DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
I’ve got to watch the game. In person, he didn’t stand out. The 2nd half D was really bad(obviously) still recovering
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2023 Las Vegas Raiders - RIP Jack - one of the greatest Super Bowl moments ever (5 Viewers)
- Thread starter Hankmoody
- Start date
Hankmoody
Footballguy
I don't want to be here again in 12 months looking forward to the 2025 QB draft class. We need to solve this now. It's a loaded class and we're going to be within striking distance of a bunch of options. We obviously don't know who's coming out or not but at a minimum Penix, Nix, and Jalen Daniels are going to be massively intriguing tier 2 options. Ewers, McCarthy, and Sanders are top underclassmen that might come out - I think McCarthy and Ewers do for sure.
Top 10 - Maye, Williams, McCarthy
Top 20 - Daniels, Penix
First round - Ewers, Nix
Wildcards - Carson Beck, Jordan Travis, Cameron Ward
My dream wildcard - Jalen Milroe
Standard disclaimer that of course tons can happen between now and then as real pros take real deep dives on film.
Milroe is a dude. He's come a long, long way from the beginning of the season and he reminds me a ton of Daunte Culpepper. He still needs plenty of work and reps and should probably stay and be a top 5 pick next year but we all saw what happened with Richardson as he vaulted into a top 5 pick immediately. Milroe is 5 times the thrower that Richardson was/is.
This is where my head is at too. If Champ and his scouts who are evaluating AOCs performance this season are still there in 3 months, they will have a pretty good grasp of what kind of QB AOC can become. But that doesn’t mean he shouldn’t have any competition. Make him win the job vs one of those rookies you mentioned above. It’ll only make him better and the QB room as a whole better.
ZADO
Footballguy
Every team needs 2 or more top shelf QBs , im on board with drafting more QB talent 100%
ZADO
Footballguy
WOW
I had to go through all these requirements. I had to do this, this, this. I had to go out and f—ing show them that I can f—ing do anything. I’m f—ing doing everything I can, like, I want to f—ing play.”
According to Sports Illustrated insider Hondo Carpenter, Crosby was at about “60 percent” health on Sunday, but he still managed to record a sack.
His 49 defensive snaps against the Chiefs was his lowest snap total of the season, but still a lot considering the status of his knee.
We don’t know when the injury to Crosby’s knee occurred, but there’s a good chance it happened on a questionable block by Teven Jenkins of the Bears in week 7…
Based on a report during the CBS broadcast on Sunday, it sounds like Crosby will have a medical procedure on his knee at the end of the season.
It will be interesting to see how the knee holds up through the end of the season, and the bye week couldn’t have come at a better time for Mad Maxx… unless, of course, it could have come just one week earlier.
Has video of Maxx talking and shows his swollen knee
Maxx Crosby Says He Was “Literally Bedridden” Before Playing Against the Chiefs
“This week was f—ed. My knee had some fluid build up. The sh– was blown up like a balloon and I wake up the next morning and I f—ing almost pass out. I felt like I was dying. I will literally bed ridden. I could not move. I get a call that night and they’re like ‘Okay, we need to go to the hospital. We found there’s bacteria in your fluid.’ So it can be f—ing dangerous.I had to go through all these requirements. I had to do this, this, this. I had to go out and f—ing show them that I can f—ing do anything. I’m f—ing doing everything I can, like, I want to f—ing play.”
According to Sports Illustrated insider Hondo Carpenter, Crosby was at about “60 percent” health on Sunday, but he still managed to record a sack.
His 49 defensive snaps against the Chiefs was his lowest snap total of the season, but still a lot considering the status of his knee.
We don’t know when the injury to Crosby’s knee occurred, but there’s a good chance it happened on a questionable block by Teven Jenkins of the Bears in week 7…
Based on a report during the CBS broadcast on Sunday, it sounds like Crosby will have a medical procedure on his knee at the end of the season.
It will be interesting to see how the knee holds up through the end of the season, and the bye week couldn’t have come at a better time for Mad Maxx… unless, of course, it could have come just one week earlier.
Has video of Maxx talking and shows his swollen knee
ICON211
Footballguy
I'm in for drafting a QB, but what teams have two top shelf QBs?
massraider
Footballguy
I think history says it's easier to go worst to first in the NFL than any other league.
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
top shelf? what are y'all watching? super trooper is middle of the pack
ICON211
Footballguy
I'm not sure he's even middle of the pack. He's played reasonably well and there is potential there, but I'm not sure what he is yet.
raidersraidersraiders
Footballguy
I don't see a point in drafting a another qb with the 1st or 2nd round picks and then he gets smacked up because the Oline is weak. imagine building the lines up on both sides of the ball and bullying other teams in the trenches. that's how championship teams are made. jacobs would be much more effective too. a great Oline will improve any qb you put behind it and set things up for if you do end up needing to draft one in the 1st round in 2025.
32 Counter Pass
Footballguy
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
Clickbait bro. That headline may as well be @ZADO s cousin says the only person mork trusts is Gruden
Sarlakticacid
Footballguy
You want a Tepper type owner to take over?
Hankmoody
Footballguy
You can do that in Free Agency. You aren't finding franchise QB on the open market. And the right QB goes a long way toward protecting themselves - quick reads, quick releases, pocket mobility. Plenty of QB's survive because they know how to play the game properly when under pressure.
32 Counter Pass
Footballguy
Those are the only two choices?
DocHolliday
Footballguy
The Raiders could turn things around in the next couple of years but it’s going to take much better drafting and personnel moves than we have seen in the last 20 years. Tough, smart decisions need to be made at the end of the season and some fans aren’t going to like them. Building a team doesn’t happen overnight but it can happen pretty fast as shown by Detroit and Houston. You can’t hold on to aging players. You need draft capital and salary cap space to build the trenches, the D, and a QB that can win games. Obviously, if AOC comes on strong by the end of the season and he can be a top 10 QB, the process just got a lot easier. It’s too early to make a decision on AOC but at least he isn’t a disaster.
LawFitz
Footballguy
Still very much believe in AOC's potential to grow into a franchise QB. The tools are there, but the processor is raw and learning on the fly. That said, if an upside QB prospect is available in rounds 2+ to compete for the role, you take him every single year. Round 1 QB pick is another story - that player puts premature heat into the room without having earned it, so you need to be more careful. That player needs to be an absolute cannot pass type of prospect - and there may be one or more of those at the Raiders pick this year due to the depth of the class, so I'm open to all possibilities.
ZADO
Footballguy
Former #Raiders GM Dave Ziegler thought CJ Stroud was a “generational” talent and wanted to draft him, but former HC Josh McDaniels overruled him because he was “hellbent” on starting Jimmy Garoppolo, via
@HondoCarpenter
Ziegler had no faith in Jimmy Garoppolo staying healthy or being their future at QB, But McDaniels “got his way” per the report.McDaniels ruined the Raiders’ future and Ziegler got fired because of it… Wild.
@HondoCarpenter
Ziegler had no faith in Jimmy Garoppolo staying healthy or being their future at QB, But McDaniels “got his way” per the report.McDaniels ruined the Raiders’ future and Ziegler got fired because of it… Wild.
Atomic Punk
Footballguy
Did he say whether they had a deal worked out to move up to #1 or 2 To take Stroud?
ZADO
Footballguy
Im not sure , Hondo is the guy releasing this info, but it sounds like Z wanted to work something out and McGooofy shot it down
Atomic Punk
Footballguy
Fair enough. I take these stories with a big dose of salt, as they are impossible to prove, especially when a massive deal would need to be made to make it happen. Much easier to believe if Stroud was available at 7 and we just took someone else.
ZADO
Footballguy
Even if they had to sell the farm , when you look at all the moves McGoofy made its clear he was screwing up lefty and right.
LawFitz
Footballguy
Dang, this article makes me think Mork should've punted McD, but kept Zieg.
Atomic Punk
Footballguy
Great article. Thanks for sharing.
ZADO
Footballguy
Eye opening behind the scenes goings on
ZADO
Footballguy
Thats what i was thinking, maybe they bring him back in some compacity
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
I read it on my phone, is there a named source?
Atomic Punk
Footballguy
None that I saw, but there was so much detail it is difficult to think it is all fabricated.
ZADO
Footballguy
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
I know he wrote the article. just wondering where all this salacious info came from
Chadstroma
Footballguy
Even more evidence of how BAD McD is. It was pretty obvious how inferior a QB Jimmy G is. I thought that his knowledge of the system would help offset those short comings but I was horribly wrong about that as well. Anyone that can evaluate talent knew Jimmy G wasn't the answer and on top of that was a defender looking at him wrong away from a major injury.
Chadstroma
Footballguy
That ain't happening.
Champ is the going to be the guy. That is pretty much a lock in my book right now. The only question is if AP gets the nod at HC as well which I think we need to see the rest of the season to have a good idea but currently I am leaning towards the decision will be to bring him back.
ZADO
Footballguy
Hondo seems to have an ear to the team , im sure he speaks to many people . I cant imagine anyone still involved with the team is going to want their name involved . Maybe Ziegler himself is providing some insight but is still friends with McGoofy (ya i know , with friends like that who needs enemies ) . If Hondo reveals people , nobody will talk to him. I see no reason for him to fabricate such stories , he could be subject to slander suits im sure .
ZADO
Footballguy
I said ''in some capacity'' , maybe as a high priced scout ?
ICON211
Footballguy
He was just fired from his GM role. There is no possible way he is back with the Raiders. Teams don't immediately bring back fired front office people and then have them report to the guy that used to be under them.
Chadstroma
Footballguy
Yea, no. Hiring anyone back that you fired before is very unusual to begin with.... not only in football but in any industry. To do so about a month afterwards for a demotion is even more unlikely. I have way more of a chance of making every Raider home game next year than this happening (considering I have no plans to do so or even as a goal, it is extremely unlikely barring a lotto win or something)
ZADO
Footballguy
He was fired because he came as a package deal with McGoofy , from everything im reading Zeigler is really good at his job of evaluating talent . The Raiders are anything but conventional , especially Mark Davis , hell im seeing rumors hes interested in Guden again lol.
ICON211
Footballguy
Then why fire him in the first place? They could have fired McDaniels and kept Ziegler. They weren't obligated to fire them both just because they were hired at the same time. They are not bringing back the GM they just fired because of an article that Hondo Carpenter wrote. Let's say the Raiders did decide they wanted to bring him back, which is really not even remotely possible right now. Look at it from Ziegler's perspective........he would be looking to come back and report to the guy that used to report to him?
I'm not saying teams don't ever bring back former coaches or other employees, but not so soon after they were fired. It's just really not possible now.
ZADO
Footballguy
Fair enough, im not saying that would happen, it was just a spaghetti throw after reading how much Zeigler liked Mark Davis and others , im sure hes pissed right now that he has anything to do with McGoofy as its reported they butted heads a lot about personal moves . I couldnt care less what Z does or doesnt do. I like Champ .
ZADO
Footballguy
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
You gotta stop gobbling up all these unsubstantiated rumors. This is exactly why I’m questions some that article from hondo. It’s a fluff piece beyond belief for Z. Everything in the article is what the fan base was screaming for plus the stroud is a generational talent. That’s some awesome hindsight!
Chadstroma
Footballguy
Hopefully Jack Jones will have his head on straight with the extremely close ties to AP
This is why Davis needs to make his next GM the one who makes the final call on all or at least most personnel decisions. Head Coaches making personnel moves just doesn’t work often enough to justify that type of power structure. Gruden is a good coach but terrible evaluating talent, McDummy was even worse. Even Belichick can’t do both jobs successfully anymore. If Davis has learned anything over the past 12 years, is hire a GM and put him in charge of ALL player acquisitions, with the council of the HC obviously, but make the GM have the power to give the final say.
raidersraidersraiders
Footballguy
I get the feeling zeig was one of hondo's sources up until the firing. just because it's a puff piece, doesn't mean the information isn't accurate. hondo has stated that he always looks to confirm information he gets and makes a deal with any source that if they lie to him he reveals who gave him the bad info. so readers know why he reported something if it turns out completely false.
maybe zeig felt he could make the trade up to 2, but that doesn't mean the other team agrees. if you offer up enough there is a price for nearly anything, but there are teams who won't budge if they want a player and are set on it.
raidersraidersraiders
Footballguy
I prefer this system, but it does lead to coaches leaving if they don't get their way. conflicts between coach and GM anytime the GM makes a call against the coach and it doesn't work out for whatever reason. the GM will feel his job is to find the talent and it's up to the coaching to make use of the talent. the coach may feel he's limited by what he's being given.
everyone always thinks they know better. especially if it's an experienced head coach who has had success at the nfl level already. head coaches probably feel like any failings they had in the past were due to personnel decisions they didn't make. people always want more control if it's their name being stamped on the product.
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
That’s entirely possible. But reporters need to make money. Which means writing stories that get clicks. Hondo is usually very critical and unbiased. He definitely comes across as a “just the facts” reporter. It just gave me pause because it was a laundry list of fan gripes of the most obvious issues the team has/had. And even if Z screams from the mountain top about stroud after the fact, it’s still hindsight. Was he really saying he was a generational talent? No one else was. Why didn’t we hear something along the lines of they tried to trade up, but couldn’t find a partner.
Revisionist history is easy to nail. We do it all the time with raider drafting. 
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
Historically, it’s not very successful.
raidersraidersraiders
Footballguy
I feel like the decision going into the offseason is more about hardegree at OC. unless AP has a disastrous finish to the season, I expect mark and champ to stick with him. good leadership is not so easy to find, it's easier finding good x's and o's guys consistently than finding one coach who can do both and also not want to be the GM.
these last 4 games ended up finishing as most expected from when the schedule was released. giants and jets winnable, dolphins and chiefs losses. watching the games it didn't play out exactly as predicted, I'm sure people saw miami putting up more points in a blowout instead of escaping in a low scoring game. 2-2 in those 4 games is still what most people saw as the best possible outcome to begin with.
I think hardegree has a major opportunity if he can get the offense to perform after being put in such a circumstance midseason. the bye week is as much help as he's going to get and it's happening at just the right time. there's 4 games to evaluate from and 5 games left to play. the extra time and time already spent should add up to better results in the next game.
these last 4 games ended up finishing as most expected from when the schedule was released. giants and jets winnable, dolphins and chiefs losses. watching the games it didn't play out exactly as predicted, I'm sure people saw miami putting up more points in a blowout instead of escaping in a low scoring game. 2-2 in those 4 games is still what most people saw as the best possible outcome to begin with.
I think hardegree has a major opportunity if he can get the offense to perform after being put in such a circumstance midseason. the bye week is as much help as he's going to get and it's happening at just the right time. there's 4 games to evaluate from and 5 games left to play. the extra time and time already spent should add up to better results in the next game.
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