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Is this forum still an Anti Trump Echo Chamber (Was: just a liberal echo chamber?) (4 Viewers)
- Thread starter spider321
- Start date
Dickies
Footballguy
Not all Trump supporters are these things, but the majority of racists and Nazis are Trump supporters
Gopher State
Footballguy
This forum is really made up of very high middle class dudes who hated Hillary and now they turned their hate to Trump.
SinbadTheSailor
Footballguy
I think most rational folks dislike Trump. It has nothing to do with being liberal, just takes being a person who keeps up with the news and has reasonable judgment.
if that’s what goes for “liberal” these days, man, conservatives are really in trouble.
if that’s what goes for “liberal” these days, man, conservatives are really in trouble.
squistion
Footballguy
https://wonkette.com/630408/mona-charen-probably-would-have-gotten-a-better-reception-at-cpac-if-she-were-an-actual-naziSaintsInDome2006 said:
Mona Charen Probably Would Have Gotten A Better Reception At CPAC If She Were An Actual Nazi
[...]
Charen was booed aggressively, by people who very likely would have considered it a horrible violation of the First Amendment if someone like Charles Murray or Milo Yiannopoulos were booed. By people attending a function where the far-right Marion Maréchal-Le Pen was speaking. As Charen points out…
It is also worth noting that Actual Nazi Sebastian Gorka got a very warm response at CPAC.
Charen also had to be escorted off the premises by security guards, for her safety.
[...]
cobalt_27
Footballguy
And, they are in a lot of trouble. If true conservatives--rational, cerebral, thoughtful conservatives--don't find their stones soon, the party will be permanently hijacked by this crew.
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
This is really what I was getting at. Mona Charen is a serious, undoubtable conservative. I deleted my post at KD, he obviously didn't want to engage the point and I don't want to be confrontational. I think this is just another example of where discussing when it reaches a crux like this is really hard to do for anyone supporting Trump. You can either flush out some very ugly ideas or simply defend the man because that's who you follow.
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
I agree with kd here (seriously). I think it's important to distinguish between being a racist, bigot, misogynist and/or sexual predator and merely supporting a president who is all of those things.
It is insult enough to accurately describe a Trump supporter as the latter, no reason to stretch the truth by describing them as the former.
Don't Noonan
Footballguy
Actually Tim, it just isn't worth it to post in here very much. Your response is part of the problem. "They repeat falsehoods over and over and when confronted with the truth" Please, that may be the case sometimes but it happens all the time with the lefty loons in here as well.
When I do visit this forum it is for enjoyment of reading the crazyness this forum has become. I do enjoy reading your posts though as you post your thoughts clearly and I don't see you attacking conservatives like many in here do.
knowledge dropper
Footballguy
Sorry I didn’t respond immediately and triggered everyone. A guy can’t even go to the dentist for a couple of hours?
Mona has always been tightly wound. Bashing the President with man-Hater rhetoric on his home turf was not a good idea.
The entire political realm is toxic these days.
SinbadTheSailor
Footballguy
It’s certainly toxic to those who support sexual assaulters who also have a dismal history with respect for women.
mcintyre1
Footballguy
I'd really like to talk about this part, because I want to take you at your word that you truly believe this. I think we should also reach a common understanding of what people really mean when they call someone/something "Nazi" -- not that they are literally a National Socialist, but that they are among a group of white supremacists/white nationalists. I think this is a fair interpretation, given the popularity of Nazi imagery among said groups.
I really think this is a blind spot in your view of the world, based on wanting to not associate yourself with this type of person. We are all guilty of these blindspots in various ways, so that isn't a knock on you specifically. The simple fact is that Trump's words and actions (and the words and actions of those he associates with) have emboldened this type of person, and combined with the power of the Internet, they are becoming more unified than than they have in quite some time.
A poll done shortly after Charlottesville showed that 9% of the population believes that "holding neo-Nazi or white supremacist views is acceptable" -- obviously that does not mean that 22 million people in America are Nazis, but it does show that there are a lot of people willing to abide Nazis (and frankly, I don't see how you can abide such a person without at least somewhat agreeing with their point of view).
Then there are groups like Atomwaffen, which was profiled by ProPublica recently after they were provided with the secret discord/chat logs of the group. That group has been implicated in 5 murders over the last few years, and has a social media presence that actively talks about genocide of non-whites. In their private conversations, they advocate for violent conflict with the government to bring about a white ethno-state. And these are not old men, the leader is in his mid 20's.
You can also see the troubling emergence of young white men being drawn in to these groups in many other ways. 4chan is very influential among a certain demographic of young white males, and it is no secret that white supremacist language and imagery is common in that venue. Many claim it is "ironic" or not to be taken seriously, but there have been enough profiles of young white men transforming into white supremacists for us to understand that this is part of a recruitment strategy by those among the very far right. They "normalize" the behavior, make personal connections, and then convince people to join the movement.
If you're a Reddit user, you've almost certainly encountered this as well. For example, several of the moderators of /r/The_Donald also moderate openly racist or extreme right wing subreddits, often existing with innocuous names like "/r/uncensorednews" and "/r/metacanada." These subreddits will contain mostly "normal" content, but will be sprinkled with occasional extreme right content. Their goal is to normalize the beliefs into acceptability.
This is something that I've been watching warily for a few years now, and it not isolated to America. All across Europe, extreme right parties are gaining in power. Merkel is being challenged by a young white man from her own party that comes from the more radical right wing of it (Merkel's party is nominally conservative, though mostly considered "centrist"). Marine Le Pen in France and Nigel Farage in England both espouse views that could be classified as "white nationalist" at the very least. Openly identified fascists and clashing in the streets with anti-fascists in Italy before their election. And a common thread among all of this is behind the scenes support from Russia. Russia sees itself as a "last bastion" of Christianity, conservatism, and Western civilization, and actively assists groups in other nations that espouse similar views.
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
Understood, thanks for the response.
But do you see my point about a situation where a conservative called out Trump and his supporters and the response was let's say less than polite?
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SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
There's zero reason - I mean reason as in like actual thinking logic - for people who consider themselves conservative to get angry to the point of needing security at a political conference because another conservative criticizes the president.
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Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
If you look at elections there has not been 3 different people of the same party elected in a row since the 1920's. It shows that neither party is well liked enough to sustain a dynasty.
James Daulton
Footballguy
Eh, let's be real, who among us hasn't chanted "blood and soil" and "jews will not replace us" while carrying torches with our fellow brothers of European ancestry on a few occasions?
Harmless right?
Steve Tasker
Footballguy
The Football Freak
Footballguy
Here’s the answer @spider321
You’ll see a lot of words and impassioned posts, but here’s the answer I think you, and all Trump supporters still left, should see. Ivan is not on the left, btw. Neither are a lot of the people bashing Trump for being a rotten President, and a truly awful person.
You should have considered that a long time ago. I will never take you seriously because you are a troll and a whiner. 90% of your replies are a laughing smilie. Because you know you don't have a serious response or because someone has backed you into a corner. I engage thoughtful Trump supporters every day. You don't even make an attempt at sounding thoughtful;. Not sure if it's because you lack the intelligence or that you are seriously only here to troll. My guess it's a combination of the two. So you're right, you should probably stop engaging me. Until you actually attempt to have a thoughtful discussion, I will just mock you for trolling.
(I saved you the time of posting your only response)When you won an election by losing the popular vote by 3 million, you aren't going to push away a single person who will vote for you.
Courtjester
The Town Drunk
Well this went well....
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
"I don't know why people say the Falcons choked. Look at this link summarizing their playoff history dated February 4, 2017!"
Ramblin Wreck
Footballguy
Yet you respond to 90% of my posts. What does that say about you?Congratulations. What does that have to do with me?
You of all people questioning someone's intelligence. Good lord that's hilarious. At least you admit you're here to troll, genius. You aren't the brightest bulb around. There's plenty of conversations I'll attempt to discuss seriously but as soon as the trolling name calling nonsense starts I'm out. You and your ilk can claim that's whatever you want it to be if you want but I'm not sure you have the brain cells to determine what a thoughtful discussion is in the first place. 90% of your replies here are to me, HT, KD, or others you disagree with.
For example, you still don't understand the irrelevancy of the popular vote. When the election is based on the electoral college, many people sit out and vote because their state is predetermined already. If it were a popular vote election that might not be the case. So no one knows what the result would be if the rules were different. But keep chanting 3 million votes in your wife beater and telling everyone how intelligent you are.
You did get a thoughtful "I wonder what the Easter Bunny thinks about it." post in a few days ago. That took a ton of brain cells I'm sure. Well done.
Reg Lllama of Brixton
Footballguy
jonessed
Footballguy
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
Only if you read "ever" into his statement instead of "currently" or "genuinely," i.e "Trump doesn't ever seem to denounce those groups" vs "Trump doesn't currently/genuinely denounce those groups."
Just pointing out Hawkeye was wrong.
In other words, only if you were looking to start a pedantic argument instead of acknowledging the larger truth that Trump doesn't seem to mind the fact that bigoted, violent hate groups love him.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
That's good. He should denounce them all the time, especially when addressing the nation.
jonessed
Footballguy
I don’t see why there is a need to read anything into Hawkeye’s statement. It’s pretty clear as it is.
jonessed
Footballguy
Why? If you didn’t believe him last summer I don’t see why you would believe him now.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
I'll question your intelligence day in and day out. Unless you're holding back, you've never shown an ounce of it around here. But at least I encouraged you to engage. So this conversation was a positive. I hope you decide to learn from it. You're on the right path.
Congratulations. What does that have to do with me?
At least you admit you're here to troll, genius. You aren't the brightest bulb around. There's plenty of conversations I'll attempt to discuss seriously but as soon as the trolling name calling nonsense starts I'm out. You and your ilk can claim that's whatever you want it to be if you want but I'm not sure you have the brain cells to determine what a thoughtful discussion is in the first place. 90% of your replies here are to me, HT, KD, or others you disagree with.
For example, you still don't understand the irrelevancy of the popular vote. When the election is based on the electoral college, many people sit out and vote because their state is predetermined already. If it were a popular vote election that might not be the case. So no one knows what the result would be if the rules were different. But keep chanting 3 million votes in your wife beater and telling everyone how intelligent you are.
You did get a thoughtful "I wonder what the Easter Bunny thinks about it." post in a few days ago. That took a ton of brain cells I'm sure. Well done.
jonessed
Footballguy
It was the first link I found searching under, “Trump denounce KKK”. It wasn’t exactly hard to find.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
I'm sure it wasn't but I haven't been looking for examples of him denouncing it. It's hard for me to not think of him addressing people and saying there are fine people on both sides. Very poorly done on his part.
AAABatteries
Footballguy
I'll question your intelligence day in and day out. Unless you're holding back, you've never shown an ounce of it around here. But at least I encouraged you to engage. So this conversation was a positive. I hope you decide to learn from it. You're on the right path.
AAABatteries
Footballguy
knowledge dropper
Footballguy
knowledge dropper
Footballguy
knowledge dropper
Footballguy
Intimidated. LOL LOL. You could support Trump and still speak out when he does things that are racist or nazi-like. Yet I've never once seen you do it. Or anyone else here who is a trump supporter. When I see that, I will stop lumping you in with the racists and the Nazis.
Gr00vus
Footballguy
Dedfin
Footballguy
Thanks for being a fresh troll. We usually have to tolerate the same ones day after day.
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