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Houston Texans 2013 In-season thread (1 Viewer)

Jason LaCanfora:

The Texans job should be the most attractive of all those that come available. I could see Chargers offensive coordinator Ken Whisenhunt emerging as the front-runner there in short order. Houston likes David Shaw from Stanford, but I would be shocked if he leaves the school, and I think Lovie Smith will end up as more of a fall-back option. If Tampa opens, there would be a lot of interest given all the talent on the roster, and if Atlanta opened -- I remain unconvinced a win over Buffalo in Toronto in Week 12 and three wins on the season prevent Mike Smith from being out -- it would trump all of the above. That's the only job I believe could still get Jon Gruden out of the booth if everything was right about it, including power and control of the roster.

From everything I am hearing about Texas A&M coach Kevin Sumlin's new extension with the school, he can't make the jump to the NFL this offseason. Baylor's Art Briles, if he wanted to, could jump to the pros pretty easily. I don't think he would consider anything other than a reunion with RG3 in Washington.
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Buckna said:
Just realized Peyton is probably going to break the TD record against us. He needs 6 more right now so you figure 3-4 in week 15 and then he can finish it out in our house in week 16. :confetti:

At least we got some short lived satisfaction to beat him and his Bronco's in Denver last year, a feat we never managed while he was in Indy.
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I still look at the Texans in disgust when Peyton was a FA and they didn't even attempt to sign him b/c Schaub was "their guy". I think they even locked Schaub down for another 4 years that off season. Oh wait, he didn't fit in here b/c Kubiak wouldn't relinquish play calling. Crazy to think what this team would've done with a decent QB.

 
I think the cap situation probably had a lot to do with it. Not even considering Peyton they already had to let Mario, Brisiel, Dreessen and others walk, cut Demeco, Winston, etc, because of cap issues

It's a lot easier to say Schaub is your guy at a cost of an extra $4m that year, versus having to release over $20m of players for Peyton and for the cap hit to cut Schaub. Money they also used to re-sign Arian Foster and Duane Brown if I remember correctly.

 
Greg Russell said:
I think the cap situation probably had a lot to do with it. Not even considering Peyton they already had to let Mario, Brisiel, Dreessen and others walk, cut Demeco, Winston, etc, because of cap issues

It's a lot easier to say Schaub is your guy at a cost of an extra $4m that year, versus having to release over $20m of players for Peyton and for the cap hit to cut Schaub. Money they also used to re-sign Arian Foster and Duane Brown if I remember correctly.
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but if you don't resign Schaub to that ridiculous contract and trade him, it seems like we would've have had room to sign Peyton. Who cares, poor management all around on this team. Unfortunately, I think this will be a rebuilding situation as players get older and others move elsewhere for better opportunities #smh

 
People need to let the Peyton thing go, Houston was never really in the running because of the cap. simply put he was too expensive at $20M per base salaries for the cash strapped Texans. With creative accounting he cost 18M against the cap in year one for the Broncos. Schaub with the extension was $11M and we were like a dollar under the cap. Where were you going to find an extra 7M plus the cap hit for cutting Schaub? You almost certainly would have had to let Foster, Brown & Cushing go plus make so more room.

Peyton did what every other smart FA has done with the Texans, said "oh the Texans are interested!" to drive up the price and then signed a better deal with another club.

 
Major said:
Greg Russell said:
I think the cap situation probably had a lot to do with it. Not even considering Peyton they already had to let Mario, Brisiel, Dreessen and others walk, cut Demeco, Winston, etc, because of cap issues

It's a lot easier to say Schaub is your guy at a cost of an extra $4m that year, versus having to release over $20m of players for Peyton and for the cap hit to cut Schaub. Money they also used to re-sign Arian Foster and Duane Brown if I remember correctly.
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but if you don't resign Schaub to that ridiculous contract and trade him, it seems like we would've have had room to sign Peyton. Who cares, poor management all around on this team. Unfortunately, I think this will be a rebuilding situation as players get older and others move elsewhere for better opportunities #smh
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My understanding is (edit to add:) pre-extension, Schaub had a 2012 cap figure of in the $7m range. Couldn't find the exact number as I'm not going to pay Spotrac for the access.

After the extension it was $11.7m, so keeping Schaub with extension was an extra $4m-ish in 2012 cap money.

Add Peyton with the contract he got in Denver, and he is an $18m cap hit and you release Schaub and have to also pay Schaub's cap hit which without knowing details other than signing and an option bonus, I'm guestimating in the $4m range but I could be off as I don't the structure fully. Going with that figure anyway, you June 1st designate him to spread it over 2 years, and you're looking at a $2m cap hit.

Actually, let me put it in terms of keep Schaub and let him play out his contract, or keep Schaub and extend him as was done, or sign Peyton and cut Schaub. Making the first option the baseline we can include savings for salary if Schaub is released.

Option 1: keep Schaub in 2012 and let him play out his contract is our baseline for 2012 cap space required.

Option 2: Keep Shaub and give the extension he got cost is an extra $4m-ish in cap room in 2012 which they were able to absorb.

Option 3: Sign Peyton to Denver's contract requires $18m of 2012 cap room. Releasing Schaub as a June 1 is a $2m cap hit but I'm guessing his salary was in the $3m range. So Schaub a net cap savings of $1m based on the best numbers I could find or guestimate.

So if you sign Peyton, you are looking at about $17m in cap room you have to come up with compared to the $4m or so they had to come up with for Schaub's extension. So the difference versus what was actually done is you need ballpark $13m more cap room to sign Peyton and release Schaub vs extending Schaub.

You could let Arian walk and that saves you $8m. Not re-signing Duane Brown saves you over $4m. So you could let both of those guys walk away from the team and afford Peyton.

 
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Rotoworld:

The Houston Chronicle's John McClain reports the Texans won't consider Mike Shanahan for their head-coaching vacancy if/when he's fired by the Redskins.

Shanahan has gone full George Costanza as he attempts to force his way out of Washington, but it apparently won't be to Houston. McClain has his finger on the pulse of the Texans like no one else in the media. According to McClain, candidates the Texans will consider are Lovie Smith, Stanford's David Shaw, Penn State's Bill O'Brien and Chargers OC Ken Whisenhunt. Shanahan's sour act — and perpetual losing — could mean his days as an NFL head man are through.

Related: Texans

Source: John McClain on Twitter
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i don't know the rules like you Greg but a trade hits the cap like that? Schaub was a valuable commodity back then. Never did I mention we cut him. Point being, if a guy like Peyton is available, you try like hell to sign him.

 
Major said:
i don't know the rules like you Greg but a trade hits the cap like that? Schaub was a valuable commodity back then. Never did I mention we cut him. Point being, if a guy like Peyton is available, you try like hell to sign him.
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Basically every dollar you pay a player has to hit your cap at some point. Doesn't matter if they are traded or cut or play out their contract. So if you cut or trade them, the money you already paid that hasn't hit your cap yet (signing bonus, other bonuses that are allowed to be prorated) has to hit your cap now.

If you trade them, you have no option, it just hits you soon as you make the trade.

If you release them, you have the option of it hitting the cap immediately, same as a trade... or it used to be that you could wait until after June 1 to cut them and then the cap hit is split so half hits this year and half the next year. They changed that recently and now you can just declare them a June 1 type release but you don't have to wait to release them. The players wanted the extra time for the player to find a new team so they kept the designation but got rid of the calendar requirement.

So trading would actually remove an option but have the same size hit. It would require the whole cap hit to fall in 2012, without the option to split it between 2012 and 2013. I agree they would try to trade him, what you might get in return is probably worth having to find the extra cap space if you're going that far.

 
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Major said:
thx Greg...so is everyone on board w/ Bridgewater?
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I would say no... he is a solid high floor prospect imo, but is the Bradford to Stafford territory of probable career outcome. Which is fine if you are going to build a really good team around him, and not want him to totally caring the load.

 
Major said:
i don't know the rules like you Greg but a trade hits the cap like that? Schaub was a valuable commodity back then. Never did I mention we cut him. Point being, if a guy like Peyton is available, you try like hell to sign him.
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Yeah, when we traded Demeco it actually hurt us that year because it accelerated his remaining bonus, which was going to be spread over a few years, all into the year that he was traded. But I still think trading him was a good long term move.

 
FF Ninja said:
Major said:
i don't know the rules like you Greg but a trade hits the cap like that? Schaub was a valuable commodity back then. Never did I mention we cut him. Point being, if a guy like Peyton is available, you try like hell to sign him.
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Yeah, when we traded Demeco it actually hurt us that year because it accelerated his remaining bonus, which was going to be spread over a few years, all into the year that he was traded. But I still think trading him was a good long term move.
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Man I dunno, I would really like to have Demeco right now with these crappy linebackers we have been trotting out.

 
jsharlan said:
TheFly06 said:
Major said:
thx Greg...so is everyone on board w/ Bridgewater?
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What if Cleveland offered us both if their 1st rounders? Say 8th and 24th overall?
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Only two first rounders? No way, it will take at least two firsts and two seconds for the first overall pick.
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Believe Cleveland currently has the 6 and 23. They're probably going 1-2 the rest of the way, so likely to end right around there.

It's too bad they won't know who's available until the picks come, but if I could script the Texans off-season, I'd sign Jay Cutler (UFA, will he be franchised or re-signed?) and draft Barr and Erving - or Matthews, OT if he falls to 6 and Shazier.

But I don't think Cleveland does it.

 
I was going to say, Jay Cutler might become available the way Josh McCown is playing.

Would love it if there was a Luck available, but all you can do is get the best player available in the year, so, yes, I'd be ok with Bridgewater. If the Texans find any of the stuff about Clowney's attitude is as reported, I could see him not being under consideration at all for their first round pick.

 
FF Ninja said:
Major said:
i don't know the rules like you Greg but a trade hits the cap like that? Schaub was a valuable commodity back then. Never did I mention we cut him. Point being, if a guy like Peyton is available, you try like hell to sign him.
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Yeah, when we traded Demeco it actually hurt us that year because it accelerated his remaining bonus, which was going to be spread over a few years, all into the year that he was traded. But I still think trading him was a good long term move.
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You are exactly right. They basically cut Winston to save cap dollars to make up for the cap hit from trading Demeco.

 
I know I mentioned Cutler, though really, I would rather draft a rookie. If you can get solid QB player from a drafted player, his salary is so much below what he's worth on the open market that it can really give you a lot of advantages for the first few years. Seattle and San Fran are able to afford so many good players in part because they are paying their QBs a fraction of what comparable QBs are getting.

 
Greg Russell said:
I know I mentioned Cutler, though really, I would rather draft a rookie. If you can get solid QB player from a drafted player, his salary is so much below what he's worth on the open market that it can really give you a lot of advantages for the first few years. Seattle and San Fran are able to afford so many good players in part because they are paying their QBs a fraction of what comparable QBs are getting.
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yep....we know what Cutler will give us, more headaches. Stay away.

 
Count me in with the group that does not want to see a Smith Cutler reunion.... That just feels like an extension of what just left. I would prefer an offensive coach who is great at adjustments to teach Bridgewater if we do indeed end up with the top pick. Getting that position right should be the highest priority of the organization and if they are going to take Bridgewater then Id prefer they just hire the absolute best guy to maximize his potential, not a defensive coach.

Fix QB once and for all then we can fix the rest

 
i can be on board with bridgewater, but now i'm wondering if we're better off taking clowney (or some are saying Barr?) as the BPA and banking on McCarron being available for pick #33. I guess the reason being is that while bridgewater is being considered a 'safe' pick, he's not necessarily a special player. If we're going to end up with an about average QB (which god knows is an improvement right now) i think McCarron will fit the bill just fine if not possibly better and we can have a better overall team by drafting BPA in round 1.

thoughts?

EDIT: and maybe spend a day 2 pick on some QB with natural talent as a bet-hedger/lottery ticket?

 
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I don't share your opinion that McCarron is a safe pick. The last decent QB out of Alabama was Ken Stabler. Think about that.

 
jsharlan said:
I don't share your opinion that McCarron is a safe pick. The last decent QB out of Alabama was Ken Stabler. Think about that.
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x2 although I wouldn't mind seeing his bird more often in the 713.

 
jsharlan said:
I don't share your opinion that McCarron is a safe pick. The last decent QB out of Alabama was Ken Stabler. Think about that.
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I don't know whether McCarron will be a safe pick, but I think he has pro potential in that he seems to play better as the spotlight gets bigger. And there haven't been many spotlights bigger than Alabama the last few years. I would much rather have someone with that on their resume than someone who has all the measurables in terms of physical size and speed, or threw for a gazillion yards and TD's against very weak competition.

 
McCarron is completely surrounded by NFL level talent, which at the college level translates into easy success. I would rather have a physically gifted player with a good mental scoring in interviews and mold him into a good NFL QB, vice an athletically limited player whose weaknesses will need to be schemed around(ie. another Schaub).

 
ragnarok628 said:
what if we take BPA round one and trade our 2nd rounder to Washington for Cousins? good idea?
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I was talking about just this with a coworker today. I think it depends on what we see from Cousins and what our scouts think of him. His game yesterday was a bit of a mixed bag. But taking Clowney round 1 and getting Cousins with the 2nd rounder sounds like a decent option.

 
jsharlan said:
ragnarok628 said:
what if we take BPA round one and trade our 2nd rounder to Washington for Cousins? good idea?
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I was talking about just this with a coworker today. I think it depends on what we see from Cousins and what our scouts think of him. His game yesterday was a bit of a mixed bag. But taking Clowney round 1 and getting Cousins with the 2nd rounder sounds like a decent option.
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IMO that would be an average move at best and a terrible move at worst. That's basically the Schaub route all over again. I think it's time we try and find our own quarterback on our own terms. I'm of the belief that teams just don't give up a good quarterback solely because "we can get a second rounder for him." A first rounder, sure; but having a good backup is something that you cannot put a real value on. That slogan of if you have two quarterbacks, you have none is total BS to me. The difference between the Bears and the Packers right now is the few games the Pack had horrible backup play from and that ultimately could cost them a playoff birth.

Any QB being shopped gives me cause to pause.

 
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WilsonTheVolleyball said:
jsharlan said:
ragnarok628 said:
what if we take BPA round one and trade our 2nd rounder to Washington for Cousins? good idea?
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I was talking about just this with a coworker today. I think it depends on what we see from Cousins and what our scouts think of him. His game yesterday was a bit of a mixed bag. But taking Clowney round 1 and getting Cousins with the 2nd rounder sounds like a decent option.
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IMO that would be an average move at best and a terrible move at worst. That's basically the Schaub route all over again. I think it's time we try and find our own quarterback on our own terms. I'm of the belief that teams just don't give up a good quarterback solely because "we can get a second rounder for him." A first rounder, sure; but having a good backup is something that you cannot put a real value on. That slogan of if you have two quarterbacks, you have none is total BS to me. The difference between the Bears and the Packers right now is the few games the Pack had horrible backup play from and that ultimately could cost them a playoff birth.

Any QB being shopped gives me cause to pause.
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The Schaub deal wasn't exactly a bad deal regardless of how bad he is today. He had some good seasons. Cousins is more mobile and has a stronger arm imo. It really depends on what type of offense we are running and who is coaching it. The first pick of the 2nd round might be the highest offer Washington would get.

 
No it wasn't that bad of a deal but he was never elite. Odds are you're never going to win big unless your quarterback is elite so Id rather take a shot rather than settle back into mediocrity. I almost hate that worse than totally sucking, because that at least brings about hope and change.

 
jsharlan said:
ragnarok628 said:
what if we take BPA round one and trade our 2nd rounder to Washington for Cousins? good idea?
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I was talking about just this with a coworker today. I think it depends on what we see from Cousins and what our scouts think of him. His game yesterday was a bit of a mixed bag. But taking Clowney round 1 and getting Cousins with the 2nd rounder sounds like a decent option.
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Schaub cost two 2nds. If we could get Cousins for one then I'd be down. His cheap salary would offset Schaub's dead money. Plus, then we could take Clowney.

 
WilsonTheVolleyball said:
jsharlan said:
ragnarok628 said:
what if we take BPA round one and trade our 2nd rounder to Washington for Cousins? good idea?
Click to expand...
I was talking about just this with a coworker today. I think it depends on what we see from Cousins and what our scouts think of him. His game yesterday was a bit of a mixed bag. But taking Clowney round 1 and getting Cousins with the 2nd rounder sounds like a decent option.
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IMO that would be an average move at best and a terrible move at worst. That's basically the Schaub route all over again. I think it's time we try and find our own quarterback on our own terms. I'm of the belief that teams just don't give up a good quarterback solely because "we can get a second rounder for him." A first rounder, sure; but having a good backup is something that you cannot put a real value on. That slogan of if you have two quarterbacks, you have none is total BS to me. The difference between the Bears and the Packers right now is the few games the Pack had horrible backup play from and that ultimately could cost them a playoff birth.

Any QB being shopped gives me cause to pause.
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well maybe i don't understand exactly what you mean by finding our own quarterback on our own terms, but it doesn't seem to me that there's any particularly good reason to not throw Cousins into the mix when deciding what to do at quarterback. I haven't seen all that much of Cousins but he seems pretty good, and we'll know more about him as an NFL quarterback than we will about anyone we might draft. Getting him from the Redskins vs. drafting someone is just as much 'finding our own quarterback on our own terms' as anything. As far as the reason behind him being shopped, it's not really so hard for me to believe the Redskins simply feel they don't really need him if they can get the right price in trade, as opposed to them seeing anything 'wrong' with him.

 
Would everyone be onboard with Bill O'Brien being the next head coach? Recent article below:

Penn State football coach Bill O'Brien's post-Christmas plans include an interview with the Houston Texans, according to an NFL.com report.

O'Brien, the former New England Patriots' offensive coordinator, is expected to be on the short list of candidates for a number of NFL teams in the event their head coaching position comes open.

The Houston Texans have a head coaching vacancy and Ian Rappaport of NFL.com is reporting O'Brien has agreed to interview with Houston.

O'Brien, who led PSU to a 7-5 mark in his second year on the job, was under consideration for some NFL openings last season before opting to return to PSU.

O'Brien signed a 5-year contract with Penn State when he was hired prior to the 2012 season and the 2014 season would be his third season with the Lions. His NFL buyout is expected to be $6.5 million.

Earlier this month, Jason LaCanfora of CBSsports.com reported that O'Brien was on the radar of the Texans and the Minnesota Vikings.

It has been reported that former Chicago Bears coach Lovie Smith has already interviewed for the Texans' job.

Penn State restructured O'Brien's contract approximately six months ago, considerably lowering O'Brien's NFL buyout.

Here is a link to Bill O'Brien's restructured contract.

 
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Id be fine with him. I posted in another thread that John Harris (1560 AM) played with him in college and is friends with him. It was Harris' take about a week and a half or so ago that he didnt think it would happen, but since then the possibility has seemed to gain steam. The buyout was thought to be a stumbling block for one. Harris also thought Happy Valley might be tough for him to leave, but recent rumblings might suggest maybe that's not such a big deal....

 
I really can't speak much to his X's and O's or the like. Don't really have anything against him as a choice, and respect what he's been able to do there.

Was hoping for David Shaw, but sounds like no chance of him coming to the NFL yet.

 
Houston turmOiler said:
No it wasn't that bad of a deal but he was never elite. Odds are you're never going to win big unless your quarterback is elite so Id rather take a shot rather than settle back into mediocrity. I almost hate that worse than totally sucking, because that at least brings about hope and change.
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The Ravens won last year with Flacco.

 
Tool said:
Houston turmOiler said:
No it wasn't that bad of a deal but he was never elite. Odds are you're never going to win big unless your quarterback is elite so Id rather take a shot rather than settle back into mediocrity. I almost hate that worse than totally sucking, because that at least brings about hope and change.
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The Ravens won last year with Flacco.
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And you could argue that Flacco played at an elite level......find us a guy capable of performing like he did last year and Im all in, no matter how you classify him
 
Bob McNair on being close to hiring Bill O'Brien: "The process continues. We have other interviews scheduled next week. It isn't over."

ESPN reporting Texans negotiating with Bill O'Brien and could be close to hiring him. He and Lovie Smith have been top candidates.

per Pancakes mcclain on Twitter

 
Obrien would be a home run hire. But I'd take clowney and find a qb another way. Like a 2 and a 5 for Ben...

 
I'm told this could get done by the end of the week. Now I'm also told there have been no contract discussions to date and that to think it could get done early this week might be a bit premature. But when we speak to people around the league there seems to be widespread consensus that it is hard to image that Bill O'Brien doesn't wind up going to Houston and becoming the next head coach of the Houston Texans.

Here's a man who cut his teeth in the NFL, knows the NFL, has a creative mind, would bring a lot of energy and excitement to the Houston offense and the organization. He looks the be the guy that the Texans organization is dialed into getting and focused into getting and eventually, when we speak to people around the NFL, they believe that Houston will get its man."

Adam S. ESPN

 
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