Official 2016 GOP thread: Is it really going to be Donald Trump?? (1 Viewer)

[Abraham]

Id go Kasich / Rubio but I agree.

 

[Rove!]

Trump and Carson sound insane on meet the press and Kasich sounds like a President

Kasich is certainly a good candidate. Trump and Carson are terrible ones. I hope they get exposed, and soon.

Love to see Kasich, Rubio, Paul, Walker, Bush, and Fiorina (for a bit of fire) come to the fore.

Bush has been exposed as a lightweight...

 

[FreeBaGeL]

Ben Carson says no muslim should ever be president.

 

[Mr. Retukes]

Ben Carson says no muslim should ever be president.

Watch his poll numbers rise.

 

[Sand]

Ben Carson says no muslim should ever be president.

Generalizations don't do any good and he should know better.

That said Carson is spot on that Islam is not consistent with the tenets of our Constitution.

 

[Sand]

Ben Carson says no muslim should ever be president.

Generalizations don't do any good and he should know better.

That said Carson is spot on that Islam is not consistent with the tenets of our Constitution.

Neither is Kim Davis, but Republicans don't seem to mind that

The whole Davis thing is dumb, too. She voluntarily signed up for public service and the vagaries of law changes that entails.

 

[squistion]

Ben Carson says no muslim should ever be president.

Generalizations don't do any good and he should know better.

That said Carson is spot on that Islam is not consistent with the tenets of our Constitution.

How is Islam not consistent with the tenets of our Constitution?

Article VI of the US constitution states: "No religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States."

 

[Sand]

It's really baffling that Rand Paul, Donald Trump, and Mike Huckabee all represent the same party

The usual complaint was the all the candidates were the same. Now, at least, we have some variety in there.

 

[Sand]

How is Islam not consistent with the tenets of our Constitution?

Start with the 1st and 14th Amendments.

 

[timschochet]

How is Islam not consistent with the tenets of our Constitution?

Start with the 1st and 14th Amendments.

But based on that, neither Christianity nor Judiasm is consistent either.

 

[squistion]

How is Islam not consistent with the tenets of our Constitution?

Start with the 1st and 14th Amendments.

But based on that, neither Christianity nor Judiasm is consistent either.

Details, details.

 

[timschochet]

Yahweh was never too big on that whole freedom of religion thing. Makes Him angry as I recall, so I think the 1st Amendment would have to go.

As for the 14th Amendment, well let's just say that In the Bible, some people are more equal than others...

 

[Mr. Retukes]

"All Muslims are fundamentalists who are incapable of following anything other than sharia law".

 

[Sand]

Yahweh was never too big on that whole freedom of religion thing. Makes Him angry as I recall, so I think the 1st Amendment would have to go.

As for the 14th Amendment, well let's just say that In the Bible, some people are more equal than others...

Talk about modern practice, not ancient writings.

Islam does not allow for the free exercise of religion. It also treats women a nowhere near the equal of a man. Those are both modern tenets, not ancient ones.

 

[Bucky86]

Why does the GOP have to go and be all angry all the time?

 

[timschochet]

Yahweh was never too big on that whole freedom of religion thing. Makes Him angry as I recall, so I think the 1st Amendment would have to go.

As for the 14th Amendment, well let's just say that In the Bible, some people are more equal than others...

Talk about modern practice, not ancient writings.

Islam does not allow for the free exercise of religion. It also treats women a nowhere near the equal of a man. Those are both modern tenets, not ancient ones.

So all American Muslims are fundamentalist?

 

[rockaction]

No, but the antannae certainly goes up. And that's the fault of practicing Muslims all over the world that can't seem to tolerate anything but rank intolerance, enshrined both politically and socially.

Sorry, but it's overwhelming.

 

[rockaction]

It's really baffling that Rand Paul, Donald Trump, and Mike Huckabee all represent the same party

It's really baffling that pro-life Catholics, Jim Traficant-esque Rust Belters, and Debbie Wasserman Schultz represent the Democrats.

One would even call it silly.

 

[Sand]

Yahweh was never too big on that whole freedom of religion thing. Makes Him angry as I recall, so I think the 1st Amendment would have to go.

As for the 14th Amendment, well let's just say that In the Bible, some people are more equal than others...

Talk about modern practice, not ancient writings.

Islam does not allow for the free exercise of religion. It also treats women a nowhere near the equal of a man. Those are both modern tenets, not ancient ones.

So all American Muslims are fundamentalist?

Of course not and if America decided to elect a Muslim president so be it. However, the modern tenets of Islam are what they are.

If you wanted to go down that road we could wax eloquent all day about politicians who call themselves one thing and aren't really even close - like Pelosi calling herself Catholic (<--- glaring example).

 

[MaxThreshold]

Yahweh was never too big on that whole freedom of religion thing. Makes Him angry as I recall, so I think the 1st Amendment would have to go.

As for the 14th Amendment, well let's just say that In the Bible, some people are more equal than others...

Talk about modern practice, not ancient writings.

Islam does not allow for the free exercise of religion. It also treats women a nowhere near the equal of a man. Those are both modern tenets, not ancient ones.

So all American Muslims are fundamentalist?

Of course not and if America decided to elect a Muslim president so be it. However, the modern tenets of Islam are what they are.

If you wanted to go down that road we could wax eloquent all day about politicians who call themselves one thing and aren't really even close - like Pelosi calling herself Catholic (<--- glaring example).

Or Warren calling herself and American Indian. Stuff like that.

 

[SIDA!]

My take is that Fiorina was the only candidate that had the potential of a game changing performance. I don't think Trump or Carson lost any momentum tonight.

In the next week, I see Trump, Carson and Fiorina break out from the pack.

I thought Fiorina gained the most ground. I still feel crazy about this, but IMHO Trump dominated. I thought Carson tumbled out of the race entirely.

Let's examine your statement about Carson.

I disagree for the following reasons. In order for Carson to tumble out of the race you would have to argue that Fiorina stole some of his support. I don't think that is where Fiorina's support is going to come from.

Fiorina's support is going to come from women who are currently backing establishment guys and those male supporters of establishment guys who don't feel comfortable backing Trump or Carson, who they feel are more crazy/nut jobs/out of their depth types.

This is going to effectively become a five horse race in short order. You will have Trump and Carson as the anti-establishment guys. Fiorina, although anti-establishment, doesn't draw the passionate anti-establishment voters. She draws some but her strength will be as the anti-establishment candidate that those voters supporting establishment candidates feel comfortable migrating too because they think Carson and Trump just aren't qualified.

Then there will be a race to see what two guys will be the establishment backers or the last two period.

I don't see Jeb Bush pulling out of this death spiral but he has so much money that he can't be counted out of the top 5.

And I am really surprised to see Rubio and Cruz being so marginalized in the grand scheme of things. I thought they would be performing better than they are.

By this time next week, I see:

Trump

Carson

Fiorina

Bush

Cruz/Rubio

Then I think we are going to see Fiorina really accelerate and possibly surpass Carson in a couple of weeks. Her rise is going to crush the candidacies of most of the others.

The big question I have is what will become of the Jeb Bush cadre of voters. I think Kasich could be that guy, but not sure.

So, NBC has a poll out today with the following results:

TRUMP 29%

Carson 14%

Fiorina 11%

Bush 8%

Cruz 7%

Rubio 7%

Which is exactly what I said...

 

[Mr. Retukes]

My take is that Fiorina was the only candidate that had the potential of a game changing performance. I don't think Trump or Carson lost any momentum tonight.

In the next week, I see Trump, Carson and Fiorina break out from the pack.

I thought Fiorina gained the most ground. I still feel crazy about this, but IMHO Trump dominated. I thought Carson tumbled out of the race entirely.

Let's examine your statement about Carson.

I disagree for the following reasons. In order for Carson to tumble out of the race you would have to argue that Fiorina stole some of his support. I don't think that is where Fiorina's support is going to come from.

Fiorina's support is going to come from women who are currently backing establishment guys and those male supporters of establishment guys who don't feel comfortable backing Trump or Carson, who they feel are more crazy/nut jobs/out of their depth types.

This is going to effectively become a five horse race in short order. You will have Trump and Carson as the anti-establishment guys. Fiorina, although anti-establishment, doesn't draw the passionate anti-establishment voters. She draws some but her strength will be as the anti-establishment candidate that those voters supporting establishment candidates feel comfortable migrating too because they think Carson and Trump just aren't qualified.

Then there will be a race to see what two guys will be the establishment backers or the last two period.

I don't see Jeb Bush pulling out of this death spiral but he has so much money that he can't be counted out of the top 5.

And I am really surprised to see Rubio and Cruz being so marginalized in the grand scheme of things. I thought they would be performing better than they are.

By this time next week, I see:

Trump

Carson

Fiorina

Bush

Cruz/Rubio

Then I think we are going to see Fiorina really accelerate and possibly surpass Carson in a couple of weeks. Her rise is going to crush the candidacies of most of the others.

The big question I have is what will become of the Jeb Bush cadre of voters. I think Kasich could be that guy, but not sure.

So, NBC has a poll out today with the following results:

TRUMP 29%

Carson 14%

Fiorina 11%

Bush 8%

Cruz 7%

Rubio 7%

Which is exactly what I said...

That's an online survey, not quite as weighty as a real poll.

 

[culdeus]

who is koch backing at this point

 

[BustedKnuckles]

My take is that Fiorina was the only candidate that had the potential of a game changing performance. I don't think Trump or Carson lost any momentum tonight.

In the next week, I see Trump, Carson and Fiorina break out from the pack.

I thought Fiorina gained the most ground. I still feel crazy about this, but IMHO Trump dominated. I thought Carson tumbled out of the race entirely.

Let's examine your statement about Carson.

I disagree for the following reasons. In order for Carson to tumble out of the race you would have to argue that Fiorina stole some of his support. I don't think that is where Fiorina's support is going to come from.

Fiorina's support is going to come from women who are currently backing establishment guys and those male supporters of establishment guys who don't feel comfortable backing Trump or Carson, who they feel are more crazy/nut jobs/out of their depth types.

This is going to effectively become a five horse race in short order. You will have Trump and Carson as the anti-establishment guys. Fiorina, although anti-establishment, doesn't draw the passionate anti-establishment voters. She draws some but her strength will be as the anti-establishment candidate that those voters supporting establishment candidates feel comfortable migrating too because they think Carson and Trump just aren't qualified.

Then there will be a race to see what two guys will be the establishment backers or the last two period.

I don't see Jeb Bush pulling out of this death spiral but he has so much money that he can't be counted out of the top 5.

And I am really surprised to see Rubio and Cruz being so marginalized in the grand scheme of things. I thought they would be performing better than they are.

By this time next week, I see:

Trump

Carson

Fiorina

Bush

Cruz/Rubio

Then I think we are going to see Fiorina really accelerate and possibly surpass Carson in a couple of weeks. Her rise is going to crush the candidacies of most of the others.

The big question I have is what will become of the Jeb Bush cadre of voters. I think Kasich could be that guy, but not sure.

So, NBC has a poll out today with the following results:

TRUMP 29%

Carson 14%

Fiorina 11%

Bush 8%

Cruz 7%

Rubio 7%

Which is exactly what I said...

That's an online survey, not quite as weighty as a real poll.

living in denial is no way to live boy

 

[timschochet]

I think Walker's done.

 

[QuizGuy66]

I think Walker's done.

Walker will basically camp in Iowa for 3 months.

Christie will do the same in New Hampshire.

Doubtful it will matter, but it's what each is down to doing at this point.

-QG

 

[QuizGuy66]

Article on the impending delegate schlog.

This is a tendency of both parties, to fix 'problems' in the last cycle and realizing a whole new bunch of problems in the next one.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/20/us/new-party-rules-fail-to-speed-up-republican-race.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&module=first-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0

-QG

 

[ffldrew]

who is koch backing at this point

Fiorina seems to have few principles and is easily manipulated

 

[B-Deep]

Ben Carson says no muslim should ever be president.

Generalizations don't do any good and he should know better.

That said Carson is spot on that Islam is not consistent with the tenets of our Constitution.

neither is christianity

 

[B-Deep]

Yahweh was never too big on that whole freedom of religion thing. Makes Him angry as I recall, so I think the 1st Amendment would have to go.

As for the 14th Amendment, well let's just say that In the Bible, some people are more equal than others...

Talk about modern practice, not ancient writings.

Islam does not allow for the free exercise of religion. It also treats women a nowhere near the equal of a man. Those are both modern tenets, not ancient ones.

There is no flavor of Christianity that accepts anything other than God as absolute ruler, and no other god as legit.

IT is modern Christianity that is applauding Kim Davis putting her interpretation of god's will over the law, it is modern Christianity fighting to impose its view on gays on this country. It is modern Christianity that leads people to protest mosque construction.

It is modern Christianity that controls so much of what happens in this country and yet thinks itself persecuted for not controlling more.

 

[culdeus]

Someone want to explain to me why establishment GOP types don't like Carly?

 

[The Commish]

It is modern Christianity that controls so much of what happens in this country and yet thinks itself persecuted for not controlling more.

Weird....they seem to be "losing" at a lot of stuff. What is it they have control over that you are taking issue with?

 

[lod01]

Someone want to explain to me why establishment GOP types don't like Carly?

She's either a liar or a moron but most likely she is both.

Carly Fiorina has a big problem with the truth. More specifically, she has a problem with embellishing the truth, in a manner very reminiscent of disgraced NBC anchor Brian Williams.

On Friday, conservative radio host Sean Hannity asked Fiorina to explain stories that Hewlett-Packard violated in the Iran embargo, by selling millions of dollars of computers, parts and equipment through a Dubai-based company, while she was CEO.

"The SEC did a thorough investigation and concluded that no one in management, myself included, knew anything about it," Fiorina told Hannity.

She repeated the line, nearly verbatim, to FOX News Sunday host Chris Wallace, this weekend.

"In fact, the SEC investigation proved that neither I nor anyone else in management knew about it," she told Wallace.

So why exactly are you CEO if you are such a clueless bonehead? How the hell did you ever get to the CEO level? What kind of CEO doesn't know that something like this is going on in an organization? The moron kind.

 

[Joe Summer]

Someone want to explain to me why establishment GOP types don't like Carly?

Because she already lost to ultra-liberal Barbara Boxer. She's a poison pill.

 

[Bucky86]

who is koch backing at this point

Fiorina seems to have few principles and is easily manipulated

Perfect for being a CEO

 

[B-Deep]

It is modern Christianity that controls so much of what happens in this country and yet thinks itself persecuted for not controlling more.

Weird....they seem to be "losing" at a lot of stuff. What is it they have control over that you are taking issue with?

Well let's see

I believe they have had 100% of the presidents elected in this country as members of their religion, i am not sure the exact percentage of congrerssmen but it is astronomically high. So there's a start.

what are they "losing"? that right the is an example, the perceived war on Christianity is ridiculous, and a sign that again, Christianity is not compatible with the constitution. Any religion who has a deity whose word and rule is absolute is not compatible with the Constitution, because the Constitution does not and cannot recognize that deity's authority over the USA.

 

[RBM]

Someone want to explain to me why establishment GOP types don't like Carly?

Because she already lost to ultra-liberal Barbara Boxer. She's a poison pill.

California doesn't count.

 

[timschochet]

Someone want to explain to me why establishment GOP types don't like Carly?

Because she already lost to ultra-liberal Barbara Boxer. She's a poison pill.

California doesn't count.

We count way more than New Jersey, mother####er!

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

Kasich not even registering in the cnn polls.

 

[B-Deep]

Kasich not even registering in the cnn polls.

that's too bad

 

[Sand]

Yahweh was never too big on that whole freedom of religion thing. Makes Him angry as I recall, so I think the 1st Amendment would have to go.

As for the 14th Amendment, well let's just say that In the Bible, some people are more equal than others...

Talk about modern practice, not ancient writings.

Islam does not allow for the free exercise of religion. It also treats women a nowhere near the equal of a man. Those are both modern tenets, not ancient ones.

There is no flavor of Christianity that accepts anything other than God as absolute ruler, and no other god as legit.

IT is modern Christianity that is applauding Kim Davis putting her interpretation of god's will over the law, it is modern Christianity fighting to impose its view on gays on this country. It is modern Christianity that leads people to protest mosque construction.

It is modern Christianity that controls so much of what happens in this country and yet thinks itself persecuted for not controlling more.

This is pretty weak, even from you. You're complaining about civil disobedience and peaceful protesting? How dare those uppity Christians exercise their first amendment rights.

You are correct that Christianity does not recognize other religions as legitimate. It also believes that one must have free will and accept the religion on one's own terms and be free to walk away. Sharia Law is completely different and lays out the ability to coerce people into the faith and punishment for apostasy, typically death. Sorry, as much as you try and torture this there is an ocean of difference here and it is plain as day.

Anyway, back to discussion of Carly as an easily manipulated she-devil.

 

[The Commish]

It is modern Christianity that controls so much of what happens in this country and yet thinks itself persecuted for not controlling more.

Weird....they seem to be "losing" at a lot of stuff. What is it they have control over that you are taking issue with?

Well let's see

I believe they have had 100% of the presidents elected in this country as members of their religion, i am not sure the exact percentage of congrerssmen but it is astronomically high. So there's a start.

what are they "losing"? that right the is an example, the perceived war on Christianity is ridiculous, and a sign that again, Christianity is not compatible with the constitution. Any religion who has a deity whose word and rule is absolute is not compatible with the Constitution, because the Constitution does not and cannot recognize that deity's authority over the USA.

Oh, I thought you were talking about issues. If it's "controlling" to simply be in a position without being able to push your agenda around (see any one of the abortion, gay marriage, "creationism" being taught in school, etc etc etc) then you're right. Carry on.

On a side note, I agree with the bold, but it's a complete mischaracterization of mainstream Christianity. I also sorta assumed it was just a bad fishing trip the first time you brought it up. Wasn't so sure now you've said it again, so I thought it was worth a small comment.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

Kasich not even registering in the cnn polls.

that's too bad

I'm not a republican, so I guess I'm not the target audience, but he's their best candidate in my opinion. The party almost isn't even viable with most of the others. I'm the type of person who thinks having a good candidate from both sides is best for the country. We need a Republican Party who has a chance. While I don't think the insane wing people can win, it scares the hell out of me that they could have a 50% chance.

 

[timschochet]

But Sand, not all Muslims believe in Sharia law any more than not all religious Jews believe in rabbinical law. And just as in rabbinical law, there are many aspects of Sharia law: marriage settlements, child custody, etc. Only in radical Islamist societies does Sharia become the evil that you seem to assume that it is everywhere. In western societies, it's essentially harmless, despite a lot of ignorance and prejudice that abounds.

Going back to the main problem with your analysis- you defended Ben Carson's assertion that no Muslim would be fit to be President. That is based on your apparent belief that all Muslims subscribe to the most fundamentalist, most exacting interpretation of Islam. This is a fundamentally false narrative, and it's ESPECIALLY false when it comes to American Muslims, whom we are discussing right now. It's also, unfortunately all too prominent a belief these days, particularly among conservatives such as yourself. You're simply not thinking this through IMO.

 

[Joe Summer]

We've had a Muslim in congress for the past 8 years and apparently the Capitol did not blow up.

 

[RBM]

Someone want to explain to me why establishment GOP types don't like Carly?

Because she already lost to ultra-liberal Barbara Boxer. She's a poison pill.

California doesn't count.

We count way more than New Jersey, mother####er!

Good for you Tim

 

[RBM]

Walker dropping out.

 

[SIDA!]

My take is that Fiorina was the only candidate that had the potential of a game changing performance. I don't think Trump or Carson lost any momentum tonight.

In the next week, I see Trump, Carson and Fiorina break out from the pack.

I thought Fiorina gained the most ground. I still feel crazy about this, but IMHO Trump dominated. I thought Carson tumbled out of the race entirely.

Let's examine your statement about Carson.

I disagree for the following reasons. In order for Carson to tumble out of the race you would have to argue that Fiorina stole some of his support. I don't think that is where Fiorina's support is going to come from.

Fiorina's support is going to come from women who are currently backing establishment guys and those male supporters of establishment guys who don't feel comfortable backing Trump or Carson, who they feel are more crazy/nut jobs/out of their depth types.

This is going to effectively become a five horse race in short order. You will have Trump and Carson as the anti-establishment guys. Fiorina, although anti-establishment, doesn't draw the passionate anti-establishment voters. She draws some but her strength will be as the anti-establishment candidate that those voters supporting establishment candidates feel comfortable migrating too because they think Carson and Trump just aren't qualified.

Then there will be a race to see what two guys will be the establishment backers or the last two period.

I don't see Jeb Bush pulling out of this death spiral but he has so much money that he can't be counted out of the top 5.

And I am really surprised to see Rubio and Cruz being so marginalized in the grand scheme of things. I thought they would be performing better than they are.

By this time next week, I see:

Trump

Carson

Fiorina

Bush

Cruz/Rubio

Then I think we are going to see Fiorina really accelerate and possibly surpass Carson in a couple of weeks. Her rise is going to crush the candidacies of most of the others.

The big question I have is what will become of the Jeb Bush cadre of voters. I think Kasich could be that guy, but not sure.

So, NBC has a poll out today with the following results:

TRUMP 29%

Carson 14%

Fiorina 11%

Bush 8%

Cruz 7%

Rubio 7%

Which is exactly what I said...

That's an online survey, not quite as weighty as a real poll.

Okay.

Give me a couple more days until Thursday.

Zogby is out today with:

Trump 33%

Carson 13%

Bush 9%

Fiorina 7%

Cruz

Rubio

 

[SIDA!]

Someone want to explain to me why establishment GOP types don't like Carly?

She's either a liar or a moron but most likely she is both.

Carly Fiorina has a big problem with the truth. More specifically, she has a problem with embellishing the truth, in a manner very reminiscent of disgraced NBC anchor Brian Williams.

On Friday, conservative radio host Sean Hannity asked Fiorina to explain stories that Hewlett-Packard violated in the Iran embargo, by selling millions of dollars of computers, parts and equipment through a Dubai-based company, while she was CEO.

"The SEC did a thorough investigation and concluded that no one in management, myself included, knew anything about it," Fiorina told Hannity.

She repeated the line, nearly verbatim, to FOX News Sunday host Chris Wallace, this weekend.

"In fact, the SEC investigation proved that neither I nor anyone else in management knew about it," she told Wallace.

So why exactly are you CEO if you are such a clueless bonehead? How the hell did you ever get to the CEO level? What kind of CEO doesn't know that something like this is going on in an organization? The moron kind.

Sorry. She may have lied about something here...but I can't take any article/piece that compares a CEO or political candidate to a "journalist".

 

[timschochet]

Well I certainly hope the CNN poll is more indicative of reality than Zogby. Trump widening his lead after that debate? I don't want to believe it. But if it's true, Republicans are...crazy.