*** OFFICIAL *** COVID-19 CoronaVirus Thread. Fresh epidemic fears as child pneumonia cases surge in Europe after China outbreak. NOW in USA (3 Viewers)

[Scoresman]

This variant get by the rapid tests? 90% sure have it again but rapid is negative. Not nearly as bad as last time.

The at home tests are a bit less sensitive to the new variants but still can detect it. The difference is that it may take 2-3 days before it shows up positive. Keep testing.

If you have spare tests, you can also try a throat and nasal swab. Swab the back of your throat a few times before doing the nasal swab (gross, I know). Just make sure it's been a while since you had anything to eat or drink before you do this.

 

[Scoresman]

So are we in a full blown wave?

We have been since July. People may not be testing anymore to keep accurate case count, but everybody poops, and the wastewater data does not lie.

Anecdotally, I feel like the July wave had or was about to peak, right as kids went back to school. Now that the little germ factories are back to school, I feel like everything is on the way back up.

Having kids in school is way more important than worry about covid-19. It's time to realign priorities back to surface-level reality.

I wasn't suggesting otherwise.

 

[Doug B]

This variant get by the rapid tests? 90% sure have it again but rapid is negative. Not nearly as bad as last time.

Generally and anecdotally: The more recent variants take longer to ping the home antigen tests (the rapid tests). It seems common to test negative for the first few days after symptoms start, and then all of a sudden test positive after you thought you were in the clear.

 

[Doug B]

It's been the same thing every year. We always see a large wave around this time, usually focused in the southeast. I'm not sure if that's really about people moving inside during the hot months or what, but I imagine this just going to be "covid season" for large swaths of the country for the time being.

I do think the COVID vaccinations are going to have to settle in at a different point in the year than the flu vaccinations. COVID vaccinations are going to have to be aimed for, say, June versus September/October.

 

[Doug B]

If you have spare tests, you can also try a throat and nasal swab. Swab the back of your throat a few times before doing the nasal swab (gross, I know).

I wonder of you can just use regular ol' Q-tips to swab your nose, and use the kits' long swabs for your throat? That way, you could test both throat and nose all at once with a single antigen test.

 

[Scoresman]

If you have spare tests, you can also try a throat and nasal swab. Swab the back of your throat a few times before doing the nasal swab (gross, I know).

I wonder of you can just use regular ol' Q-tips to swab your nose, and use the kits' long swabs for your throat? That way, you could test both throat and nose all at once with a single antigen test.

Don't most tests have you insert the swab into the test somehow? How would you do it with two swabs? Q tips are also thicker than the test swabs. I might be worried that could affect the test results somehow.

I believe the direction UK has given is swab the throat first, then stick it in your nose. And when you think of the stereotype of Brits and oral hygene,

 

[Doug B]

Don't most tests have you insert the swab into the test somehow? How would you do it with two swabs?

Sequentially. Dip one swab into the solution, stir and squeeze per instructions. Then do the same thing with the second swab.

 

[Scoresman]

Don't most tests have you insert the swab into the test somehow? How would you do it with two swabs?

Sequentially. Dip one swab into the solution, stir and squeeze per instructions. Then do the same thing with the second swab.

Ah ok. The Binax tests dont work that way. You squeeze the solution into the test tray firstvand then insert a swab and leave it in for the 15 minutes.

The Binax tests are best for throat swabs because they come with really long swabs.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

I won't be throat swabbing. I would rather have an undiagnosed case for however long it takes for a nasal swab to come up positive.

 

[Scoresman]

I won't be throat swabbing. I would rather have an undiagnosed case for however long it takes for a nasal swab to come up positive.

Yeah, this is the other thing. For most people, it's almost become a who cares situation, understandably so. For me, my wife is immunocompromised, so we need to know ASAP to get her paxlovid if needed.

 

[Doug B]

Ah ok. The Binax tests dont work that way. You squeeze the solution into the test tray first and then insert a swab and leave it in for the 15 minutes.

Shoot - you're right about the Binax tests. Been using the FlowFlex and another one that works similarly.

 

[Doug B]

Another variant of interest has entered the chat. BA.2.86

CDC tracking new COVID variant BA.2.86 after highly mutated strain reported in Michigan

Cases of the new COVID variant BA.2.86 have been spotted in Michigan, Denmark and Israel.

www.cbsnews.com

Just from what I gleaned combing through some evo bio Twitter threads on it, there are several different mutations that make it stand out, but nothing in early reporting saying it will be definitively worse, but not 'better' either. But it's also too early to tell a whole lot.

Dr. Jetelina has shared updated research on BA.2.86.

BA.2.86 update

Since the last BA.2.86 update, lab and epidemiological data have trickled in. Many of us took a big sigh of relief after seeing specific results over the weekend. Here is your update. Lab data Three labs have already tested BA.2.86 in a petri dish. (The speed of scientific discovery for...

yourlocalepidemiologist.substack.com

She seems pretty encouraged three weeks in. Takeaways:

Escapes immunity. As suspected, BA.2.86 can escape our neutralizing antibodies— our immune system’s first line of defense. We thought BA.2.86 would escape our antibodies ~10 times more than XBB (the most recent Omicron subvariant to sweep the U.S.), but it’s only escaping 2-3 fold. In other words, we can expect BA.2.86 to cause infections, but not as much as anticipated.​

​

Infectivity. BA.2.86 has a more challenging time infecting our cells than XBB. The more difficult time it has getting into our cells, the better. (When a virus evolves, there are typically tradeoffs—it gets better at one thing but at the expense of another. It seems that BA.2.86 traded infectivity for antibody escape.)​

​

... initial estimates suggest that BA.2.86 isn’t spreading as fast as the original Omicron (which had a weekly growth rate of 400%) but faster than XBB. In other words, we won’t have a tsunami, but a BA.2.86 wave is possible.​

Maybe it's not right to measure everything against Omicron ... but it took Omicron less than a month to take over. Probably less than two weeks to demonstrate that it would, indeed, take over and skyrocket. At present, we can say that BA.2.86 isn't working anywhere near as quickly.

 

[Scoresman]

Another variant of interest has entered the chat. BA.2.86

CDC tracking new COVID variant BA.2.86 after highly mutated strain reported in Michigan

Cases of the new COVID variant BA.2.86 have been spotted in Michigan, Denmark and Israel.

www.cbsnews.com

Just from what I gleaned combing through some evo bio Twitter threads on it, there are several different mutations that make it stand out, but nothing in early reporting saying it will be definitively worse, but not 'better' either. But it's also too early to tell a whole lot.

Dr. Jetelina has shared updated research on BA.2.86.

BA.2.86 update

Since the last BA.2.86 update, lab and epidemiological data have trickled in. Many of us took a big sigh of relief after seeing specific results over the weekend. Here is your update. Lab data Three labs have already tested BA.2.86 in a petri dish. (The speed of scientific discovery for...

yourlocalepidemiologist.substack.com

She seems pretty encouraged three weeks in. Takeaways:

Escapes immunity. As suspected, BA.2.86 can escape our neutralizing antibodies— our immune system’s first line of defense. We thought BA.2.86 would escape our antibodies ~10 times more than XBB (the most recent Omicron subvariant to sweep the U.S.), but it’s only escaping 2-3 fold. In other words, we can expect BA.2.86 to cause infections, but not as much as anticipated.​

​

Infectivity. BA.2.86 has a more challenging time infecting our cells than XBB. The more difficult time it has getting into our cells, the better. (When a virus evolves, there are typically tradeoffs—it gets better at one thing but at the expense of another. It seems that BA.2.86 traded infectivity for antibody escape.)​

​

... initial estimates suggest that BA.2.86 isn’t spreading as fast as the original Omicron (which had a weekly growth rate of 400%) but faster than XBB. In other words, we won’t have a tsunami, but a BA.2.86 wave is possible.​

Maybe it's not right to measure everything against Omicron ... but it took Omicron less than a month to take over. Probably less than two weeks to demonstrate that it would, indeed, take over and skyrocket. At present, we can say that BA.2.86 isn't working anywhere near as quickly.

This is what I was thinking was going to be the case. The poop metrics are kind of suggesting the same thing. The curves were starting to steady before back to school. It's rising again, but at the same rate as before.

 

[Yankee23Fan]

This effing virus. Just tested positive with a home test. Feel like I got hit by 4 buses.

 

[Senor Schmutzig]

After spending the weekend in Orlando (not the parks) to see our son, who just started college (warning, warning!), my wife mentioned she had a bit of a sore/scratchy throat yesterday. I think my wife probably wins the award for most negative COVID tests in South Florida because she takes one every time she feels any sort of potential symptom.

She took a Binax test (positive) and then took another type of test that we had on hand, I couldn't remember the name, and it came out negative. Had to go to the store to get some more. I ended up purchasing 6 Flow Flex. Tested her again with that and it came up very lightly positive. The line was faint, but it was there.

So she is quarantining, most likely until she gets sick of being sequestered...maybe today or tomorrow. LOL. My wife tends to get very dramatic when she has the slightest fever so of course last night she told me she thought she was going to die until she backtracked a bit and said she didn't feel THAT bad. Her temperature was about 100 and she said her skin feels "weird". Not scratchy or anything, just weird.

I don't have any symptoms yet so I am enjoying some quiet time alone.

 

[ProstheticRGK]

Anecdotal observations from Northern CA. We have seen a significant uptick in cases for the past 3 weeks. Nothing close in severity to Alpha or Delta variants. In fact, out of roughly 15 cases admitted, all but one were incidental findings, with no patients progressing to full-blown ARDS.

The one case I would call a legit COVID hopitalization was a 77-year-old COPD patient with an exacerbation of his disease and an overlaid bacterial pneumonia, which may have been hospital acquired. Even he rallied and recovered after about 8 days.

Question on treatment: is remdesevir still considered effective in treating COVID? We are still using a combo of remdesevir and dexamethasone as primary treatment. Have not seen anyone get any of the monoclonals.

 

[Nathan R. Jessep]

Question on treatment: is remdesevir still considered effective in treating COVID? We are still using a combo of remdesevir and dexamethasone as primary treatment. Have not seen anyone get any of the monoclonals.

I think all the monoclonals have been de-authorized because they became less and less effective as variants emerged. Just going from memory but I think remdesevir (and dex, as you mentioned), molnupiravir and Paxlovid are pretty much the only treatments in use any more.

Oh and ivermectin.

 

[ProstheticRGK]

Question on treatment: is remdesevir still considered effective in treating COVID? We are still using a combo of remdesevir and dexamethasone as primary treatment. Have not seen anyone get any of the monoclonals.

I think all the monoclonals have been de-authorized because they became less and less effective as variants emerged. Just going from memory but I think remdesevir (and dex, as you mentioned), molnupiravir and Paxlovid are pretty much the only treatments in use any more.

Oh and ivermectin.

or drinking bleach and swallowing a UV light.

 

[Yankee23Fan]

I'm getting paxlovid for my current bout.

 

[nirad3]

I continue to count my lucky stars that I've only had it once (as far as I know), and the worst part about having it was it made me miss my birthday celebration last year. I just slept the entire day and drank a crapload of Gatorade and felt perfectly fine the next day.

Hope all of you that are catching it recently feel OK soon!

 

[Yambag]

Round 2 for me, ironically I got it the exact same date last year. Scratchy throat and mild fatigue from last Friday to Tuesday. Congestion hit Wednesday, tested negative. Not much improvement today, tested positive. Never enough to put me down for the count, more like 7 days of a mild head cold and not a ton of energy, but could function. Hopefully better in a day or two.

 

[Terminalxylem]

Question on treatment: is remdesevir still considered effective in treating COVID? We are still using a combo of remdesevir and dexamethasone as primary treatment. Have not seen anyone get any of the monoclonals.

I think all the monoclonals have been de-authorized because they became less and less effective as variants emerged. Just going from memory but I think remdesevir (and dex, as you mentioned), molnupiravir and Paxlovid are pretty much the only treatments in use any more.

Oh and ivermectin.

More or less. Really sick patients qualify for a couple immunomodulators, one of which is a monoclonal antibody (tocilizumab).

 

[Nathan R. Jessep]

The BA.2.86 variant and the new booster

Facts, data, and analytics about biomedical matters.

erictopol.substack.com

 

[Nathan R. Jessep]

COVID-19 may trigger new-onset high blood pressure

Research Highlights: An analysis of more than 45,000 people infected with SARS-CoV-2 found a significant association between the virus and the development of persistent high blood pressure among those with no prior history of high blood pressure. In...

newsroom.heart.org

tl;dr:

Health data were analyzed from electronic medical records at the Montefiore Health System in Bronx, New York, which serves a large, racially and ethnically diverse population. The study included 45,398 people with COVID-19 — hospitalized between March 1, 2020 and February 20, 2022 — and 13,864 people with influenza without COVID-19 — hospitalized between January 2018 and February 20, 2022 — who returned to the hospital system for any medical reasons within an average follow-up period of six months.​

​

The analysis found:​

​

• 21% of people hospitalized with COVID-19 and 11% of those who were not hospitalized for COVID-19 developed high blood pressure, compared to 16% of people hospitalized with influenza and 4% of those not hospitalized for influenza.
• People hospitalized for COVID-19 were more than twice as likely and those not hospitalized are 1.5 times more likely to develop persistent hypertension compared to people hospitalized and non-hospitalized with influenza, respectively.
• People infected with SARS-CoV-2 who were over 40 years old, men, Black adults or those with preexisting conditions, such as chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, coronary artery disease or chronic kidney disease, had an elevated risk of developing high blood pressure.
• Persistent high blood pressure was more common among people infected with SARS-CoV-2 who were treated with vasopressor and corticosteroid medications during the pandemic.

 

[Doug B]

The study included 45,398 people with COVID-19 — hospitalized between March 1, 2020 and February 20, 2022

I admit to grasping at straws a bit here ... but I am curious as to whether these cardiovascular effects will continue to show in the data when the time frame means that the strains were pretty exclusively Omicron and its downstream variants (February 2020 - present).

No doubting at all that the original strains -- while perhaps replicating slower -- were hell on blood vessels.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

Contagion was on last night. Has been a while since I saw it, but damn is the beginning of that movie eerily similar to early-2020. Gave me the creeps (is that a long covid symptom?).

 

[Nathan R. Jessep]

FDA approves updated Covid-19 vaccines

The FDA announced Monday that it had greenlit two updated Covid-19 booster shots in people as young as six months old.

www.statnews.com

Moderna and Pfizer updated booster get approval, and pending CDC ACIP meeting tomorrow, can be available by the end of the week

 

[Nathan R. Jessep]

Your ACIP cliff notes

Who is eligible for a Covid-19 vaccine this fall?

yourlocalepidemiologist.substack.com

YLE Clif's notes from the ACIP committee meeting today.

Re: Covid vaccine update -> Recommended for everyone 6mo and up. Awaiting CDC director sign-off and could be available by tonight.

 

[Doug B]

Covid vaccine update -> Recommended for everyone 6yo and up.

Even more than that: six months old and up.

 

[Max Power]

Is there any other country recommending boosters for healthy 6 month olds still?

 

[Mitchie]

Is there any other country recommending boosters for healthy 6 month olds still?

Good question, actually was surprised to find out the answer is no

COVID boosters are back: what scientists say about whether to get one

Many countries heading into autumn are targeting high-risk people for vaccinations, leaving lower-risk people uncertain about the right choice.

www.nature.com

 

[IvanKaramazov]

Is there any other country recommending boosters for healthy 6 month olds still?

Good question, actually was surprised to find out the answer is no

COVID boosters are back: what scientists say about whether to get one

Many countries heading into autumn are targeting high-risk people for vaccinations, leaving lower-risk people uncertain about the right choice.

www.nature.com

Science is uniquely politicized in the US. It isn't like that in other countries, at least not yet -- it only seems that way because the US scientific community is the largest and most visible part of "science."

It probably doesn't matter very much either way whether you give your 6 month-old a covid vaccine. They're at no real risk from covid, but their odds of suffering an adverse side effect from the vaccine are also very low. We're trading off epsilon-level risks here and it's not worth getting worked up over it either way. But even those of us who are pro-vaccine realize the US is an outlier on this one, and we all know why.

 

[belljr]

So this may be a dumb question - will the booster - give you the same side effects as previously? I don't mean the rare heart conditions etc etc. I guess "potency" --

All 3 of my shots - I have been miserable for 36-72 hours. I am strongly considering skipping it if I need to deal with that again. I'm not "worried" about covid as I once was.

 

[The Commish]

So this may be a dumb question - will the booster - give you the same side effects as previously? I don't mean the rare heart conditions etc etc. I guess "potency" --

All 3 of my shots - I have been miserable for 36-72 hours. I am strongly considering skipping it if I need to deal with that again. I'm not "worried" about covid as I once was.

Will vary from person to person unfortunately. FWIW, I only have the three original shots....2 plus first booster.

 

[belljr]

So this may be a dumb question - will the booster - give you the same side effects as previously? I don't mean the rare heart conditions etc etc. I guess "potency" --

All 3 of my shots - I have been miserable for 36-72 hours. I am strongly considering skipping it if I need to deal with that again. I'm not "worried" about covid as I once was.

Will vary from person to person unfortunately. FWIW, I only have the three original shots....2 plus first booster.

Same - moderna

 

[beer 30]

I got Covid last week and the rapid tests tested positive

Wife had a low grade fever all last week, came and went. Monday we got a rapid test from Amazon and it was positive so I've been working at home at all week. She feels fine other than the fever coming and going.

 

[jvdesigns2002]

I got Covid last week and the rapid tests tested positive

Wife had a low grade fever all last week, came and went. Monday we got a rapid test from Amazon and it was positive so I've been working at home at all week. She feels fine other than the fever coming and going.

Glad she seems okay. My experience was a little worse, but not terrible. Covid kinda kicked my butt for like 2-3 days (really bad headache, body aches-especially in my legs, fatigue, and an intermittent fever). I did pretty much completely lose my sense of smell and it’s still not close to being back. My biggest concern was spreading it to my elderly mother that lives with me—and luckily it seems like we were able to successfully do that. I closed off the hallway doors in a wing of the home and put air purifiers near the closed off areas to help prevent germs from penetrating into the rest of the home. Once my symptoms were gone, I did a massive cleaning and sterilization of the wing of the house that I isolated in. Luckily it seems like the strain that is going around now isn’t nearly as bad as the first strain or delta.

 

[beer 30]

Glad she seems okay. My experience was a little worse, but not terrible. Covid kinda kicked my butt for like 2-3 days (really bad headache, body aches-especially in my legs, fatigue, and an intermittent fever). I did pretty much completely lose my sense of smell and it’s still not close to being back. My biggest concern was spreading it to my elderly mother that lives with me—and luckily it seems like we were able to successfully do that. I closed off the hallway doors in a wing of the home and put air purifiers near the closed off areas to help prevent germs from penetrating into the rest of the home. Once my symptoms were gone, I did a massive cleaning and sterilization of the wing of the house that I isolated in. Luckily it seems like the strain that is going around now isn’t nearly as bad as the first strain or delta.

You went a lot further than I did and rightfully so. It's just me & her and I've been living life as normal with her so didn't see any reason to change after she was positive a week after starting to experience symptoms.

Funny you mention smell, she's had it 3 times since all this started and lost her sense of smell in 2020, hasn't really ever came back. She can smell things sometimes but for the most part, nothing.

 

[Doug B]

Science is uniquely politicized in the US. It isn't like that in other countries, at least not yet -- it only seems that way because the US scientific community is the largest and most visible part of "science."

It probably doesn't matter very much either way whether you give your 6 month-old a covid vaccine. They're at no real risk from covid, but their odds of suffering an adverse side effect from the vaccine are also very low. We're trading off epsilon-level risks here and it's not worth getting worked up over it either way.

FWIW, data regarding COVID in infants and children was presented and considered at the ACIP meeting. While you didn't say otherwise, your post implied that recommendations were based primarily on politics and only secondarily on anything else. The YLE piece Nathan linked yesterday summarizes the data (with three visuals that I can't post here) as follows:

Severe disease for kiddos is similar to flu.​

​

One of the biggest questions was whether vaccine benefits continue to outweigh the risks for kids. Updated stats were presented:​

• More than half of children hospitalized for Covid-19 do not have a co-morbidity. (her emphasis - db)
• Behind adults 75+ years, infants (<6 months) had the highest rate of Covid-19 hospitalization. The burden of severe illness is lowest among children ages 5–17 years compared to other age groups.
• For kids, hospitalization rates were lower or comparable to flu. Once hospitalized, though, more kids went to the ICU for Covid-19 than for flu.
• Covid-19 hospitalization rate is higher than other vaccine-preventable diseases.

 

[The Commish]

With respect to young kids.....logic suggests whatever you do with your kids with respect to flu, you'd do with covid. What's required in other countries seems pretty irrelevant to the decisions YOU make for YOUR kids. Our attitude towards flu shots is different than a bunch of other countries too. That's not been a consideration for flu (at least that I've heard) so it really makes no sense to me why it'd be a consideration with covid.

 

[jobarules]

Is there any other country recommending boosters for healthy 6 month olds still?

Pure insanity

 

[jobarules]

With respect to young kids.....logic suggests whatever you do with your kids with respect to flu, you'd do with covid. What's required in other countries seems pretty irrelevant to the decisions YOU make for YOUR kids. Our attitude towards flu shots is different than a bunch of other countries too. That's not been a consideration for flu (at least that I've heard) so it really makes no sense to me why it'd be a consideration with covid.

Except the flu has been proved to be more dangerous to young children than COVID. So is RSV

 

[Scoresman]

Just made my updated booster appointment. The Walgreens/CVSs of the world are now accepting appointments.

Great timing at two weeks before a Hawaii trip we have planned.

 

[Mr.Pack]

Round 2 here. Tested positive the Sunday of Labor Day weekend, finally tested negative this Monday. It kicked my *** for nearly ten days. Still not feeling good, Still weak and just feel like crap. About the same as the first go-round two years ago.

 

[Judge Smails]

Just made my updated booster appointment. The Walgreens/CVSs of the world are now accepting appointments.

Great timing at two weeks before a Hawaii trip we have planned.

Same - I'm headed to Ireland a week from Friday so getting both Flu and Covid-19 shot. Last thing I want to do is get sick/quarantined there - especially since I'm going with 15 people. Don't want to be that guy or have the trip ruined.

 

[Scoresman]

Just made my updated booster appointment. The Walgreens/CVSs of the world are now accepting appointments.

Great timing at two weeks before a Hawaii trip we have planned.

Same - I'm headed to Ireland a week from Friday so getting both Flu and Covid-19 shot. Last thing I want to do is get sick/quarantined there - especially since I'm going with 15 people. Don't want to be that guy or have the trip ruined.

I've had three group trips cancelled/ruined because of COVID, and I've never even had it. So annoying. Twice it was because family/friends we were supposed to travel with got it, and once because Hawaii told people not to travel there during Delta.

For our upcoming trip I told my wife we're going even if other members in the party get it and don't go. They can just stay behind. I'm not cancelling another trip just because people dont stay up to date on their boosters or arent a little more careful leading up to a big trip.

 

[The Commish]

With respect to young kids.....logic suggests whatever you do with your kids with respect to flu, you'd do with covid. What's required in other countries seems pretty irrelevant to the decisions YOU make for YOUR kids. Our attitude towards flu shots is different than a bunch of other countries too. That's not been a consideration for flu (at least that I've heard) so it really makes no sense to me why it'd be a consideration with covid.

Except the flu has been proved to be more dangerous to young children than COVID. So is RSV

I'd like a link please. Everything I've read suggests they are very similar. Covid and Flu....can't speak to RSV.

 

[Doug B]

With respect to young kids.....logic suggests whatever you do with your kids with respect to flu, you'd do with covid. What's required in other countries seems pretty irrelevant to the decisions YOU make for YOUR kids. Our attitude towards flu shots is different than a bunch of other countries too. That's not been a consideration for flu (at least that I've heard) so it really makes no sense to me why it'd be a consideration with covid.

Except the flu has been proved to be more dangerous to young children than COVID. So is RSV

I'd like a link please. Everything I've read suggests they are very similar. Covid and Flu....can't speak to RSV.

YLE addresses this exact thing in her latest column, as it was addressed at the ACIP meeting that approved the latest boosters.

 

[The Commish]

With respect to young kids.....logic suggests whatever you do with your kids with respect to flu, you'd do with covid. What's required in other countries seems pretty irrelevant to the decisions YOU make for YOUR kids. Our attitude towards flu shots is different than a bunch of other countries too. That's not been a consideration for flu (at least that I've heard) so it really makes no sense to me why it'd be a consideration with covid.

Except the flu has been proved to be more dangerous to young children than COVID. So is RSV

I'd like a link please. Everything I've read suggests they are very similar. Covid and Flu....can't speak to RSV.

YLE addresses this exact thing in her latest column, as it was addressed at the ACIP meeting that approved the latest boosters.

Right....I'm looking for articles/evidence/studies saying what jobarules is saying though. YLE agrees with us.

 

[CGRdrJoe]

I've been laid out since Sunday, this is the worst I've been sick in a very long time. I can't stay awake for **** and get winded just getting up to go to the bathroom I'm going to Vegas next Saturday for 4 days so I'm hoping this runs its course over the next 7 days and I'm able to enjoy it.