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Yes. It was equally incensed by that. I said earlier that I think the Right is largely to blame for starting this horrible tradition of veiled physical threats against political targets. The Left is taking it to a whole new level. Thankfully the Right doesn't have rap videos.
Dude, did you just stroke out or something? Seriously. I'm worried.Wtf you talking bout, Jack?
Indictments where called for. It's not that difficult. Trial. Cross-examination. Light of day.
No. Where did you see me say the other video was ok. Niether are. But if that does happen, i dont think the person should face criminal charges. It would be simply some artist making an awful video, in terrible taste. Im sure there will be plenty horrible videos on both side of the coin produced by people on the net.So you think it's ok to make a video showing a gun to Al Sharpton's head and the first words of the song are, "Because two cops got killed, L Sharpton's gotta die."? Would response be refined to saying that it's in "terrible taste"?Im not familiar with what farakhan said. Uncle murda, while an idiot made a song. no different from making a movie really. I think its in terrible taste. But sony made a movie about assassinating the leader of a countryI'm specifically talking about Louis Farakhan and Uncle Murda. Do you not think either of these two should face criminal charges?your reaching here. very few involved wanted violence.Inciting a riot? Inciting violence? I'm sure there's a criminal statute that could be invoked. You honestly think it's ok to publicly call for someone's murder? Really?What are you going to have them arrested for?That's a fair question, and I appreciate your approach - seriously.My answer is - no, I don't think most protesters think like that. I think most protesters are good people trying to do the right thing. Just like I think most cops are good people trying to do the right thing as well. The protests crossed the line in the Mike Brown case. They fostered the lie that Mike Brown was shot in the back, then whipped everyone into a frenzy when the Grand Jury came back with its very reasonable conclusion not to indict. Then things went WAY off the rails into criminal behavior when Brown's stepfather called for people to burn down the city. He should have been arrested immediately for that. The protests have gotten progressively out of hand, lies have gone uncorrected, and people have sat idly by while rappers have made music videos starring public defenders that are paid with taxpayer money that directly call pon people to murder cops.do you really think that all the protesters and supporters of this movement think like the folks in that video?
I'm outraged that people have become so callous that when a tragedy like this happens, they come into message boards to troll and have a little fun. I'm outraged that the good people in here sit idly by and don't say a word. Sick of people making excuses for the people who bear responsibility for this. Nobody in here is calling out the rappers who made the video. More people have defended Al Sharpton in here than have criticized him. The Left has lost all sense of reason on this issue.
And don't think I'm some right wing fanatic either. I'm equally passionate about the crap going on with the Right. In many ways it is the Right that started this horrible trend in this country of demonizing political opponents to the point where it borders on criminal behavior. Pro-life lunatics targeting abortion doctors - publishing their home address. The pro gun lobby, and Sara Palin supporters, making tee shirts that show their political opponents in cross-hairs. How can direct threats like this be tolerated in a civilized society? I guess the answer is, we are no longer a civilized society. And Urbanhack - there's your answer to why I am angry.
I started off in this thread saying I predicted this would happen weeks ago. This was misunderstood as me bragging or being a Nostradamus??? No, it was simple resignation that my warnings over the last few months gave way to my worst fears. We laid out these poor cops as a human sacrifice to appease people who were legitimately wronged for many years. Sharpton knew what he was doing was over the line. The media knew it too. But the did it anyway. For personal gain and for ratings. If you yell fire in a crowded movie theatre you are responsible for the ensuing panic. If you sit idly by while people call for cops heads, and don't do anything to stop it, you are complicit when the cops are eventually murdered. I'm sick of it. Time to call out idiots like Farakhan and Uncle Murda. Time to put these people in jail where they belong. It's not free speech. It's criminal behavior. And if you don think that it sways public opinion then you are not paying attention. Where do you think yesterday's killer got the phrase "two of them for everyone one of ours"?
Well you already put words in my mouth, so that's fine if you think I'm offending the grieving family, you can believe what you want. Obviously not my intention. God bless them that they can feel that way after the loss of family. Btw, do you have a link for where they said "we forgive him"? I hadn't read that yet.You're disrespecting the people who said "We forgive him" and "...peaceful coexistence." You're using a family's tragedy to further your own agenda.
Interesting.... Is that the same conflict of interest that exists when a minority jury is pressured to find the defendant guilt when it gets to trial? Kinda like reverse OJ?
Not sure I follow you on that one. Are you in the same building as Apple Jack? If so please check the CO detector immediately.
Based on your theory, everyone is supposed to follow the direction of a public speaker. You're removing the ability of the individual to decide what is right or wrong.
The law don't work that way. Isn't that one of the great liberal tenets? I am my brother's keeper? It's the same principle that allows ridiculous product liability suits where people do some of the most stupid stuff you cold ever imagine. In short, you do have to interpret how the idiots of the world will handle your product, or in this case, your words.Let's just put it this way, if you plan on protesting agains the police in New York anytime soon, I'd be very careful with what you say.
Thanks dude. I appreciate your kind words. Especially after I attacked you this morning lol. Good to see there's some good eggs left in the FFA.
That's a good point. Lost in all of this is that the two people murdered were minorities. Not sure I'd call them non-white though.BustedKnuckles said:
Do you really believe that someone who says "someone should assassinate X" should be charged with a crime?General Tso said:
Doesn't that sort of possibly fall into incitement and the true threat doctrine?
I can't believe this is actually a serious question. Of course I think they should be charged with a crime. Because it is a crime. In many states, like Ohio for instance, it's a third degree felony:
Not sure what you're getting at, Jack. Use your words.
I'm still not sure how the Kaminer article doesn't shed at least a question on Henry Ford's hypothetical. You may ignore at your own leisure, of course, but I think it's unwise.
Yes, your Honor. Their statements created a clear and present danger that proximately resulted in a crime!
I'm really, really sorry.General Tso said:
Cute emojis aside, not sure what your point is. When the killer cites a phrase used by Louis Farrakhan ("you take one of ours we take two of yours") who just so happened to give a highly charged speech in Baltimore a few weeks ago overtly calling for violence, then yeah, I'd say that it's proximate enough.
Yes, your Honor. Their statements created a clear and present danger that proximately resulted in a crime!
Didn't Sean Connery say this in The Untouchables?Cute emojis aside, not sure what your point is. When the killer cites a phrase used by Louis Farrakhan ("you take one of ours we take two of yours") who just so happened to give a highly charged speech in Baltimore a few weeks ago overtly calling for violence, then yeah, I'd say that it's proximate enough.
Yes, your Honor. Their statements created a clear and present danger that proximately resulted in a crime!
It will be interesting to see where the investigation goes on this. If this guy attended Farrakhan's speech in Baltimore, and there was evidence that he was motivated in some way by the speech (difficult to prove, granted) then it's very plausible that a criminal case could be made against Farrakhan.
I think the country has had enough of the threats of violence from both sides. I know I have.
So in your simple mind that's all that can be said about this topic - that you can't kill cops. Bravo! Why didn't anyone think of that earlier? You sir are a genius.
... this is where you follow it up with some kind of fact, opinion, or heck - even an emotion or feeling - that advances the conversation...
I think we could have a really worthwhile conversation on this topic if you would spend a few years in law school first.
Oh please. What a toolishly snobby and condescending remark.
So maybe I need to read some more of Pinky's posts, but I have a question for Pinky, and I mean this forthrightly and not in a baiting fashion:PinkydaPimp said:do you really think that all the protesters and supporters of this movement think like the folks in that video?General Tso said:Thank you for at least acknowledging that. It's a small step, but encouraging.PinkydaPimp said:No those are just idiots.General Tso said:
And BTW i saw that video when it came out and was ashamed. but knew at some point someone would point out that video and make it seem as if we all think like that. The makers of that video are as bad as the few cops that tweeted out threats. Neither are representative of the entire group however.
Man, you just dont get it. Why are you searching for some agenda with this incident. The guy was crazy, tried to kill himself previously, did something crazy and killed himself. He in no way has nothing to do with the protesters other than him using the hashtag. Even if he had attended a protest, he is obviously mentally ill.
I find this interesting because: 1. it does tie in the Liu and Ramos deaths to the calls for reform of police arrest policies (which is a big admission in this thread); and 2. it sets up a mirror situation, because the next conclusion from this premise is that those calling for reform should also cull out the Sharptons and Farrakhans and celebrities and other demagogues who are making money or pr value off these tragedies by using dangerous rhetoric from their ranks.Apple Jack said:
Liu and Ramos were by all accounts "out in the neighborhood." They were part of a community "safety" policing program that had reduced crime by 33% in a very dangerous neighborhood, helping people and families of all classes, incomes, backgrounds, ethnicities make a better life for themselves. My understanding is that the 'vice versa' was there too, that the people appreciated them and that there was genuine sadness hearing of this.
