Mike Rowe Answers a Viewer's Questions (Vocational Trade Training) (1 Viewer)

[Grace Under Pressure]

I like Mike Rowe. No way JB actually exists.

 

[NutterButter]

I'd love to know from guys with less employable majors how they wound up down that path. Did your parents try to persuade you to choose a more lucrative major? Having two young girls, I might be put in that position in another decade and its never too early to start planting the right seeds. I'd be thrilled if they followed in their dad's footsteps and became programmers.

Vocational works sounds glamorous when compared to a slow day at the office, but the older I get the more glad that I'm not doing something physical everyday. My neighbor is a roofer in his 50's and just had his knee replaced last year. I have no idea how he does it.

 

[Quez]

I suspect many skilled laborer jobs allow for as much overtime as you want.

 

[SacramentoBob]

I'd love to know from guys with less employable majors how they wound up down that path.

I think this was covered in the millennials thread.

 

[Jutz]

In this interview... I don't think JB is an actual person. But come on, we all know JB 'exists'. There are a lot of JB's in the world.

 

[3C's]

We can't find enough people to work in production. The guys we do have are making Boatloads with overtime and bonuses.

Define boatloads.

I guess "boatloads" is relative. We have quite a few welders making $14-$18 an hour. Add 20 hours of time-and-a-half, plus an $500 monthly bonus if they work X number of hours, and they are making a very good wage for this area (very small town Nebraska).

It's funny that the younger single guys don't take advantage of the optional overtime, but the older family guys do.

Young guys want to party/go out, old family guys have bills to pay.

 

[Rayderr]

I like Mike Rowe. No way JB actually exists.

Not sure why you'd say that. I'm sure if you think about it, you know a JB. You know, the type of person who does nothing to complain about how the other side is reuining the country. Heck, JB could very well be one of our elected officials. Seems like every time they're asked a question about why something hasn't been improved or done, they just blame the other side.

 

[NCCommish]

I know it sucks when the guy you hate the most basically made the exact same point you are trying to make... about a year or two earlier then you did. Go ahead and bash the guy all you want. The two of you are pretty much in exact agreement on this subject, and it's tough for you to accept. So... name calling. Old hat for Santorum.

Yeah I was beating this drum a long time before doofus said that.

 

[Jutz]

I know it sucks when the guy you hate the most basically made the exact same point you are trying to make... about a year or two earlier then you did. Go ahead and bash the guy all you want. The two of you are pretty much in exact agreement on this subject, and it's tough for you to accept. So... name calling. Old hat for Santorum.

Yeah I was beating this drum a long time before doofus said that.

 

[cstu]

I agree with MR on this. We have turned being skilled labor, the very backbone of the middle class, into some kind of failure. It's ridiculous.

Yep. Rahm Emanuel was on TV yesterday proclaiming that the goal of the Chicago public schools will be to get every student ready to go to college. Absolutely ridiculous. First, that shouldn't be the goal. Second, the goal is unachievable.

Get ready doesn't necessarily mean go to college. How hard is HS that kids can't graduate with enough knowledge to allow them to attend college if their arc welding plans don't work out?

2 problems. 1, it sends kids the wrong message. 2, vo-tech curriculum suffers. Why shouldn't a kid who wants to be a welder, plumber, carpenter, electrician, etc. be able to study those disciplines in HS?

Here are the graduation requirements in CA:

EC 51225.3 states that all pupils receiving a diploma of graduation from a California high school must have completed all of the following courses, while in grades nine to twelve, inclusive:

• Unless otherwise specified, each course shall have a duration of one school year:Three courses in English
• Two courses in mathematics, including one year of Algebra I (EC Section 51224.5)
• Two courses in science, including biological and physical sciences
• Three courses in social studies, including United States history and geography; world history, culture, and geography; a one-semester course in American government and civics, and a one-semester course in economics
• One course in visual or performing arts, foreign language, or commencing with the 2012-13 school year, career technical education. For the purpose of satisfying the minimum course requirement, a course in American Sign Language shall be deemed a course in foreign language
• Two courses in physical education, unless the pupil has been exempted pursuant to the provisions of EC Section 51241

I do think schools should have more vocational classes and encourage kids who aren't planning to go to college to take them, but those requirements aren't very steep.

 

[cstu]

This is another subject where we see broad consensus in the FFA. Always has been a cross aisle winner here. When will we put enough pressure on the powers that be to make something happen? When will we not vote for the person who doesn't support skills education? When will we start telling our kids that there is dignity in all jobs and that you aren't a failure if you don't get a four year degree as long as you have a trained skill? That's when something will change.

When will we not vote for the person who doesn't support skills education? When you vote for Rick Santorum:

President Obama once said he wants everybody in America to go to college, what a snob. Not all folks are gifted in the same way, Some people have incredible gifts with their hands...there are good decent men and women who go out and work hard every day and put their skills to test that aren’t taught by some liberal college professor trying to indoctrinate them. Oh, I understand why he wants you to go to college. He wants to remake you in his image. I want to create jobs so people can remake their children into their image, not his.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/02/25/rick-santorum-obama-snob-college_n_1301854.html

He got ripped for saying it (surprise). But he was right.

It's not snobbish to want everyone to go to college. Not everyone will be able to of course but it's a good goal to have. If your talent lies in doing something with your hands that's great as well, but there's nothing wrong with wanting people to maximize their intellectual capabilities.

 

[igbomb]

I agree with MR on this. We have turned being skilled labor, the very backbone of the middle class, into some kind of failure. It's ridiculous.

Yep. Rahm Emanuel was on TV yesterday proclaiming that the goal of the Chicago public schools will be to get every student ready to go to college. Absolutely ridiculous. First, that shouldn't be the goal. Second, the goal is unachievable.

Get ready doesn't necessarily mean go to college. How hard is HS that kids can't graduate with enough knowledge to allow them to attend college if their arc welding plans don't work out?

2 problems. 1, it sends kids the wrong message. 2, vo-tech curriculum suffers. Why shouldn't a kid who wants to be a welder, plumber, carpenter, electrician, etc. be able to study those disciplines in HS?

Here are the graduation requirements in CA:

EC 51225.3 states that all pupils receiving a diploma of graduation from a California high school must have completed all of the following courses, while in grades nine to twelve, inclusive:

• Unless otherwise specified, each course shall have a duration of one school year:Three courses in English
• Two courses in mathematics, including one year of Algebra I (EC Section 51224.5)
• Two courses in science, including biological and physical sciences
• Three courses in social studies, including United States history and geography; world history, culture, and geography; a one-semester course in American government and civics, and a one-semester course in economics
• One course in visual or performing arts, foreign language, or commencing with the 2012-13 school year, career technical education. For the purpose of satisfying the minimum course requirement, a course in American Sign Language shall be deemed a course in foreign language
• Two courses in physical education, unless the pupil has been exempted pursuant to the provisions of EC Section 51241

I do think schools should have more vocational classes and encourage kids who aren't planning to go to college to take them, but those requirements aren't very steep.

Michigan is a little steeper.

4 years of math

4 years of English

3 years of Social Studies

3 years of Science

2 years of foreign language

Plus some modest PE and Arts requirements

But it's not just the requirements, it's the constant pressure for test scores. With schools chasing test scores, everything else becomes secondary.

If you're going to encourage vocational programs, you need to reduce the burden of constant improvement in test scores, etc. That's one of the benefits of the tracking system in place overseas. College prep schools are compared to other college prep schools and vocational schools are compared to other vocational schools.

Here, if some school wanted to offer stronger vocational programs and reduce the emphasis on math, etc., they would get in trouble from the state on test scores and sites like greatschools would call them terrible places to send your children.

 

[mr roboto]

This is another subject where we see broad consensus in the FFA. Always has been a cross aisle winner here. When will we put enough pressure on the powers that be to make something happen? When will we not vote for the person who doesn't support skills education? When will we start telling our kids that there is dignity in all jobs and that you aren't a failure if you don't get a four year degree as long as you have a trained skill? That's when something will change.

When will we not vote for the person who doesn't support skills education? When you vote for Rick Santorum:

President Obama once said he wants everybody in America to go to college, what a snob. Not all folks are gifted in the same way, Some people have incredible gifts with their hands...there are good decent men and women who go out and work hard every day and put their skills to test that arent taught by some liberal college professor trying to indoctrinate them. Oh, I understand why he wants you to go to college. He wants to remake you in his image. I want to create jobs so people can remake their children into their image, not his.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/02/25/rick-santorum-obama-snob-college_n_1301854.html

He got ripped for saying it (surprise). But he was right.

It's not snobbish to want everyone to go to college. Not everyone will be able to of course but it's a good goal to have. If your talent lies in doing something with your hands that's great as well, but there's nothing wrong with wanting people to maximize their intellectual capabilities.

I'm usually agreeing with you cstu, but this sounds very elitist. Is college the only place to 'maximize their intellectual capabilities'? Do all college students really blossom intellectually in school? Is the goal of 50k in debt simply expanding the mind?I know what you are trying to say, but this belief in America that more schooling is always better is folly. Especially when it costs money. This kind of thinking has really bought into the lie that academic achievement = intelligence.

 

[Rayderr]

This is another subject where we see broad consensus in the FFA. Always has been a cross aisle winner here. When will we put enough pressure on the powers that be to make something happen? When will we not vote for the person who doesn't support skills education? When will we start telling our kids that there is dignity in all jobs and that you aren't a failure if you don't get a four year degree as long as you have a trained skill? That's when something will change.

When will we not vote for the person who doesn't support skills education? When you vote for Rick Santorum:

President Obama once said he wants everybody in America to go to college, what a snob. Not all folks are gifted in the same way, Some people have incredible gifts with their hands...there are good decent men and women who go out and work hard every day and put their skills to test that aren’t taught by some liberal college professor trying to indoctrinate them. Oh, I understand why he wants you to go to college. He wants to remake you in his image. I want to create jobs so people can remake their children into their image, not his.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/02/25/rick-santorum-obama-snob-college_n_1301854.html

He got ripped for saying it (surprise). But he was right.

It's not snobbish to want everyone to go to college. Not everyone will be able to of course but it's a good goal to have. If your talent lies in doing something with your hands that's great as well, but there's nothing wrong with wanting people to maximize their intellectual capabilities.

Actually, it is a bit snobbish, because it implies they are not meeting your standards if they don't. Of course, Obama actually never said he wanted everyone to go to college.

 

[matuski]

We can't find enough people to work in production. The guys we do have are making Boatloads with overtime and bonuses.

Define boatloads.

I guess "boatloads" is relative. We have quite a few welders making $14-$18 an hour. Add 20 hours of time-and-a-half, plus an $500 monthly bonus if they work X number of hours, and they are making a very good wage for this area (very small town Nebraska).

It's funny that the younger single guys don't take advantage of the optional overtime, but the older family guys do.

So $40k-$50k.. not knocking it, but I expect/demand my kids do better. This would be a great starting wage/salary, but then what? Is there a career path in welding/production?

 

[mr roboto]

We can't find enough people to work in production. The guys we do have are making Boatloads with overtime and bonuses.

Define boatloads.

I guess "boatloads" is relative. We have quite a few welders making $14-$18 an hour. Add 20 hours of time-and-a-half, plus an $500 monthly bonus if they work X number of hours, and they are making a very good wage for this area (very small town Nebraska).

It's funny that the younger single guys don't take advantage of the optional overtime, but the older family guys do.

So $40k-$50k.. not knocking it, but I expect/demand my kids do better. This would be a great starting wage/salary, but then what? Is there a career path in welding/production?

I'm sorry, but 50k in many areas of the country is a livable wage.

 

[igbomb]

We can't find enough people to work in production. The guys we do have are making Boatloads with overtime and bonuses.

Define boatloads.

I guess "boatloads" is relative. We have quite a few welders making $14-$18 an hour. Add 20 hours of time-and-a-half, plus an $500 monthly bonus if they work X number of hours, and they are making a very good wage for this area (very small town Nebraska).

It's funny that the younger single guys don't take advantage of the optional overtime, but the older family guys do.

So $40k-$50k.. not knocking it, but I expect/demand my kids do better. This would be a great starting wage/salary, but then what? Is there a career path in welding/production?

I just heard a report this morning on NPR about vocational opportunities in Akron. This girl was training to become a mason in high school. The teacher of the class was pulling 6 figures as a professional mason.

And the skilled trades where I work probably have a base of about $60K with overtime and shift premiums pushing plenty of them over $100K.

Even if it was just $40K, do you know how many college grads would kill to make $40K right now? Not everyone is suited for a STEM or business vocation.

 

[Rayderr]

We can't find enough people to work in production. The guys we do have are making Boatloads with overtime and bonuses.

Define boatloads.

I guess "boatloads" is relative. We have quite a few welders making $14-$18 an hour. Add 20 hours of time-and-a-half, plus an $500 monthly bonus if they work X number of hours, and they are making a very good wage for this area (very small town Nebraska).

It's funny that the younger single guys don't take advantage of the optional overtime, but the older family guys do.

So $40k-$50k.. not knocking it, but I expect/demand my kids do better. This would be a great starting wage/salary, but then what? Is there a career path in welding/production?

From the original article:

Two weeks ago, I talked with a heavy equipment technician up in Butler, N.D. Jack’s 26 years old. Started welding part-time in high school. Got a job at the local CAT dealer working on big machines. Had a knack for it. Took a training program. Started around $65,000, with a 25% “Impact Signing Bonus.” Went to work in earnest. 60-hour weeks, mostly outside. Tough work, but he was good at it, and willing. Doubled his pay in a year. Met a girl. Got married. Bought a house. Had a kid. Got a raise. Paid off his house. Had another kid. Just quit his job to freelance. Why? Because he has a trade that’s in demand and real-world experience. He can work when he wants at $150 an hour anywhere on the High Plains. Jack is debt-free, highly trained, good at what he does, and absolutely thriving. Why? Because he combined a useful skill with a solid work ethic, and welcomed a chance to be uncomfortable.

 

[mr roboto]

The high plains job market is really hot right now though. Lots of money flowing up there.

 

[T Bell]

We can't find enough people to work in production. The guys we do have are making Boatloads with overtime and bonuses.

Define boatloads.

I guess "boatloads" is relative. We have quite a few welders making $14-$18 an hour. Add 20 hours of time-and-a-half, plus an $500 monthly bonus if they work X number of hours, and they are making a very good wage for this area (very small town Nebraska).

It's funny that the younger single guys don't take advantage of the optional overtime, but the older family guys do.

So $40k-$50k.. not knocking it, but I expect/demand my kids do better. This would be a great starting wage/salary, but then what? Is there a career path in welding/production?

The point is that your kids likely won't do better right out of college.

What I've quickly read about welding is that if you continue to train and get certified (mostly thru OJT) in specialized areas of welding, you can rapidly increase that and with overtime you could be earning six figures within 5-7 years.

I would have to think that there's got to be an emerging set of welding technologies for high-tech stuff, such as for aerospace manufacturing or electronics. I do know that the oil and gas industry has a huge demand for it - I knew a guy who used to be an underwater welder for the oil and gas industry, working on oil rigs, and who made huge money.

 

[Rayderr]

The high plains job market is really hot right now though. Lots of money flowing up there.

And will be for quite some time (in fact, it'll probably get even hotter as more and more welders retire and no one to take their spots.)

 

[matuski]

We can't find enough people to work in production. The guys we do have are making Boatloads with overtime and bonuses.

Define boatloads.

I guess "boatloads" is relative. We have quite a few welders making $14-$18 an hour. Add 20 hours of time-and-a-half, plus an $500 monthly bonus if they work X number of hours, and they are making a very good wage for this area (very small town Nebraska).

It's funny that the younger single guys don't take advantage of the optional overtime, but the older family guys do.

So $40k-$50k.. not knocking it, but I expect/demand my kids do better. This would be a great starting wage/salary, but then what? Is there a career path in welding/production?

The point is that your kids likely won't do better right out of college.

What I've quickly read about welding is that if you continue to train and get certified (mostly thru OJT) in specialized areas of welding, you can rapidly increase that and with overtime you could be earning six figures within 5-7 years.

I would have to think that there's got to be an emerging set of welding technologies for high-tech stuff, such as for aerospace manufacturing or electronics. I do know that the oil and gas industry has a huge demand for it - I knew a guy who used to be an underwater welder for the oil and gas industry, working on oil rigs, and who made huge money.

That is exactly why I asked... the money is about in-line with a kid out of college. I was wondering about beyond that. If a job at age 18 pays $15/hr, and you are making $18/hr at age 30... I'm not supporting that for my kids.

Sounds like any "college" profession.. you work hard and continue to learn/specialize. Carve out a niche and make money.

 

[cstu]

It's not snobbish to want everyone to go to college. Not everyone will be able to of course but it's a good goal to have. If your talent lies in doing something with your hands that's great as well, but there's nothing wrong with wanting people to maximize their intellectual capabilities.

I'm usually agreeing with you cstu, but this sounds very elitist. Is college the only place to 'maximize their intellectual capabilities'? Do all college students really blossom intellectually in school? Is the goal of 50k in debt simply expanding the mind?I know what you are trying to say, but this belief in America that more schooling is always better is folly. Especially when it costs money. This kind of thinking has really bought into the lie that academic achievement = intelligence.

I'm not insinuating that only college graduates are intelligent. With all the free information available on the internet there's no reason why someone couldn't be far more knowledgeable than college graduates. And no, not all college students become intellectuals.

More schooling is not always better but too many people tell themselves they can't do it when I believe that many of them could. Why wouldn't I want everyone to become engineers, scientists and doctors rather than plumbers?

However, people should do what they want to do and be respected when they do a good job at at, regardless of how much education they've had in school. In the end it's about doing what makes you happy, whatever job you choose to do.

 

[Slapdash]

Three courses in social studies, including United States history and geography; world history, culture, and geography; a one-semester course in American government and civics, and a one-semester course in economics

Boggles my mind that government and economics always gets less importance than history, geography, and culture for social studies. Those first two are much more important to people's lives especially as economics at that level will generally contain some personal finance.

 

[Rayderr]

It's not snobbish to want everyone to go to college. Not everyone will be able to of course but it's a good goal to have. If your talent lies in doing something with your hands that's great as well, but there's nothing wrong with wanting people to maximize their intellectual capabilities.

I'm usually agreeing with you cstu, but this sounds very elitist. Is college the only place to 'maximize their intellectual capabilities'? Do all college students really blossom intellectually in school? Is the goal of 50k in debt simply expanding the mind?I know what you are trying to say, but this belief in America that more schooling is always better is folly. Especially when it costs money. This kind of thinking has really bought into the lie that academic achievement = intelligence.

I'm not insinuating that only college graduates are intelligent. With all the free information available on the internet there's no reason why someone couldn't be far more knowledgeable than college graduates. And no, not all college students become intellectuals.

More schooling is not always better but too many people tell themselves they can't do it when I believe that many of them could. Why wouldn't I want everyone to become engineers, scientists and doctors rather than plumbers?

However, people should do what they want to do and be respected when they do a good job at at, regardless of how much education they've had in school. In the end it's about doing what makes you happy, whatever job you choose to do.

Well, because as a society, we'd be ####ed if a pipe sprung a leak.

 

[mr roboto]

It's not snobbish to want everyone to go to college. Not everyone will be able to of course but it's a good goal to have. If your talent lies in doing something with your hands that's great as well, but there's nothing wrong with wanting people to maximize their intellectual capabilities.

I'm usually agreeing with you cstu, but this sounds very elitist. Is college the only place to 'maximize their intellectual capabilities'? Do all college students really blossom intellectually in school? Is the goal of 50k in debt simply expanding the mind?I know what you are trying to say, but this belief in America that more schooling is always better is folly. Especially when it costs money. This kind of thinking has really bought into the lie that academic achievement = intelligence.

I'm not insinuating that only college graduates are intelligent. With all the free information available on the internet there's no reason why someone couldn't be far more knowledgeable than college graduates. And no, not all college students become intellectuals.

More schooling is not always better but too many people tell themselves they can't do it when I believe that many of them could. Why wouldn't I want everyone to become engineers, scientists and doctors rather than plumbers?

However, people should do what they want to do and be respected when they do a good job at at, regardless of how much education they've had in school. In the end it's about doing what makes you happy, whatever job you choose to do.

Well, because as a society, we'd be ####ed if a pipe sprung a leak.

 

[Grace Under Pressure]

I like Mike Rowe. No way JB actually exists.

Not sure why you'd say that. I'm sure if you think about it, you know a JB. You know, the type of person who does nothing to complain about how the other side is reuining the country. Heck, JB could very well be one of our elected officials. Seems like every time they're asked a question about why something hasn't been improved or done, they just blame the other side.

Agreed, but still think it's fake.

 

[Loan Sharks]

I'd love to know from guys with less employable majors how they wound up down that path. Did your parents try to persuade you to choose a more lucrative major? Having two young girls, I might be put in that position in another decade and its never too early to start planting the right seeds. I'd be thrilled if they followed in their dad's footsteps and became programmers.

Vocational works sounds glamorous when compared to a slow day at the office, but the older I get the more glad that I'm not doing something physical everyday. My neighbor is a roofer in his 50's and just had his knee replaced last year. I have no idea how he does it.

I have a degree in economics, I didn't really choose economics it chose me. When I was a freshman you have to take all the basics and for whatever reason I liked economics and it came very easily to me. I found no reason to get crappy grades pushing Math, chemistry or whatever when I could straight A every econ class I took. My report card would typically be A's in econ and econ related classes and a B or C in stuff I was forced to take.

No one ever tried to "talk me out of it"

While I knew there was little chance that I would become a government economic adviser or Econ teacher, Economics is generally viewed favorably as a business degree. I have found no real issues getting hired or advancing in the insurance field.

 

[Loan Sharks]

Three courses in social studies, including United States history and geography; world history, culture, and geography; a one-semester course in American government and civics, and a one-semester course in economics

Boggles my mind that government and economics always gets less importance than history, geography, and culture for social studies. Those first two are much more important to people's lives especially as economics at that level will generally contain some personal finance.

I have a degree in Economics and I couldn't agree more. The way I explain economics is Econ is a degree in decision making. You take information about anything like the GDP and take imports exports gov spending etc and you predict the most likely outcome. This critical thinking skill can be applied to any life experience.

The one that always leaves me scratching my head is foreign language. I actually learned Spanish in high school and college, but I think I am in the extreme minority and surmise that over 90% of people never speak a word of that language again after high school.

I would prefer a vocation or more Econ/Business at the expense of French if you will.

 

[NCCommish]

Three courses in social studies, including United States history and geography; world history, culture, and geography; a one-semester course in American government and civics, and a one-semester course in economics

Boggles my mind that government and economics always gets less importance than history, geography, and culture for social studies. Those first two are much more important to people's lives especially as economics at that level will generally contain some personal finance.

I have a degree in Economics and I couldn't agree more. The way I explain economics is Econ is a degree in decision making. You take information about anything like the GDP and take imports exports gov spending etc and you predict the most likely outcome. This critical thinking skill can be applied to any life experience.

The one that always leaves me scratching my head is foreign language. I actually learned Spanish in high school and college, but I think I am in the extreme minority and surmise that over 90% of people never speak a word of that language again after high school.

I would prefer a vocation or more Econ/Business at the expense of French if you will.

I have always said we should do more on personal finance in high school. Credit card interest, balancing accounts, budgeting, etc.

 

[Slapdash]

Three courses in social studies, including United States history and geography; world history, culture, and geography; a one-semester course in American government and civics, and a one-semester course in economics

Boggles my mind that government and economics always gets less importance than history, geography, and culture for social studies. Those first two are much more important to people's lives especially as economics at that level will generally contain some personal finance.

I have a degree in Economics and I couldn't agree more. The way I explain economics is Econ is a degree in decision making. You take information about anything like the GDP and take imports exports gov spending etc and you predict the most likely outcome. This critical thinking skill can be applied to any life experience.

The one that always leaves me scratching my head is foreign language. I actually learned Spanish in high school and college, but I think I am in the extreme minority and surmise that over 90% of people never speak a word of that language again after high school.

I would prefer a vocation or more Econ/Business at the expense of French if you will.

Economics was one of my majors as well. I actually got a minor in Spanish and took a few years of Portuguese. Not sure that was useful.

 

[Grace Under Pressure]

Three courses in social studies, including United States history and geography; world history, culture, and geography; a one-semester course in American government and civics, and a one-semester course in economics

Boggles my mind that government and economics always gets less importance than history, geography, and culture for social studies. Those first two are much more important to people's lives especially as economics at that level will generally contain some personal finance.

I have a degree in Economics and I couldn't agree more. The way I explain economics is Econ is a degree in decision making. You take information about anything like the GDP and take imports exports gov spending etc and you predict the most likely outcome. This critical thinking skill can be applied to any life experience.

The one that always leaves me scratching my head is foreign language. I actually learned Spanish in high school and college, but I think I am in the extreme minority and surmise that over 90% of people never speak a word of that language again after high school.

I would prefer a vocation or more Econ/Business at the expense of French if you will.

I have always said we should do more on personal finance in high school. Credit card interest, balancing accounts, budgeting, etc.

Absolutely, more preparation for financial life decisions everyone faces. Rent vs. own, college finances.

 

[cstu]

It seems rather hypocritical for a guy who was a communication major in college and went on to host cushy (and highly lucrative) TV jobs to say kids should go into the trades.

 

[Rayderr]

It seems rather hypocritical for a guy who was a communication major in college and went on to host cushy (and highly lucrative) TV jobs to say kids should go into the trades.

Yes, that communications degree is what earned him a spot at the Baltimore Opera, where he would then hear about auditions for QVC, which he got a job and then turned that into a voiceover and on air career.

 

[Abraham]

I'd love to know from guys with less employable majors how they wound up down that path.

I think this was covered in the millennials thread.

I was a Poli Sci major because I could make the best grades in that major with the least amount of study. The thinking then (90's) was that simply HAVING the degree is all that mattered. Hindsight being what it is, when I was having some troubles and close to starving to death last spring I would have given my big toe for a trade certification that would have allowed me to get to work more quickly without burning through savings and living on credit cards.

We can't find enough people to work in production. The guys we do have are making Boatloads with overtime and bonuses.

Define boatloads.

I guess "boatloads" is relative. We have quite a few welders making $14-$18 an hour. Add 20 hours of time-and-a-half, plus an $500 monthly bonus if they work X number of hours, and they are making a very good wage for this area (very small town Nebraska).

It's funny that the younger single guys don't take advantage of the optional overtime, but the older family guys do.

So $40k-$50k.. not knocking it, but I expect/demand my kids do better. This would be a great starting wage/salary, but then what? Is there a career path in welding/production?

There are plenty of career paths in welding and production, just like any profession. Welding is a complicated field with many niches. Underwater welders, for example, often work about 1 week per month and make 6 figures because it is such a specialized skill set.

 

[T Bell]

It seems rather hypocritical for a guy who was a communication major in college and went on to host cushy (and highly lucrative) TV jobs to say kids should go into the trades.

Not really. He's not saying trades are for everyone, he's just saying that college has been oversold and isn't as economically viable as advertised; meanwhile the trades are struggling to find people to fill jobs that actually pay well. That's not hypocrisy.

 

[cstu]

It seems rather hypocritical for a guy who was a communication major in college and went on to host cushy (and highly lucrative) TV jobs to say kids should go into the trades.

Yes, that communications degree is what earned him a spot at the Baltimore Opera, where he would then hear about auditions for QVC, which he got a job and then turned that into a voiceover and on air career.

I bet without his communications degree he wouldn't have aced that QVC audition.

 

[cstu]

It seems rather hypocritical for a guy who was a communication major in college and went on to host cushy (and highly lucrative) TV jobs to say kids should go into the trades.

Not really. He's not saying trades are for everyone, he's just saying that college has been oversold and isn't as economically viable as advertised; meanwhile the trades are struggling to find people to fill jobs that actually pay well. That's not hypocrisy.

It comes across to me as "Hey kids, you're not as talented as me so go get a trade job".

Are kids that aren't good in school but good with their hands even considering college anyway?

 

[cstu]

By the way, I agree with the way he's building the image of trade jobs as respectable professions but disagree with the negative view of college that he's presenting.

 

[Abraham]

It seems rather hypocritical for a guy who was a communication major in college and went on to host cushy (and highly lucrative) TV jobs to say kids should go into the trades.

Not really. He's not saying trades are for everyone, he's just saying that college has been oversold and isn't as economically viable as advertised; meanwhile the trades are struggling to find people to fill jobs that actually pay well. That's not hypocrisy.

It comes across to me as "Hey kids, you're not as talented as me so go get a trade job".

Are kids that aren't good in school but good with their hands even considering college anyway?

They are being pushed to college, absolutely.

And it doesn't come across that way at all. You don't have to be part of a cohort to speak intelligently about it. Rowe can be in a suit and tie and apply for a job at the department of labor and it doesn't invalidate that his point is correct.

 

[Loan Sharks]

Three courses in social studies, including United States history and geography; world history, culture, and geography; a one-semester course in American government and civics, and a one-semester course in economics

Boggles my mind that government and economics always gets less importance than history, geography, and culture for social studies. Those first two are much more important to people's lives especially as economics at that level will generally contain some personal finance.

I have a degree in Economics and I couldn't agree more. The way I explain economics is Econ is a degree in decision making. You take information about anything like the GDP and take imports exports gov spending etc and you predict the most likely outcome. This critical thinking skill can be applied to any life experience.

The one that always leaves me scratching my head is foreign language. I actually learned Spanish in high school and college, but I think I am in the extreme minority and surmise that over 90% of people never speak a word of that language again after high school.

I would prefer a vocation or more Econ/Business at the expense of French if you will.

Economics was one of my majors as well. I actually got a minor in Spanish and took a few years of Portuguese. Not sure that was useful.

Hilarious, I thought I was the only Econ/Spanish guy in the world. No Portuguese though. The ONLY reason my Spanish came in handy was I started with a insurance company in Los Angeles and our target demographic was hispanic drivers.

 

[NCCommish]

Three courses in social studies, including United States history and geography; world history, culture, and geography; a one-semester course in American government and civics, and a one-semester course in economics

Boggles my mind that government and economics always gets less importance than history, geography, and culture for social studies. Those first two are much more important to people's lives especially as economics at that level will generally contain some personal finance.

I have a degree in Economics and I couldn't agree more. The way I explain economics is Econ is a degree in decision making. You take information about anything like the GDP and take imports exports gov spending etc and you predict the most likely outcome. This critical thinking skill can be applied to any life experience.

The one that always leaves me scratching my head is foreign language. I actually learned Spanish in high school and college, but I think I am in the extreme minority and surmise that over 90% of people never speak a word of that language again after high school.

I would prefer a vocation or more Econ/Business at the expense of French if you will.

Economics was one of my majors as well. I actually got a minor in Spanish and took a few years of Portuguese. Not sure that was useful.

Hilarious, I thought I was the only Econ/Spanish guy in the world. No Portuguese though. The ONLY reason my Spanish came in handy was I started with a insurance company in Los Angeles and our target demographic was hispanic drivers.

Portuguese is the fastest growing language right now. It is also becoming the trade language of Africa,

 

[cstu]

The one that always leaves me scratching my head is foreign language. I actually learned Spanish in high school and college, but I think I am in the extreme minority and surmise that over 90% of people never speak a word of that language again after high school.

I would prefer a vocation or more Econ/Business at the expense of French if you will.

Two years of French and by the time I got to France I'd forgotten most of it.

 

[SacramentoBob]

The one that always leaves me scratching my head is foreign language. I actually learned Spanish in high school and college, but I think I am in the extreme minority and surmise that over 90% of people never speak a word of that language again after high school.

I would prefer a vocation or more Econ/Business at the expense of French if you will.

Two years of French and by the time I got to France I'd forgotten most of it.

Not the kissing part though.

 

[The Big Guy]

MR is a great follow on FB. He has a great way of telling a story and whlie long winded, tends to be funny most of the time. This is a nice issue for him to be a spokesman for and I love how he tries to neutralize the politics and keep the focus on the jobs.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

It seems rather hypocritical for a guy who was a communication major in college and went on to host cushy (and highly lucrative) TV jobs to say kids should go into the trades.

How is that hypocritical? Rowe certainly knows that the overwhelming majority of communication majors won't go on to fame and fortune on television, and there's nothing particularly hypocritical about advising people to take a different life path than you took.

 

[Rayderr]

It seems rather hypocritical for a guy who was a communication major in college and went on to host cushy (and highly lucrative) TV jobs to say kids should go into the trades.

Yes, that communications degree is what earned him a spot at the Baltimore Opera, where he would then hear about auditions for QVC, which he got a job and then turned that into a voiceover and on air career.

I bet without his communications degree he wouldn't have aced that QVC audition.

I doubt that. There are plenty of on screen people who do not have degrees. Among the more famous, George Clooney, Leonardo Dicaprio, Adam Savage (and I doubt Jaime's degree in Russian helped him land the Mythbusters gig seeing as the show is filmed in English) Drew Carey, Ben Affleck, Woody Allen, the list goes on and on.

 

[wazoo11]

Vocational high schools here in new england are under funded with helping kids get into co-op program as upperclassmen. The work experience I got through HS and college co-op was a thousand times better than sitting through a physics lecture in college. It also doesn't help that the guidance counslers (white collar) are giving advice to blue collar voc HS students.

 

[wazoo11]

Vocational high schools also battle the stigma that they're for rejects and or kids with a troubled past.

 

[matuski]

There are plenty of career paths in welding and production, just like any profession. Welding is a complicated field with many niches. Underwater welders, for example, often work about 1 week per month and make 6 figures because it is such a specialized skill set.

What does the career path look like if you don't become the 1%, what about the top 10%? Top 20%?