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***Chicago Bears Thread*** Ben Johnson hired. The Resurrection Begins! (4 Viewers)
- Thread starter flapgreen
- Start date
RBM
Footballguy
And yet some of these supposed long time fans still think something is going to change. The complaining isn't just for Pace, who based on the history of the fools who hired him, will probably fail, it's for the whole dysfunctional unit. From the top down. Failure is the norm.
flapgreen
Footballguy
You're right, brother. There's just nothing to indicate anything will ever change. You can read this thread and see the loser's mentality. Same as it was last year and year before. We're still a couple years away. We don't need to sign any top guys because we're not going to compete for another couple years anyway. Just keep sucking because signing top guys or keeping our own is useless. That's the environment of a losing organization and how the Bears have convinced some fans that it's OK. It's all lies from the top.
KCitons
Footballguy
KCitons
Footballguy
flapgreen
Footballguy
Do you have an outline to show us what we're allowed to say on an Internet magic football message board?
KCitons
Footballguy
flapgreen
Footballguy
Interseptopus
Footballguy
Thats fine and all, I just realize I don't get anything if my team wins and I don't lose anything if they lose. I like watching sports to be entertained and if I'm not entertained why watch? I don't go to a movie that won't entertain me. And I don't complain about movies I go to. Sports are no different, it's entertainment. I used to care to the extent that flapper does, but I realized I was always so unhappy, like flapper. It's dumb. It's a child game. There's more important things to be passionate about. Such as family, constructive hobbies, and my job. Sports shouldn't affect people to the degree they do from a mental standpoint. That's unhealthy
3nOut
Footballguy
At this point, I don't think I want the Bears to draft a QB at #3. Or in the second round for that matter. I'm not a talent evaluator, but many of those who are say this draft is not a very strong one at QB. Take the best players every chance you get. I wouldn't mind seeing us load up on talent instead of reaching for a QB, and draft one next year where the QB crop is supposed to be much better.
flapgreen
Footballguy
We need a lot of talent everywhere. No doubt about that. But all the talent in the world doesn't matter when you don't have a qb. The idea of "reaching" for a QB is foreign to me. You either think he's a franchise guy or you don't. If you think he is, there's no reason to wait and hope he falls, or wait until next year. That's the only position on the team that will make or break a coach or GM.
I've said this on here before. The talk about the top 3-4 qbs not being that good is overblown. We'll find out more in a couple months, but I still think 4 qbs will go in the top half of the first. If Pace sees any of the QBs available at 3 as a franchise guy, he better take him. No idea why he would say signing Glennon could affect where he drafts a qb. Let's hope that's just talk.
I've said this on here before. The talk about the top 3-4 qbs not being that good is overblown. We'll find out more in a couple months, but I still think 4 qbs will go in the top half of the first. If Pace sees any of the QBs available at 3 as a franchise guy, he better take him. No idea why he would say signing Glennon could affect where he drafts a qb. Let's hope that's just talk.
Limp Ditka
Footballguy
Go back and look at the QBs that have won Super Bowls, Trent Dilfer, Mark Rypien, Jim McMahon, Brad Johnson. Hell, HOF jacket or not, Joe Namath was garbage too.
and look at some of the guys that got there but lost. Grossman, Kaepernick, Neil O'Donnell
It might be the exception, not the rule, but don't tell me it can't be done.
I think at this point we are better off just hoping that we lose every game this year and that next year's draft has a great QB or 2. I don't personally think that Glennon is an upgrade over Cutler so maybe there is a better chance of losing more games and having an even higher pick...
RBM
Footballguy
flapgreen
Footballguy
I get exactly what you're saying, but this losing organization needs to build a culture of winning at some point for there to ever be a change. Losing to get higher picks just make for an even worse culture than there already is. They just need to start winning at some point.
flapgreen
Footballguy
Kizer has all the tools and is the Prototypical qb. Played in pro-style offense. I like him.
But something about Watson. He has something in him that you can't teach. Rises to the occasion no matter the circumstances. I'd have a hard time ever letting a guy like that get past me if I'm looking for a QB. Guys with that type of ability are rare. If I were a GM, I'd place my job security on him more than anyone else available. You don't wait until next year because there may or may not be a better option available at the pick you take. Try and build a winner already. Start with a guy who's done it.
Limp Ditka
Footballguy
KCitons
Footballguy
This. The NFL is a business first and it's all about making money. Until there is a negative customer result there is no reason for the business model to change. Sometimes it even happens without the negative result. Teams move to new cities in order to build bigger (and more profitable) stadiums, even though the current stadium is still selling out.
I would compare it to parents at Christmas. Do you buy your kid everything they want on their list? Maybe some years. But other years, you buy what fits into your financial plan.
Here's what is most likely to happen if they draft a QB in the 1st or 2nd RD. Glennon starts out but they lose because the team is just not good. Rumblings starts to put the rookie in. They finally do because that is what happens to backup QBs that get starting jobs elsewhere and in the same year, they draft a QB. The rookie loses as well but they talk like he's the guy. Glennon is sent packing. They hitch their wagon to the rookie.
Plus Fox needs to save his job and uses the excuse that Glennon really wasn't good enough, the rookie is green and he needs time to mold the rookie into a superstar QB.
Seen the scenario numerous times.
Plus Fox needs to save his job and uses the excuse that Glennon really wasn't good enough, the rookie is green and he needs time to mold the rookie into a superstar QB.
Seen the scenario numerous times.
flapgreen
Footballguy
Nailed it! Except Fox will be goneHere's what is most likely to happen if they draft a QB in the 1st or 2nd RD. Glennon starts out but they lose because the team is just not good. Rumblings starts to put the rookie in. They finally do because that is what happens to backup QBs that get starting jobs elsewhere and in the same year, they draft a QB. The rookie loses as well but they talk like he's the guy. Glennon is sent packing. They hitch their wagon to the rookie.
Plus Fox needs to save his job and uses the excuse that Glennon really wasn't good enough, the rookie is green and he needs time to mold the rookie into a superstar QB.
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flapgreen
Footballguy
Looking at the details of #Bears QB Mike Glennon’s deal: Total guarantee of $18.5 million; $3 million sign bonus; has incentives
New #Bears WR Markus Wheaton’s two-year deal is worth $11M with $5M total guarantee. It includes bonuses for receptions and rec. yards.
New #Bears safety Quintin Demps’ three-year deal is worth $13.5M with a total guarantee of $5M. It includes per-game roster bonuses.
New #Bears CB Marcus Cooper’s three-year deal is worth $16M with a total guarantee of $8M. It has bonuses for INTs and Pro Bowl.
Prince Amukamara's deal with the #Bears is one year, $7 million, fully guaranteed.
#Bears agreed to terms on a one-year deal worth up to $4m with WR Kendall Wright, source said.
$53.5 million in guaranteed money dished out by the #Bears between Glennon, Cooper, Amukamara, Demps, Wheaton, Sims
New #Bears WR Markus Wheaton’s two-year deal is worth $11M with $5M total guarantee. It includes bonuses for receptions and rec. yards.
New #Bears safety Quintin Demps’ three-year deal is worth $13.5M with a total guarantee of $5M. It includes per-game roster bonuses.
New #Bears CB Marcus Cooper’s three-year deal is worth $16M with a total guarantee of $8M. It has bonuses for INTs and Pro Bowl.
Prince Amukamara's deal with the #Bears is one year, $7 million, fully guaranteed.
#Bears agreed to terms on a one-year deal worth up to $4m with WR Kendall Wright, source said.
$53.5 million in guaranteed money dished out by the #Bears between Glennon, Cooper, Amukamara, Demps, Wheaton, Sims
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need2know
Footballguy
Snorkelson
Footballguy
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
I agree with that to a certain point because there are a lot of people who think it can be done easily. The truth is though, every year there is a team that does exactly that. There always seems to be a team that goes from worst to first or very close to that. That's one of the things about the NFL, a good GM and coach can turn a team around very quickly. It just doesn't happen as easily or to as many teams as fans like to think.
I blame madden games. Giving a bunch of 20 and 30 somethings the impression that anyone can turn a crummy franchise into a perennial winner in a matter of one FA and draft, and anything less is not acceptable. Too many fragile personas who can't handle losing because everyone is supposed to get a trophy.
The Bears are not far away from being a pretty good team. Have to crawl before you walk though so these things take time. As in more than one season
youre right, football is supposed to bring joy and excitement and positive distraction. If it's such a depressing thing for some folks perhaps they should find a new hobby, or perhaps get some perspective on life. It's a game
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
First, Dilfer and McMahon were first round picks. Second, don't pin your hopes on that. Look at the QBs who have won Super Bowls/lost them as well:
Rodgers, Bradshaw, Jim Kelly, Dan Marino, Troy Aikman, Ben Roethlisberger, Drew Brees, Cam Newton, Joe Montana, Tom Brady, John Elway, Eli Manning, Peyton Manning, Steve Young... I only stopped listing them when I couldn't remember them off the top of my head.
The list of top notch, best in class, mainly first round QBs is far bigger and far more successful. The guys you listed above had #1 all time Ds or complete teams outside of QB. You guys are miles from that, so the easiest way to compete is a top notch QB.
Man, that looks disappointing when you think of the guys who have left over the past few years from Marshall, Jeffrey, Forte, Bennett and Cutler. If I wake up a few years from now hearing that the Panthers have let go of Kuechly, Benjamin, Stewart, Cam and Olsen, I think I'd be a bit bitter after they tell me that some backup from the Bucs is our new hope.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
I've been saying that about the Bears but one very big difference between the Bears and Panthers comparison, the Panthers have won with all those players and the Bears never did. It's a shame they couldn't do well with the talent they once had.
flapgreen
Footballguy
It's in the culture of the organization. Losing. It's why we never won with Urlacher and the rest of that defense either. Couldn't win with Cutler, Marshall, Alshon, Forte. Now we still have the same losing culture but no talent to go with it.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
I still keep some faith, not in the ownership but with Pace. I hope Fox is gone after this year and Pace finds his own, hand picked head coach and that coach helps draft and develop their franchise QB. So far I feel Pace knows what he's doing, especially when it comes to the draft.
flapgreen
Footballguy
With the strategy it appears he's taking, he needs to hit a grand slam in multiple consecutive drafts. I hope he does it, but the first draft looks like a pretty big flop at the moment. I can't say I'm down with jettisoning every veteran from the team like he's done with no foundation to build on.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
The best teams are generally built through the draft with FAs being supplements. I like seeing the Bears put more emphasis on the importance of drafting now. I also think Pace's first draft wasn't all that bad.
Round 1 - Kevin White - I know some are calling this a bust already but we just don't know what he is yet. Terrible luck with this pick but still has an opportunity to prove his worth.
Round 2 - Eddie Goldman - I think we can all agree that this was a fantastic pick.
Round 3 - Hroniss Grasu - I see a lot of people harp on this pick but it's actually pretty good. He started as a rookie when he wasn't suppose and did OK. He's solid depth now.
Round 4 - Jeremy Langford - Got solid starting time his rookie year and did well in place of Forte. Now he's great depth at a pretty strong position for the Bears. Not a bad 4th.
Round 5 - Adrian Amos - Was one of the few DBs that performed well his rookie year. Didn't do as well last year but is another solid depth player for the secondary.
Round 6 - Tayo Fabuluje - This turned into a worthless pick but it was a 6th rounder so it's not uncommon.
So 5 out of the 6 players in that draft started at one point and have been major contributors to the team. Most are depth players now but it wasn't a terrible draft class, yet.
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Interseptopus
Footballguy
I don't know how anyone can call that draft "a pretty big flop." If that's the case then no GM ever has a successful draft
Goldman and Langford alone make that draft a complete home run. Even if White completely flops he got:
2 future pro bowlers (Goldman, Langford)
A potential future starter on the OL
Starting FS in ROUND FIVE
And Kevin White still might turn into a serviceable WR. Not Round 1 quality likely but he could be a good contributor.
Ted Thompson blows a lot of 1st round picks but for some reason they seem to do alright. And they aren't known for going out and getting big name FAs. This is why I say, Chicago is not far away from being a very good team. Another "pretty big flop" of a draft this year and Chicago is looking like a team that will make some serious noise in 2-3 seasons.
Good point. You'd think a team with Cutler at QB, Bennett at TE, Marshall/Jeffrey at WR and Forte at RB would have been hard to stop. Seems like they never gave it enough time together. One or two left every year the past 3.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
Lets not get carried away with Langford, future pro bowler? He's a serviceable RB right now. They do have some talent in that draft though and a good amount of future potential.
How is Langford a future pro-bowler?
Also, the reason GB does alright even with blown picks is Rodgers. Simple as that.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
Very poor management. The Trestman hire really blew everything up. His first year showed the fire power they had but the team was an absolute mess off the field. The other thing was that by building that offense they really let the defense fall apart.
Interseptopus
Footballguy
Who are the best young talents at RB these days? I mean young young. Elliot is about all I got. Langford is near the top of his class.
Langford is not far away from being a top 10 or even 5 RB. Just think, by the time Chicago has their stuff together Langford will be in year 3-4 and has potential to have a huge break out.
