ericttspikes
Footballguy
I think people underestimate Jony Ive's contribution to Apple's innovation. He and Jobs were a team. Jony's still at Apple. I'm confident he has a few more things coming out.
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Apple (AAPL) : Tim Cook announces iForum. Dodds and Bryant prepare shut down operations (1 Viewer)
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NCCommish
Footballguy
All I know is I heard all the same stuff when they ousted him. "Oh he's just one guy". Nearly killed them. Riding yesterdays products right now to all this new profit. Hope I am wrong as innovation is good for everyone.
ILUVBEER99
Footballguy
first off Jobs was a freak visionary, but even with him it wasn't like new groundbreaking things came out every year.NCCommish said:
iPod - Oct 2001
iPhone - June 2007
iPad - April 2010
Assuming iWatch comes out sometime this year that is pretty inline for putting out a new product. Whether or not it succeeds who knows, but people have been a bit off claiming innovation has stopped because it's been a few years for a new product category to be introduced.
If Jony Ive leaves then i'd be extremely worried, but so far there are no indications of that happening.
NCCommish
Footballguy
Since there is no truly Marxist system no one knows Marxism. And certainly if you think we should really put much stock into something that runs off the same two primal drives an infant does well I got a mortgage to sell you that has only been stepped on 40 times.
The Commish
Footballguy
bingoNCCommish said:
Mario Kart
Footballguy
Man, I like Apple products but I hate Apple stock. I was itching to jump in back at $400 and have been mentioning doing it last week before the split news. Now, in one week this has jumped ~70 points.
Might try to get in at 550 if it falls back down before the split. ARGH!!!!
It is difficult to pass up a stock at ~80 (post split) with such high dividends. I'd be buying for the dividends and if the stock jumps huge, then great. Looking to invest ~$4,000 or so.
Might try to get in at 550 if it falls back down before the split. ARGH!!!!
It is difficult to pass up a stock at ~80 (post split) with such high dividends. I'd be buying for the dividends and if the stock jumps huge, then great. Looking to invest ~$4,000 or so.
The stock is at equivalent of 85 right now, and the dividends at that stock price will be 2.2%. Not exactly a world beater on dividends.
Mario Kart
Footballguy
How is this thing going to react to the "big" purchase? Is Apple going to throw some money around now?
Still a buy right now?
Still a buy right now?
The Commish
Footballguy
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Insoxicated
Short Corner
Footballguy
saintfool
Dead sexy
they were losing the streaming music market to Spotify and Pandora. Beats gives them that and more.
Glad I asked, didn't realize there was some app that goes to. Would like to see someone scoop up Pandora because it is such a solid product.
fantasycurse42
Footballguy Jr.
I like Pandora as is... If someone bought them, I'd be scared they might change the product a little.
saintfool
Dead sexy
i don't know what their respective market shares look like but, IIRC, Spotify was big in Europe before landing in our domestic market. i would look at Spotify first before Pandora.
The Commish
Footballguy
I had no idea either. I use Spotify. It does everything I need/want. I can do my own playlists or just start a channel. Don't really need anything else.
Short Corner
Footballguy
Still a steep price for Beats. HTC just sold a 51% share of Beats in 2012-13 for $415M. Spotify is valued at $4B.
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Insoxicated
Yep. I use spotify most of the time and pandora occasionally. Tried Beats at the request of a buddy with Warner Music Group, just didn't get any reason to switch.
Todem
Footballguy
So again. A perfect lesson about investing in value companies. When everyone is running for the exit......you should going through the door. Especially on a company as strong as Apple.
The price the day I made this post was 455.49. Now obviously you can never time a bottom and I definitely was a little early. But for a patient, disciplined long term investor it was a a great entry point for those that missed the boat in the 200 and 300's.
Today Apple is 625.63 and heading for 7-1 split. The China Mobile deal went through, and more brand new innovative products are still yet to be brought to the market. I am confident that Apple will again be a trailblazer for another device we have yet to see. Again, that is the speculative nature of buying a technology company. But Apple is becoming more than that. Entertainment, telecommunications and more. I think it can hit 700 before the split.
Congratulations to those that had patience and did not listen to the noise. You are up a cool 37% in just under 17 months.
NutterButter
Footballguy
Making a respectable run at 700 before the split.That was kinda the joke
The Commish
Footballguy
Wager with buddy....they were either going home automation or all in on TV deal....I took home automation. Hope you're right on this one. They could do this correctly and dominate the industry or they could be just another group doing automated thermostats. We'll see.
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Insoxicated
Yep. Right now home automation is the wild west. Hundreds of companies making random crap and a couple companies making centralized systems that are either too pricey, not well designed, or not well integrated.
If any company could leverage their massive installed base of controls (phones/tablets) into a well designed whole home system that was simple enough for joe sixpack and susie homemmaker to install and use, it's Apple. IF they pull it off, it could be HUGE.
saintfool
Dead sexy
saintfool
Dead sexy
Personally, I think it is all tied to the split. Investors feel really good about that right now. After the split? Who knows...
Todem
Footballguy
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Insoxicated
Samsung hasn't really shown the ability to build a fully integrated ecosystem just yet. They're a hardware manufacturer who's stood on the shoulders of android. Sure they've skinned it, but arguably to the detriment of performance and aesthetics.
Their "new" OS, Tizen, has been pretty significantly improved... but it was way behind to start. I'd say there's no way you can consider Apple's iOS and Samsung's Tizen to be equals. Comparing proprietary interfaces like Samsung's smart TV vs Apple TV shows a similar gap in favor of Apple.
Bottom line... Samsung makes excellent hardware but has done a questionable job of developing software/UI design. Apple arguably lags a little big behind Samsung with regards to hardware, however has a significant advantage when it comes to ecosystem and user interface design.
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Insoxicated
Investors are tired of incremental product improvement in existing categories. I think you'll see a measurable sell off after the split with a corresponding dip... the size and duration of the dip hinges on the upcoming product announcements. They open strong in wearables / home automation and the news coupled with the lower (more accessible) stock price could see continued strength. A "new" iMac, iPhone 6 (slightly bigger, slightly faster), and incremental software news and things could stagnate for a bit IMO
total amateur opinion here of course. One benefit is the lower stock price post split WILL make the stock more accessible/appealing to a range of investors.
Todem
Footballguy
No....your mostly right. The next catalyst for the stock is brand new products and innovation. The next "thing". Coupled with the lower sticker price of the stock and you have another big rally in the price.
Earnings will continue to be robust. This company just makes incredible revenue and still has good margins. But that's not enough anymore. The stock is still cheap though. Think about this for a moment.
Current P/E = 15
Google's is 30
So what would happen if people start getting excited about a new product Apple introduces? It will start to trade at Google multiples eventually. which today would equal a stock price of:
$1320
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Insoxicated
I hear you there, though I think AAPL's P/E of 15x is MUCH healthier than GOOG's 30x. All things being equal, logical investor strategy would cause GOOG to drift down to AAPL not vice versa.
THAT said, there's a lot of variables in play with regards to maturity and future prospects of the two companies. I think that P/E gap says volumes about where investors see the two companies right now:
AAPL: Mature blue chip with limited prospects for upward growth given current product stable/pipeline.
GOOG: Growth blue chip with interesting prospects in a wide range of potentially lucrative categories (ISP, transport, energy, etc).
AAPL making a splash into a growth category would go a long way toward changing that perception as investors generally view them as having much higher chance of a home-run when entering a category than google. One Apple segment entry is worth 4-5 Google segment entries (numbers made up, but you get the idea).
THAT said, there's a lot of variables in play with regards to maturity and future prospects of the two companies. I think that P/E gap says volumes about where investors see the two companies right now:
AAPL: Mature blue chip with limited prospects for upward growth given current product stable/pipeline.
GOOG: Growth blue chip with interesting prospects in a wide range of potentially lucrative categories (ISP, transport, energy, etc).
AAPL making a splash into a growth category would go a long way toward changing that perception as investors generally view them as having much higher chance of a home-run when entering a category than google. One Apple segment entry is worth 4-5 Google segment entries (numbers made up, but you get the idea).
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Insoxicated
QUITE the opposite...
The split will bring AAPL down into a range where it can be added to the DOW. This will open a lot of doors for institutional investing which is a whole pool of money this stock hasn't necessarily been accessible to, lately.
The DOW thing would be very minor (if it happens) and I'm pretty sure institutional investors haven't had much of an issue "accessing" AAPL stock lately, lol.
The Commish
Footballguy
Problem is....there is no Jobs to guide this venture. We wouldn't be questioning their success in this area if he were still alive. It'd be a foregone conclusion.[icon] said:
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Insoxicated
There is no doubt Jobs was a tremendous guiding force in the company, but I'd be hesitant to say they are devoid of guidance or creative talent right now with Cook and Ive still plugging away.
It will be interesting for sure.
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The Commish
Footballguy
I'm not saying they are devoid of guidance. They have to prove themselves to me. So far, they've followed the blueprint that Jobs had laid out. Now they are beginning to chart their own course. We will know shortly if they have the goods to continue in Jobs' footsteps. I think they'll be "ok" but not close to Jobs. Time will tell. They are following the Jordan of computers.
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Insoxicated
NutterButter
Footballguy
So the split will if anything increase the price? Above you said they'll be a sell off after the split.[icon] said:
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Insoxicated
Just my .02 as a non-pro investor
• generally there is some profit taking after a split (esp if there's a run up prior to the split)
• Bringing the stock down to the lower range will allow it to be added to the DOW which would open AAPL up to a lot of retirement type accounts that lean heavily toward index funds and such. That could help increase value.
culdeus
Footballguy
SNP500 index funds hold a #### ton of AAPL. There isn't much play in Dow index funds anymore. You could spin dow entry as a negative at this point.
Some of the biggest snp funds like vanguard can hit as much as 11% AAPL.
Frankly, I have no idea if you can be a member of both. I don't know of one that is, but I've never really bothered to look into it.
