Are You A FBG Subscriber? (1 Viewer)

[Adam Harstad]

I've been a subscriber every year of FBGs' existence. Despite being staff now, I still actually have a paid subscription, since I bought a 3-year pack a couple years back. It might sound odd coming from a guy hired to generate content, but I do agree that the content isn't the main selling point of the subscription for me. There are a lot of smart and prolific guys on staff, but there are a lot of smart and prolific guys elsewhere, too- FBGs doesn't have a monopoly on quality fantasy analysis. What they do have a monopoly (or near-monopoly) on is ridiculous tools. The Draft Dominator is the easiest and most intuitive drafting software I've found, and I've not only been using it for a decade, I've also been recommending all of my leaguemates get at least the free version so our drafts will go more smoothly. The new Draft GM iPad app (which, granted, is not subscriber content- it's a separate purchase) is also extremely efficient, and I used it for a lot of my drafts this year. I've probably said every single year that the Data Dominator and Historical Data Dominator are worth the price of admission all by themselves. You can go ahead and add MyFBGs to that list, now that they've added the capability to link your leagues and upload rosters automatically. Just the ability to use MyFBGs to see who is a free agent in all of my leagues at once rather than having to check them all one-by-one probably saves me two to three hours a week, which adds up to 40+ hours a year. I value my time enough that I'd gladly drop 30 bones to save me 40 hours worth of it, even ignoring the other benefits.

My first year on the site, I wanted to check it out before I did subscribe. I will be next year

Glad you're here. You're a solid contributor.

msudaisy is the perfect example of why I think a subscriber-only forum is trouble. It would keep out too many good, quality contributors, and often we'd never even realize what we'd lost. I've belonged to several forums that have used a subscriber- or member-only model, and while I've seen it succeed (once), typically it wound up being a complete death knell for the forums as they either cut off all new blood entirely, or created a two-tier system that split their traffic. In my opinion, the Shark Pool's biggest strength is its sheer size and scope, and anything that dilutes that is trouble. Plus I'm not at all convinced that the quality of discourse would be any higher just because someone shelled out the $30.

With that said, and keeping in mind that I'm speaking solely from my experience as a subscriber and not as a representative of FBGs, I think the best solution would be a system of tags and filters. When you create a thread, you could tag it as "dynasty", "redraft", "subscriber", "IDP", whatever. Then each individual visitor to the site could use filters to remove any tags they weren't interested in. Make the "subscriber" tag only visible to subscribers, and then people would be free to discuss subscriber content right in the pool itself. It'd also give FBGs the functionality of a "Dynasty-only" or "IDP-only" forum without splitting traffic out of the Shark Pool. I know nothing about forum software and therefore don't have any clue how feasible such a system would be, but it seems to me like it would be the best of all worlds.

 

[MAC_32]

Having read some of the subscriber content for free during the offseason I will vouch the information is beneficial, but there is enough free information available out there for me to justify passing on the in-season content. If I didn't have the time to do my own research I'd consider it though.

 

[Adam Harstad]

I have been a subscriber before. I still spent most of my time here in the SP rather than reading subscriber content. I mainly just subscribed before to pay for using the SP.

Part of the reason why I would not spend time reading subscriber content is because I found that most of it had already been pretty thoroughly covered in the SP as soon as news broke. By the time something that might interest me was published in subscriber content, the issue was already old hat.

FBGs has been culling posters from the SP for a long time, adding them to staff. This has the effect of making SP content decline. If this is by agreement or the new staff members just decide to not post in SP anymore is not clear to me. But it makes sense from their perspective I suppose to get paid for the time instead of just sharing in the SP for nothing. The debate and discussion may not be as good though. So staff use alias to check the SP at times I think in their information gathering for some content they may be working on.

One thing I always liked about Anarchy is he would bring some of that content he felt needed more debate/discussion into the SP. Which I do think makes for a better overall discussion. But may be frowned upon by other staff.

There are many journalists and other knowledgeable people who post here in the SP who are not FBG staff. To get breaking news I have not found a better resource. If something is worth talking about or is news, it almost always makes it here to the SP pretty quickly after it happens (is about to happen).

As someone who recently made staff, I can assure you that no one is discouraged from participating in the pool. What I appreciate most about Joe and David is that they recognize that we're all just passionate fantasy owners rather than "professionals" or on a "career track". They largely let us decide how we want to participate, what features we want to take part in, what we want to write about, etc. On their part, I think it's a smart business decision, because it makes sure everyone is only doing what they want to do and feel passionately about. On my part, I appreciate it because it leaves me free to continue participating in fantasy football on my own terms. Joe and David aren't really big on "rules", per se (other than that if you commit to something, you better follow through on it)- mostly they just lay general guidelines and give us the autonomy to operate within them. I choose to participate in the pool because I've always participated in the pool, because I feel there's a ton of value to be gained by participating in the pool, and because I'm a pompous blowhard who loves to hear himself talk.

I'm reminded that correlation does not imply causation. I do think there's a correlation between making staff and disappearing from the shark pool, but I think there's a correlation between NOT making staff and disappearing from the shark pool. A lot of long-time contributors see their participation fall off over time and simply fade away. If one of those long-time contributors is tapped for a staff position based on the quality of their past contributions, that fade might look like it's connected to them becoming staff. Really, though, people drift away regardless of their life circumstances. I know that over the years my free time has ebbed and flowed, and when it's on a downswing, I post a lot less. My staff commitments do eat into my free time a bit, which limits the amount of time I have to post, but that's no different than if I'm picking up a bunch of overtime at a "regular" job, or if a family member gets sick and I have to take care of them, or any number of things which limit how much time I have to kill.

Also, if you want the best resource for breaking news, join Twitter, follow Adam Schefter, and set your phone up to receive alerts every time he tweets. Instant notification of any noteworthy developments. I find that, with Twitter becoming so popular, I use the Shark Pool a lot less for news and a lot more for analysis, where it remains unmatched.

 

[MattFancy]

Shark Pool is definitely a good source of info. It's great to get other people's opinions on players and such. Sure you can read any fantasy site and get that, but to be able to have a debate with people about it, makes it so much more interesting. We all value different guys and ideas differently, so sometimes it's good to hear how someone else is thinking about player X.

 

[Adam Harstad]

I too subscribed up until a couple years ago. That is when I realized no amount of help is ever going to win me a championship. Also a little disgruntled about the lack of in season and off season dynasty and rookie rankings leading up to rookie drafts.

I'm right there with you on the dynasty content, and have complained about it in the past, but FBGs has been taking steps to beef it up a bit. Both Chad Parsons and I have a new weekly dynasty feature, and for the past couple of years FBGs has been releasing a weekly "Dynasty Movement" feature where the various staff members who update their rankings in-season discuss who is moving and why. There hasn't really been any discussion of off-season dynasty content yet, but I know I plan on continuing to write as long as they'll let me after the season ends. Bloom spoke this past offseason about dramatically increasing the number of dynasty features this coming offseason. I think FBGs still has a way to go on dynasty coverage (as a biased owner who plays almost exclusively in dynasty leagues now), but I also think they're making strong steps in the right direction.

 

[footballnerd]

Haven't been in the SP as much this year, but previous years I frequented both. FBG did a good job of integrating some key weekly conversations from the SP into their content so it's easy to just go to their site. The one thing the SP has on them is break through news and game day info.

 

[Ignoratio Elenchi]

Since this thread turned from what I think OP intended into a discussion of the merits of subscribing, etc. I figured I'd add my thoughts on the value of a subscription. I've been a subscriber for years and will continue to be one for as long as I continue to play fantasy football. The value, to me, is tremendous. Here are the real selling points to me, in no particular order:

1) The Subscriber Contest. This thing provides months of fun (and some frustration!) starting the first week in August and all season long. As anyone who's frequented the Subscriber Contest threads in past years knows, I go way overboard in my interest in this contest, building databases to track the performance of all 13,000+ entries, posting weekly updates, etc. even long after my own entry has been eliminated. I look forward to this as much as, and perhaps even more than, my fantasy leagues each year. I'd pay $30 a year just for this.

2) Draft Dominator. This is such a valuable drafting tool, I haven't gone into a single draft without it in years. With the click of a button it always has the most up to date FBG projections imported, all customized to your own league(s) scoring and other settings. At a glance I can see what players are remaining, what their value is at any point in the draft relative to the time until my next pick, all my opponents and which positions they've already drafted, etc. I get so much use out of this thing I can't even describe it all. I'd pay $30 a year just for this.

3) MyFBG. This isn't one thing, it's many things, and especially this year they've made vast improvements. The automatic syncing with your leagues, and the new 10-second primer are incredible new features they added this year. I can get weekly cheatsheets, rest-of-season value, strength of schedule, etc. all customized to each of my leagues scoring settings, and now showing my own players as well as all available free agents highlighted in different colors and updated automatically, etc. I probably visit the MyFBG page at least once every single day throughout the entire fantasy season for one reason or another. I'd pay $30 a year just for this.

4) All the other info. I don't even read 99% of the content they produce each week, but the stuff I do read is always useful. I especially like the upgrade/downgrade reports, which now are helpfully posted to each player's individual page so I can get FBGs thoughts on a player. I'm a numbers guy so I love that they have game logs, the Data Dominator, stats updated each week (and again, customizable to my own leagues' scoring systems, etc.) Just a mountain of useful stuff.

And for the past two years you could effectively get an FBG subscription for free simply by making a deposit at FanDuel. The worst that happens is you gamble the money at FanDuel and lose it all - big deal, you were going to spend it on an FBG subscription anyway. More likely, you get the free FBG subscription and use it to actually win money at FanDuel. Either way it's an absolute no-brainer IMO. I'm not a staff member or a shill or anything, and I have even been and continue to be vocal about issues I've had with the service, but they're always relatively minor - but overall I honestly think it's such an obvious value that anyone who takes fantasy football even a little bit seriously would be a fool not to be a subscriber here.

 

[MAC_32]

Having read some of the subscriber content for free during the offseason I will vouch the information is beneficial, but there is enough free information available out there for me to justify passing on the in-season content. If I didn't have the time to do my own research I'd consider it though.

i.e. the Tavon Austin discussion on Twitter between Sigmund, Waldman, Fantasy ##### from rotoviz, smart football, Beherns from Yahoo, PFF Sam, Eric Stoner from Draft Breakdown and Draft Mecca, and Eric Galko from Optimum Scouting on twitter right now...can't be any less beneficial than whatever is behind the paid content wall imho.

 

[Adam Harstad]

Having read some of the subscriber content for free during the offseason I will vouch the information is beneficial, but there is enough free information available out there for me to justify passing on the in-season content. If I didn't have the time to do my own research I'd consider it though.

i.e. the Tavon Austin discussion on Twitter between Sigmund, Waldman, Fantasy ##### from rotoviz, smart football, Beherns from Yahoo, PFF Sam, Eric Stoner from Draft Breakdown and Draft Mecca, and Eric Galko from Optimum Scouting on twitter right now...can't be any less beneficial than whatever is behind the paid content wall imho.

Probably not, although I hate trying to follow discussions on Twitter. The format is terribly ill-suited for it. But like I said, there are a ton of really smart, really talented guys out there who don't work for FBGs. Mike Clay and Bryan Fontaine over at PFF Fantasy, Ryan McDowell and Steve Wyremski at DLF, Evan Silva at Rotoworld, several of the 4for4 guys (who are all good follows on Twitter, even if I can't stand that eyesore of a website), Fantasy ##### and the Rotoviz crew, and various other guys who aren't affiliated with any of the big sites (EBF/Jurb/Thrifty/Rene and the rest of the Dynasty Superthread crew always bring it, wdcrob's blog is must-read info for dynasty leaguers, I routinely run a search to make sure I haven't missed any posts from ZWK, etc). Outside of fantasy football, guys like Joe Bussell (@NFLosophy), Chris Brown (Smart Football), Brian Burke (Advanced NFL Stats), and the Football Perspective and Football Outsiders crew (including former FO staff like Tanier, Barnwell, and Farrar) really up the quality of football analysis compared to a decade ago. There are tons more people (including you), and there's no way I could ever list them all. Footballguys doesn't have all of the best analysis. FBGs doesn't even have MOST of the best analysis. There are just so many smart guys spread so far over the internet that if you're only getting your analysis from one place, you're behind the 8-ball, and I'm saying this as a guy who has subscribed to FBGs for a decade now. Footballguys is useful in that it aggregates a lot of that analysis in one place, which can be a big time saver, but there are far too many really, really smart guys to limit yourself if you can avoid it.

The content here is great, but in my opinion, it's the apps, tools, and contests that make the subscription such a no-brainer. The only other thing on the internet that can even come close in terms of both uniqueness and usefulness is NFL Game Rewind, although you've got to devote a lot of free time to get your money's worth, there. And, again, I'm saying this as a guy whose job is to create content for the website. I just think that, for the majority of fantasy owners, MyFBGs is much more indispensable than I am. And I'm okay with that.

 

[Bishman]

FBG and numberFire is all I need.

 

[MAC_32]

Having read some of the subscriber content for free during the offseason I will vouch the information is beneficial, but there is enough free information available out there for me to justify passing on the in-season content. If I didn't have the time to do my own research I'd consider it though.

i.e. the Tavon Austin discussion on Twitter between Sigmund, Waldman, Fantasy ##### from rotoviz, smart football, Beherns from Yahoo, PFF Sam, Eric Stoner from Draft Breakdown and Draft Mecca, and Eric Galko from Optimum Scouting on twitter right now...can't be any less beneficial than whatever is behind the paid content wall imho.

Probably not, although I hate trying to follow discussions on Twitter. The format is terribly ill-suited for it. But like I said, there are a ton of really smart, really talented guys out there who don't work for FBGs. Mike Clay and Bryan Fontaine over at PFF Fantasy, Ryan McDowell and Steve Wyremski at DLF, Evan Silva at Rotoworld, several of the 4for4 guys (who are all good follows on Twitter, even if I can't stand that eyesore of a website), Fantasy ##### and the Rotoviz crew, and various other guys who aren't affiliated with any of the big sites (EBF/Jurb/Thrifty/Rene and the rest of the Dynasty Superthread crew always bring it, wdcrob's blog is must-read info for dynasty leaguers, I routinely run a search to make sure I haven't missed any posts from ZWK, etc). Outside of fantasy football, guys like Joe Bussell (@NFLosophy), Chris Brown (Smart Football), Brian Burke (Advanced NFL Stats), and the Football Perspective and Football Outsiders crew (including former FO staff like Tanier, Barnwell, and Farrar) really up the quality of football analysis compared to a decade ago. There are tons more people (including you), and there's no way I could ever list them all. Footballguys doesn't have all of the best analysis. FBGs doesn't even have MOST of the best analysis. There are just so many smart guys spread so far over the internet that if you're only getting your analysis from one place, you're behind the 8-ball, and I'm saying this as a guy who has subscribed to FBGs for a decade now. Footballguys is useful in that it aggregates a lot of that analysis in one place, which can be a big time saver, but there are far too many really, really smart guys to limit yourself if you can avoid it.

The content here is great, but in my opinion, it's the apps, tools, and contests that make the subscription such a no-brainer. The only other thing on the internet that can even come close in terms of both uniqueness and usefulness is NFL Game Rewind, although you've got to devote a lot of free time to get your money's worth, there. And, again, I'm saying this as a guy whose job is to create content for the website. I just think that, for the majority of fantasy owners, MyFBGs is much more indispensable than I am. And I'm okay with that.

Now that you mention it I have probably chosen Game Rewind over FBG. I think I get more out of watching the game with my own eyes, plus I enjoy it. In the end, I'm more of a pure football nerd than I am fantasy football nerd.

 

[Hu-Tang Clan]

I'm not a current subscriber but have been a 10+ year subscriber of a different site. I'm thinking of switching sites next year and am following the forums of different sites and looking at the free content available to decide where my money will go. I like the form here (compared to my paid site) since there is a lot more activity but there seems to be too much activity as I can't even keep up with how many threads and posts exist.

 

[MoveToSkypager]

Should have added a

"Do you participate in polls?

[ ] yes

[ ] no

 

[Adam Harstad]

Now that you mention it I have probably chosen Game Rewind over FBG. I think I get more out of watching the game with my own eyes, plus I enjoy it. In the end, I'm more of a pure football nerd than I am fantasy football nerd.

If you have the time for it, it's a hard choice to fault. I agree that nothing compares to actually watching the games. The problem is that 16 games a week take between 8 and 20 hours to watch (depending on whether you're watching the condensed games or the coaches' film), plus whatever you're spending watching the games live on Sunday/Monday/Thursday and sometimes Saturday, plus whatever time you're spending managing your teams. If you're watching all of the games, fantasy football can very easily balloon into a full-time, 40-hour-a-week job. I absolutely love fantasy football, and have loved being able to spend that time whenever I can, but some seasons I've not been in a place where that was an option. The nice thing about a FBGs subscription is that it decreases the amount of time you have to spend on the hobby rather than increasing it.

 

[Slider]

Subscribed for years then dropped it this year. Way too much info out there and I've gotten pretty decent at this. They did rate my teams this year as old school great with a 90% chance of the playoffs so maybe they needed me more. j/k

 

[drummer]

Should have added a

"Do you participate in polls?

[x] yes

[ ] no

 

[scrumptrulescent]

Been a subscriber for years now. Probably the best money I spend all year.

I subscribed to FBG the last 3 years but didn't this year. I did okay the past 3 years but have had my best start ever this year when I based most my own rankings off of FFToday's projections. True Story.

 

[Squatch]

Gotta give a plug for subscription. I find the subscription content to be well worth the money. Plus, I find that their customer service to be outstanding (kudos to Clayton Gray in particular).

With a little luck, the subscription contest alone will cover the fees.

 

[MAC_32]

Now that you mention it I have probably chosen Game Rewind over FBG. I think I get more out of watching the game with my own eyes, plus I enjoy it. In the end, I'm more of a pure football nerd than I am fantasy football nerd.

If you have the time for it, it's a hard choice to fault. I agree that nothing compares to actually watching the games. The problem is that 16 games a week take between 8 and 20 hours to watch (depending on whether you're watching the condensed games or the coaches' film), plus whatever you're spending watching the games live on Sunday/Monday/Thursday and sometimes Saturday, plus whatever time you're spending managing your teams. If you're watching all of the games, fantasy football can very easily balloon into a full-time, 40-hour-a-week job. I absolutely love fantasy football, and have loved being able to spend that time whenever I can, but some seasons I've not been in a place where that was an option. The nice thing about a FBGs subscription is that it decreases the amount of time you have to spend on the hobby rather than increasing it.

I usually watch a game per night after the family goes to bed Tuesday, Wednesday, and Friday. Add that to Thursday, Sunday, and Monday and I get eight per week. October is a completely different animal due to baseball, but there are also less games per week. Sometimes get opportunities to watch more, but usually spend the rest of my time on coach's tape as I rarely have 90 minutes to myself any other time during the week.