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☹ Official 2020 Las Vegas Raiders thread ☹ (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Hankmoody
- Start date
Chadstroma
Footballguy
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Chadstroma
Footballguy
QB Marcus Mariota returned to practice; Signed WR De'Mornay Pierson-El to the practice squad; Released QB DeShone Kizer from the practice squad.
Garrett
Footballguy
Josh Allen is obviously playing with a lot of confidence right now, but Maxx Crosby is the kind of rangy/high motor DE that will make him pay for that if he is overconfident in or around the pocket.
I’m not sure why many seem to think the Raiders can’t compete with Buffalo?
I’m not sure why many seem to think the Raiders can’t compete with Buffalo?
Stompin' Tom Connors
Footballguy
Injuries and the Bills being solid on both sides make this game hard for sure.Garrett said:
But I think we'll compete.
GO RAIDERS!
DocHolliday
Footballguy
I hate watching TD Lamb catch passes every week while Ruggs has done nothing but be injured. It’s early in their careers but the Raiders could really use a WR. Can’t build the D on draft day when the org is trying to find a WR.
I hate seeing this too. But to be fair, the half game Ruggs was healthy, it was clear he was a huge part of the offense. If it weren't for injury, I'm confident he would be right there with Lamb. Maybe not in yards because I don't think we'll ever see DC throw for over 500 yards in a game like Dak, but Ruggs' talent was evident.
I think I hate seeing Jeudy make acrobatic TD catches from a 3rd string QB more because it the Broncos. Either way, Ruggs will someday prove he was the right pick, hopefully...
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Ed Wood
Footballguy
I've had my say on Lamb > Ruggs so I'll leave that be. But the offense isn't the problem and when Ruggs gets back it'll be even better. But, yep, the defense is borderline atrocious. I don't know about the numbers but I don't notice any appreciable improvement over the 2-1/4 years Guenther has been in charge of it. I'd say it may be time to look in another direction at the end of the season.
Props to Carr. I'm not sold but four games without an interception is damn good no matter how far down the field you're throwing the ball--and I think he's throwing the ball further down the field than in the past two seasons. And I don't blame the fumbles entirely on him. I think his pocket awareness is adequate, possibly could be a little better. Need to get the line healthy and I think that problem will be resolved.
And now to the house of horrors. Fortunately they'll catch the Chiefs on a short week but I don't think any betting line will be high enough. I was afraid they'd be 1-5 after 6 games so 2-4 would be a "blessing" of sorts. Then after 6 games I thought the schedule softened up. Not anymore. After the Chiefs come the Browns and Mayfield and Beckham and Landry and Chubb. This defense is nowhere near ready for that. Then the Chargers with Herbert who already looks comfortable with the NFL game--even if he is only 14 years old.
Could seriously be looking at 2-7 unless the defense tightens up and keeps them in games so Jacobs can be more of a factor--52 carries in 2 wins, 31 in 2 losses.
Chadstroma
Footballguy
We lost to a very good Bills team that is nearly full strength and we are missing a bunch of key guys on offense and one key guy on D.
Offense: We are missing a bunch of key players. Williams, Ruggs, Edwards, Incognito and Brown. If not for an illegal formation, this game may have broke different. The turnovers sucked but overall considering how good the Bills D is and how much we are missing players- I continue to not have much concern at all for our offense once we get out guys back. We can score.
Defense: Here is the issue. Still no QB rush as the biggest issue. Collins left the game I believe but hasn't done anything. Littleton a huge disappointment (6 tackles but still not a difference maker... yet?). We are not good enough here. This is where we are losing games. It isn't injuries either because we got Kwiat back this game and was missing Arnette (important and key but he is one guy).
Offense: We are missing a bunch of key players. Williams, Ruggs, Edwards, Incognito and Brown. If not for an illegal formation, this game may have broke different. The turnovers sucked but overall considering how good the Bills D is and how much we are missing players- I continue to not have much concern at all for our offense once we get out guys back. We can score.
Defense: Here is the issue. Still no QB rush as the biggest issue. Collins left the game I believe but hasn't done anything. Littleton a huge disappointment (6 tackles but still not a difference maker... yet?). We are not good enough here. This is where we are losing games. It isn't injuries either because we got Kwiat back this game and was missing Arnette (important and key but he is one guy).
Chadstroma
Footballguy
The Carr haters have had three main complaints. 1) Doesn't throw down field. 2) Doesn't run. 3) Those two plays where he threw it away.
Last game, he sure did throw down field and he ran. But we lost. So... it will be his fault.
Stompin' Tom Connors
Footballguy
Honestly I think this is the biggest weakness of our D. We have variable coverage and ability to tackle downfield, and our 3rd down stop/protection habitually gives up yards so the opposing team can get the first down.
But I think a lot of that is solved with better pass rush up front. Will need to rewatch this game but in previous games, Crosby often gets doubled/chipped, but the other guys on the line just don't provide that rush at the QB. They may be getting better, but if we're pressuring the QB and blitzing effectively, we shouldn't be giving opposing QBs the time for routes to develop and hit guys past the sticks.
If this improves, I think the whole level of the D improves.
Definitely a kick in the gut game. We could have been in there through the 3rd. Moreau's penalty prevented us from being up at the half with the ball back to start the 3rd Q -- huge momentum killer. Carr played well but also lost the handle on the ball a few times and needs to get better.
The 4 consecutive series where we punted, fumbled and turned the ball over twice, and turned over on downs was the momentum killer we never recovered from.
Real disappointment as the Bills were not on their game either. These are the games we should have won.
It doesn't make a difference that looking at the first 5 games in preseason, I thought we'd be at 2-3. It looks like that's going to be the case.
Hoping we heal up, get Brown and Ruggs back after the bye, and use this to further define who we are and turn this around and make a run for the playoffs.
Stompin' Tom Connors
Footballguy
That 49 yard bomb to Agholor could not have been thrown better by anyone.
If it weren't for Moreau's line awareness, the outcome of this game may very well have been different. The Bills D were not playing well outside of some solid run defense where we put it between the tackles, and we could have swung momentum.
We need to be more disciplined, period. Had just one turnover in our two wins. We had three turnovers in the Pats game. Two in this game. A minus-4 turnover differential on the season.
Penalties are also killing us. Four defensive penalties on four separate drives ended with a total of 24 points for the Bills.
It's not a stretch to say we're beating ourselves.
ICON211
Footballguy
Whatever Guenther is doing it is not working no matter who plays and who does not. The opposing QB is rarely under any pressure and certainly not consistently. When you change players and the results are the same I am going to put the blame on the scheme and the coaching.
And the penalty on Jacobs was typical and comical and the roughing the passer they called on us was as well. I don't care what other people say about us whining about the refs because time and time again we get the short end of the calls.
Chadstroma
Footballguy
That Jacobs penalty wasn't lowering his helmet to initiate contact but him lowering to protect himself from getting obliterated.
The Hankins penalty for roughing the passer was pretty bad too.
Stompin' Tom Connors
Footballguy
Ah, the grand unifier of our sub: REFS SUCK!
DocHolliday
Footballguy
With Chubb out, it will be Hunt racking up rushing and receiving yards in gobs against that Pitiful d.
dcgangstas
Footballguy
Don't get me started, Doc.DocHolliday said:
I was throwing things at the TV during the draft when I saw them take Ruggs instead of Lamb. We had the next DeAndre Hopkins fall in our laps and Mayock and Gruden passed on him for a Ty Hill "clone".
I'm also bothered because I know that Clelin Ferrell will never live up to that 4th overall selection.
ICON211
Footballguy
Ferrell is a good player, but that pick should have been Josh Allen. And I think most people wanted Allen at the time so it's not hindsight. But overall, I like the job Mayock has done.
Chadstroma
Footballguy
If Ruggs is a Hill clone then I am all in on that. Hill does more for the KC offense than he own individual production and I think we got a small taste of that from Ruggs too.
Ferrell was ranked 19th out of all edge rushers going into yesterday's game where he got a lower snap count for whatever reason (78%) and was moved inside at times. He finished last season ranked 9th out of all edge rushers (I think it was the last 4 or 5 games) grading out above guys like Nick Bosa and even Mack. I fear Ferrell will be a victim of two things, lack of sack production and where he was drafted. It doesn't look like he will bw a double digit sack guy and for many, specifically fantasy football guys, sacks are all that count. He does a lot very well though that doesn't show up in stats or you have to dig further for those kind of stats (hurries and knock downs for example). Now, you can debate if that type of player that isn't top elite at pass rushing is worth that draft spot or not and I understand the viewpoint it isn't but he is and continues to be a good player.
Littleton? Collins? Where they hell is their impact? I was pumped when we got him in FA and so far, such a bummer. I was neutral on Collins but after looking at what he did with the Cowboys expected him to make an impact. Nothing. Is Joyner playing at safety or slot? I wonder if rolling the dice on Earl Thomas would be a help but it wouldn't help our rush which is what we need more of for sure.
32 Counter Pass
Footballguy
The team has spent draft capital on defense. They have dedicated a significant amount of money in FA acquire defenses players. Fans get excited and the hype train gains steam. Yet the same result on the scored board. Rinse and repeat next year. Gunther is the issue and until Gruden recognizes it gonna be the same d, same old.
This is not a playoff defense. Period.
bet the over in all Raider games until further notice.
This is not a playoff defense. Period.
bet the over in all Raider games until further notice.
Ed Wood
Footballguy
I said in a previous post re: Guenther I didn't have the numbers on the Raiders defense during that time. "It doesn't mattter, Josh," Dubow does tho.
https://twitter.com/JoshDubowAP/status/1312997527310929921?ref_src=twsrc^tfw
#Raiders defense under Paul Guenther:
Points per game: 27.9, 31st
Yards per play: 6.1, 31st
Passer rating against: 101.6, 31st
Sacks: 49, 32nd
Takeaways: 34, 32nd
Perhaps prescient comment in that thread: "I bet he’ll get fired after this KC game when we give up another 30+ points. Heading into the bye week lol."
I'd say that's a distinct possibility. Gruden says "he's a good coach and the mistakes are correctable." The numbers--at least as Raiders D coordinator--suggest otherwise.
https://twitter.com/JoshDubowAP/status/1312997527310929921?ref_src=twsrc^tfw
#Raiders defense under Paul Guenther:
Points per game: 27.9, 31st
Yards per play: 6.1, 31st
Passer rating against: 101.6, 31st
Sacks: 49, 32nd
Takeaways: 34, 32nd
Perhaps prescient comment in that thread: "I bet he’ll get fired after this KC game when we give up another 30+ points. Heading into the bye week lol."
I'd say that's a distinct possibility. Gruden says "he's a good coach and the mistakes are correctable." The numbers--at least as Raiders D coordinator--suggest otherwise.
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Charlie Harper
Footballguy
Gunther sucks. Knew it since he was hired, CIN D was average at it's best under him.
Cable is great. See how he's done with a position group that's lost people? Defended his addition to the staff. Don't only why Gruden can't see the difference between those two.
For those crying about Ruggs. There's no coincidence our offense has stalled without him. His speed is like Steph Curry's 3 point shot....it opens up the field for everyone else. That's why Gruden rolled the dice on AB and why they picked Ruggs over Lamb. Give it time. Everything I've seen from Ruggs so far has me impressed.
Cable is great. See how he's done with a position group that's lost people? Defended his addition to the staff. Don't only why Gruden can't see the difference between those two.
For those crying about Ruggs. There's no coincidence our offense has stalled without him. His speed is like Steph Curry's 3 point shot....it opens up the field for everyone else. That's why Gruden rolled the dice on AB and why they picked Ruggs over Lamb. Give it time. Everything I've seen from Ruggs so far has me impressed.
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32 Counter Pass
Footballguy
Chadstroma
Footballguy
Looks like it is time to give up on Key too. I was hearing a lot of encouraging things about him in camp but not seeing anything on the field.
Chadstroma
Footballguy
Hurst to reserve COVID list
DocHolliday
Footballguy
joey
Footballguy
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Stompin' Tom Connors
Footballguy
Agree -- he wasn't all-pro, but he steadily progressed and was making an impact.
Another blow in yet another injury riddled season.
NFL football is a war of attrition, so you can't use injuries as an excuse. If anything, I'd expect Gruden and Mayock to have been building not just competitive starters, but quality depth for "next man up" football.
Too many injuries has robbed us of the former (though I'd say we've been fairly competitive so far -- even in this last Bills game, we beat ourselves more than we were beaten -- at least through the half).
But we sorely lack depth, and are still missing key components up front and in the backfield to give this D some oomph and help the offense stay in games. We fix that, get some key offensive pieces back, and we keep our upward trajectory.
DocHolliday
Footballguy
There’s always next season! Said during every season except one in the last 20 years. Gotta live being a Raider fan.Stompin' Tom Connors said:
Chadstroma
Footballguy
Ruggs practicing
Chadstroma
Footballguy
No, I wouldn't. Renfrow will get targets specially with Edwards still out. He might even get more targets with Ruggs loosening things up and defenses keying on Waller and worried about Ruggs speed.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Chiefs secondary is very underrated. Maybe not any more, but IIRC Carr Hans’t played well at KC in the past against lesser KC defenses. I’d downgrade all LV players for this game. And yes I did type OAK before deleting & retyping “LV”. heh
Considering benching Carr for Danny Dimes at QB2 in my superflex this weekend
Stompin' Tom Connors
Footballguy
10/19/2017
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Very different teams on both sides of the ball. Man, looking at that game - the numbers put up by both Carr (417 3/0) and Alex Smith (343 3/0) are just eye popping. And Crabtree with the game winner.
I don’t expect this game to be that high scoring for the Raiders, but it would be fuN if it was.
https://www.espn.com/nfl/boxscore?gameId=400951571
CGRdrJoe
Footballguy
I don't see the KC secondary as being underrated, in fact I'd almost argue they've had the one of the easiest schedules in the NFL so far. Houston has turned out to be a turd post Hopkins, SD had a rookie QB start with almost no first team reps and he put up decent numbers. Baltimore is a run heavy team and the Pats were without out SuperCam but there were some missed throws that should have been TD's for the Pats. Their run D is nothing special so Jacobs should be able to soften up the D for Waller.
DocHolliday
Footballguy
I would downgrade Jacobs and upgrade Carr. The Raiders will be playing from behind after the fourth quarter. Carr will be dinking and dunking all game to Renfrow and Waller. I expect 270 yards and 2 TDS from Carr. Raiders lose 38-14.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Sounds like you’re underrating the KC defense to me. Validating my point really.
We’ll see what happens on Sunday i guess, but I’ve been impressed with KC’s defense this year. Their secondary is excellent. Their DBs have been solid & the safeties are hard hitters. They’ve also played pretty clean, and don’t seem to give up a lot of penalty yards.
Weird you talk SOS allegedly being weak for KC (BAL’s only bad game, btw) yet you can’t dismiss HOU as being “a turd” without acknowledging that they had the toughest 3-game start to the season. Their offense looked a heck of a lot better week 4 than weeks 1-3. So SOS matters for the Chiefs but not the Texans if it helps you make a point?
And outside of game 1, Jacobs hasn’t been awesome. As you mentioned, he should run all over KC. If he doesn’t maybe that’ll say something about the Raiders/Jacobs.
The Chiefs biggest defensive weakness is against the run, but that doesn’t usually bite them because of the game scripts they generate. They have a stout secondary so if a team can’t run run run, they’re gonna be playing from behind in a hurry.
As for the Pats without Cam, teams play the team on the schedule that week. NEP’s defense was still tough. It wasn’t a cakewalk. And they did what you expect a good defense to do against Hoyer & Stidham - they had what, 5-6 Ints? You can’t say NE *almost* threw a bunch of TDs against them so they aren’t that good defensively. That’s magical thinking.
I hope the Raiders win this week. I’m not betting on it.
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CGRdrJoe
Footballguy
wk 1: da Johnson 11 for 77, 1 TD
wk 2: Ekeler 16 for 93 & Kelley 23 for 64
wk 3: Lamar 9 for 83
wk 4: Harris 17 for 100 & Burkhead 11 for 45.
So a mixed bag and I think you are probably right but it's covid football and there won't be the crowd to factor in.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Definitely a potential garbage time game. The secondary is a strength for KC though so I have concerns about the production - but if KC goes into prevent mode Q4 up a couple scores you’re likely right.
CGRdrJoe
Footballguy
From a gambling stand point I've watched all of the KC games, Monday night I had any NE player (outside of 4) for the first TD and so I payed attention to every throwSounds like you’re underrating the KC defense to me. Validating my point really.
We’ll see what happens on Sunday i guess, but I’ve been impressed with KC’s defense this year. Their secondary is excellent. Their DBs have been solid & the safeties are hard hitters. They’ve also played pretty clean, and don’t seem to give up a lot of penalty yards.
Weird you talk SOS allegedly being weak for KC (BAL’s only bad game, btw) you can’t dismiss HOU as being “a turd” without acknowledging that they had the toughest 3-game start to the season. Their offense looked a heck of a lot better week 4 than weeks 1-3. So SOS matters for the Chiefs but not the Texans if it helps you make a point?
And outside of game 1, Jacobs hasn’t been awesome. As you mentioned, he should run all over KC. If he doesn’t maybe that’ll say something about the Jacobs.
The Chiefs biggest defensive weakness is against the run, but that doesn’t usually bite them because of the game scripts they generate. They have a stout secondary so if a team can’t run run run, they’re gonna be playing from behind in a hurry.
As for the Pats without Cam, teams play the team on the schedule that week. NEP’s defense was still tough. It wasn’t a cakewalk. And they did what you expect a good defense to do against Hoyer & Stidham - they had what, 5-6 Ints? You can’t say NE *almost* threw a bunch of TDs against them so they sick. That’s magical thinking.
I hope the Raiders win this week. I’m not betting on it.
I would hope that Houston looked better in week 4 against an 0-3 Vikings team but their HC/GM f'd up trading Hopkins and the team has suffered for that.
I am not betting on the Raiders this weekend, our Defense is the same as it always is...HORRIBLE. However from a FF perspective I think Jacobs, Carr and Waller are viable options to put up some points. Carr has played bad in KC however it's put up or shut up time after saying how he is sick of losing, there will be no crowd noise.
Oh who am I kidding, it's the Raiders....
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
my main league’s game is against my oldest, best friend, a die-hard Raiders fan. I put Carr back in for the garbage time points and to vex my buddy. I like messing with his rooting interests. Carr throws a TD my buddy will be all “woohoo awwwww!”
DocHolliday
Footballguy
Love it.Hot Sauce Guy said:my main league’s game is against my oldest, best friend, a die-hard Raiders fan. I put Carr back in for the garbage time points and to vex my buddy. I like messing with his rooting interests. Carr throws a TD my buddy will be all “woohoo awwwww!”
Chadstroma
Footballguy
I rather lose my fantasy than see my Raiders lose. If I am going against Raiders, I might hope for another player to do better (Jacobs vs Carr or Renfrow vs Waller etc) but in the end, if I lose because the Raider players did well that is on me.... I should have put in a better lineup.Hot Sauce Guy said:my main league’s game is against my oldest, best friend, a die-hard Raiders fan. I put Carr back in for the garbage time points and to vex my buddy. I like messing with his rooting interests. Carr throws a TD my buddy will be all “woohoo awwwww!”
Stompin' Tom Connors
Footballguy
Ruggs and Brown back practicing.
https://www.silverandblackpride.com/2020/10/7/21506433/raiders-trent-brown-henry-ruggs-return-practice
Not sure if either will play but an undeniably great sign. If both are back for the Chiefs game, that's a big upgrade for our O.
https://www.silverandblackpride.com/2020/10/7/21506433/raiders-trent-brown-henry-ruggs-return-practice
Not sure if either will play but an undeniably great sign. If both are back for the Chiefs game, that's a big upgrade for our O.
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