squistion
Footballguy
I don't buy those numbers. I don't know who did the study or methodology involved but 21% seems out of whack to me.
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In honor of pride month, let’s get real (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter pinkham13
- Start date
I don't buy those numbers. I don't know who did the study or methodology involved but 21% seems out of whack to me.
pinkham13
Footballguy
Oooh wow you got me. So in your world there is no Pride month going on and it’s just a conspiracy theory invented by racist QANONs. LOL you guys crack me up.
Amused to Death
Footballguy
Gen Z is people who are currently 10-25. I'd imagine there are a lot of young adults who are still figuring out who they are.
BladeRunner
Footballguy
Then I expect to see you in the 1/6 and Trump threads saying the same thing, because it's still happening.
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Amused to Death
Footballguy
I stay out of the "Trump is Great" thread. I don't recall seeing it in the 1/6 threads though.
General Malaise
Footballguy
While I do champion the idea of equality for all, I'm not sure I'm always saying that on this website. Maybe you can show me where I'm always saying this?
Can you list the bunch of groups that are excluded from my view of equality? I'm not sure I'm following this line of logic.
Lastly, I wouldn't care if you or Stealthy Cat wanted to form a grass roots movement to get your own month for heterosexuals. I really wouldn't. I do like Black History Month because it calls attention to issues, movements and historical incidents I might not have otherwise known about. I used February to read "Across that Bridge" by John Lewis, which was fabulous. Year prior I read Michelle Obama's book in February. I discover new music, watch documentaries (if you haven't watched "Summer of Soul" you should - it's fantastic) and listen to podcasts about Black History. So I like it. I should also try and do the same during Pride month but other than watching gay porn on the hubs, I haven't really picked up any books.
General Malaise
Footballguy
zoonation
Footballguy
Zow
Footballguy
No way. Cam Smith is a legend.
General Malaise
Footballguy
No, this is Pride month. It's just not on EVERY TV show, commercial, social media post, etc as you and that author suggest. The way you two spin it, it's just overwhelming you and man, that must be tough. Sorry you're going through that right now.
General Malaise
Footballguy
zoonation
Footballguy
Herb
Footballguy
sho nuff
Footballguy
Why do the heterosexuals need a holiday to celebrate always being accepted?
the point of pride is celebrating being treated more equally and being able to be themselves without being shunned.
Seems there is still more work to be done there.
BladeRunner
Footballguy
Okay, if you're trying to do a technical gotcha' by saying, "It's not on EVERY media outlet" then you're probably right. I'm sure we can find at least one where it isn't being whored out for virtues. You got'eem!! Good job.
However, I literally cannot turn a channel (of the channels I watch) on my TV without seeing it which is what his point was, I think.
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matttyl
Footballguy
I’m not at all advocating judgement, scorn, ridicule or violence. Honestly trying to learn more. You’re on the “fluid” side of my options, so thank you for your answer. So is this, in your eyes, more feelings based, or more of a something they would have a choice/control over?
Im straight, have always been. Had a gay uncle, who has passed. He was always gay, knew from a very young age. The idea of changing or being fluid is a bit foreign to me.
General Malaise
Footballguy
But what if I liked Cam Smith thrusting this Pride in my face? What if it felt really good to me? How could something that feels sooooooooooooooooo good be unhealthy for me?
General Malaise
Footballguy
General Malaise
Footballguy
Me too, but now that sexy hunk Cam Smith is getting me to feel different feelings.....
Zow
Footballguy
Stealthycat
Footballguy
promote / increase / bolster ........ that's not equal/fair that's asking for special IMO
I know, its not woke or PC ... its just how I see it is all
BladeRunner
Footballguy
matttyl
Footballguy
While true, the study didn’t question individuals younger than 18 about their sexuality. Possible legal reasons?
https://www.ipsos.com/sites/default/files/LGBT Pride 2021 Global Survey Report - US Version.pdf
reading the “methodology” at bottom, they asked 18-70s in US and a few other countries, 16-70s in other countries.
Here is the Gallup study (the 21% study) just in US. You’ll notice they say “gen Z” as born between 2003 and 1997 (making the youngest 18 when study was done last year).
https://news.gallup.com/poll/389792/lgbt-identification-ticks-up.aspx?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=newsletter_axiospm&stream=top
Zow
Footballguy
BladeRunner
Footballguy
Stealthycat
Footballguy
matttyl
Footballguy
Just posted two studies above. Please look. I find those numbers extraordinarily high, as I guess you do as well saying they are “out of whack”. Maybe we agree on something.
Stealthycat
Footballguy
I could dive down that path but won't - different thread maybe ?
I remember people like Sheryl Swoopes and Buck Angel and others who tell it like it is ... and what they have to say is pushed under the rug and ignored
Stealthycat
Footballguy
oh I think its rational/logic to be proud of race/ethnicity/heritage absolutely
but American first, and I think its damaging to split this country into 1000 different little sub groups all trying to scream loudly in promotion/bolstering/growing/recruiting etc
again - my view on it all
Amused to Death
Footballguy
Thanks. I'm never sure what ages are what "gens" ( wasn't even sure what group I'm in - turns out its 'X'). I did a quick search and a site I opened defined 'Z' as born between '97 & '12.
But still by your definition Gen Z seems to be right in the wheelhouse where young adults may be struggling to know who they are and find themselves with mixed signals.
General Malaise
Footballguy
squistion
Footballguy
Yes we do.
As I have said repeatedly in several threads, the percentages of LGBT+ folks in the population should be the same as it has always been, because one's sexual orientation (or whatever term you prefer) is something that for just about everyone is hard wired, meaning there is no conscious choice or decision that they made.
And that is the reason those who claim it is a choice are never able to give me an answer when I ask for the date that they chose their own sexuality.
matttyl
Footballguy
21% chance you self identify as LGBTQ then. I kid, I kid.
It’s not my definition, it’s the accepted one (which you found), they just I assume couldn’t ask individuals younger than 18 (or 16) about their orientation/preferences. I would image the number would increase if they included even younger folks, as the numbers went down as age increased to other generations.
So I guess from your answer you would call more into camp #3 of my options above. 21% of gen Z believes they are LGTBQ, when in fact that may not be (rather only a smaller percentage actually is). What do you think is causing these “mixed signals”? Personally, I don’t recall having any mixed signals (at 18 I was a college senior and at that point had many prior hetero relationships, and found happiness in them). If at 18 this high of a percentage of people are still having mixed signals, should we increase the legal age to marry?
sho nuff
Footballguy
Religion of treating people with respect?
Yes…I want me kids to be inclusive and treat people well.
What are you getting at with this?
sho nuff
Footballguy
matttyl
Footballguy
squistion
Footballguy
No, I don't believe so, although a small number of people claim to have switched teams (to use a sports metaphor) although I am really skeptical of that just as I am usually skeptical of guys who claim to be bisexual (or now the trendier pansexual).
Doug B
Footballguy
Desert_Power
Footballguy
This issue is really animating folks on the right more than anything I've seen in some time. Even libertarian-leaning folks. Part of that is there is an entire cottage industry dedicated to posting out-of-context stories about LGBTQ+ folks to inspire fear and hatred. Another part is that all of the non-Trump politicians on the right are using this hard as a wedge.
Either way it is inspiring a ton of nastiness around this forum. Many personal attacks and unexcellent posts. Baffling this is allowed, but my ignore list is growing very quickly.
Desert_Power
Footballguy
Who was it, maybe scoobygang, that had the signature of "I became gay all of the sudden!". Prime LABS would absolutely have a heyday with all of the insecurities folks are expressing in these parts.
matttyl
Footballguy
Another thought popped in my head rereading your post here. Why do we see such varied results (in the first study I linked) country to country? Wouldn’t all these kids be going through the same “mixed signals” from nature, or do you mean “mixed signals” from their environment. That may be what the author in this OP was getting at, though horribly and with a very bigoted outlook on life.
Why is the self reported LGBTQ population in the US twice that (by rate) twice that if Italy, or Japan or Russia? That goes completely against it being nature over nurture.
matttyl
Footballguy
So, to finally go full circle back to my question above, I think you’d answer #3 then. You definitely aren’t 2 (you don’t think it’s fluid), and you think 21% is high so you aren’t #1. So unless there is something else at play, 21%of gen Z believes they are LGBTQ when they in fact aren’t. Again, in a horrible way, that’s what the author was getting at. It can have negative consequences, and even be dangerous, to believe you are LGBTQ when in fact you aren’t.
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Mookie
Footballguy
I wasn't being accusatory at all - just trying to answer your question. I too am straight and have been happily married for almost 30 years. I too had a gay uncle who married a woman in the 1960s and discovered his gayness in the late 1970s, divorced, and moved to California. he died of AIDS in 1990.
I believe that many people have always had these "feelings" that they are somehow different or would like to explore different gender roles and sexuality than what the Bible tells us. Some people, like your uncle, know they are gay from a young age, and for some, like my uncle, that realization or "feeling" is repressed, or less strong, and isn't acted upon until later in life. Some may be content being bisexual and for some, they are more comfortable identifying as another gender, or "we" or "they", or whatever. It is WAAAAY beyond my limited frame of reference, but my general view is that people deserve to be happy, and everyone has a right to be left alone, so long as they aren't hurting anyone.
(HULK)
(Smash)
When you consider that homosexuality isn't a choice as part of your frame of reference, I don't see any problem with celebrating our differences.
And if you want to argue that it is a choice, then I ask you, are you choosing to be heterosexual? I'm hetero, and it wasn't a choice... so if it is a choice for you, maybe you're actually gay and just suppressing your urges for various reasons?
IvanKaramazov
Footballguy
I think this marks the first time I've seen somebody on this forum play the "during Pride month" card unironically.
(HULK)
(Smash)
Every day is straight people day. Nothing wrong with giving some harmless cheers to those who don't benefit from being the norm in our society.
Desert_Power
Footballguy
It's a good question. I think most LGBTQ+ advocate types would say the actual numbers would be relatively similar across countries, but cultural stigma has a big role to play in how somebody publicly identifies. Those countries you listed I would view as higher on the scale of "masculine" or traditional cultures.
There is also the consideration that folks in our country could be over-identifying due to general angst and confusion we all had at times as teens. Or are just in an experimentation phase. Trying to figure out where they really fit in (which I would argue is a lifetime journey) and are hesitant to put themselves in the same cisgendered straight box as their parents.
Insomniac
Footballguy
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