Sabertooth
Footballguy
I expected him to complete the workout at least.
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Eddie Lacy - 4.4x forties?! Or not - 4.56-4.62 range (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Concept Coop
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ShaHBucks
Footballguy
Roll Tide
ShaHBucks
Footballguy
Interesting but now whe're debating 10-20 more pounds. Could be a logical reason to lose speed. It's not like he's going to make his money running off tackle. He's a power back. He's not a all-world athlete... Ok, but if he lands in the right situation I'd take him in a rookie draft over a better talent. Now we wait
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I'd just like to point out that there's absolutely nothing wrong with Lacy's 40 time. For a guy that big, a 4.6 is a fine time. It's not Jonathan Stewart/Ronnie Brown/Steven Jackson "guys this big shouldn't be physically capable of running this fast", but it's a perfectly fine time for a 240 LB back being considered in the first round. Big backs do not run as fast as small backs- this is physics 101.
I'd also like to point out that this is a major red herring. For the most part, the guys raking Lacy over the coals are not doing so because of his 40 time. They don't care about his 40 time, which was just fine for a 240 LB RB. They care about him being unable to finish the rest of his workout, which is less fine for an RB hoping to get heavy usage in an NFL setting that is far more demanding than a handful of drills in shorts. They also care about how underwhelming all of his other results have been, and how that suggests a lack of explosion which would be problematic in a "power" back.
Guys with Lacy's measurables aren't doomed to NFL failure. They also aren't typically exceptional enough prospects to warrant a first round selection.
With all of this said, if I had a rookie draft tomorrow, I'd still take Lacy at 1.01. Who else is available that doesn't have equally serious red flags?
I'd also like to point out that this is a major red herring. For the most part, the guys raking Lacy over the coals are not doing so because of his 40 time. They don't care about his 40 time, which was just fine for a 240 LB RB. They care about him being unable to finish the rest of his workout, which is less fine for an RB hoping to get heavy usage in an NFL setting that is far more demanding than a handful of drills in shorts. They also care about how underwhelming all of his other results have been, and how that suggests a lack of explosion which would be problematic in a "power" back.
Guys with Lacy's measurables aren't doomed to NFL failure. They also aren't typically exceptional enough prospects to warrant a first round selection.
With all of this said, if I had a rookie draft tomorrow, I'd still take Lacy at 1.01. Who else is available that doesn't have equally serious red flags?
I don't think Hopkins has any red flags at all, he just doesnt have Calvin/AJ/Dez upside. Austin has just as much, if not more upside in a PPR. Bernard or Franklin could easily be more valuable than Lacy depending on destination.
ShaHBucks
Footballguy
You can say that about most of the backs in the league in bad situations. Just ask Bernard Pierce or Toby Gerhart. Or even Mark Ingraham who I think Lacy is more talented than. With that said, I think I'd rather bet on 230+ pounds getting me double digit TD's eventually before Bernard or Franklin. After this workout I think it's time to start giving big backs like Ball and Bell some more credit or as much as Lacy.
A month from now, I could easily see preferring Gio or Franklin to Lacy. In the meantime, "depending on destination" doesn't do me much good when I'm talking about a hypothetical rookie draft being held tomorrow.
I love Hopkins, and could easily see him being my favorite receiver once the draft has shaken out, but best case scenario for him is likely late 1st round, 3rd receiver off the board. Both of those are huge red flags when considering taking a WR with the #1 overall, especially if the fall can't be blamed on character concerns (a la Moss or Dez). Tavon Austin is probably the guy with the fewest red flags right now, but he's still got plenty. For one thing, he's 5'8", 174 lbs. It's one thing to believe he can overcome that (I do), but another to discount it as a red flag entirely. For another, there are only a handful of franchises that I believe are creative enough to commit to him and use him properly. This is less of a concern, since any franchise drafting him high will likely have done their homework- they're likely to self sort on that count. This draft doesn't have any bulletproof prospects. Lacy's struggles are a major negative, but we still have to compare them to everyone else's major negatives and see who gets dinged the least. If I'm drafting tomorrow, Lacy's still that guy for me. Maybe as more information trickles in, that'll change. After the draft, since there are so many tightly-clustered, heavily-flawed prospects, I'm sure everyone's boards will be shuffling radically, anyway.
Harvin, Nicks, Bowe, Roddy all taken in the 20s. Not sure why being taken in the late first is a red flag for a WR.A month from now, I could easily see preferring Gio or Franklin to Lacy. In the meantime, "depending on destination" doesn't do me much good when I'm talking about a hypothetical rookie draft being held tomorrow.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
Probably because when you are talking about the #1 pick, you want a WR that teams are falling all over themselves for, like Julio, Green, Calvin type of guys that have the potential to not only be the #1 overall rookie pick, but at some point the #1 overall dynasty player.Harvin, Nicks, Bowe, Roddy all taken in the 20s. Not sure why being taken in the late first is a red flag for a WR.A month from now, I could easily see preferring Gio or Franklin to Lacy. In the meantime, "depending on destination" doesn't do me much good when I'm talking about a hypothetical rookie draft being held tomorrow.
It's not a red flag saying the guy isn't going to be good, but it's a red flag saying he likely doesn't have stud potential, which is what you want in the #1 pick.
Of course there are exceptions to everything, just like some WRs taken in the top 5 have sucked.
I give him 4.5 on a good day. Plenty enough to turn the corner, break a tackle, whatever. Nobody is drafting Eddie Lacy to be a speedback and hit homeruns. You draft Eddie Lacy to be a workhorse, get the dirty yardage on broken plays.
Get him to the 2nd Level and he has enough in his arsenal to get the job done; his size cannot be understated and you've got to love that in a back. Another "big back" in Mikel Leshoure hammered out 9 Touchdowns last season.
Players develop and change their games when they reach the pros. I wouldn't worry about any times, he's nursing an injury and who's to say if he had the option he wouldn't have deferred running?
Get him to the 2nd Level and he has enough in his arsenal to get the job done; his size cannot be understated and you've got to love that in a back. Another "big back" in Mikel Leshoure hammered out 9 Touchdowns last season.
Players develop and change their games when they reach the pros. I wouldn't worry about any times, he's nursing an injury and who's to say if he had the option he wouldn't have deferred running?
werdnoynek
Footballguy
i agree that his draft position wouldn't be a major red flag but i disagree hopkins is without one. in my eyes, his main red flag would be explosiveness. he just doesn't have it. i think he could be a solid WR in the NFL, but i honestly doubt he could be elite because of that lack of explosiveness.Harvin, Nicks, Bowe, Roddy all taken in the 20s. Not sure why being taken in the late first is a red flag for a WR.A month from now, I could easily see preferring Gio or Franklin to Lacy. In the meantime, "depending on destination" doesn't do me much good when I'm talking about a hypothetical rookie draft being held tomorrow.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
Honestly if I still had any top picks in any leagues, he would probably be my #1 ranked guy as long as he didn't go to one of like the top 3 worst possible destinations while one of the top Rbs didn't end up in the perfect spot.
But in a vacuum now, before the draft, he is my #1. Not real comfortable with the pick in general as a #1, but he is my top of the mediocre crop pick.
cusefan115
Footballguy
An explanation from the Lacy camp. Take it for what its worth. I've been a Lacy backer throughout and I think it makes sense. I know that some people will be more skeptical though. We'll see what the NFL thinks soon enough.
Eddie Lacy - RB - Player
Alabama RB Eddie Lacy attributed his inability to finish his April 11 Pro Day to having only two weeks to train.
Lacy battled a hamstring tear for all of January through March. Finally healthy, Lacy turned in a below-average workout and couldn't finish, noticeably losing his breath at times. "By the time it was anywhere close to 100 percent, I only had two weeks to train," he said. "Everybody knows two weeks is not enough time, pretty much to do anything. I went out there, I did the best I could." We still tentatively expect the workout to knock Lacy into round two.
Source: Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel
Apr 19 - 10:52 PM
Eddie Lacy - RB - Player
Alabama RB Eddie Lacy attributed his inability to finish his April 11 Pro Day to having only two weeks to train.
Lacy battled a hamstring tear for all of January through March. Finally healthy, Lacy turned in a below-average workout and couldn't finish, noticeably losing his breath at times. "By the time it was anywhere close to 100 percent, I only had two weeks to train," he said. "Everybody knows two weeks is not enough time, pretty much to do anything. I went out there, I did the best I could." We still tentatively expect the workout to knock Lacy into round two.
Source: Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel
Apr 19 - 10:52 PM
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Dinsy Ejotuz
Footballguy
Weird how many guys get through a 13-game NCAA season unscathed but come up with minor soft-tissue injuries before the combine.
Also, NFLDS.com crediting Lacy with 4.64.
Also, NFLDS.com crediting Lacy with 4.64.
yeah, even if you want to give Lacy a pass on the conditioning issue, being sidelined for 3 months by a hamstring injury that didnt come in a game only adds to his durability issues. He already had a reputation for always being nicked up before the pre-draft season. He had a very serious case of turf toe that required surgery and never had more than 204 carries (never even over 100 coming into this year). Whether he can hold up under an NFL starting RB workload is a serious question. He may be best-suited as 1A, as opposed to being a 300+ carry workhorse.
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Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
I'm not sure it's all that surprising. The college season ends in November/December (depending on if you go to a bowl) and once that ends, if you're not involved with team activities, it's easy to see how your conditioning could slip. Then when they try to perform at pre-draft evaluations as if it's in-season their bodies say "WTH?".
werdnoynek
Footballguy
Andy Dufresne said:
ETA: Perhaps this has a bit more to do with the evaluation in the signature than it does with Eddie Lacy's durability/conditioning.
Quick! Back track!
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This explanation from Lacy's camp makes perfect sense, but what bothers me is why that wasn't his answer when Bucky Brooks asked him about it immediately following his pro day workout. Instead, Lacy's response of "ehhh, I feel like, I mean, if I would've ate a little more, since it was an early morning workout, I would've been able to finish a little better, but it is what it is" was ridiculous.
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-player-interviews/0ap2000000159061/Eddie-Lacy-1-on-1
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-player-interviews/0ap2000000159061/Eddie-Lacy-1-on-1
werdnoynek
Footballguy
If the reason you're out of shape to the point where you can't finish your pro day workout is that you've only been able to train for two weeks, you're sure as hell right the first thing out of my mouth is that explanation. Not, "doh, i didn't eat a big enough breakfast." Lacy's either a moron, or the only-two-weeks-to-train-prior-to-my-pro-day excuse that just came out 10 days after his pro day is exactly that, an excuse. You don't need to be a public speaker to tell the truth as to why you were gassed if it truly was because of his limited training time since his hamstring recovery.the kid was put on the spot. he's not taking a job as a public speaker.
werdnoynek
Footballguy
Following him on twitter, I think this is an accurate assessment.If the reason you're out of shape to the point where you can't finish your pro day workout is that you've only been able to train for two weeks, you're sure as hell right the first thing out of my mouth is that explanation. Not, "doh, i didn't eat a big enough breakfast." Lacy's either a moron, or the only-two-weeks-to-train-prior-to-my-pro-day excuse that just came out 10 days after his pro day is exactly that, an excuse. You don't need to be a public speaker to tell the truth as to why you were gassed if it truly was because of his limited training time since his hamstring recovery.the kid was put on the spot. he's not taking a job as a public speaker.
werdnoynek
Footballguy
You can't do cardio with a bum hamstring. To completely stop running and then only have a couple of weeks to get into shape, it's understandable that he'd be dragging ### during a workout like that imo.
Donnybrook
Footballguy
IIRC, didn't the same thing happen to Dez Bryant a couple of years ago? People made a big deal out of it but it didn't effect his draft status very much.
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Concept Coop
Footballguy
Kiper, Pollian, McShay, Mayock - all projecting Lacy in the first, and calling him a 1st round talent. I don't think this is as big a deal as many are making it out to be. I think he's a fringe 1st round pick, just like he was 10 days ago.
cstu
Footballguy
I agree, but it's also disconcerting that it took him 2 months to recover from a torn hamstring. Not the sign of a fast healer.
werdnoynek
Footballguy
Hamstring injury prognosis varies depending on severity and the person. We don't know how severe it was, I don't think we should pass judgement on recovery time without fully grasping the situation.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
People really need to stop saying "it took him so and so long to recover from a torn hamstring".
For one, hamstring tears have many levels of severity.
Also, and the MOST important issue. If a torn hamstring is not rehabbed properly it can become a CHRONIC problem. Do you really think it would be wise for a player to tear his hammy and then try to push it so that he can perform well at the ####### combine or proday???? That would only make sense for someone tha is basically a no-name that wouldnt be drafted or signed as an UDFA without those workouts.
If I am Lacy, knowing I will be a probable late 1st with a halfway decent workout, or maybe a mid 2nd with NO workout, I am gonna rest my hammy until it feels perfect................and then rest/rehab another month before pushing it at all.
For one, hamstring tears have many levels of severity.
Also, and the MOST important issue. If a torn hamstring is not rehabbed properly it can become a CHRONIC problem. Do you really think it would be wise for a player to tear his hammy and then try to push it so that he can perform well at the ####### combine or proday???? That would only make sense for someone tha is basically a no-name that wouldnt be drafted or signed as an UDFA without those workouts.
If I am Lacy, knowing I will be a probable late 1st with a halfway decent workout, or maybe a mid 2nd with NO workout, I am gonna rest my hammy until it feels perfect................and then rest/rehab another month before pushing it at all.
cstu
Footballguy
Lacy supposedly tore his hamstring after the season working out for the draft and claimed it was only a small tear. Then it takes him 7 weeks to workout but is already out of shape. The red flags are huge with this guy. In a normal year where he's a mid round pick it would be worth taking the chance but with the 1.01 he's simply not worth it. Unfortunately I don't see many other better options.
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ghostguy123
Footballguy
Mid round pick?? What year would Lacy not be a 1st round pick in rookie drafts?? Mid round?
cstu
Footballguy
ghostguy123
Footballguy
werdnoynek
Footballguy
mlball77
Footballguy
This has probably already been talked about, but for those thinking Lacy is still likely a 1st rd pick, where are the realistic destinations? Rams at 22, Colts at 24, Packers at 26 and Broncos at 28?
For those thinking 2nd rd is more likely, same question. Bengals at 37, Jets at 39, Dolphins at 42, Rams at 46 or Steelers at 48?
For those thinking 2nd rd is more likely, same question. Bengals at 37, Jets at 39, Dolphins at 42, Rams at 46 or Steelers at 48?
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
These picks are plausible.
17. Pittsburgh
21. Cincinnati
22. St. Louis
26. Green Bay
28. Denver
31. San Francisco
37. Cincinnati
38. Arizona
39. NY Jets
17. Pittsburgh
21. Cincinnati
22. St. Louis
26. Green Bay
28. Denver
31. San Francisco
37. Cincinnati
38. Arizona
39. NY Jets
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
Donnybrook
Footballguy
Why cross off SF? SF drafts haven't been exactly predictable lately ie AJ Jenkins. Gore is getting up there, Hunter is injured and James is not a workhorse IMO.
mlball77
Footballguy
Yeah, I thought SF seemed unlikey initially, but based on their recent history + RB situation + high number of picks in the draft, Lacy could get a real look from them. Seems plausible enough, I guess.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
Donnybrook
Footballguy
They added Brandon Jacobs last year with the same depth chart. Hunter, of course, was uninjured.
