prefontaine
Footballguy
Btw, Russia.....nyet!
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***Official Soccer Discussion Thread*** (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter jpeace121
- Start date
prefontaine
Footballguy
oui
Native
Footballguy
thanks
prefontaine
Footballguy
Hard to tell to me with the low qualify feed but I thought it was a dive. He had played the ball and it was going out regardless and I'm not even sure Given made contact
prefontaine
Footballguy
meh. goal france
Whiplash Inc.
Footballguy
prefontaine
Footballguy
And on the replay, Henry clearly handled it...shame if it ends like this
prefontaine
Footballguy
I don't believe this is the case, is it? I thought road goals don't matter any more and we are only on aggregate in the OT
Whiplash Inc.
Footballguy
It's a general thread about soccer.
Don't see what's arrogant about but if that's how you feel, more power to you.
Native
Footballguy
According to BBC it cant go to penalties now...
prefontaine
Footballguy
Interesting and very cool
Senor Schmutzig
Footballguy
Love that I'm watching the France v. Ireland match while flying from NYC-ATL.
Onboard wifi is awesome!
Onboard wifi is awesome!
prefontaine
Footballguy
Thought it was just me. This kinda sucks...anyone have a link?
prefontaine
Footballguy
travestmockery
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prefontaine
Footballguy
Ted Lange as your Bartender
Footballguy
I don't see your argument as arrogant, but I don't see why anybody would want the toughest possible draw either. You never hear coaches interviewed after the draw is made say "We got the Group of Death, that's exactly what we wanted to happen." That's because in the grand scheme of things, it's completely irrelevant.First, there's too many statistical anomalies in a short tournament like the World Cup to say that the cup winner was the only team worthy to win. You have uneven group strength. You can advance from a group by winning only 1 of 3 matches (see: France in 2006, US in 2002, and many others). Italy won their last two Cups in matches that were technically considered draws. They won on penalty shootouts, which is one step above flipping a coin.It's a general thread about soccer.Don't see what's arrogant about but if that's how you feel, more power to you.
The thing is, none of that matters. History only cares about who wins the Cup, there's no extra credit given for how you win it. In order to win the Cup, do you have to be able to beat all 31 teams on a particular day in a one-off match? Absolutely. But in reality, you only need to play 7 matches, and you don't even need to win all 7, even the final, to be considered the World Champions.
So taking all of that into consideration, why wouldn't everyone (not just the US) want the path of least resistance?
QuizGuy66
Footballguy
France-Ireland should be compelled to have a replay match. In the spirit of promotion of the game (and to soothe FIFA with a large $ amount) the game should be played at Wembley. There is precedent now for FIFA overturning a result based on a referee's error. It comes from the 2006 World Cup Qualifiers. It's actually kind of comical and classic FIFA.
Here's the Article, but I'll also summarize below.
Uzbekistan faced Bahrain in a 2-leg Asian playoff for the right to meet Australia in another 2-leg playoff to determine a berth in the 2006 World Cup Finals.
Uzbekistan won the first leg, at home 1-0. However, a technical error cost the Uzbeks a chance at a penalty kick. They protested to FIFA.
FIFA agreed that the referee had made a technical error, therefore the ENTIRE result was thrown out (gotta love FIFA).
Naturally Uzbekistan tied the replay of the game 1-1 and ended up losing out on away goals after the Bahrainis held them to a 0-0 draw in the 2nd leg.
My point is that a result has been overturned after the fact by FIFA after the game is over because of a mistake by the referee. While overturning this result would be a bit of an expansion on that precedent, it would certainly be the fairest outcome in these circumstances.
With that, I announced by campaign to become President of FIFA
-QG
Here's the Article, but I'll also summarize below.
Uzbekistan faced Bahrain in a 2-leg Asian playoff for the right to meet Australia in another 2-leg playoff to determine a berth in the 2006 World Cup Finals.
Uzbekistan won the first leg, at home 1-0. However, a technical error cost the Uzbeks a chance at a penalty kick. They protested to FIFA.
FIFA agreed that the referee had made a technical error, therefore the ENTIRE result was thrown out (gotta love FIFA).
Naturally Uzbekistan tied the replay of the game 1-1 and ended up losing out on away goals after the Bahrainis held them to a 0-0 draw in the 2nd leg.
My point is that a result has been overturned after the fact by FIFA after the game is over because of a mistake by the referee. While overturning this result would be a bit of an expansion on that precedent, it would certainly be the fairest outcome in these circumstances.
With that, I announced by campaign to become President of FIFA
-QG
Whiplash Inc.
Footballguy
More proof we need some sort of replay system for referees. Just like in the NFL.
Certainly for big games like this.
Certainly for big games like this.
Bonzai
Footballguy
Completely. Just not a fun game to watch.Didn't even have the chance to get a feel for the guys the US is developing (esp Castillo). All around bummer.
JMon348
Footballguy
Really sucks, its been 20 years since we have been so a lot of our great players will never get a chance to play on that stage.Feel like crap right now.Algeria through - sorry JMon
QuizGuy66
Footballguy
Giantseasonticketholder
Whammy
Try Flomax.I can't believe they let that goal through. Ireland deserves a rematch.
Steve Tasker
Footballguy
Thierry>you're still my favorite player ever, but that was pretty weak 
The Z Machine
Footballguy
Initially I was going for URU, but then I switched to CRC after the first leg and the probability that the US would end up w/ a Group of Death as a result.That's what I get for vacillating.
That would be very tough for any ref to see. Tough luck for Eire.
scoobygang
Footballguy
I don't see how Uruguay makes a group of death more likely. They mentioned redoing the draw if Costa Rica won. They weren't going into pot 3. Mexico probably would. Other than Algeria, who's a better Pot 3 matchup for the US than Uruguay? Cameroon, Ivory Coast, and Ghana are all stacked with world class players. Nigeria is stacked with great athletes and is a perennial youth team power. Paraguay and Chile were significantly better than Argentina in qualifying. I'm not even sure what a "Group of Death" would look like this year. Considering how strong Pot 3 is and that Japan, South Korea, Australia, the US, and Mexico are all dangerous in Pot 4, there are going to be multiple Groups of Death. Some of those #1 seeds are going to be really unlucky.
Mjolnirs
Footballguy
I agree with your first paragraph and understand what you mean, but I don't see hoping for the toughest group possible.
I don't think his post is arrogant, just a different perspective from a different history.
CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
What do you consider arrogant about this guy stating his opinion as a dutch fan? Personally, I think the whole "Group of Death" issue is overrated. Every group is tough and every country complains about how bad its draw is. It is a certainty that the US will need multiple upset results to advance to the knock out round, no matter what happens with the draw. Every tournament has one or two surprise teams that make the quarters and one or two surprise teams that are expected to do well but don't make it out of the group stage. My hope for the draw is that we get to see some great teams - like four years ago when we saw the US play eventual champion Italy to a very tough draw. I would honestly rather draw Holland than Slovakia, and rather see the US play Nigeria than Algeria.
-QG
QuizGuy66
Footballguy
Interesting Speculative Seeding
I think this actually is pretty much how it will break down. My hunch is that since last time they put CONCACAF and ASIA into the same bucket, they will opt to rotate this time since the numbers allow for it. Also, by splitting the African and South American teams, it allows for more possiblities in terms of the groups teams can land in.
With that, the following agrees with the seeds listed in the post, which uses the '06 formula. Since it seems to be in line with what I suspect FIFA's priorities would be, I think this seems plausible. People will seriously complain about France getting a seed, but it'll happen for sure.
Pot A: South Africa, Argentina, Brazil, Italy, Germany, France, England, Spain
Pot B: Denmark, Greece, Holland, Portugal, Serbia, Slovakia, Slovenia, Switzerland
Pot C: Honduras, United States, Mexico, Algeria, Cameroon, Cote D'Ivoire, Ghana, Nigeria
Pot D: New Zealand, Australia, Japan, South Korea, North Korea, Chile, Paraguay, Uruguay
Looked at another way, with South Africa guaranteed a seed, and the math of the other confeds the way things fall FIFA has one of two choices:
1) Guarantee a CONCACAF team in South Africa's group (US, Mexico, or Honduras)
or
2) Guarantee a non-seed South American team in South Africa's group (Chile, Paraguay, or Uruguay).
FIFA, IMO, would prefer option A. The CONCACAF teams, rightly or wrongly, will be perceived as the weaker trio and thus would give the hosts a better chance of getting out of the group stage, something FIFA would desire. Oddly enough, from a global TV standpoint, putting the US or Mexico with the hosts would be appealing as it would presumably enhance the chance of these teams advancing which are more attractive markets for FIFA.
Of course part of the fun is that you could get a comically weak first round group of:
South Africa, Honduras, North Korea, Slovenia
and a comically hard first round group of:
Spain, Holland, USA, Paraguay (acutally the way the draw usually goes for us, you can probably book this)
So there ya go, you heard it here first
-QG
I think this actually is pretty much how it will break down. My hunch is that since last time they put CONCACAF and ASIA into the same bucket, they will opt to rotate this time since the numbers allow for it. Also, by splitting the African and South American teams, it allows for more possiblities in terms of the groups teams can land in.
With that, the following agrees with the seeds listed in the post, which uses the '06 formula. Since it seems to be in line with what I suspect FIFA's priorities would be, I think this seems plausible. People will seriously complain about France getting a seed, but it'll happen for sure.
Pot A: South Africa, Argentina, Brazil, Italy, Germany, France, England, Spain
Pot B: Denmark, Greece, Holland, Portugal, Serbia, Slovakia, Slovenia, Switzerland
Pot C: Honduras, United States, Mexico, Algeria, Cameroon, Cote D'Ivoire, Ghana, Nigeria
Pot D: New Zealand, Australia, Japan, South Korea, North Korea, Chile, Paraguay, Uruguay
Looked at another way, with South Africa guaranteed a seed, and the math of the other confeds the way things fall FIFA has one of two choices:
1) Guarantee a CONCACAF team in South Africa's group (US, Mexico, or Honduras)
or
2) Guarantee a non-seed South American team in South Africa's group (Chile, Paraguay, or Uruguay).
FIFA, IMO, would prefer option A. The CONCACAF teams, rightly or wrongly, will be perceived as the weaker trio and thus would give the hosts a better chance of getting out of the group stage, something FIFA would desire. Oddly enough, from a global TV standpoint, putting the US or Mexico with the hosts would be appealing as it would presumably enhance the chance of these teams advancing which are more attractive markets for FIFA.
Of course part of the fun is that you could get a comically weak first round group of:
South Africa, Honduras, North Korea, Slovenia
and a comically hard first round group of:
Spain, Holland, USA, Paraguay (acutally the way the draw usually goes for us, you can probably book this)
So there ya go, you heard it here first
-QG
prefontaine
Footballguy
Don't agree here. The sideline official should be running to the line to make sure the ball does not cross. There is really no way you can't see this as the ball would have crossed the touchline without the hand ball that occurred several feet from his body. Henry was by himself so there should be little to no interfence unless you think Given standing there blocked his view. Frankly, I think this has to be one of the easiest calls in the box one can make given how often there is poor line of site.
prefontaine
Footballguy
You guys are right that the last post isn't. But I was really working off of the 4 before that. But I don't disagree that I may have been a bit harsh. It just gets a little annoying to keep harping on American fans for worrying about the draw. It's simply huge to us and that has to be obvious.
magichat
Footballguy
Not really any different to a million bad offside or penalty calls or dives leading to ####ty goals, but Thierry Henry proved for all time what class he truly has. Pretty hard for this Irishman to take though.
The French of course reminding the world once again why they are so loved. (Domenech "Let me enjoy this time..")
The French of course reminding the world once again why they are so loved. (Domenech "Let me enjoy this time..")
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