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Charcandrick WEST - Should we be talking about this kid ? (1 Viewer)

Why can't you see Ware being the workhorse?  West is on the waiver wire in 2 of my leagues :shrug:
But up until yesterday, Charles was expected to play week 1 which may explain why he is still on the WW  :shrug:

I just think everyone who thinks Ware will be the workhorse week 1 may be very disappointed.  I believe a healthy West may see 40 to 50% of the touches.

 
But up until yesterday, Charles was expected to play week 1 which may explain why he is still on the WW  :shrug:

I just think everyone who thinks Ware will be the workhorse week 1 may be very disappointed.  I believe a healthy West may see 40 to 50% of the touches.
why?

 
To be clear, I believe Ware will get the start.  Although, when JC went down last year, it was a RBBC.  I think those who are expecting a high volume day from Ware may be disappointed.  BTW, I do not own any shares of JC, Ware or West.

 
West will get probably 40% at worse , Ware seems to be all everyone is talking about. It appears he will be the starter but West will get plenty of work too.

 
Week 14: West - 10 touches, Ware - 8 touches

Week 15: West - 18 touches, Ware - 0 touches 

Week 16: West - 15 touches, Ware - 5 touches

Week 17: Ware - 16 touches, West - 14 touches

In the above games, West also got the start.  I just think many are just labeling Ware a "workhorse back" because West was injured in pre-season and Ware was the beneficiary of all first team reps.  When JC went down last year, both backs were used in tandem.

 
I'm starting to come around to the RBBC idea for the Chiefs this year. I do think West will be the one losing out if Charles is healthy but if Charles is out I believe it could be a pretty even split if Ware/West are both good to go. They did sign almost identical contracts this offseason didn't they?

 
People are high on ware based on last year plus all usage in preseason and 1st team practice reps has been ware.  West has been mia and injured.  

 
If you believe West is going to get at minimum 40% of the carries than you should pick West up off of waivers. The evidence I see points to him being jumped on the depth chart by Ware. Frankly I was never a West believer (he's proven hes nothing special)but KC gave him a nice contract so they must have some plans for him. More of a Ware backup imo. 

 
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I also failed to mention that West is the better pass receiver out of the backfield.  That is a big part of KC's offense and where JC excels.  I guess we will know Sunday afternoon what Reid has in mind.  I would just suggest all Ware owners temper expectations week 1.

 
I also failed to mention that West is the better pass receiver out of the backfield.  That is a big part of KC's offense and where JC excels.  I guess we will know Sunday afternoon what Reid has in mind.  I would just suggest all Ware owners temper expectations week 1.
Thanks.

 
If you believe West is going to get at minimum 40% of the carries than you should pick West up off of waivers. The evidence I see points to him being jumped on the depth chart by Ware. Frankly I was never a West believer (he's proven hes nothing special)but KC gave him a nice contract so they must have some plans for him. More of a Ware backup imo. 
I drafted him.

 
  Chiefs | Charcandrick West sees first-team reps    Tue Aug 30, 10:05 PM

Kansas City Chiefs RB Charcandrick West has been seeing some starter's snap in training camp and the preseason, although RB Spencer Ware has seen the majority with RB Jamaal Charles (knee) slow to recover.

West 2015- 600-4 rec. 200-1

ware 2015- 400-6 rushing 

i get he was banged up in the preseason, but he's healthy now and was seeing reps with the ones August 30th

 
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You want to know why the Ware truthers are drinking the kool-aid? Both had strong years last year but Ware had a better ypc. The difference is training camp and preseason. We've heard very very little about West in camp and in the preseason, West has had 4 carries and 0/2 on catches, Ware has had 24 carries and 8/8 on catches and has scored in each game. One of them has shown/earned the job and the other hasn't. It might be because of injury in West's case, but Ware has shown in the preseason that he can be the 3 down guy.

 
That's obvious.  But anyone can see that for the very least this week wests role will be minor at best.  He s been hurt, not practicing with the ones, and not used in preseason.  Why would he have a huge role sunday?  Makes no sense
I do NOT consider potentially 10-12 touches for West, huge.  I never said West will be in line for a huge workload.  All i'm saying is if West is healthy, DO NOT expect Ware to be a "workhorse" back. 

 
Yeah so huge they had ware running with the 1st team and West running with the 2nd team when they were both healthy this preseason. Couple that with Ware throughly out playing West on a per snap basis last year and there's enough evidence for me.

Ware>>>West.

 
Yeah so huge they had ware running with the 1st team and West running with the 2nd team when they were both healthy this preseason. Couple that with Ware throughly out playing West on a per snap basis last year and there's enough evidence for me.

Ware>>>West.
Per snap yes but west had more snaps and is the receiving back, west was banged up in preseason so that's why Ware ran with ones in preseason. Do you really think Ware will get everything and West will sit on the bench, come on. West will have a solid roll with Charles out, we will see Sunday.

 
Per snap yes but west had more snaps and is the receiving back, west was banged up in preseason so that's why Ware ran with ones in preseason. Do you really think Ware will get everything and West will sit on the bench, come on. West will have a solid roll with Charles out, we will see Sunday.
When both were healthy this preseason Ware came in first and played all 3 downs. Not sure how you can interpret that any other way than Ware is ahead of West on the depth chart. 

 
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What it DOES mean is, if you have to plug in West on any of your teams, (RB2, or flex), you drafted poorly.

On the flip side, if you are Starting Ware this weekend in the RB slot or flex, there's no downside.


Since you and some other Ware proponents are so smugly certain of your position, please tell everyone here how the touches and production will break down this weekend. 

I'm seeing a RBBC where Reid may start leaning on the hot hand. Ware does some things better than West, but conversely West also has advantages over Ware. 

 
Since you and some other Ware proponents are so smugly certain of your position, please tell everyone here how the touches and production will break down this weekend. 

I'm seeing a RBBC where Reid may start leaning on the hot hand. Ware does some things better than West, but conversely West also has advantages over Ware.
What would that be?

 
I have Ware and not West - so I expect Ware to get 100% of the snaps, amass 600 yards rushing, 237 yards receiving on 42 receptions and score 10 TDs this weekend.  Yes, this weekend.

 
I remember charc was very productive and the first person ed turned to to take over the role when jc went down last year. He's a better pass catcher than Ware and we are talking about a qb that has one if the lowest ypa. A real check down artist. Like every season, alot of these group think theories will get turned on their head after week 1. Charc is a legit threat for touches especially with kc trailing in a game.

 
Since you and some other Ware proponents are so smugly certain of your position, please tell everyone here how the touches and production will break down this weekend. 

I'm seeing a RBBC where Reid may start leaning on the hot hand. Ware does some things better than West, but conversely West also has advantages over Ware. 
I guess we can only go on the assumption of rational coaching. Sure seemed as though Ware wrestled the job away with the opportunity given in PS.

As far as the breakdown on touches, what was the breakdown when JC was healthy? Is West healthy?  We know: Goal line=Ware. 

Totally agree with you on your point about the "hot hand". Looks like Ware has already established that. Do we know that West is even healthy?

 
What would that be?


West is a better receiver both in running routes and has better hands, and is more explosive. I'm certain that you will refuse to recognize this since you clutter every KC RB thread with your constant repetitious tedious sack swinging. 

 
I guess we can only go on the assumption of rational coaching. Sure seemed as though Ware wrestled the job away with the opportunity given in PS.

As far as the breakdown on touches, what was the breakdown when JC was healthy? Is West healthy?  We know: Goal line=Ware. 

Totally agree with you on your point about the "hot hand". Looks like Ware has already established that. Do we know that West is even healthy?


You are absolutely certain in your position. Why are you avoiding a simple question?

 
West is a better receiver both in running routes and has better hands, and is more explosive. I'm certain that you will refuse to recognize this since you clutter every KC RB thread with your constant repetitious tedious sack swinging. 
:lmao:  hey maybe you'll be right about something someday. That moment hasn't come yet it appears. 

 
What would that be?
I have no dog in this fight but it seems pretty clear that West is a significantly better receiver.  Maybe Ware has improved on that but going into the season West obviously has obviously been more trusted in the passing game during both college and the pros.

 
I'm already correct about you littering the threads with your relentless dismissive self serving nonsense, so there is that. 
Well if you say so. You're hilariously wrong on this. It's your MO to avoiding making many calls on players ever though. You just like to sit back and make wise cracks about posters who do. Which i can't blame ya you are much better at that than evaluating talent. 

 
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I have no dog in this fight but it seems pretty clear that West is a significantly better receiver.  Maybe Ware has improved on that but going into the season West obviously has obviously been more trusted in the passing game during both college and the pros.
They didn't pull Ware on 3rd downs when both were healthy. They kept him in and targeted him heavily. 

 
They didn't pull Ware on 3rd downs when both were healthy. They kept him in and targeted him heavily. 
Like I said Ware may have improved in the passing game but last year in the 6 games they played together after Charles went down (weeks 6-11) Ware had 5 targets and West had 23 and in the one preseason game they played together this year (8/13) West had 2 targets to 0 for Ware.

Ware has never been targeted heavily when he and West were both healthy.   He was only targeted in the two games West did not play (4 vs the Rams and 4 vs Chi).  

When you say things like the quote above, despite the fact that a quick search of the data demonstrates it is factually incorrect, it makes it difficult to take any of your analyses seriously because there will be a question about how much actual research you have put into your statements.

Like I said I don't have a horse in this race so good luck, I hope Ware wins you many championships.

 
Like I said Ware may have improved in the passing game but last year in the 6 games they played together after Charles went down (weeks 6-11) Ware had 5 targets and West had 23 and in the one preseason game they played together this year (8/13) West had 2 targets to 0 for Ware.

Ware has never been targeted heavily when he and West were both healthy.   He was only targeted in the two games West did not play (4 vs the Rams and 4 vs Chi).  

When you say things like the quote above, despite the fact that a quick search of the data demonstrates it is factually incorrect, it makes it difficult to take any of your analyses seriously because there will be a question about how much actual research you have put into your statements.

Like I said I don't have a horse in this race so good luck, I hope Ware wins you many championships.
Yeah I meant in the Preseason game "this" year. I should have specified that. Ware wasn't coming out on 3rd downs. 

I don't worry about who takes me seriously on here or not. If you don't want to that's fine. I'm happy with my success choosing players I think are going to do well. 

 
Yeah I meant in the Preseason game "this" year. I should have specified that. Ware wasn't coming out on 3rd downs. 

I don't worry about who takes me seriously on here or not. If you don't want to that's fine. I'm happy with my success choosing players I think are going to do well. 
Kansas City had two third down situations in the one game they played together this preseason.  That isn't much of a data set to speak with such confidence.

And you probably shouldn't care what anyone else thinks on here but, if what you have demonstrated in this small exchange is the quality of your research and analysis, you should think about caring for your sake.  Particularly if you are in any leagues with money on the line.

Good luck.  I think Ware is a nice player to own for the early part of the season and maybe longer, particularly if you got him earlier when you could maximize the value of the pick, and I hope he helps you succeed in your leagues.

 
Kansas City had two third down situations in the one game they played together this preseason.  That isn't much of a data set to speak with such confidence.

And you probably shouldn't care what anyone else thinks on here but, if what you have demonstrated in this small exchange is the quality of your research and analysis, you should think about caring for your sake.  Particularly if you are in any leagues with money on the line.

Good luck.  I think Ware is a nice player to own for the early part of the season and maybe longer, particularly if you got him earlier when you could maximize the value of the pick, and I hope he helps you succeed in your leagues.
Yeah I've had him since last year and do just fine in my leagues. Lol at discarding the Chiefs game script in a preseason game.

 
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Chaka said:
Like I said Ware may have improved in the passing game but last year in the 6 games they played together after Charles went down (weeks 6-11) Ware had 5 targets and West had 23 and in the one preseason game they played together this year (8/13) West had 2 targets to 0 for Ware.

Ware has never been targeted heavily when he and West were both healthy.   He was only targeted in the two games West did not play (4 vs the Rams and 4 vs Chi).  

When you say things like the quote above, despite the fact that a quick search of the data demonstrates it is factually incorrect, it makes it difficult to take any of your analyses seriously because there will be a question about how much actual research you have put into your statements.

Like I said I don't have a horse in this race so good luck, I hope Ware wins you many championships.
Nice post here

 
Milkman said:
They didn't pull Ware on 3rd downs when both were healthy. They kept him in and targeted him heavily. 
I don't have a horse in this race, but this is an absolute false statement.  I think, in the small sample size of games played between the two, West out targeted Ware 22 to 6. 

 
Milkman said:
Yeah I've had him since last year and do just fine in my leagues. Lol at discarding the Chiefs game script in a preseason game.
I didn't discard anything.  If you want to view the first preseason game as a good barometer for their regular season game script then Charcandrick West was in for four third down opportunities in the only game they played together.  So I guess it's fair to say that he will get 2 x the opportunities than Ware.

Gonna go out on a limb and say that you are going to disagree with that analysis.  Probably without any sense of irony.

 

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