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Former acquaintance shot and killed while shackled...apparently. (1 Viewer)

Sabertooth said:
Well, he won't get a trial now will he?  So we don't really know what he did or didn't do.  You seem to have convicted him based off an accusation.  I'm saying what I knew of him, he was a decent guy.  Cutting sense of humor.  Now I haven't spoken with him in a long time.  So who knows, maybe he became a total nut.  But explosives is a vague term.  Family says it was more like fireworks.  

Obviously not too big a blast because somebody hurt a hand when they set off one of these.  
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Hey Sabe, big fan from team MOP here and I always have appreciated you sharing in stories that might never happen to others here. 

When I worked in nightclubs it used to really Eff me up when the ambulances would show up periodically to rush a 19/20 year old who had too much ecstacy in the early mid 90s from our clubs/venues in Orlando. I felt like I was contributing just by being a part of the entertainment side of the venue and housing all these young mostly drug induced folks on the weekends. 

I saw a lot of things that jaded me in ways so that later in life I tend to get involved in situations where others might shy away from. Here you knew the guy so you were comfortable but I imagine to the regular reader that this friend of yours seems a little off. It is disturbing that he would rig fireworks which is a kid magnet and they could get hurt. I'm just saying that while your friendship with him may and is/was very real that it's possible he was a different animal when it came to others or what was ticking in his mind. 

I still think the cops/fireman have some serious explaining to do. This guy should be in jail awaiting a lawyer or hiring a lawyer, that day will never come now. 

I appreciate you putting yourself out there for some ridicule for keeping this guy as a friend. Because MOP likes to toke up in a state where it is still illegal despite 58% of people voting approval last year...so I have to keep a couple "friends" around that I probably would prefer not but as you age you find less and less folks who fess up to enjoying or partaking in it. 

 
Totally agree MOP.

In all honesty, he was much closer to my good friend.  I haven't spoken to him in a long time.  However I would probably stop and talk to him if I saw him out or something.  Not really my loss.  My good friend is pretty shaken up by it.  They were kind of inseparable for a few years.  

I fully acknowledge he might have cracked.  Sounds like he was doing some pretty insane #### (allegedly).  But in light of the Brendan Dassey thing and all that, my trust in small town law enforcement is at an all time low.  And the guy I knew would have been a total ### to them just because they were small town law enforcement.  He wasn't any shrinking violet to be sure.  But he wasn't a fighter either.  More of a sarcastic guy.  Very social.  Banged plenty of chicks.  

And what he was accused of aside, what the #### happened in the woods with the cops?  That's the part that is puzzling.  Hopefully they wore body cams.  If so and they let the footage out to corroborate their narrative and we can see what happened, great.   Then we can just say, yeah he was a nut and went for a gun or whatever.  But if that isn't what happened, or if something sinister happened, well that's a different story.  Then that's an execution.  

 
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Sinn Fein said:
Sorry to hear about this.

Too be fair, he was killed by a Fire Investigator - not a trained cop.

Not sure that the distinction matters, but I am guessing the Fire Investigator has even less training than a typical police officer when it comes to these situations.
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When I lived in PA my good friend was a State Police officer who was also the Fire Investigator for that region. Not sure if it is the same there but we were in a rural area and the State Police are the law enforcement for all the little towns and investigated all fires for the little volunteer fire departments. All that to say, my friend was a trained cop that had been trained to investigate fires also. Maybe same situation in this case?

 
mr roboto said:
Not hurt a hand, lost fingers. I know you were a friend but he was setting out bombs for random people to take home. That's not justifiable even if it was due to people stealing them. 

Take your trail cams out of public woods if you don't want them stolen. Don't turn them into bombs. 
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Imagine a scenario where someone steals the cam, takes it home, and a child puts a battery into it. 

Sorry, about your friend but he was creating bombs to injure people.

 
El Floppo said:
and I get that the OPs friend doesn't exactly come across as... not crazy. 

but IMO, the point here isn't the crazy #### he did- it's that he got shot down... while in custody of the police. even if he was actually trying to escape- is he a danger to society at that point? is he going to be crafting trail cam bombs and throwing them at people as he runs for his life?
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don't rule it out...have you seen how fast some of these guys can solve a Rubik's cube??

 
two different issues at play here, no?

1) turning trail cams into bombs

2) shooting a man to death 

one does not automatically make the other okay. 

that seems to the police/media narrative these days "well, have you seen his record? the guy is a felon.. we pretty much didn't have a choice but to shoot him for stealing that Clark bar."

 
mr. furley said:
two different issues at play here, no?

1) turning trail cams into bombs

2) shooting a man to death 

one does not automatically make the other okay. 

that seems to the police/media narrative these days "well, have you seen his record? the guy is a felon.. we pretty much didn't have a choice but to shoot him for stealing that Clark bar."
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Really like the specific detail with the Clark bar.

 
If I were the friend and had gotten caught, I would try to slip away from the fire inspector too, so I could remove and destroy any other devices that I put out there. I bet they would add a charge for each unit, so no way would I want to just hand over all of the other units to them.

Just my vision of what could have happened.

 
mr. furley said:
two different issues at play here, no?

1) turning trail cams into bombs

2) shooting a man to death 

one does not automatically make the other okay. 

that seems to the police/media narrative these days "well, have you seen his record? the guy is a felon.. we pretty much didn't have a choice but to shoot him for stealing that Clark bar."
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The details are relevant since they affect credibility. What in this story other than the OP saying this nut was mellow and cool could you possibly point to that says the fire marshall bill that shot him is lying or that he wasnt trying to escape? 

Are you honestly saying they should just let this guy escape? 

 
parasaurolophus said:
The details are relevant since they affect credibility. What in this story other than the OP saying this nut was mellow and cool could you possibly point to that says the fire marshall bill that shot him is lying or that he wasnt trying to escape? 

Are you honestly saying they should just let this guy escape? 
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pretty sure there options between "letting him escape" and "kill".

 
parasaurolophus said:
The details are relevant since they affect credibility. What in this story other than the OP saying this nut was mellow and cool could you possibly point to that says the fire marshall bill that shot him is lying or that he wasnt trying to escape? 

Are you honestly saying they should just let this guy escape? 
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We'll probably never know for sure what happened that day in the woods.  No way to know if lethal force was necessary.

ETA:  I read he was handcuffed, and I think there were multiple officers out there.  If that really was the situation, why not just catch him and throw him back in jail?

 
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OK a middle eastern guy is caught putting bombs in the woods in public lands, he disguised them as nature cams and waits for people to steal them then execute them. He has multiple cams planted and we need to find these before other people including kids do.   

 
Trail cams are roughly hand size & most time they are colored camo.  Very very easy to hide & still have them work.   I highly doubt another person could find them in a wooded area, even a sparsely wooded area.  Also most trail cams do not have a flash when they snap a picture so mostly undetectable.

Something is not right in this story. IMO

Sorry he got killed.

 
El Floppo said:
pretty sure there options between "letting him escape" and "kill".
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An article I read that said an altercation occurred when he tried to escape and he was killed during said altercation. 

 
perry147 said:
OK a middle eastern guy is caught putting bombs in the woods in public lands, he disguised them as nature cams and waits for people to steal them then execute them. He has multiple cams planted and we need to find these before other people including kids do.   
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He's not middle eastern.  He was a Yooper, born and raised in Gladstone, Michigan.  

 
VandyMan said:
We'll probably never know for sure what happened that day in the woods.  No way to know if lethal force was necessary.

ETA:  I read he was handcuffed, and I think there were multiple officers out there.  If that really was the situation, why not just catch him and throw him back in jail?
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That's the sticking point for me.  If he was handcuffed, even in front, how the #### is he going to get away?  Now maybe he lunged for a weapon.  Or maybe the cops went MCSD on him.  

 
johnnycakes said:
Yeah, the police would never contrive a cover-up to protect their own.  :rolleyes:  
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You didnt read anything about this story did you? Or click on that link? His dad says he was framed for making the bombs. He says he was in the woods just to help. He happen to find 6 bombs just because he was observant right?

"It can be anybody who tampered with his camera in the woods to put the initials," Ali said. "Someone tampered with the cameras and put powder."

"Also they found the bear pelt," Ali said. "He don't hunt for bear so somebody throw in his yard to incriminate him."
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parasaurolophus said:
You didnt read anything about this story did you? Or click on that link? His dad says he was framed for making the bombs. He says he was in the woods just to help. He happen to find 6 bombs just because he was observant right?
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I read both the article directly linked and the article linked from that one.  My comment was not about the deceased's behavior, but about the police behavior. 

 
johnnycakes said:
I read both the article directly linked and the article linked from that one.  My comment was not about the deceased's behavior, but about the police behavior. 
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Your comment was in response to me pointing out his dad says he was framed. So you were saying that the police made up the whole story about the bombs in the woods to cover up one of their own? The frame job mentioned wasn't regarding the incident where he was shot the frame job was about the making of the bombs. 

 
parasaurolophus said:
Your comment was in response to me pointing out his dad says he was framed. So you were saying that the police made up the whole story about the bombs in the woods to cover up one of their own? The frame job mentioned wasn't regarding the incident where he was shot the frame job was about the making of the bombs. 
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I think the frame job was about his being shot. Sorry for quoting you in my response 

 
"Someone had been stealing these cameras. He was upset, so he actually figured out a way to put a little firework in a camera that was up in a tree, that would go off when that person put a battery in it. This was only supposed to scare them, it was not to really hurt them. It was not a bomb," said Penn.
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It was exactly a bomb.

 
parasaurolophus said:
The details are relevant since they affect credibility. What in this story other than the OP saying this nut was mellow and cool could you possibly point to that says the fire marshall bill that shot him is lying or that he wasnt trying to escape? 

Are you honestly saying they should just let this guy escape? 
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i think they should have let him go on setting bombs all over the world. then play Where in the World is Carmen San Diego to find him.

think of the fun!

 
I don't understand the facts of the case.

Lexington Fire Department investigator Capt. Brad Dobrzynski shot Sawaf during the altercation, which occurred after Sawaf tried to escape, state police said.
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Lexington Fire Department investigator Capt. Brad Dobrzynski shot Sawaf during the altercation, which occurred after Sawaf tried to escape, state police said.
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So. Sawaf and the ATF agents are out in the woods. Looking for the trail cams. Right?

And the fire investigator is in the woods. Looking for the trail cams. Right?

And (supposedly) Sawaf tries to escape?

And the investigator shot him?

And that's all we know?

 
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This sounds like he wasn't interested about stolen trail cams, at all - just maiming/killing people.  If he was just interested in stopping theft,couldn't he have locked and/or hidden the trail cams? Or, you know, use the trail cams to find out who's been stealing them?!

Credit to the Middle Eastern Yoopers for not rioting... All 14 of them.

 
So the guy planted explosive devices and was under investigation for child porn? Sounds like a good dude as the OP pointed out...

 
poopdawg said:
So the guy planted explosive devices and was under investigation for child porn? Sounds like a good dude as the OP pointed out...
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Unfortunately this seems to be the way it works now. It is trendy and hip to hate cops so people latch onto any narrative where the killer was a good kid, loved by so many, etc. 

They get so worked up initially and say some strong things that even when the facts come out they dont want to look foolish so they play the coverup card. 

You know, like planted bear pelts.

 
parasaurolophus said:
Unfortunately this seems to be the way it works now. It is trendy and hip to hate cops so people latch onto any narrative where the killer was a good kid, loved by so many, etc. 

They get so worked up initially and say some strong things that even when the facts come out they dont want to look foolish so they play the coverup card. 

You know, like planted bear pelts.
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:confused:

OP said this guy has been a long-time friend... but the actions of this friend are pretty indefensible (especially if the kid-porn stuff is true). STILL doesn't necessarily warrant justifying shooting him dead, given the limited info at hand. he tried to escape? and... ? Kill him. but because cops are under heat for shootings, and are just doing their jobs, it's ok- questioning them or the strange accounts surround these shootings amounts to hating cops.

 
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