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HBO - Song of Ice&Fire Series -Varsity Thread - no TV only whiners (3 Viewers)

Leeroy Jenkins said:
I hope this season is making people realize how great Crows and Dragons actually were. Those meandering stories and character development and all the details about everything are what make the series special. The showrunners just sprinting through the outline points has made for some exciting moments, but the overall show and story has suffered a lot. Still great, but now it's more summer blockbuster than drama. 
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This season, save episode 8, has been top notch imo. Season 5 did drag it seemed. But hardhomme on was excellent.

The future books are about to be made irrelevant if he ever does them.

 
So I think everybody is now where they will end up in the books, but obviously they will get there differently (and Theon and Asha will be replaced with Victarion). 

How do we think it will go down?

I have suspected for some time that the Tyrells were for the dragons and would join Dany and Aegon (cannot remember why I thought this!). Dorne obviously already was involved in the plots.  I'm not sure why the show had to make Doran so weak.  

 
Leeroy Jenkins said:
So I think everybody is now where they will end up in the books, but obviously they will get there differently (and Theon and Asha will be replaced with Victarion). 

How do we think it will go down?

I have suspected for some time that the Tyrells were for the dragons and would join Dany and Aegon (cannot remember why I thought this!). Dorne obviously already was involved in the plots.  I'm not sure why the show had to make Doran so weak.  
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Showrunners probably thought sand snakes werd cooler.

I did like how arya did the pie and killed walder frey. 

 
I never understood why the show didn't use some of the iconic words from the books (broken man speech, "Edd, fetch me a block") It was nice to hear Doran's fire and blood speech even though it was Ellaria and Varys but there was no reason they couldn't have incorporated some of Manderly's speech last night.

 
A lot of it didn't make sense (does Varys have a Concorde?), but that was an awesome ####### episode and the biggest game-changing ep in the entire series. Just don't think about the logic too much.

 
Bill Brasky said:
fill me in, I'm a non-book reader
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A really fat northern lord (Manderly) killed 3 Frey sons (revenge). He made three huge meat pies and brought them to Fake Arya Stark's wedding to Ramsay Bolton.

In the books it was the first hint that the northern lords were going to rise up against the Frey's and Bolton's and get some revenge.

 
I'm in a hybrid situation, I've got the books, but I've had a bad habit of hopping around in them based on the character titles. - Does anyone want to speculate  on what happened to the sword prophecy? The show did have Melisandre sort of do her magic with the bonfire and Stannis' sword a couple seasons back, but obviously that was not 'the' sword so now what? Is that particular prophecy still in play in the show?

 
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refresh my recollection:

Do the Faceless Men use real faces / masks in the books? As I recall it, they train their muscles to contort their faces and change their appearance.

incidentally, I think we saw Jaquen do just that one of the very first times he revealed the ability (as opposed to tearing off a mask scoobie doo style).

I totally understand why the show did it their way though.

 
JerseyToughGuys said:
refresh my recollection:

Do the Faceless Men use real faces / masks in the books? As I recall it, they train their muscles to contort their faces and change their appearance.

incidentally, I think we saw Jaquen do just that one of the very first times he revealed the ability (as opposed to tearing off a mask scoobie doo style).

I totally understand why the show did it their way though.
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They do both actually.

 
Leeroy Jenkins said:
So I think everybody is now where they will end up in the books, but obviously they will get there differently (and Theon and Asha will be replaced with Victarion). 

How do we think it will go down?

I have suspected for some time that the Tyrells were for the dragons and would join Dany and Aegon (cannot remember why I thought this!). Dorne obviously already was involved in the plots.  I'm not sure why the show had to make Doran so weak.  
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Focus groups/women empowerment/political correctness/Alexander Siddig looks like a terrorist? 

 
JerseyToughGuys said:
refresh my recollection:

Do the Faceless Men use real faces / masks in the books? As I recall it, they train their muscles to contort their faces and change their appearance.

incidentally, I think we saw Jaquen do just that one of the very first times he revealed the ability (as opposed to tearing off a mask scoobie doo style).

I totally understand why the show did it their way though.
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They use faces.

They use magical illusion.

They use (or at least it is implied) regular disguises.

 
I know many like to gush over Lady Mormont, but I thought Lena Headey and Liam Cunningham stole the show last night in terms of acting. 

They've fast tracking everything now, but that was still a masterpiece episode. I like how they not so subtly acknowledged how bad they botched the Dorne treatment through Olenna's dialog, dismissing the sand snakes as stupid and unimportant. 

Favorite part was Arya. I wonder if she goes South or North from there. Maybe she hits up King's Landing, offs Jamie, swipes his countenance, and then does Cersei.

No real surprises in the grand scheme of things, though it was nice to see the details of how the events we knew were coming played out.

Danaerys seems to have it too easy right now. Can't see it lasting.

So, given that Bran is now a homing device for the Others, does he negate the magic of the wall if he goes south of it? They seem to have dispensed with the whole horn of Joramun thing, so that seems to be the device by which they'll allow the zombies to go south. It'd be dumb of Bran to pass the wall if that's the case though. :shrug:  

Seems like they're setting Jon up for an ultimate sacrifice kind of thing. Maybe he has to become one of the Others himself,  take the Night King's place and make the zombies go back north, remove their animus or something like that.

 
Gr00vus said:
I know many like to gush over Lady Mormont, but I thought Lena Headey and Liam Cunningham stole the show last night in terms of acting. 

They've fast tracking everything now, but that was still a masterpiece episode. I like how they not so subtly acknowledged how bad they botched the Dorne treatment through Olenna's dialog, dismissing the sand snakes as stupid and unimportant. 

Favorite part was Arya. I wonder if she goes South or North from there. Maybe she hits up King's Landing, offs Jamie, swipes his countenance, and then does Cersei.

No real surprises in the grand scheme of things, though it was nice to see the details of how the events we knew were coming played out.

Danaerys seems to have it too easy right now. Can't see it lasting.

So, given that Bran is now a homing device for the Others, does he negate the magic of the wall if he goes south of it? They seem to have dispensed with the whole horn of Joramun thing, so that seems to be the device by which they'll allow the zombies to go south. It'd be dumb of Bran to pass the wall if that's the case though. :shrug:  

Seems like they're setting Jon up for an ultimate sacrifice kind of thing. Maybe he has to become one of the Others himself,  take the Night King's place and make the zombies go back north, remove their animus or something like that.
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Cunningham was tremendous in the confrontation with Melisandre, yeah. Really powerful. And seeing Cersei on her victory lap was excellent too.

That was probably the best season finale in the show's history. The openers and finales tend to be more about moving characters from place to place and setting the scene, rather than driving the plot forward, but this one breathed new life into the show. The stagnant King's Landing and Meereen plots were finally advanced in a major way.

The production was fantastic. Loved the costumes, the Mountain's face, Margaery and Cersei's dresses, etc. The Philip Glass-y music during the King's Landing scenes was killer. One of the few times the music really shone through on the show for me, apart from the opening sequence.

Loved the way they repurposed certain lines and scenes from the books and made them work ("Fire and blood", "the North remembers", Frey pie). Thrilled to have Arya Stark back as an actual character.

 
Gr00vus said:
I know many like to gush over Lady Mormont, but I thought Lena Headey and Liam Cunningham stole the show last night in terms of acting. 

They've fast tracking everything now, but that was still a masterpiece episode. I like how they not so subtly acknowledged how bad they botched the Dorne treatment through Olenna's dialog, dismissing the sand snakes as stupid and unimportant. 

Favorite part was Arya. I wonder if she goes South or North from there. Maybe she hits up King's Landing, offs Jamie, swipes his countenance, and then does Cersei.

No real surprises in the grand scheme of things, though it was nice to see the details of how the events we knew were coming played out.

Danaerys seems to have it too easy right now. Can't see it lasting.

So, given that Bran is now a homing device for the Others, does he negate the magic of the wall if he goes south of it? They seem to have dispensed with the whole horn of Joramun thing, so that seems to be the device by which they'll allow the zombies to go south. It'd be dumb of Bran to pass the wall if that's the case though. :shrug:  

Seems like they're setting Jon up for an ultimate sacrifice kind of thing. Maybe he has to become one of the Others himself,  take the Night King's place and make the zombies go back north, remove their animus or something like that.
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Is the horn of Joramun the same as what Euron has that supposedly controls the Dragons ? I havent read the books in a while and I am a little foggy

ETA: Nope, thats the Dragon Horn. I have to assume that comes in to play next season if Euron is to stay relevant

 
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Gr00vus said:
Favorite part was Arya. I wonder if she goes South or North from there. Maybe she hits up King's Landing, offs Jamie, swipes his countenance, and then does Cersei.
Click to expand...
She's got to face off against Zombie Mountain at some point right? :popcorn:  

 
Gr00vus said:
I know many like to gush over Lady Mormont, but I thought Lena Headey and Liam Cunningham stole the show last night in terms of acting. 

They've fast tracking everything now, but that was still a masterpiece episode. I like how they not so subtly acknowledged how bad they botched the Dorne treatment through Olenna's dialog, dismissing the sand snakes as stupid and unimportant. 

Favorite part was Arya. I wonder if she goes South or North from there. Maybe she hits up King's Landing, offs Jamie, swipes his countenance, and then does Cersei.

No real surprises in the grand scheme of things, though it was nice to see the details of how the events we knew were coming played out.

Danaerys seems to have it too easy right now. Can't see it lasting.

So, given that Bran is now a homing device for the Others, does he negate the magic of the wall if he goes south of it? They seem to have dispensed with the whole horn of Joramun thing, so that seems to be the device by which they'll allow the zombies to go south. It'd be dumb of Bran to pass the wall if that's the case though. :shrug:  

Seems like they're setting Jon up for an ultimate sacrifice kind of thing. Maybe he has to become one of the Others himself,  take the Night King's place and make the zombies go back north, remove their animus or something like that.
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Re Bran, my theory is also that he's going to wreck the wall if he passes through, but I'd also like to think Benjen would have mentioned that to him when he dumped him off. 

 
I wouldn't be surprised if Sam discovers, fairly late in the game, that they have to do something like kill off the dragons.  There's a reason the maesters want magic dead.  We know the dragons fueled magic in Qarth.  That's why Pyat Pree wanted to lock them and Dany in the House of the Undying.  We know the obsidian candles have suddenly come alive, now that there are dragons.  I believe the red priests also said their magic was suddenly more powerful.  Is there also some tie in to the Others becoming prominent?  It shouldn't be a direct tie in, as I believe the Targ dragons were around for quite a long time post-Others, while the Others hadn't been seen for thousands of years.  Perhaps some kind of chicken and egg thing going on.  But particularly with the song of ice and fire theme, there's some kind of relationship there.   

 
thecatch said:
Re Bran, my theory is also that he's going to wreck the wall if he passes through, but I'd also like to think Benjen would have mentioned that to him when he dumped him off. 
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Exactly. They made a pretty big deal out of that in the hold the door episode. You'd think that would have stuck in someone's memory such that it would have triggered while Benjen was rehashing the magical nature of the wall this week.

 
I'm sure Arya will get word of what's happening in the North and head up there. Assuming Starks join up with Danny, that side of the board seems pretty loopsided. But maybe they Need that strength for the ice zombies?

 
Bob Sacamano said:
I wouldn't be surprised if Sam discovers, fairly late in the game, that they have to do something like kill off the dragons.  There's a reason the maesters want magic dead.  We know the dragons fueled magic in Qarth.  That's why Pyat Pree wanted to lock them and Dany in the House of the Undying.  We know the obsidian candles have suddenly come alive, now that there are dragons.  I believe the red priests also said their magic was suddenly more powerful.  Is there also some tie in to the Others becoming prominent?  It shouldn't be a direct tie in, as I believe the Targ dragons were around for quite a long time post-Others, while the Others hadn't been seen for thousands of years.  Perhaps some kind of chicken and egg thing going on.  But particularly with the song of ice and fire theme, there's some kind of relationship there.   
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It seems to me there's been a bit of foreshadowing that the next great villain in the story will be Dany. I can see an end game where she defeats the white walkers, only to become another crazy power hungry Targ leader, and the other western houses once again unite against her. 

 
If Jon's dad is Rheagar, and Rheagar and Lyanna got married (don't know how polygamy sells in Westeros) then Jon's the rightful heir to the whole kingdom. He could then get cajoled into (yet again) going against his own devices by his Northern banner men who would probably not want to submit to Danaerys and force Jon to fight for the crown or at least fight to retain autonomy of the North. Littlefinger probably encourages Jon to do this in hopes he gets killed, then he can continue with operation marry Sansa as she'd inherit the north.

Just trying to figure out how things don't go smoothly straight into the battle of five armies battle between the zombies and the rest of Westeros.

Maybe the Valyrian volcanoes erupt while Danaerys is sailing west and wipe out some of her fleet. Or, more obviously, Euron shows up with his 1000 ships and fights her fleet if/when he gets rebuffed. She's got it too easy right now.

 
Since they dropped the Aegon/Young Griff storyline, and rolled some of it into Dany's story, the fleet will get split up near the Stepstones. This could be done by having Euron's fleet meet up and with Dany and this will be her first battle before she lands in Dorne.  

Dany and the dragons, unsullied, dornish then march on kings landing with the Tyrells and Theon/Yara rest of the fleet sail to Kings Landing to have a 2 pronged attack on KL. This battle could be the end of season 7.  Then season 8 would be the workup to the final battle against the WW/Night's King.

 
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