Looting in Missouri after cops shoot 18 year old (2 Viewers)

[msommer]

Why does Wilson have to be firing before Brown charges towards him?

Why else would he stop?

Stop what?

running away

Wilson shot him in the back?

In the video where the body is laying on the ground and the two officers are standing alone, one pacing there is no police vehicle in sight. How did the body get away from the police vehicle if Brown did not run away?

I'm not saying he didn't run away. I'm asking why Wilson had to start shooting at Brown before Brown charges towards him. To get him to stop running would put bullets in Browns back.

Or a graze on the hand or arm (coroner states possible) or a close miss.Remember we still do not know how many shots fired.

Or Wilson in the heat of the moment called Brown a ###### as Brown was running away, prompting Brown to stop and come back to pound on Wilson some more... until he was pumped full of lead.

I'm not saying I know what happened. I'm just amazed that Tim can't imagine Brown doing something irrational that would result in him charging back towards Wilson. It was a heated fight. Just because Brown ran after assaulting Wilson, doesn't mean he's "Let It Go". I've seen many fights that looked over that rekindled into a second round. Again, I don't know what happened, but could Brown have charged back at Wilson for a second go 'round?... of course he could have. It's not out of the realm of possibility like Tim claims.

Possible, but much less likely than stopping because the officer fired his gun. Agreed?

 

[Christo]

In the video where the body is laying on the ground and the two officers are standing alone, one pacing there is no police vehicle in sight.

How did the body get away from the police vehicle if Brown did not run away?

They moved the vehicle?

The vehicle that was part of the crime scene, where allegedly a felony took place (assaulting an officer of the law)?

That sounds like an interesting theory

Yet, people are claiming that this was the most incompetent police force in the history of mankind.

And others claim that at least one of the police officers involved had an exemplary record in said police force

Maybe it wasn't him who moved it.

Reaching are we?

Maybe the ace officer should have told the other guy. Dude, that's a crime scene

Yeah, I'm the one who's reaching even though I'm not the one drawing a conclusion from a quick video that was taken sometime after the incident.

You really use those emoticons a lot when you run out of coherent arguments. Have you noticed that?

 

[Politician Spock]

Why does Wilson have to be firing before Brown charges towards him?

Why else would he stop?

Stop what?

running away

Wilson shot him in the back?

In the video where the body is laying on the ground and the two officers are standing alone, one pacing there is no police vehicle in sight. How did the body get away from the police vehicle if Brown did not run away?

I'm not saying he didn't run away. I'm asking why Wilson had to start shooting at Brown before Brown charges towards him. To get him to stop running would put bullets in Browns back.

Or a graze on the hand or arm (coroner states possible) or a close miss.Remember we still do not know how many shots fired.

Or Wilson in the heat of the moment called Brown a ###### as Brown was running away, prompting Brown to stop and come back to pound on Wilson some more... until he was pumped full of lead.

I'm not saying I know what happened. I'm just amazed that Tim can't imagine Brown doing something irrational that would result in him charging back towards Wilson. It was a heated fight. Just because Brown ran after assaulting Wilson, doesn't mean he's "Let It Go". I've seen many fights that looked over that rekindled into a second round. Again, I don't know what happened, but could Brown have charged back at Wilson for a second go 'round?... of course he could have. It's not out of the realm of possibility like Tim claims.

Possible, but much less likely than stopping because the officer fired his gun. Agreed?

No.

I'm not looking for the best odds to place my bet. I'm wondering why Tim is claiming things that are possible aren't.

 

[msommer]

Maybe it wasn't him who moved it.

Reaching are we?

Maybe the ace officer should have told the other guy. Dude, that's a crime scene

Maybe Wilson wasn't standing right next to his car when he fired. Maybe the "scuffle" started at the car and took both ~10-30 feet from the car before a gun was drawn. We still don't know what happened.

So why speculate?

You were the one who said he was running away.

Are you saying he was shot next to the police car?

How would he be able to rush the officer if he is standing next to the door?

How does the officer get out of the car with a 290 pound standing by the door?

 

[Christo]

Maybe it wasn't him who moved it.

Reaching are we?

Maybe the ace officer should have told the other guy. Dude, that's a crime scene

Maybe Wilson wasn't standing right next to his car when he fired. Maybe the "scuffle" started at the car and took both ~10-30 feet from the car before a gun was drawn. We still don't know what happened.

So why speculate?

You were the one who said he was running away.

Are you saying he was shot next to the police car?

How would he be able to rush the officer if he is standing next to the door?

How does the officer get out of the car with a 290 pound standing by the door?

Let's deal with your speculation first. You were the one who said he was running away. What's your basis for that conclusion?

 

[msommer]

Maybe it wasn't him who moved it.

Reaching are we?

Maybe the ace officer should have told the other guy. Dude, that's a crime scene

Maybe Wilson wasn't standing right next to his car when he fired. Maybe the "scuffle" started at the car and took both ~10-30 feet from the car before a gun was drawn. We still don't know what happened.

So why speculate?

You were the one who said he was running away.

Are you saying he was shot next to the police car?

How would he be able to rush the officer if he is standing next to the door?

How does the officer get out of the car with a 290 pound standing by the door?

Let's deal with your speculation first. You were the one who said he was running away. What's your basis for that conclusion?

you were laughing at it further up the thread. Short term memory issues?

 

[lod01]

Right now the only thing that matters is that Wilson shot Brown from a distance of 30 feet, and Brown was unarmed.

We don't know that Wilson shot Brown from thirty feet away. That thirty feet estimate was provided by Dorian Johnson. The autopsy neither confirmed nor dismissed the thirty feet estimate.

Didn't Johnson also say that Brown was shot in the back, or at least while running away - which the autopsy dismissed. I can pretty much forgive him for not mentioning the robbery - but not mentioning it along with telling his side of the shooting which the autopsy dismissed pretty much makes me think that anything he says is false.

how many missed shots were there?

We don't yet know that (add another thing to the list). Being that we do know that 6 shots hit Brown, and that all the reports I've seen say they heard "at least 5 shots", I'm going to guess not many. Has anyone said they have heard 8+ shots?

Dorian Johnson said Brown was shot once at close range, once as he ran away (which looking at the autopsy drawing, could be the shot in the hand or forearm) and that the officer shot 7 more times after Brown turned around to surrender. Of course, I don't think its unreasonable for a witness to miscount how many shots fired in that situation.

Doesn't matter what that guy says. He would be destroyed in a cross examination. He will actually only hurt the Brown case.

 

[lod01]

I can't wrap my head around why Brown (according to some reports) would be beating the guy up.....run 30 feet away and then decide to finially do something right and "freeze" when ordered to. Why not just keep running?

Marijuana in system. It is possible he was high at the time. Most people are paranoid when high. Not all.

Aaaaand we have a winner....a couple of us were wondering when someone was going to play the weed card lol

You are aware that there's a reason why they do toxicology reports on the deceased in such situations? It's because substances in your system can and often do alter behavior. If it wasn't potentially relevant they wouldn't waste the time, energy, and money having the tests performed.

BustedKnuckles goes to the same school as Sinn Fein and Tobias Funke. The school of illogic and lets make #### up.

I love how the articles are slowly coming out making these guys look ridiculous and totally clueless.

Darren Wilson has a perfectly clean record of service.

https://news.yahoo.com/video-ferguson-officer-darren-wilson-commended-for-struggle-with-previous-suspect-182521551.html

However apparently he is a bad cop that murdered a man in the middle of broad daylight. Just ask Tobias Funke.

at the those that are saying Wilson didn't get assaulted by Brown and that he doesn't have a broken orbital socket. You will once again just look ridiculous. Your best move is to exit this thread and stop embarrassing yourselves. I don't think you have gotten anything right yet.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/08/20/missouri-cop-was-badly-beaten-before-shooting-michael-brown-says-source/

Gotta love the guilty until proven innocent crowd.

 

[Christo]

Maybe it wasn't him who moved it.

Reaching are we?

Maybe the ace officer should have told the other guy. Dude, that's a crime scene

Maybe Wilson wasn't standing right next to his car when he fired. Maybe the "scuffle" started at the car and took both ~10-30 feet from the car before a gun was drawn. We still don't know what happened.

So why speculate?

You were the one who said he was running away.

Are you saying he was shot next to the police car?

How would he be able to rush the officer if he is standing next to the door?

How does the officer get out of the car with a 290 pound standing by the door?

Let's deal with your speculation first. You were the one who said he was running away. What's your basis for that conclusion?

you were laughing at it further up the thread. Short term memory issues?

I was laughing for a reason. I thought you might have an actual good reason.

 

[msommer]

Maybe it wasn't him who moved it.

Reaching are we?

Maybe the ace officer should have told the other guy. Dude, that's a crime scene

Maybe Wilson wasn't standing right next to his car when he fired. Maybe the "scuffle" started at the car and took both ~10-30 feet from the car before a gun was drawn. We still don't know what happened.

So why speculate?

You were the one who said he was running away.

Are you saying he was shot next to the police car?

How would he be able to rush the officer if he is standing next to the door?

How does the officer get out of the car with a 290 pound standing by the door?

Let's deal with your speculation first. You were the one who said he was running away. What's your basis for that conclusion?

you were laughing at it further up the thread. Short term memory issues?

I was laughing for a reason. I thought you might have an actual good reason.

So, now that we've discussed my speculation. What's yours

 

[lod01]

Officer 'Go #### Yourself' suspended for losing his mind.

 

[PatsWillWin]

ccording to the well-placed source, Wilson was coming off another case in the neighborhood on Aug. 9 when he ordered Michael Brown and his friend Dorain Johnson to stop walking in the middle of the road because they were obstructing traffic. However, the confrontation quickly escalated into physical violence, the source said.

“They ignored him and the officer started to get out of the car to tell them to move," the source said. "They shoved him right back in, that’s when Michael Brown leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and the face."

The source claims that there is "solid proof" that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson for the policeman’s firearm, resulting in the gun going off – although it still remains unclear at this stage who pulled the trigger. Brown started to walk away according to the account, prompting Wilson to draw his gun and order him to freeze. Brown, the source said, raised his hands in the air, and turned around saying, "What, you're going to shoot me?"

At that point, the source told FoxNews.com, the 6-foot-4, 292-pound Brown charged Wilson, prompting the officer to fire at least six shots at him, including the fatal bullet that penetrated the top of Brown's skull, according to an independent autopsy conducted at the request of Brown's family.

Wilson suffered a fractured eye socket in the fracas, and was left dazed by the initial confrontation, the source said. He is now "traumatized, scared for his life and his family, injured and terrified" that a grand jury, which began hearing evidence on Wednesday, will "make some kind of example out of him," the source said.

 

[Greggity]

ccording to the well-placed source, Wilson was coming off another case in the neighborhood on Aug. 9 when he ordered Michael Brown and his friend Dorain Johnson to stop walking in the middle of the road because they were obstructing traffic. However, the confrontation quickly escalated into physical violence, the source said.

“They ignored him and the officer started to get out of the car to tell them to move," the source said. "They shoved him right back in, that’s when Michael Brown leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and the face."

The source claims that there is "solid proof" that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson for the policeman’s firearm, resulting in the gun going off – although it still remains unclear at this stage who pulled the trigger. Brown started to walk away according to the account, prompting Wilson to draw his gun and order him to freeze. Brown, the source said, raised his hands in the air, and turned around saying, "What, you're going to shoot me?"

At that point, the source told FoxNews.com, the 6-foot-4, 292-pound Brown charged Wilson, prompting the officer to fire at least six shots at him, including the fatal bullet that penetrated the top of Brown's skull, according to an independent autopsy conducted at the request of Brown's family.

Wilson suffered a fractured eye socket in the fracas, and was left dazed by the initial confrontation, the source said. He is now "traumatized, scared for his life and his family, injured and terrified" that a grand jury, which began hearing evidence on Wednesday, will "make some kind of example out of him," the source said.

He should be concerned. The white guilt is strong in this country....

 

[msommer]

ccording to the well-placed source, Wilson was coming off another case in the neighborhood on Aug. 9 when he ordered Michael Brown and his friend Dorain Johnson to stop walking in the middle of the road because they were obstructing traffic. However, the confrontation quickly escalated into physical violence, the source said.

“They ignored him and the officer started to get out of the car to tell them to move," the source said. "They shoved him right back in, that’s when Michael Brown leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and the face."

The source claims that there is "solid proof" that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson for the policeman’s firearm, resulting in the gun going off – although it still remains unclear at this stage who pulled the trigger. Brown started to walk away according to the account, prompting Wilson to draw his gun and order him to freeze. Brown, the source said, raised his hands in the air, and turned around saying, "What, you're going to shoot me?"

At that point, the source told FoxNews.com, the 6-foot-4, 292-pound Brown charged Wilson, prompting the officer to fire at least six shots at him, including the fatal bullet that penetrated the top of Brown's skull, according to an independent autopsy conducted at the request of Brown's family.

Wilson suffered a fractured eye socket in the fracas, and was left dazed by the initial confrontation, the source said. He is now "traumatized, scared for his life and his family, injured and terrified" that a grand jury, which began hearing evidence on Wednesday, will "make some kind of example out of him," the source said.

Great. More sources. That don't match the autopsy...

 

[financewonk]

ccording to the well-placed source, Wilson was coming off another case in the neighborhood on Aug. 9 when he ordered Michael Brown and his friend Dorain Johnson to stop walking in the middle of the road because they were obstructing traffic. However, the confrontation quickly escalated into physical violence, the source said.

“They ignored him and the officer started to get out of the car to tell them to move," the source said. "They shoved him right back in, that’s when Michael Brown leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and the face."

The source claims that there is "solid proof" that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson for the policeman’s firearm, resulting in the gun going off – although it still remains unclear at this stage who pulled the trigger. Brown started to walk away according to the account, prompting Wilson to draw his gun and order him to freeze. Brown, the source said, raised his hands in the air, and turned around saying, "What, you're going to shoot me?"

At that point, the source told FoxNews.com, the 6-foot-4, 292-pound Brown charged Wilson, prompting the officer to fire at least six shots at him, including the fatal bullet that penetrated the top of Brown's skull, according to an independent autopsy conducted at the request of Brown's family.

Wilson suffered a fractured eye socket in the fracas, and was left dazed by the initial confrontation, the source said. He is now "traumatized, scared for his life and his family, injured and terrified" that a grand jury, which began hearing evidence on Wednesday, will "make some kind of example out of him," the source said.

Great. More sources. That don't match the autopsy...

How does that source's version of events conflict with the autopsy?

 

[KCitons]

ccording to the well-placed source, Wilson was coming off another case in the neighborhood on Aug. 9 when he ordered Michael Brown and his friend Dorain Johnson to stop walking in the middle of the road because they were obstructing traffic. However, the confrontation quickly escalated into physical violence, the source said.

“They ignored him and the officer started to get out of the car to tell them to move," the source said. "They shoved him right back in, that’s when Michael Brown leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and the face."

The source claims that there is "solid proof" that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson for the policeman’s firearm, resulting in the gun going off – although it still remains unclear at this stage who pulled the trigger. Brown started to walk away according to the account, prompting Wilson to draw his gun and order him to freeze. Brown, the source said, raised his hands in the air, and turned around saying, "What, you're going to shoot me?"

At that point, the source told FoxNews.com, the 6-foot-4, 292-pound Brown charged Wilson, prompting the officer to fire at least six shots at him, including the fatal bullet that penetrated the top of Brown's skull, according to an independent autopsy conducted at the request of Brown's family.

Wilson suffered a fractured eye socket in the fracas, and was left dazed by the initial confrontation, the source said. He is now "traumatized, scared for his life and his family, injured and terrified" that a grand jury, which began hearing evidence on Wednesday, will "make some kind of example out of him," the source said.

I don't feel like looking for the video. If there was a shooting that happened in the police car, there should be crime scene tape around the car. I can't remember if the car was inside the tape or out.

 

[msommer]

ccording to the well-placed source, Wilson was coming off another case in the neighborhood on Aug. 9 when he ordered Michael Brown and his friend Dorain Johnson to stop walking in the middle of the road because they were obstructing traffic. However, the confrontation quickly escalated into physical violence, the source said.

“They ignored him and the officer started to get out of the car to tell them to move," the source said. "They shoved him right back in, that’s when Michael Brown leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and the face."

The source claims that there is "solid proof" that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson for the policeman’s firearm, resulting in the gun going off – although it still remains unclear at this stage who pulled the trigger. Brown started to walk away according to the account, prompting Wilson to draw his gun and order him to freeze. Brown, the source said, raised his hands in the air, and turned around saying, "What, you're going to shoot me?"

At that point, the source told FoxNews.com, the 6-foot-4, 292-pound Brown charged Wilson, prompting the officer to fire at least six shots at him, including the fatal bullet that penetrated the top of Brown's skull, according to an independent autopsy conducted at the request of Brown's family.

Wilson suffered a fractured eye socket in the fracas, and was left dazed by the initial confrontation, the source said. He is now "traumatized, scared for his life and his family, injured and terrified" that a grand jury, which began hearing evidence on Wednesday, will "make some kind of example out of him," the source said.

Great. More sources. That don't match the autopsy...

How does that source's version of events conflict with the autopsy?

No sign of abrasions from a struggle

 

[msommer]

ccording to the well-placed source, Wilson was coming off another case in the neighborhood on Aug. 9 when he ordered Michael Brown and his friend Dorain Johnson to stop walking in the middle of the road because they were obstructing traffic. However, the confrontation quickly escalated into physical violence, the source said.

“They ignored him and the officer started to get out of the car to tell them to move," the source said. "They shoved him right back in, that’s when Michael Brown leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and the face."

The source claims that there is "solid proof" that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson for the policeman’s firearm, resulting in the gun going off – although it still remains unclear at this stage who pulled the trigger. Brown started to walk away according to the account, prompting Wilson to draw his gun and order him to freeze. Brown, the source said, raised his hands in the air, and turned around saying, "What, you're going to shoot me?"

At that point, the source told FoxNews.com, the 6-foot-4, 292-pound Brown charged Wilson, prompting the officer to fire at least six shots at him, including the fatal bullet that penetrated the top of Brown's skull, according to an independent autopsy conducted at the request of Brown's family.

Wilson suffered a fractured eye socket in the fracas, and was left dazed by the initial confrontation, the source said. He is now "traumatized, scared for his life and his family, injured and terrified" that a grand jury, which began hearing evidence on Wednesday, will "make some kind of example out of him," the source said.

I don't feel like looking for the video. If there was a shooting that happened in the police car, there should be crime scene tape around the car. I can't remember if the car was inside the tape or out.

Outside

ETA: IIRC

 

[timschochet]

ccording to the well-placed source, Wilson was coming off another case in the neighborhood on Aug. 9 when he ordered Michael Brown and his friend Dorain Johnson to stop walking in the middle of the road because they were obstructing traffic. However, the confrontation quickly escalated into physical violence, the source said.

“They ignored him and the officer started to get out of the car to tell them to move," the source said. "They shoved him right back in, that’s when Michael Brown leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and the face."

The source claims that there is "solid proof" that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson for the policeman’s firearm, resulting in the gun going off – although it still remains unclear at this stage who pulled the trigger. Brown started to walk away according to the account, prompting Wilson to draw his gun and order him to freeze. Brown, the source said, raised his hands in the air, and turned around saying, "What, you're going to shoot me?"

At that point, the source told FoxNews.com, the 6-foot-4, 292-pound Brown charged Wilson, prompting the officer to fire at least six shots at him, including the fatal bullet that penetrated the top of Brown's skull, according to an independent autopsy conducted at the request of Brown's family.

Wilson suffered a fractured eye socket in the fracas, and was left dazed by the initial confrontation, the source said. He is now "traumatized, scared for his life and his family, injured and terrified" that a grand jury, which began hearing evidence on Wednesday, will "make some kind of example out of him," the source said.

It all seems plausible until the bolded part. He walks away, puts his hands up, and then charges a guy with a gun? I just don't buy it.

 

[KCitons]

ccording to the well-placed source, Wilson was coming off another case in the neighborhood on Aug. 9 when he ordered Michael Brown and his friend Dorain Johnson to stop walking in the middle of the road because they were obstructing traffic. However, the confrontation quickly escalated into physical violence, the source said.

“They ignored him and the officer started to get out of the car to tell them to move," the source said. "They shoved him right back in, that’s when Michael Brown leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and the face."

The source claims that there is "solid proof" that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson for the policeman’s firearm, resulting in the gun going off – although it still remains unclear at this stage who pulled the trigger. Brown started to walk away according to the account, prompting Wilson to draw his gun and order him to freeze. Brown, the source said, raised his hands in the air, and turned around saying, "What, you're going to shoot me?"

At that point, the source told FoxNews.com, the 6-foot-4, 292-pound Brown charged Wilson, prompting the officer to fire at least six shots at him, including the fatal bullet that penetrated the top of Brown's skull, according to an independent autopsy conducted at the request of Brown's family.

Wilson suffered a fractured eye socket in the fracas, and was left dazed by the initial confrontation, the source said. He is now "traumatized, scared for his life and his family, injured and terrified" that a grand jury, which began hearing evidence on Wednesday, will "make some kind of example out of him," the source said.

I don't feel like looking for the video. If there was a shooting that happened in the police car, there should be crime scene tape around the car. I can't remember if the car was inside the tape or out.

Outside

Thank You.

 

[Fennis]

The autopsy said Brown was hit "six to eight" times

Seriously? I thought it was 6 bullets, with one or possibly more that exited and re-entered. Are they saying more than 6 bullets struck him?

The Ferguson coroner said 6-8 and also said multiple chest wounds

The private consultant (forensic pathologist and medical examiner in NYC team) said that the one bullet that hit the eye travelled down and out under the jaw, entering the torso. six hits. three bullets recovered

Dr. Baden said that while Mr. Brown was shot at least six times, only three bullets were recovered from his body. But he has not yet seen the X-rays showing where the bullets were found, which would clarify the autopsy results. Nor has he had access to witness and police statements.

 

[Christo]

Maybe it wasn't him who moved it.

Reaching are we?

Maybe the ace officer should have told the other guy. Dude, that's a crime scene

Maybe Wilson wasn't standing right next to his car when he fired. Maybe the "scuffle" started at the car and took both ~10-30 feet from the car before a gun was drawn. We still don't know what happened.

So why speculate?

You were the one who said he was running away.

Are you saying he was shot next to the police car?

How would he be able to rush the officer if he is standing next to the door?

How does the officer get out of the car with a 290 pound standing by the door?

Let's deal with your speculation first. You were the one who said he was running away. What's your basis for that conclusion?

you were laughing at it further up the thread. Short term memory issues?

I was laughing for a reason. I thought you might have an actual good reason.

So, now that we've discussed my speculation. What's yours

I don't know what happened.

 

[financewonk]

ccording to the well-placed source, Wilson was coming off another case in the neighborhood on Aug. 9 when he ordered Michael Brown and his friend Dorain Johnson to stop walking in the middle of the road because they were obstructing traffic. However, the confrontation quickly escalated into physical violence, the source said.

“They ignored him and the officer started to get out of the car to tell them to move," the source said. "They shoved him right back in, that’s when Michael Brown leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and the face."

The source claims that there is "solid proof" that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson for the policeman’s firearm, resulting in the gun going off – although it still remains unclear at this stage who pulled the trigger. Brown started to walk away according to the account, prompting Wilson to draw his gun and order him to freeze. Brown, the source said, raised his hands in the air, and turned around saying, "What, you're going to shoot me?"

At that point, the source told FoxNews.com, the 6-foot-4, 292-pound Brown charged Wilson, prompting the officer to fire at least six shots at him, including the fatal bullet that penetrated the top of Brown's skull, according to an independent autopsy conducted at the request of Brown's family.

Wilson suffered a fractured eye socket in the fracas, and was left dazed by the initial confrontation, the source said. He is now "traumatized, scared for his life and his family, injured and terrified" that a grand jury, which began hearing evidence on Wednesday, will "make some kind of example out of him," the source said.

Great. More sources. That don't match the autopsy...

How does that source's version of events conflict with the autopsy?

No sign of abrasions from a struggle

That doesn't necessarily mean that there wasn't one. Perhaps Brown threw less than a handful of shots and Wilson didn't throw any. Moreover, if I recall correctly from Baden's press conference, he said nothing about examining Brown's hands one way or another.

 

[Courtjester]

ccording to the well-placed source, Wilson was coming off another case in the neighborhood on Aug. 9 when he ordered Michael Brown and his friend Dorain Johnson to stop walking in the middle of the road because they were obstructing traffic. However, the confrontation quickly escalated into physical violence, the source said.

“They ignored him and the officer started to get out of the car to tell them to move," the source said. "They shoved him right back in, that’s when Michael Brown leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and the face."

The source claims that there is "solid proof" that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson for the policeman’s firearm, resulting in the gun going off – although it still remains unclear at this stage who pulled the trigger. Brown started to walk away according to the account, prompting Wilson to draw his gun and order him to freeze. Brown, the source said, raised his hands in the air, and turned around saying, "What, you're going to shoot me?"

At that point, the source told FoxNews.com, the 6-foot-4, 292-pound Brown charged Wilson, prompting the officer to fire at least six shots at him, including the fatal bullet that penetrated the top of Brown's skull, according to an independent autopsy conducted at the request of Brown's family.

Wilson suffered a fractured eye socket in the fracas, and was left dazed by the initial confrontation, the source said. He is now "traumatized, scared for his life and his family, injured and terrified" that a grand jury, which began hearing evidence on Wednesday, will "make some kind of example out of him," the source said.

Great. More sources. That don't match the autopsy...

How does that source's version of events conflict with the autopsy?

I have seen probably 5 different articles that have advanced theories of what happened and then used the 2nd autopsy as the "proof" for the theory.

We can all keep guessing, but we need to see the complete formal 1st autopsy report because the 2nd one that so many are relying on was not complete and was impacted by the 1st one and Baden admitted that.

The medical examiner who did the first one had access to the clothes (very important)--Baden did not. Had access to the xrays showing any remaining bullets--Baden did not. And will ultimately have the toxicology levels. Baden did not as far as I know.

Baden was a hired expert (granted he waived his fee)--nothing more, nothing less and the family cherry picked the findings to fit their narrative.

 

[Widbil83]

ccording to the well-placed source, Wilson was coming off another case in the neighborhood on Aug. 9 when he ordered Michael Brown and his friend Dorain Johnson to stop walking in the middle of the road because they were obstructing traffic. However, the confrontation quickly escalated into physical violence, the source said.

“They ignored him and the officer started to get out of the car to tell them to move," the source said. "They shoved him right back in, that’s when Michael Brown leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and the face."

The source claims that there is "solid proof" that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson for the policeman’s firearm, resulting in the gun going off – although it still remains unclear at this stage who pulled the trigger. Brown started to walk away according to the account, prompting Wilson to draw his gun and order him to freeze. Brown, the source said, raised his hands in the air, and turned around saying, "What, you're going to shoot me?"

At that point, the source told FoxNews.com, the 6-foot-4, 292-pound Brown charged Wilson, prompting the officer to fire at least six shots at him, including the fatal bullet that penetrated the top of Brown's skull, according to an independent autopsy conducted at the request of Brown's family.

Wilson suffered a fractured eye socket in the fracas, and was left dazed by the initial confrontation, the source said. He is now "traumatized, scared for his life and his family, injured and terrified" that a grand jury, which began hearing evidence on Wednesday, will "make some kind of example out of him," the source said.

It all seems plausible until the bolded part. He walks away, puts his hands up, and then charges a guy with a gun? I just don't buy it.

Why wouldn't you buy it? This is the same guy who 10 minutes prior was caught on video robbing and assaulting an Indian store clerk. Seems perfectly plausible that he would continue to act crazy.

 

[Christo]

ccording to the well-placed source, Wilson was coming off another case in the neighborhood on Aug. 9 when he ordered Michael Brown and his friend Dorain Johnson to stop walking in the middle of the road because they were obstructing traffic. However, the confrontation quickly escalated into physical violence, the source said.

“They ignored him and the officer started to get out of the car to tell them to move," the source said. "They shoved him right back in, that’s when Michael Brown leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and the face."

The source claims that there is "solid proof" that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson for the policeman’s firearm, resulting in the gun going off – although it still remains unclear at this stage who pulled the trigger. Brown started to walk away according to the account, prompting Wilson to draw his gun and order him to freeze. Brown, the source said, raised his hands in the air, and turned around saying, "What, you're going to shoot me?"

At that point, the source told FoxNews.com, the 6-foot-4, 292-pound Brown charged Wilson, prompting the officer to fire at least six shots at him, including the fatal bullet that penetrated the top of Brown's skull, according to an independent autopsy conducted at the request of Brown's family.

Wilson suffered a fractured eye socket in the fracas, and was left dazed by the initial confrontation, the source said. He is now "traumatized, scared for his life and his family, injured and terrified" that a grand jury, which began hearing evidence on Wednesday, will "make some kind of example out of him," the source said.

It all seems plausible until the bolded part. He walks away, puts his hands up, and then charges a guy with a gun? I just don't buy it.

Why wouldn't you buy it? This is the same guy who 10 minutes prior was caught on video robbing and assaulting an Indian store clerk. Seems perfectly plausible that he would continue to act crazy.

[timscrotch]Objection, relevance![/timscrotch]

 

[financewonk]

O'Mara is on CNN talking about why you should never create a violent confrontation with a cop. He states that you will never win a fight with them, since they always have a right to use a higher degree force than you use.

 

[KCitons]

O'Mara is on CNN talking about why you should never create a violent confrontation with a cop. He states that you will never win a fight with them, since they always have a right to use a higher degree force than you use.

He also said you shouldn't tug on Superman's cape, or spit into the wind. Duh!

 

[msommer]

Let's deal with your speculation first. You were the one who said he was running away. What's your basis for that conclusion?

you were laughing at it further up the thread. Short term memory issues?

I was laughing for a reason. I thought you might have an actual good reason.

So, now that we've discussed my speculation. What's yours

I don't know what happened.

Don't weasel out now.

You speculated that the car was moved.

Go.

.

 

[msommer]

ccording to the well-placed source, Wilson was coming off another case in the neighborhood on Aug. 9 when he ordered Michael Brown and his friend Dorain Johnson to stop walking in the middle of the road because they were obstructing traffic. However, the confrontation quickly escalated into physical violence, the source said.

“They ignored him and the officer started to get out of the car to tell them to move," the source said. "They shoved him right back in, that’s when Michael Brown leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and the face."

The source claims that there is "solid proof" that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson for the policeman’s firearm, resulting in the gun going off – although it still remains unclear at this stage who pulled the trigger. Brown started to walk away according to the account, prompting Wilson to draw his gun and order him to freeze. Brown, the source said, raised his hands in the air, and turned around saying, "What, you're going to shoot me?"

At that point, the source told FoxNews.com, the 6-foot-4, 292-pound Brown charged Wilson, prompting the officer to fire at least six shots at him, including the fatal bullet that penetrated the top of Brown's skull, according to an independent autopsy conducted at the request of Brown's family.

Wilson suffered a fractured eye socket in the fracas, and was left dazed by the initial confrontation, the source said. He is now "traumatized, scared for his life and his family, injured and terrified" that a grand jury, which began hearing evidence on Wednesday, will "make some kind of example out of him," the source said.

Great. More sources. That don't match the autopsy...

How does that source's version of events conflict with the autopsy?

I have seen probably 5 different articles that have advanced theories of what happened and then used the 2nd autopsy as the "proof" for the theory.

We can all keep guessing, but we need to see the complete formal 1st autopsy report because the 2nd one that so many are relying on was not complete and was impacted by the 1st one and Baden admitted that.

The medical examiner who did the first one had access to the clothes (very important)--Baden did not. Had access to the xrays showing any remaining bullets--Baden did not. And will ultimately have the toxicology levels. Baden did not as far as I know.

Baden was a hired expert (granted he waived his fee)--nothing more, nothing less and the family cherry picked the findings to fit their narrative.

SO you're knocking the second autopsy for being incomplete, but stating the first was complete.

So where is it?

 

[Jim11]

ccording to the well-placed source, Wilson was coming off another case in the neighborhood on Aug. 9 when he ordered Michael Brown and his friend Dorain Johnson to stop walking in the middle of the road because they were obstructing traffic. However, the confrontation quickly escalated into physical violence, the source said.

“They ignored him and the officer started to get out of the car to tell them to move," the source said. "They shoved him right back in, that’s when Michael Brown leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and the face."

The source claims that there is "solid proof" that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson for the policeman’s firearm, resulting in the gun going off – although it still remains unclear at this stage who pulled the trigger. Brown started to walk away according to the account, prompting Wilson to draw his gun and order him to freeze. Brown, the source said, raised his hands in the air, and turned around saying, "What, you're going to shoot me?"

At that point, the source told FoxNews.com, the 6-foot-4, 292-pound Brown charged Wilson, prompting the officer to fire at least six shots at him, including the fatal bullet that penetrated the top of Brown's skull, according to an independent autopsy conducted at the request of Brown's family.

Wilson suffered a fractured eye socket in the fracas, and was left dazed by the initial confrontation, the source said. He is now "traumatized, scared for his life and his family, injured and terrified" that a grand jury, which began hearing evidence on Wednesday, will "make some kind of example out of him," the source said.

Great. More sources. That don't match the autopsy...

How does that source's version of events conflict with the autopsy?

I have seen probably 5 different articles that have advanced theories of what happened and then used the 2nd autopsy as the "proof" for the theory.

We can all keep guessing, but we need to see the complete formal 1st autopsy report because the 2nd one that so many are relying on was not complete and was impacted by the 1st one and Baden admitted that.

The medical examiner who did the first one had access to the clothes (very important)--Baden did not. Had access to the xrays showing any remaining bullets--Baden did not. And will ultimately have the toxicology levels. Baden did not as far as I know.

Baden was a hired expert (granted he waived his fee)--nothing more, nothing less and the family cherry picked the findings to fit their narrative.

SO you're knocking the second autopsy for being incomplete, but stating the first was complete.

So where is it?

Patience, lad. It'll all come out eventually. Meanwhile, for entertainment, you can just await Tim's theory of the moment.

 

[financewonk]

O'Mara is on CNN talking about why you should never create a violent confrontation with a cop. He states that you will never win a fight with them, since they always have a right to use a higher degree force than you use.

He also said you shouldn't tug on Superman's cape, or spit into the wind. Duh!

Seems to be one of the lessons that folks should take away from the Brown/ WIlson incident.

 

[Guest]

I took a break. Did we solve this yet?

What happens when we find out that the first shots were justified, but the coup de grâce wasn't?

 

[Courtjester]

I am not one to continue to nest quotes, but to answer your question, the first one is all we have, so it better be complete.

Each subsequent autopsy further degrades the body and makes determining anything less accurate. That is why the Fed's 3rd autopsy is the least reliable of them all.

 

[[icon]]

Has anyone disproven my Kiit Kat theory yet?

 

[KCitons]

Has anyone disproven my Kiit Kat theory yet?

Gimme a break.

 

[boots11234]

It is amazing to me that anyone can at this point fault the cop. With everything that is out there there is no doubt in my mind that it was totally justified. Lots of crow going to be eaten by you all.

 

[MaxThreshold]

It is amazing to me that anyone can at this point fault the cop. With everything that is out there there is no doubt in my mind that it was totally justified. Lots of crow going to be eaten by you all.

 

[KCitons]

It is amazing to me that anyone can at this point fault the cop. With everything that is out there there is no doubt in my mind that it was totally justified. Lots of crow going to be eaten by you all.

Not hungry, just had a Kit Kat. (thanks icon)

 

[PatsWillWin]

It is amazing to me that anyone can at this point fault the cop. With everything that is out there there is no doubt in my mind that it was totally justified. Lots of crow going to be eaten by you all.

It's amazing to me that anyone can at this point say they have "no doubt" one way or another.

 

[BustedKnuckles]

Newest witness Michael Brady on anderson cooper

'I see the officer get out of the car and immediately start shooting'Michael Brady is stepping forward with a new account of Michael Brown's final moments. He was inside his apartment when he first heard Brown's altercation with Officer Darren WIlson, then he saw it out the window. Brady says he ran outside after the first shots were fired. He tells Anderson that's when the next round of shooting began.

Michael Brady is offering just one of a growing number of sometimes conflicting accounts of what happened in the moments before Michael Brown lost his life. Randi Kaye takes a closer look.

 

[timschochet]

ccording to the well-placed source, Wilson was coming off another case in the neighborhood on Aug. 9 when he ordered Michael Brown and his friend Dorain Johnson to stop walking in the middle of the road because they were obstructing traffic. However, the confrontation quickly escalated into physical violence, the source said.

They ignored him and the officer started to get out of the car to tell them to move," the source said. "They shoved him right back in, thats when Michael Brown leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and the face."

The source claims that there is "solid proof" that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson for the policemans firearm, resulting in the gun going off although it still remains unclear at this stage who pulled the trigger. Brown started to walk away according to the account, prompting Wilson to draw his gun and order him to freeze. Brown, the source said, raised his hands in the air, and turned around saying, "What, you're going to shoot me?"

At that point, the source told FoxNews.com, the 6-foot-4, 292-pound Brown charged Wilson, prompting the officer to fire at least six shots at him, including the fatal bullet that penetrated the top of Brown's skull, according to an independent autopsy conducted at the request of Brown's family.

Wilson suffered a fractured eye socket in the fracas, and was left dazed by the initial confrontation, the source said. He is now "traumatized, scared for his life and his family, injured and terrified" that a grand jury, which began hearing evidence on Wednesday, will "make some kind of example out of him," the source said.

It all seems plausible until the bolded part. He walks away, puts his hands up, and then charges a guy with a gun? I just don't buy it.

Why wouldn't you buy it? This is the same guy who 10 minutes prior was caught on video robbing and assaulting an Indian store clerk. Seems perfectly plausible that he would continue to act crazy.

because it's a whole different kind of crazy. It's suicidal . At worst the video shows Brown to be a criminal punk. It does not show that he has a death wish. Those of you making the assumption that one leads to the other are not convincing in the least; not to me anyhow.

 

[timschochet]

It is amazing to me that anyone can at this point fault the cop. With everything that is out there there is no doubt in my mind that it was totally justified. Lots of crow going to be eaten by you all.

i am guessing that you are a conservative with a dislike for protests against the police, especially when racial issues are at play, and a strong desire to defend the police in such situations. Because it's simply not possible that any objective person could not have any doubts as this point, one way or the other.

 

[Jim11]

Newest witness Michael Brady on anderson cooper

'I see the officer get out of the car and immediately start shooting'Michael Brady is stepping forward with a new account of Michael Brown's final moments. He was inside his apartment when he first heard Brown's altercation with Officer Darren WIlson, then he saw it out the window. Brady says he ran outside after the first shots were fired. He tells Anderson that's when the next round of shooting began.

Michael Brady is offering just one of a growing number of sometimes conflicting accounts of what happened in the moments before Michael Brown lost his life. Randi Kaye takes a closer look.

Yeah, that's what I'd do if I heard gunshots outside my place. I'd run right out there. And it only took 11 days for that dude to concoct that story...errrrr report what he saw.

 

[Jim11]

It is amazing to me that anyone can at this point fault the cop. With everything that is out there there is no doubt in my mind that it was totally justified. Lots of crow going to be eaten by you all.

i am guessing that you are a conservative with a dislike for protests against the police, especially when racial issues are at play, and a strong desire to defend the police in such situations. Because it's simply not possible that any objective person could not have any doubts as this point, one way or the other.

Oh, so you still have doubts, Tim? I thought you had it all worked out.

 

[timschochet]

It is amazing to me that anyone can at this point fault the cop. With everything that is out there there is no doubt in my mind that it was totally justified. Lots of crow going to be eaten by you all.

i am guessing that you are a conservative with a dislike for protests against the police, especially when racial issues are at play, and a strong desire to defend the police in such situations. Because it's simply not possible that any objective person could not have any doubts as this point, one way or the other.

Oh, so you still have doubts, Tim? I thought you had it all worked out.

of course I have doubts. I wrote what I think probably happened, and what could cause me to change my mind again. I have changed my mind twice since I first read about this. But I'm able to do that, because unlike you I don't let what I want the result to be inform my decision making.

 

[timschochet]

Newest witness Michael Brady on anderson cooper

'I see the officer get out of the car and immediately start shooting'



Michael Brady is stepping forward with a new account of Michael Brown's final moments. He was inside his apartment when he first heard Brown's altercation with Officer Darren WIlson, then he saw it out the window. Brady says he ran outside after the first shots were fired. He tells Anderson that's when the next round of shooting began.

Michael Brady is offering just one of a growing number of sometimes conflicting accounts of what happened in the moments before Michael Brown lost his life. Randi Kaye takes a closer look.

Yeah, that's what I'd do if I heard gunshots outside my place. I'd run right out there. And it only took 11 days for that dude to concoct that story...errrrr report what he saw.

And here we have a prime example. Jim11, who wants the cops to be exonerated, believes every witness on his "side" as completely honest, while every witness on the side of the protestors as dishonest. In this regard, Jim is no different from the protestors. Both sides have made up their minds long since.

 

[BustedKnuckles]

Newest witness Michael Brady on anderson cooper

'I see the officer get out of the car and immediately start shooting'Michael Brady is stepping forward with a new account of Michael Brown's final moments. He was inside his apartment when he first heard Brown's altercation with Officer Darren WIlson, then he saw it out the window. Brady says he ran outside after the first shots were fired. He tells Anderson that's when the next round of shooting began.

Michael Brady is offering just one of a growing number of sometimes conflicting accounts of what happened in the moments before Michael Brown lost his life. Randi Kaye takes a closer look.

Yeah, that's what I'd do if I heard gunshots outside my place. I'd run right out there. And it only took 11 days for that dude to concoct that story...errrrr report what he saw.

yes....everyone that saw what you dont believe what happened is lying ...but anonymous callers who werent even on the scene are right...got it

 

[financewonk]

ccording to the well-placed source, Wilson was coming off another case in the neighborhood on Aug. 9 when he ordered Michael Brown and his friend Dorain Johnson to stop walking in the middle of the road because they were obstructing traffic. However, the confrontation quickly escalated into physical violence, the source said.

They ignored him and the officer started to get out of the car to tell them to move," the source said. "They shoved him right back in, thats when Michael Brown leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and the face."

The source claims that there is "solid proof" that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson for the policemans firearm, resulting in the gun going off although it still remains unclear at this stage who pulled the trigger. Brown started to walk away according to the account, prompting Wilson to draw his gun and order him to freeze. Brown, the source said, raised his hands in the air, and turned around saying, "What, you're going to shoot me?"

At that point, the source told FoxNews.com, the 6-foot-4, 292-pound Brown charged Wilson, prompting the officer to fire at least six shots at him, including the fatal bullet that penetrated the top of Brown's skull, according to an independent autopsy conducted at the request of Brown's family.

Wilson suffered a fractured eye socket in the fracas, and was left dazed by the initial confrontation, the source said. He is now "traumatized, scared for his life and his family, injured and terrified" that a grand jury, which began hearing evidence on Wednesday, will "make some kind of example out of him," the source said.

It all seems plausible until the bolded part. He walks away, puts his hands up, and then charges a guy with a gun? I just don't buy it.

Why wouldn't you buy it? This is the same guy who 10 minutes prior was caught on video robbing and assaulting an Indian store clerk. Seems perfectly plausible that he would continue to act crazy.

because it's a whole different kind of crazy. It's suicidal . At worst the video shows Brown to be a criminal punk. It does not show that he has a death wish. Those of you making the assumption that one leads to the other are not convincing in the least; not to me anyhow.

Striking a police officer isn't borderline suicidal?

 

[timschochet]

ccording to the well-placed source, Wilson was coming off another case in the neighborhood on Aug. 9 when he ordered Michael Brown and his friend Dorain Johnson to stop walking in the middle of the road because they were obstructing traffic. However, the confrontation quickly escalated into physical violence, the source said.

They ignored him and the officer started to get out of the car to tell them to move," the source said. "They shoved him right back in, thats when Michael Brown leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and the face."

The source claims that there is "solid proof" that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson for the policemans firearm, resulting in the gun going off although it still remains unclear at this stage who pulled the trigger. Brown started to walk away according to the account, prompting Wilson to draw his gun and order him to freeze. Brown, the source said, raised his hands in the air, and turned around saying, "What, you're going to shoot me?"

At that point, the source told FoxNews.com, the 6-foot-4, 292-pound Brown charged Wilson, prompting the officer to fire at least six shots at him, including the fatal bullet that penetrated the top of Brown's skull, according to an independent autopsy conducted at the request of Brown's family.

Wilson suffered a fractured eye socket in the fracas, and was left dazed by the initial confrontation, the source said. He is now "traumatized, scared for his life and his family, injured and terrified" that a grand jury, which began hearing evidence on Wednesday, will "make some kind of example out of him," the source said.

It all seems plausible until the bolded part. He walks away, puts his hands up, and then charges a guy with a gun? I just don't buy it.

Why wouldn't you buy it? This is the same guy who 10 minutes prior was caught on video robbing and assaulting an Indian store clerk. Seems perfectly plausible that he would continue to act crazy.

because it's a whole different kind of crazy. It's suicidal . At worst the video shows Brown to be a criminal punk. It does not show that he has a death wish. Those of you making the assumption that one leads to the other are not convincing in the least; not to me anyhow.

Striking a police officer isn't borderline suicidal?

im not sure who started that. But you're right, it's bad. It's not close to the same level of insanity as charging a cop from 30 feet away who has his gun out and is pointing it at you. That's a whole different ball of wax. Like I wrote, you have to want to die. And who knows? Maybe Brown did want to die. But there's no evidence to indicate it.