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**** OFFICIAL Marvel's Avengers: Endgame **** SPOILERS ALLOWED! Enter at your own risk!!! (1 Viewer)

Did anyone catch what seemed like a throwaway comment about earthquake in Ocean by Wakanda? Is that their way to foreshadow Prince Namor as in the next Black Panther movie, or am I stretching too far with this?

 
The Big Guy said:
Did anyone catch what seemed like a throwaway comment about earthquake in Ocean by Wakanda? Is that their way to foreshadow Prince Namor as in the next Black Panther movie, or am I stretching too far with this?
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Stretching too far. IMO it was to illustrate how much control Widow was trying to exert to control/stop bad things happening.

 
The Big Guy said:
Did anyone catch what seemed like a throwaway comment about earthquake in Ocean by Wakanda? Is that their way to foreshadow Prince Namor as in the next Black Panther movie, or am I stretching too far with this?
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Nope. A lot of people speculating that that's the premise for BP2.

 
FreeBaGeL said:
Maybe I am misremembering this but I thought they established that only changes with the infinity stones would create separate branches in reality.

Didn't they say in the scene where they were making fun of the time travel movies that changing things while time traveling wouldn't effect the timeline, but then it was later established that because the infinity stones were the driving force of creation or whatever star trek mumbo jumbo, if those were altered then it would break into a separate branch of reality.
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I think you're misremembering.

a) The point of the scene with Hulk talking about the movies was that you cannot go into your past, change something, and expect to see the change reflected when you return to your present. 

b) The point of the Sorcerer Supreme talking to Hulk was, when you change something in the past... an alternate timeline continues onwards that does reflect the change. This has nothing to do with the Stones.  It's just how time travel works.

The plot implication of a) is that you cannot go strangle baby Thanos and fix the present.  But you can, say, take items from the past and bring them to your present and use them in the present.

The plot implication of b) was that the changes do have repercussions on a new, alternate timeline continuing forward from said changes.  If you take necessary tools from them, you don't change your own present but you can #### over that entire timeline.  In particular, if they stole the Time Stone from the past, that timeline  was doomed to enslavement by Dormamu because it was the only thing capable of defeating him when he shows up a few years later. 

Thus the solution to return the Stones once they were done using them. Get what you need from the past, use them, then return them back so you don't doom an alternate Earth to enslavement.

 
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GregR said:
I think you're misremembering.

a) The point of the scene with Hulk talking about the movies was that you cannot go into your past, change something, and expect to see the change reflected when you return to your present. 

b) The point of the Sorcerer Supreme talking to Hulk was, when you change something in the past... an alternate timeline continues onwards that does reflect the change.

The plot implication of a) is that you cannot go strangle baby Thanos and fix the present.  But you can, say, take items from the past and bring them to your present and use them in the present.

The plot implication of b) was that the changes do have repercussions on a new, alternate timeline continuing forward from said changes.  If you take necessary tools from them, you don't change your own present but you can #### over that entire timeline.  In particular, if they stole the Time Stone from the past, that timeline  was doomed to enslavement by Dormamu because it was the only thing capable of defeating him when he shows up a few years later. 

Thus the solution to return the Stones once they were done using them. Get what you need from the past, use them, then return them back so you don't doom an alternate Earth to enslavement.
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Seems like taking Mjolnir from the past would screw up that timeline pretty badly as well.  Not to mention Thanos, Gamora, Nebula, etc.

 
FreeBaGeL said:
Seems like taking Mjolnir from the past would screw up that timeline pretty badly as well.  Not to mention Thanos, Gamora, Nebula, etc.
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Taking Mjolnir would too, yes.  So Cap takes it with him when he returns the stones, presumably to return it as well.

Removing Thanos?  Probably not.  Depends on what we consider "screwing up" a timeline.  There isn't one timeline that is the correct one.  Some changes you might make result in better lives for those in the timeline.  Others result in worse.  

Case in point from the X-men comics.  In some alternate timeline, Senator Kelly is killed by Mystique.  Anti-mutant sentiment swells, laws enacted, Sentinels are created and empowered. The Sentinel AI evolves, deciding the only way to deal with mutants is to enslave humanity too, since human reproduction can give rise to mutants. They enslave North America, kill all the heroes including non-mutants, with nuclear war imminent from the rest of the world to stop them from spreading. 20+ years from now, Rachel Summers (the daughter of Cyclops and Jean Grey in that world) sends 40 year old Kate Pryde back in time into the mind of her 13-year-old self (Kitty Pryde), and set the X-men to save Senator Kelly.

They succeed. Kate Pryde goes home and finds NOTHING CHANGED in her timeline.  Because of part a) above. Back To The Future was wrong.

Meanwhile a new timeline continues on from Kate's actions in the past.  Anti-mutant sentiment does not hit the same levels.  That timeline continues forward with a much brighter future.

The kicker?  The "alternate" timeline that continued forward from Kate's time intervention, is what we consider the normal Marvel timeline.  It only exists as it does because someone from a much worse timeline came back in time, trying to fix their own but not realizing they couldn't, and ended up giving "our" timeline a better future.

So is the core Marvel universe "screwed up" because a time traveler intervened and now the Sentinels do not enslave humanity?  No... it's just different.  Different in better ways for the inhabitants.

That comics story, incidentally, is called Days of Future Past, which inspired the X-men movie. But the movie plot changed many details to revolve around the characters played by the biggest movie stars in the cast, Jackman's Wolverine and Jennifer Lawrence's Mystique.

 
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Insein said:
That's 3.75 billion people gone in an instant if it's precisely 50%. That's a lot of people. But it's not like it was evenly distributed across the universe. There could be more gone from Earth than other places.
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But Thanos tells Stark on Titan that when he’s done, half of humanity will be left. And he hopes they remember him. 

Gamora tells them that he goes to planets and kills half the population. Thor tells Rocket half his people were gone. Seems like the gist is half of every planet/people/etc die.

 
Andrew74 said:
But Thanos tells Stark on Titan that when he’s done, half of humanity will be left. And he hopes they remember him. 

Gamora tells them that he goes to planets and kills half the population. Thor tells Rocket half his people were gone. Seems like the gist is half of every planet/people/etc die.
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I guess that's his schtick

 
Went to see it a couple days ago, with my 12 year old daughter. We loved it.

 it was completely bitter sweet.  These movies have been one of our “things” to do together. Mom couldn’t care less. We have watched all of them together (many times) over the last 5ish years. Now what?   :cry:  

Kudos to the marvel universe. They’ve created an unbelievable story over the years.  One that brought my daughter and I, that much closer. 

 
GregR said:
I think you're misremembering.

a) The point of the scene with Hulk talking about the movies was that you cannot go into your past, change something, and expect to see the change reflected when you return to your present. 

b) The point of the Sorcerer Supreme talking to Hulk was, when you change something in the past... an alternate timeline continues onwards that does reflect the change. This has nothing to do with the Stones.  It's just how time travel works.

The plot implication of a) is that you cannot go strangle baby Thanos and fix the present.  But you can, say, take items from the past and bring them to your present and use them in the present.

The plot implication of b) was that the changes do have repercussions on a new, alternate timeline continuing forward from said changes.  If you take necessary tools from them, you don't change your own present but you can #### over that entire timeline.  In particular, if they stole the Time Stone from the past, that timeline  was doomed to enslavement by Dormamu because it was the only thing capable of defeating him when he shows up a few years later. 

Thus the solution to return the Stones once they were done using them. Get what you need from the past, use them, then return them back so you don't doom an alternate Earth to enslavement.
Click to expand...
Isn't that part of the issue with nebula? Part of her is AI, that part is synched with the Nebula that comes from the future, hence she shows the future Nebula's past.  

Or at least I think that's how it worked.

 
DA RAIDERS said:
Went to see it a couple days ago, with my 12 year old daughter. We loved it.

 it was completely bitter sweet.  These movies have been one of our “things” to do together. Mom couldn’t care less. We have watched all of them together (many times) over the last 5ish years. Now what?   :cry:  

Kudos to the marvel universe. They’ve created an unbelievable story over the years.  One that brought my daughter and I, that much closer. 
Click to expand...
At least we have some continuity of the story starting with Spiderman this summer. Marvel warned that the upcoming trailer (next week?) will have Endgame spoilers in it.

GOTG3 in 2021, Captain Marvel 2, Black Widow, Black Panther 2 all coming at a steady pace I would assume. And perhaps another Thor?

My guess is Marvel also makes sure to intertwine some of the storylines for these movies so we get a small taste of the larger MCU in each movie.

 
Reel Blend podcast - which is a great podcast for movie people - will have the Russo brothers on Monday's release and they will discuss the movie in depth (with spoilers).

 
Andrew74 said:
But Thanos tells Stark on Titan that when he’s done, half of humanity will be left. And he hopes they remember him. 

Gamora tells them that he goes to planets and kills half the population. Thor tells Rocket half his people were gone. Seems like the gist is half of every planet/people/etc die.
Click to expand...
1. "humanity" is not the same as "earthlings" (or "NYC or SF residents")
2.  The "killing half" incidents Gamora and Thor were talking about were pre-gauntlet, when Thanos was doing his thing the hard way.  If you're going to kill half the population of California, and you don't have the stones, you go from city to city, killing half of the people at each stop. If you have the stones, you snap your fingers and half of the state is killed, but that doesn't necessarily mean exactly half of LA is killed.

 
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The Dude said:
Reel Blend podcast - which is a great podcast for movie people - will have the Russo brothers on Monday's release and they will discuss the movie in depth (with spoilers).
Click to expand...
Cool. But I'm not going to remember that. Please post a link when it happens? 

 
Just saw the movie today and there’s too much posted here to read through it all.

Does anyone understand why, at the end of the movie, it’s 2023 but Peter Parker is back in high school with his friends? Are we supposed to assume that everyone in that storyline got dusted at the end of IW and all came back 5 years later?

 
IIRC they did mention trying to do a census on Earth and concluding pretty close to half of the planet's population was killed.

 
-OZ- said:
Isn't that part of the issue with nebula? Part of her is AI, that part is synched with the Nebula that comes from the future, hence she shows the future Nebula's past.  

 Or at least I think that's how it worked.
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Yes, that's what was going on with her.  Like Nebula's head has interstellar wifi or something, and soon as future Nebula showed up, she auto-connected to the same system.

 
bcdjr1 said:
Just saw the movie today and there’s too much posted here to read through it all.

Does anyone understand why, at the end of the movie, it’s 2023 but Peter Parker is back in high school with his friends? Are we supposed to assume that everyone in that storyline got dusted at the end of IW and all came back 5 years later?
Click to expand...
The ones that came back went back to school.

 
bcdjr1 said:
Just saw the movie today and there’s too much posted here to read through it all.

Does anyone understand why, at the end of the movie, it’s 2023 but Peter Parker is back in high school with his friends? Are we supposed to assume that everyone in that storyline got dusted at the end of IW and all came back 5 years later?
Click to expand...
Yes discussed and also confirmed by directors

 
So is it alright to think the movie was just OK, or is this like the GOT thread where you get blasted if you dont love everything about it? 

:oldunsure:

 
I've thought about it more.  I really was a great way to wrap up the series and say goodbye to IM and CA in a great way.   Yes, I cried a little too - just about any parent/kid stuff gets me, so Hawkeye at the start and Tony's daughter stuff hit home.  There were funny parts, emotional parts, and they did a good job of touching base with each of the remaining characters and giving them a good quiet moment which is one thing that I think sets the good Marvel movies apart from the typical blockbuster fare.  

That said, I did feel the 3 hours and wasn't on board for the time travel heist.    Also, the one movie the son and I didn't get around to was Capt. Marvel, so I was taken aback by how powerful she is and wondered WTF she didn't take care of the problem in 2 secs.  

For me it was a good Marvel movie, but I was a little surprised to feel a little let down after Black Panther, Infinity War, and Spiderman being some of my favorites of the series, so I was expecting the recent streak to continue.  

 
bcdjr1 said:
Just saw the movie today and there’s too much posted here to read through it all.

Does anyone understand why, at the end of the movie, it’s 2023 but Peter Parker is back in high school with his friends? Are we supposed to assume that everyone in that storyline got dusted at the end of IW and all came back 5 years later?
Click to expand...
Maybe I missed what you are saying, but I think they showed one character from Spiderman: Homecoming and that was Ned.  So all we know is that Ned  dusted during the first snap.  We have no knowledge of the other kids, who are likely just a mix of previously dusted kids who just came back and kids who were 5 years younger when the first snap happened that are now the same age.

 
Full disclosure I am not a big Marvels guy and I don't think I have seen all the movies.  I saw end game today with the family and there were many characters I did not recognize.  Who did C America marry?  The girl in the office when he travelled back in time?  Are we supposed to know who that is?  

Jon Favernau sp? was in a previous movie?  I don't remember him at all.  I also had no idea who the girl that rescued Iron Man in space at the beginning was.  I didn't understand why snapping your fingers with arm glove on sometimes erases people and sometimes brings them back.  Or that it killed Iron Man for that matter.

Overall it was a little long but I was entertained.  

 
Don't Noonan said:
Full disclosure I am not a big Marvels guy and I don't think I have seen all the movies.  I saw end game today with the family and there were many characters I did not recognize.  Who did C America marry?  The girl in the office when he travelled back in time?  Are we supposed to know who that is?  

Jon Favernau sp? was in a previous movie?  I don't remember him at all.  I also had no idea who the girl that rescued Iron Man in space at the beginning was.  I didn't understand why snapping your fingers with arm glove on sometimes erases people and sometimes brings them back.  Or that it killed Iron Man for that matter.

Overall it was a little long but I was entertained.  
Click to expand...
Girl was Peggy Carter.  She has been in multiple MCU movies including staring in the first Captain America.  She also starred in the TV series Agent Carter.

Favreau has been there since day 1 in the first Iron Man (which he directed).  His character has shown up in multiple movies.

The girl in space was Nebula, an important character in the Guardians of the Galaxy movies.

The entire movie was written assuming people saw the whole series.  You likely missed numerous story lines and cool call backs if you missed a bunch of the movies (which it sounds like you did).

=====

As an aside, I always have the same reaction to posts like this.  When one reads a book, do people just skip chapters and expect the ending to make sense?

 
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NewlyRetired said:
Girl was Peggy Carter.  She has been in multiple MCU movies including staring in the first Captain America.  She also starred in the TV series Agent Carter.

Favreau has been there since day 1 in the first Iron Man (which he directed).  His character has shown up in multiple movies.

The girl is space was Nebula, an important character in the Guardians of the Galaxy movies.

The entire movie was written assuming people saw the whole series.  You likely missed numerous story lines and cool call backs if you missed a bunch of the movies (which it sounds like you did).

=====

As an aside, I always have the same reaction to posts like this.  When one reads a book, do people just skip chapters and expect the ending to make sense?
Click to expand...
Thanks.  I know who Nebula is.   I am talking about the girl who flew into space to save Iron Man at the start.

 
Don't Noonan said:
Full disclosure I am not a big Marvels guy and I don't think I have seen all the movies.  I saw end game today with the family and there were many characters I did not recognize.  Who did C America marry?  The girl in the office when he travelled back in time?  Are we supposed to know who that is?  

Jon Favernau sp? was in a previous movie?  I don't remember him at all.  I also had no idea who the girl that rescued Iron Man in space at the beginning was.  I didn't understand why snapping your fingers with arm glove on sometimes erases people and sometimes brings them back.  Or that it killed Iron Man for that matter.

Overall it was a little long but I was entertained.  
Click to expand...
Peggy Carter is in the first Captain America movie and the second one when she's older. She's the girl cap fell in love with in the 40's but lost when he was frozen in ice.

Jon Farvue is Iron Man's personal assistant. He's in all the iron Man movies.

Captain Marvel is the overpowered girl. She just had her movie this year.

The infinity guantlet with all of the stones together basically grants the users wish. Technically I don't think you had to snap your fingers but Thanos did so Hulk and Iron Man did also. The stones are stupidly powerful. They nearly killed hulk and Thanos when they used them. Tony is just a human. 

 
NewlyRetired said:
Maybe I missed what you are saying, but I think they showed one character from Spiderman: Homecoming and that was Ned.  So all we know is that Ned  dusted during the first snap.  We have no knowledge of the other kids, who are likely just a mix of previously dusted kids who just came back and kids who were 5 years younger when the first snap happened that are now the same age.
Click to expand...
There are also the trailers for the new Spider-Man movie which have that quiz bowl team from the first Spider-Man movie - MJ, Flash, Betty, and some others.  They've said Far From Home takes place after Endgame.

 
hagmania said:
C'mon man. Even if you didn't know who she was, context of the scene should tell you that, yes, you should know who that was.
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It looked like he recognized her for sure that is why I asked.  It didn't make any sense to me how since he travelled back in time.

 
NewlyRetired said:
why did it not make sense?  She is from the past so going back in time is the only way it happens.  She was born in 1921.
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Because I had never seen a C America movie so I had no idea how a 30 year old guy could go back in time and recognize some girl.  I still don't understand but that is fine.

 
Don't Noonan said:
It looked like he recognized her for sure that is why I asked.  It didn't make any sense to me how since he travelled back in time.
Click to expand...
If you are talking about when he went back to 1970, she probably looked a little younger than she should have.  She would have been 49 in that scene but they looked like they let Haley play it with out aging her.  Haley was 36 when this was filmed.

 
Don't Noonan said:
Because I had never seen a C America movie so I had no idea how a 30 year old guy could go back in time and recognize some girl.  I still don't understand but that is fine.
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oh I see.   Captain America was born in 1920.  At the end of the first Captain America movie he is frozen for 70 years which when thawed brings him up to our times for the rest of the movies.

 
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Mile High said:
Avengers: Endgame is now the second highest grossing film of all time with $2.189 billion.
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this movie is just killing it overseas.

It is 9th domestically all time but should jump quite a bit in the coming week.  It will be interesting to see if it has the domestic legs to catch The Force Awakens which is a little over $300m ahead of it.

 
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Saw it yesterday, going to post my thoughts before I read through the thread:

Not the best movie I've ever seen, but as a wrap up to the last 18 years or whatever (I've seen maybe 60% of them).  I'm thoroughly satisfied.  Great send offs for both Iron Man and Captain America.  I've read some online about how Iron Man stole the stones from Thanos and it still seems a little "Wait, what?" to me, but whatever.  Also the "I'm with Her" sequence was gratuitous and a little eye-rolling, but again whatever.  Didn't take away from my enjoyment at all.  Fun movie, and I'm glad I got to experience it.

 
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