****OFFICIAL 2009 Off Season Washington Redskins Thread**** (1 Viewer)

[buster c]

Bailey wasn't coming back. To argue that CBs are worth more than RBs is stupid in this case. Bailey wasn't going to be part of the Redskins and everyone knew it, the pick was thrown in for Portis because everyone in the NFL knew we couldn't get anything near market value for Champ.

Bailey wasn't coming back? Everyone knew it? This is not the way I recall it, but feel free to provide evidence. The fact of the matter is that the Skins could have franchised him and he would have played for us. Look around the NFL. Players are always saying they're not playing for their team (and again, I do not recall Bailey ever doing this). Chad Johnson was as good as gone from Cincy, right? Disgruntled players get franchised and sign every year. It is very rare for a player to any miss time in a hold out these days. There's simply too much cabbage at stake.Bailey was no different. That's the fact.

Bailey said he was not going to play for Washington. That's a fact. The rumor was that he was having an affair with a WaPo writer/employee's wife. That employee told Bailey to leave DC or there would be a story.

link please

 

[buster c]

The Case Against Cutler (NY Times blog)

Since Brett Favre retired (again) in February, the buzz in the media and in the blogosphere has been that the Jets cannot enter the 2009 season with a battle of unknowns at quarterback. There has been rampant speculation that the Jets may make a play for Jay Cutler, offering up a young QB and a draft pick, perhaps.

Allow me to say: Don’t do it.

By wrestling his organization to the ground, Cutler has shown that he will deploy the nuclear option (”I won’t play, and you can’t make me”) when he is unhappy. He has shown that, with a guaranteed $16 million left to come in the next two years, and the starting QB job still his, he can still find a way to place a petty quarrel with a coach above the team.

Cutler is behaving as if he ought to be held in the same reverence as John Elway, who won two Super Bowls in his storied career, while Cutler has won exactly nothing, and who presided over a collapse eerily similar to that of the Jets in 2008.

Of course there is an upside: Cutler has a strong arm, good mobility, and might eventually develop into a consistent winner.

But if the Jets trade for Cutler, all of the media attention will immediately lash onto the new quarterback, which will immediately tilt the balance of power in the locker room and between player and organization.

His inflated ego, combined with his selfishness, combined with his seeming emotional instability, combined with the simple fact that he hasn’t won yet, add up to a headache that Rex Ryan does not need.

In other words, not my definition of “leader.”

Some may place less importance on this than I do, but the quarterback needs to be the most respected player on the team. There can be others, of course, but the quarterback must be above controversy and above finger pointing, either from him or toward him. That man is not Cutler, and it is not likely to be Cutler.

I make the occasional point that New York is a different place to play than another city. I’ve seen it written that Cutler has had to live in the shadow of Elway. No, that was Jake Plummer’s miserable fate. Cutler arrived as the antidote to Plummer’s perceived reckless play, and was given a lot of room to find his way by Denver fans. He has poisoned that relationship now, for sure. He would be offered no immunity in New York.

The Jets have three quarterbacks on the roster for a reason. As recently as 2007, they considered Kellen Clemens talented enough to start, and for all of 2008 we kept hearing what a future star Brett Ratliff is destined to be.

So, let’s find out. And while we do, we keep the cost of the position reasonable until we know what we have, and we build team unity, and Ryan has the opportunity to mold his new team in his image.

Which is, after all, what we got him for.

The downside of bringing Cutler in at this time far outweighs the upside, and it assumes facts not in evidence: that the Jets cannot find a reliable starter from the corps they currently have.

A new coach has free rein to jettison deadwood, to accomplish addition by subtraction. Obtaining Cutler runs an unnecessary and, in my view, unacceptable risk of achieving subtraction by addition.

 

[Hang 10]

The Case Against Cutler (NY Times blog)

Since Brett Favre retired (again) in February, the buzz in the media and in the blogosphere has been that the Jets cannot enter the 2009 season with a battle of unknowns at quarterback. There has been rampant speculation that the Jets may make a play for Jay Cutler, offering up a young QB and a draft pick, perhaps.

Allow me to say: Don’t do it.

By wrestling his organization to the ground, Cutler has shown that he will deploy the nuclear option (”I won’t play, and you can’t make me”) when he is unhappy. He has shown that, with a guaranteed $16 million left to come in the next two years, and the starting QB job still his, he can still find a way to place a petty quarrel with a coach above the team.

Cutler is behaving as if he ought to be held in the same reverence as John Elway, who won two Super Bowls in his storied career, while Cutler has won exactly nothing, and who presided over a collapse eerily similar to that of the Jets in 2008.

Of course there is an upside: Cutler has a strong arm, good mobility, and might eventually develop into a consistent winner.

But if the Jets trade for Cutler, all of the media attention will immediately lash onto the new quarterback, which will immediately tilt the balance of power in the locker room and between player and organization.

His inflated ego, combined with his selfishness, combined with his seeming emotional instability, combined with the simple fact that he hasn’t won yet, add up to a headache that Rex Ryan does not need.

In other words, not my definition of “leader.”

Some may place less importance on this than I do, but the quarterback needs to be the most respected player on the team. There can be others, of course, but the quarterback must be above controversy and above finger pointing, either from him or toward him. That man is not Cutler, and it is not likely to be Cutler.

I make the occasional point that New York is a different place to play than another city. I’ve seen it written that Cutler has had to live in the shadow of Elway. No, that was Jake Plummer’s miserable fate. Cutler arrived as the antidote to Plummer’s perceived reckless play, and was given a lot of room to find his way by Denver fans. He has poisoned that relationship now, for sure. He would be offered no immunity in New York.

The Jets have three quarterbacks on the roster for a reason. As recently as 2007, they considered Kellen Clemens talented enough to start, and for all of 2008 we kept hearing what a future star Brett Ratliff is destined to be.

So, let’s find out. And while we do, we keep the cost of the position reasonable until we know what we have, and we build team unity, and Ryan has the opportunity to mold his new team in his image.

Which is, after all, what we got him for.

The downside of bringing Cutler in at this time far outweighs the upside, and it assumes facts not in evidence: that the Jets cannot find a reliable starter from the corps they currently have.

A new coach has free rein to jettison deadwood, to accomplish addition by subtraction. Obtaining Cutler runs an unnecessary and, in my view, unacceptable risk of achieving subtraction by addition.

100% agree with this. While the scrutiny would probably be greater in NYC, it wouldn't be a huge drop off in DC. I think the points in this article are fitting for the Redskins as well.

 

[southeastjerome]

In other news..courtesy of JLC's blog.

Titans Submit Tampering EvidenceA report out of Nashville says that the Titans have asked the NFL to look into whether the Redskins tampered in the signing of Albert Haynesworth in February. Jim Wyatt of tennessean.com reports:The Titans recently turned in what they considered to be evidence that the Redskins had contact with Haynesworth before he became a free agent in February. The league indicated to the Titans that it planned to look into the matter

 

[dgreen]

Bailey wasn't coming back. To argue that CBs are worth more than RBs is stupid in this case. Bailey wasn't going to be part of the Redskins and everyone knew it, the pick was thrown in for Portis because everyone in the NFL knew we couldn't get anything near market value for Champ.

Bailey wasn't coming back? Everyone knew it? This is not the way I recall it, but feel free to provide evidence. The fact of the matter is that the Skins could have franchised him and he would have played for us. Look around the NFL. Players are always saying they're not playing for their team (and again, I do not recall Bailey ever doing this). Chad Johnson was as good as gone from Cincy, right? Disgruntled players get franchised and sign every year. It is very rare for a player to any miss time in a hold out these days. There's simply too much cabbage at stake.Bailey was no different. That's the fact.

Bailey said he was not going to play for Washington. That's a fact. The rumor was that he was having an affair with a WaPo writer/employee's wife. That employee told Bailey to leave DC or there would be a story.

link please

Once technology allows me to link you to my radio a few years ago, I'll make sure you're the first to know.

 

[Sidewinder16]

Matt Terl reports the following info from Greg Blache (and Chris Wilson):

But there was one interesting tidbit, one that explained Chris Wilson's comment from yesterday that "I'm pretty excited to see how they're gonna use me this year" -- because Blache mentioned that the team was looking at Wilson to potentially help fill the role of strongside linebacker.

"Yeah," Wilson told me, "I'm pretty excited for that. I've played the position before, and it's all stuff that I can do."

Wilson, at 6-4, 246, is similar in size to 6-3, 248 pound Marcus Washington, who played the strongside position last year, so it makes some kind of sense, and he's also known for his speed as a lineman. It's still an experiment at this point, barely more than an idea, but it at least offers a solid glimpse at the team's plans as the 2009 season gets closer.

 

[Marvelous]

PFT

We’re told via a short chain of reliable sources that things were interesting this morning in Washington.

As we hear it, Redskins executive V.P. of football operations Vinny Cerrato was retrieved from draft meetings at roughly 10:00 a.m. on Wednesday to go to owner Daniel Snyder’s office. Not long thereafter, they fetched coach Jim Zorn. And the three men remained in Snyder’s office into the evening.

PFT also

Amid reports that the Washington Redskins are actively pursuing a trade for Broncos quarterback Jay Cutler, we’ve caught wind of rumors that the Redskins are trying to trade current starter Jason Campbell. We need to emphasize that this is a rumor, and we’re currently trying to nail down whether or not it’s an accurate rumor.

Campbell is under contract through 2009. Talk of signing him to a new contract subsided significantly after his strong start to the 2008 season faded into something less than that.

Looks like Florio has a real source for the Redskins now. In the past, his writings on the Redskins have been pretty weak and mostly speculation.

 

[Marvelous]

Bailey wasn't coming back. To argue that CBs are worth more than RBs is stupid in this case. Bailey wasn't going to be part of the Redskins and everyone knew it, the pick was thrown in for Portis because everyone in the NFL knew we couldn't get anything near market value for Champ.

Everyone now knows Cutler won't be a Bronco. Do you think the Broncos are only going to get discounted offers for Cutler? Especially if the Redskins are bidding on Cutler? I highly doubt it.

 

[Marvelous]

Bailey wasn't coming back. To argue that CBs are worth more than RBs is stupid in this case. Bailey wasn't going to be part of the Redskins and everyone knew it, the pick was thrown in for Portis because everyone in the NFL knew we couldn't get anything near market value for Champ.

Bailey wasn't coming back? Everyone knew it? This is not the way I recall it, but feel free to provide evidence. The fact of the matter is that the Skins could have franchised him and he would have played for us. Look around the NFL. Players are always saying they're not playing for their team (and again, I do not recall Bailey ever doing this). Chad Johnson was as good as gone from Cincy, right? Disgruntled players get franchised and sign every year. It is very rare for a player to any miss time in a hold out these days. There's simply too much cabbage at stake.Bailey was no different. That's the fact.

Bailey said he was not going to play for Washington. That's a fact. The rumor was that he was having an affair with a WaPo writer/employee's wife. That employee told Bailey to leave DC or there would be a story.

I never heard that. WOW, if true.

 

[T Bell]

I need a moment of catharsis, so please understand and bear with me.I'm physically ill at the thought of this happening.IMO Jason Campbell and Jay Cutler are pretty much exactly the same guy, sans race and maturity level. IMO again, there is absolutely no difference in natural talent or skills. IMO, this is a net negative. Switch them and their respective situations, and the Redskins would be trying to do the same thing, except the Broncos wouldn't be trading a perfectly fine QB.If this goes down, I pray Campbell winds up in a situation where he's got a good Offensive Line, some decent WR's to work with, and a Defense that can generate a pass rush, and force turnovers. There was a Denver fan who called in to the Doc Walker/Kevin Sheehan show today, saying he'd absolutely make the deal, and be more than happy with Campbell as the QB of the Broncos. I think with the Offensive talent around him, and facing the Defenses of the AFC West, he'd do just fine, thank you very much. :X - can one be all of these things at the same time?Stupid, stupid, stupid, stupid Daniel and Vinnie. YOU BUILD A WINNING FOOTBALL TEAM FROM THE INSIDE, OUT - YOU MORONS!!!Welcome to the Defenses of the NFC East, CryBaby Jay - and to your new O-Line, WR's and Defense. (Well at least the Defense has a real chance to be better than the one you played with in Denver).Just can't wait to hear what you have to say after taking a beating or three at the hands of the Cowboys, Eagles and Giants, though. No time to throw, no one to throw to, and...they sure didn't have pass rushes and coverages like that where I came from. Thank you all for bearing with me through this cathartic moment. I'm only letting this all out now so that in case this happens, I'll be a little more rational at that time.

I feel the exact same way. You can't call yourself a farmer if you're exchanging every young plant you ever get for an older one that's already grown (though often not all that well). Patience is one of the most important ingredients in developing players, and yet our organization has virtually none of it. It kills me.

 

[T Bell]

I wonder if Daniel, Vinnie and Zorn are going to have a sleepover tonight...

This is how ludicrously insane things are around here in RedskinsLand:

I could easily see Daniel and Vinny 'taking Zorn's temperature' regarding bringing Shanahan on board in a 'Consultant Role' as early as the NFL Draft or Training Camp.

I could also easily see them (at least Daniel and Vinny between themselves before bringing Zorn into the Office) debating the idea of trying to convince Zorn to take the Offensive Co-Ordinator/Asst Head Coach/Head Coach In Waiting Position under Shanahan's Mentorship as Head Coach for a period of time.

I can't imagine either of them making the move to hire Zorn originally if they knew there was a real possibility that Shanahan would have been available.

I can absolutely see Snyder dressed up in his little 'Lord Helmet' suit (see Spaceballs movie - wouldn't Rick Moranis make a PERFECT Daniel Snyder?), banging his helmeted head into a wall the minute it was announced that Shanahan and the Broncos had parted ways...and then immediately developing some nefarious scheme designed to bring Shanahan on board, and keep Zorn - 'You Will accept Mike Shanahan as your Mentor for the forseeable future' :darksideoftheforcemindtrick:

Oh, my aching head...(and I ain't wearing a tinfoil hat two sizes too small)!!!

I would lose a lot of respect for Zorn if he accepted such an arrangement. I happen to doubt that they'd even propose that - better to fire Zorn outright, and it's not like they would flinch over the wasted money on Zorn's contract.

 

[T Bell]

Bailey wasn't coming back. To argue that CBs are worth more than RBs is stupid in this case. Bailey wasn't going to be part of the Redskins and everyone knew it, the pick was thrown in for Portis because everyone in the NFL knew we couldn't get anything near market value for Champ.

Bailey wasn't coming back? Everyone knew it? This is not the way I recall it, but feel free to provide evidence. The fact of the matter is that the Skins could have franchised him and he would have played for us. Look around the NFL. Players are always saying they're not playing for their team (and again, I do not recall Bailey ever doing this). Chad Johnson was as good as gone from Cincy, right? Disgruntled players get franchised and sign every year. It is very rare for a player to any miss time in a hold out these days. There's simply too much cabbage at stake.Bailey was no different. That's the fact.

Bailey said he was not going to play for Washington. That's a fact. The rumor was that he was having an affair with a WaPo writer/employee's wife. That employee told Bailey to leave DC or there would be a story.

I heard that it was an ultimatum from Bailey's wife, but either way (and maybe both are true) the point is that Bailey was most definitely on his way out of Washington.

 

[T Bell]

Bailey wasn't coming back. To argue that CBs are worth more than RBs is stupid in this case. Bailey wasn't going to be part of the Redskins and everyone knew it, the pick was thrown in for Portis because everyone in the NFL knew we couldn't get anything near market value for Champ.

Everyone now knows Cutler won't be a Bronco. Do you think the Broncos are only going to get discounted offers for Cutler? Especially if the Redskins are bidding on Cutler? I highly doubt it.

I don't know about the "Redskins effect", but the Broncos most certainly have less trade leverage in this situation than they would were Cutler's dissatisfaction and rift with the team not common knowledge. That isn't good for his trade value no matter how you slice it. One key difference between Cutler and Bailey, however, is the remaining length of their contracts. Bailey had only one more year when he was traded; Cutler is under contract until 2013 IIRC. That makes the Broncos' trade position stronger in that regard than was the Redskins' position with Bailey.

 

[buster c]

Bailey wasn't coming back. To argue that CBs are worth more than RBs is stupid in this case. Bailey wasn't going to be part of the Redskins and everyone knew it, the pick was thrown in for Portis because everyone in the NFL knew we couldn't get anything near market value for Champ.

Bailey wasn't coming back? Everyone knew it? This is not the way I recall it, but feel free to provide evidence. The fact of the matter is that the Skins could have franchised him and he would have played for us. Look around the NFL. Players are always saying they're not playing for their team (and again, I do not recall Bailey ever doing this). Chad Johnson was as good as gone from Cincy, right? Disgruntled players get franchised and sign every year. It is very rare for a player to any miss time in a hold out these days. There's simply too much cabbage at stake.

Bailey was no different. That's the fact.

Bailey said he was not going to play for Washington. That's a fact. The rumor was that he was having an affair with a WaPo writer/employee's wife. That employee told Bailey to leave DC or there would be a story.

I heard that it was an ultimatum from Bailey's wife, but either way (and maybe both are true) the point is that Bailey was most definitely on his way out of Washington.

I don't think that's necessarily true, unless little danny and wanted it to be. I think what happened was that Champ got bitter that he hadn't gotten paid yet and made some noise that irked the boy king. Next thing you know, Shanny is greasing up, and with a shout of BOHICA, extracts a bonus #2 pick from

in any event, I googled around and dug this one up from the kool aid board (my apologies for polluting the board with such garbage):

http://www.extremeskins.com/showthread.php?t=185470

 

[Harjiran]

If, as Einstein said, “the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results,” then I think Dan Snyder qualifies as a garden variety lunatic, at least in terms of how he manages the Redskins. Since he's supposedly a savvy businessman, you'd think Dan would see how the Patriots and Steelers of the football world operate and model his own team accordingly, but I guess that would preclude a lot of the hands-on owner involvement that he craves. Marketing aside, it's almost as if the Redskins aren't a business to him; they're an obsession, so all his business acumen goes out the window. It's like he's addicted to this game of acquiring free agents, wining and dining them, going in for the kill, compiling a roster that looks amazing on paper. Yes, I like Cutler and I feel he'd be an upgrade over Campbell. They have big holes to fill in areas other than QB but I suppose I'd be OK with trading Campbell and their #1 for Cutler. But my gut tells me that the Redskins are going to give up the farm: multiple picks, maybe multiple players. My gut also tells me that other teams are going to take advantage of Snyder's obvious, one-dimensional, get-the-player-I-want-at-any-cost strategy. Over the past decade, the only thing Snyder seems to have learned is how to overpay for younger players instead of past-their-prime guys like Bruce Smith, Deion Sanders, etc. He still has no idea what he's doing when it comes to building a sustainable, winning franchise. He still hasn't surrounded himself with smart people who know football. He just doesn't get it. And I don't think he ever will.

 

[dgreen]

They have big holes to fill in areas other than QB but I suppose I'd be OK with trading Campbell and their #1 for Cutler.

Which would you rather have: Campbell and a promising young RT or Cutler and status quo on the OL?

 

[Harjiran]

They have big holes to fill in areas other than QB but I suppose I'd be OK with trading Campbell and their #1 for Cutler.

Which would you rather have: Campbell and a promising young RT or Cutler and status quo on the OL?

That's a tough question ... but status quo on the OL is unacceptable. I think if you get Cutler, you have to find a way to improve the OL as well. Maybe you spend a bunch of later-round draft picks and hope you get lucky. Or you look for cheap free agents this summer. Or maybe you bite the bullet and commit to fully rebuilding the OL during next year's draft, assuming you don't give away all your 2010 picks in the Cutler deal.

 

[Bizkiteer]

Bailey wasn't coming back. To argue that CBs are worth more than RBs is stupid in this case. Bailey wasn't going to be part of the Redskins and everyone knew it, the pick was thrown in for Portis because everyone in the NFL knew we couldn't get anything near market value for Champ.

Bailey wasn't coming back? Everyone knew it? This is not the way I recall it, but feel free to provide evidence. The fact of the matter is that the Skins could have franchised him and he would have played for us. Look around the NFL. Players are always saying they're not playing for their team (and again, I do not recall Bailey ever doing this). Chad Johnson was as good as gone from Cincy, right? Disgruntled players get franchised and sign every year. It is very rare for a player to any miss time in a hold out these days. There's simply too much cabbage at stake.

Bailey was no different. That's the fact.

Bailey said he was not going to play for Washington. That's a fact. The rumor was that he was having an affair with a WaPo writer/employee's wife. That employee told Bailey to leave DC or there would be a story.

I heard that it was an ultimatum from Bailey's wife, but either way (and maybe both are true) the point is that Bailey was most definitely on his way out of Washington.

I don't think that's necessarily true, unless little danny and wanted it to be. I think what happened was that Champ got bitter that he hadn't gotten paid yet and made some noise that irked the boy king. Next thing you know, Shanny is greasing up, and with a shout of BOHICA, extracts a bonus #2 pick from

in any event, I googled around and dug this one up from the kool aid board (my apologies for polluting the board with such garbage):

http://www.extremeskins.com/showthread.php?t=185470

I'm not sure about the whole cheating, wife thing, but Champ had made it known that he was not going to play again. Whatever happened behind the scenes, it was clear as day that we better get something for him now because we'll have nothing after he leaves via FA. Buster, you have a short memory.

 

[T Bell]

They have big holes to fill in areas other than QB but I suppose I'd be OK with trading Campbell and their #1 for Cutler.

Which would you rather have: Campbell and a promising young RT or Cutler and status quo on the OL?

Without improving the o-line, Cutler is likely going to be little better than Campbell if at all. We need to replace 4 to 5 OL starters in the next 2-3 years, and at least two of those spots (RG and RT) before the start of the 2010 season at the latest (RT really should be replaced this year). That's a major assignment even with all of the draft picks at one's disposal.

The team has no business trading away draft picks in a foolish pursuit to upgrade QB right now. Stick with Jason and see if he's worth a new contract after 2009, and address the team's other pressing needs. It's the only approach that makes any sense.

 

[Bizkiteer]

Matt Terl reports the following info from Greg Blache (and Chris Wilson):

But there was one interesting tidbit, one that explained Chris Wilson's comment from yesterday that "I'm pretty excited to see how they're gonna use me this year" -- because Blache mentioned that the team was looking at Wilson to potentially help fill the role of strongside linebacker.

"Yeah," Wilson told me, "I'm pretty excited for that. I've played the position before, and it's all stuff that I can do."

Wilson, at 6-4, 246, is similar in size to 6-3, 248 pound Marcus Washington, who played the strongside position last year, so it makes some kind of sense, and he's also known for his speed as a lineman. It's still an experiment at this point, barely more than an idea, but it at least offers a solid glimpse at the team's plans as the 2009 season gets closer.

This is the kind of crap that a team does when they have absolutely no depth and can't fill the holes. If they are counting on Wilson to start or contribute in the SLB spot for the year...can you say we are in trouble? Now it would be a different situation if the move is to provide depth in case an injury during the season.

 

[Bizkiteer]

They have big holes to fill in areas other than QB but I suppose I'd be OK with trading Campbell and their #1 for Cutler.

Which would you rather have: Campbell and a promising young RT or Cutler and status quo on the OL?

Without improving the o-line, Cutler is likely going to be little better than Campbell if at all. We need to replace 4 to 5 OL starters in the next 2-3 years, and at least two of those spots (RG and RT) before the start of the 2010 season at the latest (RT really should be replaced this year). That's a major assignment even with all of the draft picks at one's disposal.

The team has no business trading away draft picks in a foolish pursuit to upgrade QB right now. Stick with Jason and see if he's worth a new contract after 2009, and address the team's other pressing needs. It's the only approach that makes any sense.

Of course, the FO's response would be that we can draft some later and get good plug in's via FA. Not saying it's right, but I'm sure that is the thinking since this is what we've seen in the past years.

 

[dgreen]

They have big holes to fill in areas other than QB but I suppose I'd be OK with trading Campbell and their #1 for Cutler.

Which would you rather have: Campbell and a promising young RT or Cutler and status quo on the OL?

Without improving the o-line, Cutler is likely going to be little better than Campbell if at all. We need to replace 4 to 5 OL starters in the next 2-3 years, and at least two of those spots (RG and RT) before the start of the 2010 season at the latest (RT really should be replaced this year). That's a major assignment even with all of the draft picks at one's disposal.

The team has no business trading away draft picks in a foolish pursuit to upgrade QB right now. Stick with Jason and see if he's worth a new contract after 2009, and address the team's other pressing needs. It's the only approach that makes any sense.

Agreed. If they trade their 1st this year for Cutler, they are risking not having a good enough OL until Cutler is almost 30.

 

[buster c]

I'm not sure about the whole cheating, wife thing, but Champ had made it known that he was not going to play again. Whatever happened behind the scenes, it was clear as day that we better get something for him now because we'll have nothing after he leaves via FA. Buster, you have a short memory.

Biz buddy, my memory is pretty solid. I can pretty much recite the 1971 roster by jersey # (85 Clifton McNeil, WR). I'm a Redskin Rain Man.Look, I can deal with DGreen's inability to produce a link for a radio report he heard. Hell, I'm even trying to prove myself wrong - I posted a link that dealt with the topic. A link with split opinions. The internet was alive and well in 2003. Why can't we find a single link where Champ says he was not going to play for the Skins? Is it because you guys are trying to paint as fact something that was mere speculation? Rumor & inuendo? Rather than ridicule my memory, prove your assertion.

 

[dgreen]

Frank Hanrihan on 980 just said he expects the deal to happen tonight. He said things are going on at Redskins Park that makes him believe that, but he wasn't willing to reveal what was going on.

 

[buster c]

Cutler to CHI

Cutler to the BEARS

 

[Harjiran]

NFL.com reporting Cutler to the BEARSno link...banner type thingy

Whew!

 

[T Bell]

I'm not sure about the whole cheating, wife thing, but Champ had made it known that he was not going to play again. Whatever happened behind the scenes, it was clear as day that we better get something for him now because we'll have nothing after he leaves via FA. Buster, you have a short memory.

Biz buddy, my memory is pretty solid. I can pretty much recite the 1971 roster by jersey # (85 Clifton McNeil, WR). I'm a Redskin Rain Man.Look, I can deal with DGreen's inability to produce a link for a radio report he heard. Hell, I'm even trying to prove myself wrong - I posted a link that dealt with the topic. A link with split opinions.

The internet was alive and well in 2003. Why can't we find a single link where Champ says he was not going to play for the Skins? Is it because you guys are trying to paint as fact something that was mere speculation? Rumor & inuendo?

Rather than ridicule my memory, prove your assertion.

The problem with this sort of rumor is that it's not going to be openly published, not only because of the general subject matter but also because in this case a WaPo reporter was involved and supposedly that was going to prove embarrassing to the Post. You're asking for proof- you may as well prove your assertion that the 'Skins were going to be able to resign Bailey.

 

[T Bell]

NFL.com reporting Cutler to the BEARSno link...banner type thingy

Whew!

No kidding. I'm a big Bears fan right now.

 

[Sebowski]

Happy this is over.

We could not afford to give what Denver wanted.

I love the way Campbell has been throughout this. I have a lot of faith in Campbell. He deserves one more year. I am glad he is going to get it. I can't wait to see JC succeed in Washington.

 

[thayman]

I'm not sure about the whole cheating, wife thing, but Champ had made it known that he was not going to play again. Whatever happened behind the scenes, it was clear as day that we better get something for him now because we'll have nothing after he leaves via FA. Buster, you have a short memory.

Biz buddy, my memory is pretty solid. I can pretty much recite the 1971 roster by jersey # (85 Clifton McNeil, WR). I'm a Redskin Rain Man.Look, I can deal with DGreen's inability to produce a link for a radio report he heard. Hell, I'm even trying to prove myself wrong - I posted a link that dealt with the topic. A link with split opinions.

The internet was alive and well in 2003. Why can't we find a single link where Champ says he was not going to play for the Skins? Is it because you guys are trying to paint as fact something that was mere speculation? Rumor & inuendo?

Rather than ridicule my memory, prove your assertion.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/stor...&id=1742003From the link:

The Redskins two weeks ago determined they could not meet Bailey's contract demands and granted the five-year veteran and former first-round draft choice permission to speak with other teams about a possible trade. Since then, the Redskins have designated Bailey a "franchise" player, the equivalent of making him a one-year qualifying offer worth $6.801 million.

 

[Harjiran]

NFL.com reporting Cutler to the BEARSno link...banner type thingy

Whew!

No kidding. I'm a big Bears fan right now.

As a Redskins fan and a Greg Olsen dynasty owner, I give this trade two thumbs up. :X

 

[buster c]

I'm not sure about the whole cheating, wife thing, but Champ had made it known that he was not going to play again. Whatever happened behind the scenes, it was clear as day that we better get something for him now because we'll have nothing after he leaves via FA. Buster, you have a short memory.

Biz buddy, my memory is pretty solid. I can pretty much recite the 1971 roster by jersey # (85 Clifton McNeil, WR). I'm a Redskin Rain Man.Look, I can deal with DGreen's inability to produce a link for a radio report he heard. Hell, I'm even trying to prove myself wrong - I posted a link that dealt with the topic. A link with split opinions.

The internet was alive and well in 2003. Why can't we find a single link where Champ says he was not going to play for the Skins? Is it because you guys are trying to paint as fact something that was mere speculation? Rumor & inuendo?

Rather than ridicule my memory, prove your assertion.

The problem with this sort of rumor is that it's not going to be openly published, not only because of the general subject matter but also because in this case a WaPo reporter was involved and supposedly that was going to prove embarrassing to the Post. You're asking for proof- you may as well prove your assertion that the 'Skins were going to be able to resign Bailey.

You got it wrong - I'm not asking for proof about an extra-marital affair. I'm asking for any link where Champ says he won't play for the Skins. And Thayman, your link says that the Redskins determined they cannot sign Bailey. I do not doubt that this was clearly their position (afterall, they traded him). But we have nothing from Bailey himself saying he wanted out.

SIX YEARS and nothing??

 

[fatness]

The internet was alive and well in 2003. Why can't we find a single link where Champ says he was not going to play for the Skins? Is it because you guys are trying to paint as fact something that was mere speculation? Rumor & inuendo?

I remember it that way, too. Bailey was leaving , no matter what. He never said it publicly, made it known to the team privately.

 

[fatness]

Happy this is over.We could not afford to give what Denver wanted.I love the way Campbell has been throughout this. I have a lot of faith in Campbell. He deserves one more year. I am glad he is going to get it. I can't wait to see JC succeed in Washington.

I listened to part of Campbell's interview today with Kevin Sheehan. Campbell said Zorn called him this morning as did other members of the coaching staff to say "he's their guy", so the pressure to get Cutler obviously came from Vinnie and Dan. Frank Hanrahan was on as well this afternoon and had a funny story. He said ESPN called him and told him to be ready to be on their 6 pm broadcast because the Redskins were getting Cutler. It was the first he'd heard of it. Later when he called ESPN back to confirm when they wanted him they told him never mind, Cutler was going to the Bears. What would be very fitting here would be for Jason Campbell to "pull a Cutler", and stop talking to the team and demand to be traded since they weren't honest and up-front with him.

 

[thayman]

I'm not sure about the whole cheating, wife thing, but Champ had made it known that he was not going to play again. Whatever happened behind the scenes, it was clear as day that we better get something for him now because we'll have nothing after he leaves via FA. Buster, you have a short memory.

Biz buddy, my memory is pretty solid. I can pretty much recite the 1971 roster by jersey # (85 Clifton McNeil, WR). I'm a Redskin Rain Man.Look, I can deal with DGreen's inability to produce a link for a radio report he heard. Hell, I'm even trying to prove myself wrong - I posted a link that dealt with the topic. A link with split opinions.

The internet was alive and well in 2003. Why can't we find a single link where Champ says he was not going to play for the Skins? Is it because you guys are trying to paint as fact something that was mere speculation? Rumor & inuendo?

Rather than ridicule my memory, prove your assertion.

The problem with this sort of rumor is that it's not going to be openly published, not only because of the general subject matter but also because in this case a WaPo reporter was involved and supposedly that was going to prove embarrassing to the Post. You're asking for proof- you may as well prove your assertion that the 'Skins were going to be able to resign Bailey.

You got it wrong - I'm not asking for proof about an extra-marital affair. I'm asking for any link where Champ says he won't play for the Skins. And Thayman, your link says that the Redskins determined they cannot sign Bailey. I do not doubt that this was clearly their position (afterall, they traded him). But we have nothing from Bailey himself saying he wanted out.

SIX YEARS and nothing??

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/foot...ncos/index.htmlBailey turned down a nine-year, $55 million offer last fall because he disagreed with several clauses in the proposal as well as its overall structure.

 

[fatness]

In the end, Denver did not want Jason Campbell. And that’s why Jay Cutler is headed to Chicago.

According to a source involved in the discussions, the Redskins were closing in on a three-way deal Thursday afternoon that involved Cleveland quarterback Brady Quinn going to Denver. The source said he was told that the deal was likely to happen soon. The Examiner reported that a deal was close. Indeed, a CBS affiliate in Denver also reported that Jay Cutler had told them he was told by his agent that he was going to Washington. ESPN also reported that the Redskins were at the top of the list and a deal could happen at any time.

However, the deal involving the Browns unraveled, prompting Chicago to jump back in and offer a less-complicated deal, knowing the Broncos liked Bears quarterback Kyle Orton. The source said Denver’s preference of quarterbacks was Quinn and then Orton. They were not high on Campbell.

So, rather than do a three-way deal with Washington and another team, the Bears, according to an NFL source, called to offer Orton, two first-round draft picks, and a third-round pick in exchange for Cutler and a fifth-round pick.

“They had the compensation,” another NFL source said of the Redskins. “In the end they chose Orton over Campbell.”

John Keim

 

[Bizkiteer]

Well, that's that...now we can all disagree on who they should pick at the 13 spot.

 

[buster c]

in spite of my grave reservations about Campbell as a quality NFL-caliber signal caller...and the fact that he oozes wishy-washy ('just tryin' to get us to where we want to go), I have been impressed with the way he has handled these last few days of rampant trade speculation. He seems to be a class act and a very mature young man (the opposite of Cutler).

 

[T Bell]

In the end, Denver did not want Jason Campbell. And that’s why Jay Cutler is headed to Chicago.

According to a source involved in the discussions, the Redskins were closing in on a three-way deal Thursday afternoon that involved Cleveland quarterback Brady Quinn going to Denver. The source said he was told that the deal was likely to happen soon. The Examiner reported that a deal was close. Indeed, a CBS affiliate in Denver also reported that Jay Cutler had told them he was told by his agent that he was going to Washington. ESPN also reported that the Redskins were at the top of the list and a deal could happen at any time.

However, the deal involving the Browns unraveled, prompting Chicago to jump back in and offer a less-complicated deal, knowing the Broncos liked Bears quarterback Kyle Orton. The source said Denver’s preference of quarterbacks was Quinn and then Orton. They were not high on Campbell.

So, rather than do a three-way deal with Washington and another team, the Bears, according to an NFL source, called to offer Orton, two first-round draft picks, and a third-round pick in exchange for Cutler and a fifth-round pick.

“They had the compensation,” another NFL source said of the Redskins. “In the end they chose Orton over Campbell.”

John Keim

Now I'd love nothing better than to have Campbell's performance this year piss off Denver fans to no end.

 

[T Bell]

in spite of my grave reservations about Campbell as a quality NFL-caliber signal caller...and the fact that he oozes wishy-washy ('just tryin' to get us to where we want to go), I have been impressed with the way he has handled these last few days of rampant trade speculation. He seems to be a class act and a very mature young man (the opposite of Cutler).

Campbell is a class act. I don't think for one minute, however, that he's going to ignore all of this when it comes time to decide to re-up with the team or not.

 

[nittanylion]

Thank God for DA BEARS!!!

I know I go off the deep end sometimes, but I'm willing to speculate that this took some beyond the grave work on the part of JKC and George Halas to overpower the sheer willpower of Daniel and Vinny and their patented Stuponetron Helmet.

I will ask the folks I know within the organization about the Champ Bailey thing. I've heard rumors about 'the affair', but I can't substantiate anything on that without further discussion.

Also, I can't produce a link, but in my conversations with Smokin' Al Cokin, and Doc Walker, who I chat Redskins with from time to time at a few nightspots in Bethesda, I can tell you that I specifically remember that Champ made it clear to the Redskins at the conclusion of his final Season here that he was NOT coming back, under any circumstances.

I was supposed to hang out with Doc last night at an event, but it got cancelled. Next time I'm in his company, I'll make it a point to ask him about the details surrounding Champ's departure, and the veracity of the affair rumors.

 

[fatness]

Now I'd love nothing better than to have Campbell's performance this year piss off Denver fans to no end.

I'd love to hear Zorn call a press conference and say "I didn't want Cutler. It was Dan and Vinnie. Jason's my guy."

 

[dallas428]

i know t bell loves the guy....nfl and fantasy wise...its been documented....i think that the skins dont want him and denver wouldnt even consider him speaks volumes....good luck guys...ty chicago...i didnt wanna face cutler twice a year...bring on the "other" guy...lol

EDIT TO ADD: WHAT A F'IN MESS HAHAHA

 

[fatness]

These 2 guys are suddenly a lot closer than they were before, linked together by a front office that didn't want one of them and didn't care that the other one did.

Campbell said he spoke with Coach Jim Zorn after completing his workout today at Redskins Park and said that Zorn was very supportive and encouraging, telling him that they are in this together and that Campbell is his quarterback.

"That meant a lot to me," Campbell said, "to know that he's behind me and he's been behind me all along. You need to have that trust with your head coach because he's the one I'm going to be dealing with most of the time. I know that the coaches and my teammates are behind me. I trust them. That means a lot to me."

JLC

 

[Sweetness_34]

For once, Snyder got trumped

 

[fatness]

Jason Campbell stuck to his offseason routine on Thursday, going to Redskin Park to work out. While he worked up a sweat in the downstairs gym, the Washington Redskins front office was working the phones, trying to find a way to trade for his replacement.

Indeed, Campbell talked to teammates and to coach Jim Zorn during his visit to the team's headquarters in Ashburn, even before the Broncos' deal with the Bears came across the airwaves around 5:30 p.m.

"I pretty much talked to all of them and I got their support," Campbell said. "That definitely meant a lot to me that they think of me as a player and a person in that way -- that they want to reach out to me."

O'Halloran and Elfin

 

[dallas428]

These 2 guys are suddenly a lot closer than they were before, linked together by a front office that didn't want one of them and didn't care that the other one did.

Campbell said he spoke with Coach Jim Zorn after completing his workout today at Redskins Park and said that Zorn was very supportive and encouraging, telling him that they are in this together and that Campbell is his quarterback.

"That meant a lot to me," Campbell said, "to know that he's behind me and he's been behind me all along. You need to have that trust with your head coach because he's the one I'm going to be dealing with most of the time. I know that the coaches and my teammates are behind me. I trust them. That means a lot to me."

JLC

weeeeeeeeee...spin......weeeeeee...spin....weeeeee......spin it how ya want...zorn new what was up...jason may not be smart enough to figure it out...but it wont fly here...zorn was informed and gave his approval...jason just isnt that good...quick question...was art monk a member of the skins the last time they were a meaningful team in the nfl???

 

[T Bell]

i know t bell loves the guy....nfl and fantasy wise...its been documented....i think that the skins dont want him and denver wouldnt even consider him speaks volumes....good luck guys...ty chicago...i didnt wanna face cutler twice a year...bring on the "other" guy...lolEDIT TO ADD: WHAT A F'IN MESS HAHAHA

Feel free to continue your sophomoric spite, but you couldn't have done a better job of demonstrating your lack of comprehension about what makes a good football team, or what the Redskins' team needs are.

 

[T Bell]

These 2 guys are suddenly a lot closer than they were before, linked together by a front office that didn't want one of them and didn't care that the other one did.

Campbell said he spoke with Coach Jim Zorn after completing his workout today at Redskins Park and said that Zorn was very supportive and encouraging, telling him that they are in this together and that Campbell is his quarterback.

"That meant a lot to me," Campbell said, "to know that he's behind me and he's been behind me all along. You need to have that trust with your head coach because he's the one I'm going to be dealing with most of the time. I know that the coaches and my teammates are behind me. I trust them. That means a lot to me."

JLC

If Campbell improves this year under Zorn, Zorn may be the lifeline that the team needs to retain and resign Campbell to a new contract. Snyder and Cerrato sure can't have a lot of credibility in Campbell's eyes at this point. If Campbell fails to improve or regresses this year, however, I think both guys are gone 12 months from now.

 

[dallas428]

i know t bell loves the guy....nfl and fantasy wise...its been documented....i think that the skins dont want him and denver wouldnt even consider him speaks volumes....good luck guys...ty chicago...i didnt wanna face cutler twice a year...bring on the "other" guy...lolEDIT TO ADD: WHAT A F'IN MESS HAHAHA

Feel free to continue your sophomoric spite, but you couldn't have done a better job of demonstrating your lack of comprehension about what makes a good football team, or what the Redskins' team needs are.

C'mon, folks, we need more insight here!

ur logged on to fbg's like ALL the time...wow...tell ur family you miss them...wow...