Ghost Rider's Patriots Pole (1 Viewer)

[cobalt_27]

I hate getting good questions that pit one vs. another and there's no poll option. Apparently Ghost Rider tried and shrugged. Here's his set up:

Tom Brady and Bill Belichick are obviously the two most important men when discussing the success of the Patriots of the last five plus years, but who deserves more credit?I gotta go with Brady, by a very small margin. Belichick's Patriots were going nowhere until Brady started playing in 2001, and in two of the three Super Bowl's, Brady came through at the end after the defense had completely collapsed in the 4th quarter. That is how I see it.

Maybe the powers that be can merge these things.

 

[Power Monster]

Double B and the management. They have instilled a team first class organization and I believe that Brady developed his magnificence thru the coaching staff. This team looks unbeatable when Brady is on but then again look at how the ST and the defense is playing overall. Protection from the OL and two stud RBs and a very good motley crew of receivers. Look out!

 

[cobalt_27]

I'm familiar wtih the north pole, the south pole, even the stripper pole.What is a patriot's pole?

This is the Patriots' Pole. Learn it. Live it. Love it.

 

[wharf rat]

I'm familiar with the north pole, the south pole, even the stripper pole.

What is a patriots pole?

 

[Wheelhouse]

Ultimately Tom Brady has to the one responsible for putting points on the board, but Bellichick helped Tom Brady become the person he is today.

I think Both can thrive without each other now, but in the beginning the both needed each other to get to where they are now.

So what's the answer? Because without Brady could the Patriots be this good with say Scott Zolak? Probably not as good, but with Bellichick - you never know?! I voted Brady.

 

[thesurfshop19]

Both are among the top 2 at what they do in this league.

At the end of the day, I just feel that coaches can only set up so much and it's up to the players to get it done. Belichick's 2001 coaching job was the best I've ever seen, but it was Brady who brought them back from the brink, down 10 to the Raiders. Lose that game and there may be no dynasty at all!

 

[pizzatyme]

This is so easy! BB is a terrific coach. He sets the schemes that help the Pats win.

Brady executes the gameplan. Brady doesn't play defense. BB controls all phases of the game.

BB is the reason. There are probable 10 QBs who could do what Brady has done.

There are probably 3 coaches who could do what BB has done.

And this comes from a staunch Colts supporter.

 

[pats3in4]

BB without Brady likely has a playoff team (I'm sure Brady's replacement would be competent, not a buffoon), but not a championship team. Brady has *had to* come up big in all three playoff runs to the championships...something I'm not sure his replacement would have done. It's not like the Pats have dominated their competition all these years. He's been the difference in otherwise tightly matched teams.

Brady without BB would also probably QB a playoff team (he's so much more than a Weis/BB creation), but perhaps his team would falter in the playoffs without a D that the Pats had during their title runs. Although, he probably could have quarterbacked a team like Pittsburgh to a handful of titles as well, especially the 2001 & 2004 squads.

Since I think "success" in this context means winning championships, then I'd give the nod to Brady. He's the one who made the Pats a championship team, not another close-but-no-cigar team like Cowher's Steelers earlier this decade, Dan Reeves' Broncos teams or Marv Levy's Bills.

 

[cobalt_27]

It's an interesting discussion, and it obviously involves a lot of synergy. Over half--twenty-one of the 40 Super Bowls--have been won by repeat coach-QB combos:

(1) Lombardi-Starr

(2) Landry-Staubach

(3) Shula-Griese

(4) Noll-Bradshaw (x4)

(5) Flores-Plunkett

(6) Walsh-Montana

(7) Johnson-Aikman

(8) Shanahan-Elway

(9) Belichick-Brady (x3)

I usually side with the head coaches on this, though, as they create the entire atmosphere and gameplan for the entire squad. And, if one looks at the SB as a benchmark, only two quarterbacks (Aikman and Montana) have won with different head coaches, while, there have been 3 head coaches (Gibbs, Parcells, Seifert) who have won with different quarterbacks.

Edited to add that it's an interesting note that the two QBs who've won with different HCs did so the year following a SB win. So, one might argue that the new regimes (Switzer and Seifert) were really extensions of the old regimes. Meanwhile, those three HCs who won with different QBs did so a combined 18 SuperBowls between those repeats.

 

[Urine_Idiot]

I'm familiar wtih the north pole, the south pole, even the stripper pole.What is a patriot's pole?

This is the Patriots' Pole. Learn it. Live it. Love it.

And after you've loved it, have some freedom fries....

 

[whhwalker]

Who is more responsible for the Patriots' success - Brady or Belichick or Vinatieri

Fixed