Todem
Footballguy
No. It’s parent driven and there are a lot of BS travel teams out there. It has become a puppy mill business.
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Kids travel sports - unreasonable request? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Max Power
- Start date
Chaz McNulty
Footballguy
You should definitely bail. You might even be able to catch on to another team that's in your daughter's age bracket.
Next year you should put your daughter in at a level where she is likely to be on the top half of the team in terms of talent. Is your daughter fairly tall, and what is her preferred position? If she is a Right Side (power), then you need to find out if the team she is trying out for already has an elite player at that position. It's up to you to put her in the best position to grow, excel, and have fun.
My kids played softball and volleyball. I will say, that I loved travel tournaments. Nothing can replace those road trips with my daughters. But in saying that, I knew my kids were going to get a majority of reps in the tournaments. I never understood the parents that had their kids playing in Rep A just to sit on the bench. There is nothing wrong with playing Rep B, getting a lot of reps, and being a more central part of the team. And as many have said, nothing can replace game experience for growth.
Next year you should put your daughter in at a level where she is likely to be on the top half of the team in terms of talent. Is your daughter fairly tall, and what is her preferred position? If she is a Right Side (power), then you need to find out if the team she is trying out for already has an elite player at that position. It's up to you to put her in the best position to grow, excel, and have fun.
My kids played softball and volleyball. I will say, that I loved travel tournaments. Nothing can replace those road trips with my daughters. But in saying that, I knew my kids were going to get a majority of reps in the tournaments. I never understood the parents that had their kids playing in Rep A just to sit on the bench. There is nothing wrong with playing Rep B, getting a lot of reps, and being a more central part of the team. And as many have said, nothing can replace game experience for growth.
SpurrierisisGod
Footballguy
Coaches have to get paid and they get paid to train your child. You should have to pay something. The benefit really is in the training. But.....
No way I'd pay full price knowing my kid will never get in a game AND have to do the grunt work at the tournaments. I wouldn't make that as a requirement as a coach either.
If this wasn't communicated at tryouts or when being invited to join the team, I would ask for a refund and go somewhere else.
On the other hand, if it was communicated and you still handed over a check, you'll never get that money back. Not saying that's the case but someone mentioned it earlier... you are helping lower the costs for the players that actually play. "Paying your dues like little Suzy did".
Soccer tournaments now cost $700+. That's roughly $50 per player. 4 tournaments is $200 each. Coaches make about 2-300 per player. Add in insurance, facilities/equipment, club fees etc etc. It really has become negative return in a lot of cases.
If i could go back, I'd save my money for private lessons and ID camps. And I coach (well, gave it up this fall for a lot of the gripes mentioned here).
Side question...
Are club volleyball coaches required to be licensed? From what I know, soccer is the only one that requires licenses.
No way I'd pay full price knowing my kid will never get in a game AND have to do the grunt work at the tournaments. I wouldn't make that as a requirement as a coach either.
If this wasn't communicated at tryouts or when being invited to join the team, I would ask for a refund and go somewhere else.
On the other hand, if it was communicated and you still handed over a check, you'll never get that money back. Not saying that's the case but someone mentioned it earlier... you are helping lower the costs for the players that actually play. "Paying your dues like little Suzy did".
Soccer tournaments now cost $700+. That's roughly $50 per player. 4 tournaments is $200 each. Coaches make about 2-300 per player. Add in insurance, facilities/equipment, club fees etc etc. It really has become negative return in a lot of cases.
If i could go back, I'd save my money for private lessons and ID camps. And I coach (well, gave it up this fall for a lot of the gripes mentioned here).
Side question...
Are club volleyball coaches required to be licensed? From what I know, soccer is the only one that requires licenses.
Terminalxylem
Footballguy
Not a parent, so this is a new concept. Sounds ridiculous.
For the uninitiated, what is the advantage of playing travel sports, and how much do they cost?
elguapo07
Footballguy
Guaranteed that your kid will get a free ride to college if not go pro.
elguapo07
Footballguy
A coworker of mine had a daughter in gymnastics from age 5 thru high school. Told me he easily spent 5k+ per year on training plus travel to competitions. Goal was to get a scholarship to an SEC school. She’s currently on a roster on a D3 school.
The dream they sell to some parents is ridiculous.
The dream they sell to some parents is ridiculous.
Todem
Footballguy
No offense but this is actually an ignorant post.
Let me give some background and context here first.
1. It’s true that travel sports is a massive business, puppy mill like and that’s across all sports, baseball, football, soccer, softball, basketball, hockey, gymnastics, lacrosse, swimming etc etc.
2. Most kids will quit their sport or sports after age 12
3. Those that continue typically have enough talent to make their high school teams
4. Of the 100% of high school athletes in the country 6-9% depending on their sport will make it to college athletics.
This girl is elite. She was in the top 8% of female high school gymnasts in this country.
Yes her goal was D1 but she made it to the college level, probably got a very nice academic scholarship package covering at least 50-75% of her tuition at this D3, she competes, continues doing what she loves and is getting an education.
If she works hard she can potentially transfer to a D2 or even D1 if she is truly good enough. If not so what. She still accomplished what only 8% of high school female gymnasts were able to do…..compete at the collegiate level.
Parents are absolutely delusional….but some get it….and prepare their student athletes properly by setting proper expectations.
Yes unfortunately there are programs, coaches and trainers who sell pipe dreams to kids who truly don’t have the talent to move onto college athletics.
But these parents I am sure had some idea at some point in her high school career she was probably not going D1 out of the gate.
Also some student athletes choose on their own to bypass D1 for D2 or D3 because the campus was a better fit, the coach and teammates were a better fit and most importantly (athletically speaking) they knew they would play vs riding pine for years.
These parents helped get their daughter to college athletics by investing in her ability.
I see clearly in her case it paid off….she is competing at the collegiate level.
Mission accomplished.
When I was coaching baseball for a decade I had realistic discussions with my players parents all the time about the do’s and don’ts of travel baseball, high school baseball and ultimately pursuing a college career. It is a highly competitive and overwhelming process and even more so than talent (all talent being fairly equal save for the physical freaks) the work ethic and self motivation and discipline required to compete at the college level is the difference.
Whatever coaches this girl had….they probably did a good job.
She made it. Obviously the parents and her hoped for D1 but that is extremely difficult in the big picture. And a lot of the times it’s not all it’s drummed up to be.
5K a year sounds about right….and I bet you the memories she has of all the competitions, tournaments and friends she made will last her the rest of her life…..that 65K invested helped shape this girls work ethic, compete level and learning to be a team player.
Invaluable life lessons that will carry her on the rest of her life.
It was not money burned at all by the looks of it….and that academic money she is getting over 4 years probably breaks them even on the 65K over 13 years.
The other side of it and to your point…..92-93% of travel athletes will not get to college and that’s also on the parents too. They need to really take the blinders off and see what college athletes look like, and how good they really are and look at their kid and say….is he or she going to be that good? Do they want it that bad?
Yeah they are being sold…..but they need to also do some due diligence on their kids ability in comparison to what elite athletes look like on the field, diamond, court, rink etc
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elguapo07
Footballguy
None taken. Don’t have a skin in the game just basing my opinion off my friends and coworkers kids all of whom played traveled teams if their kid showed signs of being a decent athlete.
I still think playing town league and having weekends available to hang out with friends and famiy and perhaps even to get a part in time job gets you to about the same place when the kid graduates graduates college - well adjusted and ready to enter a competitive and ever changing workforce.
Just about all my buddies whose kids played travel teams have buyers remorse, antidotal but still. Parents with the means have always done everything they can t give their kids a perceived advantage to get into colleges. Call me ignorant or old fashioned but still think the best way to get into colleges is via academics.
I still think playing town league and having weekends available to hang out with friends and famiy and perhaps even to get a part in time job gets you to about the same place when the kid graduates graduates college - well adjusted and ready to enter a competitive and ever changing workforce.
Just about all my buddies whose kids played travel teams have buyers remorse, antidotal but still. Parents with the means have always done everything they can t give their kids a perceived advantage to get into colleges. Call me ignorant or old fashioned but still think the best way to get into colleges is via academics.
CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
I think the popular image of a sports parent expecting their kid to get a D1 scholarship is overstated. Yes parents like that exist, but most are realistic enough to understand reality. Every club has a webpage that shows university commitments and it’s easy to understand the odds. I’ve never seen a club that tries to sell parents on the myth of youth sports leading to scholarships. Of course those very few kids who play in college have typically come up through a top youth club. Most parents just want to give their kids some good experiences and be able to share in those experiences while they are still at home. There’s also great benefits in a kid being exposed to a higher level of physical activity , hard work, pressure and goal-setting than they will get through their school teams.
El Floppo
Footballguy
Travel sports, in theory, are about playing at the highest level. You're playing with the best kids in your area against the best kids from around the state/region/country/world. Bottom line, That's a great thing for any athlete; no better way to grow than to challenge yourself with and against the best.
If your goal as a kid or parent is to just run around and have fun- there's rec leagues in town set up for that, or the kid can just go run around with their friends.
All about the goals for both the kid and the parent.
The business and expense built around the travel sports is awful. Understandable to a degree as others have posted here... But still awful. It starts separating young athletes into haves and have nots,rather than just by talent and ability
The expectations of far too many parents, and by proxy their kids... Also awful. Less than 10% are going to play competitive college sports. IME, far, far more than 10% approach their kids sports as if it's either a ticket into college or even a scholarship.
My 13yo daughter plays tennis. Talk about an extreme of haves and have nots. You have to pay any time you even step into a court (here in NYC), let alone take lessons or classes. She's as good as my paycheck allows and plays in area tournaments doing ok. I would say 80-90% of the parents I chat with at these or at her classes have an expectation that tennis will help get their kid into college or get a scholarship. My daughter from the giddy up had a goal to get better, try to start winning tournaments, and play in HS. If she got good enough to get college interest, great. But thats not her current goal.
Fantasy_Freak
Footballguy
In my daughters experience each game had one paid referee, the rest were players from other teams. So their is the main referee on a stand (paid referee), opposite of him at net is a player, judges on the lines are players, book is covered by players and a player covers rotation.
Max Power
Footballguy
We're in a little over $500 before the first game.
$25 registration fee just to try out
$350 Team dues - coaching
$150ish - 2x unforms and a monogramed team backpack.
There will be tournament and game fees throughout the season.
Spoke with the wife about it last night and we're leaning towards just letting our daughter practice with the team and skipping events that don't work for us.
dgreen
Footballguy
My daughter's volleyball club had a $5000 fee. (Fortunately for us, the club director offered us a deal to join for $1000 because they needed someone at her position and we didn't do club because of the cost.) She'd play in 6-7 multi-day tournaments that required travel and hotels. One tournament required a flight. They'd play about 4-5 one-day tournaments that were all within about an hour of us so no significant costs to those. The team would also require the players purchase uniforms and a team backpack. IIRC, that was a few hundred, but they did let you carry it over year to year rather than buy new ones each year.
Here in the DC area, the cheapest club I found was about $2500. They'd travel to probably 3 tournaments and play in a few local one-day tournaments. And then there were a couple of the top clubs that I think were over $10,000. They probably didn't play in more tournaments than my daughter's club, but they were more likely go to more that required flights. Those clubs regularly send girls to D1 schools and easily qualified for the national championships each year. Very, very few from the cheapest clubs are going to play at any level of college. My daughter's teams had a handful of girls go to D2 or D3 schools with an occasional lower-end D1 program.
Outside of the potential scholarships for some of them, the advantage of playing is the level of competition. House/rec youth leagues just don't provide any type of quality of play. For example, in volleyball, a rec league team is just trying to get the ball over the net. Some teams might try to make a good pass so they can try a set and then attempt to actually hit it, but it often doesn't work. So, if you like a sport, you can go the club/travel route to find good competition.
There really appears to be a lack of anything in the middle ground, at least for volleyball near me.
Ron Swanson
Footballguy
Lot's of great comments here from knowledgeable people, but this statement stands out to me. This "vibe" may just be parent gossip. Ask the coach directly whether practice team players who don't travel have a reduced chance of getting called up.
dickey moe
Fingerpicker
That is absolutely insane.
dgreen
Footballguy
They may have been hiding it well, but I got the sense that these prices weren't a big deal to most of the families. I went to a few of their houses and they appear to be doing really well. But, of course, these are clearly prices that make it really hard for a lot of people.
Our friend's daughter played for this club and they really needed someone who could play middle. They told the club that our daughter would be a good fit, but we don't do club because of the cost. They said they'd be willing to work something out if she came to a practice for a tryout and they liked her. She did well at the tryout and the coach came to talk to me. He said he liked her game and that he was going to suggest to the director to work with us on the cost. He then said to me, "I grew up on the free-and-reduced lunch program, so I know what it's like." I looked at him a bit confused and replied, "Oh, that's not us. Our kids aren't on the free-and-reduced lunch program." There's a world of people in between those living in poverty and those who are cool with dropping $5,000 on something like this.
What a thing to say to someone. These people are nuts.
El Floppo
Footballguy
Exactly.
Tennis is insane... And you're not even paying for competition- just classes and lessons which run well over that 5k. I've watched kids equivalent with my daughter 2 years ago who's parents could afford to do weekly lessons, 3x classes, tennis camps all summer and spring, and regular tournaments... Things I can't do. No surprise, those kids have all gotten much better than my daughter- despite being athletically weaker.
I've chosen to pony up a little more this year to support her goal of making the HS team next year. But I still can't match that. Sucks as a parent, tbh.
I'll assume this is the case across all sports- with talented, athletic less wealthy kids not able to progress the same as those with the resources.
dgreen
Footballguy
Yeah, it definitely surprised me at the time. I think he was probably just led to believe that was the situation. The club is a 501c3 so they do also receive donations and provide scholarships to people based on income. There were a couple girls who I assume were in that situation.
I ended up really liking that coach, despite that first impression. He was the best coach my daughter had in her three years there. We even played together in an adult volleyball league.
dgreen
Footballguy
Yeah, I definitely felt a bit of failure as a parent because I just couldn't give her what other parents gave their kids. In the back of mind, I knew it was ok, but it still sucked. It was nice that she would always comment on how insane the culture was, so it's not like she was disappointed that we didn't do more. But, still, as a parent it sucks to not be able to give them more.
Thorn
Footballguy
I remember when I was a kid, I wanted to go to sleepover camp for baseball. I don't know how expensive it was, but I'm sure it was more than we could afford. When I asked my dad, he said "look, if you work pretty hard, you have the talent to be a bench player on your varsity HS team, but probably not until junior or senior year. So no, we're not paying extra for what you can learn at home doing fundamental drills."
PS he was right
PS he was right
My kid loves baseball and asked to play on a travel team this year. I doubt this response would be approved by parenting gurus, but I basically told him he's fortunate to have a dad who can and will spend whatever he wants in the future to support you in this endeavor, but you have to show me you are willing to work hard enough to make the rec league all star team first (he has enough talent to do it, but not so much that he can roll out of bed and be one of the best players). We'll see if it works as a motivational tactic or if it becomes a chapter in his book about how he was mistreated by his parents in his youth.
Fat Nick
Footballguy
This kind of thing just reaffirms how happy I am that my son chose not to play travel. He's a very good natural athlete - especially with throwing/catching sports. He has zero practice or work ethic though. He's been asked to play travel baseball and basketball by his coaches, and could probably play on our local youth football team too. He's pretty dominant in a rec flag league we have -certainly on his team. He doesn't want to play travel because he doesn't want to basically give up every weekend during a given season. I'm very thankful for that, and so are my wife and daughter.
My neighbor's daughter plays travel softball - they are literally gone every weekend during the summer. So much so that they bought an RV so they could stop worrying about hotels, etc. Their poor son who doesn't play travel just gets dragged along with them and I can't help but imagine he's bored out of his mind. Meanwhile, my son gets to play local rec sports, and we can still go on vacation, go to the beach, boating, etc. when we want to during the summer.
Honestly, competitive youth sports has gotten to the point where some good athletes are going to be "priced" out of playing - either via money or via time commitment. I'm not saying it's not for anyone - lots of kids love it, and for some, I think it's potentially a pathway to college or higher, but for a lot of kids, there is more to life than 100% devotion to a sport. Just my $0.02.
My neighbor's daughter plays travel softball - they are literally gone every weekend during the summer. So much so that they bought an RV so they could stop worrying about hotels, etc. Their poor son who doesn't play travel just gets dragged along with them and I can't help but imagine he's bored out of his mind. Meanwhile, my son gets to play local rec sports, and we can still go on vacation, go to the beach, boating, etc. when we want to during the summer.
Honestly, competitive youth sports has gotten to the point where some good athletes are going to be "priced" out of playing - either via money or via time commitment. I'm not saying it's not for anyone - lots of kids love it, and for some, I think it's potentially a pathway to college or higher, but for a lot of kids, there is more to life than 100% devotion to a sport. Just my $0.02.
DocHolliday
Footballguy
V ball is my daughters favorite sport. My wife and I coach v ball at the school and my wife coaches my daughters club v ball. I get my chaperone cert every year so I can help coach at the club. I hear so many horror stories about club v ball and feel bad for parents and kids that end up wasting time and money while having a bad experience. Parents need to research clubs and choose the club team that works for them.
My daughter has become a good player and has been requested to join more expensive national teams which would require a lot more travel. If there was a chance she could play at a D1 school that might make sense. Realistically, she is a D3 or D2 player. We chose a club that will challenge her with great competition but travel is limited to about a 4 hour radius and usually only has two weekend long tournaments. Most tournaments are one day but we usually leave around 5 am and get home between 5 and 9 pm. It’s long days but a lot volleyball is played and the experience is so valuable. That is how you get better.
At our club, every player is expected to play at least a little every game. There is no way I would have my daughter on a team where she didn’t play. That goes against the whole point of the extra club season and that extra experience. I can tell pretty quickly which players are on club teams when watching school teams.
Do your daughter a favor and choose a club where she plays.
My daughter has become a good player and has been requested to join more expensive national teams which would require a lot more travel. If there was a chance she could play at a D1 school that might make sense. Realistically, she is a D3 or D2 player. We chose a club that will challenge her with great competition but travel is limited to about a 4 hour radius and usually only has two weekend long tournaments. Most tournaments are one day but we usually leave around 5 am and get home between 5 and 9 pm. It’s long days but a lot volleyball is played and the experience is so valuable. That is how you get better.
At our club, every player is expected to play at least a little every game. There is no way I would have my daughter on a team where she didn’t play. That goes against the whole point of the extra club season and that extra experience. I can tell pretty quickly which players are on club teams when watching school teams.
Do your daughter a favor and choose a club where she plays.
Grace Under Pressure
Footballguy
That's some serious BS. Join the team and not play? Wow.
Dear Penthouse...
Todem
Footballguy
Great academics paid off for my son who plays college baseball in division 3. He has a 75% academic scholarship.
Which made it possible for him to go to this small private college in downtown Raleigh NC.
He had offers from 2 other D2 schools and another D3. All offering about the same in terms of academic scholarship money.
You are right….it is the best way to have a chance to play college athletics if you have the talent and a high level work ethic. Most college athletes are on mostly if not all academic money. Very few get athletic money in most sports not named football or basketball. And it’s not life a changing amount and most schools won’t bother with you if you don’t have grades.
Grades are critical to being able to move on to the next level for most athletes wanting to continue in college.
As far as rec leagues vs travel….I can only speak to my area which is South Florida. If your son (baseball) or daughter (softball) is a really talented player you can’t play Rec anymore and expect to get better. The talent spread is too wide these days. Yes it’s fun…..but it does nothing down here to improve their game unfortunately.
Travel unfortunately has also gotten watered down big time. It’s mostly a money grab when you see these weak teams that have zero business playing travel.
Back when I played (1977-1985) rec was all we had and travel was if you made all stars for the summer.
Different world back then.
Today? And when my son was growing up? 2012-2018 I had to pull him from Rec ball after his first season in kid pitch and get him going in a more competitive environment because he loved the game and I saw he had the natural talent to take it as far as he could if he wanted to.
For me the decision was a good one. We made some mistakes early on (everyone does) and then I took matters into my own hands and formed a local travel team in my town by obtaining a charter for the travel organization we have in our city (Parkland). I had my own set of requirements and rules for both the players and the parents (yes I had a manifesto for my program that every player and parent signed).
Because of my way of doing things we had good competitive teams made up of not the best local talent but players who wanted to work hard, have fun and learn. We did not trophy chase, stayed out of Perfect game till we hit 14U and were better prepared (had the same core from ages 13 thru 16) and also I coached his middle school team which was a feeder into his high school (Stoneman Douglas). Also coached High School Showcase till he was 16 then let it all go….so I could enjoy just watching him play high school and summer ball and chase his college dreams.
It worked out for us….but unfortunately I have seen it go all wrong for some families.
Hopping from team to team, toxic coaches, toxic parents and yes toxic players. I cut several thru the years regardless if they were great or not.
We cherish our travel memories and talk about them all the time.
Cooperstown (12U), Ripken (14U) Disney AAU Grand Nationals (did that at 11U and 13U). Great times with the players and parents.
Worth every cent.
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belljr
Footballguy
How are her twins?
belljr
Footballguy
Not related to the OP and I agree not too long ago club teams were cream of the crop. Now someone gets butthurt and they form their own team anyway....
This is more for the people that disagree with travel programs. I think this is all wildly age dependent and talent level. We started in rec then in third grade it was obvious how much better a couple kids were compared to the rest of the league my kid included. We then joined a town travel team for 2 years. Then at 12u jumped to club with 3 "trips" a year and the rest about an hour max. We did that until 15u. Then we joined a big boy organization and paid "a lot" compared to what we were paying. The only reason, my daughter decided she wanted to play in college. And here it matters what travel/club level you play and sometimes what org.
What I agree on is some 12/13 year old playing on the "national" team flying all over the country. Totally not worth 15k a year at that age group. I know people if you count all the travel and dues etc that paid probably that for 7 years only for their kids to play in the same college league as my daughter. There is a time you need "to graduate" to a new level of college is your goal. And I mean to just play not even about $$. There are a lot of girls/kids that think they want to play in college that end up quitting after their Junior year and just playing HS the last season. Nothing wrong with that they just realized it's not for them
This is more for the people that disagree with travel programs. I think this is all wildly age dependent and talent level. We started in rec then in third grade it was obvious how much better a couple kids were compared to the rest of the league my kid included. We then joined a town travel team for 2 years. Then at 12u jumped to club with 3 "trips" a year and the rest about an hour max. We did that until 15u. Then we joined a big boy organization and paid "a lot" compared to what we were paying. The only reason, my daughter decided she wanted to play in college. And here it matters what travel/club level you play and sometimes what org.
What I agree on is some 12/13 year old playing on the "national" team flying all over the country. Totally not worth 15k a year at that age group. I know people if you count all the travel and dues etc that paid probably that for 7 years only for their kids to play in the same college league as my daughter. There is a time you need "to graduate" to a new level of college is your goal. And I mean to just play not even about $$. There are a lot of girls/kids that think they want to play in college that end up quitting after their Junior year and just playing HS the last season. Nothing wrong with that they just realized it's not for them
JAA
Footballguy
I think tennis is different IMO. As one of the better players on his HS team, I took a couple lessons here and there when I was younger, but overall it was about finding like people to practice against. I used to keep a list and call all these old dudes to play. Yes, a little 14yo kid calling around 40-60yr old men to get some tennis in. LOL!
JAA
Footballguy
Junior year of HS, yes.Did you get any booze out of that?
Tennis is its own world... I won't bog the thread down with that.
Chaz McNulty
Footballguy
Did she brush your knee (accidentally-unpurpose), quickly put her hand on and off, or was it more of a lingering feel with maybe a double squeeze? And was Mrs. Wrigley present and was she annoyed, or did she seem curious?
Terminalxylem
Footballguy
Probably a better investment to spend that 5K on a tutor, and go for an academic scholarship.
Terminalxylem
Footballguy
Makes sense for sports like tennis and volleyball, but does this apply for football, basketball, and baseball?
Navin Johnson
Footballguy
Seems like a big ask. My only advice for travel ball is don't put your kid on a team where the coach's kid plays the same position.
Todem
Footballguy
This has been going on the last 30 years easy.
With baseball we did one major summer “travel away” tournament from age 11-15. It was a great time.
Everything else was all local until we were on the college recruiting circuit. That was exhausting and expensive.
That is when we started really spending some money. But that is what you do when you are trying to play vs elite competition in front of dozens upon dozens of potential colleges. And that’s in addition to ID camps (I have a do and don’t regarding all that too! I can write a guide).
There is an investment that every parent will make for their kid if they are truly good enough to play college sports.
The only ones who can get off super cheap are those parents of the elite of the elite. The top .5% of high school athletes.
And I will iterate again having great grades is critical to move on for most athletes (not all as we know). A lot of people think if you are not D1 it’s no good. That could not be farther from the truth.
Are there insane costs associated with travel sports? Oh yeah it can get insane.
All depends on the sport, the team you choose etc.
Our particular travel team was $200 a month for 9 months out of the year. That covered insurance, umpires, baseballs, the two league fees, indoor batting cage/training center membership we had, and 2 local tournaments in the Fall and 2 in the spring.
Then we had the one summer “sportcation” tournaments we did each summer and that was anywhere from 1500-3000 per family for a week long destination tournament which included lodging, food and travel costs. We would fundraise throughout the year with carwashes, poker tourneys etc.
The one big mama was Cooperstown Field of Dreams tourney. That we had to do major fundraising including all the above and a golf tourney, super-bowl squares etc. It is a once in a lifetime “baseball” experience when the players are 12 years old. We will never forget that trip.
So it all depends what you are trying to get out of it. It is not all about college ball. 50% of the kids quit baseball after 12 (little league).
Since I was a parent/coach as well as my assistant coach we had no “professional coaching fee’s” which can get stupid.
People have this term they love to use “daddy ball” well that did not apply with us. My son was one of the top players and my assistant coaches kid was in the bottom. Literally the 12th kid out of 12. He was not a regular starter. But we were very fair about rotating, etc because development was our #1, fun #2, winning was a by product.
Anyway travel sports when done right are great. They are fun, highly competitive and will give the players and parents amazing memories.
But like with anything there is a dark side and a lot of teams who do it wrong and you really only hear about the negative more often in this social media world we live in.
I can speak to baseball. But I do know hockey and volleyball can get stupid expensive as well as lacrosse.
College showcase is another topic. And that is where the scamming really kicks into high gear. Pre high school travel can be awesome but a lot of gullible parents fall prey into the whole “athletic scholarship, training for college” jargon way too early.
That should not even be a consideration until their Sophomore year in high school after they make their high school team and see where they are stacking up, how their physical development is going, their mental development and their academic development.
Again I can write a book on the do’s and don’ts on this topic.
Boston
Footballguy
I have two kids who are fortunate enough to play college Lax and I can say lax is not that expensive compared to other sports (and is not as over-the-top)...I played college hockey back in the 80's and right now lax is kind of where hockey was back in that era (i.e. before hockey become the idiotic ****show it is now)...like many of these other sports it will probably change with time (and people figuring out how to make more off of it...in the big picture lax is still somewhat of a new sport at least as far as it becoming mainstream and popular) but right now lax is semi-sane compared to many of the other sports.
Todem
Footballguy
Good to hear. I have a few clients whose two boys are in Hockey….OMG. Totally out of control.
Boston
Footballguy
Having played and living in one of the "hotbeds" of hockey I can speak to it very well (my kids don't play but I have friends who have been NHL players and HCs, agents or have kids who have played at the highest level)...as bad as you think it is it is worse which is unfortunate because it is such a great sport.
*So many parents in this sport are so clueless...they think their kid has a chance to play college hockey when they actually have a better chance being President (and I'm not kidding)...D3 hockey looks like the NHL 30 years ago...the level of play is so high and I don't think many parents understand just how good it is...and hockey is far different than most of the other sports because there are way more players than colleges that have hockey so the spots are very limited unlike many of the other sports where you can find a home on a college roster if that's your goal (playing time can be a different story).
*Even if you are a good enough to play college the path many kids have to take to do so is disgusting...to just play D3 most kids need to play Juniors for two years which is so stupid...then the kid gets to school and he's now 2 years older than his classmates...also, schools have zero issues decommitting kids...it can be cutthroat.
*USA Hockey sucks (the organization)...they only care about the National Team (which they do an excellent job at by the way)...the goal for most of the kids should be to play high school because that is way more realistic...on the youth side you have so many kids wasting big $ on Club teams when they are not that good (and never will be) but unfortunately the culture is for kids to leave town hockey at an early age and chase the dream by playing club or the town programs have been gutted so it's not the option it should be,
*IMO the no-hitting at a young age has created false expectations...I do get the thought behind it but too many kids grow-up with a false game because they light it up at a young age because they don't have to worry about getting lit up...that makes many of these parents think their kids are better than they are...then the hitting starts and suddenly Little Johnny's not that good because he's not a big fan of the contact which many times leads to the parents blaming the coaching for the kid's decline so they pack their bags and go to another club...the sport has become very mercenary which is too bad because IMO hockey had by far the best team culture of all team sports but it's just not like that anymore.
Ok...done with the rant...I could keep going but won't...
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First off by and large Travel Ball is an absolute racket. It has diluted the talent so much that it has diluted itself. It is no longer the elite players playing against elite players. It has also destroyed rec ball because if you have any talent at all whatsoever you will not improve at all playing rec ball. Rec ball has become 85% daisy pickers that are only there because their parents are making them play a sport with the other 15% being new kids with some ability that will quickly realize they are getting nothing out of rec ball.
That is all a generalization as I am sure there are some rec leagues that are in big enough areas that can survive and be ok for kids with solid skills where they can improve somewhat.
I will also say that all Travel Teams are not created equal and you must do your homework on all teams in your area to choose the program that is right for you. There are terrible ones out there like described in the OP that may fit for some but not all (paying full price for practice only and no opportunity to play in games and then making travel mandatory for tourney's you won't play in is ridiculous). That being said, there are quality programs out there. There are also a ton of daddy ball teams as well. You need to do your due diligence to find the right fit for you. They are out there.....you just need to find them.
In my area we are relatively small. Our Little League had maybe 4 teams per age group when my son was playing. His 9 yr old season he was drafted to the Majors (typically for 11-12 years old - the LL World Series age group is what most people will recognize). He was good enough to play with the 11-12 yr olds in our area and did well. There were nine other 9-yr olds that were also drafted to the Majors that year and they all held their own. At the end of that season the league entered a 9-10 yr old All Star team into the LL district tournament and we took those ten 9-yr olds and few other 10 yr olds. We won one game and lost the next two and it was the first all star game a team from our district had won in many years. After seeing these players play me and another dad asked the parents if they wanted to do a couple tournaments to finish out the summer. We decided to play three tournaments that were in our area (maybe 45 minutes to an hour away). These players progressed more in these three tournaments than they did in the entirety of the LL season. That was how diluted the "rec ball" league was in our area.
After we finished those three tournaments the parents decided to ask us to give up rec ball and just do travel ball with this team. We weren't part of any organization or Baseball Mill. Just an area team that had a good crop of 9 yr olds. We split the costs evenly among all players. Got an insurance policy (relatively cheap), had access to a community field (free), and started it up. We began practicing in Feb and played into August. We averaged 2 tournaments a month (so we had two weekends off a month). We practiced 2-3 times a week for that time frame. We stopped in August so kids could do football/soccer/baseketball/etc.
We also played everyone evenly and rotated positions so every player knew how to play every position. Obviously as they got older and developed skills that narrowed in a bit but never really below 2 or 3 positions per player. It was important to us to develop total players.
We played about 50 games a season and the boys quickly improved. The idea was to have this group go to HS together (they were all in the same HS area) and we could develop them to be ready for HS. We kept the team together (for the most part, had a few stop and added a few as well as some fill ins when people weren't available). Then when we got to HS 75% decided to go to the rival HS because they were "better". My son and a couple other kids stayed and went where they were supposed to. They played Varsity as freshman (the other's that left did not play Varsity until junior year) and we lost to them two times (once freshman year and once sophomore year) when we played head to head over the next four years. Our team ended up winning lead both Junior and Senior years and went to the State Finals their junior year while the other "better" team did not. It was very satisfying. hahahaha.
Anyway, all that to say that you can make travel ball make sense for you. It's not all bad and terrible but you have to do your due diligence and find a program/team that matches your goals and desires. They are out there.
Our costs were $500 a year to cover uniforms, insurance, and tourney fees. We rarely traveled over 1 hr away but did go on overnight trips 2 or 3 times a year just to get away and see some other teams as well as to have fun staying in a hotel, swimming, seeing sites etc. We treated them as family vacations with your 10 closest friends. All the families had great times. We never signed up for an overnight tourney without having everyone agreeing to it ahead of time so they were planned.
My son is now playing at a D2 school in Colorado. Four of the other kids are playing at a local JC in California. Not bad to have half the kids succeed enough to play college ball in some manor.
That is all a generalization as I am sure there are some rec leagues that are in big enough areas that can survive and be ok for kids with solid skills where they can improve somewhat.
I will also say that all Travel Teams are not created equal and you must do your homework on all teams in your area to choose the program that is right for you. There are terrible ones out there like described in the OP that may fit for some but not all (paying full price for practice only and no opportunity to play in games and then making travel mandatory for tourney's you won't play in is ridiculous). That being said, there are quality programs out there. There are also a ton of daddy ball teams as well. You need to do your due diligence to find the right fit for you. They are out there.....you just need to find them.
In my area we are relatively small. Our Little League had maybe 4 teams per age group when my son was playing. His 9 yr old season he was drafted to the Majors (typically for 11-12 years old - the LL World Series age group is what most people will recognize). He was good enough to play with the 11-12 yr olds in our area and did well. There were nine other 9-yr olds that were also drafted to the Majors that year and they all held their own. At the end of that season the league entered a 9-10 yr old All Star team into the LL district tournament and we took those ten 9-yr olds and few other 10 yr olds. We won one game and lost the next two and it was the first all star game a team from our district had won in many years. After seeing these players play me and another dad asked the parents if they wanted to do a couple tournaments to finish out the summer. We decided to play three tournaments that were in our area (maybe 45 minutes to an hour away). These players progressed more in these three tournaments than they did in the entirety of the LL season. That was how diluted the "rec ball" league was in our area.
After we finished those three tournaments the parents decided to ask us to give up rec ball and just do travel ball with this team. We weren't part of any organization or Baseball Mill. Just an area team that had a good crop of 9 yr olds. We split the costs evenly among all players. Got an insurance policy (relatively cheap), had access to a community field (free), and started it up. We began practicing in Feb and played into August. We averaged 2 tournaments a month (so we had two weekends off a month). We practiced 2-3 times a week for that time frame. We stopped in August so kids could do football/soccer/baseketball/etc.
We also played everyone evenly and rotated positions so every player knew how to play every position. Obviously as they got older and developed skills that narrowed in a bit but never really below 2 or 3 positions per player. It was important to us to develop total players.
We played about 50 games a season and the boys quickly improved. The idea was to have this group go to HS together (they were all in the same HS area) and we could develop them to be ready for HS. We kept the team together (for the most part, had a few stop and added a few as well as some fill ins when people weren't available). Then when we got to HS 75% decided to go to the rival HS because they were "better". My son and a couple other kids stayed and went where they were supposed to. They played Varsity as freshman (the other's that left did not play Varsity until junior year) and we lost to them two times (once freshman year and once sophomore year) when we played head to head over the next four years. Our team ended up winning lead both Junior and Senior years and went to the State Finals their junior year while the other "better" team did not. It was very satisfying. hahahaha.
Anyway, all that to say that you can make travel ball make sense for you. It's not all bad and terrible but you have to do your due diligence and find a program/team that matches your goals and desires. They are out there.
Our costs were $500 a year to cover uniforms, insurance, and tourney fees. We rarely traveled over 1 hr away but did go on overnight trips 2 or 3 times a year just to get away and see some other teams as well as to have fun staying in a hotel, swimming, seeing sites etc. We treated them as family vacations with your 10 closest friends. All the families had great times. We never signed up for an overnight tourney without having everyone agreeing to it ahead of time so they were planned.
My son is now playing at a D2 school in Colorado. Four of the other kids are playing at a local JC in California. Not bad to have half the kids succeed enough to play college ball in some manor.
What you need to do as a parent is really evaluate his skill level and see if the local rec league is still challenging him to the point that his skills are improving. If they are then "travel" isn't a necessity. Even making the "all star" team may not mean the league is not challenging enough for him.
Secondly, you need to research the teams in your area and really see what they are about. Are they a money grab? Are they bringing in 50 kids and play time is minimal? Do they move players around to learn all positions or do you get stuck at one position? How many games do they play? How much travel do they do? Ask parents that are in the program and ones that left the program the pros and cons. You need to treat this as a job interview and find the candidate that best fits your family.
In my case the all star thing is really just a barometer for how seriously he’s taking it and ensuring that he wants to play badly enough to justify the additional investment, more so than making sure I’m optimizing his skill development with an eye toward being a college player.
Anarchy99
Footballguy
I agree with folks saying find a team your kid can play regularly. Having to pay full freight not to play seems like the ultimate money grab. Our son played AAU basketball. There were two options for us: play locally in NH where our kid dominated . . . or play in metro Boston where the talent was way better and sometimes struggle for him to get to play. We did both (usually at the same time).
Both had plusses and minus. On the local circuit, our son sat more than we expected, not because he wasn't a good player, but because they played a lot of developmental players against bottom feeder teams. They saved him for tough opponents . . . and they fed him the ball in those games. His stat lines were pretty wanky . . . 4 points against terrible teams, 8 points against so-so teams, 20 points against decent teams, and 30+ points against great teams. With tournaments running 2-3 days, we almost told skipped some easy games when he wasn't going to play much. Part of the issue for playing on local teams was he was typecast as a center.
The better AAU leagues had a different problem. First, we signed up for them with the expectation that they were going to get him run as a shooting guard (not tall enough to be a top-level center). When he was on their A level team (at $1K a pop), he played shooting guard and small forward. That part was great. He usually didn't start but was their first sub in. He got to play a lot, and if one of the starters wasn't doing much, they would give him an extended run. But the problem was, sometimes they would bring in ringers from one of their other teams for a high-profile tournament.
When that happened, we were given the option of him mostly watching from the bench or playing that week on their B team. The problem with that was the B team could be playing in a different tournament nowhere near the A team . . . and we had just drove to the A team tournament location. On top of that, he was the tallest one by far of the B team kids, so playing on the B team meant he had to play center.
He got so fed up being yanked around that he finally quit AAU in HS and only played for his HS team. At 6'5" / 6'6", they only let him play center, even though he had spent years playing every position. His coach was a hard-nosed SOB, and if our son made a three pointer, he would get pulled from the game (not his job). He was tethered to the paint on offense and defense, which wasn't all that fun. Finally, as a senior, he did whatever he wanted, as they were one of the best teams in the state. Then COVID hit and the season stopped on a dime before they could finish the state tournament. Thanks, COVID.
Both had plusses and minus. On the local circuit, our son sat more than we expected, not because he wasn't a good player, but because they played a lot of developmental players against bottom feeder teams. They saved him for tough opponents . . . and they fed him the ball in those games. His stat lines were pretty wanky . . . 4 points against terrible teams, 8 points against so-so teams, 20 points against decent teams, and 30+ points against great teams. With tournaments running 2-3 days, we almost told skipped some easy games when he wasn't going to play much. Part of the issue for playing on local teams was he was typecast as a center.
The better AAU leagues had a different problem. First, we signed up for them with the expectation that they were going to get him run as a shooting guard (not tall enough to be a top-level center). When he was on their A level team (at $1K a pop), he played shooting guard and small forward. That part was great. He usually didn't start but was their first sub in. He got to play a lot, and if one of the starters wasn't doing much, they would give him an extended run. But the problem was, sometimes they would bring in ringers from one of their other teams for a high-profile tournament.
When that happened, we were given the option of him mostly watching from the bench or playing that week on their B team. The problem with that was the B team could be playing in a different tournament nowhere near the A team . . . and we had just drove to the A team tournament location. On top of that, he was the tallest one by far of the B team kids, so playing on the B team meant he had to play center.
He got so fed up being yanked around that he finally quit AAU in HS and only played for his HS team. At 6'5" / 6'6", they only let him play center, even though he had spent years playing every position. His coach was a hard-nosed SOB, and if our son made a three pointer, he would get pulled from the game (not his job). He was tethered to the paint on offense and defense, which wasn't all that fun. Finally, as a senior, he did whatever he wanted, as they were one of the best teams in the state. Then COVID hit and the season stopped on a dime before they could finish the state tournament. Thanks, COVID.
belljr
Footballguy
We were always on the cheaper side until 15u - its why everyone wanted to play for us - we were half the cost.
Why - we didn't get paid. We had a free field. We had a free indoor area for winter workouts. However tournaments sky rocketing in softball as they got older.
The tourneys that used to cost 500 are now 750. Showcase tourneys are ridiculous.
There is NO WAY we could do it for the 1500 we were doing it now.
We would have to rent a field, rent an indoor place etc.
