ESPN Article on Brady & Kraft Sabotaging the Future for Brady's Ego (1 Viewer)

[Thunderlips]

Only way one can fault Brady in this is if he retires after this year.  

If I'm BB....and I want to keep going for 10 more years.....I'm kicking the tires on Brady behind the scenes.

Kraft isn't going to give up a GOAT who insists (and has proven this year) that he still has it in the tank.

 

[rockaction]

Vinnie Paz was just on the local news here in RI this week. He was arrested because he showed up at an apartment in Providence at 1am and got into a fight with a guy over money. They showed him on the news with two black eyes, he looked rough.

Oh, these straight edge guys all started dealing and using, inevitably. It wasn't a pretty scene. 

That's an awesome tidbit, by the way. Gonna have to look that up.

And I messed up. It's Vic DeCarla of Inside Out. At least you know I just type this out off the cuff.   

 

[JuniorNB]

hmmmmm..so we get banned for speaking the truth? He is upset because I correctly stated: 

A. The browns are a poorly run organization (True)

B. They have only been in the playoffs one time this century (True)

C. They passed on Wentz and Watson (Both true)

I'm sorry the truth hurts feelings. Maybe we should bring this up to the NFL competition committee. They can address this and make sure everyone feels SPECIAL. 

You will be banned for all the namecalling and the general juvenile cockiness of your posts. I've been around. So have you. Which is why you're on your fourth username. People aren't reporting you, they're trying to help. Do with it what you want.

 

[baymen]

acceptance is the first step. Don't worry then the Pat's are gutted you, the bills and the fins can maybe try to be competitive. Hell the league tried to cheat for you guys and they still won. 

 

 

[hoffman0001]

I wouldn't bet on that as long as Woody owns the Jets. Ooof.  

There is a solution...find a better team to root for. At some point the fans need to show they are unhappy buy not giving $ to the owners for poor product. 

 

[Anarchy99]

Good point.  Jax D scares me but then you step back and think "it's still Blake Bortles!"  Pitts O scares me, but NE seems to be in their head and they manage to blow games they should win somehow.  Should be a couple good games though, and I really hope Hogan and Rex are near full health then that opens everything up for the Pats.  

IF the Pats don't make it, for the sake of the NFL I actually hope it's the Jags or KC - it's gotta be tiring seeing the same 2 AFC teams there every year.  

Before I get bashed for hating on PIT, let me say I think they have a good team and a lot of top level talent. I think their coaching sometimes leaves a lot to be desired, but the team itself is most likely more talented than NE's.

But as the Steelers offense and defense goes, comparing the Pats actual results over the season, NE's offense still scores more than PIT's does and their defense allows fewer points than the Steelers does. Based on points scored or points allowed, NE has ranked higher than PIT in both categories for 5 straight years. That doesn't even take into account that NE has had their way with NE over that time. With all the talk of the Killer B's and how unstoppable they have been, the Pats have been able to score more (even with Gronk and Edelman out a ton).

If these two meet again, I think things will be much tougher for PIT playing in NE than in PIT. Not that prior results impact future games, but the average game score between these two in the BB/TB era when playing in PIT has been 27-24 in favor of New England. The average game score playing in NE has been 37-19 in favor of the Patriots. That's more than a two TD difference.

To be clear, PIT certainly could win if they play well, the ball bounces their way, and they don't make dumb mistakes. All I am saying is that historically the Steelers have had trouble playing in NE.

 

[hoffman0001]

You will be banned for all the namecalling and the general juvenile cockiness of your posts. I've been around. So have you. Which is why you're on your fourth username. People aren't reporting you, they're trying to help. Do with it what you want.

This is my ONLY USERNAME, period. I think footballguys would know if it was not. Name calling? Not sure what you mean. People are so SENSITIVE (oh wait is that name calling). Cockiness (is that when you tell the truth about a badly run team?) oh brother. 

 

[JuniorNB]

This is my ONLY USERNAME, period. I think footballguys would know if it was not. Name calling? Not sure what you mean. People are so SENSITIVE (oh wait is that name calling). Cockiness (is that when you tell the truth about a badly run team?) oh brother. 

SNOWFLAKE?  We should all sing Kumbuya?   You don't think that sounds like something a cocky 14 year-old would post?

Like I said, my friend. It's no sweat off my back if you get banned.  Keep doing what you're doing.  

 

[Snickers]

Oh, these straight edge guys all started dealing and using, inevitably. It wasn't a pretty scene. 

That's an awesome tidbit, by the way. Gonna have to look that up.

And I messed up. It's Vic DeCarla of Inside Out. At least you know I just type this out off the cuff.   

https://www.google.com/amp/wpri.com/2018/01/03/wanted-for-assault-vinny-paz-turns-himself-in/amp/

 

[rockaction]

This is my ONLY USERNAME, period. I think footballguys would know if it was not. Name calling? Not sure what you mean. People are so SENSITIVE (oh wait is that name calling). Cockiness (is that when you tell the truth about a badly run team?) oh brother. 

Don't turn this into a thread about you. Have fun with it and be cool. This is a cool thread, mang. 

Talk some football. Hang out. That's my advice. I'm also willing to get way divergent in stuff, so I understand when things go off-the-cuff. 

Anyway, back to football. 

The Chiefs win this weekend, in my opinion, no doubt. How do they cover Gronk without Berry? 

 

[hoffman0001]

SNOWFLAKE?  We should all sing Kumbuya?   You don't think that sounds like something a cocky 14 year-old would post?

Like I said, my friend. It's no sweat off my back if you get banned.  Keep doing what you're doing.  

He was the one attacking me for being honest about his poorly run team. He was acting like a a snowflake, so I called him on it. I'm sorry if his feelings were hurt. Dude, I take it back the BROWNS are equally as good as the teams that actually find ways to win A GAME. I hope that makes you feel good inside, let me know if you need a hug as well. 

 

[rockaction]

https://www.google.com/amp/wpri.com/2018/01/03/wanted-for-assault-vinny-paz-turns-himself-in/amp/

Wow. The back of that building in the picture looks like...well, you know. A house. I like the back step exit Paz is making. Perp walk.  

 

[hoffman0001]

Don't turn this into a thread about you.

Never did..others are making it about me. I would much rather talk about the issues...if that is ok and does not upset anyone. Please, is it ok to have an opinion? 

 

[fred_1_15301]

 

 

[JuniorNB]

He was the one attacking me for being honest about his poorly run team. He was acting like a a snowflake, so I called him on it. I'm sorry if his feelings were hurt. Dude, I take it back the BROWNS are equally as good as the teams that actually find ways to win A GAME. I hope that makes you feel good inside, let me know if you need a hug as well. 

I take it all back. You actually are 14. Enjoy your day buddy. 

 

[FreeBaGeL]

:This idiotic move to trade Garropolo makes a lot more sense now.  It seemed like Belichick was way too smart for that.

 

[hoffman0001]

I take it all back. You actually are 14. Enjoy your day buddy. 

I will. Can't wait till the NFL stops that painful practice of keeping score, giving trophies, and keeping win-loss records. In fact it would be better if we just shut down the NFL so no one ever felt sad....

 

[Anarchy99]

:This idiotic move to trade Garropolo makes a lot more sense now.  It seemed like Belichick was way too smart for that.

So what was their alternative?

 

[fred_1_15301]

Before I get bashed for hating on PIT, let me say I think they have a good team and a lot of top level talent. I think their coaching sometimes leaves a lot to be desired, but the team itself is most likely more talented than NE's.

But as the Steelers offense and defense goes, comparing the Pats actual results over the season, NE's offense still scores more than PIT's does and their defense allows fewer points than the Steelers does. Based on points scored or points allowed, NE has ranked higher than PIT in both categories for 5 straight years. That doesn't even take into account that NE has had their way with NE over that time. With all the talk of the Killer B's and how unstoppable they have been, the Pats have been able to score more (even with Gronk and Edelman out a ton).

If these two meet again, I think things will be much tougher for PIT playing in NE than in PIT. Not that prior results impact future games, but the average game score between these two in the BB/TB era when playing in PIT has been 27-24 in favor of New England. The average game score playing in NE has been 37-19 in favor of the Patriots. That's more than a two TD difference.

To be clear, PIT certainly could win if they play well, the ball bounces their way, and they don't make dumb mistakes. All I am saying is that historically the Steelers have had trouble playing in NE.

I agree that things will likely be much tougher for Pittsburgh if the 2 teams meet in the playoffs.  The encouraging part for me is that the Steelers coaching staff DID make adjustments when they met a few weeks ago.  Quite honestly, that's the first I've seen of it from that staff against the Patriots.  Not sure if that will be enough to knock off the Pats in foxboro. 

By your own admission, the Steelers are more talented than NE (I don't necessarily agree) so that to me would be the biggest difference from previous years.  To me, a lot of it will depend on whether or not AB can come back relatively healthy and who the Patriots will have returning. If both teams are at full strength (or close to it), I think the Patriots win.  However, I don't see it being a laugher like last year's AFC championship game.  

 

[KarmaPolice]

Don't turn this into a thread about you. Have fun with it and be cool. This is a cool thread, mang. 

Talk some football. Hang out. That's my advice. I'm also willing to get way divergent in stuff, so I understand when things go off-the-cuff. 

Anyway, back to football. 

The Chiefs win this weekend, in my opinion, no doubt. How do they cover Gronk without Berry? 

Spoiler

They don't.

 

[JuniorNB]

So what was their alternative?

I covered that

 

[KarmaPolice]

I agree that things will likely be much tougher for Pittsburgh if the 2 teams meet in the playoffs.  The encouraging part for me is that the Steelers coaching staff DID make adjustments when they met a few weeks ago.  Quite honestly, that's the first I've seen of it from that staff against the Patriots.  Not sure if that will be enough to knock off the Pats in foxboro. 

By your own admission, the Steelers are more talented than NE (I don't necessarily agree) so that to me would be the biggest difference from previous years.  To me, a lot of it will depend on whether or not AB can come back relatively healthy and who the Patriots will have returning. If both teams are at full strength (or close to it), I think the Patriots win.  However, I don't see it being a laugher like last year's AFC championship game.  

I think JuJu coming on is a big deal.  Pitt definitely has more top end talent with Bell and Brown (the best 2 players at their position in the league), but the Pats have the ability to do many more different things so they have the harder O to plan for if that makes any sense.  JuJu helps a lot by adding another player to plan for besides the usual 2.  

Pitts coaching staff just needs to stick to their guns and stop trying to out-Belichick Belichick. 

 

[Anarchy99]

I covered that

Right. The make TB12 play for pennies on the dollar so JG could make $25 million not to play plan. Sorry, I forgot about that.

 

[Steeler]

The good news for NE is they can only play JAX or PIT, they can't face both.

This is the biggest impact of the Pats beating the Steelers earlier this year.  I so wanted the Steelers to get the #1 seed so they would only have to face one of NE/JAX.  Plus, I would have liked to see the JAX defense against NE because they seem like the type of defense that has given Brady trouble in the past - they have great corners and can get a pass rush with the Dline.  

 

[ShamrockPride]

Right. The make TB12 play for pennies on the dollar so JG could make $25 million not to play plan. Sorry, I forgot about that.

Sacrificing 15 more great years for 2 or 3 more great years seems equally illogical.

 

[fred_1_15301]

I think JuJu coming on is a big deal.  Pitt definitely has more top end talent with Bell and Brown (the best 2 players at their position in the league), but the Pats have the ability to do many more different things so they have the harder O to plan for if that makes any sense.  JuJu helps a lot by adding another player to plan for besides the usual 2.  

Pitts coaching staff just needs to stick to their guns and stop trying to out-Belichick Belichick. 

Yeah they have Bell and Brown but they don't have Brady and they don't have an absolute uncoverable tight end.  Brandin Cooks and Dion Lewis also present big matchup problems for most teams (albeit they aren't Bell or Brown).  I think the top end talent is actually similar.  My concern is that the current state of the Steelers defense is not very good (to put it lightly).  

 

[KarmaPolice]

Sacrificing 15 more great years for 2 or 3 more great years seems equally illogical.

 

[ShamrockPride]

You don't think Pats with Jimmy at the helm would result in another decade of deep playoff runs?

 

[rockaction]

Spoiler

They don't.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

So what was their alternative?

I've spoken at length about that starting on page 43 of this thread. 

The obvious solution is you move on from a 41 year old Brady at the end of this year and turn the reigns over to Garoppolo, the same way the Colts moved on from Peyton for Luck, the 9ers moved on from Montana for Young, and the Packers moved on from Favre for Rodgers.

And I know the obvious reaction to that is "none of those guys were playing as well as Brady is when they left", but the thing about them is that all of them went on to have at least 1 elite season for their new teams and yet none of those teams regretted moving on from them even with that hindsight. 

Even with the knowledge that Favre would 100% have another very elite season after they let him go, no one is saying "man I wish we had kept Favre".  Even with the knowledge that Montana would 100% have another elite season after they let him go, no one is saying "man I wish we had kept Montana".  Even with the knowledge that Manning would have THREE very elite seasons left, including one where he set the NFL record for TD passes, no one is saying "man I wish we would have kept Peyton" (assuming Luck's injury isn't career ending of course, which is obviously not a normal case).  Yet people think that if Brady has one or two elite seasons left (far from a guarantee), people are going to be saying "man I'm really glad we kept Brady!".

So what does Brady have left in the tank?  Maybe 1 great elite season?  Maybe 2?  No way he has what Peyton still had left.  Yet in all of those scenarios, it was still the right move to let those guys walk.  We already know the answer even if we can say with 100% certaintly that Brady won't decline next year, and really we can't even say that.

 

[JuniorNB]

Right. The make TB12 play for pennies on the dollar so JG could make $25 million not to play plan. Sorry, I forgot about that.

That's not what I said. You sit Brady down and explain the situation. Maybe he plays for 15 million.  Maybe Jimmy G agrees to take a little less than market value to be ensured the starting position and big bucks in a year or two?  I think they got rid of the wrong guy if they couldn't get them both to work together. 

 

[Workhorse]

You don't think Pats with Jimmy at the helm would result in another decade of deep playoff runs?

That's just it: We have no idea. But I wouldn't be willing to sacrifice the next year or two with Brady playing at a high level and the Pats having a team with the flexibility to be a legit Super Bowl contender for another QB who COULD be great, but we don't have enough info yet to know for sure.  A bird in the hand, etc...

 

[KarmaPolice]

You don't think Pats with Jimmy at the helm would result in another decade of deep playoff runs?

No, I am not going to go that far after 7 starts from Jimmy G.   I think saying 15 years of greatness is a bit far fetched, because that happens so rarely.  

Also, I think until the rest of the AFC East does something to try to be competitive, they probably would have chance at a deep playoff run for the next decade with Hoyer behind Center.  I also think all of that is moot if BB hangs them up earlier than that - way too hard to replace a HOF Qb AND a HOF coach and expect that high of a level of success.  

 

[Workhorse]

That's not what I said. You sit Brady down and explain the situation. Maybe he plays for 15 million.  Maybe Jimmy G agrees to take a little less than market value to be ensured the starting position and big bucks in a year or two?  I think they got rid of the wrong guy if they couldn't get them both to work together. 

Yeah, that doesn't work. He can't just cut salary. You'd have to extend his contract out beyond 43 years old to lower the cap hit next year. So that way, you are now paying two QBs starter money for three more years?  That's not very smart.

 

[KarmaPolice]

That's not what I said. You sit Brady down and explain the situation. Maybe he plays for 15 million.  Maybe Jimmy G agrees to take a little less than market value to be ensured the starting position and big bucks in a year or two?  I think they got rid of the wrong guy if they couldn't get them both to work together. 

Like anarchy said, his cap # is in the bottom 1/2 of starters for the NFL.  Do you really think this is realistic solution given the year that Brady was able to put together?

 

[FreeBaGeL]

No, I am not going to go that far after 7 starts from Jimmy G.   I think saying 15 years of greatness is a bit far fetched, because that happens so rarely.  

Also, I think until the rest of the AFC East does something to try to be competitive, they probably would have chance at a deep playoff run for the next decade with Hoyer behind Center.  I also think all of that is moot if BB hangs them up earlier than that - way too hard to replace a HOF Qb AND a HOF coach and expect that high of a level of success.  

If this report is true, wouldn't it make it a lot more likely that BB hangs them up (or goes elsewhere), if ownership forced him to trade away the guy that he believed was going to be the future despite his intense objection to it?

Even with Belichick staying I think this was a terrible move.  If this leads to Belichick moving on as well it could go down as one of the worst decisions in NFL history.  I think there's a pretty decent chance the Pats' dynasty would have just kept on rolling on with Garoppolo/Belichick in there, and that could all be gone because of one day.

 

[Workhorse]

If this report is true, wouldn't it make it a lot more likely that BB hangs them up (or goes elsewhere), if ownership forced him to trade away the guy that he believed was going to be the future despite his intense objection to it?

Even with Belichick staying I think this was a terrible move.  If this leads to Belichick moving on as well it could go down as one of the worst decisions in NFL history.  I think there's a pretty decent chance the Pats' dynasty would have just kept on rolling on with Garoppolo/Belichick in there, and that could all be gone because of one day.

If Belichick walks away, it has nothing to do with trading Jimmy G, IMO.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

YOU ARE the one who held up 2 AFC championships LOSSSES as a badge of honor about how great you team was.

You're not very smart. You said the Jets had no on field success in 10 years so I brought up those two years to show you were clueless (as usual).

I love my team and want them to win. If they win the Super Bowl it won't make me a better person - just happy for a few days. You seem to think rooting for a winning team makes you successful in life. Sad.

 

[jabarony]

I will. Can't wait till the NFL stops that painful practice of keeping score, giving trophies, and keeping win-loss records. In fact it would be better if we just shut down the NFL so no one ever felt sad....

You Pats fans are something else. 

 

[hoffman0001]

You Pats fans are something else. 

Not a Pats fan, but I do respect what they have done. You know what happens when you ASSume right?

 

[JuniorNB]

Like anarchy said, his cap # is in the bottom 1/2 of starters for the NFL.  Do you really think this is realistic solution given the year that Brady was able to put together?

My point is, I'd rather lost Brady and his one or two more years than Garappalo and his 10-12.  The man has probably made 200 million dollars. His wife has even more money.  Asking him to play for 'only' 15 million is not exactly a slap in the face at the age of 41 next year.  If he bulked at the idea, then he asks to be traded or retires and he makes the decision for you. And he looks like the selfish one and the franchise comes out smelling like a rose.  Jimmy G looks as good as Brady right now. And they could have had him till 2030.  

 

[hoffman0001]

You're not very smart. You said the Jets had no on field success in 10 years so I brought up those two years to show you were clueless (as usual).

so losing in 2 AFC Championship games=Success? I guess some fans have low standards. Whatever makes you happy bro! Maybe you enjoy watching BUTT FUMBLE footage in the off-season?

 

[JuniorNB]

Not sure the teen last out the day. He only knows how to post one way.  

 

[hoffman0001]

Not sure the teen last out the day. He only knows how to post one way.  

yep your right, I post the TRUTH. shame on me. 

 

[zoonation]

As discussed in the many Jimmy G threads, what else were the Pats going to do? Brady won the SB last year and is going to be MVP this year. They realistically could not have afforded to pay both guys and would have had to franchise Garoppolo. No way were they shelling out $45 million on two players at the same spot. All they could do was trade JG.

No.  they could have traded Brady or let him walk, which was the prudent business move.   Brady will win (and deserves) MVP, but he is clearly in decline.  He ain't playing at a high level until 45, and Bill knows it.   The Pats always make the prudent business play.  Instead, in very un-Patriot like fashion, they sold out their future to reward the past.  I will be shocked if Bill is there next year.  He lost the war.  

 

[Dr. Octopus]

That surely doesn't prove him wrong. I give you about another hour or two as a member. Enjoy your stay.  

He'll just come back this is about his 5th alias.

 

[zoonation]

My point is, I'd rather lost Brady and his one or two more years than Garappalo and his 10-12.  The man has probably made 200 million dollars. His wife has even more money.  Asking him to play for 'only' 15 million is not exactly a slap in the face at the age of 41 next year.  If he bulked at the idea, then he asks to be traded or retires and he makes the decision for you. And he looks like the selfish one and the franchise comes out smelling like a rose.  Jimmy G looks as good as Brady right now. And they could have had him till 2030.  

agree with all of this except that Jimmy looks better than Brady right now.  Tom Brady doesn't QB the niners to a 5-0 record to end the season.

 

[zoonation]

If Belichick walks away, it has nothing to do with trading Jimmy G, IMO.

with all due respect I think this is completely wrong.  if he leaves it will have everything to do with him getting sold out by management and a breach of trust (real or perceived)

 

[Anarchy99]

agree with all of this except that Jimmy looks better than Brady right now.  Tom Brady doesn't QB the niners to a 5-0 record to end the season.

Let's see how Brady does when he isn't banged up and with his weapons back. Way too soon, IMO, to conclude he has dropped off. He does this every December.

 

[hoffman0001]

He'll just come back this is about his 5th alias.

I have one username, now and always. You must spend a lot of your time watching conspiracy theories videos.