Official Hillary Clinton 2016 thread (4 Viewers)

[ShamrockPride]

And again, here is where the sexism plays a part. If Hillary was a man, she would have likely told the media on Friday that she had pneumonia and was taking some days off to recuperate. That would have been a big story, and there would have been some rumors until Hillary was seen again healthy- but nothing like the feeding frenzy going on here.

But because Hillary is a woman, she likely didn't want to reveal that she had pneumonia, because she has to appear energetic at all times to make up for the fact that she is not a man, and therefore in the eyes of the public, weaker.

This is literally 100% speculation Tim. These are your opinions of how you think the general public views gender roles.

 

[Phil Elliott]

And again, here is where the sexism plays a part. If Hillary was a man, she would have likely told the media on Friday that she had pneumonia and was taking some days off to recuperate. That would have been a big story, and there would have been some rumors until Hillary was seen again healthy- but nothing like the feeding frenzy going on here.

But because Hillary is a woman, she likely didn't want to reveal that she had pneumonia, because she has to appear energetic at all times to make up for the fact that she is not a man, and therefore in the eyes of the public, weaker.

I think she gets more sympathy than Trump.

 

[timschochet]

Trump is pounding Hillary right now in Baltimore for calling half the voters deplorable on Friday.  This truly was her 47% moment.  Very damaging.

This is, IMO, a much more damaging story than the pneumonia. The pneumonia will, I believe, be rather easily countered by Hillary's upcoming appearance on the debate stage. This remark by Hillary, self-inflicted, is not so easily removed.

And I reject the Machiavellian comments that this was deliberate and will actually help her. I don't believe it. It was stupid and it will hurt her- how much remains to be seen.

 

[Baloney Sandwich]

And again, here is where the sexism plays a part. If Hillary was a man, she would have likely told the media on Friday that she had pneumonia and was taking some days off to recuperate. That would have been a big story, and there would have been some rumors until Hillary was seen again healthy- but nothing like the feeding frenzy going on here.

But because Hillary is a woman, she likely didn't want to reveal that she had pneumonia, because she has to appear energetic at all times to make up for the fact that she is not a man, and therefore in the eyes of the public, weaker.

So Hillary was sexist?

 

[HellToupee]

And again, here is where the sexism plays a part. If Hillary was a man, she would have likely told the media on Friday that she had pneumonia and was taking some days off to recuperate

All part & parcel of a dishonest candidate. Is she dishonest because she is a woman? Of course not , she's just dishonest.

 

[TobiasFunke]

Trump is pounding Hillary right now in Baltimore for calling half the voters deplorable on Friday.  This truly was her 47% moment.  Very damaging.

The problem with the 47% comment was that it was dismissive of people who take government assistance.  The "deplorable" comment was dismissive of racists, homophobes, xenophobes and Islamophobes. They're not remotely the same thing. 

Many undecided voters take government assistance and/or want a president who grasps that those people have legitimate concerns. That was the problem with the 47% comment. Very few undecided voters are self-proclaimed racists, homophobes, xenophobes or Islamophobes or want a president who grasps that those people have legitimate concerns.

 

[The Commish]

I've noticed, Politician Spock, that whenever you make any analysis of either Hillary Clinton or the people around her, your conclusion is always one that puts them in the worst possible light. You're not the only one that does this, of course, but it's always startling to read coming from you because, despite my various disagreements with you on a host of issues, I know that that you are both non-partisan (in terms of liberal vs. conservative) , and very intelligent.

Are the two options you provided (either devious lying or morons) possible? Of course. Does either one ring truthful? Not to me. What does ring truthful is close to what Axelrod was talking about- Hillary's excessive need for privacy, her (not unreasonable, but in this instance regrettable) fear that if her pneumonia was known, it would hurt her campaign. So what likely happened is that she was told on Friday that her cold was actually a bout of pneumonia, and she decided to "soldier on", hoping that it wouldn't get out to the public because of Trump's continual comments about her "stamina". That also means its very likely that few people in the Clinton campaign knew about the pneumonia, which accounts for the confusion immediately after the fainting spell. For me at least, the whole thing starts to make sense in a way which excludes both of your alternatives.

There's a scene in the last season of The West Wing in which Senator Vinick (Alan Alda) breaks his hand, and is desperate to cover it up, because he does not want any contrast with his more energetic opponent. Earlier he has a cold and tries to cover that up as well, despite a doctor telling him he needs to take it easy or it could become pneumonia. I think we're witnessing some of that playing out in real life before our eyes.

while being a public servant.....that's not how it works unfortunately.  why isn't this a red flag again?

 

[timschochet]

The biggest reason Hillary's comment is so damaging is because it unites conservatives and right-wing leaning independents in a way that nothing else does- if there is one thing that they despise more than other IMO, it's the left's patronizing of them as bigots and racists and idiots. The fact that Donald Trump actually is promoting both racism and bigotry makes no difference to this resentment, because it's been going on for 50 years or more.

As I wrote earlier, I don't believe the pneumonia story is going to cause anyone to change their vote (unless she truly is hiding something.) But her "deplorables" comment may.

 

[timschochet]

while being a public servant.....that's not how it works unfortunately.  why isn't this a red flag?

It is. It's definitely a flaw.

I don't regard it as a disqualifying flaw.

 

[The Commish]

And again, here is where the sexism plays a part. If Hillary was a man, she would have likely told the media on Friday that she had pneumonia and was taking some days off to recuperate. That would have been a big story, and there would have been some rumors until Hillary was seen again healthy- but nothing like the feeding frenzy going on here.

But because Hillary is a woman, she likely didn't want to reveal that she had pneumonia, because she has to appear energetic at all times to make up for the fact that she is not a man, and therefore in the eyes of the public, weaker.

OR....it's treated the way the  treated McCain....incidentally, why do we care what the  are saying again?  The  will always be around if we pay attention to them.

 

[timschochet]

So Hillary was sexist?

Actually, in a way, yeah.

I don't think she's immune to the perception that women are the "weaker" sex. Her whole life can be seen as a struggle to prove that in her case it's not true. That's probably true of many feminists who grew up when she did.

 

[Sinn Fein]

Trump firing back quickly on the "deplorable" comment - releasing a new ad in 4 swing states

 

[TobiasFunke]

The biggest reason Hillary's comment is so damaging is because it unites conservatives and right-wing leaning independents in a way that nothing else does- if there is one thing that they despise more than other IMO, it's the left's patronizing of them as bigots and racists and idiots. The fact that Donald Trump actually is promoting both racism and bigotry makes no difference to this resentment, because it's been going on for 50 years or more.

As I wrote earlier, I don't believe the pneumonia story is going to cause anyone to change their vote (unless she truly is hiding something.) But her "deplorables" comment may.

Except she didn't call conservatives and right-wing leaning independents anything.  She called half of Trump supporters something.

Stuff like the 47% comment and the "clinging to guns and religion" comment are damaging because (1) there are undecided voters who might hear the comment and think the candidate is referring to them; (2) there are people who might not fall into that category but are sympathetic to those who do; and (3) they confirm a negative perception of the candidate (Romney as a rich guy who doesn't care about little people, Obama as an academic elitist). 

None of this stuff is true about Clinton's comment.  She's talking about Trump supporters and/or people who are racists, Islamophobes, etc.  Nobody who describes themselves that way or is sympathetic to those who do is voting for Clinton in two months.

ETA:  Or to put it another way:

 


 

Nick Spencer ‏@nickspencer Sep 10
Only in America do we see the rise of white nationalism and agonize over whether or not we're being too rude to it.

 

[timschochet]

Except she didn't call conservatives and right-wing leaning independents anything.  She called half of Trump supporters something.

Stuff like the 47% comment and the "clinging to guns and religion" comment are damaging because (1) there are undecided voters who might hear the comment and think the candidate is referring to them; (2) there are people who might not fall into that category but are sympathetic to those who do; and (3) they confirm a negative perception of the candidate (Romney as a rich guy who doesn't care about little people, Obama as an academic elitist). 

None of this stuff is true about Clinton's comment.  She's talking about Trump supporters and/or people who are racists, Islamophobes, etc.  Nobody who describes themselves that way or is sympathetic to those who do is voting for Clinton in two months.

Since Donald Trump is the Republican candidate I don't think most people are going to make this distinction. 

 

[cobalt_27]

Hillary would rather die than withdraw

She ultimately may have no choice.  She's sick, everyone knows she's sick, her lack of transparency and lies only fuels the conspiracy theories (which, at this point, can you really fully disregard now?), she has to keep campaigning while being sick and confronting questions about her honest around the "pneumonia" and everything else, she's had gait and stability problems, in addition to the coughing episodes repeatedly for months now so every sniffle will be scrutinized, her poll numbers have been plummeting and none of this will decelerate that process.  All indications are she is going to lose this thing now and don't think the Dems in power know this.  An alternative has to be made immediately, because with each day that passes and she doesn't drop out, the chances increase exponentially that Donald ####### Trump will be our next president.

 

[TobiasFunke]

Since Donald Trump is the Republican candidate I don't think most people are going to make this distinction. 

Let me put it this way:  I can easily describe the thought process of an undecided voter who might be swayed by the 47% comment, or the "clinging to guns and religion" comment.  I assume you could as well. They think the candidate might be talking about them, or about people that they think a presidential candidate should care about and not dismiss.  Easy.

How would you describe the thought process of an undecided voter who is swayed by the "deplorables" comment? Republicans and right-leaning conservatives who so far have rejected Trump have generally done so in large part because they agree with what Clinton said.  Maybe not the "half" figure, but the idea that those people are awful and should be rejected and marginalized and that Trump has been successful in large part because he caters to them. They're not going to feel insulted or dismissed by the quote. And no undecided voter is going to think "how dare she dismiss me and/or my racist friends!"

 

[The Commish]

Except she didn't call conservatives and right-wing leaning independents anything.  She called half of Trump supporters something.

Stuff like the 47% comment and the "clinging to guns and religion" comment are damaging because (1) there are undecided voters who might hear the comment and think the candidate is referring to them; (2) there are people who might not fall into that category but are sympathetic to those who do; and (3) they confirm a negative perception of the candidate (Romney as a rich guy who doesn't care about little people, Obama as an academic elitist). 

None of this stuff is true about Clinton's comment.  She's talking about Trump supporters and/or people who are racists, Islamophobes, etc.  Nobody who describes themselves that way or is sympathetic to those who do is voting for Clinton in two months.

Since Donald Trump is the Republican candidate I don't think most people are going to make this distinction.

Tend to agree here....I have to think if anyone is legitimately trying to figure out what they're going to do in November, they don't have a shot of making this distinction.  TF, you give the American people way too much credit when it comes to things like this.  However absurd we may think it is, that's the reality.

 

[cstu]

She ultimately may have no choice.  She's sick, everyone knows she's sick, her lack of transparency and lies only fuels the conspiracy theories (which, at this point, can you really fully disregard now?), she has to keep campaigning while being sick and confronting questions about her honest around the "pneumonia" and everything else, she's had gait and stability problems, in addition to the coughing episodes repeatedly for months now so every sniffle will be scrutinized, her poll numbers have been plummeting and none of this will decelerate that process.  All indications are she is going to lose this thing now and don't think the Dems in power know this.  An alternative has to be made immediately, because with each day that passes and she doesn't drop out, the chances increase exponentially that Donald ####### Trump will be our next president.

She's going to release more medical records.

 

[knowledge dropper]

Trump can easily label Hillary as an elitist, decrepit old bag that cannot stand the common man.  It's going to stick. 

 

[Baloney Sandwich]

She ultimately may have no choice.  She's sick, everyone knows she's sick, her lack of transparency and lies only fuels the conspiracy theories (which, at this point, can you really fully disregard now?), she has to keep campaigning while being sick and confronting questions about her honest around the "pneumonia" and everything else, she's had gait and stability problems, in addition to the coughing episodes repeatedly for months now so every sniffle will be scrutinized, her poll numbers have been plummeting and none of this will decelerate that process.  All indications are she is going to lose this thing now and don't think the Dems in power know this.  An alternative has to be made immediately, because with each day that passes and she doesn't drop out, the chances increase exponentially that Donald ####### Trump will be our next president.

Yeah, no chance she steps aside.  Of course she has a choice, nobody can force her to step aside.

There are zero indications she is going to lose the race, she is a huge favorite right now and up against a guy that fairs worse than Romney did against Obama when you look at state by state polling.

I wish she would drop out as I have no desire for her to be President but you are dillusional if you think she would step aside.

 

[SoBeDad]

If a poll were to be secretly commissioned by the DNC, and it showed Biden/Kaine with a statistically significant edge over Clinton/Kaine, then in the greater interest of the nation, she should drop out due to "health concerns".

 

[cstu]

Let me put it this way:  I can easily describe the thought process of an undecided voter who might be swayed by the 47% comment on the "clinging to guns and religion" comment.  I assume you could as well.  They think the person might be talking about them or about people that they think a presidential candidate should care about and not dismiss.

How would you describe the thought process of an undecided voter who is swayed by the "deplorables" comment.  Republicans and right-leaning conservatives who so far have rejected Trump have generally done so in large part because they agree with what Clinton said.  Maybe not the "half" part, but the idea that those people are awful and should be rejected and marginalized and that Trump has been successful in large part because he caters to them.

There are legions of Republicans who are outspoken in their criticism of Trump - they find him deplorable and by extension the people who support him.

 

[TobiasFunke]

Tend to agree here....I have to think if anyone is legitimately trying to figure out what they're going to do in November, they don't have a shot of making this distinction.  TF, you give the American people way too much credit when it comes to things like this.  However absurd we may think it is, that's the reality.

Yeah, maybe.  I've been coming around to the idea that I give the American people way too much credit.  Even if Trump loses by 10 points it's still gonna bum me out that 35-40% of us voted for him. It won't be a happy day no matter what, from the looks of it.  Either gonna be relieved and bummed out, or worried and bummed out.

 

[DocHolliday]

OR....it's treated the way the  treated McCain....incidentally, why do we care what the  are saying again?  The  will always be around if we pay attention to them.

So funny when Hillary is treated just like everyone else.  Hillary should not be scrutinized for anything.  She is royalty! 

 

[soothsayer]

Here's the thing - the story of Hillary fainting/losing bodily function and the subsequent actions taken by her/her campaign make no sense. It doesn't add up. If we are to believe the narrative (in chronological order):

- Hillary is said to be suffering from seasonal allergies (which explains her persistent cough)

- On Friday she is diagnosed with pneumonia (which is kept private)

- On Sunday she loses bodily function/passes out/faints/stumbles

- As a nearly 70-year old with pneumonia, after passing out, she is taken to her daughter's apartment and not to a hospital.

- The "episode" is initially blamed on "overheating"

- The "episode" is later blamed on dehydration as a result of her previously diagnosed pneumonia

- Approximately 90 minutes after losing bodily function/passing out/fainting/stumbling, she is waving on the sidewalk and it is reported that she is (paraphrasing) "re-hydrated and feeling great".

My questions:

- In what universe would it make sense for a 68-year old with pneumonia to NOT go to the hospital on Sunday after that "episode"?

- If dehydration is so severe that it causes loss of bodily function, what would the standard treatment be? Drink a bottle of water and call it good? Fluids via IV? Other?

- Imagine your having a 68-year old parent, diagnosed with pneumonia just two days earlier, passing out (even if briefly). Can you envision any scenario in which you'd let him/her walk around outside with no assistance just 90-minutes later? Can you envision any scenario in which you'd let them not go to a hospital for treatment/observation?

- If such a patient does go to a hospital (pneumonia + fainting), what would the standard response be? Can any doctors/nurses here comment on how long such a person would be kept under observation? How long would an IV treatment take in that case? Would a person be discharged as soon as the IV bag was empty?

I don't have many answers, but I can tell you that this isn't adding up for me. And I don't know what the implication of that is, I just know this whole thing makes no sense. The response, the "overheated" story, the post-"treatment" spin, the walk on the sidewalk - the whole thing is just wonky. None of it passes the smell test, but I have no idea what that means.

 

[Hang 10]

She's going to release more medical records.

I wonder what kind of detailed medical records they keep at Chelsea's house.

 

[timschochet]

Let me put it this way:  I can easily describe the thought process of an undecided voter who might be swayed by the 47% comment, or the "clinging to guns and religion" comment.  I assume you could as well. They think the person might be talking about them or about people that they think a presidential candidate should care about and not dismiss.  Easy.

How would you describe the thought process of an undecided voter who is swayed by the "deplorables" comment? Republicans and right-leaning conservatives who so far have rejected Trump have generally done so in large part because they agree with what Clinton said.  Maybe not the "half" figure, but the idea that those people are awful and should be rejected and marginalized and that Trump has been successful in large part because he caters to them. They're not going to feel insulted or dismissed by the quote.

I disagree. 

People are tribaliatic in nature. Take my dad- he criticizes Israel all the time. But let a non-Jew criticize Israel and he thinks its anti-semitism. Moderate Republicans may strongly detest Trump and his supporters, but when Hillary Clinton makes sweeping comments about those supporters that gets their ire up because their whole lives they've been hearing that they too are bigots just for voting Republican. 

 

[Sammy3469]

Let me put it this way:  I can easily describe the thought process of an undecided voter who might be swayed by the 47% comment, or the "clinging to guns and religion" comment.  I assume you could as well. They think the candidate might be talking about them, or about people that they think a presidential candidate should care about and not dismiss.  Easy.

How would you describe the thought process of an undecided voter who is swayed by the "deplorables" comment? Republicans and right-leaning conservatives who so far have rejected Trump have generally done so in large part because they agree with what Clinton said.  Maybe not the "half" figure, but the idea that those people are awful and should be rejected and marginalized and that Trump has been successful in large part because he caters to them. They're not going to feel insulted or dismissed by the quote. And no undecided voter is going to think "how dare she dismiss me and/or my racist friends!"

Silver had a tweet on Friday that the 47% comment maybe (and this was the upper bound) affected Romney by 1%.  Stuff like this just doesn't matter.  

 

[shader]

Yeah, maybe.  I've been coming around to the idea that I give the American people way too much credit.  Even if Trump loses by 10 points it's still gonna bum me out that 35-40% of us voted for him. It won't be a happy day no matter what, from the looks of it.  Either gonna be relieved and bummed out, or worried and bummed out.

They probably feel the same way about you. Why would you let the decisions made by millions of random people bum you out?  Both candidates are a joke, and neither will do anything to improve the lives of anyone in any significant way.  

 

[TobiasFunke]

If a poll were to be secretly commissioned by the DNC, and it showed Biden/Kaine with a statistically significant edge over Clinton/Kaine, then in the greater interest of the nation, she should drop out due to "health concerns".

"Sorry, women and black people. We know you voted for Clinton overwhelmingly in the primaries.  And we know you've supported our party in large numbers for decades. But white guys don't like your chosen candidate as much as you do, so we're going with an old white dude instead."

 

[cobalt_27]

She's going to release more medical records.

Only because this latest event forced her hand.  This is a chronic problem with Hillary.

 

[Sammy3469]

"Sorry, women and black people. We know you voted for Clinton overwhelmingly in the primaries.  And we know you've supported our party in large numbers for decades. But white guys don't like your chosen candidate as much as you do, so we're going with an old white dude instead."

It's not just that, but the filing deadline in the majority of states has either passed or is about to pass this week.  Short of her dying or being in a coma, replacing her isn't happening.

 

[Grace Under Pressure]

Is loss of bodily function code for "please say she #### her pants".

 

[Sammy3469]

Only because this latest event forced her hand.  This is a chronic problem with Hillary.

Anything she discloses is never enough for you guys.  

 

[cobalt_27]

Yeah, no chance she steps aside.  Of course she has a choice, nobody can force her to step aside.

There are zero indications she is going to lose the race, she is a huge favorite right now and up against a guy that fairs worse than Romney did against Obama when you look at state by state polling.

I wish she would drop out as I have no desire for her to be President but you are dillusional if you think she would step aside.

I didn't say it would be an easy sell.  And you're probably right.  But, she and her blind as #### supporters will be 100% responsible if Trump wins.

 

[cobalt_27]

Anything she discloses is never enough for you guys.  

Because she doesn't disclose squadoosh until someone catches her in a lie.  Otherwise, she changes the story, obfuscates, evades.  

 

[ShamrockPride]

Anything she discloses is never enough for you guys.  

It will be enough when I see that Goldman Sachs speech.

 

[stlrams]

How do you suffer from heat exhaustion in 78 degree weather?

 

[IC FBGCav]

It is. It's definitely a flaw.

I don't regard it as a disqualifying flaw.

How many almost disqualifying flaws can you have and still be taken seriously?

 

[Hang 10]

How do you suffer from heat exhaustion in 78 degree weather?

When heat exhaustion is code for seizures. 

 

[TobiasFunke]

They probably feel the same way about you. Why would you let the decisions made by millions of random people bum you out?  Both candidates are a joke, and neither will do anything to improve the lives of anyone in any significant way.  

I know many right-leaning people might find this hard to believe, but I'm super duper patriotic. Always have been. I'm so patriotic that I've defended things like Congress, the city of Cleveland and watching too much television in these forums. I've been a civil servant for many years and probably will be for many more in part because of that

I've seen my preferred candidate lose many times, but I've always been able to accept that as legitimate differences of opinion between people who agree on the same basic principles. Trump is the first time I've come face to face with the fact that lots of Americans are willing to toss aside those basic principles due to fear or anger or resentment. It's also the first time I've ever seen so many Americans get taken in by a transparent scam.  Whether he wins or loses, that's depressing for someone like me

 

[timschochet]

How many almost disqualifying flaws can you have and still be taken seriously?

I don't find it even "almost disqualifying". I don't think Hillary has any flaws which "almost" disqualify her. 

 

[ericttspikes]

Trump is pounding Hillary right now in Baltimore for calling half the voters deplorable on Friday.  This truly was her 47% moment.  Very damaging.

I think the number was probably low balled. Join em if you want, but others have a right to think they are dangerous scumbags. From NPI, KKK to Traditionalist Worker Party members; they're all for Trump and are the worst that America has to offer. If that's up for debate, so be it. 

National Policy Institute's Richard Spencer described Trump’s campaign as a kind of jumping-off point for the “alt-right” -- an opportunity to introduce their pro-white agenda to a broad national audience. “Certainly we have been, you could say, riding his coattails, there’s been more interest in us because we’re generally pro-Trump, because we’re inspired by him and things like that.”

https://mediamatters.org/blog/2016/09/10/white-nationalists-see-trump-chance-break-media-mainstream/212984

“White men in America and across the planet are partying like it’s 1999 following Trump’s decisive victory over the evil enemies of our race,” wrote Holocaust denier Andrew Anglin, who calls Mr. Trump “the Glorious Leader” on his Daily Stormer website, after the candidate all but sewed up the GOP nomination on May 3.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/white-nationalists-see-advancement-through-donald-trumps-candidacy-1463523858

Earlier this year, Rachel Pendergraft — the national organizer for the Knights Party, a standard-bearer for the Ku Klux Klan — told The Washington Post that the KKK had begun using Trump’s candidacy as a new conversation starter to recruit followers.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2016/08/07/top-nazi-leader-trump-will-be-a-real-opportunity-for-white-nationalists/?utm_term=.38b5ce952ffe

 

[The Commish]

Yeah, maybe.  I've been coming around to the idea that I give the American people way too much credit.  Even if Trump loses by 10 points it's still gonna bum me out that 35-40% of us voted for him. It won't be a happy day no matter what, from the looks of it.  Either gonna be relieved and bummed out, or worried and bummed out.

Right there with you GB....sucks.  Wouldn't say I'll be worried, but will certainly be embarrassed or really really embarrassed.  

 

[tommyboy]

And again, here is where the sexism plays a part. If Hillary was a man, she would have likely told the media on Friday that she had pneumonia and was taking some days off to recuperate. That would have been a big story, and there would have been some rumors until Hillary was seen again healthy- but nothing like the feeding frenzy going on here.

But because Hillary is a woman, she likely didn't want to reveal that she had pneumonia, because she has to appear energetic at all times to make up for the fact that she is not a man, and therefore in the eyes of the public, weaker.

yes, its everyone elses fault.

 

[Joe Summer]

Only because this latest event forced her hand. This is a chronic problem with Hillary.

*cough cough* Dr. Bornstein.

Because she doesn't disclose squadoosh until someone catches her in a lie. Otherwise, she changes the story, obfuscates, evades.

*cough cough* Veteran's fundraiser.

 

[cobalt_27]

Pretty strong summary here:

http://theweek.com/articles/648141/why-did-hillary-clinton-lie-about-health?utm_content=bufferf2a87&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

The most charitable reading of [her campaign's] timeline is that her campaign — presumably with the blessing and perhaps insistence of the candidate — fully intended to keep her illness a secret from the public. Let's be clear about what this means: Her campaign intended to lie. Even though doing so would require her to keep up a public schedule that might well make her condition worse and require ever-more elaborate forms of concealment. Because, of course, to curtail her schedule would raise questions that might reveal the truth.

 

[sublimeone]

Except she didn't call conservatives and right-wing leaning independents anything.  She called half of Trump supporters something.

Stuff like the 47% comment and the "clinging to guns and religion" comment are damaging because (1) there are undecided voters who might hear the comment and think the candidate is referring to them; (2) there are people who might not fall into that category but are sympathetic to those who do; and (3) they confirm a negative perception of the candidate (Romney as a rich guy who doesn't care about little people, Obama as an academic elitist). 

None of this stuff is true about Clinton's comment.  She's talking about Trump supporters and/or people who are racists, Islamophobes, etc.  Nobody who describes themselves that way or is sympathetic to those who do is voting for Clinton in two months.

ETA:  Or to put it another way:

 


 

Of course nobody is concerned about offending racists. The problem with Hillary's comment is that she's stereotyping millions of Americans unfairly. There are a lot of people supporting Trump or who may support Trump that resent the race card constantly being thrown at any non-democrat. It's been ridiculous for a while now and people are sick and tired of it. 

It's not a huge deal but these things do add up. People already don't trust her, it's become evident she's dealing with undisclosed health issues, and now she's making nasty comments like this. She's a poor candidate. Always has been. Still is.

 

[tommyboy]

How do you suffer from heat exhaustion in 78 degree weather?

shhh.   they want to believe her and the the campaign with all these excuses.

the sheeple cannot be disturbed.   how dare you?

 

[timschochet]

 Trump is the first time I've come face to face with the fact that lots of Americans are willing to toss aside those basic principles due to fear or anger or resentment. It's also the first time I've ever seen so many Americans get taken in by a transparent scam.  Whether he wins or loses, that's depressing for someone like me

First off, I don't believe that the vast majority of Trump voters are deliberately willing to toss aside the basic principles you mention. I think that they just haven't given too much thought to it one way or another- which is scary in itself. But it doesn't reflect anything permanent.

Be of good cheer. We've had these populist waves before. Senator Joe McCarthy being the last best example. They arrive at a time when the public is scared about the future, as the public is now, and they take advantage of that fear. History shows that, at least in this country, they rarely have any lasting impact. Americans ALWAYS eventually get over their fears and act reasonable after a time.