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Jerry Sandusky accused of child molestation (2 Viewers)

There are a lot of statues of sports figures around this country
Is this true? I can't really think of any I know.
:shrug: Off the top of my head I know of three stadiums within an hour of you that have at least one
Hmm, I have no idea what they are.
Nats have a few, I know one is Josh GibsonRavens have a big Unitas and I'm sure Ray-Ray will be there the day he hangs em upOrioles have a few... Brooks Robinson and Cal off the top of my head..I really couldn't say if there are any at FedEx Field though, or anywhere else around here
 
I was very naive about the power Joe Pa held up there, and the extent of the reverence as well. Many of us were I think.
I don't think so at all. I those of us who were calling for Paterno's head from the beginning had a pretty good idea of what happened there. I think it was primarily the Penn State fans/alumni and the Paterno defenders who wanted to bury their heads in the sand on this.
I didn't say all of us were, but thanks for another dose of self-righteousnessYou #######s were right but you've said a lot of terrible things to a lot of good people in this thread and for that you can go #### yourselves.
:confused: I don't recall saying anything terrible to anyone in this thread. :shrug:
Fair enough, but I'm not sure what your point was here, clearly many of us had the wrong idea this whole time about Joe Paterno's role in the cover-up, for various reasons. Otherwise this thread would have been a lot shorter.
 
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There's a Babe Ruth statue at Camden, too.
Outside of Staples Center in Los Angeles there are statues of Magic Johnson, Jerry West, Wayne Gretzky, Oscar De La Hoya, and Chick Hearn. Still though, the statue of a coach on a college campus is a little bit different.
Some sports figures have certainly been more revered than others, but I don't think their job or the location of the statue has a whole lot to do with itJoe Paterno is clearly a very exceptional figure in society, and his flock (I'm really trying to avoid hyperbole here) are clearly having trouble separating. I wonder how things would be different if he'd been alive and well for all of this. Probably not much, save for even more BS coming from that side..
 
What's striking to me about the Penn State students' reaction is their uniformity. Supposed this story happened at UCLA involving John Wooden? (One of the few college coaches perhaps revered even more than Paterno has been). While there would be lots of UCLA students vigorously defending Wooden, there would also be just as many excoriating him. Probably fist fights and riots would break out between the two sides; that has happened before at UCLA. And at Berkeley. And other California campuses. The students are rarely if ever unified.

Perhaps the East coast has a different culture?

 
What's striking to me about the Penn State students' reaction is their uniformity. Supposed this story happened at UCLA involving John Wooden? (One of the few college coaches perhaps revered even more than Paterno has been). While there would be lots of UCLA students vigorously defending Wooden, there would also be just as many excoriating him. Probably fist fights and riots would break out between the two sides; that has happened before at UCLA. And at Berkeley. And other California campuses. The students are rarely if ever unified.Perhaps the East coast has a different culture?
Perhaps Penn State has a different cultureJesus
 
There are a lot of statues of sports figures around this country
Is this true? I can't really think of any I know.
:shrug: Off the top of my head I know of three stadiums within an hour of you that have at least one
Hmm, I have no idea what they are.
PNC Park in PIttsburgh has them, pretty sure Clemente and StargellNats park as mentioned.I recall Camden Yards having a bunch. I think there's a damn steinbrenner statue in Yankee stadium somewhere.
 
What's striking to me about the Penn State students' reaction is their uniformity. Supposed this story happened at UCLA involving John Wooden? (One of the few college coaches perhaps revered even more than Paterno has been). While there would be lots of UCLA students vigorously defending Wooden, there would also be just as many excoriating him. Probably fist fights and riots would break out between the two sides; that has happened before at UCLA. And at Berkeley. And other California campuses. The students are rarely if ever unified.Perhaps the East coast has a different culture?
Perhaps Penn State has a different cultureJesus
Dude's a visionary.
 
Good God, after catching up with this thread is Christo really defending Paterno here? Holy hell dude.
No he is not. Trying to frame a narrative to make the horrible things Paterno did and did not do that is different from the simplistic one that dominates this thread in order to try to make sense of it is not defending, excusing, making light, diminishing, etc. Paterno's role.All Christo said was that he believed Paterno was "in denial" that Sandusky was molesting kids. There is no evidence in the Freeh report or anywhere else that contradicts this. Paterno doesn't need to know (or care) what Sandusky did at any point to be the puppet master that orchestrated these "distractions" be brushed aside and to look the other way at potential future instances so he could do his job with the football program. And if this version is true (or partially true) it doesn't reform Paterno's image in any way. The exact character flaw(s) that lead to allowing this awful scenario playing out is really irrelevant.
 
A report on ESPN says the trustees have decided that the statue stays up for now. It looks like they are afraid to upset alumni (read donors) who adore the coach. One trustee is even quoted as saying "the statue represents the good that Joe did. It doesn't represent the bad he did".
This won't end well if they keep going down this path.
Proceeding methodically is a poor path at this time? Seems that rushing to move on is what got them into this mess.
They're going to need to guard it 24/7.
Having someone deface it or tear it down would make life easier for them.
 
I was very naive about the power Joe Pa held up there, and the extent of the reverence as well. Many of us were I think.
I don't think so at all. I those of us who were calling for Paterno's head from the beginning had a pretty good idea of what happened there. I think it was primarily the Penn State fans/alumni and the Paterno defenders who wanted to bury their heads in the sand on this.
I didn't say all of us were, but thanks for another dose of self-righteousnessYou #######s were right but you've said a lot of terrible things to a lot of good people in this thread and for that you can go #### yourselves.
:confused: I don't recall saying anything terrible to anyone in this thread. :shrug:
Fair enough, but I'm not sure what your point was here, clearly many of us had the wrong idea this whole time about Joe Paterno's role in the cover-up, for various reasons. Otherwise this thread would have been a lot shorter.
I guess the point is that many Penn State folks saw only what they wanted to see.Reminds me of someone...

 
The trustees have picked up right where Paterno, Spanier, Schultz and Curley left off when it comes to lack of leadership. Thinking the alumni will offer a wake up call seems unlikely as I would have to imagine the most powerful alumni are the ones saying don't even think about disrupting my Saturday football games.

While a monster like Sandusky is obviously an outlier don't the same dynamics still exist at PSU today that allowed him to operate with impunity for over a decade?
In my honest opinion, no. The issue was (and still is in terms of memories and memorials) one man: Joe Paterno. I hesitate to bring this up because it seems like a cop out, although I did say it here back in Nov, either in this thread or another. Paterno was way too powerful. Football is big at Penn State but Paterno was bigger. He WAS football at Penn State. Bill O'Brien is the guy Tom Brady yelled at on the sideline. He's not powerful at all. And I think it's reasonable to assume that the replacement AD, VP of Campus Police and President are not as morally corrupt as their predecessors. The memory of Joe is what a lot of alumni, and by extension, the BOT, is trying to protect. I don't think they are trying to protect the "football coach bigger than the President" situation. Even the mouth breathers you see on Facebook are smarter than that.
 
I was very naive about the power Joe Pa held up there, and the extent of the reverence as well. Many of us were I think.
I don't think so at all. I those of us who were calling for Paterno's head from the beginning had a pretty good idea of what happened there. I think it was primarily the Penn State fans/alumni and the Paterno defenders who wanted to bury their heads in the sand on this.
I didn't say all of us were, but thanks for another dose of self-righteousnessYou #######s were right but you've said a lot of terrible things to a lot of good people in this thread and for that you can go #### yourselves.
:goodposting:
 
The trustees have picked up right where Paterno, Spanier, Schultz and Curley left off when it comes to lack of leadership. Thinking the alumni will offer a wake up call seems unlikely as I would have to imagine the most powerful alumni are the ones saying don't even think about disrupting my Saturday football games.

While a monster like Sandusky is obviously an outlier don't the same dynamics still exist at PSU today that allowed him to operate with impunity for over a decade?
In my honest opinion, no. The issue was (and still is in terms of memories and memorials) one man: Joe Paterno. I hesitate to bring this up because it seems like a cop out, although I did say it here back in Nov, either in this thread or another. Paterno was way too powerful. Football is big at Penn State but Paterno was bigger. He WAS football at Penn State. Bill O'Brien is the guy Tom Brady yelled at on the sideline. He's not powerful at all. And I think it's reasonable to assume that the replacement AD, VP of Campus Police and President are not as morally corrupt as their predecessors. The memory of Joe is what a lot of alumni, and by extension, the BOT, is trying to protect. I don't think they are trying to protect the "football coach bigger than the President" situation. Even the mouth breathers you see on Facebook are smarter than that.
It's pretty mind boggling to think that a football coach was so easily able to get the president of a major university - a man who devoted his entire life to education, not to mention getting to the position he was in at that time - to absolutely incriminate himself just to protect the freedom of a child rapist/psychopath.Just unbelievable, really.

 
The trustees have picked up right where Paterno, Spanier, Schultz and Curley left off when it comes to lack of leadership. Thinking the alumni will offer a wake up call seems unlikely as I would have to imagine the most powerful alumni are the ones saying don't even think about disrupting my Saturday football games.

While a monster like Sandusky is obviously an outlier don't the same dynamics still exist at PSU today that allowed him to operate with impunity for over a decade?
In my honest opinion, no. The issue was (and still is in terms of memories and memorials) one man: Joe Paterno. I hesitate to bring this up because it seems like a cop out, although I did say it here back in Nov, either in this thread or another. Paterno was way too powerful. Football is big at Penn State but Paterno was bigger. He WAS football at Penn State. Bill O'Brien is the guy Tom Brady yelled at on the sideline. He's not powerful at all. And I think it's reasonable to assume that the replacement AD, VP of Campus Police and President are not as morally corrupt as their predecessors. The memory of Joe is what a lot of alumni, and by extension, the BOT, is trying to protect. I don't think they are trying to protect the "football coach bigger than the President" situation. Even the mouth breathers you see on Facebook are smarter than that.
It's pretty mind boggling to think that a football coach was so easily able to get the president of a major university - a man who devoted his entire life to education, not to mention getting to the position he was in at that time - to absolutely incriminate himself just to protect the freedom of a child rapist/psychopath.Just unbelievable, really.
Hard to believe any of them went along with it. They had to know someone would talk. There were multiple victims here, sooner or later it would all come out.

 
The trustees have picked up right where Paterno, Spanier, Schultz and Curley left off when it comes to lack of leadership. Thinking the alumni will offer a wake up call seems unlikely as I would have to imagine the most powerful alumni are the ones saying don't even think about disrupting my Saturday football games.

While a monster like Sandusky is obviously an outlier don't the same dynamics still exist at PSU today that allowed him to operate with impunity for over a decade?
In my honest opinion, no. The issue was (and still is in terms of memories and memorials) one man: Joe Paterno. I hesitate to bring this up because it seems like a cop out, although I did say it here back in Nov, either in this thread or another. Paterno was way too powerful. Football is big at Penn State but Paterno was bigger. He WAS football at Penn State. Bill O'Brien is the guy Tom Brady yelled at on the sideline. He's not powerful at all. And I think it's reasonable to assume that the replacement AD, VP of Campus Police and President are not as morally corrupt as their predecessors. The memory of Joe is what a lot of alumni, and by extension, the BOT, is trying to protect. I don't think they are trying to protect the "football coach bigger than the President" situation. Even the mouth breathers you see on Facebook are smarter than that.
It's pretty mind boggling to think that a football coach was so easily able to get the president of a major university - a man who devoted his entire life to education, not to mention getting to the position he was in at that time - to absolutely incriminate himself just to protect the freedom of a child rapist/psychopath.Just unbelievable, really.
Yeah it really is. And remember, Spanier was very, very well thought of among his colleagues. Really as one of the best University Presidents in the country. He was at Nebraska before coming to Penn State. And although there is more than enough blame to go around, it's hard for me to not blame Spanier more than Paterno. Yes Paterno was more powerful but it was Spanier's job to lay down the law. That was his job. Add in the fact that Spanier didn't have the "excuse" of closeness to Sandusky that might have made Paterno a little doubtful of the continued actions of Sandusky and I think you have the man that even more than Paterno should have stopped this in 2001: Graham Spanier. Hell, if you lose the political battle than quit the job. That would have been a huge red flag for a president so highly regarded to suddenly quit. If and buts....

 
The trustees have picked up right where Paterno, Spanier, Schultz and Curley left off when it comes to lack of leadership. Thinking the alumni will offer a wake up call seems unlikely as I would have to imagine the most powerful alumni are the ones saying don't even think about disrupting my Saturday football games.

While a monster like Sandusky is obviously an outlier don't the same dynamics still exist at PSU today that allowed him to operate with impunity for over a decade?
In my honest opinion, no. The issue was (and still is in terms of memories and memorials) one man: Joe Paterno. I hesitate to bring this up because it seems like a cop out, although I did say it here back in Nov, either in this thread or another. Paterno was way too powerful. Football is big at Penn State but Paterno was bigger. He WAS football at Penn State. Bill O'Brien is the guy Tom Brady yelled at on the sideline. He's not powerful at all. And I think it's reasonable to assume that the replacement AD, VP of Campus Police and President are not as morally corrupt as their predecessors. The memory of Joe is what a lot of alumni, and by extension, the BOT, is trying to protect. I don't think they are trying to protect the "football coach bigger than the President" situation. Even the mouth breathers you see on Facebook are smarter than that.
It's pretty mind boggling to think that a football coach was so easily able to get the president of a major university - a man who devoted his entire life to education, not to mention getting to the position he was in at that time - to absolutely incriminate himself just to protect the freedom of a child rapist/psychopath.Just unbelievable, really.
Hard to believe any of them went along with it. They had to know someone would talk. There were multiple victims here, sooner or later it would all come out.
And that's what made it so hard to believe. I know people like to blame the PSU fans/Alumni for having their "head in the sand" but really it's almost illogical that so many, highly regarded people could let this skate. Not just Paterno. Spanier was very highly regarded. Curley was as well. And most fans were rooting for McQueary and thought he did an excellent job as an assistant. So it may be more fun to say we were all idiots last November. But the truth is that it was so illogical to do what they did that it defied belief.
 
Put an agent on campus who gives Curtis Enis $1,000 and President Spanier won't tolerate that and will aggressively ensure the agent is prosecuted. Tell him the defensive coordinator is raping little kids in the football facilities and he'll cover it up. Great guy. Can't believe anyone doesn't think this isn't a football issue.

 
The trustees have picked up right where Paterno, Spanier, Schultz and Curley left off when it comes to lack of leadership. Thinking the alumni will offer a wake up call seems unlikely as I would have to imagine the most powerful alumni are the ones saying don't even think about disrupting my Saturday football games.

While a monster like Sandusky is obviously an outlier don't the same dynamics still exist at PSU today that allowed him to operate with impunity for over a decade?
In my honest opinion, no. The issue was (and still is in terms of memories and memorials) one man: Joe Paterno. I hesitate to bring this up because it seems like a cop out, although I did say it here back in Nov, either in this thread or another. Paterno was way too powerful. Football is big at Penn State but Paterno was bigger. He WAS football at Penn State. Bill O'Brien is the guy Tom Brady yelled at on the sideline. He's not powerful at all. And I think it's reasonable to assume that the replacement AD, VP of Campus Police and President are not as morally corrupt as their predecessors. The memory of Joe is what a lot of alumni, and by extension, the BOT, is trying to protect. I don't think they are trying to protect the "football coach bigger than the President" situation. Even the mouth breathers you see on Facebook are smarter than that.
It's pretty mind boggling to think that a football coach was so easily able to get the president of a major university - a man who devoted his entire life to education, not to mention getting to the position he was in at that time - to absolutely incriminate himself just to protect the freedom of a child rapist/psychopath.Just unbelievable, really.
Hard to believe any of them went along with it. They had to know someone would talk. There were multiple victims here, sooner or later it would all come out.
And that's what made it so hard to believe. I know people like to blame the PSU fans/Alumni for having their "head in the sand" but really it's almost illogical that so many, highly regarded people could let this skate. Not just Paterno. Spanier was very highly regarded. Curley was as well. And most fans were rooting for McQueary and thought he did an excellent job as an assistant. So it may be more fun to say we were all idiots last November. But the truth is that it was so illogical to do what they did that it defied belief.
...is the root of all evil toooooday.
 
Put an agent on campus who gives Curtis Enis $1,000 and President Spanier won't tolerate that and will aggressively ensure the agent is prosecuted. Tell him the defensive coordinator is raping little kids in the football facilities and he'll cover it up. Great guy. Can't believe anyone doesn't think this isn't a football issue.
I don't think your logic here is sound. Those are both football issues. The fact that Spanier went after Nalley so hard but didn't do anything about Sandusky makes the case that the issue was with the person (Spanier, therefore Paterno) and not the whole program.
 
And that's what made it so hard to believe. I know people like to blame the PSU fans/Alumni for having their "head in the sand" but really it's almost illogical that so many, highly regarded people could let this skate. Not just Paterno. Spanier was very highly regarded. Curley was as well. And most fans were rooting for McQueary and thought he did an excellent job as an assistant. So it may be more fun to say we were all idiots last November. But the truth is that it was so illogical to do what they did that it defied belief.
Yep. I swear I'm a pretty cynical person but man, I really didn't want to think this was how it went down.All Spanier had to do was go to the DPW. That's it. There really wasn't even that much at stake - there's no question it would have all been long forgotten by now.
 
The memory of Joe is what a lot of alumni, and by extension, the BOT, is trying to protect. I don't think they are trying to protect the "football coach bigger than the President" situation.
Then they somehow still don't get it.The memory of Joe doesn't deserve to be protected.

 
And that's what made it so hard to believe. I know people like to blame the PSU fans/Alumni for having their "head in the sand" but really it's almost illogical that so many, highly regarded people could let this skate. Not just Paterno. Spanier was very highly regarded. Curley was as well. And most fans were rooting for McQueary and thought he did an excellent job as an assistant. So it may be more fun to say we were all idiots last November. But the truth is that it was so illogical to do what they did that it defied belief.
Which is why the "denial" argument is the really the only one that makes any sense at all. They let this skate because they didn't believe it was happening.
 
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There are a lot of statues of sports figures around this country
Is this true? I can't really think of any I know.
The Carolina Panthers have a statue of Sam Mills at their stadium.
This has to be the lamest statue ever.
Any statue of you would be a bronzed pile of poo.
What are you? 4? Am I supposed to respond with "your mom" or something?
 
And that's what made it so hard to believe. I know people like to blame the PSU fans/Alumni for having their "head in the sand" but really it's almost illogical that so many, highly regarded people could let this skate. Not just Paterno. Spanier was very highly regarded. Curley was as well. And most fans were rooting for McQueary and thought he did an excellent job as an assistant. So it may be more fun to say we were all idiots last November. But the truth is that it was so illogical to do what they did that it defied belief.
Why is that hard to believe? This hardly was the first time a large institution enabled a pedophile.It's not "fun to say" you were all idiots last November. It's sad.
 
The memory of Joe is what a lot of alumni, and by extension, the BOT, is trying to protect. I don't think they are trying to protect the "football coach bigger than the President" situation.
Then they somehow still don't get it.The memory of Joe doesn't deserve to be protected.
Yeah, something is not computing for these people. They seem incapable of fully processing what happened. There is no, "yeah, but..." about this.
 
How many college coaches have ever received the reverence of Joe Paterno? What I mean is, respected in their communities not only as great coaches, but also as great men? I can only think of three:John WoodenBear BryantTom OsbornePerhaps there are others, but they're not coming to mind for me right now.
Bo
 
Put an agent on campus who gives Curtis Enis $1,000 and President Spanier won't tolerate that and will aggressively ensure the agent is prosecuted. Tell him the defensive coordinator is raping little kids in the football facilities and he'll cover it up. Great guy. Can't believe anyone doesn't think this isn't a football issue.
I don't think your logic here is sound. Those are both football issues. The fact that Spanier went after Nalley so hard but didn't do anything about Sandusky makes the case that the issue was with the person (Spanier, therefore Paterno) and not the whole program.
Wasted breath GB.
 
There are a lot of statues of sports figures around this country
Is this true? I can't really think of any I know.
The Carolina Panthers have a statue of Sam Mills at their stadium.
This has to be the lamest statue ever.
Any statue of you would be a bronzed pile of poo.
What are you? 4?
No, I'm someone who thinks you aren't a nice person, Capella.
 
The memory of Joe is what a lot of alumni, and by extension, the BOT, is trying to protect. I don't think they are trying to protect the "football coach bigger than the President" situation.
Then they somehow still don't get it.The memory of Joe doesn't deserve to be protected.
Yeah, something is not computing for these people. They seem incapable of fully processing what happened. There is no, "yeah, but..." about this.
Yup. Would these people also like to remember the good things that Cardinal Law did, when he wasn't busy rotating pedophile priests around the different parishes? If not, I'd love for someone to explain what the difference is.
 
Those of you who are claiming this cover-up was all about money are in denial as well

It is way worse than that

There was very little money or permanent damage at risk if the university discovers a child molester in their midst and does the right thing about it. A little egg on the face, public apologies, possibly some financial settlements with a few families which would really be a drop in the bucket.

 
Those of you who are claiming this cover-up was all about money are in denial as wellIt is way worse than thatThere was very little money or permanent damage at risk if the university discovers a child molester in their midst and does the right thing about it. A little egg on the face, public apologies, possibly some financial settlements with a few families which would really be a drop in the bucket.
At least part of the motivation was protecting Sandusky, someone they considered a friend and former colleague, not a monster. One of the emails talked about how not going to the authorities was the most "humane" approach. They didn't want to destroy this guy's life.
 
The memory of Joe is what a lot of alumni, and by extension, the BOT, is trying to protect. I don't think they are trying to protect the "football coach bigger than the President" situation.
Then they somehow still don't get it.The memory of Joe doesn't deserve to be protected.
Oh I agree. I'm just saying that's what is happening. I think they'll make better decisions once things calm down. Remember they were absolutely blitzed by Alumni when they fired Joe because it was too soon and they got swept up in emotion. In retrospect they certainly made the right call but they would actually be pretty dumb to make another rash decision right away. Give it a couple of weeks. The problem they have is that football season is fast approaching. They would be much better off if it was February.
 
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