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*** NEW ENGLAND v OAKLAND - GAME THREAD *** (1 Viewer)
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4thAndForever
Footballguy
Wait a minute - are you guys arguing about Jake Plummer vs. Kerry Collins?That's like one of those questions, would you rather make out with your grandmother or have relations with your dog. Either way, you lose.
M
mojorizin
Guest
Nah, I wasn't. Marc was.
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Iwannabeacowboybaby!
Footballguy
That was kind of you to say mistersmith. I watched the entire game myself, I really enjoyed it. It was fun to watch football again.
MSULions
Footballguy
please enlighten us regarding previous top 3 FF qbs with completion percentages below 50%. I'm betting there are few, if any. Collins may be at the lower end of the top ten, but he will not approach top 5....let alone top 3. That's just crazy talk. the list of other QBs that MAY reach the top ten is long....people taking Collins as QB4-6 are idiots.you get points for completion percentage? odd.glllApproaching 300 yards and 3 tds. Man, how will he ever reach top five this year?
Go ahead and post his completion percentage again.
railman305
Footballguy
I also was surprised at how many looks T. brown got, seems like the #2 WR is split between him and givens, and that watson might be in more for receiving duties, and graham more for blocking, Brady looked solid, no mistakes at all really, Dillon progressed as game went on but first half was ineffective and non-factor, didnt look like he had much room, but still was impressed with OAK. run defense overall (made big stop on 4 and 1), there pass defense still bad, (they drop 8 guys back and brady would still find an open WR)
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geoff8695
Footballguy
please enlighten us regarding previous top 3 FF qbs with completion percentages below 50%. I'm betting there are few, if any. Collins may be at the lower end of the top ten, but he will not approach top 5....let alone top 3. That's just crazy talk. the list of other QBs that MAY reach the top ten is long....people taking Collins as QB4-6 are idiots.you get points for completion percentage? odd.glllApproaching 300 yards and 3 tds. Man, how will he ever reach top five this year?
Go ahead and post his completion percentage again.
People taking Collins as a top 10 QB are wise in seeing that the supporting players around Collins will allow him to produce very good ff numbers in 2005.I am not suggesting that he is a great NFL QB or that his career has been indicative of greatness up to this point in time.
However it is foolish of you to think that he will be average in 2005 just because he has never had this talented of a supporting cast before or because of a tough season opener. Keep in mind that Collins did in fact have a very successful "fantasy" performance tonight. And that this was in the 1st regular season game of the year, on the road, against a top tier defense, with a less than healthy Porter, Curry, Gabriel, Etc.
Believe me I am not a fan of the Raiders or of Kerry Collins but I do know a great ff situation when I see one...
Hellfire Snail
Footballguy
You obviously have hatred for Collins making your judgments absurd. People taking Collins as QB 4-6 are idiots? Only an idiot could think that after tonight. In my opinion he played rather poorly against the champs in their building opening night and he had 260 yards and 3 tds. Enlighten us: who are the guarenteed qbs who will finish above him? Manning, Culpepper, McNabb, and? Bulger? He is far from a touchdown machine. Who else? I don't understand. At all.please enlighten us regarding previous top 3 FF qbs with completion percentages below 50%. I'm betting there are few, if any. Collins may be at the lower end of the top ten, but he will not approach top 5....let alone top 3. That's just crazy talk. the list of other QBs that MAY reach the top ten is long....people taking Collins as QB4-6 are idiots.you get points for completion percentage? odd.glllApproaching 300 yards and 3 tds. Man, how will he ever reach top five this year?
Go ahead and post his completion percentage again.
I dont care about what happened in the past. I care about what is happening and what will happen. What Is happening is a very fine FF performance with a crappy completion percentage. If that continues to happen I dont give a crap about what has happened in the past.He had a "good" FF day against a great defense. Your argument against him amounts to "oh yeah?" and seems bitter.please enlighten us regarding previous top 3 FF qbs with completion percentages below 50%. I'm betting there are few, if any. Collins may be at the lower end of the top ten, but he will not approach top 5....let alone top 3. That's just crazy talk. the list of other QBs that MAY reach the top ten is long....people taking Collins as QB4-6 are idiots.you get points for completion percentage? odd.glllApproaching 300 yards and 3 tds. Man, how will he ever reach top five this year?
Go ahead and post his completion percentage again.
Carter_Can_Fly
Footballguy
Not sold on Collins yet but the pass that was completed to Moss for a TD was not a fluke pass. I don't know if you saw the replay but the DB covering Moss made a pretty good play on it but it went just over his head and Moss jumbled the ball a little bit but it was not a fluke throw by Collins, it was actually thrown very well. The problem I saw with Oakland tonight was like mentioned at half the inconsistency of the O-line. If they get better which I am assuming they will as they are just becoming a unit then Collins will be just fine. I really like what I saw out of Jordan today. The guy will be just fine. Starting in his first game on a new team against the defending champs he had 110 combined yards against a defense that is coached by the greatest scheme coach that was targeting him as the number person to stop. He was in there on goal line situations and he looked good running between the tackles at times. When they play against a lesser opponent and they are up points and having more success throwing the ball He will be great could very well be a top 10 back this year.Yes, and one fluke bomb to Moss.
Luckily for Collins owners, 55% of his passes had no chance of being caught by anyone.
Judge Smails
Footballguy
Collins will be a very good fantasy QB in 2005, without question. As others have stated, his situation with surrounding talent is just too good not too. And he fits the talent with the vertical game. Still, he'll always be leaving owners with the sense that more was on the table, especially if you are penalized for INT's and fumbles. Still prone to throwing off his back foot and forcing throws. Moss will save countless picks by acting like a DB and batting errant throws down. Still, 3TD's with one pick against NE on the road is a good performance - I don't care what his completion percentage was. Oakland will light up the scoreboard vs. lesser defenses.
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Biabreakable
Footballguy
DonnyT33
Footballguy
This guy sounds like Kimmell. If Collins does not get injured and plays all 16 games he will slip into the 4-6 range and you will be the idiot for passing on him. There will be many a shoot out in Oakland games this year. When Curry and Gabriel come back and Poter is 100% watch out scoreboards.please enlighten us regarding previous top 3 FF qbs with completion percentages below 50%. I'm betting there are few, if any. Collins may be at the lower end of the top ten, but he will not approach top 5....let alone top 3. That's just crazy talk. the list of other QBs that MAY reach the top ten is long....people taking Collins as QB4-6 are idiots.you get points for completion percentage? odd.glllApproaching 300 yards and 3 tds. Man, how will he ever reach top five this year?
Go ahead and post his completion percentage again.
DonnyT33
Footballguy
smart man, and those of us who have him in any kind of distance scoring leagues should all be smiling right now.please enlighten us regarding previous top 3 FF qbs with completion percentages below 50%. I'm betting there are few, if any. Collins may be at the lower end of the top ten, but he will not approach top 5....let alone top 3. That's just crazy talk. the list of other QBs that MAY reach the top ten is long....people taking Collins as QB4-6 are idiots.you get points for completion percentage? odd.glllApproaching 300 yards and 3 tds. Man, how will he ever reach top five this year?
Go ahead and post his completion percentage again.
I am not suggesting that he is a great NFL QB or that his career has been indicative of greatness up to this point in time.
However it is foolish of you to think that he will be average in 2005 just because he has never had this talented of a supporting cast before or because of a tough season opener. Keep in mind that Collins did in fact have a very successful "fantasy" performance tonight. And that this was in the 1st regular season game of the year, on the road, against a top tier defense, with a less than healthy Porter, Curry, Gabriel, Etc.
Believe me I am not a fan of the Raiders or of Kerry Collins but I do know a great ff situation when I see one...
Routilla
Footballguy
It worked! Well sort of. Brady 200 yds and 2 TDs in 1st half, 100 yds NO TDs in 2nd half. I'll take it. Thank you Mr. Dillon for keeping Brady out of the endzone in the 2nd half. I'm down 29-0(Brady and Givens). Calling Carson Palmer and Antonio Bryant to equal these guys out on Sunday.Brady is killin' me. Going to bed and hoping NE gets the running game going.
Silver & Black
Footballguy
My thoughts on last night's game:Sloppy, sloppy, sloppy. What, did Oakland have 14 penalties last night? Dude, not good, very not good.Collins: I hate to say it, but I don't feel comfortable with him at the healm. Yes, I think he is going to end up with pretty good fantasy numbers this year. But as a Raiders fan, I really and truly don't like him. When defenders get anywhere close to him, he appears to panic, gets happy feet, and for God's sake man, he holds the football like a loaf of bread out there!! Hold onto the ball Kerry!Defense: I didn't see any Raider remotely close to Brady on one single pass play at all in the first half. None. They did better in the first half of the third quarter, but I was very unimpressed with the pass rush. And holy cow, Pats weren't open all night, they were WIDE open. Overall, I am praying that all those stupid penalties and Collins' happy feet is just first game jitters or offsesaon rust...or from playing the defending champs on the road to start the season. Not a good night for Oakland fans. 
I didn't see any Raider remotely close to Brady on one single pass play at all in the first half. None. They did better in the first half of the third quarter, but I was very unimpressed with the pass rush. And holy cow, Pats weren't open all night, they were WIDE open. Overall, I am praying that all those stupid penalties and Collins' happy feet is just first game jitters or offsesaon rust...or from playing the defending champs on the road to start the season. Not a good night for Oakland fans. 
ZJilla
Footballguy
Ok, again. I LOVE MOSS. I like what Lamont showed.But if you think that Collins pass to Moss wasn't a little bit flukey, given his 45% completion ratio....well then I don't know what would be. Basically, Moss created that play. He looked EXACTLY like he did in Minny. Took plays off, didn't block that well, was amazing in his ability to adjust while going downfield - EXACTLY.Not sold on Collins yet but the pass that was completed to Moss for a TD was not a fluke pass. I don't know if you saw the replay but the DB covering Moss made a pretty good play on it but it went just over his head and Moss jumbled the ball a little bit but it was not a fluke throw by Collins, it was actually thrown very well. The problem I saw with Oakland tonight was like mentioned at half the inconsistency of the O-line. If they get better which I am assuming they will as they are just becoming a unit then Collins will be just fine. I really like what I saw out of Jordan today. The guy will be just fine. Starting in his first game on a new team against the defending champs he had 110 combined yards against a defense that is coached by the greatest scheme coach that was targeting him as the number person to stop. He was in there on goal line situations and he looked good running between the tackles at times. When they play against a lesser opponent and they are up points and having more success throwing the ball He will be great could very well be a top 10 back this year.Yes, and one fluke bomb to Moss.
Luckily for Collins owners, 55% of his passes had no chance of being caught by anyone.
So, while Moss will be top 3-5 WRs, and Collins will be top 10, Collins is still overrated at 4-6.
When he puts up a 4 int week, and throws for 225 yrds, I'll mention it again.
CalBear
Footballguy
The Raiders will have a lot of games like this this year. Yes, the pass to Moss was fluky, but it's also the kind of play that he can make more often than anyone else in the league. Expect a number of big plays. Expect the offense to look unstoppable at times, and terrible at others. (After the first drive, the offense wasn't effective for the rest of the game). Expect the defense to suck all year. Expect them to lead the league in penalties (again). Expect it all to fall apart quite a bit. This is a team that will struggle to finish .500.
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