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*** Official Russia vs. Ukraine Discussion - Invasion has begun *** (9 Viewers)

I was thinking today....

The totality of Russian history can be summed up in them oppressing their own people and causing problems for the rest of the world.
The high point likely being the Mongol invasion.
 
I just finished reading a book about the Persian revolution in the early 1900s (with a focus on a young Presbyterian missionary, Howard Baskerville). Russia, of course, actively stuck their nose in all of it. They just can't stop themselves.
 
Ukraine says that a European ally donation of an anti-air defense system has had to be changed because it doesn't work. He doesn't say what equipment from who. Maybe it would be the German Gepard. Beyond MANPAD there isn't a ton of air defense systems that have been donated and some are proven on the battlefield. Outside of Ukraine, I don't think this system has ever been used in warfare. On top of that the German military has been neglected so much that much of their active equipment is known to be in disrepair. There have been some reports of it being effective against drones but that is pretty much it. There are known reports of them having issues with it's ammo.

Maybe the British Stormer HVMs or French Crotale. Outside of that there really isn't a whole lot of potentials that would fit a Euro country donating an air defense system that isn't proven.
 

Right now nuclear threats are the only thing Putin and his cronies have to offer. With the Russian army proving to be inept everytime there is a setback they have to throw out the nuke threat. Same as Noth Korea.

Nobody was ever going to invade Russia, and who would ever want to invade North Korea..for what?

Right now Putin is not fighting a war with Ukraine anymore, he is fighting for his own survival. Only concern is if Putin is replaced will it be someone as bad or worse?
 
A lot of people aren't really familiar with Tatarskiy. Unfortunately, I know quite a bit about him since I've been following his channel for a while now. But a quick rundown of what he was doing during the war: - Participated in the Donbas war since 2014. - A criminal, was in prison for bank robbery. - A self-proclaimed "writer" (I haven't read anything). - Since Feb 2022, been on and off in the Donbas, often traveling back to Russia. - Definitely felt very comfortable in the war. - Had a sizeable TG following, was posting "Evening Vladlen" summaries to his channel every night, in addition to opinions and suggestions. - Close associate with a number of Rascists, including RSOTM admin (Wagner group). He was indeed very close with Wagner. - In recent months, began hosting an irregular show on Solovyev's channel together with the creator of Rybar. - Essentially, he was a minor superstar in the z-world, everyone knows him. While his death may not trigger a physical response, it will have a massive effect on the Russians. It already does.
 
“The leaked documents claim that Russia has sustained troop losses ranging from 16,000 to 17,500 while Ukrainian losses amount to as many as 71,500 – a staggering differential that stands at odds with the triumphalist narrative projected by Kiev. They are dated March 1 2023 and appear to be part of an ongoing briefing effort to analyze the war’s progress and plan a Ukrainian counteroffensive. “


WW3 has never been closer
 
“The leaked documents claim that Russia has sustained troop losses ranging from 16,000 to 17,500 while Ukrainian losses amount to as many as 71,500 – a staggering differential that stands at odds with the triumphalist narrative projected by Kiev. They are dated March 1 2023 and appear to be part of an ongoing briefing effort to analyze the war’s progress and plan a Ukrainian counteroffensive. “


WW3 has never been closer
thought i read somewhere that they were altered prior to be leaking
 
“The leaked documents claim that Russia has sustained troop losses ranging from 16,000 to 17,500 while Ukrainian losses amount to as many as 71,500 – a staggering differential that stands at odds with the triumphalist narrative projected by Kiev. They are dated March 1 2023 and appear to be part of an ongoing briefing effort to analyze the war’s progress and plan a Ukrainian counteroffensive. “


WW3 has never been closer
The entire thing has been such a huge scam. You have to have such a low IQ to believe Ukraine ever had a shot at stopping Russia or that the American government ever believed the money being sent there was going to amount to anything other than propping up a corrupt government and funneling money back to the big war machine. What an absolute embarrassment
 
“The leaked documents claim that Russia has sustained troop losses ranging from 16,000 to 17,500 while Ukrainian losses amount to as many as 71,500 – a staggering differential that stands at odds with the triumphalist narrative projected by Kiev. They are dated March 1 2023 and appear to be part of an ongoing briefing effort to analyze the war’s progress and plan a Ukrainian counteroffensive. “


WW3 has never been closer
The entire thing has been such a huge scam. You have to have such a low IQ to believe Ukraine ever had a shot at stopping Russia or that the American government ever believed the money being sent there was going to amount to anything other than propping up a corrupt government and funneling money back to the big war machine. What an absolute embarrassment

Wait... what?

Flap you've kinda been progressively more entrenched into the right wing talking points but.. what on earth is all this about?

The US has spent a tiny fraction of what we spent in GWOT. No Americans are dying. A chunk of our "cost" is in equipment that was about to be scrapped/mothballed (ie MRAPs and old Abrahams.

Javelins and HIMAARS have real costs but to what real loss? Still not our best stuff and ROI includes exposing Russias gear as trash.

AND... Ukraine is actually winning

Russia is already backing resources out of Crimea and fortifying.... indicating an "Ex GF scorched earth" exit. They're trotting out untrained folks with trash gear. For ****s sake, Russia has mobilized half a million troops and has gained a postage stamp per person. If that.

This is a complete and total pantsing of Putin et al.

This take is so horribly off base I'm confused how it could come from such a sharp dude.

GB help me understand how you're seeing what you're seeing
 
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“The leaked documents claim that Russia has sustained troop losses ranging from 16,000 to 17,500 while Ukrainian losses amount to as many as 71,500 – a staggering differential that stands at odds with the triumphalist narrative projected by Kiev. They are dated March 1 2023 and appear to be part of an ongoing briefing effort to analyze the war’s progress and plan a Ukrainian counteroffensive. “


WW3 has never been closer
thought i read somewhere that they were altered prior to be leaking

The plans were seemingly leaked by a dimwit at 4chan. Usual MO... **** sizing debate.

There are two decks running around. One was real numbers something like (~100k UKR/~300KRUS). Then one with bad photoshop of a much lower set of numbers.

Leak seems to be legit and a pretty big embarrassment.

Photoshops likely out of RUS are equally embarrassing. That shame also spills into those buying into that ridiculous narrative.

Other data (ordinance burn rate) is allegedly accurate and a mildly bad piece of intel to leak. Not ideal but not end of world by any stretch.
 
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“The leaked documents claim that Russia has sustained troop losses ranging from 16,000 to 17,500 while Ukrainian losses amount to as many as 71,500 – a staggering differential that stands at odds with the triumphalist narrative projected by Kiev. They are dated March 1 2023 and appear to be part of an ongoing briefing effort to analyze the war’s progress and plan a Ukrainian counteroffensive. “


WW3 has never been closer
The entire thing has been such a huge scam. You have to have such a low IQ to believe Ukraine ever had a shot at stopping Russia or that the American government ever believed the money being sent there was going to amount to anything other than propping up a corrupt government and funneling money back to the big war machine. What an absolute embarrassment

Wait... what?

Flap you've kinda been progressively more entrenched into the right wing talking points but.. what on earth is all this about?

The US has spent a tiny fraction of what we spent in GWOT. No Americans are dying. A chunk of our "cost" is in equipment that was about to be scrapped/mothballed (ie MRAPs and old Abrahams.

Javelins and HIMAARS have real costs but to what real loss? Still not our best stuff and ROI includes exposing Russias gear as trash.

AND... Ukraine is actually winning

Russia is already backing resources out of Crimea and fortifying.... indicating an "Ex GF scorched earth" exit. They're trotting out untrained folks with trash gear. For ****s sake, Russia has mobilized half a million troops and has gained a postage stamp per person. If that.

This is a complete and total pantsing of Putin et al.

This take is so horribly off base I'm confused how it could come from such a sharp dude.

GB help me understand how you're seeing what you're seeing
COVID and social media have done some real serious damage to this country in hindsight. Trying to keep it apolitical. It feels like there are fringe groups on both sides that have gone from extremists that people kind of ignored to adding a lot of supporters who can’t been talked off ledges anymore. It’s kind of scary for the future because it doesn’t seem like a solvable problem where people will come to their senses and find middle ground. This guy feels like a completely different poster the past couple years. Just bizarre.
 
“The leaked documents claim that Russia has sustained troop losses ranging from 16,000 to 17,500 while Ukrainian losses amount to as many as 71,500 – a staggering differential that stands at odds with the triumphalist narrative projected by Kiev. They are dated March 1 2023 and appear to be part of an ongoing briefing effort to analyze the war’s progress and plan a Ukrainian counteroffensive. “


WW3 has never been closer
thought i read somewhere that they were altered prior to be leaking
Yes, there was speculation that the Russians gained them and then released them because of several areas where it did appear the documents were altered to favor the Russians.
I would think that whomever released them may have done it themselves as they clearly are sympathetic to the Russians for whatever reason.
 
“The leaked documents claim that Russia has sustained troop losses ranging from 16,000 to 17,500 while Ukrainian losses amount to as many as 71,500 – a staggering differential that stands at odds with the triumphalist narrative projected by Kiev. They are dated March 1 2023 and appear to be part of an ongoing briefing effort to analyze the war’s progress and plan a Ukrainian counteroffensive. “


WW3 has never been closer
The entire thing has been such a huge scam. You have to have such a low IQ to believe Ukraine ever had a shot at stopping Russia or that the American government ever believed the money being sent there was going to amount to anything other than propping up a corrupt government and funneling money back to the big war machine. What an absolute embarrassment
The amount of damage done to the Russian military is tremendous. Even if you want to start with Ukraine was always doomed (pretty much everyone believed that they were doomed and would have been over run in a matter of weeks.....) The significant degrading of Russia is a strategic win for the US. Russia's military, economy, prestige and diplomatic power are all significantly degraded. The Russian arms export business will be pretty close to eliminated and it is going to be be left with farming and natural resources as almost it's only exports. Further, this has reinvigorated NATO with many of our allies increasing their military spending and added Finland (eventually Sweden as well once Turkey and Hungary get enough out of it) which are huge wins for the alliance. Russia is being reduced to a vassal state of China which is fine as they were already aligned. Essentially this takes Russia as what was seen as a near peer threat (though now they have been exposed as not being any where close to as near as we had thought) to a minor player under the Chinese umbrella. It should allow us to shift our full gaze to China. Even if Ukraine losses (I don't see it losing- Russia can not sustain an offensive. The only good thing for Russia in grinding by inches in Bakhmut is that it's logistics are fixed.) The degradation of an belligerent Russia that will be left unable to threaten others in the area for many years is still a "good" thing enough for US support.
 
“The leaked documents claim that Russia has sustained troop losses ranging from 16,000 to 17,500 while Ukrainian losses amount to as many as 71,500 – a staggering differential that stands at odds with the triumphalist narrative projected by Kiev. They are dated March 1 2023 and appear to be part of an ongoing briefing effort to analyze the war’s progress and plan a Ukrainian counteroffensive. “


WW3 has never been closer
The entire thing has been such a huge scam. You have to have such a low IQ to believe Ukraine ever had a shot at stopping Russia or that the American government ever believed the money being sent there was going to amount to anything other than propping up a corrupt government and funneling money back to the big war machine. What an absolute embarrassment

Wait... what?

Flap you've kinda been progressively more entrenched into the right wing talking points but.. what on earth is all this about?

The US has spent a tiny fraction of what we spent in GWOT. No Americans are dying. A chunk of our "cost" is in equipment that was about to be scrapped/mothballed (ie MRAPs and old Abrahams.

Javelins and HIMAARS have real costs but to what real loss? Still not our best stuff and ROI includes exposing Russias gear as trash.

AND... Ukraine is actually winning

Russia is already backing resources out of Crimea and fortifying.... indicating an "Ex GF scorched earth" exit. They're trotting out untrained folks with trash gear. For ****s sake, Russia has mobilized half a million troops and has gained a postage stamp per person. If that.

This is a complete and total pantsing of Putin et al.

This take is so horribly off base I'm confused how it could come from such a sharp dude.

GB help me understand how you're seeing what you're seeing
COVID and social media have done some real serious damage to this country in hindsight. Trying to keep it apolitical. It feels like there are fringe groups on both sides that have gone from extremists that people kind of ignored to adding a lot of supporters who can’t been talked off ledges anymore. It’s kind of scary for the future because it doesn’t seem like a solvable problem where people will come to their senses and find middle ground. This guy feels like a completely different poster the past couple years. Just bizarre.
Extremist on both sides of the political coin are using the craziness and issues of the last few years to gain influence and power. People are becoming more polarized and more willing to follow. Meanwhile, the Roman Empire continues to fall.
 

"Troops from these ethnic minority regions have made up the bulk of Russian cannon fodder in this war, with one BBC analysis estimating that men from the Muslim-majority region of Dagestan had died at ten times the rate of those from Moscow. Some critics claim this is a direct result of a cynical strategy from Putin: avoiding domestic backlash by having ethnic minorities bear the brunt of the meat grinder. “The Russians won’t actually go and fight themselves,”
 

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