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2023 NY Giants - (Schoen & Daboll episode 2 – Danny turns Dimes into Dollars) (1 Viewer)

Q

Qammy

Footballguy
Qammy said:

Cardinals release DeAndre Hopkins: Giants should pursue him as target for Daniel Jones​

www.nj.com

Cardinals release DeAndre Hopkins: Giants should pursue him as target for Daniel Jones

DeAndre Hopkins is a free agent.
www.nj.com www.nj.com
Click to expand...
There's not enough room for everyone ... but there will be injuries and disappointments PS, and PUP ... So why not !

Imagine
  1. Hopkins (Waller @ TE and Saquan @ RB)
  2. Slayton
  3. Campbell
  4. Hyatt
  5. Hodgins
  6. Crowder (Punt Returner)
  7. Jeff Smith (they might want to keep him for ST)
  8. Robinson (PUP)
  9. Shepherd (PUP)
  10. Collin Johnson (practice Sq)
  11. BFWheaton (practice sq ... he will probably be snatched up by another team if he is there)
 
U

Uncle Leo

Footballguy
Hopkins still has “it”. He can be our Alpha. This is a move you got to try to make. It’s not going to be free, but at least you keep your draft capital.
 
Q

Qammy

Footballguy
kodycutter said:
I doubt this happens but you still have to make the call. I'd guess Bills or Ravens is where hopkins lands.
Click to expand...
Ravens just signed Odell and Drafted Zay Flowers in the 1st rd ... Hopkins was recently working out with Barkley and Odell.
It would be nice but yeah ... I doubt it
 
Yenrub

Yenrub

Footballguy
Rubi said:
IF you think we can win it all THIS year then Hopkins would be a must get,but we're only in year two of the reconstruction process so I don't think it happens. Trust The Process.
Click to expand...
I don't think the Giants are "a WR away" from being a championship team, but they will probably kick the tires. I doubt DHop would want to play for the Giants (they weren't on his list of desired places).
Obviously, the Giants don't have an established #1 WR on their roster, it will be interesting to see if one of the many WR on the roster grows into that role this season.
 
T

Tanner9919

Footballguy
Qammy said:
Qammy said:

Cardinals release DeAndre Hopkins: Giants should pursue him as target for Daniel Jones​

www.nj.com

Cardinals release DeAndre Hopkins: Giants should pursue him as target for Daniel Jones

DeAndre Hopkins is a free agent.
www.nj.com www.nj.com
Click to expand...
There's not enough room for everyone ... but there will be injuries and disappointments PS, and PUP ... So why not !

Imagine
  1. Hopkins (Waller @ TE and Saquan @ RB)
  2. Slayton
  3. Campbell
  4. Hyatt
  5. Hodgins
  6. Crowder (Punt Returner)
  7. Jeff Smith (they might want to keep him for ST)
  8. Robinson (PUP)
  9. Shepherd (PUP)
  10. Collin Johnson (practice Sq)
  11. BFWheaton (practice sq ... he will probably be snatched up by another team if he is there)
Click to expand...
nope.criminally baaaad idea and will never happen. we learned what OBJ means and it's the same thing with dhopp. Giants have a decent corps of WR that play hard they don't need a Queen on the team now. no way ,no how
 
Q

Qammy

Footballguy
The Giants WRs really don't look that great when you break down the 14 WRs on the roster - Hyatt is really the only one that has #1 potential and there are only 4 that look like a sure thing to make the opening day roster.

These 4 are opening day locks to make the roster (this is not a strong group)
  1. Darius Slayton
  2. Isaiah Hodgins
  3. Parris Campbell
  4. Jalin Hyatt
Jeff Smith (Special Teams)

These 4 Coming off of serious injuries
Jamison Crowder (Broken Ankle) Probably the #5 opening day
Wan'Dale Robinson (Torn ACL - week 11) PUP
Sterling Shepard (Torn ACL ) PUP
Collin Johnson (Torn Achilles) PUP

Unlikely to make the roster
Bryce Ford-Wheaton (Practice Squad)
David Sills V (Practice Squad)
Kalil Pimpleton
Jaydon Mickens
Makai Polk
 
The Frankman

The Frankman

Footballguy
ESPN+ Bill Barnwell: Ranking best, worst 2023 NFL offseasons: Which teams improved?

29. New York Giants​

What went right: The Giants brought in a variety of receivers for Daniel Jones, but I'm not sure they landed that No. 1 guy who might have been on general manager Joe Schoen's list. Still, after running out Isaiah Hodgins, Darius Slayton, Richie James and Daniel Bellinger as primary receivers in a playoff victory last season, Schoen has added a whole fleet of playmakers to the passing game this offseason.

Hodgins, Slayton and Bellinger return, but New York also brought back Sterling Shepard, who is recovering from a torn ACL. Parris Campbell, who finally stayed healthy with the Colts last season, was added in free agency. Schoen then used a third-round pick on speedster Jalin Hyatt, who was projected as a potential first-round pick by some and adds the sort of quickness that only Slayton really had on this roster previously. With gadget receiver Wan'Dale Robinson eventually returning from his own torn ACL, the Giants should be able to sort through this mix and find three starting wideouts as the season goes along.

The biggest addition was former Raiders tight end Darren Waller. I can't fault Schoen for using a third-round pick to acquire Waller, given his production over 2020 and 2021, but Waller turns 31 in September and has played more than 50% of the offensive snaps just 16 times over the past two seasons because of various injuries. New York isn't locked into Waller for long if it doesn't work out, but it has to treat him as more of a luxury than a true top option.

What went wrong: The organization appears to have bought into its own hype. An unexpected trip to the postseason and a road victory once they got there was a pleasant surprise for the Giants, who had been treating 2023 as a year to get their salary cap right and begin a rebuild. Their underlying performance wasn't quite as impressive; they were outscored on the season and finished 21st in DVOA. They went 8-4-1 in games decided by eight or fewer points and were lucky to draw an even worse playoff opponent in the Vikings, whose DVOA ranked them as the sixth-worst team in the league.

In response, the Giants appear to be running it back. They franchise-tagged Saquon Barkley and committed to Jones, signing the same player who wasn't worth a fifth-year option 12 months earlier to a four-year, $160 million deal with $81 million guaranteed over the first two seasons. They brought back Slayton and Shepard, who seemed to be on the way out, and while those weren't major deals, the move for Jones certainly was just that.

Jones ranked sixth in Total QBR last season, so I won't be arguing that he played poorly. In terms of Jones' development, though, coach Brian Daboll squeezed just about everything out of him. The 2019 first-rounder threw the shortest average pass of any quarterback (6.0 air yards per attempt), which helped drop his interception rate to an unsustainably-low mark of 1.1%. Jones was incredible as a scrambler, but his 708 rushing yards nearly doubled his career rushing total from Years 1 through 3. He averaged just 6.8 yards per attempt and still managed to take sacks on nearly 9% of his dropbacks. Plus, he attempted just 29.5 passes per game.

On a rookie deal, that sort of production is incredibly valuable. At $40 million per year, it wouldn't be a good use of resources. Jones has to improve as a passer to justify that sort of contract, and the steps he has to take as a downfield thrower and a post-snap processor likely open him up to the turnovers he avoided in 2022.

The cap space the Giants were supposed to be clearing last year went to Jones and Barkley, which limited what they could do to upgrade a defense that ranked 29th in DVOA last season. I liked the addition of A'Shawn Robinson to one of the league's worst rush defenses, but a four-year, $40 million deal for off-ball linebacker Bobby Okereke was too aggressive at a position where the majority of useful players settled for much smaller commitments. Schoen used the team's first-round pick on much-needed cornerback Deonte Banks, but this secondary is going to struggle against an NFC East full of imposing receivers.

What's left to do: Resolve the Barkley situation. The Giants haven't sounded close to a deal with their star back, who had his best season since 2018 while playing out his fifth-year option. It's reasonable to wonder whether committing a long-term deal to him would be a good idea given his injury history, but he helps the Giants overcome their lack of impactful playmakers at wide receiver. Barkley playing out the 2023 season on the tag feels like the most likely outcome.
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
Q

Qammy

Footballguy
The Frankman said:
ESPN+ Bill Barnwell: Ranking best, worst 2023 NFL offseasons: Which teams improved?

29. New York Giants​

What went right: The Giants brought in a variety of receivers for Daniel Jones, but I'm not sure they landed that No. 1 guy who might have been on general manager Joe Schoen's list. Still, after running out Isaiah Hodgins, Darius Slayton, Richie James and Daniel Bellinger as primary receivers in a playoff victory last season, Schoen has added a whole fleet of playmakers to the passing game this offseason.

Hodgins, Slayton and Bellinger return, but New York also brought back Sterling Shepard, who is recovering from a torn ACL. Parris Campbell, who finally stayed healthy with the Colts last season, was added in free agency. Schoen then used a third-round pick on speedster Jalin Hyatt, who was projected as a potential first-round pick by some and adds the sort of quickness that only Slayton really had on this roster previously. With gadget receiver Wan'Dale Robinson eventually returning from his own torn ACL, the Giants should be able to sort through this mix and find three starting wideouts as the season goes along.

The biggest addition was former Raiders tight end Darren Waller. I can't fault Schoen for using a third-round pick to acquire Waller, given his production over 2020 and 2021, but Waller turns 31 in September and has played more than 50% of the offensive snaps just 16 times over the past two seasons because of various injuries. New York isn't locked into Waller for long if it doesn't work out, but it has to treat him as more of a luxury than a true top option.

What went wrong: The organization appears to have bought into its own hype. An unexpected trip to the postseason and a road victory once they got there was a pleasant surprise for the Giants, who had been treating 2023 as a year to get their salary cap right and begin a rebuild. Their underlying performance wasn't quite as impressive; they were outscored on the season and finished 21st in DVOA. They went 8-4-1 in games decided by eight or fewer points and were lucky to draw an even worse playoff opponent in the Vikings, whose DVOA ranked them as the sixth-worst team in the league.

In response, the Giants appear to be running it back. They franchise-tagged Saquon Barkley and committed to Jones, signing the same player who wasn't worth a fifth-year option 12 months earlier to a four-year, $160 million deal with $81 million guaranteed over the first two seasons. They brought back Slayton and Shepard, who seemed to be on the way out, and while those weren't major deals, the move for Jones certainly was just that.

Jones ranked sixth in Total QBR last season, so I won't be arguing that he played poorly. In terms of Jones' development, though, coach Brian Daboll squeezed just about everything out of him. The 2019 first-rounder threw the shortest average pass of any quarterback (6.0 air yards per attempt), which helped drop his interception rate to an unsustainably-low mark of 1.1%. Jones was incredible as a scrambler, but his 708 rushing yards nearly doubled his career rushing total from Years 1 through 3. He averaged just 6.8 yards per attempt and still managed to take sacks on nearly 9% of his dropbacks. Plus, he attempted just 29.5 passes per game.

On a rookie deal, that sort of production is incredibly valuable. At $40 million per year, it wouldn't be a good use of resources. Jones has to improve as a passer to justify that sort of contract, and the steps he has to take as a downfield thrower and a post-snap processor likely open him up to the turnovers he avoided in 2022.

The cap space the Giants were supposed to be clearing last year went to Jones and Barkley, which limited what they could do to upgrade a defense that ranked 29th in DVOA last season. I liked the addition of A'Shawn Robinson to one of the league's worst rush defenses, but a four-year, $40 million deal for off-ball linebacker Bobby Okereke was too aggressive at a position where the majority of useful players settled for much smaller commitments. Schoen used the team's first-round pick on much-needed cornerback Deonte Banks, but this secondary is going to struggle against an NFC East full of imposing receivers.

What's left to do: Resolve the Barkley situation. The Giants haven't sounded close to a deal with their star back, who had his best season since 2018 while playing out his fifth-year option. It's reasonable to wonder whether committing a long-term deal to him would be a good idea given his injury history, but he helps the Giants overcome their lack of impactful playmakers at wide receiver. Barkley playing out the 2023 season on the tag feels like the most likely outcome.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Any Relation?
 
Q

Qammy

Footballguy
The Frankman said:
ESPN+ Bill Barnwell: Ranking best, worst 2023 NFL offseasons: Which teams improved?

29. New York Giants​

What went right: The Giants brought in a variety of receivers for Daniel Jones, but I'm not sure they landed that No. 1 guy who might have been on general manager Joe Schoen's list. Still, after running out Isaiah Hodgins, Darius Slayton, Richie James and Daniel Bellinger as primary receivers in a playoff victory last season, Schoen has added a whole fleet of playmakers to the passing game this offseason.

Hodgins, Slayton and Bellinger return, but New York also brought back Sterling Shepard, who is recovering from a torn ACL. Parris Campbell, who finally stayed healthy with the Colts last season, was added in free agency. Schoen then used a third-round pick on speedster Jalin Hyatt, who was projected as a potential first-round pick by some and adds the sort of quickness that only Slayton really had on this roster previously. With gadget receiver Wan'Dale Robinson eventually returning from his own torn ACL, the Giants should be able to sort through this mix and find three starting wideouts as the season goes along.

The biggest addition was former Raiders tight end Darren Waller. I can't fault Schoen for using a third-round pick to acquire Waller, given his production over 2020 and 2021, but Waller turns 31 in September and has played more than 50% of the offensive snaps just 16 times over the past two seasons because of various injuries. New York isn't locked into Waller for long if it doesn't work out, but it has to treat him as more of a luxury than a true top option.

What went wrong: The organization appears to have bought into its own hype. An unexpected trip to the postseason and a road victory once they got there was a pleasant surprise for the Giants, who had been treating 2023 as a year to get their salary cap right and begin a rebuild. Their underlying performance wasn't quite as impressive; they were outscored on the season and finished 21st in DVOA. They went 8-4-1 in games decided by eight or fewer points and were lucky to draw an even worse playoff opponent in the Vikings, whose DVOA ranked them as the sixth-worst team in the league.

In response, the Giants appear to be running it back. They franchise-tagged Saquon Barkley and committed to Jones, signing the same player who wasn't worth a fifth-year option 12 months earlier to a four-year, $160 million deal with $81 million guaranteed over the first two seasons. They brought back Slayton and Shepard, who seemed to be on the way out, and while those weren't major deals, the move for Jones certainly was just that.

Jones ranked sixth in Total QBR last season, so I won't be arguing that he played poorly. In terms of Jones' development, though, coach Brian Daboll squeezed just about everything out of him. The 2019 first-rounder threw the shortest average pass of any quarterback (6.0 air yards per attempt), which helped drop his interception rate to an unsustainably-low mark of 1.1%. Jones was incredible as a scrambler, but his 708 rushing yards nearly doubled his career rushing total from Years 1 through 3. He averaged just 6.8 yards per attempt and still managed to take sacks on nearly 9% of his dropbacks. Plus, he attempted just 29.5 passes per game.

On a rookie deal, that sort of production is incredibly valuable. At $40 million per year, it wouldn't be a good use of resources. Jones has to improve as a passer to justify that sort of contract, and the steps he has to take as a downfield thrower and a post-snap processor likely open him up to the turnovers he avoided in 2022.

The cap space the Giants were supposed to be clearing last year went to Jones and Barkley, which limited what they could do to upgrade a defense that ranked 29th in DVOA last season. I liked the addition of A'Shawn Robinson to one of the league's worst rush defenses, but a four-year, $40 million deal for off-ball linebacker Bobby Okereke was too aggressive at a position where the majority of useful players settled for much smaller commitments. Schoen used the team's first-round pick on much-needed cornerback Deonte Banks, but this secondary is going to struggle against an NFC East full of imposing receivers.

What's left to do: Resolve the Barkley situation. The Giants haven't sounded close to a deal with their star back, who had his best season since 2018 while playing out his fifth-year option. It's reasonable to wonder whether committing a long-term deal to him would be a good idea given his injury history, but he helps the Giants overcome their lack of impactful playmakers at wide receiver. Barkley playing out the 2023 season on the tag feels like the most likely outcome.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Is Giants QB Daniel Jones better than Jets QB Aaron Rodgers?​

giantswire.usatoday.com

Is Giants QB Daniel Jones better than Jets QB Aaron Rodgers?

A long-time NFL reporter makes the argument that New York Giants QB Daniel Jones is better than New York Jets QB Aaron Rodgers.
giantswire.usatoday.com giantswire.usatoday.com
 
Q

Qammy

Footballguy
Yenrub said:
Bobby Okereke comes in at #23 on the LB list
https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-linebacker-rankings-2023-nfl-season
Click to expand...
I felt like the Giants significantly over paid Okereke ... The only thing that I can think of is that he is a perfect fit for Winks system. I hope that is the case because there were 3 or 4 supposedly better LBs on the market that signed for a lot less.

I know these guys are smart but so are some of the other GMs and analysts.
GMs often outsmart themselves ... only time will tell
 
Last edited:
Yenrub

Yenrub

Footballguy
Qammy said:

Giants' Daniel Jones ranks highly in Chris Simms' top 40 QB countdown​

giantswire.usatoday.com

Giants' Daniel Jones ranks highly in Chris Simms' top 40 QB countdown

New York Giants QB Daniel Jones nearly cracked the top 10 in Chris Simms’ Top 40 QB Countdown and drew incredibly high praise.
giantswire.usatoday.com giantswire.usatoday.com
Click to expand...
I hope Simms is right.
The Giants paid Jones like they expect him to improve to that level.
Jones cut down on the turnovers last year so that is a good sign, this year he will need to improve the passing yards and explosive plays.
While the passing offense was ranked slightly higher in 2022 (26th) than it was in 2021 (31st), they threw for more yards in 2021 (3196) than they did in 2022 (3157).
Second year in the system, along with some faster weapons and hopefully improved OL play will bear fruit for the passing offense.
 
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