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Chris Wesseling Dynasty Ranks: Running Backs (1 Viewer)

JohnnyU

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Dynasty Ranks: Running Backs

Running backs

I never worshiped at the altar of the "running backs are gold" philosophy, especially in Dynasty leagues where elite quarterbacks and wide receivers can carry a team for a decade. Running backs, on the other hand, come and go with great frequency. The key to team building in Dynasty leagues is to ensure that you have one sure-fire bell cow back. Then you can creatively fill in around that bulwark with mid-round picks, timely trades, and the waiver wire.

In researching these rankings, two major themes emerged at running back:

1. If the 2009 season taught us anything about Dynasty backs, it was the cliff-diving of highly valued aging backs such as LaDainian Tomlinson, Clinton Portis, and Brian Westbrook. While quarterbacks and receivers gradually decline, allowing owners to plan for a replacement, a top-flight running back's value simply crumbles under a heavy workload or the effects of age. Meanwhile, young backs such as Ray Rice, Rashard Mendenhall, Jamaal Charles, and Felix Jones emerged from the shadows, flying past the downward trending veterans.

Of necessity, aging backs must be devalued while talented young backs must be treasured before their breakout seasons. More than any other position, staying ahead of the curve is mandatory with running backs.

2. The 2008 draft class is the running backs' answer to the much acclaimed 1983 quarterback class of Dan Marino, John Elway, Jim Kelly, et al. The 2008 class boasts two of the top four in these rankings and five of the top 10.

Chris Johnson broke the 2,000-yard barrier while shattering Marshall Faulk's yards from scrimmage record. Ray Rice led all backs in receiving and finished second in yards from scrimmage. Jonathan Stewart out-rushed starter DeAngelo Williams while Jamaal Charles finished second to Johnson in fantasy points over the second half of the season. Rashard Mendenhall, Matt Forte, Steve Slaton, and Kevin Smith all have 1,000-yard seasons under their belt. Felix Jones, flashing as much homerun ability as any back in the class, finally broke through with 178 yards in the Cowboys' playoff rout of the Eagles last week. Committee back Tim Hightower even finished second to Rice in receptions. Ironically, it's the first back drafted, Darren McFadden, who has found NFL success elusive. On to the rankings:

Tier One

1. Chris Johnson, Titans | Age: 25.0 – We've never seen a running back with his combination of sick speed, moves, and quick-cutting ability. The answer to the question of whether Vince Young would do more harm than good was answered definitively in the final 10 games.

Despite the yards from scrimmage record and his 2009 rushing title at a whopping 582 more yards than his closest competitor, Johnson is experiencing unwarranted long-term skepticism for his body size. To set the record straight, bigger backs have shorter careers than backs of Johnson's stature. There are arguments to be made for Adrian Peterson and Maurice Jones-Drew at No. 1, but body size isn't one of them.

2. Adrian Peterson, Vikings | Age: 25.6 – You can't be faulted if you stick to your guns on ADP as the No. 1 back. While he saw a drop-off in attempts, yards, and YPC, he more than made up for it with a two-fold increase in receptions and a league-high 18 TDs. Could he put it all together in 2010?

With all of the attention on his second-half slump and declining yards per carry, it went unnoticed that Peterson shattered his best fantasy season this year. His receptions have risen steadily from 19 to 21 to 42 – just four fewer than Chris Johnson (and eight fewer than Frank Gore and Steven Jackson).

3. Maurice Jones-Drew, Jaguars | Age: 25.6 – In his four-year career, MJD has averaged 14 TDs, 50 receptions, and 4.7 YPC mostly in part-time work. The focal point of the Jags offense, Jones-Drew's value is as safe as it gets.

4. Ray Rice, Ravens | Age: 23.8 – Profootballfocus.com's No. 1 back in 2009. Drawing comparisons to a faster Emmitt Smith, Rice was the best receiving back in the league, an explosive runner, and a very good blocker. The hand-wringing over the lack of goal-line carries is reminiscent of Chris Johnson last season. Rice's 45 touchdowns in his last two seasons at Rutgers suggest he can handle the role just fine.

One pre-2008 scouting report said Rice "doesn't have change-of-pace speed and doesn't provide much in the passing game." It's another reason why mid-to-late first-round rookie picks are overrated. Our knowledge of these players coming in to the NFL is just too limited.

Tier Two

5. Jonathan Stewart, Panthers | Age: 23. 6 – Reminiscent of Jones-Drew when Fred Taylor was still tops on the depth chart, Stewart is a physical freak whose talent alone would put him comfortably in the top tier.

Has he made DeAngelo Williams expendable on the cap-strapped Panthers? It's a sentiment gaining steam of late, though skepticism is advised. The Panthers aren't in the business of parting with their impact players, especially one with a salary as low as Williams' $725K. Though D-Willy isn't likely to depart this season, his contract is up in 2011.

6. Frank Gore, 49ers | Age: 27.4 – The concerns about his injury history and workload in a potential spread offense are severely overblown. The do-everything back finished fifth in fantasy points despite missing almost three full games, and he actually bettered Ray Rice in points per week.

7. Steven Jackson, Rams | Age: 27.2 – S-Jax is the test case for special talent as the trump card in Dynasty leagues. With a floor is so high that he's producing quality numbers in a sunk offense, he's the perfect example of why studs have to be ranked highly regardless of situation. Remember that the next time somebody tells you that Calvin Johnson isn't an elite Dynasty receiver.

8. DeAngelo Williams, Panthers | Age: 27.5 – It's not that Williams isn't one of the best backs in the league; he is. The problem is he's going to spend another year of his prime splitting carries.

9. Jamaal Charles, Chiefs | Age: 23.9 – My reaction to Charles was similar to Todd Haley's: "We started by saying that this was a 15-carry per game guy. He's forced us to think differently about him." I'm trying to pick apart his game and his situation to find a major concern, but I've come up empty. Charles is a 23-year-old feature back with the second-most fantasy points over the second-half of the season on top of 5.9(!) YPC and natural pass-catching skills. What's not to like?

10. Rashard Mendenhall, Steelers | Age: 23.3 – Mendenhall's downhill, physical style is a natural fit for the Steelers offense, and he surprisingly pushed Mewelde Moore out of the third-down role down the stretch. He's an every-down back heading into a 2010 season in which the Steelers want to re-establish the running game.

Tier Three

11. Beanie Wells, Cardinals | Age: 22.1 - Ran like a man possessed over the second half of the season, punishing tacklers and refusing to go down on first contact. I've heard him described as 95 percent of Adrian Peterson, which isn't as ridiculous as it sounds at first blush.

12. Knowshon Moreno, Broncos | Age: 23.2 – I never considered Moreno an explosive back, so the lack of big plays isn't particularly bothersome to me. He's a chain-mover with impressive success rates and few negative plays. What killed him down the stretch was that defenses didn't respect the passing game and the offensive line fell apart.

With Josh McDaniels weeding out the Shanahan guys, his offense will start to go through Moreno instead of Brandon Marshall. Knowshon won't always be paired with a back like Correll Buckhalter, so his production will be more consistent and his receptions will skyrocket. I'm expecting rock-solid borderline RB1 production for the next five years.

13. Michael Turner, Falcons | Age: 28.7 – Far too reliant on touchdowns. Similar to Clinton Portis last season, backs in their age-28 seasons usually receive a downgrade because most of their value is tied up in the past as opposed to the future. Turner can still put forth a dominant season in 2010, but is that worth giving up five years of production from a younger back?

14. Felix Jones, Cowboys | Age: 23.4 – Can the Cowboys really keep him on the bench after he showed what he could do with 15+ touches against the Eagles last week? Jones still has questions to answer about workload and fragility, but his playmaking ability makes him a fantasy asset with 12-15 touches per week.

15. Matt Forte, Bears | Age: 24.9 – Poor Forte received no help from his offensive line, but neither did Jamaal Charles. While Forte is solid across the board, there's just nothing special about his talent. No longer the offensive centerpiece, it's hard to consider him a nucleus player in Dynasty circles with a 3.6 YPC and major red-zone issues.

16. Ryan Grant, Packers | Age: 27.9 – We know what Grant is now: a very good open-field runner who still struggles at times to read his blocks and should never be used in the passing game. Grant finished No. 8 in fantasy points on the season, emphatically slamming the door on speculation that his starting job is in jeopardy. The Packers' high-scoring offense gives him a short-term value boost.

17. Cedric Benson, Bengals | Age: 27.9 - Bears fans can't believe it. The Cincinnati Benson bears little resemblance to the Chicago Benson, and he's running with authority and explosiveness behind a heavy workload. The Bengals' new offensive centerpiece is a free agent after next season.

18. Shonn Greene, Jets | Age: 25.1 - Showed great short-area quickness and finished his runs with authority, pushing Thomas Jones to the side against the Bengals last week. Jones is expected to return to the Jets in 2010, so Greene may have to wait another year for weekly fantasy value.

Tier Four

19. Pierre Thomas, Saints | Age: 25.9 – Finished first in Football Outsiders' DVOA ratings and fifth in Profootballfocus.com's ratings after finishing in the Top-5 in DVOA last season. His effectiveness is undeniable. We'd all like to see Pierre used more often, but the root of the issue is that Sean Payton is convinced Thomas can't handle a full workload without getting nicked up.

20. Donald Brown, Colts | Age: 23.5 – His injury-plagued rookie season isn't going to have the Colts in a hurry to part ways with Joseph Addai. Brown will have to prove he can hold up as an NFL back before his workload increases.

21. Ronnie Brown, Dolphins | Age: 28.9 – He remains one of the best all-around talents at the position, but he just can't stay healthy for a full season. Brown will be close to 29 years old and coming off another major injury going into next season. And Ricky Williams isn't going anywhere.

22. Joseph Addai, Colts | Age: 27.4 – Addai has always been a player who derived too much value out of situation and not enough out of talent. That remains the case, and he stands to lose a lot of value throughout the 2010 season if Donald Brown can stay healthy.

23. LeSean McCoy, Eagles | Age: 22.2 - His rookie season was a mixed bag. When Brian Westbrook first went down, McCoy was given the opportunity to take the job and run with it. Instead, he forced the coaches to work fullback Leonard Weaver into the mix. While he's already an asset in PPR leagues, I can't shake the feeling that his shake-and-bake style will make him a long-term committee back as opposed to a Westbrook clone.

24. Marion Barber, Cowboys | Age: 27.3 – Injuries adversely affected his production for the second straight year, enough so that Felix Jones is threatening to take over as the feature back. Since signing his big-money deal, MBIII's per-carry average has dropped by half a yard, he's fumbling twice as often, and his touchdown percentage has been cut in half. Remember: it's never a good sign for long-term value when your backups can step in without missing a beat.

Tier Five

25. Darren McFadden, Raiders | Age: 23.1 - An injury-prone timeshare back in an offense held hostage by the quarterback, McFadden has left far too much yardage on the field the past two seasons. Keeping the faith is getting increasingly difficult, but now is the ideal time to buy low if you were ever a true believer.

26. Marshawn Lynch, Bills | Age: 24.5 - Dynasty owners didn't draft him to be a time-share back. The problem is that Lynch isn't all that talented, and he's been outproduced by his backup for two straight seasons. I wouldn't want to count on the new coaching staff liking him better than F-Jax, especially since Jackson certainly appears to be the better player.

27. Jerome Harrison, Browns | Age: 27.7 – He's a virtual lock to enter 2010 as the Browns' starter, but I'm not one who sees a long-term feature back here. Harrison's impressive job-saving finish for Eric Mangini came against the Chiefs, Raiders, and Jaguars. Selling high is advised.

28. Reggie Bush, Saints | Age: 25.6 - No longer even a good flex option, Bush is nothing more than a role player in the Saints offense. He could end up with more playing time outside of New Orleans, but how much value can he have without the ability or the willingness to run forward?

29. Ahmad Bradshaw, Giants | Age: 24.6 – Built like a change of pace back, but runs like he's an iron head. As we saw in 2009, however, that style leads to injuries. On a positive note, Bradshaw was far more effective than backfield partner Brandon Jacobs.

30. Fred Jackson, Bills | Age: 29.7 – The Bills offense simply runs better with Jackson as the main man. F-Jax is a superior receiver, arguably a more explosive runner, and does a fine job in short-yardage. If his new head coach decides to put production ahead of pedigree, F-Jax will remain the feature back.

31. Darren Sproles, Chargers | Age: 27.3 – Give him this: when he plays, he produces fantasy points. The Chargers' 2010 backfield is up in the air, but it's easy to picture Sproles in a similar role to the one he's had the past two seasons, perhaps with a slight increase in carries.

32. Brandon Jacobs, Giants | Age: 28.2 – Aging backs have to produce now, and Jacobs isn't getting it done. There's no question that he was a slower, more plodding back in 2009, but his disappointing season also served as a useful reminder that bigger backs are much more reliant on their blocking. Jacobs' value is wrapped up in touchdowns, which is troublesome with Bradshaw out-producing him in the red zone. If you're not scared off by aging, injury-prone running backs who don't catch passes, buy low. Everyone else: run away fast.

Tier Six

33. Tashard Choice, Cowboys | Age: 25.10 – More effective than an injury-plagued Marion Barber for the second straight season.

34. Willis McGahee, Ravens | Age: 28.11 – Expected to be a cap casualty in Baltimore, and his Week 17 performance against the Raiders may have been enough to earn him the greater share of a committee job in 2010. He'll be bringing fresh legs wherever he lands.

35. Steve Slaton, Texans | Age: 24.8 - He is what we thought he was last offseason: a passing-down, change-of-pace back masquerading as a lead back. My concern with Slaton was always that he was going to be a back in the vain of Willie Parker and Joseph Addai, where the coaches continue to take pieces of responsibility away from him until he's nothing more than complementary part. Such is the case in Houston, where the Texans are expected to add an early-down back early in this year's draft.

36. Laurence Maroney, Patriots | Age: 25.7 - Maroney had his final chance to be "the man" in New England, I think, and he fumbled it away. He's a committee back with a fumbling problem, a checkered injury history, and a reputation for running east/west and dancing at the line. Congrats if you sold high a month ago.

37. Thomas Jones, Jets | Age: 32.1 - The passing of the torch? Jones has been phenomenal the past two seasons, far surpassing expectations while laughing in the face of the age-30 running back decline. But Shonn Greene is coming like a freight train.

38. Arian Foster, Texans | Age: 24.1 – My pet sleeper from last summer played well down the stretch when given a shot at the starting job. While nobody would mistake him for a special talent, Foster averaged nearly a full yard more per carry than Ryan Moats and a yard and a half more than Steve Slaton. Throw in nice hands and after-the-catch ability, and he has a puncher's chance to open 2010 as the starter in Gary Kubiak's one-cut-and-go system.

39. Michael Bush, Raiders | Age: 26.3 – Looking on the bright side, the Raiders coaches have no idea how to evaluate running back talent. Despite being shoe-horned into a fullback role last season and neglected this season, Bush still has the three best rushing performances of the past year and a half. Bush owners should be rooting hard for a coaching change in the next week or two.

40. Justin Forsett, Seahawks | Age: 24.11 – A very good NFL role player. Even on the off chance that he gets a shot at the lead-back job, he's not likely to hold onto it for multiple seasons.

41. Chester Taylor, Vikings | Age: 31.0 – Taylor is due to hit unrestricted free agency at age 31. While he's obviously one of the top backups in the game, he's a longshot to land his own starting gig in 2010.

42. Leon Washington, Jets | Age: 28.1 – Jerious Norwood North? Actually, that comparison sells the old Leon Washington short. Unfortunately, we don't know how much speed and cutting ability he left on the operating table after he suffered a double open fracture to his right leg.

Tier Seven

43. Brian Westbrook, Eagles | Age: 31.0 - Will the Eagles bring him back at a reduced salary considering his obvious fragility? I wouldn't count on it. Westbrook can still play effectively, but the Eagles' reluctance to use him in the playoff loss speaks volumes.

44. LaDainian Tomlinson, Chargers | Age: 31.3 - Report to the principal's office if you drafted him in the first round of redraft leagues. As Rotoworld predicted last summer, the trademark explosiveness is gone. You can forget about the retirement talk, but LT is likely playing out his last San Diego hurrah over the next few weeks. Where he lands in 2010 in anyone's guess.

45. Clinton Portis, Redskins | Age: 29.0 - Running on empty. Portis can't stay on the field, and he's ineffective when he does play. May not be long for D.C. with a new regime in town and his work ethic being called into question.

46. Ricky Williams, Dolphins | Age: 33.3 - The most interesting character in sports over the past decade. "Unique" doesn't mean rare or uncommon, it means alone in the universe. As the unique football player, universals don't apply to Ricky. Who knows what he has in store for his next act in 2010?

47. Bernard Scott, Bengals | Age: 26.7 – Check out his age. Scott is an intriguing talent, but he's already 26 years old and sitting behind a better back in Cedric Benson.

48. LenDale White, Titans | Age: 25.9 - The Titans' "keep the lead" back was left on the bench for the final three months of the season. A restricted free agent, White's best hope for value is to be reunited with Pete Carroll in Seattle.

49. Carnell Williams, Buccaneers | Age: 28.5 – Caddy may have been more deserving of the Comeback Player of the Year award than Tom Brady, but his fantasy ceiling is limited by the Bucs' rotation and his own injury history.

50. Kevin Smith, Lions | Age: 23.9 - Though Smith proved that his toughness was beyond question in playing through a shoulder separation, the Lions were already on the look-out for another back before his gruesome knee injury. With multiple ligaments torn, he's unlikely to be ready for Week 1.

51. Derrick Ward, Buccaneers | Age: 30.1 – Ward wasn't reliable even as a flex option this season. What's going to change for next season?

Grab Bag Tier

52. Rashad Jennings, Jaguars | Age: 25.6 – An intriguing roster stash, but he doesn't hold much value outside of handcuffing Maurice Jones-Drew.

53. Glen Coffee, 49ers | Age: 23.4 – Which was the real Coffee? The mad slasher who tore up preseason action or the ineffective plodder who flunked his three-game audition when Frank Gore was injured?

54. Jerious Norwood, Falcons | Age: 27.2 – Norwood's string of posting unreal rate stats was stopped cold in 2009, when he was slowed by a hip injury. Three different coaching staffs have deemed him nothing more than a change of pace back, and his next one will as well.

55. Tim Hightower, Cardinals | Age: 24.4 - Was never a good bet to maintain startable value once the team drafted Beanie Wells, and it appears he's finally on the verge of losing flex value as well. Can catch the ball but doesn't do much with it afterward.

56. Lex Hilliard, Dolphins | Age: 26.2 – A big, physical back who can move well and catch passes, Hilliard has earned the No. 3 job in Miami for next season.

57. Jason Snelling, Falcons | Age: 26.9 – The Swiss Army knife of backups. A pedestrian talent, but Snelling has good size in a "jack of all trades, master of none" type of back.

58. Correll Buckhalter, Broncos | 31.11 – A fantastic change-of-pace back but 31-years-old and not quite a weekly flex option.

59. Larry Johnson, Bengals | 30.10 – Not worth the headache. The Bengals are one of the few teams that don't factor in character, so he could return in a backup role again next season.

60. Willie Parker, Steelers | 29.10 – Injuries and the effects of age have taken the "fast" out of Fast Willie. His inability to exploit an open hole was disconcerting.

61. Julius Jones, Seahawks | 29.1 - A prime candidate to be cut this offseason, Jones has been one of the most ineffective starters in the league for two straight years.

62. Brandon Jackson, Packers | 24.11 – Showed major improvement as a blocker in 2009, but he remains a subpar runner.

63. James Davis, Browns | 24.8 – Whatever window he may have had closed when Jerome Harrison carried the team to a 4-0 finish in December.

64. Mike Bell, Saints | 27.8 – Averaged 3.2 YPC from Week 8 on in an offense tailor-made for running back success.

65. Justin Fargas, Raiders | 30.8 – Raiders coaches love his run-to-contact style, but he's a 30-year-old back who doesn't catch passes, doesn't score, and splits touches
 
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Dynasty Ranks: Running Backs 27. Jerome Harrison, Browns | Age: 27.7 – He's a virtual lock to enter 2010 as the Browns' starter, but I'm not one who sees a long-term feature back here. Harrison's impressive job-saving finish for Eric Mangini came against the Chiefs, Raiders, and Jaguars. Selling high is advised.
While I agree about the Chiefs, Raiders, and Jaguars part, it should be noted that when Harrison was given an opportunity early in the year he was very effective against both Baltimore and Cincinnati.Against BAL (#5 rush D) he ran for 52 yds and caught 5 for 33 yds on a day when Anderson/Quinn combined for 4 INTs. Harrison was the only player to do anything that day.Against CIN (#7 rush D) he ran for 121 yds and caught another 5 for 31 yds. He's the reason the Browns took that game to OT and almost won.Might be some decent value there next year.
 
Good stuff. I usually see eye to eye with F&L's rankings. I think he has a good understanding of the dynasty format.

A couple minor quibbles:

- Charles at #9. This ranking just seems way too speculative to me. Charles had a great second half, but I've seen lots of young backs become overvalued after a hot debut (K. Jones, J. Jones, Maroney, Lynch, etc). I think in this case it's wise to err on the side of caution. At RB9, Charles is all downside with no upside. If he pans out, he'll only be marginally better than the other guys you could've drafted in the same spot. If he busts, he'll be a huge disaster. The reward doesn't justify the risk quite so high (although to be fair, there aren't exactly a lot of sure things behind him on the list).

- Addai, Grant, and Forte. I think these guys are the embodiment of mediocrity. Decent RB2 candidates in redraft leagues, but scary propositions in dynasty leagues because they're not really good enough to stave off a challenge from a talented competitor. I would rather gamble on someone with a higher ceiling like Shonn Greene, Felix Jones, Ronnie Brown, and LeSean McCoy. That said, the first group has more immediate value if you're focusing on that.

- Cadillac Williams at #49. I know he's not a star and I know you're not a big fan, but I think he deserves a little bit of credit for the year he had in 2009. He quietly shouldered a big workload and stayed 100% healthy. He'll only be 28 next season and while I certainly wouldn't want him as one of my top 2 backs, there's some sneaky upside here. That offense isn't going to get any worse. I can't say I would move him for someone like Foster or Forsett.

I like the list overall. I think Felix, Greene, and McCoy are the best buy low targets this offseason (along with whichever rookies look good after draft day). Greene's price tag is soaring after his good playoff game. In two separate leagues I was rejected trying to get him straight up. Once for Moreno (non PPR) and once for CJ Spiller. Rightly or wrongly, his owners have seemingly succumbed to the Julius Jones Theorem (any rookie RB who shows promise = automatic stud).

 
nice stuff

The problem I have is with some of the logic in rankings of the paired playersor in Dallas' case triplets- split the carries= dilute the points:

Stewart/ Williams as a pair are each too high, also

Barber, Jones, Choice

Brown/ Addai

Bush/ Thomas

yet Lynch/ Jackson are paired a tad low and it appears the author considers this a long term stalemate

 
nice stuff

The problem I have is with some of the logic in rankings of the paired playersor in Dallas' case triplets- split the carries= dilute the points:

Stewart/ Williams as a pair are each too high, also

Barber, Jones, Choice

Brown/ Addai

Bush/ Thomas

yet Lynch/ Jackson are paired a tad low and it appears the author considers this a long term stalemate
Stewart finished this season as RB11, and Williams finished as RB14. And Carolina's running game actually REGRESSED this year. It's not at all unreasonable to expect DeAngelo to be a strong RB1 next year, and after that he'll have his own show. It's also not at all unreasonable to expect Stewart to put up RB2 production again next year (he's finished 24th and 11th in his two seasons), and the season after that he'll be 24 and he'll have his own show, too. I think both are deserving of top-10 rankings on their own individual merits, whether they're splitting time this year or not.
 
nice stuff

The problem I have is with some of the logic in rankings of the paired playersor in Dallas' case triplets- split the carries= dilute the points:

Stewart/ Williams as a pair are each too high, also

Barber, Jones, Choice

Brown/ Addai

Bush/ Thomas

yet Lynch/ Jackson are paired a tad low and it appears the author considers this a long term stalemate
Stewart finished this season as RB11, and Williams finished as RB14. And Carolina's running game actually REGRESSED this year. It's not at all unreasonable to expect DeAngelo to be a strong RB1 next year, and after that he'll have his own show. It's also not at all unreasonable to expect Stewart to put up RB2 production again next year (he's finished 24th and 11th in his two seasons), and the season after that he'll be 24 and he'll have his own show, too. I think both are deserving of top-10 rankings on their own individual merits, whether they're splitting time this year or not.
I agree with this.I think F/L undervalues Harrison, but other than that I can't argue too much with these rankings overall.

 
I agree on Jamal Charles being way too high. No way would I give up #9 value but if I owned him he would be gone for that value. So many guys behind him I like better.

One name not on here, I think people should remember and that is Andre Brown from the Giants. I think Jacobs is on downside and I liked what I read about this guy last year. I think he has more talent than Shonn Greene and I got him right there with Tashard Choice if not higher.

I love me some Beanie at that ranking. A couple of those 27 year old RB's scare me.

 
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Warning: Shonn Greene is old for a rookie, especially for a RB. He will be 25 by the time the 2010 season starts. Consider that Thomas Jones will probably still be with the Jets in 2010, that makes Greene 26 by the time he gets the gig to himself. To put it into perspective, Jones-Drew has been in the league 4 years and is only 5 months older than Greene...ouch. Also, consider that Greene could go from penthouse to dog house in a hurry with his fumbling problems. I know everyone is falling over themselves to acquire Greene, but IMO you have to take this into consideration in dynasty leagues. Now I still own Greene in one league, but I also traded him and Anthony Gonzalez in another league for the 1.03 in this year's rookie draft.
 
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I don't agree with the comments about Jamaal Charles being all downside and no upside at #9. He had 968 yards and 7 TDs over the last eight games, and gets plenty of receptions, and whilst it is always very optimistic to expect that numbers produced over the second half of the season will come close to being replicated over the course of a full season the following year, he was second only to Johnson amongst RBs in most leagues for the second half of the year. To my mind, he's a risk/reward pick with very high upside, but also bust potential.

 
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Charles proves Chris's point about getting in early on talented RBs. I don't think there's much risk associated with him at all, but the time to buy was prior to 2009.

 
Skepticism on Jamaal Charles is running crazy all over these boards. But I've yet to hear a good reason why he should be devalued after what he did in 2009.

I've heard plenty of reasons, but they all pretty much sound like "I didn't get to watch him play, so he must have been doing it with smoke and mirrors." Or my personal favorite, "I trusted Steve Slaton and Matt Forte too much after their breakouts, so I'm not going to trust Jamaal Charles."

A whole lot of fear of the unknown going on here.

 
Skepticism on Jamaal Charles is running crazy all over these boards. But I've yet to hear a good reason why he should be devalued after what he did in 2009.

I've heard plenty of reasons, but they all pretty much sound like "I didn't get to watch him play, so he must have been doing it with smoke and mirrors." Or my personal favorite, "I trusted Steve Slaton and Matt Forte too much after their breakouts, so I'm not going to trust Jamaal Charles."

A whole lot of fear of the unknown going on here.
One ***** in Charles' armor is that he has arguably the biggest fumbling problem of any RB in the NFL. He coughs it up constantly, that was one of many reasons that he was stuck behind LJ, though really the only decent reason. Now, fumbling doesn't necessarily mean he's a risk for losing touches, Peterson is probably among the top-3 fumblers at RB and its never really effected his touches, but Charles, as good as he looked, is nowhere near that talented.

I could see KC bringing in a GL back just because of that issue. I like Charles and have no problem with his ranking, but he certainly has a flaw.

 
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Skepticism on Jamaal Charles is running crazy all over these boards. But I've yet to hear a good reason why he should be devalued after what he did in 2009.

I've heard plenty of reasons, but they all pretty much sound like "I didn't get to watch him play, so he must have been doing it with smoke and mirrors." Or my personal favorite, "I trusted Steve Slaton and Matt Forte too much after their breakouts, so I'm not going to trust Jamaal Charles."

A whole lot of fear of the unknown going on here.
One ***** in Charles' armor is that he has arguably the biggest fumbling problem of any RB in the NFL. He coughs it up constantly, that was one of many reasons that he was stuck behind LJ, though really the only decent reason. Now, fumbling doesn't necessarily mean he's a risk for losing touches, Peterson is probably among the top-3 fumblers at RB and its never really effected his touches, but Charles, as good as he looked, is nowhere near that talented.

I could see KC bringing in a GL back just because of that issue. I like Charles and have no problem with his ranking, but he certainly has a flaw.
:lol: Of his four fumbles in 266 touches this season, two came on kickoff returns.

So on his 230 touches from scrimmage, he fumbled the ball twice. That doesn't sound like a fumbling problem to me.

 
One ***** in Charles' armor is that he has arguably the biggest fumbling problem of any RB in the NFL. He coughs it up constantly, that was one of many reasons that he was stuck behind LJ, though really the only decent reason.
He's lower-middle of the pack in terms of fumbles/carry. He had one on a KO this year (and kickoff returns have a fumble rate about 3x as high as carries). I also believe he had one on a reception this year, but overall the fumbling is overstated. As you might expect when reading something that says "coughs it up constantly" or "biggest fumbling problem of any RB in the NFL." Simply not true.ETA: I'll defer to F&Ls stats since I was going from memory, but the main point is still good.
 
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Skepticism on Jamaal Charles is running crazy all over these boards. But I've yet to hear a good reason why he should be devalued after what he did in 2009.

I've heard plenty of reasons, but they all pretty much sound like "I didn't get to watch him play, so he must have been doing it with smoke and mirrors." Or my personal favorite, "I trusted Steve Slaton and Matt Forte too much after their breakouts, so I'm not going to trust Jamaal Charles."

A whole lot of fear of the unknown going on here.
One ***** in Charles' armor is that he has arguably the biggest fumbling problem of any RB in the NFL. He coughs it up constantly, that was one of many reasons that he was stuck behind LJ, though really the only decent reason. Now, fumbling doesn't necessarily mean he's a risk for losing touches, Peterson is probably among the top-3 fumblers at RB and its never really effected his touches, but Charles, as good as he looked, is nowhere near that talented.

I could see KC bringing in a GL back just because of that issue. I like Charles and have no problem with his ranking, but he certainly has a flaw.
:lol: Of his four fumbles in 266 touches this season, two came on kickoff returns.

So on his 230 touches from scrimmage, he fumbled the ball twice. That doesn't sound like a fumbling problem to me.
You are correct. I must have seen every single one multiple times or something because it sure seemed like more than 4. That'll teach me not to fact check.
 
You are correct. I must have seen every single one multiple times or something because it sure seemed like more than 4. That'll teach me not to fact check.
IIRC, Charles ended up in the doghouse, deactivated for one game early in the season for his fumble on the opening kickoff against the Giants. Haley made a big deal of the fumble at the time. But Haley also wasted Charles behind "Mr. 2.7 YPC" Larry Johnson, so what does he know?
 
What backs outside of Tier 1 (not including Stewart since it's indicated in the article that he's Tier 1 on talent alone) have the greatest chance to leap into Tier 1? IIRC, Steven Jackson was a Tier 1 guy at one point last year.

 
What backs outside of Tier 1 (not including Stewart since it's indicated in the article that he's Tier 1 on talent alone) have the greatest chance to leap into Tier 1? IIRC, Steven Jackson was a Tier 1 guy at one point last year.
On talent alone, I'd say Gore and Wells. Really, I was surprised Gore was in tier 2.
 
What backs outside of Tier 1 (not including Stewart since it's indicated in the article that he's Tier 1 on talent alone) have the greatest chance to leap into Tier 1? IIRC, Steven Jackson was a Tier 1 guy at one point last year.
Tier 2) SJax and Gore are obvious on-the-cusp tier 1 types. Situation and age devalue them a little. DWill will also be tier 1 again after 2010 when he's looking more likely to be the unquestioned starter on a different team but will be 28 by that time. I think the value play in tier 2 is Mendenhall. Not a realistic shot to finish top 3 any given year, but very likely to finish inside the top 10 most years, especially PPR.Tier 3) Turner, Grant, Moreno and Benson are my targets. Turner is top 10 when he plays. Missing games at the end of the year is a sour taste that many owners may be wanting to wash out. Grant is not a PPG stud, but can be counted on all year on a high-powered offense. Moreno will likely have to wait for a QB 'till his offense is good enough to put him into tier 1 but that could be very likely over the next 2-3 years. Benson is like Rudi II to me. Will always be valued in the 11-15 range and is a VERY SAFE bet to finish around RB 10 every year. The perfect #2 RB. Perrenial 12-1300 & 8. I would say he is very UNLIKELY to make it to the 1st tier, but he's a good value target.Tier 4) Ronnie is listed as a year too old. He just turned 28 and is a PPG monster. Top 5 candidate in PPG but you have to have depth if you own him. Benson/Ronne was a fantastic duo for me while I was waiting for Rice & Mendenhall to take their starting jobs.
 
Warning: Shonn Greene is old for a rookie, especially for a RB. He will be 25 by the time the 2010 season starts. Consider that Thomas Jones will probably still be with the Jets in 2010, that makes Greene 26 by the time he gets the gig to himself. To put it into perspective, Jones-Drew has been in the league 4 years and is only 5 months older than Greene...ouch. Also, consider that Greene could go from penthouse to dog house in a hurry with his fumbling problems. I know everyone is falling over themselves to acquire Greene, but IMO you have to take this into consideration in dynasty leagues. Now I still own Greene in one league, but I also traded him and Anthony Gonzalez in another league for the 1.03 in this year's rookie draft.
If he continues to get very limited carries next year, I don't think his age has a lot to do with it. I believe it's more about the mileage than the age. I consider his ball control skills more of a concern.
 
Here's why I would not touch Charles with a top 20 pick in a dynasty startup:

- He wasn't billed as an elite talent entering the league.

- His current value is based primarily on an 4 game stretch that may or may not be an accurate reflection of his talent.

- His YPC and workload over that 4 games are not sustainable over a full season.

His ceiling is probably not much higher than RB9, but his floor is a lot lower. I certainly won't consider drafting him in the top two rounds of my dynasty startups this offseason. He's an unnecessary risk that high.

 
Here's why I would not touch Charles with a top 20 pick in a dynasty startup:- He wasn't billed as an elite talent entering the league.
If "elite" is the barometer, then neither were Frank Gore, Ray Rice, or Maurice Jones-Drew. But Reggie Bush and Darren McFadden sure were.
- His current value is based primarily on an 4 game stretch that may or may not be an accurate reflection of his talent.
It's actually based on his 8 game stretch after getting the starting job, which gives us a better reflection of his talent. Watching his games and keeping up with quotes coming out of Kansas City also gives us a pretty good reflection of his talent.
- His YPC and workload over that 4 games are not sustainable over a full season.
Good point. If they were, he'd be ranked second or third instead of a more reasonable ninth.
His ceiling is probably not much higher than RB9, but his floor is a lot lower. I certainly won't consider drafting him in the top two rounds of my dynasty startups this offseason. He's an unnecessary risk that high.
Considering he finished second in the league in fantasy points in the final 8 games, I'd say his ceiling is much higher than you're giving him credit for. Actually, the risk is necessary. If you want his upside, you're not going to be able to get him by waiting for him to fall to you.
 
Tier 4) Ronnie is listed as a year too old.
:goodposting: Ages are listed as of Week 1 of the 2010 season. Brown is 28 now and will turn 29 late in the 2010 season.
I saw 28.9 and figured you were writing this a month ago. He just turned 28 last month. He should be good for 3 more years. I'd put him right with Turner/Benson also. I just think 3 years worth of top 5 PPG is a pretty good deal for someone rated that low. I do have to say, if he ended another year on IR I'd sell him for a candy bar.
 
What backs outside of Tier 1 (not including Stewart since it's indicated in the article that he's Tier 1 on talent alone) have the greatest chance to leap into Tier 1? IIRC, Steven Jackson was a Tier 1 guy at one point last year.
On talent alone, I'd say Gore and Wells. Really, I was surprised Gore was in tier 2.
Gore's 27. He'd merit tier 1 status based on his production over the next 3 years, but he has no exit value. Remember the point made in the paragraph before the rankings- RBs don't see a slow decline in value, they see a sudden drop. 3 years from now, Rice and Gore might have put up comparable points, but Rice will still fetch a pair of rookie first rounders, while Gore might fetch a 3rd rounder if the other guy is desperate for RB help.
 
Here's why I would not touch Charles with a top 20 pick in a dynasty startup:- He wasn't billed as an elite talent entering the league.- His current value is based primarily on an 4 game stretch that may or may not be an accurate reflection of his talent. - His YPC and workload over that 4 games are not sustainable over a full season. His ceiling is probably not much higher than RB9, but his floor is a lot lower. I certainly won't consider drafting him in the top two rounds of my dynasty startups this offseason. He's an unnecessary risk that high.
He was also fairly untrained coming out of college IIRC. Wasn't he mostly involved in track during the offseason, not a football offseason program? Maybe he's getting strong enough that the coaches think he's ready. Nobody expected him to outright take LJ's job away in the first two years anyways. Well, he did. I don't know that I could pick him top 20 in a startup dynasty, but by pick 30 he would start looking really good. I know I would take Mendenhall, Turner, Benson, Moreno, and maybe Ronnie and Wells over him. Add in 15 WRs and 5 QBs
 
I saw 28.9 and figured you were writing this a month ago. He just turned 28 last month. He should be good for 3 more years. I'd put him right with Turner/Benson also. I just think 3 years worth of top 5 PPG is a pretty good deal for someone rated that low. I do have to say, if he ended another year on IR I'd sell him for a candy bar.
Brown's not going to be 100% at the beginning of next season, so I doubt he'll be top 5 PPG next year. Three years from now, he'll be 30 (with two major season-ending injuries on his legs already), so I doubt he'll be a top 5 PPG guy. I'd be surprised if Brown had more than 1 top-5 season left in him.I'm as big of a Ronnie fan as you'll find- I've been needling F&L since this past offseason about how Brown should have been rated ahead of Turner- but the season-ending injury changes the equation big-time.
 
What backs outside of Tier 1 (not including Stewart since it's indicated in the article that he's Tier 1 on talent alone) have the greatest chance to leap into Tier 1? IIRC, Steven Jackson was a Tier 1 guy at one point last year.
On talent alone, I'd say Gore and Wells. Really, I was surprised Gore was in tier 2.
Gore's 27. He'd merit tier 1 status based on his production over the next 3 years, but he has no exit value. Remember the point made in the paragraph before the rankings- RBs don't see a slow decline in value, they see a sudden drop. 3 years from now, Rice and Gore might have put up comparable points, but Rice will still fetch a pair of rookie first rounders, while Gore might fetch a 3rd rounder if the other guy is desperate for RB help.
Excellent point, and reinforces the concept of value windows that you've preached before.
 
Tier 4) Ronnie is listed as a year too old.
:no: Ages are listed as of Week 1 of the 2010 season. Brown is 28 now and will turn 29 late in the 2010 season.
I saw 28.9 and figured you were writing this a month ago. He just turned 28 last month. He should be good for 3 more years. I'd put him right with Turner/Benson also. I just think 3 years worth of top 5 PPG is a pretty good deal for someone rated that low. I do have to say, if he ended another year on IR I'd sell him for a candy bar.
Turner/Benson get the ball 20 times a game. Ronnie Brown splits time with a very productive back. Where are you getting 3 years of Top 5 PPG? This is just something you are personally projecting? I have a hard time seeing him beginning a string of 16-game seasons at age 28 when he's been unable to avoid major injuries to this point.
 
Gore's 27. He'd merit tier 1 status based on his production over the next 3 years, but he has no exit value. Remember the point made in the paragraph before the rankings- RBs don't see a slow decline in value, they see a sudden drop. 3 years from now, Rice and Gore might have put up comparable points, but Rice will still fetch a pair of rookie first rounders, while Gore might fetch a 3rd rounder if the other guy is desperate for RB help.
Well put.
 
Tier 4) Ronnie is listed as a year too old.
:no: Ages are listed as of Week 1 of the 2010 season. Brown is 28 now and will turn 29 late in the 2010 season.
I saw 28.9 and figured you were writing this a month ago. He just turned 28 last month. He should be good for 3 more years. I'd put him right with Turner/Benson also. I just think 3 years worth of top 5 PPG is a pretty good deal for someone rated that low. I do have to say, if he ended another year on IR I'd sell him for a candy bar.
Turner/Benson get the ball 20 times a game. Ronnie Brown splits time with a very productive back. Where are you getting 3 years of Top 5 PPG? This is just something you are personally projecting? I have a hard time seeing him beginning a string of 16-game seasons at age 28 when he's been unable to avoid major injuries to this point.
Splitting hairs here but I think you were being generous on Ronnie's #21 rank. He's had an ACL and now a LisFranc fracture. Those same two injuries basically wiped Kevin Jones off the fantasy landscape.
 
Tier 4) Ronnie is listed as a year too old.
:no: Ages are listed as of Week 1 of the 2010 season. Brown is 28 now and will turn 29 late in the 2010 season.
I saw 28.9 and figured you were writing this a month ago. He just turned 28 last month. He should be good for 3 more years. I'd put him right with Turner/Benson also. I just think 3 years worth of top 5 PPG is a pretty good deal for someone rated that low. I do have to say, if he ended another year on IR I'd sell him for a candy bar.
Turner/Benson get the ball 20 times a game. Ronnie Brown splits time with a very productive back. Where are you getting 3 years of Top 5 PPG? This is just something you are personally projecting? I have a hard time seeing him beginning a string of 16-game seasons at age 28 when he's been unable to avoid major injuries to this point.
I probably am too high on Ronnie, but I've owned him a couple times over the last few years and when he plays, he's a bona-fide #1 RB (he was #6 PPG in my league this year). It's not like Westy either where you have to be watching the inactive list every week. Now Ricky is going to be 33 and this is a detriment?
 
Now Ricky is going to be 33 and this is a detriment?
Why wouldn't it be? A heck of a lot of Brown's value is tied up in 2010, a season in which he's coming off a second straight major injury while Ricky is coming off one of the three best age-32 seasons of all time.
And Ronnie was still #6 in PPG played. I agree there is doubt about future implications from his latest injury. I'm not trying to argue that you or anybody else should have Ronnie ranked higher. I only have him over about 6 other guys on your list. I'd have Charles several spots lower too and that is where I was coming from. I like Charles, and would like to roster him but I'm not paying RB9 price for him. Nowhere near that.ETA - the original response was to "who is most likely to make the jump to tier 1?" On your list, I doubt anybody from tier 3 down have a chance to make your tier 1. I'm answering it from a "who is likely to outperform tier 1 guys over the next 3 years?"

 
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He was also fairly untrained coming out of college IIRC. Wasn't he mostly involved in track during the offseason, not a football offseason program? Maybe he's getting strong enough that the coaches think he's ready. Nobody expected him to outright take LJ's job away in the first two years anyways. Well, he did. I don't know that I could pick him top 20 in a startup dynasty, but by pick 30 he would start looking really good. I know I would take Mendenhall, Turner, Benson, Moreno, and maybe Ronnie and Wells over him. Add in 15 WRs and 5 QBs
Turner and Ronnie are both damaged goods- both an old 28, both coming off of season-ending injuries. Both guys are more "established" than Charles, but at the same time, their value is still every bit as precarious. I might value them higher if I had an established contender and I was looking for a final piece, but if I didn't think I was in the top third of the league, I'd go for Charles.Benson's also damaged goods, but in a different way. He's almost as old as those two, and while his counting stats were fantastic this year, his rate stats weren't good enough to completely wash the taste of his first four seasons out of my mouth.Mendenhall, Moreno, and Wells all have a solid argument over Charles. They're young and they have impeccable pedigree. The problem is that none of the three have been all that impressive, imo. Wells has been the best of the bunch, but he's also the guy I liked least coming into the league, and it's not like he's been THAT impressive. According to DVOA, Wells was 28th, Mendenhall was 31st, and Moreno was 37th this year. That's a lot of mediocrity. It comes down to, then, whether you'd rather have a mediocre back with fantastic measurables and pedigree, or a fantastic back with mediocre measurables and pedigree.Mendenhall, in particular, I think is very overrated right now. He started the season like gangbusters, averaging 5+ ypc in 5 of his first 7 games (and in one of the two games where he didn't, he only had 4 carries), and a whopping 5.73 ypc total over that span. That helped mask the fact that he put up one heck of a second half swoon, averaging just 3.77 ypc over his last 8 games. What also gets lost in the shuffle is that he did most of his damage against the Weak Sisters of the Poor. He had a game against Detroit (25th in rushing yards allowed, 21st in ypc allowed), Denver (26th, 27th), Kansas City (31st, 31st), Oakland (29th, 28th), and San Diego (20th and 24th, and their defense was even worse than that because they'd just lost Jamal Williams for the season and hadn't found an answer yet). He also had two games against Cleveland (28th in rushing yards allowed, 29th in rushing ypc allowed). That's 7 games against downright bad rush defenses (including 5 against the bottom 6), and he only played 13 games this year. That's more than half of his season. Against the elite run defenses he faced (Cincy, GB, Minnesota, Baltimore x2), Mendenhall averaged 15/55/0.4 rushing (3.67 ypc). Now, I'm not going to bury a guy for struggling against great run defenses, because that's what slightly above average RBs do- they struggle against elite run defenses. I'm just pointing out that it's not what ELITE RBs do. I don't see any difference between Rashard Mendenhall right now and a guy like Marshawn Lynch or Kevin Smith a year ago. He's an above average back who is good enough to get the job done, but I think his high ranking has more to do with the dearth of deserving candidates than it does with his own merit.
 
He was also fairly untrained coming out of college IIRC. Wasn't he mostly involved in track during the offseason, not a football offseason program? Maybe he's getting strong enough that the coaches think he's ready. Nobody expected him to outright take LJ's job away in the first two years anyways. Well, he did. I don't know that I could pick him top 20 in a startup dynasty, but by pick 30 he would start looking really good. I know I would take Mendenhall, Turner, Benson, Moreno, and maybe Ronnie and Wells over him. Add in 15 WRs and 5 QBs
Turner and Ronnie are both damaged goods- both an old 28, both coming off of season-ending injuries. Both guys are more "established" than Charles, but at the same time, their value is still every bit as precarious. I might value them higher if I had an established contender and I was looking for a final piece, but if I didn't think I was in the top third of the league, I'd go for Charles.Benson's also damaged goods, but in a different way. He's almost as old as those two, and while his counting stats were fantastic this year, his rate stats weren't good enough to completely wash the taste of his first four seasons out of my mouth.

Mendenhall, Moreno, and Wells all have a solid argument over Charles. They're young and they have impeccable pedigree. The problem is that none of the three have been all that impressive, imo. Wells has been the best of the bunch, but he's also the guy I liked least coming into the league, and it's not like he's been THAT impressive. According to DVOA, Wells was 28th, Mendenhall was 31st, and Moreno was 37th this year. That's a lot of mediocrity. It comes down to, then, whether you'd rather have a mediocre back with fantastic measurables and pedigree, or a fantastic back with mediocre measurables and pedigree.



Mendenhall, in particular, I think is very overrated right now. He started the season like gangbusters, averaging 5+ ypc in 5 of his first 7 games (and in one of the two games where he didn't, he only had 4 carries), and a whopping 5.73 ypc total over that span. That helped mask the fact that he put up one heck of a second half swoon, averaging just 3.77 ypc over his last 8 games. What also gets lost in the shuffle is that he did most of his damage against the Weak Sisters of the Poor. He had a game against Detroit (25th in rushing yards allowed, 21st in ypc allowed), Denver (26th, 27th), Kansas City (31st, 31st), Oakland (29th, 28th), and San Diego (20th and 24th, and their defense was even worse than that because they'd just lost Jamal Williams for the season and hadn't found an answer yet). He also had two games against Cleveland (28th in rushing yards allowed, 29th in rushing ypc allowed). That's 7 games against downright bad rush defenses (including 5 against the bottom 6), and he only played 13 games this year. That's more than half of his season. Against the elite run defenses he faced (Cincy, GB, Minnesota, Baltimore x2), Mendenhall averaged 15/55/0.4 rushing (3.67 ypc). Now, I'm not going to bury a guy for struggling against great run defenses, because that's what slightly above average RBs do- they struggle against elite run defenses. I'm just pointing out that it's not what ELITE RBs do. I don't see any difference between Rashard Mendenhall right now and a guy like Marshawn Lynch or Kevin Smith a year ago. He's an above average back who is good enough to get the job done, but I think his high ranking has more to do with the dearth of deserving candidates than it does with his own merit.
And during Charles super stretch, which defenses did he face? A HUGE game against the faltering Broncos, and good games against the Bengals, Browns, Bills and Raiders. I'm not saying I'm not impressed with what he did, but a big 2nd 1/2 of a season doesn't make me put someone in my top 10 dynasty RBs. Especially one that is playing for a franchise that has been run the way KC has been the last few years.Mendenhall on the other hand, has a good supporting cast. Good ownership and team management. Won the starting job from Parker and by the end of the season had earned the 3rd down role over M.Moore who is a very competent 3rd down back. I totally expect Mendys #s to climb next year as Pittsburgh finally has a draft pick that should afford them a decent lineman and has been told by owner, agreed by head coach and (had better be) accepted by O coordinator that 42% rushing plays is unacceptable.

 
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Turner and Ronnie are both damaged goods- both an old 28, both coming off of season-ending injuries. Both guys are more "established" than Charles, but at the same time, their value is still every bit as precarious. I might value them higher if I had an established contender and I was looking for a final piece, but if I didn't think I was in the top third of the league, I'd go for Charles.
This is pretty much where I'm coming from on Charles. Even if you consider him a risky RB, he's a still a 23-year-old feature back with obvious talent and impressive production in his 8-game starting window. How risky is that, really, compared to the guys ranked near him?
 
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I am torn on Charles. On one hand he performed and showed no signs of stopping. On the other I sense that the coaching staff will bring in a bigger complementary back to share the load. Living in KC I was forced to watch all games more or less and Charles was playing through minor injury A LOT. While he gets credit for playing it also sets off some red flags especially around his shoulder which keeps popping in and out of joint during games. I'd probably take him in the 2nd round of a startup figuring his downside is a 10-15 touch explosive back with RB1 upside but not as my first pick.

 
Turner and Ronnie are both damaged goods- both an old 28, both coming off of season-ending injuries. Both guys are more "established" than Charles, but at the same time, their value is still every bit as precarious. I might value them higher if I had an established contender and I was looking for a final piece, but if I didn't think I was in the top third of the league, I'd go for Charles.
This is pretty much where I'm coming from on Charles. Even if you consider him a risky RB, he's a still a 23-year-old feature back with obvious talent and impressive production in his 8-game starting window. How risky is that, really, compared to the guys ranked near him?
About as risky as it was for Kevin Jones, Julius Jones, William Green, etc when they were in the same situation :lol:
 
I am torn on Charles. On one hand he performed and showed no signs of stopping. On the other I sense that the coaching staff will bring in a bigger complementary back to share the load. Living in KC I was forced to watch all games more or less and Charles was playing through minor injury A LOT. While he gets credit for playing it also sets off some red flags especially around his shoulder which keeps popping in and out of joint during games. I'd probably take him in the 2nd round of a startup figuring his downside is a 10-15 touch explosive back with RB1 upside but not as my first pick.
:lol: Valid points. And for the record, I don't see the No. 9 ranked RB as a first-rounder in startup drafts. Andre Johnson, Fitz, Calvin Johnson, Aaron Rodgers, and Drew Brees should all be first rounders.
 
Turner and Ronnie are both damaged goods- both an old 28, both coming off of season-ending injuries. Both guys are more "established" than Charles, but at the same time, their value is still every bit as precarious. I might value them higher if I had an established contender and I was looking for a final piece, but if I didn't think I was in the top third of the league, I'd go for Charles.
This is pretty much where I'm coming from on Charles. Even if you consider him a risky RB, he's a still a 23-year-old feature back with obvious talent and impressive production in his 8-game starting window. How risky is that, really, compared to the guys ranked near him?
About as risky as it was for Kevin Jones, Julius Jones, William Green, etc when they were in the same situation :lol:
They finished 2nd in the NFL in fantasy points over the second half of the season? I bought into Kevin Jones before the injuries, but I was never high on Julius Jones and William Green should never have been in anybody's Top 20 RBs. I'm leery of painting backs with a wide brush just because they had second-half success.
 
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Turner and Ronnie are both damaged goods- both an old 28, both coming off of season-ending injuries. Both guys are more "established" than Charles, but at the same time, their value is still every bit as precarious. I might value them higher if I had an established contender and I was looking for a final piece, but if I didn't think I was in the top third of the league, I'd go for Charles.
This is pretty much where I'm coming from on Charles. Even if you consider him a risky RB, he's a still a 23-year-old feature back with obvious talent and impressive production in his 8-game starting window. How risky is that, really, compared to the guys ranked near him?
About as risky as it was for Kevin Jones, Julius Jones, William Green, etc when they were in the same situation :excited:
They finished 2nd in the NFL in fantasy points over the second half of the season?
I don't have the numbers on where they finished here on me, but I wouldn't be surprised if they weren't close to 2nd over the second half of the season when they got a shot at the starting gig. I think you're forgetting just how dominant they were when they came in for their stretch runs.Jamal Charles took over the featured gig in week 10 and went for 1109/7 in 8 games. 138/.87 per game.Kevin Jones took over the featured gig in week 10 and went for 1016/4 in 8 games. 127/.5 per game.Julius Jones took over the featured gig in week 11 and went for 718/3 in 7 games. 103/.43 per game.William Green took over the featured gig in week 11 and went for 837/5 in 7 games. 120/.72 per game.Ryan Grant took over the featured gig in week 9 and went for 1047/8 in 9 games. 116/.89 per game.So you can see that Charles was a bit better than those guys, but not by much really.
 
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Benson is like Rudi II to me. Will always be valued in the 11-15 range and is a VERY SAFE bet to finish around RB 10 every year. The perfect #2 RB. Perrenial 12-1300 & 8.
Really? :yes: I guess it's possible going forward, but they've been totally different through their first 4 or 5 years being in the league (with Benson under-performing his draft NFL draft status and Rudi over-achieving)
 
Turner and Ronnie are both damaged goods- both an old 28, both coming off of season-ending injuries. Both guys are more "established" than Charles, but at the same time, their value is still every bit as precarious. I might value them higher if I had an established contender and I was looking for a final piece, but if I didn't think I was in the top third of the league, I'd go for Charles.
This is pretty much where I'm coming from on Charles. Even if you consider him a risky RB, he's a still a 23-year-old feature back with obvious talent and impressive production in his 8-game starting window. How risky is that, really, compared to the guys ranked near him?
About as risky as it was for Kevin Jones, Julius Jones, William Green, etc when they were in the same situation :goodposting:
They finished 2nd in the NFL in fantasy points over the second half of the season?
I don't have the numbers on where they finished here on me, but I wouldn't be surprised if they weren't close to 2nd over the second half of the season when they got a shot at the starting gig. I think you're forgetting just how dominant they were when they came in for their stretch runs.Jamal Charles took over the featured gig in week 10 and went for 1109/7 in 8 games. 138/.87 per game.Kevin Jones took over the featured gig in week 10 and went for 1016/4 in 8 games. 127/.5 per game.Julius Jones took over the featured gig in week 11 and went for 718/3 in 7 games. 103/.43 per game.William Green took over the featured gig in week 11 and went for 837/5 in 7 games. 120/.72 per game.Ryan Grant took over the featured gig in week 9 and went for 1047/8 in 9 games. 116/.89 per game.So you can see that Charles was a bit better than those guys, but not by much really.
So what are you telling me?Charles is going to suffer a torn ACL and lisfranc injury?Charles is going to lose his confidence and split carries with a better back?Charles is going to start doing drugs on a regular basis and be out of the league in a couple of years?Charles is going to stay a solid but unspectacular Top-10 back?I guess I just don't know what to do with this info. Jamaal Charles is a different player than those guys.
 
Here's why I would not touch Charles with a top 20 pick in a dynasty startup:- He wasn't billed as an elite talent entering the league.- His current value is based primarily on an 4 game stretch that may or may not be an accurate reflection of his talent. - His YPC and workload over that 4 games are not sustainable over a full season. His ceiling is probably not much higher than RB9, but his floor is a lot lower. I certainly won't consider drafting him in the top two rounds of my dynasty startups this offseason. He's an unnecessary risk that high.
EBF pretty much sums up my feelings. I would like to have him on my team but I wouldn't want to pay top 20 prices to get him because his body of work is not extensive. With RBs, there are often guys who emerge who can put together a string of good games but that doesn't prove that they can do it over a whole season. Frankly, other than age, I am not sure what makes Charles so much better than Harrison.
 

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