining D (Colts) at 13.01 might stimulate a run. Of course that left Latavius for Ref (Kamara), but I'd already gotten my top player in that tier earlier (Pollard), so I couldn't afford the luxury. Handed him a great pick. Well, a minor D run did happen, but it petered out at 14.06. I didn't mind Goff/ZWilson/DJones going, as the QB's I preferred  were sliding, but Slob taking Wilson as his QB3 made me nervous that others might go that route, and me sticking out like a sore thumb on the end with only 1 to that point. Crippler did the same (3rd QB, Jones). Then Ref took Fitz as his 3rd at 14.12, which took away one of my QB plans. Hmm, what to do...

If I don't go QB at 14/15, the target on my back is going to start flashing like a siren. Also, Holloway and Bass, each with only 1 QB to that point, were going to pick twice, and 3 guys had taken QB 3, and more might do the same. On the flipside, the QB pickings were pretty slim, while a lot of juice at the other positions remained, and no one had taken a Kicker yet, so that had to start sometime. 24 Rounds allows for some unconventional builds. Had Fitz come my way, I had a plan that I'll get into later. That left Darnold, Winston and Fields. The appeal of Darnold was that I had McCaffrey, and I would have gone Darnold/Terrance Marshall for the stack, but thought I might land that later, because I'm the only one that might find upside in Darnold, and thought Winston and Fields were more attractive to Holloway and Bass and no one would take Darnold as QB3. Well, Holloway took Darnold as his QB2 and Bass took Winston as his QB2. I had pondered Winston at 14/15, with a plan I'll get into later. That left Fields, who Holloway took on the way back as his QB3. On to plan D.

Meanwhile, what to do at 14/15...certainly didn't expect to see 49'ers D there, and that said 'value', and if I'd known I could land them there, I'd have passed on Colts previously, and not written over half of this. I've been scooping up Gio Bernard everywhere since he landed in Tampa, and just had to have him, despite some other attractive options. I think he's going to finish 2021 as the Bucs RB1. Of course, that cost me Darnold, Winston and Fields, but like I said: 'Plan D'. It's coming.

Closed out Round 16 with Chuba Hubbard as McCaffrey insurance, after seeing what Mike Davis was able to do last year when McC got hurt. When we resume, Plan D will go into effect.

It's been a zany last 4 Rounds for me. You guys made some nice picks along the way.

11th: love the pairing of Lance with Lamar Jackson. Although Pollard was at the top of my RB4-type tier, Darrell Henderson and Nyheim Hines are solid in that grouping.

12th: value TE's Jarwin, Trautman, Everett and Gronk.

13th: Lat Murray, Bateman, Hooper, Jamaal, Dillon.

14th: Defenses, Emmanuel Sanders, John Brown, who I think could be Raiders WR1, Ertz, Fitzmagic

15th: Defenses (deep position this year, looks like), Marshall...and Darnold and Winston if they're right in the head.

16th: Demarcus Robinson, Gainwell, James White, and Tyrell Williams - Lions WR1 as WR72!

Have a great Independence Day weekend, everyone!

 
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These larger round drafts feel a lot more like playing poker as you seem to have to take greater risks to get any value. I was planning to take three QBs, but definitely wanted to get the back-ups late. With this plan, I was resigned to Darnold being one of the guys and I thought that I had waited too long.

I will say that the gambling risk is easier in the middle of the draft than at the end where you have to wait for twenty-four picks between your draft selections. I might not wait quite as late if I were on the turns. But I definitely understand all the commentary provided above by @nittanylion.

Thankful that I was able to get two of my targets very late and just a wee bit sorry for you being forced into Plan D. Best of luck going forward friend.

 
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OldMilwaukee said:
@nittanylion
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I don't mind picking, and will do so now, but from the posts above, I thought we were picking back up on Tuesday?

Any of you fellas competing in the Scott Fish Bowl? Drafts started this morning. I randomly lucked into the 1.01 there, too.

https://scottfishbowl.com/2021/rules.php

Season-long Best Ball

Super Flex (QB has the most bizzare scoring rules I've ever seen, yet they still command a premium)

PPR/TE Premium (.5 per, TE gets 1 per)

Points Per 1st Down (.5 per, TE gets 1 per)

No D/ST

12-Team Leagues with serpentine Drafts, yet they are implementing 3rd-Round Reversal, which, IMHO, serves no purpose.

22 Rounds, 11 Starters 1/2/3/1/0* - 7 Starters + 4 Flex (max 2 QB, all other positions can max flex (so, yes, 6RB or 7WR or 4TE. You don't have to start a PK, but you can start up to 4)

Bottom Line: I love being involved in this, but I'd be hard pressed to play in a League like this if there was an entry fee involved - it's like Scott and his crew opened the Motherlode of Scoring/Lineup/Draft options and ran amok. There are way too many variables for luck not to play a major role in determining the outcome.

 
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nittanylion said:
I don't mind picking, and will do so now, but from the posts above, I thought we were picking back up on Tuesday?

Any of you fellas competing in the Scott Fish Bowl? Drafts started this morning. I randomly lucked into the 1.01 there, too.

https://scottfishbowl.com/2021/rules.php

Season-long Best Ball

SupUgger Flex (QB has the most bizzare scoring rules I've ever seen, yet they still command a premium)

PPR/TE Premium (.5 per, TE gets 1 per)

Points Per 1st Down

No D/ST

12-Team Leagues with serpentine Drafts, yet they are implementing 3rd-Round Reversal, which, IMHO, serves no purpose.

22 Rounds, 11 Starters 1/2/3/1/0* - 7 Starters + 4 Flex (max 2 QB, all other positions can max flex (so, yes, 6RB or 7WR or 4TE. You don't have to start a PK, but you can start up to 4)

Bottom Line: I love being involved in this, but I'd be hard pressed to play in a League like this if there was an entry fee involved - it's like Scott and his crew opened the Motherlode of Scoring/Lineup/Draft options and ran amok. There are way too many variables for luck not to play a major role in determining the outcome.
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Ugg.....my bad.    Working today and it put me off.   Wait until tomorrow.......

I have a 1.04 in SFB.... still waiting to pick.

 
@Stinkin Ref, would you consider turning the timer on? Since the Independence Day Weekend Vacation, momentum has seemed to me to have fallen off, at least it seems that way to me. We're 3 weeks in, and folks are spending hours away from the Draft Board between picks. I'm could be in the minority, but I'd like it if we picked up the pace and knocked this thing out ASAP. Just a suggestion. Thanks!

 
nittanylion said:
@Stinkin Ref, would you consider turning the timer on? Since the Independence Day Weekend Vacation, momentum has seemed to me to have fallen off, at least it seems that way to me. We're 3 weeks in, and folks are spending hours away from the Draft Board between picks. I'm could be in the minority, but I'd like it if we picked up the pace and knocked this thing out ASAP. Just a suggestion. Thanks!
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I feel you....but I think there have really only been a couple speed bumps by repeat offenders....hopefully they know who they are with the nudges they have been given in here, etc.....like I just nudged @renesauz via text ( i know his job can be tough for these)....with 24 roster spots I know many have formulated draft plans for these later rounds and targets that seem irrelevant at the time, may be part of some master plan so my gut is leaning toward just riding it out.....hate to implement a clock now when decisions are being made about possible QB backups or third or 4th QB's or defenses/kickers etc....a missed pick could see a bunch of picks go off and derail a master plan in this super competitive high dollar money league...lol...hopefully we are in no real hurry right now, and those holding things up will make an effort to be better moving forward.....this is one of the reason I tried to make signing up for the OTC text notifications a requirement in some I threw together last year....all solid dudes here...lets just keep rollin the best we can..... :drive: :banned:

 
Last 3rd, final leg of the Draft (Rounds 17-24) Marathon.

Led off with a big swing. Ball will be traveling for a bit before we find out if it's a long out, or a home run. Watson as my QB2, having waited too long to address the position since going big early with Murray. I think a suspension is likely inevitable...but for how long? Compounded by his utterances that he's played his last down in Houston. Not an answer at this time, but rather a speculative piece to contingency build that might amount to nothing, but a swing I felt compelled to take, all things considered. Now, we wait...

Well, the expected Kicker run ensued (9 of the next 24 picks), along with 4 more D/ST, along with 11 position Players, none of which were targets, so there was that. Felt fortunate to land Prater (ranked PK8/selected as PK13), who I'd targeted, as I'm somewhat a fan of pairing a premier QB with his PK. I hadn't expected Taysom Hill to make it back, however. One of my QB plans was Winston/Hill, but Bass foiled that in Round 15, and I fully expected him to snap up Hill in 17/18. Most, including me, expect Winston to win that job, but regardless, Hill will play weekly and generate something, and I need that guaranteed 'in case of emergency, break glass' production, no matter how small. When Hill did play, he was reasonably productive/efficient, enough to offer some hope. Hope that Kyler Murray doesn't miss a snap, and Watson actually plays. How about that?

Another 24 picks that didn't affect my target list, but still a conundrum at 20/21: there were couple of juicy RB's inexplicably (to me, at least) still hanging around, but I already had 6 (although maybe Hubbard would only count as one-half). Also, I hadn't taken a WR since 11.01 (Rondale Moore at WR55) and I only had 5, which is pretty indefensible, and the next to go would be WR86...my WR1 is 4.13 Kupp (WR20). Kinda weak. Preferred Woods, but was sniped at 4.12 by SR. Decided to play defense and acquire some Kupp insurance by doubling up with Van Jefferson/DeSean Jackson. I'm absolutely infatuated with the McVay/Stafford dynamic. It's a spray-and-pray shotgun stack approach, and doesn't include Woods/Higbee. Littered with risk, but I didnt' have many other palatable outs. Light 'em up, Matty!

I would have been hard-pressed to pass on Malcolm Brown and Damien Williams (the juicy RB's mentioned above) had they fallen back into my lap at 22/23, but Holloway and ruffrodys proved savvy. Such great late-round potential value! While I personally like my TE's (Irv/Hurst), unless I'm right about them, it's one of the League's weaker groups. I'd been eyeing Noah Gray, the Chiefs rookie who's been getting some buzz during OTA's. Nothing but upside, right?!! Grabbed 2nd PK, Folk. Hope he makes the Team, and makes some FG. Mr. Irrelevant? Almost threw up in my mouth, selecting Tyrod Taylor, but with 24 picks you have some margin to work within.

Murray/Watson/TayHill/TyTaylor

McCaffrey/Dobbins/NHarris/Pollard/Bernard/Hubbard

Kupp/Chark/Boyd/AntBrown/RMoore/DSJackson/VJefferson

Irv/Hurst/Gray

Prater/Folk Colts/49'ers

Like the build, but the bottom line is, if Kyler Murray goes down, I'd need multiple miracles to see it come to fruition. Good Luck, fellas!

 
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My team

QB. Ryan, Goff, Jones. I like this trio for really waiting. Ryan is dependable and think the other 2 can give me weeks. I would have taken Lock. And unlike Johnny, I think the Rams made a huge mistake and will be about the same. Detroit made out getting young QB and 2 1st. I think Detroit will work around Goffs strengths. Jones has pretty nice weapons

RB. It is ugly. Zek is stud and target in any draft at value. Love the off season. Etienne. Who knows but he will get receptions. White could spell him occasionally. I think Kerryon has great talent but are the injuries going to derail. He was target from start. Read article that Deejay could be that surprise guy and Carson never picture of health. Only need 2 per week

WR. To my ugly, goes the opposite. This group is high upside with lots of guys who can have big games in any week. All starters but Marquez who still has Rodgers. Not much to say here. It is the strength of team

TE. Not great but it should be solid. With only .25 per TE extra was not a huge focus like WR. Here is hoping Njoku gets traded as what I expect to happen. Or he might only give me one week

pK. I got 2 that should have jobs barring injury. Should have waited to get McPherson though in 24th round. Not sure much changes though. Only Malcolm Brown was a thought

D. This is where hay can be grown and ripen the profits. Why 3. They score fairly well first of all and rather them as flex than any RB outside top 25. With 3, 2 probably score each week and wanted solid ones.expect all 3 to be top 21

some Context #21 D > #31 RB last year, #54 WR, #17 TE, #4 PK. We start 2-3-1 and 3 flex. That is 26-39-13. Leaves 39 more starters  and only count 24 better

 
Crippler said:
D. This is where hay can be grown and ripen the profits. Why 3. They score fairly well first of all and rather them as flex than any RB outside top 25. With 3, 2 probably score each week and wanted solid ones.expect all 3 to be top 21

some Context #21 D > #31 RB last year, #54 WR, #17 TE, #4 PK. We start 2-3-1 and 3 flex. That is 26-39-13. Leaves 39 more starters  and only count 24 better
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Really surprised that only 3 of us went this route and that 4 defenses went un-drafted.

 
BassNBrew said:
Really surprised that only 3 of us went this route and that 4 defenses went un-drafted.
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Towards the end of the draft I was beginning to wonder if I might miss out on a second defense....turns out I needn't worry. When I looked at the scoring rules prior to the draft I didn't see anything that would indicate defenses would be overly attractive even with the flex option. Maybe my team will benefit from the flex option at D for a couple of weeks, like say week 7 for instance but, I just dont feel that a 3rd D taking up a roster slot is better to have than a 9th WR. Especially when they start scoring negative points after 30 (combined ST & offensive) points against and 499 net yards against. Those thresholds aren't too difficult to achieve on any given week.

Side note: Negative points are the suxor. For any position. Never understood the reasoning behind this quirky fantasy scoring rule. No NFL team has ever had points removed from the scoreboard due to poor performance from any singular position or unit. I know I'm in the minority regarding negative points. I'm okay with that. Just voicing my thoughts. I'll never condone or allow negative points in any league I run. My fee-fees on this don't stop me from participating in leagues that do though.

 
Ruffrodys05 said:
Towards the end of the draft I was beginning to wonder if I might miss out on a second defense....turns out I needn't worry. When I looked at the scoring rules prior to the draft I didn't see anything that would indicate defenses would be overly attractive even with the flex option. Maybe my team will benefit from the flex option at D for a couple of weeks, like say week 7 for instance but, I just dont feel that a 3rd D taking up a roster slot is better to have than a 9th WR. Especially when they start scoring negative points after 30 (combined ST & offensive) points against and 499 net yards against. Those thresholds aren't too difficult to achieve on any given week.

Side note: Negative points are the suxor. For any position. Never understood the reasoning behind this quirky fantasy scoring rule. No NFL team has ever had points removed from the scoreboard due to poor performance from any singular position or unit. I know I'm in the minority regarding negative points. I'm okay with that. Just voicing my thoughts. I'll never condone or allow negative points in any league I run. My fee-fees on this don't stop me from participating in leagues that do though.
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I used to be one of these guys too....and I still am in most of my home leagues....although I am coming around a little....here's why...

if a QB has a bad game and throws 4 picks and loses a fumble, (I realize they are not always the QB's fault which is why I was am still a little one of those guys) that usually has a really bad affect on the outcome of the game for his team....and so if we do the fantasy/real life football comparison/model thing.....it should maybe also have a bad affect on your fantasy team.....does it suck if Mahomes throws Kelce a perfect pass, but Kelce lets it go through his hands and it gets picked and Mahomes gets the int....yeah it does....but lots of times picks are because of bad passes/reads.....

with that in mind for defense...the same kind of thing applies....in most leagues you only start one....and you put them in your lineup....so if you start that DST and they play like ####.....you should feel that pain a little too.....especially when you probably had plenty of other options that week on the WW if you needed them....in these best ball, I kind of kept that in mind for the DST especially with scoring in the NFL and the advantages offenses seem to have these days.....so if your DST does good stuff I rewarded them a little more than "we are used too"....but if they play really bad and give up the cookies in a big way, they should pay the price too.....so yeah you can start two and it as another option but its not a given and the end all be all....(not sure how many times 2 actually started for people last year)... 

it wasn't until I really started thinking about these things the last few years that it kind of hit me....I was the same way.....you don't get negative points in real life, why do it in fantasy.....but the fact is, when Winston had 30 int and like 9 fumbles he put his team in a position to lose and in a way you could say he was scoring negatively for his team cause it lead to the other team scoring....so to speak....turnovers are huge in NFL games....they often lead to points....which actually sucks for the DST on the other side...lol... :shrug:

 
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5.02    Dak Prescott DAL QB4 (7)
9.02    Trevor Lawrence JAC QB14 (7)
14.12    Ryan Fitzpatrick WAS QB26 (9)    

1.02    Alvin Kamara NOS RB2 (6)
3.02    Clyde Edwards-Helaire  KCC RB15 (12)
8.12    Gus Edwards BAL RB34 (8)
13.02    Latavius Murray  NOS RB47 (6)
17.02    Phillip Lindsay HOU RB59 (10)
23.02    Jerick McKinnon KCC RB73 (12)

2.12    Michael Thomas NOS WR9  (6)
4.12    Robert Woods LAR WR19 (11)
7.02    Courtland Sutton DEN WR35 (11)
10.12    Marvin Jones JAC WR54 (7)
15.02    Terrace Marshall CAR WR69 (13)
16.12    Allen Lazard GBP WR73    (13)
21.02    Sammy Watkins BAL WR88 (8)
24.12    Kendrick Bourne NEP WR101 (14)
    
6.12    Tyler Higbee LAR TE9 (11)    
11.02    Jonnu Smith NEP TE16    (14)
22.12    C.J. Uzomah CIN TE34 (10)

18.12    Matt Gay LAR PK12 (11)    
20.12    Graham Gano NYG PK19 (10)

12.12    Washington WAS DST3 (9)    
19.02    Green Bay Packers DST21 (13)

16.12    Allen Lazard GBP WR73    (13)
I was set to take DeMarcus Robinson here but Bass negated that this round.  Lazard felt like a decent consolation prize if he holds off the rookie and becomes the solid #2 is GB. Seems like we have been waiting to just be able to plug this guy in as the WR@ but he always seems to leave us feeling a little unfulfilled or something.  In best ball he is better than regular FF. Hopefully Rodgers is back and having one of his weapons is usually worth a couple starts. No other real sniffs here. Round 16: nothing crazy, Like Bass’s pick and also nittany taking Hubbard.

17.02    Phillip Lindsay HOU RB59 (10)
Was going to take Lindsay with one of the two picks at this turn so glad he cam back.  Plays hard, almost too hard as he runs with some attitude.  Wouldn’t be surprised if he becomes the lead guy over DJ. I sniffed around a little at a third TE here but passed. Round 17: liked OJ Howard pick and thought the Kirk pick was brilliant.

18.12    Matt Gay LAR PK12 (11)    
Time to get one.  Toss up between him and Prater.  Took Prater in no Mercy so switched it here.  Think Gay will be top 10 with a shot at top 5. No other real sniffs.  Round 18: thought there were some solid WWR picks this round in Pascal, Sheppard, Meyers, and Crowder.

19.02    Green Bay Packers DST21 (13)
Meh….no rhyme or reason just felt like it was time to get a second. Had them higher than a few and expected more to start going. Round 19: lol…liked a PK pick (Carlson) was hoping he made it back.

20.12    Graham Gano NYG PK19 (10)
Didn’t realize how good/actually great this guy was last year.  Holy cow. Only missed one FG.  Finished top 6 in FG made, just not enough extra points to get him a top billing. No other sniffs.  Round 20: liked the Mims pick. 

21.02    Sammy Watkins BAL WR88 (8)
So I went ahead and decided to be that guy.  As my WR7 I’ll ####### take him, somebody had to and the pickens were getting slim, so his upside in a good offense seemed like a decent price. Sniffed a third TE but didn’t love anything that would make me mad if it didn’t make it back. Round 21: Liked the Lock and Knox picks.

22.12    C.J. Uzomah CIN TE34 (10)
This could be a mini steal. Feels like this offense will be pretty good and hopefully he has recovered. Kind of like him as my TE3. Wold have sniffed Scott/Perine here.  Round 22: liked the Scott and Perine picks as well as Renfrow.

23.02    Jerick McKinnon KCC RB73 (12)
Felt I should add a 6th and pickens are slim.  Hope he carves out a role in the offense, they like speed.  He could score for me a couple weeks and could battle for RB2 snaps in KC. Sniffed Gurley here and Herndon.  Round 23: liked Cobb and Herndon picks.

24.12    Kendrick Bourne NEP WR101 (14)
DST or WR or TE4.  The DST at this point could be a wasted pick, although you never know.  I’m cool with my TE, so I will take Bourne.  I think I drafted him in a league earlier.  They are paying him and seems like he will be on the field in a starting role so as my WR8 I will take it. Round 24: Nittany getting IMO a full year starter with the final pick has to carry some value. Even if they are bad, he will be playing and scoring points if needed. 

Wrap up coming…… :banned:
 

 
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Team rzrback77

QB - went three deep without significant investment. Took Brady as QB7 a full round after Russell Wilson. Brady, even though definitely up against father time, has played in all 16 games for the past four seasons and 11 out of the last 12 years. I may be crazy, but I do not see him setting out games, even in this season of so-called rest worthy patterns in NBA and MLB. Waited a long time and then added Darnold and Fields late as QB27 and QB29. I expect Darnold to improve this season, escaping Gase, adding weapons and having strong coaching. Fields should be starting rather early because he is better than Dalton (went undrafted here) and since he is a different type of QB, it seems wasteful to develop two different offensive plans in Chicago. 

I see this group as top five in the league and the DD Classic, who knows the effectiveness here with the loss of David Dodds, has them as 2nd best behind @Ruffrodys05, with @Stinkin Ref, @Aaron Rudnicki and @drunken slobclose behind.

RB - I had predetermined to draft five running backs and spend heavily early. I did not set out to draft three in a row out of the gate, but that is where I saw value so I continued to draft them. Henry at RB6 seemed like stealing with less than normal ppr scoring. I was very happy to get him at 1.08. I really like Cam Akers this year. He seems to be valued differently here on this board, but he has skills and I do expect him to keep a lion's share of the carries and get more receptions in year two. I took him at RB12 and I would not be surprised to see him finish top ten easily. When I was preparing to make my third pick, I had Keenan Allen on my short list, along with DAndre Swift and Chris Carson. @Crippler took Allen one pick before me and @Aaron Rudnickitook Swift a couple before that. Top flight RBs were continuing to fly off the board and several WRs seemed to be in the same tier, so I went with Carson at RB19. Sure enough, three more were taken with the next three picks.

With these three on board, I definitely shifted my focus and did not return to RB until 10.6 when I tabbed James Connor at RB39. By this point, I had drafted five WRs and a QB. I might should have considered TE even before that point, but all my choices went before I thought they should. I considered Zak Moss, who I think might take over the top slot in Buffalo, but went with Connor, who could be RB 1B to Edmonds, who has never had 100 rushes in a season. Connor has had plenty of games where he had over 20 carries and has nice potential as an every down back if Edmonds is injured. Next was Jamaal Williams in the 13th round and I thought that would do it. Then added Malcolm Brown, who like Connor could see a true RBBC in Miami and was just too much potential to pass up in the 22nd round.

DD Classic rates this group as RB2 behind @drunken slob, who drafted eight RBs, including five over the first five rounds. @nittanylionrated a close third and them well back to @ryheaps, @Duckboyand @Aaron Rudnicki.

WR - I took my first in the 4th round and then added four more in the next five rounds. I had wanted for WR to be a strength, but the dedication early to value at RB took that possibility away. I do like the potential of this group to provide some flex scores though and I do not see this as a weak spot. Lockett WR15, DJ Moore WR22, Robby Anderson WR37, Jerry Jeudy WR41 and Michael Gallup WR46 mostly seemed like value picks and they all have rather high ceilings on a per game basis which is ideal for best ball. Also added Sterling Shepard and Byron Pringle late to give me seven guys at the WR position.

DD Classic puts the following all closely packed at the top at the WR position. @renesauz, @OldMilwaukee, @Crippler, @Ruffrodys05and @Aaron Rudnicki, with me and @Stinkin Reffollowing kind of close to the top grouping. 

TE - OK, you almost had to sacrifice a position to gain strength in the other big three positions and I sort of chose TE in this league. I was a little surprised that the top three TEs (Kelce, Waller & Kittle) all went by the 31st pick. Last year, only Kelce 17th and Waller 24th finished above 76th overall in scoring. L. Thomas finished at 77th and Hockenson at 79th. Our draft saw nine overall drafted by the 77th pick including Andrews, Pitts, Hockenson, Fant, Thomas and Higbee. I did not see that value and as a result my TE group of Henry, Trautman and Graham placed me at tenth overall. @BassNBrew, @Ruffrodys05 and @ryheapseasily led our league.

PK - I wanted two with different bye weeks and took Lutz (maybe NO struggles to score TDs) at PK6 and Santos at PK22. Light investment and not sure that the DD Classic means anything with PKs, but ranked 7th overall.

DST - I do think that a larger group is an advantage here and my team was one of three who landed three defenses. I would have considered a 4th if I could not identify a worthy selection, but I went with Malcolm Brown, Pringle and easily Graham as my TEs were likely last before that addition. 

Regarding scoring from a year ago, of the players that finished in the top 100, that included 28 QBs, but that position can not be flexed so a lot of the scores were not used as teams had other QBs outscoring them, 19 RBs, 36 WRs, 7 TEs and 10 DSTs. In addition, with the negative scoring potential it seems even more imperative to have coverage when one of your DSTs faces a top offense. I am really surprised that DSTs went undrafted and only three teams will carry three in our league.

For the record, DD Classic has @Crippler, @BassNBrew and me at the top and we all carried three. @nittanylionwas next with two taken 4th and 11th and @Duckboy followed with Pittsburgh valued as DST1 and the Jets taken late.

 
Ruffrodys05 said:
Towards the end of the draft I was beginning to wonder if I might miss out on a second defense....turns out I needn't worry. When I looked at the scoring rules prior to the draft I didn't see anything that would indicate defenses would be overly attractive even with the flex option. Maybe my team will benefit from the flex option at D for a couple of weeks, like say week 7 for instance but, I just dont feel that a 3rd D taking up a roster slot is better to have than a 9th WR. Especially when they start scoring negative points after 30 (combined ST & offensive) points against and 499 net yards against. Those thresholds aren't too difficult to achieve on any given week.

Side note: Negative points are the suxor. For any position. Never understood the reasoning behind this quirky fantasy scoring rule. No NFL team has ever had points removed from the scoreboard due to poor performance from any singular position or unit. I know I'm in the minority regarding negative points. I'm okay with that. Just voicing my thoughts. I'll never condone or allow negative points in any league I run. My fee-fees on this don't stop me from participating in leagues that do though.
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In the Ref 12 teamer league last year I drafted Cowboys, Rams and Vikings.  I flexed a D 13 of 14 weeks and the average flex score was 15.  D scoring was worth about 50% more so that would really be about 10 pts per week at flex.

In Ref's Top Gun league the D scoring looks to be close to this league.  I drafted Titans, Giants, Chefs, and Browns who finished 10, 13, 19, and 26.  I flexed D 16 of 17 weeks with an average flex score of 11.5.  My "fourth" D was used 6 times, my best D was used 9 times.  Now part of that usage was due to drafting Funchess, Mickael Thomas, Watkins, Beckham with Cooks/Landry/Hardman which meant about half of the season I was eating 4 donuts at WR and stuck with what my 3 healthy guys posted.

 
BassNBrew said:
In the Ref 12 teamer league last year I drafted Cowboys, Rams and Vikings.  I flexed a D 13 of 14 weeks and the average flex score was 15.  D scoring was worth about 50% more so that would really be about 10 pts per week at flex.

In Ref's Top Gun league the D scoring looks to be close to this league.  I drafted Titans, Giants, Chefs, and Browns who finished 10, 13, 19, and 26.  I flexed D 16 of 17 weeks with an average flex score of 11.5.  My "fourth" D was used 6 times, my best D was used 9 times.  Now part of that usage was due to drafting Funchess, Mickael Thomas, Watkins, Beckham with Cooks/Landry/Hardman which meant about half of the season I was eating 4 donuts at WR and stuck with what my 3 healthy guys posted.
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But this is another great point. D will play all season long. Lots of players can miss time. 

 
BassNBrew said:
In the Ref 12 teamer league last year I drafted Cowboys, Rams and Vikings.  I flexed a D 13 of 14 weeks and the average flex score was 15.  D scoring was worth about 50% more so that would really be about 10 pts per week at flex.

In Ref's Top Gun league the D scoring looks to be close to this league.  I drafted Titans, Giants, Chefs, and Browns who finished 10, 13, 19, and 26.  I flexed D 16 of 17 weeks with an average flex score of 11.5.  My "fourth" D was used 6 times, my best D was used 9 times.  Now part of that usage was due to drafting Funchess, Mickael Thomas, Watkins, Beckham with Cooks/Landry/Hardman which meant about half of the season I was eating 4 donuts at WR and stuck with what my 3 healthy guys posted.
Click to expand...
Honestly, I'm glad you guys let me draft in these. Your guy's ways of looking at different ways to gain advantages in these drafts amazes me. I know the information is out there and I utilize such a small portion. I am a BPA, gut feeling,  with some ADP sprinkled in kind of drafter. I don't usually have a plan going into most drafts and I let the draft come to me. I am at best middle of the road drafter against you guys and my typical spot in the standings reflects this. But consistently drafting against you guys sure helps me in leagues outside of here. Thanks. 

 
BASSNBREW

PLAYER2020 PTSBYE

Allen, Josh BUF QB486.567

Trubisky, Mitchell BUF QB195.807

Winston, Jameis NOS QB2.406

Fournette, Leonard TBB RB123.009

Henderson, Darrell LAR RB (Q)126.3011

Jackson, Justin LAC RB60.557

Jones, Ronald TBB RB181.309

Kelley, Joshua LAC RB77.457

Singletary, Devin BUF RB135.107

Beckham, Odell CLE WR (Q)86.8213

Claypool, Chase PIT WR215.907

Higgins, Rashard CLE WR120.9013

Hopkins, DeAndre ARI WR289.8012

Kirk, Christian ARI WR146.4012

Robinson, Allen CHI WR262.9010

Robinson, Demarcus KCC WR108.6012

Goedert, Dallas PHI TE127.9014

Herndon, Chris NYJ TE (Q)83.456

Waller, Darren LVR TE307.358

Gould, Robbie SFO PK93.506

McManus, Brandon DEN PK113.0011

Broncos, Denver DEN Def122.0011

Browns, Cleveland CLE Def148.0013

Buccaneers, Tampa Bay TBB Def207.009

24 TOTAL PLAYERS
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Hate that it comes via injury, but my RB corps went from beyond abysmal to worst in the league.

 
Pretty shocked, and stoked, I'm rockin this league after 5 weeks......1028.21 total, 205.6 avg. ......with what I thought was a pretty ho-hum team after the draft.

Oh well, it won't last but, I'm enjoying it while it lasts......yay Me!!

 
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