*NBA THREAD* Abe will be missed (9 Viewers)

[Premier]

The Cleveland Cavaliers are pushing for free-agent center Andrew Bynum to accept a two-year, $24 million-plus, incentive-based contract offer, league sources told Yahoo! Sports on Monday night.

Actually seems rather reasonable.

 

[the moops]

If Bynum signs that, and stays healthy, I can see the Lebron going back to CLE scenarion becoming even more likely.

They probably would have space to sign Lebron and another max guy

 

[scoobus]

If Bynum signs that, and stays healthy, I can see the Lebron going back to CLE scenarion becoming even more likely.

They probably would have space to sign Lebron and another max guy

No they wouldn't, unless you mean Kyrie.

 

[Good Posting Judge]

Speights = bleh.

What on Earth are the Bucks doing? They have like a hundred bigs.

 

[sporthenry]

The Cleveland Cavaliers are pushing for free-agent center Andrew Bynum to accept a two-year, $24 million-plus, incentive-based contract offer, league sources told Yahoo! Sports on Monday night.

Actually seems rather reasonable.

I can't see it. At that price, he might as well just take a 1 year deal. Cleveland wants the team option but I don't see how he does that unless he wants to play with Kyrie. I could see a bigger contract with more incentives but that would be a possible steal for them.

 

[Bobcat10]

If Bynum signs that, and stays healthy, I can see the Lebron going back to CLE scenarion becoming even more likely.

They probably would have space to sign Lebron and another max guy

No they wouldn't, unless you mean Kyrie.

Obviously that's not what he means.

 

[the moops]

If Bynum signs that, and stays healthy, I can see the Lebron going back to CLE scenarion becoming even more likely.

They probably would have space to sign Lebron and another max guy

No they wouldn't, unless you mean Kyrie.

Yea, you are right? Looks like they would be at 50 or so if they pick up the options of Irving, Waiters, and Thompson.

Bynum at 12, Kyrie at 7.5, Lebron at 20.5, Thompson at 5.4, Waiters at 5.1.

 

[Notorious T.R.E.]

Would the Cavs owner even take Lebron back? He seems like a spiteful little turd.

 

[Premier]

On the extremely unlikely chance that Bynum is healthy, that's a pretty good team. Definitely playoff caliber in the god forsaken east.

 

[Juxtatarot]

Would the Cavs owner even take Lebron back? He seems like a spiteful little turd.

There is no way he could say no. The entire city would be ready to welcome him back with open arms. They'd be crazy not to.

 

[Cliff Clavin]

I think you guys talking down at us are actually missing the point. We get that it's not the NBA HoF. We're saying that makes it less elite and special. The fact that those two are virtual locks to get in indicates how diluted it is.

You and psycho have opinions that indicate you don't know what the #### you're talking about.

Or, perhaps, our standards of what makes someone an All-Star are more in line with the actual use of the term "All-Star." Perhaps we like the word to have meaning. Kind of like when everyone gets a ribbon for playing. Pretty soon everyone is going to be an All-Star.

I think you're a little confused in here. Take a breather, re-read what you wrote and try again.

 

[Bobcat10]

Would the Cavs owner even take Lebron back? He seems like a spiteful little turd.

There is no way he could say no. The entire city would be ready to welcome him back with open arms. They'd be crazy not to.

Nah alot of people would be pissed...seriously....at first. After that, winning cures all wounds.

I think Gilbert takes him back....it's business.

 

[Mr. Retukes]

Lebron is about 10 years from even considering returning to Cleveland.

 

[DrJ]

Ralph Sampson is in the HOF off of mostly college accomplishments. There's really no debate on Pau or Manu after something like that. Personally I think Grant Hill has a serious beef if he doesn't make HOF based on his college resume along with the start to his pro career. You could practically make a case for Glenn Robinson off of his Purdue years now.

There won't be too many of these college types long term since no one plays there anymore though. Anyways, Pau and Manu are in.

 

[tommyGunZ]

The Cleveland Cavaliers are pushing for free-agent center Andrew Bynum to accept a two-year, $24 million-plus, incentive-based contract offer, league sources told Yahoo! Sports on Monday night.

Actually seems rather reasonable.

Handing Bynum $12M per for multiple years after the heist he pulled last year seems like a disaster waiting to happen.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Would the Cavs owner even take Lebron back? He seems like a spiteful little turd.

If I am LeBron, to even consider going back to Cleveland, Dan Gilbert would have to do some much bridge rebuilding. Gilbert didn't just burn those bridges when LBJ went to Miami, he torched them and then pissed on the ashes.

The Cleveland Cavaliers are pushing for free-agent center Andrew Bynum to accept a two-year, $24 million-plus, incentive-based contract offer, league sources told Yahoo! Sports on Monday night.

Actually seems rather reasonable.

Handing Bynum $12M per for multiple years after the heist he pulled last year seems like a disaster waiting to happen.

I couldn't agree more.

 

[DrJ]

Pelicans really dont want to give Philly a top pick in this coming draft. If the Pelican make the playoffs that was a monster deal for them since I dont think Noel will be anything special at this level whenever healthy.

I agree that the trade probably doesn't look nearly as good for Philly now. I am higher on Noel than you. At worst, I think he develops into a rim protector. I always overrate young guys abilities to produce but it certainly seems like the Pelicans will be in contention for the playoffs. So goes from a possible 6-10 pick to a mid teen pick which is a pretty significant gap.

But if they win the lottery, they still come out as winners with the top pick in next years class which was the biggest reason for the trade.

I think the pick is top 5 protected, so the Cans winning the lottery doesn't help.

 

[Bobcat10]

The Cleveland Cavaliers are pushing for free-agent center Andrew Bynum to accept a two-year, $24 million-plus, incentive-based contract offer, league sources told Yahoo! Sports on Monday night.

Actually seems rather reasonable.

Handing Bynum $12M per for multiple years after the heist he pulled last year seems like a disaster waiting to happen.

I'm thinking yr 2 is a team option...I've heard nothing other than them offering him one year guaranteed money the past couple days, not that that is worth anything. Find it hard to believe they lock up space next season without it being their option.

 

[sporthenry]

The Cleveland Cavaliers are pushing for free-agent center Andrew Bynum to accept a two-year, $24 million-plus, incentive-based contract offer, league sources told Yahoo! Sports on Monday night.

Actually seems rather reasonable.

Handing Bynum $12M per for multiple years after the heist he pulled last year seems like a disaster waiting to happen.

It is a team option for the 2nd year.

 

[Bobcat10]

The questions are...what will the Dallas knee investigation reveal and what will they offer? Atlanta seems like an afterthought...unless they offer a ridic deal.

 

[sporthenry]

Pelicans really dont want to give Philly a top pick in this coming draft. If the Pelican make the playoffs that was a monster deal for them since I dont think Noel will be anything special at this level whenever healthy.

I agree that the trade probably doesn't look nearly as good for Philly now. I am higher on Noel than you. At worst, I think he develops into a rim protector. I always overrate young guys abilities to produce but it certainly seems like the Pelicans will be in contention for the playoffs. So goes from a possible 6-10 pick to a mid teen pick which is a pretty significant gap.

But if they win the lottery, they still come out as winners with the top pick in next years class which was the biggest reason for the trade.

I think the pick is top 5 protected, so the Cans winning the lottery doesn't help.

Yes, it is top 5 protected. I meant the Sixers winning the lottery with their own pick which is the ultimate goal. The Pelicans pick is just gravy.

 

[Britney Spears]

If Manu and Pau get into the Hall of Fame, it truly is the Hall of Medicroity.

Both guys have multiple NBA rings and have excelled in international play.

I know its funny. Can you imagine them in the NBA Hall of Fame? I can't.Manu = 3 rings, 2 all-stars in 11 seasons. And, he was a "starter" in four of those eleven.

Pau = 2 rings, 4 all-stars in 13 seasons. Averaging double/double in three of those thirteen.

Yeah, it would be funny if those stats allow for an NBA Hall of Fame induction.

You seem to still be struggling on a very important point here.

No, I get it. The NBA is arguably the top players in the world and the two in question have performed in a non-All-Star fashion. The merits of their NBA careers do not favor an All-Star selection.

:snicker:

 

[Britney Spears]

Would the Cavs owner even take Lebron back? He seems like a spiteful little turd.

Tough to imagine any scenario where Gilbert comes out looking good.

If LeBron comes back, its in spite of him. If LeBron doesn't, Gilbert's tantrum will definitely seem like a factor.

 

[tommyGunZ]

Oladipo shot just 2-of-12 from the field

welcome to the NBA

 

[biggamer3]

I think it's hilarious someone here actually thought there was a question if Gilbert would accept LeBron back.

 

[Good Posting Judge]

Can someone give me the low-down on Speights? How's his defense, besides what looks like decent rebounding?

He does have "Free Boosie" in his Twitter profile.

 

[Good Posting Judge]

Can someone give me the low-down on Speights? How's his defense, besides what looks like decent rebounding?

He does have "Free Boosie" in his Twitter profile.

Wait a minute...why are 65% of his attempts jump shots.

 

[scoobus]

Can someone give me the low-down on Speights? How's his defense, besides what looks like decent rebounding?

He does have "Free Boosie" in his Twitter profile.

Wait a minute...why are 65% of his attempts jump shots.

As you've noticed, he shoots a lot of jumpers, with pretty good range. If he makes his first few shots, he's pretty engaged, but if he's cold, he pretty much checks out on both ends. He likes to shoot, a lot. At times he looks like a great asset off the bench, other times you never want to see him play again.

I think he's a significant downgrade from Carl Landry. I don't think Cleveland fans are too upset to see him go.

 

[Good Posting Judge]

Can someone give me the low-down on Speights? How's his defense, besides what looks like decent rebounding?

He does have "Free Boosie" in his Twitter profile.

Wait a minute...why are 65% of his attempts jump shots.

As you've noticed, he shoots a lot of jumpers, with pretty good range. If he makes his first few shots, he's pretty engaged, but if he's cold, he pretty much checks out on both ends. He likes to shoot, a lot. At times he looks like a great asset off the bench, other times you never want to see him play again.

I think he's a significant downgrade from Carl Landry. I don't think Cleveland fans are too upset to see him go.

Landry shoots a lot of J's too.

This is mildly depressing, but at least we've go @Andre.

 

[Daywalker]

Lebron is about 10 years from even considering returning to Cleveland.

He should go back to Cleveland. The goodwill he'd garner, especially if they win titles, would be an avalanche. The average fan loves to root against Lebron right now. That would change to a large degree if he went back to Cleveland.

Lebron had $42mill in endorsements last year. Kobe had $34mill. Seems like the disparity should be much larger at this point in time. We've all the seen the segments on ESPN wondering why Paul and Griffin are all over the tube , commercial-wise, while Lebron is nowhere to be found. Just seems like Lebron is leaving a lot of money on the table.

Perhaps that will change if he keeps on winning in Miami or say NY or LA and it gets overwhelming. But it may not. It hasn't happened yet. I do think if he went back to Cleveland and won it would guarantee him maxing out endorsement-wise. Could set him up to be one of those guys who continues to rake on huge endorsement dollars long after he retires.

So financially going back to Cleveland makes the most sense IMO. Lebron and Irving along with the rest of that young-promising roster would be very formidable. Plenty of assets to trade for another stud if necessary too. Financially and basketball-wise it's a no-brainer.

 

[Good Posting Judge]

Guys?

He's extending with the Heat a year from now. Write it down.

 

[Short Corner]

Guys?

He's extending with the Heat a year from now. Write it down.

Pretty sure he's not extending.

 

[pollardsvision]

The Cleveland Cavaliers are pushing for free-agent center Andrew Bynum to accept a two-year, $24 million-plus, incentive-based contract offer, league sources told Yahoo! Sports on Monday night.

Actually seems rather reasonable.

Handing Bynum $12M per for multiple years after the heist he pulled last year seems like a disaster waiting to happen.

It is a team option for the 2nd year.

I think it's a pretty smart deal, even if the 2nd year wasn't a team option (though obviously better with that being the case).

I know people love the direction the Cavs are going in, but this is still a team that won 3 more games than the Bobcats last year. They aren't very good and they need to take a risk like this. Either Bynum is healthy and it makes them a much better team, or he's not and they very likely back with another high lottery pick in 2014 (and have a 12-year expiring to deal next year, if they want).

For the Cavs (and a lot of other teams), I'd rather give Bynum a 2-year deal than a 4-year deal for somebody like Iguodala or Smith. A young player that will either be great or be worthless on a very short deal is exactly the right kind of deal for a bad team on the way up.

 

[metoo]

Would the Cavs owner even take Lebron back? He seems like a spiteful little turd.

Do you mean would Lebron take him back?

 

[Abraham]

Bynum 2/24 is a steal. They have to spend some money and they have so many guys on rookie or min deals that somebody has to get paid. If he's 85% of what he was then he's a top 10 big man and they get paid 12 a year.

 

[pollardsvision]

Bynum 2/24 is a steal. They have to spend some money and they have so many guys on rookie or min deals that somebody has to get paid. If he's 85% of what he was then he's a top 10 big man and they get paid 12 a year.

Not to nitpick and I completely agree with everything, but I think $12 mill/year on a short contract is less "Top 10 big man" salary and closer to "anybody that's close to 7-feet and not a complete stiff" salary.

Given the length, it's a far less desirable contract (for the player) than what Splitter got. It's a far less desirable contract than what Jefferson got, and he's not in a healthy Bynum's league. Both of those were considered very reasonable contracts.

 

[Abraham]

Bynum 2/24 is a steal. They have to spend some money and they have so many guys on rookie or min deals that somebody has to get paid. If he's 85% of what he was then he's a top 10 big man and they get paid 12 a year.

Not to nitpick and I completely agree with everything, but I think $12 mill/year on a short contract is less "Top 10 big man" salary and closer to "anybody that's close to 7-feet and not a complete stiff" salary.Given the length, it's a far less desirable contract (for the player) than what Splitter got. It's a far less desirable contract than what Jefferson got, and he's not in a healthy Bynum's league. Both of those were considered very reasonable contracts.

Understood, but they'll have his early bird rights in two seasons (iirc) and can give him a big, long deal if me makes it through the next two years. I think it's a big deal for the Lebron attraction as well. Money well spent.

 

[Long Ball Larry]

Speights is certainly a talent and I was excited when the Sixers drafted him. But he has never shown a commitment to working hard to improve and his effort is usually not there on defense (as scoobus mentioned). He was the 16th pick in the draft in 08 that the Sixers turned into 2 2nds 4 years later, so that doesn't bode well.

 

[Abraham]

Question for those if you who know how to use Basketball Reference (since I don't).

What is the fewest minutes played in a non-injury rookie season of a future all star? The rockets board is arguing Terrence jones potential after he dominated another summer league game and someone pointed out that he played fewer than 300 minutes and (iirc) Steve Nash's 650 minute as a rookie is the low mark for that metric.

 

[thecatch]

Bynum 2/24 is a steal. They have to spend some money and they have so many guys on rookie or min deals that somebody has to get paid. If he's 85% of what he was then he's a top 10 big man and they get paid 12 a year.

Not to nitpick and I completely agree with everything, but I think $12 mill/year on a short contract is less "Top 10 big man" salary and closer to "anybody that's close to 7-feet and not a complete stiff" salary.

Given the length, it's a far less desirable contract (for the player) than what Splitter got. It's a far less desirable contract than what Jefferson got, and he's not in a healthy Bynum's league. Both of those were considered very reasonable contracts.

Not by Zach Lowe. He's been killing the Jefferson deal.

 

[Daywalker]

Bynum 2/24 is a steal. They have to spend some money and they have so many guys on rookie or min deals that somebody has to get paid. If he's 85% of what he was then he's a top 10 big man and they get paid 12 a year.

Not to nitpick and I completely agree with everything, but I think $12 mill/year on a short contract is less "Top 10 big man" salary and closer to "anybody that's close to 7-feet and not a complete stiff" salary.

Given the length, it's a far less desirable contract (for the player) than what Splitter got. It's a far less desirable contract than what Jefferson got, and he's not in a healthy Bynum's league. Both of those were considered very reasonable contracts.

Not by Zach Lowe. He's been killing the Jefferson deal.

Lowe on the latest BS Report was a nice NBA fix.

 

[pollardsvision]

Bynum 2/24 is a steal. They have to spend some money and they have so many guys on rookie or min deals that somebody has to get paid. If he's 85% of what he was then he's a top 10 big man and they get paid 12 a year.

Not to nitpick and I completely agree with everything, but I think $12 mill/year on a short contract is less "Top 10 big man" salary and closer to "anybody that's close to 7-feet and not a complete stiff" salary.

Given the length, it's a far less desirable contract (for the player) than what Splitter got. It's a far less desirable contract than what Jefferson got, and he's not in a healthy Bynum's league. Both of those were considered very reasonable contracts.

Not by Zach Lowe. He's been killing the Jefferson deal.

Certainly, Jefferson is a flawed player and it's plenty reasonable to question the Bobcats actually trying to win a few more games in a year where it doesn't make any sense to try to win a few more games.

But I like it, and I think it makes sense for the fan base. It's not a long deal and with so many teams blatantly trying to lose games already (a number sure to rise as the season progresses), it might be more difficult than it usually is for the Bobcats to get their Top 5 pick.

Bobcats aren't your run of the mill ####ty franchise. I think it makes sense when you've got a fan base barely hanging on, to actually try to get a little better. Punting this season completely and missing on one of the studs in the draft would be a complete disaster, even by Bobcats standards.

Chances are, Jefferson won't help that much, and the Bobcats will still be in the mix for a Top 6 pick. They are likely going to stink anyway, but they could use a team to root for that wins some games from time to time.

Also, Bobcats fans don't believe for one second that they every would've or will land Wiggins. There are some other franchise players to miss out on, but they know they won't get him.

 

[Cliff Clavin]

Can someone give me the low-down on Speights? How's his defense, besides what looks like decent rebounding?

He does have "Free Boosie" in his Twitter profile.

Wait a minute...why are 65% of his attempts jump shots.

As you've noticed, he shoots a lot of jumpers, with pretty good range. If he makes his first few shots, he's pretty engaged, but if he's cold, he pretty much checks out on both ends. He likes to shoot, a lot. At times he looks like a great asset off the bench, other times you never want to see him play again.

I think he's a significant downgrade from Carl Landry. I don't think Cleveland fans are too upset to see him go.

Landry shoots a lot of J's too.

This is mildly depressing, but at least we've go @Andre.

Kobe thinks Speights needs to learn how to pass.

Not expecting big assists number from him, but he is one of the all-time worst. If he gets the ball, the shot is going up.

 

[Good Posting Judge]

Bynum 2/24 is a steal. They have to spend some money and they have so many guys on rookie or min deals that somebody has to get paid. If he's 85% of what he was then he's a top 10 big man and they get paid 12 a year.

Not to nitpick and I completely agree with everything, but I think $12 mill/year on a short contract is less "Top 10 big man" salary and closer to "anybody that's close to 7-feet and not a complete stiff" salary.

Given the length, it's a far less desirable contract (for the player) than what Splitter got. It's a far less desirable contract than what Jefferson got, and he's not in a healthy Bynum's league. Both of those were considered very reasonable contracts.

Not by Zach Lowe. He's been killing the Jefferson deal.

Certainly, Jefferson is a flawed player and it's plenty reasonable to question the Bobcats actually trying to win a few more games in a year where it doesn't make any sense to try to win a few more games.

But I like it, and I think it makes sense for the fan base. It's not a long deal and with so many teams blatantly trying to lose games already (a number sure to rise as the season progresses), it might be more difficult than it usually is for the Bobcats to get their Top 5 pick.

Bobcats aren't your run of the mill ####ty franchise. I think it makes sense when you've got a fan base barely hanging on, to actually try to get a little better. Punting this season completely and missing on one of the studs in the draft would be a complete disaster, even by Bobcats standards.

Chances are, Jefferson won't help that much, and the Bobcats will still be in the mix for a Top 6 pick. They are likely going to stink anyway, but they could use a team to root for that wins some games from time to time.

Also, Bobcats fans don't believe for one second that they every would've or will land Wiggins. There are some other franchise players to miss out on, but they know they won't get him.

Are Bobcats fans that unsophisticated that they'd think this is a good move somehow?

 

[Daywalker]

Jefferson going to go 20/9 the next two seasons and opt-out. 2/28mill for that production isn't a bad get when you are the Bobcats.

 

[Abraham]

Jefferson going to go 20/9 the next two seasons and opt-out. 2/28mill for that production isn't a bad get when you are the Bobcats.

Agreed. JEfferson isn't going to be the best player on a title team but so what? If you're a lottery team and have a player under 30 that should average 18+/8+ and has a chance to score 30 points any given night then it's worth that kind of money.

 

[Notorious T.R.E.]

I think it's hilarious someone here actually thought there was a question if Gilbert would accept LeBron back.

HAHAHAAHAHA

 

[Notorious T.R.E.]

Would the Cavs owner even take Lebron back? He seems like a spiteful little turd.

Do you mean would Lebron take him back?

Well, I know that's not going to happen. I was just entertaining the hat-in-hand Gilbert side of it...

 

[TobiasFunke]

I try to stay out of the team-specific threads because they should be for fans of that team and they shouldn't have to put up with people who know less about their team and fan base, so no Lakers thread for me. But it's amazing to me how many people still don't understand the Chris Paul trade veto over there (and presumably elsewhere).

The trade was vetoed by the owners of the Hornets, not the league. Yes, the league owned the team, but they weren't acting in in an administrative capacity when they vetoed the trade, they were acting as the owners of the Hornets. Owners of sports teams vetoes personnel moves all the time. You don't have a right to be free of the whims of nutty rich owners on the other side of your team's trade offers, whether it's just one guy or a collection of 29 different people/families/investment groups.

If you want to complain, complain about the league taking ownership of one of its franchises in the first place. That's at least a reasonable complaint. But once it happens, they're just like any other team. If ownership decides it doesn't like a trade, there's no trade, end of story.

 

[Abraham]

I try to stay out of the team-specific threads because they should be for fans of that team and they shouldn't have to put up with people who know less about their team and fan base, so no Lakers thread for me. But it's amazing to me how many people still don't understand the Chris Paul trade veto over there (and presumably elsewhere).

The trade was vetoed by the owners of the Hornets, not the league. Yes, the league owned the team, but they weren't acting in in an administrative capacity when they vetoed the trade, they were acting as the owners of the Hornets. Owners of sports teams vetoes personnel moves all the time. You don't have a right to be free of the whims of nutty rich owners on the other side of your team's trade offers, whether it's just one guy or a collection of 29 different people/families/investment groups.

If you want to complain, complain about the league taking ownership of one of its franchises in the first place. That's at least a reasonable complaint. But once it happens, they're just like any other team. If ownership decides it doesn't like a trade, there's no trade, end of story.

This whole Chris Paul thing is interesting to me. I know that Steve Nash is on the books for a couple years, but why was there absolutely no discussion whatsoever (press, speculation, etc.) of Paul changing locker rooms? It seemed weird to me that there were no articles pointing out that if Howard walked the Lakers could conceivably construct some package or whatnot to get Paul on their team. For all the love the Lakers fans show for Paul when discussing the non-trade, it struck me as odd that his name was never ever floated again as a Lakers target.