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You obviously don't know much about the NFL if you think Pat Kirwin is a dope. He is probably the most knowledgable NFL analyist out there. The dude was in the Jets personel department for a lot of years and knows the system better than most past players. You diss Kirwin you diss yourself.
Actually, your first sentence is likely correct. While Edge will get a big payday, he will likely have very few(<3) suitors.
Randle El is going to get a huge contract...some have speculated he could get as much as $10 million in a signing bonus
Who's supposed to be in the market for Randle El? All I hear about is CHI but if it's a bidding war between PIT and CHI there's no way PIT is going to drive the price up anywhere near a $10mil signing bonus.
I haven't followed it that closely, but I do know that Chicago will definitely target him. Personally, I don't think he's close to being worth that much but everyone seems to hype him up b/c he can also return punts and run some trick plays.
Diesel, I am in complete agreement with you. I can't believe this guy hasn't gotten more press. He has played fairly well in his limited action. Most importantly, he has won football games. The W/L record of Arizona with him as their starting QB is noticably higher when he has started and when he hasnt. How many chances do teams get to sign a young QB with upside who have a body of work for teams to evaluate him on? I know if I were a team in need of a QB, he'd be one of the first guys I called.
I agree with Kirwan about McCown, and think he is the 2nd best QB option besides Brees.
He was very raw coming out of college, and really needs to get into a situation with could coaching.
Hes got great physical tools, can make all the throws....just really needs to have a great coach to work with him on the little things.
If I were an NFL GM, Id be all over him, and treat him almost like I would a rookie QB, giving him a year to learn the system and work on the fundamentals.
I think he'll turn out to be a very good player in the NFL.
IMO.using his criteria what does your top ten list look like? Will you put damaged goods like Ahman Green, Deshaun Foster and Drew Brees in? No. Michael Bennett? No. Chester Taylor? nope. There aren't any receivers that are top ten except ARE. Maybe Runyan at Tackle but won't he be franchised? I could see a case for bentley at C. Now that Abraham has been tagged. i'd move Howard onto the list. I think the list is about right.As for Kirwin, offhand not sure how sharp he is or isn't, but that list is a real
All hail the mighty Kirwin!! How he drafted Montana,Rice and Craig was a work of art. Getting Aikman, Irvin and Smith was pure genius!! He was the only one who saw the talent of Brady and the miracle work of Belicheck. No wonder he is an ANALYST!!Spare me the you diss yourself if you diss Kiriwin. You sit here in AZ and watch Mcnown play football for the past several years and you would understand why he should not rate that high on anyones F/A list. Sure, if it is a list for clipboard holders who slobber all over the #### of the starting QB. (See K. Warner). Mcnown acted like Montana himself signed with the Cards and was just thankful for the opportunity to stand near him in the shower. Physically talented, yes, but NFL defenses are alot smarter than he is, or will ever be.
Obviously you haven't been watching McCown that closely...Spare me the you diss yourself if you diss Kiriwin. You sit here in AZ and watch Mcnown play football for the past several years and you would understand why he should not rate that high on anyones F/A list. Sure, if it is a list for clipboard holders who slobber all over the #### of the starting QB. (See K. Warner). Mcnown acted like Montana himself signed with the Cards and was just thankful for the opportunity to stand near him in the shower. Physically talented, yes, but NFL defenses are alot smarter than he is, or will ever be.
I can't think of 1 NFL team that Mcnown could win the starting job at. Including Miami and Detroit.
So, go ahead and hope your favorite team signs him to a long term deal to be your back-up. It will be money well spent.
You're making yourself look worse and worse. Just stop.All hail the mighty Kirwin!! How he drafted Montana,Rice and Craig was a work of art. Getting Aikman, Irvin and Smith was pure genius!! He was the only one who saw the talent of Brady and the miracle work of Belicheck. No wonder he is an ANALYST!!Spare me the you diss yourself if you diss Kiriwin. You sit here in AZ and watch Mcnown play football for the past several years and you would understand why he should not rate that high on anyones F/A list. Sure, if it is a list for clipboard holders who slobber all over the #### of the starting QB. (See K. Warner). Mcnown acted like Montana himself signed with the Cards and was just thankful for the opportunity to stand near him in the shower. Physically talented, yes, but NFL defenses are alot smarter than he is, or will ever be.
I can't think of 1 NFL team that Mcnown could win the starting job at. Including Miami and Detroit.
So, go ahead and hope your favorite team signs him to a long term deal to be your back-up. It will be money well spent.
Why would you incoherently blast a two-week old article?
Sorry, but your circular reasoning isn't really going to sway my opinion (or anyone else's).If you disagree, I'd like to know why. I think he poses a viable argument for his list, and it makes you think. I fail to see how your asking of a few very simple questions completely invalidates his article or him as a football intellect.
Sorry, but I already explained my reasoning, which was hardly "circular." Might want to get someone to explain the term to you. And I really have no interest in "swaying" anyone - just expressing opinions on the topic/article.
You would, if you bothered to read what I've already stated.
And that makes him a worse FA pickup than the likes of Kitna, Randy L, or
McCown because.....Oh well, at least you finally got around to actually addressing the article and players.
There's no sustainable argument here. You load it up with a few baseless opinions in the first "paragraph" (I merely use that as a means to identify the few short and choppy sentences you use), pose a couple very simple and rhetorical questions (as if supporting some point that you have), and then you deflate those opinions in the next paragraph by implying that he wasn't set up to succeed in the first place. And your rebuttal to that? "Oh, but he had good Receivers!" It doesn't matter how good your receivers are if you don't have the protection or running game to consistently get them the ball. Finally, your last paragraph supports your counter-argument!Now, as for McCown being terrible, here's some easy evidence that he's perfectly capable of succeeding.If "being raw" means "he sucks" I agree.
Sorry, he's not a guy I would call a great FA grab. I wouldn't mind him as a cheap "project" but is he really going to be all that cheap? And wouldn't he be looking for a strong chance at a starting job - one he doesn't deserve?
As for his "upside," let's review 05. This is no rook; it was his 3d year with a significant amount of reps...true, the OL is suspect and the RBs stunk, but he also had arguably the best starting WRs in the game.
He threw 9 TDs and 11 INTs on his way to a career-best 74.9 rating (which included a win over a pathetic SF team and a meaningless game vs Colt 2d stringers - which they still lost). Not to mention the (former) backing and mentoring of ol Denny "Grand slam" Green, the supposed QB whiz....
....who went out and signed (and now re-signed) Warner.
<_<
As for Kirwin, offhand not sure how sharp he is or isn't, but that list is a real
That post up there was completely empty drivel. Now, read your "analysis" again. This is exactly what you wrote.
There's no sustainable argument here. You load it up with a few baseless opinions in the first "paragraph" (I merely use that as a means to identify the few short and choppy sentences you use), pose a couple very simple and rhetorical questions (as if supporting some point that you have), and then you deflate those opinions in the next paragraph by implying that he wasn't set up to succeed in the first place. And your rebuttal to that? "Oh, but he had good Receivers!" It doesn't matter how good your receivers are if you don't have the protection or running game to consistently get them the ball. Finally, your last paragraph supports your counter-argument!Now, as for McCown being terrible, here's some easy evidence that he's perfectly capable of succeeding.If "being raw" means "he sucks" I agree.
Sorry, he's not a guy I would call a great FA grab. I wouldn't mind him as a cheap "project" but is he really going to be all that cheap? And wouldn't he be looking for a strong chance at a starting job - one he doesn't deserve?
As for his "upside," let's review 05. This is no rook; it was his 3d year with a significant amount of reps...true, the OL is suspect and the RBs stunk, but he also had arguably the best starting WRs in the game.
He threw 9 TDs and 11 INTs on his way to a career-best 74.9 rating (which included a win over a pathetic SF team and a meaningless game vs Colt 2d stringers - which they still lost). Not to mention the (former) backing and mentoring of ol Denny "Grand slam" Green, the supposed QB whiz....
....who went out and signed (and now re-signed) Warner.
<_<
As for Kirwin, offhand not sure how sharp he is or isn't, but that list is a real
Take a look at his game stats:
http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/302085/gamelogs/2005
Do you see that in some games (v. SF, CAR, PHI, @IND) he had great numbers? Then some games he had terrible numbers. That's potential. It's not "oh he's a bad QB because Denny Green wants to win now so he signed Warner."
Like Deisel said, the guy just needs more coaching, and he's certainly capable of being a very good QB in the NFL.
Please learn to make an intelligible argument before trying to pass off statements of opinion as statements of fact. As you can see, it's very easy to poke holes in swiss cheese, and neither of us really comes out as a winner, since there wasn't really a bout of wits to begin with.
Id love to apply what you just said to 25% of the posts in the Shark Pool. Thank you for writing that out.
what means this?
You're exactly right. I've given up defending Randle El on FF boards. Either you get it or you don't. I'm glad to see one of the better analysts gets it. (Or maybe I'm just happy that someone who knows something agrees with me.) I can see placing Witherspoon ahead of him, and Edge is too low, but the others won't help their new team nearly as much as Randle El will.
