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Kobe Bryant dead in helicopter crash - TMZ (2 Viewers)

Let's put it this way.  Someone is going to be sued.  The question is who.  

I hope for Kobe's family that it wont be them.

However, I fully expect whoever is most responsible will be sued. 

 
Mile High said:
I did say I could be wrong and even if he did I don't see how he is at fault 
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Last I will say about this, cause I was really only just saying this will be even worse and more heartbreaking for the family if they have to deal with lawsuits.

But.

If Kobe owned a helicopter and took people up in dangerous conditions then crashed into a mountain killing everyone, there is 100% liability there and lawsuits will happen, and they will likely win.

 
ghostguy123 said:
If a guy owns a helicopter and takes people up in dangerous conditions and crashes, killing everyone, that person is probably liable for damages.
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For one thing it was probably not the helicopters fault.  I was watching a show last night and the chopper they were on was top on the line, twin engine, had radar terrain guidance system.  Would be shocked if this turned out to be anything other than pilot error.

 
Kobe bought the helicopter because he was uncomfortable driving from Newport Beach to LA in the car (mucles/long drive) so often. Virtually no chance he was piloting.

 
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Mr. Ham said:
Don’t know that I’ve ever heard as credible and coherent a first party account of anything. Based on level of detail, agree with his assessment that pilot didn’t know the hill was there and flew right into it in cloudy conditions. Just awful tragedy.
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Pretty much exactly what I thought upon hearing that. He coherently spoke with insight regarding aviation, meteorology and geography as it pertained to what he witnessed. 

 
ghostguy123 said:
Question.  Who's owned the helicopter?  Who was flying the helicopter?  

I am not sure of either.
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Unless Kobe owned the helicopter (I don't know if he did) or was flying it (he wasn't) there is no liability on his part and no lawsuit against him would survive.

 
One thing that is interesting to me is that the flight data said they were traveling 161 knots when they crashed.  That seemed incredibly fast for very bad visibility.  Then I looked it up and it's actually about 10 mph faster than the TOP SPEED of the helicopter.   :confused:

 
Isn't there a thread for attorney talk?  This is just like yesterday people speculating about bs before knowing the facts.

 
On another note the media botches another story with irresponsible reporting.

It is an old rule of journalism that it is better to get it right than to get it first.

But after seeing how reporters reacted Sunday to news of retired NBA star Kobe Bryant's death, you could be forgiven for thinking that such a rule no longer exists, if it ever existed at all.

The former Los Angeles Laker was among nine people killed Sunday morning in a helicopter crash in Southern California. The other victims include Bryant’s 13-year-old daughter Gianna, one of her teammates on her basketball team, the teammate’s parent, and the pilot.

Those are the facts. Everything else you may have heard about the victims of the crash is false. These falsehoods, it turns out, come almost entirely from reporters at mainstream news outlets. Of the journalists who fell down on the job Sunday, none fell harder than ABC News’s Matt Gutman, who inexplicably repeated a rumor on air, alleging Bryant had died in the helicopter crash along with his four daughters.

“[T]he fact that four of his children are believed to be on that helicopter with him, all daughters, one of them a newborn, is simply devastating,” he said during a live broadcast, adding, “hoping that this is not the case but, you know, from the police reports right now, it appears that Kobe Bryant is down in that helicopter.”

ABC affiliates soon picked up Gutman's erroneous reporting, with some claiming verbatim that, “Bryant’s four daughters were also on board the helicopter.”

Erring in the other direction were reporters at other ABC affiliates, including one in Washington, D.C., where reporter Lindsey Mastis reported that, “Kobe Bryant is survived by his wife and four children, so it does not appear they were on board the helicopter.”

Then there is ESPN, which reported that the victims included retired NBA player Rick Fox, who is definitely not dead.

 
Da Guru said:
On another note the media botches another story with irresponsible reporting.

It is an old rule of journalism that it is better to get it right than to get it first.

But after seeing how reporters reacted Sunday to news of retired NBA star Kobe Bryant's death, you could be forgiven for thinking that such a rule no longer exists, if it ever existed at all.

The former Los Angeles Laker was among nine people killed Sunday morning in a helicopter crash in Southern California. The other victims include Bryant’s 13-year-old daughter Gianna, one of her teammates on her basketball team, the teammate’s parent, and the pilot.

Those are the facts. Everything else you may have heard about the victims of the crash is false. These falsehoods, it turns out, come almost entirely from reporters at mainstream news outlets. Of the journalists who fell down on the job Sunday, none fell harder than ABC News’s Matt Gutman, who inexplicably repeated a rumor on air, alleging Bryant had died in the helicopter crash along with his four daughters.

“[T]he fact that four of his children are believed to be on that helicopter with him, all daughters, one of them a newborn, is simply devastating,” he said during a live broadcast, adding, “hoping that this is not the case but, you know, from the police reports right now, it appears that Kobe Bryant is down in that helicopter.”

ABC affiliates soon picked up Gutman's erroneous reporting, with some claiming verbatim that, “Bryant’s four daughters were also on board the helicopter.”

Erring in the other direction were reporters at other ABC affiliates, including one in Washington, D.C., where reporter Lindsey Mastis reported that, “Kobe Bryant is survived by his wife and four children, so it does not appear they were on board the helicopter.”

Then there is ESPN, which reported that the victims included retired NBA player Rick Fox, who is definitely not dead.
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What I found even more odd was that ESPN didn't interrupt their ESPNews replay of a UFC fight.  Instead they chose to just have a crawl on the bottom for a good amount of time.  

 
TheIronSheik said:
One thing that is interesting to me is that the flight data said they were traveling 161 knots when they crashed.  That seemed incredibly fast for very bad visibility.  Then I looked it up and it's actually about 10 mph faster than the TOP SPEED of the helicopter.   :confused:
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If you watch the videos on the atc Channel you see these airspeed anomalies alot as the plane crashed.  

 
Mr. Ham said:
Summary

  • Kobe owned the helicopter
  • Unlikely his estate would incur liability for an accident with pilot error, since pilot was properly licensed and Kobe had nothing to do with the accident 
  • Kobe probably maintained insurance anyway
  • Who gives a #### - not the time to speculate how victims’ families are compensated, if at all
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I only commented because his passion for that take seems odd and the first two google returns indicate the helicopter is owned by Island Express Holding Corporation. But you're right so let's move on.

 
culdeus said:
If you watch the videos on the atc Channel you see these airspeed anomalies alot as the plane crashed.  
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Yeah, I'd love to know what's typical in low vis and what the pilot was doing here.  Gunning it (if he indeed did do that) in that kind of visibility seems insane.  Plus doesn't simple GPS onboard show mountains around?  This all seems so careless on the surface, but I'm sure we'll read and learn a lot more from experts in the area.

 
Hugh Jass said:
Yeah, I'd love to know what's typical in low vis and what the pilot was doing here.  Gunning it (if he indeed did do that) in that kind of visibility seems insane.  Plus doesn't simple GPS onboard show mountains around?  This all seems so careless on the surface, but I'm sure we'll read and learn a lot more from experts in the area.
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I'm not a pilot, so take this for what it's worth, but I do work in the rotor-wing industry and am around helicopters every day. Typically what happens when you fly into an inadvertent instrument meteorological conditions (IIMC) involves either landing immediately if possible, turning around around, or climbing above the clouds and moving into Instrument Flight Rule (IFR), instead of Visual Flight Rule (VFR). Our organization does IIMC drills monthly... we "punch into the clouds" and simulate meteorological conditions like rain, snow, fog, etc. 

IIMC is obviously a dangerous position to be put in and lots can go wrong. I imagine a pilot who flies this particular aircraft would need to be very experienced, but spacial disorientation can happen to anyone. Could be any number of things, and we'll just have to wait for the NTSB report to come out to find out what happened. 

 
Mrs. Rannous said:
I don't have Twitter, so I can't see it.  What the heck is it?
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A video of a comedian saying it was a good day because a rapist got what he deserved. But the audio doesn’t come close to matching the lips in several parts. I see no reason to think it’s real. Of course, someone made the video, but not this comedian who is claiming he’s been hacked so he shouldn’t be ripped over this. 

 
dgreen said:
A video of a comedian saying it was a good day because a rapist got what he deserved. But the audio doesn’t come close to matching the lips in several parts. I see no reason to think it’s real. Of course, someone made the video, but not this comedian who is claiming he’s been hacked so he shouldn’t be ripped over this. 
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There’s plenty of reasons to rip this dude already but agree we should wait. 
 

Also, deep fake technology is scary AF. We’re entering into a incredibly unpredictable and scary age. We’re all lucky that we likely won’t live long enough to truly see where all this leads. 

 
fissure man said:
There’s plenty of reasons to rip this dude already but agree we should wait. 
 

Also, deep fake technology is scary AF. We’re entering into a incredibly unpredictable and scary age. We’re all lucky that we likely won’t live long enough to truly see where all this leads. 
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Speak for yourself.  CyberSheik will live on forever. 

I, for one, welcome me as our new leader.

 
John Lennon 1980

Challenger Disaster 1986

Kurt Cobain 1994 although when it's DbS it has a different feel

Those were the events that came to mind trying to compare how this might feel. The NBA/NFL/MLB have all lost big time players over the years like Fernandez from the Marlins a couple years back but Kobe reached a WIDE audience and it has impacts far reaching beyond NBA/Lakers fans. 

I think Kobe's daughter being on board also added a lot to how this story ends and it hit home to many people who might not have even been huge NBA fans. 

There are plenty of things to get offended about with how the coverage was done yesterday be it TMZ reporting it way ahead of the local authorities/officials who had no chance to secure the area and gather information...or ABC/ESPN not cutting away from the Pro Bowl coverage fast enough to cover this story, just remember that it's perfectly normal during these tragedies. People are going to be angry and upset and mad and you just can't expect everyone to eat it and so I think thru social media you're going to see a lot of snarky things, I wouldn't let it impact you too much. There is legit reasons to discuss it all but it's going to spin this thread into something none of us really want.  

 
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Capella said:
I don’t get people upset at ESPN. They devoted an entire network to cover it all day. 
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For the record, I wasn't upset with them.  I brought up ESPN, but I wasn't saying I was upset.  

I just thought it was odd that they have a network devoted to News and they didn't break into a taped replay of a meaningless UFC fight to talk about it when it happened.  

I just found that strange.  But not upsetting.  

 
TheIronSheik said:
For the record, I wasn't upset with them.  I brought up ESPN, but I wasn't saying I was upset.  

I just thought it was odd that they have a network devoted to News and they didn't break into a taped replay of a meaningless UFC fight to talk about it when it happened.  

I just found that strange.  But not upsetting.  
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Maybe since most who have the ESPN channel with that UFC fight also have the main channel and could switch over for wall to wall coverage.  Me, I found no dearth of coverage. 

 
Capella said:
I don’t get people upset at ESPN. They devoted an entire network to cover it all day. 
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And they called in everyone as soon as they possibly could but it was odd that things were moving along in the Pro Bowl like nothing was happening. Again I'm not personally offended but in these tragedies people have to lash out at something. It's human nature. I had to get the first info from places like CNN/FOX/MSNBC seemed like they were running the info first or had a lot more of it faster. 

Super Bowl Monday looks about a 180 from what ESPN, FOX and the NFL were hoping for today in around South Beach with all the Media camped out. Most of us were getting into Super Bowl mode feel like the rug was pulled out from under us. 

FS1 looked terrible trying to broadcast live this morning from South Beach, is that Nick Wright that hosts that show? 

Has anyone even thought about the logistics of a funeral this week with the Super Bowl looming on Sunday? 

 
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ghostguy123 said:
And now his family is going to have to deal with an abundance of lawsuits.  Guaranteed that will happen.  Not saying those families shouldnt sue (cause they should), but that's really gonna add insult to injury for the wife and the rest of the family.
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Don't get this. If anyone gets sued it's whoever gave it a go to fly in the weather when LA had grounded it's helicopters. Maybe Vanessa will sue too. I would. This looks like an avoidable tragedy so far.

 
Just a horrible tragedy. Kobe was one of the great ones. Too soon. Just too damn soon. And the fact kids were on board makes it even tougher to swallow. God bless the surviving family members who must all be going through incredible grief. 

Obviously it will take a long time to get an official report on what went wrong. But on the surface it seems to be pilot error in highly in-climate weather for flying. Just a terrible tragedy.

 
Ministry of Pain said:
John Lennon 1980 - Don't remember this one. I do remember my parents telling me about Reagan getting shot as it was the same day the Hoosiers won the NCAA championship which was a bigger deal to a young General.

Challenger Disaster 1986 - In art class, a kid came running in and started yelling about this.

Kurt Cobain 1994 although when it's DbS it has a different feel - In the shower, listening to radio and they had played a few Nirvana songs in a row. DJ came on and broke the news.
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Without stopping to think about it there are not many events I remember in this way you hit some of the big ones.

Of course 9/11 attacks.

 
CurlyNight said:
Don't get this. If anyone gets sued it's whoever gave it a go to fly in the weather when LA had grounded it's helicopters. Maybe Vanessa will sue too. I would. This looks like an avoidable tragedy so far.
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I don't feel real comfortable talking about this aspect of the tragedy, but what happens with nearly every crash is that everyone gets hit... the pilot, the vendor, the aviation vendor (which could very well be a different org... this is the company that employees the pilots/mechanics)... pretty much everyone. That's how it starts. 

 
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Yeah, I can’t think of a bigger reaction to a celebrity passing. Maybe Princess Diana? 
 

Roberto Clemente comes to mind but that was way before my time and obviously before social media. 
 

 
Robin Williams 

Heath Ledger 

Rich Cronin

Chester Bennington 

Chris Cornell 

Many sad celebrity deaths over the past 20 years....

 
Ministry of Pain said:
John Lennon 1980

Challenger Disaster 1986

Kurt Cobain 1994 although when it's DbS it has a different feel

Those were the events that came to mind trying to compare how this might feel. The NBA/NFL/MLB have all lost big time players over the years like Fernandez from the Marlins a couple years back but Kobe reached a WIDE audience and it has impacts far reaching beyond NBA/Lakers fans. 

I think Kobe's daughter being on board also added a lot to how this story ends and it hit home to many people who might not have even been huge NBA fans. 

There are plenty of things to get offended about with how the coverage was done yesterday be it TMZ reporting it way ahead of the local authorities/officials who had no chance to secure the area and gather information...or ABC/ESPN not cutting away from the Pro Bowl coverage fast enough to cover this story, just remember that it's perfectly normal during these tragedies. People are going to be angry and upset and mad and you just can't expect everyone to eat it and so I think thru social media you're going to see a lot of snarky things, I wouldn't let it impact you too much. There is legit reasons to discuss it all but it's going to spin this thread into something none of us really want.  
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You are comparing this to the Challenger disaster?  Seems odd.  I think it's comparable to a lot of celebrity deaths, where it's unexpected.  Some people seem to have a personal connection.  The Challenger disaster feels way different to me.

 
Magic Johnson's HIV announcement was up there as well. Partially because he was still an active player and had to abruptly retire, partially because the AIDS epidemic was not well understood by the public, and because it was assumed at the time that he would be dead within a year or two.

Others shockers include Len Bias overdosing after going 1st to Boston and Hank Gathers collapsing on the court during game action and dying.

 
Softballguy said:
I'm not a pilot, so take this for what it's worth, but I do work in the rotor-wing industry and am around helicopters every day. Typically what happens when you fly into an inadvertent instrument meteorological conditions (IIMC) involves either landing immediately if possible, turning around around, or climbing above the clouds and moving into Instrument Flight Rule (IFR), instead of Visual Flight Rule (VFR). Our organization does IIMC drills monthly... we "punch into the clouds" and simulate meteorological conditions like rain, snow, fog, etc. 

IIMC is obviously a dangerous position to be put in and lots can go wrong. I imagine a pilot who flies this particular aircraft would need to be very experienced, but spacial disorientation can happen to anyone. Could be any number of things, and we'll just have to wait for the NTSB report to come out to find out what happened. 
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Thanks for sharing that, GB. :thumbup:

 
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