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2024-25 NBA Thread: for the second time, somebody in Dallas hits low percentage shot that leads to a generation of conspiracy theories (24 Viewers)

So not one home team has won in this round? Amazing.
While on that topic...how is it fair that Golden State gets to play Minnesota while OKC has to square off with Denver, this seems rather cruel
And to me it weakens the WCF with one of the spots guaranteed at this point to a low seeded team

You want me to explain how seeding works?
:popcorn: for the math lesson.
Minnesota also beat Denver in last year's playoffs. Poor MoP, some things never change.
Pretty sure MOP is a Miami Heat fan.
Fair weatherish
2 Minutes for false proclamations
Go to the penalty box or I'm bumping my LeBron to South Beach thread
:lol:
Marginal Panther/Lightning fan too
5 Finals Appearances in a row
3 Stanley Cups
And a slew of good times going to games at both arenas

Part timer all the way
I would love to be an NBA part timer that plays just a a handful of minutes per night, gets to sit and watch from the best seats in the house, never the reason why they lose and get paid millions
Udonis Haslem, what a ride for that guy the final 10-12 years
 
Ok fine.

Simply put, the Wolves played like crap. They couldn't shoot and even when Ant was smart enough to realize he could get to the lane at will he couldn't finish until they were down by 20. And even with Curry out Golden State is too good to come back against from that far down when their role guys are hitting shots.

That is the worst game I've seen them play in a long time, maybe all year. And watching the game I didn't see anything Golden State was doing to cause it - it was all self-inflicted which has been a problem with these team all year and really for a lot longer. From Ant to Finch to Randle to Rudy to the bench, these guys can coast and make dumb plays.

Let me go back - the zone has me a bit concerned since they've struggled against zones in the past. But pretty much if they play like this they're not going to win the series and probably won't win a game. I have to believe the team we saw against the Lakers and the last 20 or so games of the season is the real Wolves. If it is, this series is far from over - Curry or no Curry. (and I hope we get Curry back). Wolves by 30 on Thursday.
 
Trying not to be too down after Game 1, but that game reminded me too much of WCF Wolves from last year against Dallas. Just no rhyme or reason behind what they were attempting to do offensively, Finch looking like a rookie coach with zero control, every player doing dumb **** they didn’t do all year, and ANT playing large portions of the game with two hands around his neck.

Golden State is going to make these games a grind, but you have to at least attempt to get something going in the paint when the Warriors are trying to rim protect with Draymond and Butler. Maddening game.
Agree we should have done more in the paint (looking at you, Randle and Edwards) but I am taking it as just an off shooting night and trying not to panic. I mean they went 5-29 (thanks to 3 makes from Naz) from three and were outshot by Draymond punchable face Green and Buddy Hield. That won't happen most nights. The defense was good most of the game as well. So, just a fluke, hopefully.
 
Ok fine.

Simply put, the Wolves played like crap. They couldn't shoot and even when Ant was smart enough to realize he could get to the lane at will he couldn't finish until they were down by 20. And even with Curry out Golden State is too good to come back against from that far down when their role guys are hitting shots.

That is the worst game I've seen them play in a long time, maybe all year. And watching the game I didn't see anything Golden State was doing to cause it - it was all self-inflicted which has been a problem with these team all year and really for a lot longer. From Ant to Finch to Randle to Rudy to the bench, these guys can coast and make dumb plays.

Let me go back - the zone has me a bit concerned since they've struggled against zones in the past. But pretty much if they play like this they're not going to win the series and probably won't win a game. I have to believe the team we saw against the Lakers and the last 20 or so games of the season is the real Wolves. If it is, this series is far from over - Curry or no Curry. (and I hope we get Curry back). Wolves by 30 on Thursday.
I like ANT as a player, I really do. But the insistence that he has arrived has been rushed. He's still young and can get there, but I just don't see him as more than an All-star and 2nd/3rd team all NBA guy at best. He's a highlight reel player but doesn't do much more than score. His defense is good, his passing is OK and his rebounding is OK. He doesn't bring enough to the table to be in that "face of the league" conversation because he will never be a superstar and NBA champion if he doesn't develop more facets of his game.

Jokic became an adequate defender after years of criticism about him being lazy on that end. He also continued to develop his offensive game. Giannis has worked on and improved his shooting through the years. Curry worked very hard on becoming a better defender. Even Tatum, for all of his cringeworthy personality flaws, has never stopped improving in every facet of the game, remains available and is a perennial NBA 1st teamer and NBA champion.

At this point, I'd put ANT's career trajectory on par with Gervin, English, McGrady or Mello. Good players and great scorers and HOFers, but never could lead a team to a championship. I hope I'm wrong but I just don't see the MJ/Kobe/LeBron/Curry level stuff in him yet.
 
Ok fine.

Simply put, the Wolves played like crap. They couldn't shoot and even when Ant was smart enough to realize he could get to the lane at will he couldn't finish until they were down by 20. And even with Curry out Golden State is too good to come back against from that far down when their role guys are hitting shots.

That is the worst game I've seen them play in a long time, maybe all year. And watching the game I didn't see anything Golden State was doing to cause it - it was all self-inflicted which has been a problem with these team all year and really for a lot longer. From Ant to Finch to Randle to Rudy to the bench, these guys can coast and make dumb plays.

Let me go back - the zone has me a bit concerned since they've struggled against zones in the past. But pretty much if they play like this they're not going to win the series and probably won't win a game. I have to believe the team we saw against the Lakers and the last 20 or so games of the season is the real Wolves. If it is, this series is far from over - Curry or no Curry. (and I hope we get Curry back). Wolves by 30 on Thursday.
I like ANT as a player, I really do. But the insistence that he has arrived has been rushed. He's still young and can get there, but I just don't see him as more than an All-star and 2nd/3rd team all NBA guy at best. He's a highlight reel player but doesn't do much more than score. His defense is good, his passing is OK and his rebounding is OK. He doesn't bring enough to the table to be in that "face of the league" conversation because he will never be a superstar and NBA champion if he doesn't develop more facets of his game.

Jokic became an adequate defender after years of criticism about him being lazy on that end. He also continued to develop his offensive game. Giannis has worked on and improved his shooting through the years. Curry worked very hard on becoming a better defender. Even Tatum, for all of his cringeworthy personality flaws, has never stopped improving in every facet of the game, remains available and is a perennial NBA 1st teamer and NBA champion.

At this point, I'd put ANT's career trajectory on par with Gervin, English, McGrady or Mello. Good players and great scorers and HOFers, but never could lead a team to a championship. I hope I'm wrong but I just don't see the MJ/Kobe/LeBron/Curry level stuff in him yet.
Respectfully disagree as someone closer to it. He's improved every year in the league. He's an amazing leader and has a huge fire to win. His play-making has gotten better every year as well, and he could easily be all defense if he didn't have to do so much on offense. I mean, he's probably going to finish 6th or 7th for MVP this year and he's 23. He's never played less than 72 games in a season.

Through Age 23 He has 3 all-star appearances and will have 2 all-nba 2nd Team appearances. That's right there with Tatum at the same age.
 
How do we not have an obnoxious Knicks fan in here? And we have an Indy fan somewhere, don't we?
I am an obnoxious Indy fan does that count?

Here are some things to talk myself into keeping it going...
Pacers shot 24 uncontested 3s in game 1.
Cavs made an avg of 2.3 passes per possession, the lowest team in the entire NBA averaged 2.7 during the season. The Pacers help less than almost anybody and the Cavs played into it by letting the ball stick. Pacers avg 3.3 passes per poss. Cavs shot off the dribble instead while the Pacers shot off the catch vs closeout.

The game was honestly not very close in starters v starters minutes and crunch time. Mobley was -20 and Mitchell was -19. Pacers entire bench was negative. Pacers will probably shorten the bench at some point and while I think the Cavs depth is impressive, it probably matters less in close playoff games than over the course of 82.

No matter what you think about the context, the shooting will obviously get closer than game1. Pacers are going to have to do better on the aggression/hustle stats. They got beat to every 50/50 ball and now you have a desperate home team. Loose balls, turnovers, steals, long rebounds, need to go way better than game 1 for the Pacers to keep it going. Also, if they're serious about the defense they played in game 1 (i.e. only helping at the rim), Mitchell is going to be successful driving a LOT. Maybe they are willing to live with him scoring 40 tonight, but he probably will.
First of all…. Yessssssssss!

Game 2 felt a lot different from game 1 because the Cavs made everything early and nothing late plus the wild finish, but a lot of things remained. Pacers not helping on drives by design is falling somewhere between genius and suicide but they ARE taking a lot of Cavs role players away. Mitchell may score 40 in every game the rest of the way.

Still getting crushed on 50/50 balls and hustle stats but NOT IN THE FINAL MINUTE!

Ty Jerome was absolutely brutal in every way. So many Pacers stepped up to keep it within reach until the big dogs showed up. Mathurin, Nemb, Nesmith AGAIN.

Still going to keep saying we need more from Hali and Siakam to win this series and beyond. Pacers are super balanced right now and on fire, but the stars need to be stars more often if we’re serious about a championship.

Also, yesssssssss see you in Indy
 
He's still young and can get there, but I just don't see him as more than an All-star and 2nd/3rd team all NBA guy at best.
Sheesh. I think his upside is best player in the league. Already one west final and now a semifinal as best player on the team. He’s a real star.
My point was that he's still a step or two away right now. Last night showed that. He's not on a team full of scrubs. He's got a former 4x DPOY, a good veteran PG, a former All-star in Randle and a former 6th man of the year plus some good role players. Minny has a good roster, so he isn't like early LeBron in Cleveland dragging a bunch of nobodys through the playoffs.

I think he has a chance to get there, but just isn't there yet. He's on par with Donovan Mitchell and Tyrese Haliburton right now. We'll see.
 
Ok fine.

Simply put, the Wolves played like crap. They couldn't shoot and even when Ant was smart enough to realize he could get to the lane at will he couldn't finish until they were down by 20. And even with Curry out Golden State is too good to come back against from that far down when their role guys are hitting shots.

That is the worst game I've seen them play in a long time, maybe all year. And watching the game I didn't see anything Golden State was doing to cause it - it was all self-inflicted which has been a problem with these team all year and really for a lot longer. From Ant to Finch to Randle to Rudy to the bench, these guys can coast and make dumb plays.

Let me go back - the zone has me a bit concerned since they've struggled against zones in the past. But pretty much if they play like this they're not going to win the series and probably won't win a game. I have to believe the team we saw against the Lakers and the last 20 or so games of the season is the real Wolves. If it is, this series is far from over - Curry or no Curry. (and I hope we get Curry back). Wolves by 30 on Thursday.
I like ANT as a player, I really do. But the insistence that he has arrived has been rushed. He's still young and can get there, but I just don't see him as more than an All-star and 2nd/3rd team all NBA guy at best. He's a highlight reel player but doesn't do much more than score. His defense is good, his passing is OK and his rebounding is OK. He doesn't bring enough to the table to be in that "face of the league" conversation because he will never be a superstar and NBA champion if he doesn't develop more facets of his game.

Jokic became an adequate defender after years of criticism about him being lazy on that end. He also continued to develop his offensive game. Giannis has worked on and improved his shooting through the years. Curry worked very hard on becoming a better defender. Even Tatum, for all of his cringeworthy personality flaws, has never stopped improving in every facet of the game, remains available and is a perennial NBA 1st teamer and NBA champion.

At this point, I'd put ANT's career trajectory on par with Gervin, English, McGrady or Mello. Good players and great scorers and HOFers, but never could lead a team to a championship. I hope I'm wrong but I just don't see the MJ/Kobe/LeBron/Curry level stuff in him yet.
WTF he had first team votes this year and he's 23.
 
He's still young and can get there, but I just don't see him as more than an All-star and 2nd/3rd team all NBA guy at best.
Sheesh. I think his upside is best player in the league. Already one west final and now a semifinal as best player on the team. He’s a real star.
My point was that he's still a step or two away right now. Last night showed that. He's not on a team full of scrubs. He's got a former 4x DPOY, a good veteran PG, a former All-star in Randle and a former 6th man of the year plus some good role players. Minny has a good roster, so he isn't like early LeBron in Cleveland dragging a bunch of nobodys through the playoffs.

I think he has a chance to get there, but just isn't there yet. He's on par with Donovan Mitchell and Tyrese Haliburton right now. We'll see.
Both the Timberwolves and Celtics shot incredibly poorly. Why do you give the Celtics a pass based on statistical variance but not Edwards? The latter was amazing all year from three. They just weren't going in last night.
 
Ok fine.

Simply put, the Wolves played like crap. They couldn't shoot and even when Ant was smart enough to realize he could get to the lane at will he couldn't finish until they were down by 20. And even with Curry out Golden State is too good to come back against from that far down when their role guys are hitting shots.

That is the worst game I've seen them play in a long time, maybe all year. And watching the game I didn't see anything Golden State was doing to cause it - it was all self-inflicted which has been a problem with these team all year and really for a lot longer. From Ant to Finch to Randle to Rudy to the bench, these guys can coast and make dumb plays.

Let me go back - the zone has me a bit concerned since they've struggled against zones in the past. But pretty much if they play like this they're not going to win the series and probably won't win a game. I have to believe the team we saw against the Lakers and the last 20 or so games of the season is the real Wolves. If it is, this series is far from over - Curry or no Curry. (and I hope we get Curry back). Wolves by 30 on Thursday.
I like ANT as a player, I really do. But the insistence that he has arrived has been rushed. He's still young and can get there, but I just don't see him as more than an All-star and 2nd/3rd team all NBA guy at best. He's a highlight reel player but doesn't do much more than score. His defense is good, his passing is OK and his rebounding is OK. He doesn't bring enough to the table to be in that "face of the league" conversation because he will never be a superstar and NBA champion if he doesn't develop more facets of his game.

Jokic became an adequate defender after years of criticism about him being lazy on that end. He also continued to develop his offensive game. Giannis has worked on and improved his shooting through the years. Curry worked very hard on becoming a better defender. Even Tatum, for all of his cringeworthy personality flaws, has never stopped improving in every facet of the game, remains available and is a perennial NBA 1st teamer and NBA champion.

At this point, I'd put ANT's career trajectory on par with Gervin, English, McGrady or Mello. Good players and great scorers and HOFers, but never could lead a team to a championship. I hope I'm wrong but I just don't see the MJ/Kobe/LeBron/Curry level stuff in him yet.
WTF he had first team votes this year and he's 23.
He's not going to be 1st team, is he? I could make a list of players that "received 1st place votes" through the years and you'd realize how insignificant that is.

Sure he's young and has got plenty of time, but this is also year 5.

Good Lord, I've actually essentially called him a future HOFer and stated he's on par with some of the greatest scorers in NBA history. I'm not calling him a scrub. I just don't think he's at the Curry/LeBron/Jokic/Giannis level yet. I feel like a lot of people are trying to put him there (in the media, not here) and I'm just pushing back a bit against that is all.
 
He's still young and can get there, but I just don't see him as more than an All-star and 2nd/3rd team all NBA guy at best.
Sheesh. I think his upside is best player in the league. Already one west final and now a semifinal as best player on the team. He’s a real star.
My point was that he's still a step or two away right now. Last night showed that. He's not on a team full of scrubs. He's got a former 4x DPOY, a good veteran PG, a former All-star in Randle and a former 6th man of the year plus some good role players. Minny has a good roster, so he isn't like early LeBron in Cleveland dragging a bunch of nobodys through the playoffs.

I think he has a chance to get there, but just isn't there yet. He's on par with Donovan Mitchell and Tyrese Haliburton right now. We'll see.
Both the Timberwolves and Celtics shot incredibly poorly. Why do you give the Celtics a pass based on statistical variance but not Edwards? The latter was amazing all year from three. They just weren't going in last night.
Wat?

I didn't give the Celtics a pass, nor do I think Edwards and the Wolves won't turn it around. I think both teams will shoot better and will win likely win their next game.
 
He's still young and can get there, but I just don't see him as more than an All-star and 2nd/3rd team all NBA guy at best.
Sheesh. I think his upside is best player in the league. Already one west final and now a semifinal as best player on the team. He’s a real star.
My point was that he's still a step or two away right now. Last night showed that. He's not on a team full of scrubs. He's got a former 4x DPOY, a good veteran PG, a former All-star in Randle and a former 6th man of the year plus some good role players. Minny has a good roster, so he isn't like early LeBron in Cleveland dragging a bunch of nobodys through the playoffs.

I think he has a chance to get there, but just isn't there yet. He's on par with Donovan Mitchell and Tyrese Haliburton right now. We'll see.

I think the biggest different between what your are seeing/saying and what the Ant stans are seeing/saying is his game really does seem to improve and change in the playoffs. As opposed to a Melo/TMac/Gervin, he is 100% ready for the big moments and has an uncommon swagger and confidence that really plays into being the best player on a team in the playoffs.
 
@Jayrod friendly FFA wager that Edwards makes an All-NBA first team before his career is over?
I'm confident, barring injury, he'll make at least one and maybe two. I'd bet on whether he makes 3 or not.

Here's a list of guys I think are comparable to ANT that have made 1-2 1st team all-NBA teams and have no rings:
  • Damian Lillard
  • Dominique Wilkins
  • Latrell Sprewell
  • Devin Booker
  • Chris Mullin
  • Grant Hill
  • Paul George
  • Penny Hardaway
  • Bernard King
  • T-Mac
  • Dave Bing
 
Maybe I need to clarify my ANT take as this:

RIGHT NOW, he isn't a 1st team all-NBA face of the league guy. I've seen that promoted in the media and online.

I think he is 2 steps away.

Step 1: 1st team All NBA, consistent threat to go to the Finals in the playoffs.
Step 2: Serious MVP candidate and NBA champion.

I think he'll get to step 1. I have doubts he'll get to step 2.

Some people are already acting like he has done both. Same thing happened with Ja Morant before his fall from grace. Highlight reel dunks don't win championships, but the talking heads and even some former NBA guys don't realize that it seems.
 
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@Jayrod friendly FFA wager that Edwards makes an All-NBA first team before his career is over?
I'm confident, barring injury, he'll make at least one and maybe two. I'd bet on whether he makes 3 or not.

Here's a list of guys I think are comparable to ANT that have made 1-2 1st team all-NBA teams and have no rings:
  • Damian Lillard
  • Dominique Wilkins
  • Latrell Sprewell
  • Devin Booker
  • Chris Mullin
  • Grant Hill
  • Paul George
  • Penny Hardaway
  • Bernard King
  • T-Mac
  • Dave Bing
The way things are now, guys that consistently play 65+ games will end up making more All-NBA teams than they probably deserve or would have in the past. We may already be seeing that with a player like Tatum. (Meaning that if other players had hit the 65 games played mark, Tatum may not have been a first team All-NBA selection as often.)

ANT has played at least 72 games in all 5 seasons since he came to MIN. His ppg, PER, VORP, and TS% have gone up every season so far. If the Wolves keep winning playoff series and / or start hitting 50 wins consistently, Edwards should start seeing more All NBA votes. On the flip side, ANT may suffer in the new positionless voting model for All NBA teams, but if the top centers and forwards struggle to get in enough games played, ANT will be on a lot of ballots.
 
Last edited:
Maybe I need to clarify my ANT take as this:

RIGHT NOW, he isn't a 1st team all-NBA face of the league guy. I've seen that promoted in the media and online.

I think he is 2 steps away.

Step 1: 1st team All NBA, consistent threat to go to the Finals in the playoffs.
Step 2: Serious MVP candidate and NBA champion.

I think he'll get to step 1. I have doubts he'll get to step 2.

Some people are already acting like he has done both. Same thing happened with Ja Morant before his fall from grace. Highlight reel dunks don't win championships, but the talking heads and even some former NBA guys don't realize that it seems.
This seems a tad silly to me considering I think most everyone would have ANT's 23 year old season and progression versus SGA's 23 year old season and progression; and we've seen how SGA has progressed.
 
Maybe I need to clarify my ANT take as this:

RIGHT NOW, he isn't a 1st team all-NBA face of the league guy. I've seen that promoted in the media and online.

I think he is 2 steps away.

Step 1: 1st team All NBA, consistent threat to go to the Finals in the playoffs.
Step 2: Serious MVP candidate and NBA champion.

I think he'll get to step 1. I have doubts he'll get to step 2.

Some people are already acting like he has done both. Same thing happened with Ja Morant before his fall from grace. Highlight reel dunks don't win championships, but the talking heads and even some former NBA guys don't realize that it seems.
This seems a tad silly to me considering I think most everyone would have ANT's 23 year old season and progression versus SGA's 23 year old season and progression; and we've seen how SGA has progressed.
You're a tad silly.
 

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