House Republicans Vote to Hobble Independent Ethics Office (1 Viewer)

[jon_mx]

Seems like a really dumb move for the optics alone.  Considering the total lack of ethics in the House, it seems this organization is not all that effective.  As long as people rationalize every move their politicians make, there will never be ethics in politicians.  Politicians always seem to write loopholes in every law for themselves.  This is a step backwards, and there are bigger issues in the law which also need to be addressed.  But who will do that?  Not the politicians. 

 

[jamny]

No defending this.

 

[bigbottom]

I'm sure there is more to the story than the headlines you're reading from the Daily Kos, ThinkProgress and NY Times.

Link to the text of the amendment so people can review and form their own opinions: 

https://s3.amazonaws.com/demandprogress/documents/Goodlatte-OCE-Amendment-to-House-Rules.pdf

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

Seems like a really dumb move for the optics alone. 

It doesn't seem like voters are responsive at all to this sort of thing.  Republicans figured that out before the Democrats did.  I don't expect any negative repercussions for House Republicans for doing this.

 

[roadkill1292]

It doesn't seem like voters are responsive at all to this sort of thing.  Republicans figured that out before the Democrats did.  I don't expect any negative repercussions for House Republicans for doing this.

Republican voters, at least. Their rationalization will be that this congress doesn't need its ethics overseen and that the office is probably full of liberals anyway, kinda like Snopes.

 

[CletiusMaximus]

 Wisconsin gutted its independent "Government Accountability Board" early in Walker's reign.

The GAB was completely eliminated last summer and replaced with a pair of kangaroo courts known as the "Wisconsin Ethics Commission" and "Wisconsin Election Commission." 

 

[MattFancy]

No defending this.

Has there been any explanation about why this happened?

 

[bigbottom]

Link to the text of the amendment so people can review and form their own opinions: 

https://s3.amazonaws.com/demandprogress/documents/Goodlatte-OCE-Amendment-to-House-Rules.pdf

A few relevant excerpts:

(B) The Office shall be subject to the au- thority and direction of the Committee on Eth- ics.

(N) Pursuant to its authority under section 1(c)(2)(F), the board of the Office shall adopt a rule that prohibits the board from accepting or considering any anonymous allegation.

(O) Paragraph (1) of section 1(d) shall apply as if the first sentence read as follows: ‘‘Notwithstanding any other provision of this section, upon receipt of a written request from the Committee on Standards of Official Con- duct that the board cease its review of any mat- ter and refer such matter to the Committee, the board shall refer such matter immediately to the Committee and cease its preliminary or sec- ond-phase review, as applicable, of that matter, and so notify any individual who is the subject of the review.’’.

(R) Nothing in section 1(f) may be con- strued to authorize the board of the Office to make any public statement, or release any in- formation or other material to the public or any other entity, unless such statement or informa- tion has already been released by the Com- mittee on Ethics or the release of such state- ment or information has been authorized by the Committee on Ethics.

(S) The board of the Office is not author- ized to employ any person for a position involv- ing communications with the public, including a communications director or press spokesperson.

(T) If at any time the board of the Office discovers information indicating that a matter which is the subject of a review by the board may involve a violation of a criminal law, the Board will immediately refer the matter to the Committee on Ethics for further review or (if determined appropriate by the Committee on Ethics) referral to an appropriate law enforcement agency. Nothing in the previous sentence may be construed to authorize the Board to refer any matter directly to any law enforcement agency.

In summary:

1) Once independent office now subject to authority of congressional committee.

2) Office categorically prohibited from acting on anonymous reports.

3) If the congressional committee directs the office to stop investigating something, it is required to stop, regardless of whether it believes continued investigation is justified.

4) The office is categorically prohibited from communicating with or releasing any information to the public.

5) The office is categorically prohibited from employing anyone whose role is to communicate with the public.

6) If the office's investigation reveals a violation of criminal law, they are prohibited from notifying law enforcement directly. Instead they are to report the crime to the congressional committee, and only communicate with law enforcement if given the approval to do so by the congressional committee. 

 

[IvanKaramazov]

I guess one benefit of Trump's successful campaign is that it demonstrated that there's really no need to go through the motions of trying to look ethical and well-behaved.  If you're going to be a crook, just go all out.  I salute the House Republicans for at least being honest about their lack of attachment to public accountability.

 

[Righetti]

A few relevant excerpts:

In summary:

1) Once independent office now subject to authority of congressional committee.

2) Office categorically prohibited from acting on anonymous reports.

3) If the congressional committee directs the office to stop investigating something, it is required to stop, regardless of whether it believes continued investigation is justified.

4) The office is categorically prohibited from communicating with or releasing any information to the public.

5) The office is categorically prohibited from employing anyone whose role is to communicate with the public.

6) If the office's investigation reveals a violation of criminal law, they are prohibited from notifying law enforcement directly. Instead they are to report the crime to the congressional committee, and only communicate with law enforcement if given the approval to do so by the congressional committee. 

Yeah, not liking this at all

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

Has there been any explanation about why this happened?

Because politicians don't like to be investigated for ethics violations?

 

[Righetti]

I guess one benefit of Trump's successful campaign is that it demonstrated that there's really no need to go through the motions of trying to look ethical and well-behaved.  If you're going to be a crook, just go all out.  I salute the House Republicans for at least being honest about their lack of attachment to public accountability.

In a world where everybody screams "fake news" in response to an inquiry into their dealings, this turn of events isn't surprising 

 

[Sammy3469]

How ####### rich:

Conway says there's been an "overzealousness" of congressional investigations under old regime. So, no Trump Tweet on topic? @GMA

https://twitter.com/rickklein/status/816256152631644160

 

[Andy Dufresne]

Well, this was just a caucus vote. Which means that 74 Republicans voted against it.

The bigger problem is if/when the complete rules package - of which this idea is simply a part - is voted on will these 74 be railroaded into voting for it or will they side with the Dems who will vote against it...and thus torpedo the whole package? Either way it's a real embarrassment for Republicans.

I wouldn't want to be Paul Ryan. Oof.

 

[Sabertooth]

Just to be clear, is THIS now the latest Democrat outrage?  It's hard to keep up with you guys - you have a new one every 20 minutes.

Not for me.  I'm still pissed about the Supreme Court. 

 

[Mario Kart]

Not for me.  I'm still pissed about the Supreme Court. 

As am I. Too bad many citizens have a short attention span. This will haunt us for the rest of our lives. 

 

[joffer]

 @ classic MaxDeflect

 

[Sammy3469]

I guess you can slide Dubai to the second spot of top Republican Congressional boondoggle destinations in 2017(feel free to add):

1. Russia
   
2. Dubai
   

They can summer on the Black Sea and winter at Trump's International Golf Course.  

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/dubai-billionaire-hussein-sajwani-ready-do-more-deals-trumps-n695566

 

[Mario Kart]

I guess you can slide Dubai to the second spot of top Republican Congressional boondoggle destinations in 2017(feel free to add):

1. Russia
   
2. Dubai
   

They can summer on the Black Sea and winter at Trump's International Golf Course.  

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/dubai-billionaire-hussein-sajwani-ready-do-more-deals-trumps-n695566

Trump will give them a 5% discount too. Repubs won't complain either. 

 

[The Commish]

Has there been any explanation about why this happened?

Does there really need to be?  Seems pretty obvious at this point.  Good thing about this election cycle is at least they've stopped pretending in Washington.  That has to be exhausting until it becomes habit.

 

[NCCommish]

Just to be clear, is THIS now the latest Democrat outrage?  It's hard to keep up with you guys - you have a new one every 20 minutes.

Just to be clrar yoi arent outraged? Since when is attempting to keep Congress honest a partisan issue? You do remember why this office was created right? Things like congressmen with printed up menus of what donations bought you. And the complaint from the GOP is they have found to much corruption so shut it down. Yeah nothing to see here silly people.

 

[roadkill1292]

I guess one benefit of Trump's successful campaign is that it demonstrated that there's really no need to go through the motions of trying to look ethical and well-behaved.  If you're going to be a crook, just go all out.  I salute the House Republicans for at least being honest about their lack of attachment to public accountability.

Yeah, we're not gonna have to guess and insinuate any more. Their voters made it clear that they're ok with the ends justifying the means and, hey, if a few hundred congressmen get rich in the process, what are you gonna do?

 

[Skoo]

Pre-election: Hillary email story goes public

"Hillary is the MOST CORRUPT POLITICIAN OF ALL-TIME!"

"DRAIN THE SWAMP!!"

Post-election: - Independent ethics office dismantled -

::crickets::

 

[Sabertooth]

As am I. Too bad many citizens have a short attention span. This will haunt us for the rest of our lives. 

Yep.  A right leaning kangaroo court.  Great.  

 

[Sammy3469]

History does indeed repeat itself (from Jan 5, 2005):

House Republicans pushed through a significant change in the handling of ethics complaints over strong Democratic objections Tuesday as the 109th Congress convened with a burst of pomp and partisanship.

The House, on a vote of 220 to 195, enacted a change that would effectively dismiss a complaint in the event of a deadlock in the ethics committee, which is equally divided between Democrats and Republicans. Its approval came after a retreat by Republicans on Monday on other proposed ethics revisions.

At the heart of both actions were calculations about how far Republicans should go to protect the House majority leader, Representative Tom DeLay. Many party members were unhappy with the ethics committee for the three admonishments it delivered to Mr. DeLay last year.

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2005/01/05/politics/after-retreat-gop-changes-house-ethics-rule.html?_r=0&referer=

 

[Andy Dufresne]

Pre-election: Hillary email story goes public

"Hillary is the MOST CORRUPT POLITICIAN OF ALL-TIME!"

"DRAIN THE SWAMP!!"

Post-election: - Independent ethics office dismantled -

::crickets::

They voted on it yesterday. How fast are you expecting people to react? It's not even 6:30 AM on the Left Coast.

 

[NCCommish]

Actually they can put a slobbering right wing lunatic on the court and it's the same court it was. Kennedy is still the swing vote. That's not much solace but this idea that replacing Scalia with Scalia is the end times seems a little much. Now of course the stubborn wouldnt retire judges are the real problem. Holding power until the bitter end was their main concern so that leaves a precarious position. Their right to stay but they had a better chance of seeing someone appointed who would carry on their philosophy of they did it before it was a forced decision.

 

[Jeremy]

Seriously though, just feels like the voters getting what they deserve

 

We didn't hold them accountable for holding up the supreme court vacancy for almost a year, and some even threatened to continue that through Hillary's presidency had she won.  We didn't hold Trump accountable for his bigotry, sexism, Russian ties, Trump University, chronic lying, etc (soooo much etc).  For god sakes, he basically confessed to sexual assault! 

Conversely Democrats didn't show up to vote, even with Trump on the other side. 

It's no wonder Republican feel they can get away with this and the shenanigans in NC.  We've basically told them they can do whatever they want.  You give people that kind of power, we can hardly complain when they abuse it. 

 

[Steve Tasker]

Right, nothing to see here .

Seriously though, just feels like the voters getting what they deserve, another step towards kleptocracy. Of course it's easy for me to feel that way when I don't have to live there.

You hiring?  We could go to Petes games and Arkells concerts all the time.

 

[bigbottom]

The Swamp Protection Amendment of 2017.

 

[adonis]

The Republican House, in preparation for Donald Trumps arrival in Washington, has effectively voted to turn off its immune system.  

 

[Peyton Marino]

It's time to live our lives guys and let the politics go for a while. Do you all really get upset about this stuff? Because if this upsets you then I could show you a whole bunch of other stuff much of it historical fact that would make the hair on your neck stand up but hey never miss a chance to feel butt hurt because some politicians in Washington didn't call you to announce what they are doing. 

Some of you should run for office and make real change. 

ah

 

[Man in the yellow hat]

Walker and the state assembly have done their fair share of damage in the great state of Wisconsin, but, nothing I can think of that blantantly went against a code of ethics... or got rid of ethics. Morally reprehensible, in some manner, sure, but North Carolina takes the cake so far. Wisconsin is going to be red for the next decade or more. The northerners love to hate on Milwaukee and Madison even though those cities bring in the money to the state. 

The Northerner love to hate on Madison and Milwaukee alright. And it's the same reason Trump won. Until the left stops acting like the smartest people in the room and knows better than everyone else, people in Northern Wisconsin will continue to vote republican. You can't treat these people like they are uneducated idiots for years and expect a different result. Go spend time in that area and speak to them on their terms and you might have a chance. 

 

[sho nuff]

A few relevant excerpts:

In summary:

1) Once independent office now subject to authority of congressional committee.

2) Office categorically prohibited from acting on anonymous reports.

3) If the congressional committee directs the office to stop investigating something, it is required to stop, regardless of whether it believes continued investigation is justified.

4) The office is categorically prohibited from communicating with or releasing any information to the public.

5) The office is categorically prohibited from employing anyone whose role is to communicate with the public.

6) If the office's investigation reveals a violation of criminal law, they are prohibited from notifying law enforcement directly. Instead they are to report the crime to the congressional committee, and only communicate with law enforcement if given the approval to do so by the congressional committee. 

Wow...sounds a lot like the structure that allowed Catholic Priests to get away with things for so long.

 

[jon_mx]

Republican voters, at least. Their rationalization will be that this congress doesn't need its ethics overseen and that the office is probably full of liberals anyway, kinda like Snopes.

 Democrats nominated Hillary. Don't even try to play this as a GOP thing.  Both parties suck big time about caring about ethics. 

 

[shader]

This is shocking news.  If Congress doesn't watch out, they may begin to get very low approval ratings!

 

[bagger]

 Democrats nominated Hillary. Don't even try to play this as a GOP thing.  Both parties suck big time about caring about ethics. 

Agree, look this is not a left or right thing, this is keeping politicians as ethical as one can. Anyone defending this is a bit troubling. Even if "your side" erodes it, it is setting up the "other side" from abusing it as well when they inevitably come into more control.

 

[Koya]

 Democrats nominated Hillary. Don't even try to play this as a GOP thing.  Both parties suck big time about caring about ethics. 

Blaming Hillary time is over. This is the GOP, it's their mess and they (and those who support / vote for them) need to own it.

Accept the responsibility of governing and, in this case, it's 100% a GOP thing, they are the one's who are gutting their own oversight.

OWN IT PEOPLE.

You voted for this, own it. So tired of the cowardice of the right. If you have the right approach and the right policies, show it. Either way, own it. 

 

[jon_mx]

Blaming Hillary time is over. This is the GOP, it's their mess and they (and those who support / vote for them) need to own it.

Accept the responsibility of governing and, in this case, it's 100% a GOP thing, they are the one's who are gutting their own oversight.

OWN IT PEOPLE.

You voted for this, own it. So tired of the cowardice of the right. If you have the right approach and the right policies, show it. Either way, own it. 

This is why the people always lose.  Stop making it so damn partisan in your points.  The only purpose it serves is to divide and conquer honest people.  

 

[sho nuff]

Even Trump...sort of...came out against this (copied from 2 tweets)

“With all that Congress has to work on, do they really have to make the weakening of the Independent Ethics Watchdog, as unfair as it......may be, their number one act and priority. Focus on tax reform, healthcare and so many other things of far greater importance! #DTS

Of course he had to add the "as unfair as it may be"

 

[sho nuff]

This is why the people always lose.  Stop making it so damn partisan in your points.  The only purpose it serves is to divide and conquer honest people.  

Well..it shouldn't be a partisan thing...people on the right and left should be against this.

Though, it can factually be pointed out that this was a Republican vote...119-74.  74 people I respect their vote on this...too bad its secret and they won't likely ever release who the 119 were.

 

[Slapdash]

Seriously though, just feels like the voters getting what they deserve, another step towards kleptocracy. Of course it's easy for me to feel that way when I don't have to live there.

Exactly.  Hard to feel bad for these people who continuously vote against their self-interest

 

[avoiding injuries]

The Northerner love to hate on Madison and Milwaukee alright. And it's the same reason Trump won. Until the left stops acting like the smartest people in the room and knows better than everyone else, people in Northern Wisconsin will continue to vote republican. You can't treat these people like they are uneducated idiots for years and expect a different result. Go spend time in that area and speak to them on their terms and you might have a chance. 

It's not just people in northern Wisconsin, it's everyone who doesn't agree with them. 

 

[Joe Summer]

I bet Max wishes that he would have waited until Trump tweeted about it.

 

[Slapdash]

Even Trump...sort of...came out against this (copied from 2 tweets)

Of course he had to add the "as unfair as it may be"

Ethical standards are unfair to Trump

 

[adonis]

 Democrats nominated Hillary. Don't even try to play this as a GOP thing.  Both parties suck big time about caring about ethics. 

Blaming Hillary time is over. This is the GOP, it's their mess and they (and those who support / vote for them) need to own it.

Accept the responsibility of governing and, in this case, it's 100% a GOP thing, they are the one's who are gutting their own oversight.

OWN IT PEOPLE.

You voted for this, own it. So tired of the cowardice of the right. If you have the right approach and the right policies, show it. Either way, own it.

Blaming Hillary time is over. This is the GOP, it's their mess and they (and those who support / vote for them) need to own it.

Accept the responsibility of governing and, in this case, it's 100% a GOP thing, they are the one's who are gutting their own oversight.

OWN IT PEOPLE.

You voted for this, own it. So tired of the cowardice of the right. If you have the right approach and the right policies, show it. Either way, own it. 

This is why the people always lose.  Stop making it so damn partisan in your points.  The only purpose it serves is to divide and conquer honest people.  

I copied Koya's original post above, which was in response to your post where you pulled out the "Hillary was the democratic nominee, therefore anything Trump or Republicans do can't be opposed because of Hillary's flaws" response.

I'm not sure why you feel that Koya's comments were so partisan while yours were not.  It was a pretty typical knee-jerk, "But Hillary was corrupt too " response, which is a partisan response.

Things can be wrong on their own.  They don't just have to be wrong relative to what the other side is doing.  When you go down that road, it's a partisan one.

 

[jon_mx]

I copied Koya's original post above, which was in response to your post where you pulled out the "Hillary was the democratic nominee, therefore anything Trump or Republicans do can't be opposed because of Hillary's flaws" response.

I'm not sure why you feel that Koya's comments were so partisan while yours were not.  It was a pretty typical knee-jerk, "But Hillary was corrupt too " response, which is a partisan response.

Things can be wrong on their own.  They don't just have to be wrong relative to what the other side is doing.  When you go down that road, it's a partisan one.

Because you choose to ignore the post by Roadkill (which my comment was directed at) saying it was a GOP voter thing and implying the Democrats would never vote against ethics.  It is a crook of ####.  Pointing out both parties suck is not a partisan viewpoint.  Nice try though.  

I never defended this or said it was OK.  

 

[knowledge dropper]

Typical government.  The staff in the ethics office weren't acting independently and they are protected from removal, so just abolish or declaw the office. 

Elections do have consequences...,,,

 

[Arsenal of Doom]

Exactly.  Hard to feel bad for these people who continuously vote against their self-interest

The sad thing is how many will convince themselves into this being a good thing because some   on radio or TV says so. 

 

[massraider]

It's time to live our lives guys and let the politics go for a while. Do you all really get upset about this stuff? Because if this upsets you then I could show you a whole bunch of other stuff much of it historical fact that would make the hair on your neck stand up but hey never miss a chance to feel butt hurt because some politicians in Washington didn't call you to announce what they are doing. 

Some of you should run for office and make real change. 

You should be embarrassed and ashamed.