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*** Official Jaguars Thread - Team Putting #DTWD to The Test *** (1 Viewer)

They blew it. What got them the lead in the 1st place was abandoned for no logical reason. NE had no answer for Corey Grant. Both scores in 1st half involved big plays by Grant. Then like teams before them, they just screw up. They quit using him. He was in with Fournette at the same time and then they just quit doing what was working. They went completely conservative, running Fournette on 1st down for 1-2 yards on virtually every series, digging themselves a hole.

On D, they stifled Brady with man to man. In the 2nd half they went zone and blew the game.

Outcoached by Belicheck and he didn't even have to adjust. They adjusted themselves out of the game.

 
Man In The Box said:
The Pats were 5-11 the season before they won their first Super Bowl and began this great run. The Rams were 4-12 the year before they went on their run with Warner. They were also 4-12 last year, and went 11-5 this year. The Panthers were under .500 one year, then went 15-1 the next. Things change fast in the NFL.
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:lmao:  things change fast in the NFL but all you did was list four terrible examples despite going back nearly 20 years. 

 
tjnc09 said:
:lmao:  things change fast in the NFL but all you did was list four terrible examples despite going back nearly 20 years. 
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Yeah, I really debated whether or not to respond to you. Looks like I made the wrong choice. 

How many teams made the playoffs this year that didn’t last year? Is that a terrible example too? Better yet, don’t respond. You’re one of those “I’m always right, even when 10 people point out that I’m wrong” guys. It’s ok to be wrong about some things. Happens to all of us. 

 
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Pipes said:
They dominated the Steelers and took the mighty Patriots to the brink in an AFC championship game in a game where the Pats had 1 penalty called against them.  You're just flat out wrong here.
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Two quality wins all year against a team that fired their OC and had one of their most critical pieces to rush defense get paralyzed.  Barely beat the Bills whose only good player was carted off the week before.  Lost to the Titans twice, Rams, and Patriots.  Beat up all year on the softest schedule in the league with back up scrubs like Tom Savage and Jacoby Brissett. 

Fake teams gonna fake.

 
Man In The Box said:
Yeah, I really debated whether or not to respond to you. Looks like I made the wrong choice. 

How many teams made the playoffs this year that didn’t last year? Is that a terrible example too? Better yet, don’t respond. You’re one of those “I’m always right, even when 10 people point out that I’m wrong” guys. It’s ok to be wrong about some things. Happens to all of us. 
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:lmao:  I said legit contender and then you promptly listed the Rams who lost in the Wild Card round.  You mentioned the Panthers who went 15-1 because they played the second easiest schedule that year and immediately regressed again to 6-10 the following season.  And then you topped it off by listing two teams from FIFTEEN years ago.

 
[icon] said:
And almost beat New England. 

I take nothing away from Jax... they played a helluva game. They're young... they'll be back. Hats off guys. 
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The problem is that Jax still has a major question mark at QB.  Teams that we know will be back every year are those with good to great QBs.  But I agree that they had a very good postseason.  

 
tjnc09 said:
Two quality wins all year against a team that fired their OC and had one of their most critical pieces to rush defense get paralyzed.  Barely beat the Bills whose only good player was carted off the week before.  Lost to the Titans twice, Rams, and Patriots.  Beat up all year on the softest schedule in the league with back up scrubs like Tom Savage and Jacoby Brissett. 

Fake teams gonna fake.
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Did you even watch the NFL this year?  It's full of mediocre teams.  Who in the AFC is clearly better than the Jags?  The Patriots...maybe.  Who else?  I'll hang up and listen. 

 
bicycle_seat_sniffer said:
Zero penalties called on pats offense or defense? Seems odd....no....not a single one??? 
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and the (multiple) holding on Lewis' game clinching run was as outrageous and obvious as any holding penalty could be.

 
Calvitron Johnson said:
They blew it. What got them the lead in the 1st place was abandoned for no logical reason. NE had no answer for Corey Grant. Both scores in 1st half involved big plays by Grant. Then like teams before them, they just screw up. They quit using him. He was in with Fournette at the same time and then they just quit doing what was working. They went completely conservative, running Fournette on 1st down for 1-2 yards on virtually every series, digging themselves a hole.

On D, they stifled Brady with man to man. In the 2nd half they went zone and blew the game.

Outcoached by Belicheck and he didn't even have to adjust. They adjusted themselves out of the game.
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Twitter thread version of your post: https://twitter.com/SharpFootball/status/955454941073731584

 
tjnc09 said:
:lmao:  Every single person calling me a troll is incapable of providing a reasonable and compelling argument to disprove what I am saying.  
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or maybe no one is really interested in arguing with some one that is saying the team that just took the Patriots down to the wire in the AFC championship game wasn't very good or did not have a great season?

 
The only major weak point on this team is Bortles. He misses easy throws all the time, and frequently throws poor passes to his pass-catchers, that they manage to somehow hold on to, but because of the location of the ball they're not able to gain more yards. In the ACF Championship he had Dede open several times, and if he threw the ball in front of him it would have gone for a big gain, but because he threw it behind him Dede had to slow down and was caught by the CB. Tons of little things like that exemplify why Bortles isn't a good QB. Or to quote him, why he's not "a natural passer."

If the Jags had Alex Smith, they'd be in the Superbowl. 

 
tjnc09 said:
The fact that you have no clue how the betting market works for the Super Bowl tells me all I need to know about you.  
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Yes, I understand how it works. They set the line to get even amounts of money on both sides. Point still stands. 

Here’s some advice. You know your stuff. But you are about as condescending a poster as there is here. What kind of debates are you expecting when the majority of your retorts have a laughing emoji in them, mocking the other poster? Grow up. 

 
Man In The Box said:
Things change fast in the NFL. And we’ve come full circle. 
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Newton was 18/41 for 265 yards, 0 TDs and 1 INT in the Super Bowl against the league's #1 defense after going 15-1 and winning the MVP against the league's second softest schedule.  Those accomplishments (sandwiched between 7-8-1 and 6-10 records) were a mirage which is precisely my point with the Jaguars.

 
tjnc09 said:
Newton was 18/41 for 265 yards, 0 TDs and 1 INT in the Super Bowl against the league's #1 defense after going 15-1 and winning the MVP against the league's second softest schedule.  Those accomplishments (sandwiched between 7-8-1 and 6-10 records) were a mirage which is precisely my point with the Jaguars.
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I remember the game. He was terrible. And they lost. But they were legit contenders that season. That is my only point. If you legitimately don’t think they were, then we will continue to just talk past each other. I also think Jacksonville was legit this year. Regardless of what happens next year or the year after.  Could they go 14-2 next year? With some progression and luck, I don’t see why not. Could they have a ton of injuries and bad breaks and go 5-11 or worse (see NYG)? Of course. Maybe we just have different definitions of being legit. I don’t think a team has to win the Super Bowl to be a legitimate contender. Hell, I thought every NFC team had a legitimate chance to go to the Super Bowl when the playoffs started. I picked Atlanta   :shrug:  

 
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steelers1080 said:
The only major weak point on this team is Bortles. He misses easy throws all the time, and frequently throws poor passes to his pass-catchers, that they manage to somehow hold on to, but because of the location of the ball they're not able to gain more yards. In the ACF Championship he had Dede open several times, and if he threw the ball in front of him it would have gone for a big gain, but because he threw it behind him Dede had to slow down and was caught by the CB. Tons of little things like that exemplify why Bortles isn't a good QB. Or to quote him, why he's not "a natural passer."

If the Jags had Alex Smith, they'd be in the Superbowl. 
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Really?  I thought Bortles played well against the Pats (at the least the bits of the game that i actually watched and from reading the AFC championship thread).  It was the play calling in the 2nd half that seemed to be the culprit.  

 
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fred_1_15301 said:
Really?  I thought Bortles played well against the Pats (at the least the bits of the game that i actually watched and from reading the AFC championship thread).  It was the play calling in the 2nd half that seemed to be the culprit.  
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Alex Smith isn't the answer in Jax. And I don't think he would of played any better in the AFC title game than Bortles did. 

 
fred_1_15301 said:
Really?  I thought Bortles played well against the Pats (at the least the bits of the game that i actually watched and from reading the AFC championship thread).  It was the play calling in the 2nd half that seemed to be the culprit.  
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He's cautious as hell, but he can actually his a WR in stride. The team also would have had 0 fear with him attempting to work down the field with 1 min left in the 1st half because he's not prone to turnovers. Bortles played ok, and avoided turnovers, but almost all of his throws were off target. The main point was that an adequate QB, not even a good or great one, would help this team improve. They could have still lost to the Pats, but I think with a better QB they'd have won.

 
tjnc09 said:
:lmao:  Every single person calling me a troll is incapable of providing a reasonable and compelling argument to disprove what I am saying.  
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:lmao:  And you never answered my question on which teams in the AFC are better than the Jags? 

 
Still not over it.

As far as the game goes, I could feel it slipping away as the clock ticked down. It was painful. For the life of me I cannot fathom why Todd Wash switched to zone coverage. I just don’t understand it. Never will.

The Myles Jack mysterious whistle on the fumble recovery was bound to happen, as were the disparity in penalties. They did affect the outcome of the game. The more pictures and videos I see of the game, the more upset I get.

Despite all that home cooking, the Jags are the ones who put themselves in that position. The delay of game out of a time out that negated a first down and took them out of FG range- that’s all on them. Allowing a 3rd and 18 to be converted- that sin is on them. Calais Campbell was dinged up early and pressure was non-existent with 4 man rush- on them to change it up and bring another rusher. Running the same dive play over again- same story. They got conservative and took their foot off the gas and that’s the wrong approach and wrong team to do that with.

I’d be lying if I was to say that I think this year was a failure due to the manner in which they lost. I can’t say that. They made it to the conference finals. I expected 5-6 wins. After a decade straight of losing, it’s better than not being there to begin with. Apathy is not an emotion I will be carrying this offseason.

 
They have done a very good job of adding talent over the last 4-5 years.  The couple they added this past postseason put them over the top.  I can't see how anyone can deny the talent.  BTW, this is the perfect case of a team NOT going "from worst to first" overnight -- it was rebuilt over time.

 
What do Jags fans think about keeping Bortles vs. going out and getting a new QB? For the life of me, I cannot understand how so many NFL analysts are saying the Jags should keep him. If it weren't for Buffalo's anemic offense, Buffalo would have won their game, and the Jags would have been eliminated in the WC round. With Watson and Luck coming back, the Jags are going to have to be able to outscore some teams. I just don't see any down side to getting Alex Smith, Kirk Cousins, or even a Case Keenum.

 
dhockster said:
What do Jags fans think about keeping Bortles vs. going out and getting a new QB? For the life of me, I cannot understand how so many NFL analysts are saying the Jags should keep him. If it weren't for Buffalo's anemic offense, Buffalo would have won their game, and the Jags would have been eliminated in the WC round. With Watson and Luck coming back, the Jags are going to have to be able to outscore some teams. I just don't see any down side to getting Alex Smith, Kirk Cousins, or even a Case Keenum.
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Apparently you have decided that Bortles sucks, despite his recent success.  This sort of sentiment is pervasive here.  People pigeon-hole players and that's that.  Truth is, in this case and most others, the player in question is adequate.  So are the others you suggest and wouldn't be a significant upgrade.  Now, if one of the few elite QBs, such as Rodgers, were available...

 
dhockster said:
What do Jags fans think about keeping Bortles vs. going out and getting a new QB? For the life of me, I cannot understand how so many NFL analysts are saying the Jags should keep him. If it weren't for Buffalo's anemic offense, Buffalo would have won their game, and the Jags would have been eliminated in the WC round. With Watson and Luck coming back, the Jags are going to have to be able to outscore some teams. I just don't see any down side to getting Alex Smith, Kirk Cousins, or even a Case Keenum.
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My stance is that if the Jags think there's a realistic upgrade available then they should move on it. It should be that way for all positions.

Bortles showed improvement and wasn't nearly as bad as people say this year. However, he was clearly this team's weak link. It's the frustrating inconsistencies that get me. It might be for couple of series or for complete games (Buffalo, Arizona, NYJ), but the lapses are crushing. A few losses this year were directed attributable to him and in the case of others, they schemed around him.

It's hard to get a feel for what they are thinking in regards to the position. I can see them drafting a QB and holding onto him this year while the rookie learns.

I would prefer Cousins, but I don't think that's likely. I am good with moving on from Bortles.

 
Watch the game tape during the playoffs when he supposedly played well. He's so inaccurate. He's one of the bottom 8 QBs. The reason he has had adequate stats for the last several years are:

  1. Garbage time - He scores TDs and gets yards when it doesn't matter. This was especially true 2 years ago when Allen Robinson was great. Their 4th quarter offense was great, and they'd still lose by multiple scores.
  2. His WRs are really good. He gets a lot of credit that should really go to his WRs. Their corps was decimated by injury this year, but Dede and Cole appear to be decent WRs. So many of Bortles' targets are inaccurate, but they're able to re-position themselves on the fly and still make a catch. Last year something like 15% of Allen Robinson's catches were deemed "uncatchable". This doesn't include all the ones thrown into the dirt 3 yards ahead of the WR, or ones thrown 5 ft over their heads.
  3. His defense and running back are awesome. The Jags won a lot of games this year, but it's all due to their Defense shutting people down, and their running back/backs scoring and gaining chunks of yards. Fournette has faced a ridiculous amount of stacked boxes this year because 0 teams fear Bortles. He is getting more credit that he deserves.
Maybe Alex Smith isn't the answer, but neither is Bortles. 

 
steelers1080 said:
Watch the game tape during the playoffs when he supposedly played well. He's so inaccurate. He's one of the bottom 8 QBs. The reason he has had adequate stats for the last several years are:

  1. Garbage time - He scores TDs and gets yards when it doesn't matter. This was especially true 2 years ago when Allen Robinson was great. Their 4th quarter offense was great, and they'd still lose by multiple scores.
  2. His WRs are really good. He gets a lot of credit that should really go to his WRs. Their corps was decimated by injury this year, but Dede and Cole appear to be decent WRs. So many of Bortles' targets are inaccurate, but they're able to re-position themselves on the fly and still make a catch. Last year something like 15% of Allen Robinson's catches were deemed "uncatchable". This doesn't include all the ones thrown into the dirt 3 yards ahead of the WR, or ones thrown 5 ft over their heads.
  3. His defense and running back are awesome. The Jags won a lot of games this year, but it's all due to their Defense shutting people down, and their running back/backs scoring and gaining chunks of yards. Fournette has faced a ridiculous amount of stacked boxes this year because 0 teams fear Bortles. He is getting more credit that he deserves.
Maybe Alex Smith isn't the answer, but neither is Bortles. 
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This.

Plus Jurell Casey says he chokes ;)  

 
Mr. Brownstone said:
Still not over it.

As far as the game goes, I could feel it slipping away as the clock ticked down. It was painful. For the life of me I cannot fathom why Todd Wash switched to zone coverage. I just don’t understand it. Never will.

The Myles Jack mysterious whistle on the fumble recovery was bound to happen, as were the disparity in penalties. They did affect the outcome of the game. The more pictures and videos I see of the game, the more upset I get.

Despite all that home cooking, the Jags are the ones who put themselves in that position. The delay of game out of a time out that negated a first down and took them out of FG range- that’s all on them. Allowing a 3rd and 18 to be converted- that sin is on them. Calais Campbell was dinged up early and pressure was non-existent with 4 man rush- on them to change it up and bring another rusher. Running the same dive play over again- same story. They got conservative and took their foot off the gas and that’s the wrong approach and wrong team to do that with.

I’d be lying if I was to say that I think this year was a failure due to the manner in which they lost. I can’t say that. They made it to the conference finals. I expected 5-6 wins. After a decade straight of losing, it’s better than not being there to begin with. Apathy is not an emotion I will be carrying this offseason.
Click to expand...
This.

As the second half went on, I felt ill.

No, literally ill. I caught whatever flu bug is going around. Between being pissed off and fever/chills and trying to breathe, this whole week has been a struggle.

Finally starting to sleep normally.  

Sigh.

 
Going into the off-season,  I thought the Jags did 1 of 2 things with Bortles option.

A- Make it a 2 year deal for less avg money but similar guarantee and draft his successor. Like 2 / 30 / 19.

B - Ditch him at start of league year, avoid option,  and get on Cousins sweepstakes.

Assuming he won't pass a physical in March, looks like it's option A.

 
JaxBill said:
Going into the off-season,  I thought the Jags did 1 of 2 things with Bortles option.

A- Make it a 2 year deal for less avg money but similar guarantee and draft his successor. Like 2 / 30 / 19.

B - Ditch him at start of league year, avoid option,  and get on Cousins sweepstakes.

Assuming he won't pass a physical in March, looks like it's option A.
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If he doesn't expect to pass the physical - wouldn't the Jags have to add some (new) guaranteed money for him to take that deal? Otherwise he risks playing at a "discount" in 2019

 
msommer said:
If he doesn't expect to pass the physical - wouldn't the Jags have to add some (new) guaranteed money for him to take that deal? Otherwise he risks playing at a "discount" in 2019
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Yes, they most likely would have to.

I don't see any reason to give him a new contract though.

 
Could they simply sign cousins if they wanted and try to trade bortles or just sit on his contract for a year? They have cap space, but maybe not that much cap space. Especially if they resign ar15 or tag him. Also fair to wonder what bortles season would have looked like with Robinson out there. 

 
Snorkelson said:
Could they simply sign cousins if they wanted and try to trade bortles or just sit on his contract for a year? They have cap space, but maybe not that much cap space. Especially if they resign ar15 or tag him. Also fair to wonder what bortles season would have looked like with Robinson out there. 
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They could get creative, I imagine.

Hated them picking up the option then. Hate it even more now.

 
Mr. Brownstone said:
They could get creative, I imagine.

Hated them picking up the option then. Hate it even more now.
Click to expand...
If you’re planning on extending bortles, then you keep him and do it, but if you are “waiting and seeing” a year, you can’t miss the opportunity to get what is/likely will be the best fa qb to come on the market. Face it, quality qbs don’t hit free agency; decent journeymen get glennon deals, teams trade for game managers like Alex smith. 

 
msommer said:
If he doesn't expect to pass the physical - wouldn't the Jags have to add some (new) guaranteed money for him to take that deal? Otherwise he risks playing at a "discount" in 2019
Click to expand...
"You can play out the option as a lame duck or this extension helps us re-sign ARob."

 
Pwingles said:
I think the odds of someone offering him more than Jax and him going elsewhere is higher than 50/50
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No one can offer him anything unless he can pass a physical in early March.

If not, he is under contract with the Jags. A guaranteed contract. For 19 million. If he passes the physical he can be cut with no cap repercussions.

Do you think it is in Blake's interest to pass the physical?

 
msommer said:
No one can offer him anything unless he can pass a physical in early March.

If not, he is under contract with the Jags. A guaranteed contract. For 19 million. If he passes the physical he can be cut with no cap repercussions.

Do you think it is in Blake's interest to pass the physical?
Click to expand...
I wasnt talking about blake....I bolded the AR15 comment in your last post

 
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