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Liz Cheney: The House GOP leadership has enabled white nationalism, white supremacy, and anti-semitism. (1 Viewer)

Agree or disagree?

  • Agree

    Votes: 59 70.2%
  • Disagree

    Votes: 23 27.4%
  • Uncertain/other

    Votes: 2 2.4%

  • Total voters
    84
Ok.  Have they been delivered or not?  No, Then they are not alive.  

Do you speed? Jaywalk? Spit? Pee outdoors?  Those things are illegal too.  Does not mean they make any rational sense. Pretending the law as it stands is the only reason to look at anything is incredibly obtuse. I don't believe that black people thought of themselves as 3/5 of a person just bc the law once said they did anymore so than someone who came to this country looking for opportunity thinks of themselves as less of a person bc they don't have the correct status.  You are imposing that on them.


it seems you are ok with casting laws aside when it fits what you want - is this what I'm reading ?

illegal literally means NOT LEGAL .... and if you're not in the USA legally, you are, therefore, ILLEGAL

its pretty straight forward

 
he was absolutely right 

people are trying to come here illegally because their countries are in such bad shape .... he was vulgar in his words, but he was right in the truth

remember the left grabbed on to the whole fake "asylum" card for a while? lol
This is disappointing.  Do you really not see anything wrong with what he said in that article.  You don't detect any racism at all?

 
This is really really gross. Not quite as bad as your pro-white power comment from earlier this week, but definitely up there.

This is the last conversation you and I will be having for a while. If you ever figure out just how awful this is, or even if you seriously want to discuss why I think this is so awful, shoot me a DM and I'd be happy to reengage. But I'm not interested in giving oxygen to your ugly brand of white nationalism any longer.


gross ?  no, its simply truth

Biden literally said

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/speeches-remarks/2021/03/25/remarks-by-president-biden-in-press-conference/

The reason they’re coming is that it’s the time they can travel with the least likelihood of dying on the way because of the heat in the desert, number one. Number two, they’re coming because of the circumstances in-country — in-country.

The way to deal with this problem — and I started to deal with it back when I was a United States senator — I mean, Vice President — putting together a bipartisan plan of over $700 million to deal with the root causes of why people are leaving.

That’s why I’ve asked the Vice President of the United States, yesterday, to be the lead person on dealing with focusing on the fundamental reasons why people leave Honduras, Guatemala, and El Salvador in the first place. It’s because of earthquakes, floods. It’s because of lack of food. It’s because of gang violence. It’s because of a whole range of things.

Thousands of words there - and not ONE TIME did Biden say "asylum" not did any reporters

Everyone knows people are flooding here illegally because their home countries have been allowed to degrade horribly

That's not gross - its true .... we can point to places in the USA that are like that too !

 
This is disappointing.  Do you really not see anything wrong with what he said in that article.  You don't detect any racism at all?


what race would he have been isming on?

but that was a closed door meeting - it was leaked to hurt Trump and nothing more

Haiti, El Salvador, Nicaragua, Honduras.  I've been to 3 of those, Haiti my uncle helped missionary trips for 3 decades .... I know a bit about them ... do you? they're not fun places - they're very much what one would describe how Trump did

I like jungles, I like that natural environment ... but the crime/police/judicial system, the infrastructure, the poverty, healthcare .... there is almost nothing good about those countries when comparing to United States

am I right? Trump was - he could have used better words, but its not racism, its calling bad places what they are

I could list several inner cities that meet those words too

 
what race would he have been isming on?

but that was a closed door meeting - it was leaked to hurt Trump and nothing more

Haiti, El Salvador, Nicaragua, Honduras.  I've been to 3 of those, Haiti my uncle helped missionary trips for 3 decades .... I know a bit about them ... do you? they're not fun places - they're very much what one would describe how Trump did

I like jungles, I like that natural environment ... but the crime/police/judicial system, the infrastructure, the poverty, healthcare .... there is almost nothing good about those countries when comparing to United States

am I right? Trump was - he could have used better words, but its not racism, its calling bad places what they are

I could list several inner cities that meet those words too
So just for the record, you agree with Trump. You would rather see people from Norway as immigrants and not people from the 4 countries you mentioned as immigrants?

 
So just for the record, you agree with Trump. You would rather see people from Norway as immigrants and not people from the 4 countries you mentioned as immigrants?
For the record they would likely bring more social capital when they arrive.

 
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We're gonna be begging Third World countries for their surplus labor in 20 years. For once, the GOP ought to get out in front of a trend and make it work for them politically.

 
We're gonna be begging Third World countries for their surplus labor in 20 years. For once, the GOP ought to get out in front of a trend and make it work for them politically.
What was the last piece of meaningful legislation that the GOP crafted and championed that was NOT tax cut related?

ETA:  That said, it's really tough to ignore that a guy like Cawthorne still managed to get 30%+ of the vote in a GOP primary given all his transgressions.  That wouldn't have been in the realm of possibility in our recent past.

 
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people are trying to come here illegally because their countries are in such bad shape .... he was vulgar in his words, but he was right in the truth
This is just a different way of saying that people are coming to the United States because this is the greatest country on earth.  Compared to Mexico or Guatemala or Cuba or whatever, it's a golden land of opportunity by comparison.  They're coming here because the US gives hard-working people a fair chance to make a better life for their kids and grandkids.  

Patriotic, pro-American people should be happy about that.  Every Mexican who sneaks across the Rio Grande is endorsing your view of America's goodness and refuting the negative narrative of this country endorsed by the Wokenvolk.  

You like Trump, right?  If you think that Trump was putting the US on the path toward national greatness, how can you object to Nicaraguans (say) wanting to get in on that action?  Of course people are going to want to sign up for a winning team. 

 
what race would he have been isming on?

but that was a closed door meeting - it was leaked to hurt Trump and nothing more

Haiti, El Salvador, Nicaragua, Honduras.  I've been to 3 of those, Haiti my uncle helped missionary trips for 3 decades .... I know a bit about them ... do you? they're not fun places - they're very much what one would describe how Trump did

I like jungles, I like that natural environment ... but the crime/police/judicial system, the infrastructure, the poverty, healthcare .... there is almost nothing good about those countries when comparing to United States

am I right? Trump was - he could have used better words, but its not racism, its calling bad places what they are

I could list several inner cities that meet those words too
Nah --he said "people" - “Why are we having all these people from s---hole countries come here?”

And damn the leaker for letting that racist comment get out!!

 
This is just a different way of saying that people are coming to the United States because this is the greatest country on earth.  Compared to Mexico or Guatemala or Cuba or whatever, it's a golden land of opportunity by comparison.  They're coming here because the US gives hard-working people a fair chance to make a better life for their kids and grandkids.  

Patriotic, pro-American people should be happy about that.  Every Mexican who sneaks across the Rio Grande is endorsing your view of America's goodness and refuting the negative narrative of this country endorsed by the Wokenvolk.  

You like Trump, right?  If you think that Trump was putting the US on the path toward national greatness, how can you object to Nicaraguans (say) wanting to get in on that action?  Of course people are going to want to sign up for a winning team. 
we do not have the resources to handle a million immigrants a year.  if I'm not mistaken the original intent was for the betterment of our country & applicants had to show that.  I may be mistaken though.

 
Nah --he said "people" - “Why are we having all these people from s---hole countries come here?”

And damn the leaker for letting that racist comment get out!!


Why are we having all these people  - not racist

from s---hole countries come here - not racist, vulgar yes, accurate yes .... not racist

the answer is what Biden already gave us - they're not good places to live

 
This is just a different way of saying that people are coming to the United States because this is the greatest country on earth.  Compared to Mexico or Guatemala or Cuba or whatever, it's a golden land of opportunity by comparison.  They're coming here because the US gives hard-working people a fair chance to make a better life for their kids and grandkids.  

Patriotic, pro-American people should be happy about that.  Every Mexican who sneaks across the Rio Grande is endorsing your view of America's goodness and refuting the negative narrative of this country endorsed by the Wokenvolk.  

You like Trump, right?  If you think that Trump was putting the US on the path toward national greatness, how can you object to Nicaraguans (say) wanting to get in on that action?  Of course people are going to want to sign up for a winning team. 


thank you for being honest - has NOTHING to do with seeking asylum like Democrats pushed - they lied

again - and why people ignore this baffles me ...... ILLEGAL is the problem, always has been

immigration is supposed to be controlled - and it isn't, and that's one of the core responsivities of the US Govt IMO, and they've failed over and over and Democrats fight tooth and nail to keep all the illegals pouring in and they've got it going on right now boy, record illegals pouring into the USA 

 
much like your terminology for the "unborn" your terminology for the "Illegals" is another concept that has some real trouble being rooted in fact.

What makes someone "Illegal"?  Well, the process for naturalization has always been fraught with issues with caps and the like.  Why is someone coming from Cuba considered "legal" but someone from Haiti is not?  Historically there have been quotas and the like as to the people we "desire" int he country when history has shown anyone who comes to America and works at it likely ends up better off than if they stayed where they were.

We still spend so much time and attention yelling about the "southern Border" when most "Non-legal" Immigration occurs from people overstaying their travel/tourist Visas at airports.

I live in South Florida so we have a pretty decent mix of people here with papers and people here without.  I examine them in my office all the time.  I have yet to notice a difference between the two...
The bolded is a great call out

I suspect that the "southern border" makes for better political theater  

 
This thread's been a great reminder of why I left this place a couple years ago. I know people like this exist, but I'm very lucky in that I don't have many of them in my life and so they can remain an abstract concept. Call it a bubble if you want, but it's good for mental health.

Seeing this brand of hatred out in the open like this- how little some people care about the lives of their fellow Americans who can't go to places of worship without fearing for their lives, not to mention their contempt for needy refugees who still want to be a part of this great country- it's rough. There are people here demanding preventative action to protect the rights of Supreme Court Justices who face little to no real danger, and then turning around and condoning or even echoing rhetoric that leads directly to mass murder and defending the powerful people who promulgate it. 

I thought this clip captured my feelings at the moment pretty well. It's from Maddow, but I don't watch her show (I dislike pretty much able cable news) and she contributes very little here, so if you hate her but want to watch just cover her up or something. The guest, Ben Collins, is one of the best journalists out there covering extremism and internet subculture. And he's simply out of ideas. There's a lot of good content in the clip, but the most jarring thing is how visibly shaken he is. He knows as well as anyone, and far better than any of us, what's out there on internet and the harm it's causing in the real world, and he can barely get through five minutes of discussion on the subject without breaking down. Hanging around here is starting to feel like that.

I wish you all the best. See you in the NBA, Netflix, and funny kid quotes threads in the FFA  :bye:

 
The bolded is a great call out

I suspect that the "southern border" makes for better political theater  


are ya'll telling me there are 250,000 over staying VISA's every month right now ?

thing is - nobody agree's with overstaying VISA's either - lets all work to stop those and send them back to their home countries 

the drugs, the human trafficking ... southern border problems and then, the hundreds of thousands coming across too and of course, covid and diseases 

can you imagine in your home town tomorrow morning, 25,000 people from another country walking in? where will they sleep? what will they eat? who will give them money? what is the impact on your town ?  that's what border cities / farms deal with .... its unbelievable 

 
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are ya'll telling me there are 250,000 over staying VISA's every month right now ?

thing is - nobody agree's with overstaying VISA's either - lets all work to stop those and send them back to their home countries 

the drugs, the human trafficking ... southern border problems and then, the hundreds of thousands coming across too and of course, covid and diseases 

can you imagine in your home town tomorrow morning, 25,000 people from another country walking in? where will they sleep? what will they eat? who will give them money? what is the impact on your town ?  that's what border cities / farms deal with .... its unbelievable 
I'm sure you can find some other sources if you like, but here is an article from 2019 that talks about visa overstays vs. southern border crossings.

https://www.npr.org/2019/01/16/686056668/for-seventh-consecutive-year-visa-overstays-exceeded-illegal-border-crossings

 
If the numbers are about the same, would this change your stance?


no, in that I don't want anyone here illegally

yes, in that the focus needs to add the stopping/cracksdowns of VISA's 

but again, we're seeing record numbers pouring across the southern border - drugs, human trafficking ... those problems need highlighted because they go hand in hard with weak border than Biden and Democrats insist on

 
I'm sure you can find some other sources if you like, but here is an article from 2019 that talks about visa overstays vs. southern border crossings.

https://www.npr.org/2019/01/16/686056668/for-seventh-consecutive-year-visa-overstays-exceeded-illegal-border-crossings


I don't think you'll find one person who is in favor of closing our southern border who is not in favor of going after Visa overstays as well.  If we had done that 22 years ago we might not have had 9/11.   Unfortunately, our government has not been doing their job regarding EITHER type of illegal immigrant.

 
I don't think you'll find one person who is in favor of closing our southern border who is not in favor of going after Visa overstays as well.  If we had done that 22 years ago we might not have had 9/11.   Unfortunately, our government has not been doing their job regarding EITHER type of illegal immigrant.
Perhaps you are correct. But I have noticed (whether on this board or various media outlets) that whenever someone complains about immigration, they ALWAYS mention the southern border. Those same people almost NEVER mention visa overstays, despite the overstays being a larger contributor to the issue they are complaining about.

As I said previously 'southern border' make for better political theater 

 
it seems you are ok with casting laws aside when it fits what you want - is this what I'm reading ?

illegal literally means NOT LEGAL .... and if you're not in the USA legally, you are, therefore, ILLEGAL

its pretty straight forward
Does trespassing make a person illegal, or is it just their action that is illegal?

 
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Does trespassing make a person illegal, or is it just their action that is illegal?


one in the same

if I break into your house tonight - I'm illegal, I'm illegally there, my actions are illegal, everything about it all is illegal

if I try and justify that you shouldn't have put locks on your doors, your places is nicer than mine and therefore I deserve to be in your place etc etc ..... that's not what our laws say is it ?

 
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Perhaps you are correct. But I have noticed (whether on this board or various media outlets) that whenever someone complains about immigration, they ALWAYS mention the southern border. Those same people almost NEVER mention visa overstays, despite the overstays being a larger contributor to the issue they are complaining about.

As I said previously 'southern border' make for better political theater 


if VISA stayers were trafficking kids, drugs, and a humanitarian crisis .... we'd see more on them I imagine 

but yes - both need dealt with

 
Thanks for clarifying. You use different definitions than the rest of the country. 


I don't think so, no

I'm not sugar coating or trying to pacify radical left .... people here illegally are here illegally and we don't need that in our country

Do you believe 10-15 million people should just do whatever they want in the USA and pay no attention to our laws ? if you do - then that's one thing but if you don't? they you can't really support all the illegally here people 

 
I don't think so, no

I'm not sugar coating or trying to pacify radical left .... people here illegally are here illegally and we don't need that in our country

Do you believe 10-15 million people should just do whatever they want in the USA and pay no attention to our laws ? if you do - then that's one thing but if you don't? they you can't really support all the illegally here people 
Thanks for sharing your views. I think people can be in the country illegally. I don’t think that makes a person illegal.  I understand what you are saying, but I would choose a phrase that doesn’t dehumanize the person as much. 
 

 
Thanks for sharing your views. I think people can be in the country illegally. I don’t think that makes a person illegal.  I understand what you are saying, but I would choose a phrase that doesn’t dehumanize the person as much. 
 


here illegally is here illegally, they are illegal in their actions just like anyone breaking our laws

what the left/liberals call that dehumanizing I don't understand .... I think it just grabs more attention is all ?? I don't know

 
here illegally is here illegally, they are illegal in their actions just like anyone breaking our laws

what the left/liberals call that dehumanizing I don't understand .... I think it just grabs more attention is all ?? I don't know
Hypothetical - illegal immigrant from Mexico is in Arkansas and is 8 weeks pregnant.  Do you want her to stay in Arkansas and have the baby or get deported back to Mexico where she can have a legal abortion?

 
In general, our Mexican and Central American immigrants seem to be just the kind of folks we want here. Believe in the American dream of hard work and upward mobility, happy to be somewhere that has a better democratic system than their home countries (though the gap is narrowing because of our systemic shortcomings).

Their votes are there for either party to grab imho.

 
Hypothetical - illegal immigrant from Mexico is in Arkansas and is 8 weeks pregnant.  Do you want her to stay in Arkansas and have the baby or get deported back to Mexico where she can have a legal abortion?


I cannot control what she does when she gets back to where she's legally supposed to be, she should never be here illegally to begin with 

 
In general, our Mexican and Central American immigrants seem to be just the kind of folks we want here. Believe in the American dream of hard work and upward mobility, happy to be somewhere that has a better democratic system than their home countries (though the gap is narrowing because of our systemic shortcomings).

Their votes are there for either party to grab imho.


so doing things legally is irrelevant ?

can I stop paying taxes? can I remove my name from draft? can I ignore insurance laws and things like that and get Govt free things ? I'm a citizen - but I want to be like an illegal 

 
so doing things legally is irrelevant ?

can I stop paying taxes? can I remove my name from draft? can I ignore insurance laws and things like that and get Govt free things ? I'm a citizen - but I want to be like an illegal 
Dude.  Read his post.  He's talking immigrants (of which our country was built on), not illegals.  

 
Dude.  Read his post.  He's talking immigrants (of which our country was built on), not illegals.  
I think this gets at what people have been talking about in the last couple days.    Other groups are just as likely to be here illegally as Latinos (expired visas, etc), but very little talk about those groups.   We start talking about immigrants and people jump to illegals.   As if we can tell interacting with them which is which, but when we focus so much on illegal, then people tend to side-eye all of them and generalizing.  Then start adding in that the dems are doing this solely for votes, and it's getting toxic in a hurry. 

 
I think this gets at what people have been talking about in the last couple days.    Other groups are just as likely to be here illegally as Latinos (expired visas, etc), but very little talk about those groups.   We start talking about immigrants and people jump to illegals.   As if we can tell interacting with them which is which, but when we focus so much on illegal, then people tend to side-eye all of them and generalizing.  Then start adding in that the dems are doing this solely for votes, and it's getting toxic in a hurry. 
Based on the definitions set on the last couple pages, every single one of us in this country are 'illegal'.  Let that sink in for a second  :lol:    There MIGHT be a terminology and language problem here.

 
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Dude.  Read his post.  He's talking immigrants (of which our country was built on), not illegals.  


very few people have problems with immigrants

illegally here people is the problem, and the southern border is unlike overstaying Visa's because of the human/sex trafficking, the drugs, the humanitarian crisis etc

but if here illegally, that's illegal 

 
Is this a necessary whataboutism in this thread? Jesus dude


I'm guessing that any 12 year old getting gender reassignment procedures has already taken the necessary step of seeing a shrink.
. Interesting.  Because it seems the focus with that is to support and encourage a 12 year old child on his or her gender fluidity but if he or she wants to read communist propaganda they have to be sent to a shrink?  Why?  to change their thinking?  Or to support their journey into the world of communism.  I read that as this 12 year old kid is messed up for the communism perspective, but heck yeah!! Let's make sure he can become a girl!! That part is ok

 
. Interesting.  Because it seems the focus with that is to support and encourage a 12 year old child on his or her gender fluidity but if he or she wants to read communist propaganda they have to be sent to a shrink?  Why?  to change their thinking?  Or to support their journey into the world of communism.  I read that as this 12 year old kid is messed up for the communism perspective, but heck yeah!! Let's make sure he can become a girl!! That part is ok
Is this supposed to be a satirical post about how conservatives don't understand the process those transitioning have to go through?

 
. Interesting.  Because it seems the focus with that is to support and encourage a 12 year old child on his or her gender fluidity but if he or she wants to read communist propaganda they have to be sent to a shrink?  Why?  to change their thinking?  Or to support their journey into the world of communism.  I read that as this 12 year old kid is messed up for the communism perspective, but heck yeah!! Let's make sure he can become a girl!! That part is ok
It seems like that is the intent because right wing media and politicians have latched onto this issue as a front line in the culture wars, and it gins up enough outrage that they'll keep doing it, even though it's completely untruthful. 

 

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