From Fat to Fit 2025 - I Really Mean It This Time! (3 Viewers)

[Terminalxylem]

Better this week.

170.7 lbs at 15.0% bodyfat.

I have crossed over to the obsessive side and I'm tracking my diet with MacroFactor, and the plan is to adhere to its baked-in coached tracking feature. In theory, if I stick to the plan, I should slide into my goal right before the new year. And I have a new goal - 155 pounds. Not sure I want to maintain at that weight, but I'll find out. My overarching goal is to cut down to an ideal fat mass, and then simply spend the rest of my life gradually adding lean mass (until I can't).

Also, trying to apply more rigor in the gym. I've been winging it for 8 months now, and while the improvement has been significant, there's been no real effort to track and progress - adding either reps or weight, weekly. After wasting some time looking at various apps, I realized that this is a tailor-made task for a spreadsheet. So my spreadsheet is built, and I'm beginning with "Find my 12," which is to identify the highest weight (which will be a embarrassingly low weight) I can move for 4 sets of 12 reps. Once I hit that, I'll increase weight and reduce reps - and then progress on new weight until 4 sets of 12 reps is acheived once again. Rinse/repeat.

Sounds good, with some caveats:

1. There may be an age when lifting to failure makes potential for injury exceed strength/muscle benefits. I’ve not seen anything specific on this topic though, so I’m open to someone changing my mind.

2. You’re probably sacrificing some aerobic training by focusing so much on weights. I’ve mentioned this before, but studies show mortality benefit from resistance training plateaus pretty quickly, around 40 minutes per week. Meanwhile, moderate intensity aerobic training continues to show benefit up to 600 minutes weekly, with no harm up to 2000 minutes.

3. There’s a threshold when body fat percentage is too low. For younger people, that’s generally 5-6%, but it seems to be higher with age, such that 8-10% may be the floor. How tall are you?

You brought up a great point I had never thought of:

1. There may be an age when lifting to failure makes potential for injury exceed strength/muscle benefits.

Very interesting. I'm 50 and increase weight, lift failure. I'm trying to get bigger. That's my mindset. I never thought of this point you mentioned. Kinda made me sad. This is inevitabley gonna happen. I guess the solution would simply be less weight longer sets. Maybe.

Yeah, I don’t think we know definitively.

Guys like Attia argue to build as much muscle as possible, to stave off inevitable decline with age. On the surface that makes sense, but in practice, I’m not sure it’s optimal because:

1. Always pushing to get bigger/stronger taxes your joints more than “just enough” to maintain strength. This is a recipe for overuse injury, and degenerative joint disease.
2. For everyday living, optimizing meaningful functionality occurs way before maximizing strength/muscle mass.
3. You only have so much exercise time, and aerobic activity offers far more bang for the longevity buck.
4. Maintaining all that muscle often leads to less healthful dietary choices, or worse, PEDs (including supraphysiologic testosterone).

All the really old, vital folks I’ve encountered are active, for sure, though none of them are ex-body builders. As I mentioned, resistance training plays a role in longevity, but the ceiling benefit is achieved fairly quickly.

 

[Mitchie]

Better this week.

170.7 lbs at 15.0% bodyfat.

I have crossed over to the obsessive side and I'm tracking my diet with MacroFactor, and the plan is to adhere to its baked-in coached tracking feature. In theory, if I stick to the plan, I should slide into my goal right before the new year. And I have a new goal - 155 pounds. Not sure I want to maintain at that weight, but I'll find out. My overarching goal is to cut down to an ideal fat mass, and then simply spend the rest of my life gradually adding lean mass (until I can't).

Also, trying to apply more rigor in the gym. I've been winging it for 8 months now, and while the improvement has been significant, there's been no real effort to track and progress - adding either reps or weight, weekly. After wasting some time looking at various apps, I realized that this is a tailor-made task for a spreadsheet. So my spreadsheet is built, and I'm beginning with "Find my 12," which is to identify the highest weight (which will be a embarrassingly low weight) I can move for 4 sets of 12 reps. Once I hit that, I'll increase weight and reduce reps - and then progress on new weight until 4 sets of 12 reps is acheived once again. Rinse/repeat.

Sounds good, with some caveats:

1. There may be an age when lifting to failure makes potential for injury exceed strength/muscle benefits. I’ve not seen anything specific on this topic though, so I’m open to someone changing my mind.

2. You’re probably sacrificing some aerobic training by focusing so much on weights. I’ve mentioned this before, but studies show mortality benefit from resistance training plateaus pretty quickly, around 40 minutes per week. Meanwhile, moderate intensity aerobic training continues to show benefit up to 600 minutes weekly, with no harm up to 2000 minutes.

3. There’s a threshold when body fat percentage is too low. For younger people, that’s generally 5-6%, but it seems to be higher with age, such that 8-10% may be the floor. How tall are you?

You brought up a great point I had never thought of:

1. There may be an age when lifting to failure makes potential for injury exceed strength/muscle benefits.

Very interesting. I'm 50 and increase weight, lift failure. I'm trying to get bigger. That's my mindset. I never thought of this point you mentioned. Kinda made me sad. This is inevitabley gonna happen. I guess the solution would simply be less weight longer sets. Maybe.

Yeah, I don’t think we know definitively.

Guys like Attia argue to build as much muscle as possible, to stave off inevitable decline with age. On the surface that makes sense, but in practice, I’m not sure it’s optimal because:

1. Always pushing to get bigger/stronger taxes your joints more than “just enough” to maintain strength. This is a recipe for overuse injury, and degenerative joint disease.
2. For everyday living, optimizing meaningful functionality occurs way before maximizing strength/muscle mass.
3. You only have so much exercise time, and aerobic activity offers far more bang for the longevity buck.
4. Maintaining all that muscle often leads to less healthful dietary choices, or worse, PEDs (including supraphysiologic testosterone).

All the really old, vital folks I’ve encountered are active, for sure, though none of them are ex-body builders. As I mentioned, resistance training plays a role in longevity, but the ceiling benefit is achieved fairly quickly.

Maybe i'm missing the point here but this seems like a gross mischaracterization, you can lift to failure and not be a body builder or take PEDs, if you've been lifting this way all your life there is no reason to change, until maybe when you're like 75 or 80.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

It's nice to know I'm not the only one feeling like a fat ***
It's actually not the weight as much as I'm simply not eating healthy
It's beer, burgers, beer, pizza, beer, hot dogs, beer, chips, beer...

I use to do a daily walk and then if not that I would say 3-4x a week, I haven't been on a walk in quite a while
Still play tennis but I've cut that down over the summer to about once a week, i get invites and i just pass
Motivation to be outside lately just isn't there, we redid the home and I've been enjoying leisure time with Mrs
Also bought a ridiculous leather sectional from Stressless, all the seats recline back, too easy to be lazy

I would be wise to just go for a short walk in the morning and evening, doesn't have to be an hour.
If I don't buy the snacks and sweets at the store then there can't be anything in the cupboards to tempt meat night

Nice to read what others are doing, inspires me to get back on that horse

 

[Terminalxylem]

Better this week.

170.7 lbs at 15.0% bodyfat.

I have crossed over to the obsessive side and I'm tracking my diet with MacroFactor, and the plan is to adhere to its baked-in coached tracking feature. In theory, if I stick to the plan, I should slide into my goal right before the new year. And I have a new goal - 155 pounds. Not sure I want to maintain at that weight, but I'll find out. My overarching goal is to cut down to an ideal fat mass, and then simply spend the rest of my life gradually adding lean mass (until I can't).

Also, trying to apply more rigor in the gym. I've been winging it for 8 months now, and while the improvement has been significant, there's been no real effort to track and progress - adding either reps or weight, weekly. After wasting some time looking at various apps, I realized that this is a tailor-made task for a spreadsheet. So my spreadsheet is built, and I'm beginning with "Find my 12," which is to identify the highest weight (which will be a embarrassingly low weight) I can move for 4 sets of 12 reps. Once I hit that, I'll increase weight and reduce reps - and then progress on new weight until 4 sets of 12 reps is acheived once again. Rinse/repeat.

Sounds good, with some caveats:

1. There may be an age when lifting to failure makes potential for injury exceed strength/muscle benefits. I’ve not seen anything specific on this topic though, so I’m open to someone changing my mind.

2. You’re probably sacrificing some aerobic training by focusing so much on weights. I’ve mentioned this before, but studies show mortality benefit from resistance training plateaus pretty quickly, around 40 minutes per week. Meanwhile, moderate intensity aerobic training continues to show benefit up to 600 minutes weekly, with no harm up to 2000 minutes.

3. There’s a threshold when body fat percentage is too low. For younger people, that’s generally 5-6%, but it seems to be higher with age, such that 8-10% may be the floor. How tall are you?

You brought up a great point I had never thought of:

1. There may be an age when lifting to failure makes potential for injury exceed strength/muscle benefits.

Very interesting. I'm 50 and increase weight, lift failure. I'm trying to get bigger. That's my mindset. I never thought of this point you mentioned. Kinda made me sad. This is inevitabley gonna happen. I guess the solution would simply be less weight longer sets. Maybe.

Yeah, I don’t think we know definitively.

Guys like Attia argue to build as much muscle as possible, to stave off inevitable decline with age. On the surface that makes sense, but in practice, I’m not sure it’s optimal because:

1. Always pushing to get bigger/stronger taxes your joints more than “just enough” to maintain strength. This is a recipe for overuse injury, and degenerative joint disease.
2. For everyday living, optimizing meaningful functionality occurs way before maximizing strength/muscle mass.
3. You only have so much exercise time, and aerobic activity offers far more bang for the longevity buck.
4. Maintaining all that muscle often leads to less healthful dietary choices, or worse, PEDs (including supraphysiologic testosterone).

All the really old, vital folks I’ve encountered are active, for sure, though none of them are ex-body builders. As I mentioned, resistance training plays a role in longevity, but the ceiling benefit is achieved fairly quickly.

Maybe i'm missing the point here but this seems like a gross mischaracterization, you can lift to failure and not be a body builder or take PEDs, if you've been lifting this way all your life there is no reason to change, until maybe when you're like 75 or 80.

You think injury threshold isn’t an issue until age 75/80?

Everyone is different, but for active climbers I know, seems like the deadline for max effort without consequence is somewhere in the 50s. And that’s just body weight exercise.

I wish it weren’t the case, believe me. I’ve been active my entire life, especially as an adult. I’ve avoided most aches and pains, but injuries are starting to creep in.

In the last couple years I’ve experienced my first serious ankle sprain trail running, and now a torn hamstring tendon, at 53. I have no doubt both could have been avoided, by easing off the gas.

Of course muscle gets stronger as you stress and repair it, as do joints and tendons, to a lesser extent. But all those processes become less efficient with age, so I don’t think it’s a stretch to believe at some point your muscular strength and mental effort will exceed that of the connective tissue/joints.

Out of curiosity, how old are you? How many 60/70/80 year olds have you seen lifting to failure?

 

[Mitchie]

Better this week.

170.7 lbs at 15.0% bodyfat.

I have crossed over to the obsessive side and I'm tracking my diet with MacroFactor, and the plan is to adhere to its baked-in coached tracking feature. In theory, if I stick to the plan, I should slide into my goal right before the new year. And I have a new goal - 155 pounds. Not sure I want to maintain at that weight, but I'll find out. My overarching goal is to cut down to an ideal fat mass, and then simply spend the rest of my life gradually adding lean mass (until I can't).

Also, trying to apply more rigor in the gym. I've been winging it for 8 months now, and while the improvement has been significant, there's been no real effort to track and progress - adding either reps or weight, weekly. After wasting some time looking at various apps, I realized that this is a tailor-made task for a spreadsheet. So my spreadsheet is built, and I'm beginning with "Find my 12," which is to identify the highest weight (which will be a embarrassingly low weight) I can move for 4 sets of 12 reps. Once I hit that, I'll increase weight and reduce reps - and then progress on new weight until 4 sets of 12 reps is acheived once again. Rinse/repeat.

Sounds good, with some caveats:

1. There may be an age when lifting to failure makes potential for injury exceed strength/muscle benefits. I’ve not seen anything specific on this topic though, so I’m open to someone changing my mind.

2. You’re probably sacrificing some aerobic training by focusing so much on weights. I’ve mentioned this before, but studies show mortality benefit from resistance training plateaus pretty quickly, around 40 minutes per week. Meanwhile, moderate intensity aerobic training continues to show benefit up to 600 minutes weekly, with no harm up to 2000 minutes.

3. There’s a threshold when body fat percentage is too low. For younger people, that’s generally 5-6%, but it seems to be higher with age, such that 8-10% may be the floor. How tall are you?

You brought up a great point I had never thought of:

1. There may be an age when lifting to failure makes potential for injury exceed strength/muscle benefits.

Very interesting. I'm 50 and increase weight, lift failure. I'm trying to get bigger. That's my mindset. I never thought of this point you mentioned. Kinda made me sad. This is inevitabley gonna happen. I guess the solution would simply be less weight longer sets. Maybe.

Yeah, I don’t think we know definitively.

Guys like Attia argue to build as much muscle as possible, to stave off inevitable decline with age. On the surface that makes sense, but in practice, I’m not sure it’s optimal because:

1. Always pushing to get bigger/stronger taxes your joints more than “just enough” to maintain strength. This is a recipe for overuse injury, and degenerative joint disease.
2. For everyday living, optimizing meaningful functionality occurs way before maximizing strength/muscle mass.
3. You only have so much exercise time, and aerobic activity offers far more bang for the longevity buck.
4. Maintaining all that muscle often leads to less healthful dietary choices, or worse, PEDs (including supraphysiologic testosterone).

All the really old, vital folks I’ve encountered are active, for sure, though none of them are ex-body builders. As I mentioned, resistance training plays a role in longevity, but the ceiling benefit is achieved fairly quickly.

Maybe i'm missing the point here but this seems like a gross mischaracterization, you can lift to failure and not be a body builder or take PEDs, if you've been lifting this way all your life there is no reason to change, until maybe when you're like 75 or 80.

You think injury threshold isn’t an issue until age 75/80?

Everyone is different, but for active climbers I know, seems like the deadline for max effort without consequence is somewhere in the 50s. And that’s just body weight exercise.

I wish it weren’t the case, believe me. I’ve been active my entire life, especially as an adult. I’ve avoided most aches and pains, but injuries are starting to creep in.

In the last couple years I’ve experienced my first serious ankle sprain trail running, and now a torn hamstring tendon, at 53. I have no doubt both could have been avoided, by easing off the gas.

Of course muscle gets stronger as you stress and repair it, as do joints and tendons, to a lesser extent. But all those processes become less efficient with age, so I don’t think it’s a stretch to believe at some point your muscular strength and mental effort will exceed that of the connective tissue/joints.

Out of curiosity, how old are you? How many 60/70/80 year olds have you seen lifting to failure?

I think people who workout regularly can continue to workout until failure until they're pretty old barring injury, I'm in my early 50s and do this without any difficulty.

 

[Terminalxylem]

Better this week.

170.7 lbs at 15.0% bodyfat.

I have crossed over to the obsessive side and I'm tracking my diet with MacroFactor, and the plan is to adhere to its baked-in coached tracking feature. In theory, if I stick to the plan, I should slide into my goal right before the new year. And I have a new goal - 155 pounds. Not sure I want to maintain at that weight, but I'll find out. My overarching goal is to cut down to an ideal fat mass, and then simply spend the rest of my life gradually adding lean mass (until I can't).

Also, trying to apply more rigor in the gym. I've been winging it for 8 months now, and while the improvement has been significant, there's been no real effort to track and progress - adding either reps or weight, weekly. After wasting some time looking at various apps, I realized that this is a tailor-made task for a spreadsheet. So my spreadsheet is built, and I'm beginning with "Find my 12," which is to identify the highest weight (which will be a embarrassingly low weight) I can move for 4 sets of 12 reps. Once I hit that, I'll increase weight and reduce reps - and then progress on new weight until 4 sets of 12 reps is acheived once again. Rinse/repeat.

Sounds good, with some caveats:

1. There may be an age when lifting to failure makes potential for injury exceed strength/muscle benefits. I’ve not seen anything specific on this topic though, so I’m open to someone changing my mind.

2. You’re probably sacrificing some aerobic training by focusing so much on weights. I’ve mentioned this before, but studies show mortality benefit from resistance training plateaus pretty quickly, around 40 minutes per week. Meanwhile, moderate intensity aerobic training continues to show benefit up to 600 minutes weekly, with no harm up to 2000 minutes.

3. There’s a threshold when body fat percentage is too low. For younger people, that’s generally 5-6%, but it seems to be higher with age, such that 8-10% may be the floor. How tall are you?

You brought up a great point I had never thought of:

1. There may be an age when lifting to failure makes potential for injury exceed strength/muscle benefits.

Very interesting. I'm 50 and increase weight, lift failure. I'm trying to get bigger. That's my mindset. I never thought of this point you mentioned. Kinda made me sad. This is inevitabley gonna happen. I guess the solution would simply be less weight longer sets. Maybe.

Yeah, I don’t think we know definitively.

Guys like Attia argue to build as much muscle as possible, to stave off inevitable decline with age. On the surface that makes sense, but in practice, I’m not sure it’s optimal because:

1. Always pushing to get bigger/stronger taxes your joints more than “just enough” to maintain strength. This is a recipe for overuse injury, and degenerative joint disease.
2. For everyday living, optimizing meaningful functionality occurs way before maximizing strength/muscle mass.
3. You only have so much exercise time, and aerobic activity offers far more bang for the longevity buck.
4. Maintaining all that muscle often leads to less healthful dietary choices, or worse, PEDs (including supraphysiologic testosterone).

All the really old, vital folks I’ve encountered are active, for sure, though none of them are ex-body builders. As I mentioned, resistance training plays a role in longevity, but the ceiling benefit is achieved fairly quickly.

Maybe i'm missing the point here but this seems like a gross mischaracterization, you can lift to failure and not be a body builder or take PEDs, if you've been lifting this way all your life there is no reason to change, until maybe when you're like 75 or 80.

You think injury threshold isn’t an issue until age 75/80?

Everyone is different, but for active climbers I know, seems like the deadline for max effort without consequence is somewhere in the 50s. And that’s just body weight exercise.

I wish it weren’t the case, believe me. I’ve been active my entire life, especially as an adult. I’ve avoided most aches and pains, but injuries are starting to creep in.

In the last couple years I’ve experienced my first serious ankle sprain trail running, and now a torn hamstring tendon, at 53. I have no doubt both could have been avoided, by easing off the gas.

Of course muscle gets stronger as you stress and repair it, as do joints and tendons, to a lesser extent. But all those processes become less efficient with age, so I don’t think it’s a stretch to believe at some point your muscular strength and mental effort will exceed that of the connective tissue/joints.

Out of curiosity, how old are you? How many 60/70/80 year olds have you seen lifting to failure?

I think people who workout regularly can continue to workout until failure until they're pretty old barring injury, I'm in my early 50s and do this without any difficulty.

Me too, until I got injured…

 

[The Longtime Lurker]

Lifting weights is a pretty important part of my workout routine. I get reasonably heavy, but am by no means a bodybuilder. This is the first I've ever heard it mentioned as more risk than reward. I credit my time in the gym as a major factor as to why I've never suffered a wear and tear injury (I'm very active and have competed athletically all my life and continue doing so). I guess that could change in the coming years, but i suspect it's doing more to protect my joints and preserve functionality than not. There's also benefits that extend beyond strength if I'm not mistaken. Is it lifting to failure that's an issue, or even heavy weights from a progressive overload type program that's risky?

I had a football coach that lifted weights well into his 70s and was the healthiest most functional man I've ever met.

 

[belljr]

I regret it currently but I took this morning off. Needed a break. I'll have to do something this evening.

 

[FarFromHome]

What standard daily vitamins are people taking? I haven't taken a daily vitamin since eating the Flintstone ones with breakfast.

 

[The Longtime Lurker]

What standard daily vitamins are people taking? I haven't taken a daily vitamin since eating the Flintstone ones with breakfast.

For me it's Vit D with K2 (we just don't get enough sun where I live, so to avoid deficiency it's a must) and fish oil. I'm a believer in bioavailability so i try to get everything else through diet. I'll mess around with the more "exotic" supplements from time to time like NAC or ALA, but I'm not sure it's worth it or not.

 

[Major]

Better this week.

170.7 lbs at 15.0% bodyfat.

I have crossed over to the obsessive side and I'm tracking my diet with MacroFactor, and the plan is to adhere to its baked-in coached tracking feature. In theory, if I stick to the plan, I should slide into my goal right before the new year. And I have a new goal - 155 pounds. Not sure I want to maintain at that weight, but I'll find out. My overarching goal is to cut down to an ideal fat mass, and then simply spend the rest of my life gradually adding lean mass (until I can't).

Also, trying to apply more rigor in the gym. I've been winging it for 8 months now, and while the improvement has been significant, there's been no real effort to track and progress - adding either reps or weight, weekly. After wasting some time looking at various apps, I realized that this is a tailor-made task for a spreadsheet. So my spreadsheet is built, and I'm beginning with "Find my 12," which is to identify the highest weight (which will be a embarrassingly low weight) I can move for 4 sets of 12 reps. Once I hit that, I'll increase weight and reduce reps - and then progress on new weight until 4 sets of 12 reps is acheived once again. Rinse/repeat.

Sounds good, with some caveats:

1. There may be an age when lifting to failure makes potential for injury exceed strength/muscle benefits. I’ve not seen anything specific on this topic though, so I’m open to someone changing my mind.

2. You’re probably sacrificing some aerobic training by focusing so much on weights. I’ve mentioned this before, but studies show mortality benefit from resistance training plateaus pretty quickly, around 40 minutes per week. Meanwhile, moderate intensity aerobic training continues to show benefit up to 600 minutes weekly, with no harm up to 2000 minutes.

3. There’s a threshold when body fat percentage is too low. For younger people, that’s generally 5-6%, but it seems to be higher with age, such that 8-10% may be the floor. How tall are you?

You brought up a great point I had never thought of:

1. There may be an age when lifting to failure makes potential for injury exceed strength/muscle benefits.

Very interesting. I'm 50 and increase weight, lift failure. I'm trying to get bigger. That's my mindset. I never thought of this point you mentioned. Kinda made me sad. This is inevitabley gonna happen. I guess the solution would simply be less weight longer sets. Maybe.

Yeah, I don’t think we know definitively.

Guys like Attia argue to build as much muscle as possible, to stave off inevitable decline with age. On the surface that makes sense, but in practice, I’m not sure it’s optimal because:

1. Always pushing to get bigger/stronger taxes your joints more than “just enough” to maintain strength. This is a recipe for overuse injury, and degenerative joint disease.
2. For everyday living, optimizing meaningful functionality occurs way before maximizing strength/muscle mass.
3. You only have so much exercise time, and aerobic activity offers far more bang for the longevity buck.
4. Maintaining all that muscle often leads to less healthful dietary choices, or worse, PEDs (including supraphysiologic testosterone).

All the really old, vital folks I’ve encountered are active, for sure, though none of them are ex-body builders. As I mentioned, resistance training plays a role in longevity, but the ceiling benefit is achieved fairly quickly.

Maybe i'm missing the point here but this seems like a gross mischaracterization, you can lift to failure and not be a body builder or take PEDs, if you've been lifting this way all your life there is no reason to change, until maybe when you're like 75 or 80.

Tread carefully my friend. 75-80 is hella optimistic. I'm not even 50 but If I feel an odd tweak or soreness that wont go away, I rest that muscle. Been dealing with tennis elbow lately so the past month I haven't gone heavy and doing higher reps instead. If I kept maxing out I'd surely be injured and out for much longer. Listen to your body old farts!

 

[Major]

What standard daily vitamins are people taking? I haven't taken a daily vitamin since eating the Flintstone ones with breakfast.

That's the one thing I've routinely taken the past 20 years. I'd recommend taking a real multivitamin like Animal Pak or Orange Triad (it will require you to take 6-8 pills daily). Stay away from that Centrum type stuff you get at the supermarket.

 

[FarFromHome]

What standard daily vitamins are people taking? I haven't taken a daily vitamin since eating the Flintstone ones with breakfast.

That's the one thing I've routinely taken the past 20 years. I'd recommend taking a real multivitamin like Animal Pak or Orange Triad (it will require you to take 6-8 pills daily). Stay away from that synthetic Centrum type stuff you get at the supermarket.

That's the feedback I was wanting. May I ask why stay away from the synthetic centrum like ones?

 

[Major]

What standard daily vitamins are people taking? I haven't taken a daily vitamin since eating the Flintstone ones with breakfast.

That's the one thing I've routinely taken the past 20 years. I'd recommend taking a real multivitamin like Animal Pak or Orange Triad (it will require you to take 6-8 pills daily). Stay away from that synthetic Centrum type stuff you get at the supermarket.

That's the feedback I was wanting. May I ask why stay away from the synthetic centrum like ones?

With most vitamins you're pissing out a lot of them but the vitamin levels are often so low in those trash drug store varieties that your body will see no benefit.

 

[MAC_32]

I had an awakening while vacationing in Ireland. My body quite simply can't hold up to the rigors of pavement pounding anymore. I've talked about this ad nauseum in the 10k thread, but I was hit by a car while running in 2020 and my body has not been the same since. No matter what I do to compliment, any time I exceed 20 miles per week for a month or so, something breaks.

While I've still sprinkled them in, I used to spend quite a bit of time on our trails. These aren't the basic trails most are used to either - they're varying degrees of technical (rocks, roots, mud, standing water, etc) and on steep terrain (15-20+ percent). The problems are there is nothing within a couple hours of me that is more than 300' in elevation and most of the good ones are at least a half hour away. As personal commitments interfered and racing goals shifted, I stopped making the time to go to those good ones and started getting bored with those near my neighborhood. My experiences in Ireland have changed my fitness goals moving forward.

Day 2 was spent at Giant's Causeway. While I spent most of my 'climbing' on the rocks along the coast, the hike up the cliff was reinvigorating. On day 4 we migrated to Glenveagh National Park and my eyes immediately gravitated towards the mountain behind the castle. While the rest in our group were talking about exploring the gardens or the interior, I pointed to some humans I saw hundreds of feet up and said 'I am going up there, I'll be back in a bit.' After doing that everyone in our group already knew what I'd be doing day 5 - climbing Sieve League. Upon arrival my wife thought I was only going to the top of what we could see, but I didn't share with her until after that I went to the (beginning of) One Man's Pass. I stopped there, I know my limits, then at the pub after discussions of what's next began. On day 7 we were finishing in Westport, which was only a short drive away from Croagh Patrick. I decided to challenge myself and see how quickly I could transverse the mountain-and-back. The average hike was 3-4 hours, so I said I'm gonna beat that. That said, I was not expecting to get up-and-down in just over an hour and a half - my garmin clocked me at 1:36, but I don't think it captured my 5 minute pause to enjoy the top nor the few short breaks to take pictures / videos on the way down, so I'll call it '1:45.' Either way, it was way faster than average and my energy was palpable at the pub at the bottom afterwards, and a new fitness vision was re-born.

I don't know where I'll land a few months from now, but it'll be somewhere out on the trails, and hopefully about 20 pounds or so lighter.

 

[Major]

Yeah I stopped running on concrete and pavement years ago. Rarely get injured anymore ie no more sore knees or strained calves.

 

[belljr]

So where should I run

 

[Terminalxylem]

Lifting weights is a pretty important part of my workout routine. I get reasonably heavy, but am by no means a bodybuilder. This is the first I've ever heard it mentioned as more risk than reward. I credit my time in the gym as a major factor as to why I've never suffered a wear and tear injury (I'm very active and have competed athletically all my life and continue doing so). I guess that could change in the coming years, but i suspect it's doing more to protect my joints and preserve functionality than not. There's also benefits that extend beyond strength if I'm not mistaken. Is it lifting to failure that's an issue, or even heavy weights from a progressive overload type program that's risky?

I had a football coach that lifted weights well into his 70s and was the healthiest most functional man I've ever met.

I don’t know if there’s a age when lifting to failure becomes a liability. Intuitively, seems like it’s less risk than lifting heavy as we age.

But if it’s anything like aerobic exercise, you probably can get plenty bang for your buck with sub-failure, moderate intensity resistance training. Think walking a few miles, versus sprinting a marathon.

The caveat is I just experienced a serious injury with sub-maximal effort.

But still, there’s probably a good reason you don’t see many old guys grunting to get one last rep, or lifting heavy. I don’t think it’s solely because they physically can’t.

 

[Major]

So where should I run

I'm partial to tracks, park trails and treadmills for running. Asphalt is much better than concrete though and more forgiving on your joints.

 

[The Longtime Lurker]

Lifting weights is a pretty important part of my workout routine. I get reasonably heavy, but am by no means a bodybuilder. This is the first I've ever heard it mentioned as more risk than reward. I credit my time in the gym as a major factor as to why I've never suffered a wear and tear injury (I'm very active and have competed athletically all my life and continue doing so). I guess that could change in the coming years, but i suspect it's doing more to protect my joints and preserve functionality than not. There's also benefits that extend beyond strength if I'm not mistaken. Is it lifting to failure that's an issue, or even heavy weights from a progressive overload type program that's risky?

I had a football coach that lifted weights well into his 70s and was the healthiest most functional man I've ever met.

I don’t know if there’s a age when lifting to failure becomes a liability. Intuitively, seems like it’s less risk than lifting heavy as we age.

But if it’s anything like aerobic exercise, you probably can get plenty bang for your buck with sub-failure, moderate intensity resistance training. Think walking a few miles, versus sprinting a marathon.

The caveat is I just experienced a serious injury with sub-maximal effort.

But still, there’s probably a good reason you don’t see many old guys grunting to get one last rep, or lifting heavy. I don’t think it’s solely because they physically can’t.

That answers my question. I wasn't sure if you were meaning lifting in general, or failure.

I haven't pushed a max or gone to failure in probably 5 years. My preferred routine relies on 90% of max for single rep and 65%-75%-85% for sets as an example. Never to heavy, but with a consistent progression week to week. I do think it's important to keep functional strength and my lifestyle is aided by being strong and the increased durability.

Injury is always a risk at our age and my intuition is that it's helping prevent that. Your story is cautionary though. Form form form is the name of the game ofcourse. Wrap those elbows (tennis elbow from trying to overdo a dumbbell curl is unpleasant) wear a belt when squatting and performing deads. Injury risk can be mitigated with precautions.

For a time i had a recurring disc issue in my lower back, but a consistent dead lift routine seemingly resolved it as it hasn't been an issue for many years.

 

[Terminalxylem]

I had an awakening while vacationing in Ireland. My body quite simply can't hold up to the rigors of pavement pounding anymore. I've talked about this ad nauseum in the 10k thread, but I was hit by a car while running in 2020 and my body has not been the same since. No matter what I do to compliment, any time I exceed 20 miles per week for a month or so, something breaks.

While I've still sprinkled them in, I used to spend quite a bit of time on our trails. These aren't the basic trails most are used to either - they're varying degrees of technical (rocks, roots, mud, standing water, etc) and on steep terrain (15-20+ percent). The problems are there is nothing within a couple hours of me that is more than 300' in elevation and most of the good ones are at least a half hour away. As personal commitments interfered and racing goals shifted, I stopped making the time to go to those good ones and started getting bored with those near my neighborhood. My experiences in Ireland have changed my fitness goals moving forward.

Day 2 was spent at Giant's Causeway. While I spent most of my 'climbing' on the rocks along the coast, the hike up the cliff was reinvigorating. On day 4 we migrated to Glenveagh National Park and my eyes immediately gravitated towards the mountain behind the castle. While the rest in our group were talking about exploring the gardens or the interior, I pointed to some humans I saw hundreds of feet up and said 'I am going up there, I'll be back in a bit.' After doing that everyone in our group already knew what I'd be doing day 5 - climbing Sieve League. Upon arrival my wife thought I was only going to the top of what we could see, but I didn't share with her until after that I went to the (beginning of) One Man's Pass. I stopped there, I know my limits, then at the pub after discussions of what's next began. On day 7 we were finishing in Westport, which was only a short drive away from Croagh Patrick. I decided to challenge myself and see how quickly I could transverse the mountain-and-back. The average hike was 3-4 hours, so I said I'm gonna beat that. That said, I was not expecting to get up-and-down in just over an hour and a half - my garmin clocked me at 1:36, but I don't think it captured my 5 minute pause to enjoy the top nor the few short breaks to take pictures / videos on the way down, so I'll call it '1:45.' Either way, it was way faster than average and my energy was palpable at the pub at the bottom afterwards, and a new fitness vision was re-born.

I don't know where I'll land a few months from now, but it'll be somewhere out on the trails, and hopefully about 20 pounds or so lighter.

Welcome to the vertical world, my friend. Mountains are suuuuch a good resource for physical fitness, as well as mental health.

The Midwest makes access a little problematic though.

 

[The Longtime Lurker]

Speaking of running, anyone remember the vibram 5 finger barefoot running shoes? I ran a half marathon in those once, plantar fasciitis says hello. I got real familiar with a tennis ball rolling under my foot. I could make a fist with my foot for awhile though which was neat.

 

[Terminalxylem]

So where should I run

Padded track to start, then work up to trails.

Limit pavement pounding to brisk walks.

 

[Terminalxylem]

What standard daily vitamins are people taking? I haven't taken a daily vitamin since eating the Flintstone ones with breakfast.

That's the one thing I've routinely taken the past 20 years. I'd recommend taking a real multivitamin like Animal Pak or Orange Triad (it will require you to take 6-8 pills daily). Stay away from that synthetic Centrum type stuff you get at the supermarket.

That's the feedback I was wanting. May I ask why stay away from the synthetic centrum like ones?

With most vitamins you're pissing out a lot of them but the vitamin levels are often so low in those trash drug store varieties that your body will see no benefit.

If you’re pissing them out, it’s probably not a bioavailability problem. Urine is an ultrafiltrate of blood, after all.

More likely, your body just doesn’t need the extra vitamins, no matter what you paid for them.

 

[belljr]

So where should I run

I'm partial to tracks, park trails and treadmills for running. Asphalt is much better than concrete though and more forgiving on your joints.

Seeing as I been running at 5am in the dark the past 2.5 weeks....I guess I'll stick with the street. I'm not driving somewhere that early just to run and I'm not sure there is a track available at that time.

Roll out of bed stretch, and go through the neighborhoods is my plan. Running around a track feels more boring somehow :

I don't know of any trails around here. Once I get more comfortable I'll have to check

 

[MAC_32]

Welcome to the vertical world, my friend. Mountains are suuuuch a good resource for physical fitness, as well as mental health.

The Midwest makes access a little problematic though.

While we don't have any one incline of consequence, we have quite a few options on trails that go up-down-and-around various river valleys as this is the start of the foothills of the Appalachians. I'll start to re-engage on former routes as the days, weeks, months go by but it is not difficult to map out 2K incline routes that are under 90 mins in several places. Hell, today I had a window over lunch to get some urban trail miles in - net 628' of vert in 45 mins (4.25 mi) and could have easily increased that to near 1k feet if I had another 10-15 mins.

 

[Orange&Blue]

Weighed in at 246 yesterday (6'5"). Down from 300 in January 2023. Goal is to get to 230. Slow and steady isn't a headline grabber, but I've found it enjoyable and as such hopefully sustainable.

Diet and weight lifting. I occasionally will run a mile, but that is maybe once a month as it's not enjoyable.

 

[Major]

So where should I run

I'm partial to tracks, park trails and treadmills for running. Asphalt is much better than concrete though and more forgiving on your joints.

Seeing as I been running at 5am in the dark the past 2.5 weeks....I guess I'll stick with the street. I'm not driving somewhere that early just to run and I'm not sure there is a track available at that time.

Roll out of bed stretch, and go through the neighborhoods is my plan. Running around a track feels more boring somehow :

I don't know of any trails around here. Once I get more comfortable I'll have to check

Most cities/towns have public parks with decent running trails that are paved and easy on the legs. Definitely something to look into but it's not an end all. My legs just (notably my calves) just don't react well to hard surfaces while I have other friends who have no problem running long distances on the street.

 

[Terminalxylem]

Welcome to the vertical world, my friend. Mountains are suuuuch a good resource for physical fitness, as well as mental health.

The Midwest makes access a little problematic though.

While we don't have any one incline of consequence, we have quite a few options on trails that go up-down-and-around various river valleys as this is the start of the foothills of the Appalachians. I'll start to re-engage on former routes as the days, weeks, months go by but it is not difficult to map out 2K incline routes that are under 90 mins in several places. Hell, today I had a window over lunch to get some urban trail miles in - net 628' of vert in 45 mins (4.25 mi) and could have easily increased that to near 1k feet if I had another 10-15 mins.

That should be enough. My usual walk gets me 800-900 feet elevation in roughly 2 1/2 miles. With some effort, it’s pretty easy to rack up 30+ minutes of zone 4 HR for interval training. At a more leisurely pace, it’s sustained Zone 2.

 

[belljr]

Down 3..... 1.92 miles in 27:00.

Friday is no walking mile. Getting there

 

[The Iguana]

So where should I run

I'm partial to tracks, park trails and treadmills for running. Asphalt is much better than concrete though and more forgiving on your joints.

Seeing as I been running at 5am in the dark the past 2.5 weeks....I guess I'll stick with the street. I'm not driving somewhere that early just to run and I'm not sure there is a track available at that time.

Roll out of bed stretch, and go through the neighborhoods is my plan. Running around a track feels more boring somehow :

I don't know of any trails around here. Once I get more comfortable I'll have to check

I'd suggest you just run wherever you are comfortable running. Trails might offer a little extra cushion but also plenty of hazards. I have rolled an ankle on many a rock, root, or hole. That's no fun either.

 

[Major]

So where should I run

I'm partial to tracks, park trails and treadmills for running. Asphalt is much better than concrete though and more forgiving on your joints.

Seeing as I been running at 5am in the dark the past 2.5 weeks....I guess I'll stick with the street. I'm not driving somewhere that early just to run and I'm not sure there is a track available at that time.

Roll out of bed stretch, and go through the neighborhoods is my plan. Running around a track feels more boring somehow :

I don't know of any trails around here. Once I get more comfortable I'll have to check

I'd suggest you just run wherever you are comfortable running. Trails might offer a little extra cushion but also plenty of hazards. I have rolled an ankle on many a rock, root, or hole. That's no fun either.

No doubt. When I say trail, these are paved almost like a track just with gravel ( ie Hermann Park). A nature trail type is a no go for me for all the potential hazards you just mentioned. Those are ideal for walks/hikes.

 

[MAC_32]

So where should I run

I'm partial to tracks, park trails and treadmills for running. Asphalt is much better than concrete though and more forgiving on your joints.

Seeing as I been running at 5am in the dark the past 2.5 weeks....I guess I'll stick with the street. I'm not driving somewhere that early just to run and I'm not sure there is a track available at that time.

Roll out of bed stretch, and go through the neighborhoods is my plan. Running around a track feels more boring somehow :

I don't know of any trails around here. Once I get more comfortable I'll have to check

I'd suggest you just run wherever you are comfortable running. Trails might offer a little extra cushion but also plenty of hazards. I have rolled an ankle on many a rock, root, or hole. That's no fun either.

No doubt. When I say trail, these are paved almost like a track just with gravel ( ie Hermann Park). A nature trail type is a no go for me for all the potential hazards you just mentioned. Those are ideal for walks/hikes.

Ultimately, what's most sustainable for you is what you should do. Sure, there are optimal ways to exercise, but if they're not sustainable for you then it's best not to pursue them. It'd be better for you to knock out a half hour at 5 am on neighborhood concrete than tell yourself you'll go somewhere else and do it on a more forgiving surface then not do it. Now, there could be a point in the future in which your body says this concrete stuff ain't working (where I am now), but that's a potential problem for future bell to solve, not current bell.

 

[odin33]

Well that was quick, dropped almost 6 pounds in two days, who knew beer had calories?!?! (and for those of you doing the math, I know. There were others factors impacting #s).

Finally cracked 125 pounds. Never ever thought I'd be here.

Was reviewing my spreadsheet where I've tracked my weight weekly since the beginning. If I can lose a pound+ a week for the next three weeks I will have lost more % wise over that years starting weight than my first year. Barely, but a beat is a beat. That just seems wrong, probably because I've felt roughly the same all year, but the numbers prove it out. SMH

That's the new short term goal, beat year 1's %. That'll set up a reasonable first half of year 4 goal to get to 40% off original weight which conveniently is 215, with an end of year 4 goal of cracking 200.

 

[Major]

So where should I run

I'm partial to tracks, park trails and treadmills for running. Asphalt is much better than concrete though and more forgiving on your joints.

Seeing as I been running at 5am in the dark the past 2.5 weeks....I guess I'll stick with the street. I'm not driving somewhere that early just to run and I'm not sure there is a track available at that time.

Roll out of bed stretch, and go through the neighborhoods is my plan. Running around a track feels more boring somehow :

I don't know of any trails around here. Once I get more comfortable I'll have to check

I'd suggest you just run wherever you are comfortable running. Trails might offer a little extra cushion but also plenty of hazards. I have rolled an ankle on many a rock, root, or hole. That's no fun either.

No doubt. When I say trail, these are paved almost like a track just with gravel ( ie Hermann Park). A nature trail type is a no go for me for all the potential hazards you just mentioned. Those are ideal for walks/hikes.

Ultimately, what's most sustainable for you is what you should do. Sure, there are optimal ways to exercise, but if they're not sustainable for you then it's best not to pursue them. It'd be better for you to knock out a half hour at 5 am on neighborhood concrete than tell yourself you'll go somewhere else and do it on a more forgiving surface then not do it. Now, there could be a point in the future in which your body says this concrete stuff ain't working (where I am now), but that's a potential problem for future bell to solve, not current bell.

Absolutely. I just want him to proceed with caution. I've played sports and been in shape my whole life but slacked off for a few years. When I started again and took my fitness journey seriously, much like Bell I started running again on pavement/concrete. I was quickly reminded of my age at the time (early 40s) and strained my calf a few weeks in. Sidelined me for a solid 3-4 weeks (2 of which I could barely hobble from the bed to the couch rendering me useless for exercise and life in general). First time I've been injured since a pulled hammy playing soccer in HS. And then when I was healed, it took me a while to get back in the routine which is half the battle. Point being, Injuries are the suck and can really set you back.

Another tip is to make sure to do some light stretching before running especially with the calves. A solid 10 minute walk to get your heartbeat going is also advisable.

 

[belljr]

Not sure if this needs to be said, but I'm not a noob when it comes to exercise. I'm a bit noobish when it comes to "running as exercise though". I just let myself go so badly that this was the best way for me to do something. I appreciate all the words and encouragement though. In college I was in the mid 5s if I knew I was just running 1mile.

I'm still dealing with back discs and a knee and shoulder so I know all too well about injuries. In fact last year I started and ran 4 miles only to hurt my back again

I'm almost 54 so 100% in the cautious side of things.

But yeah running as "sport/exercise" is definitely low on my experience. Weights, gym sport specific exercise not so much

This is definitely a newish/different journey for sure.

Much thanks for the replies!!!!

 

[The Iguana]

Not sure if this needs to be said, but I'm not a noob when it comes to exercise. I'm a bit noobish when it comes to "running as exercise though". I just let myself go so badly that this was the best way for me to do something. I appreciate all the words and encouragement though. In college I was in the mid 5s if I knew I was just running 1mile.

I'm still dealing with back discs and a knee and shoulder so I know all too well about injuries. In fact last year I started and ran 4 miles only to hurt my back again

I'm almost 54 so 100% in the cautious side of things.

But yeah running as "sport/exercise" is definitely low on my experience. Weights, gym sport specific exercise not so much

This is definitely a newish/different journey for sure.

Much thanks for the replies!!!!

Just noticed that you have nothing loaded on Strava for a long time. None of these "runs" count of not on there!

 

[belljr]

Oh I thought I deleted my account lol

 

[belljr]

Well it was harder than I expected. Ran 1 mile. Not including the warm up and cool down I ran the mile in 13.09.

Need to really get on top of the food intake ..

This week I missed getting up at 4:45. And "slept in" to my normal 5:30 and went to work. Got a walking lap in at lunch on Tuesday. So of the 21 days (including this weekend) I will have gotten up early on 19 and did "something" if you count playing golf on Sundays as "something"

 

[rockaction]

Hey belljr, sort of been reading here and there and I’m just thinking of somebody who talked to me when I was trying to get back into shape in 2011 and I was bigger. I was concerned about joint issues and my knee, back, and hip were all bothering me and we talked about exercise and I wanted to run because I knew from experience that it was good for my body and I needed that level of exertion to lose weight. The dude listened to me, looked at me, and said, “You need to get on top of your diet and work up to maybe running.” He said I needed to do low-impact elliptical and stair training (especially elliptical) and lose weight (and lift) until I was down enough in weight to run.

So I was discouraged (how did I get this way?), but the thing he said that stuck in my mind was, “Do you think your joints and back are going to appreciate you jumping up and down on one foot at 230 lbs. a jump?”

That nearly knocked me over in its logic. I’m sure everyone is telling you what to do, and who knows what you think of me chiming in, but just think about that. If you’re really unhappy with your physical condition perhaps see if the local gym has a trial period with a physical trainer session and maybe go for that. He or she would assess you and if they give a few free sessions you could glean enough modern kinesiology to avoid damaging your joints while you get back in shape.

It might be a longer process, but if you go like Rocky Balboa; all hitting meat slabs and running on concrete (we weren’t made to do that—especially at 50+) it might signal your last efforts before serious injury. Nobody wants that kind of thing to happen. And maybe more importantly to you is that you might be more efficient the other way. If you go without any coaching or with older techniques, you’ll be wasting all that effort (and it is effort) and not getting results you deserve.

Just a thought. I’m in bad shape also so I can empathize. I wish you luck and take care.

 

[FarFromHome]

We talk supplements. We talk nutrition. We talk diet. Stretching is so crucial as we get older. I spend 5 to 10 minutes DAILY stretching out this old body. My family teases old dad about leaving him alone during "dad stretch time." Stretch people.

 

[odin33]

We talk supplements. We talk nutrition. We talk diet. Stretching is so crucial as we get older. I spend 5 to 10 minutes DAILY stretching out this old body. My family teases old dad about leaving him alone during "dad stretch time." Stretch people.

This is ringing true as I try to get back on track. Can I ask what stretches you do? Personally I know I need to roll my ankles (snap crackle pop), quads, and hamstring stretch if I don't want to be a cripple at the end of the day. Probably need to add something for my back as that's usually the next to start hurting.

Quick update: down to 231, so as long as I don't go rogue I'll hit that annual % goal. Sunny and low 70s in the mornings this weekend. Can't beat that for getting my miles in.

 

[belljr]

Get one of these for Hammys alone

https://a.co/d/ey7Y9j4

 

[FarFromHome]

We talk supplements. We talk nutrition. We talk diet. Stretching is so crucial as we get older. I spend 5 to 10 minutes DAILY stretching out this old body. My family teases old dad about leaving him alone during "dad stretch time." Stretch people.

This is ringing true as I try to get back on track. Can I ask what stretches you do? Personally I know I need to roll my ankles (snap crackle pop), quads, and hamstring stretch if I don't want to be a cripple at the end of the day. Probably need to add something for my back as that's usually the next to start hurting.

Quick update: down to 231, so as long as I don't go rogue I'll hit that annual % goal. Sunny and low 70s in the mornings this weekend. Can't beat that for getting my miles in.

Surprisenly enough due to my structured OCD, I really go with the flow. I know they have countless routines online, but I start in a comfortable standing position and almost use a tai chi approach. I shift my energy to my troubled spots. Lower back, Hamstrings and knee. I feel the key to a good stretch is to simply put the time in. Just seems like there is no such thing as a bad stretch as long as you doing it. All my opinion of course.

 

[belljr]

Well it was harder than I expected. Ran 1 mile. Not including the warm up and cool down I ran the mile in 13.09.

Need to really get on top of the food intake ..

This week I missed getting up at 4:45. And "slept in" to my normal 5:30 and went to work. Got a walking lap in at lunch on Tuesday. So of the 21 days (including this weekend) I will have gotten up early on 19 and did "something" if you count playing golf on Sundays as "something"

1.5 run this morning not including warmup and cool down. 12:40 pace. Tough for me but it was completed

 

[Mister CIA]

Slight gain this week results in 90 calorie loss from daily budget. 2257/day is this week's recommendation to stay on the path to 155 by the new year.

Weigh-in = 171.0, bodyfat 15.1%.

 

[3C's]

I do a once a month event. I haven't lost any weight in the last month but I guess I'm a little leaner because people who haven't seen me since last month mentioned I looked slimmer.

 

[The Longtime Lurker]

No weekly weigh in. Carb loaded for a 30mi mountain bike race, flat tire 6 miles in, ate like i road my bike 100 miles afterwards. Back on track this morning and start weekly weigh ins next week.

Plan is to hit the target weight and try to add back 10lbs of muscle. One more race in two weeks and race season is over. I think I'm still on track for hitting my goal for that race.

 

[belljr]

Down 3 pounds in 3 weeks. Not good but got a mile "run" in this morning.

I can tell I'm getting in better shape overall and a little tighter but still lackadaisical with the diet.

 

[Alex P Keaton]

Down 3 pounds in 3 weeks. Not good but got a mile "run" in this morning.

I can tell I'm getting in better shape overall and a little tighter but still lackadaisical with the diet.

Down 3 pounds is down 3 pounds. Better than being up 3 lbs no? Keep going!!!