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***Official Soccer Discussion Thread*** (14 Viewers)

He'll probably never make the first team, but Arsenal have just signed Romanian youngster Vlad Dragomir. Just in case, I suppose, UEFA passes a rule where you have to have at least one player who sounds like a character on Game of Thrones.

 
CletiusMaximus said:
Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
roadkill1292 said:
Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
The joke is that Liverpool paid 54 million pounds for him and got 6 league goals out of it.

On his day, Carroll looks unplayable, but he's always injured or working his way back into form.
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That helps. Seems to happen a lot more often in big time futbol than in American sports, guys failing to duplicate earlier performances when they change teams. The relationship with the other 10 guys wearing the same jersey must be more delicately balanced.Osvaldo, snicker.
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Carroll was young. He probably had less than 15 total PL goals when that transfer took place. Liverpool had to sell Torres and he was on a hot tear for Newcastle. In retrospect, it was kind of insane to pay that much for such an unproven player. Torres, at least, had a record of EPL success. Of course, he might have been a bigger bust.
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Somewhat interestingly, I think Carrol's fee is still the second highest paid for an English player, with Rio's transfer to United still top even after a dozen or more years have passed. I think Beckham to Madrid is third. Perhaps all will shift down a peg if Sterling moves this summer.
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I guess Carroll was 35 million pounds. Was Torres 54 million? My memory blows.

 
So people who'd heard of Firmino before last week... can he play? The Brazil clips looked good, mostly because he was in a side that seemed to have most of the first-choice starters. But I can't claim to know anything about the guy.

 
wdcrob said:
So people who'd heard of Firmino before last week... can he play? The Brazil clips looked good, mostly because he was in a side that seemed to have most of the first-choice starters. But I can't claim to know anything about the guy.
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He's good, but quite an overpay IMO.

 
Slapdash said:
wdcrob said:
So people who'd heard of Firmino before last week... can he play? The Brazil clips looked good, mostly because he was in a side that seemed to have most of the first-choice starters. But I can't claim to know anything about the guy.
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He's good, but quite an overpay IMO.
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I think Liverpool was in a situation where they had to 'overpay' get a guy they valued after trying to budget shop last year at forward. An extra few million to fill a desperate need and maybe help convince other transfer targets you're a serious player could end up being worth it in the end. Call it the Jason Werth axiom.

 
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Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
CletiusMaximus said:
Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
roadkill1292 said:
Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
The joke is that Liverpool paid 54 million pounds for him and got 6 league goals out of it.

On his day, Carroll looks unplayable, but he's always injured or working his way back into form.
Click to expand...
That helps. Seems to happen a lot more often in big time futbol than in American sports, guys failing to duplicate earlier performances when they change teams. The relationship with the other 10 guys wearing the same jersey must be more delicately balanced.Osvaldo, snicker.
Click to expand...
Carroll was young. He probably had less than 15 total PL goals when that transfer took place. Liverpool had to sell Torres and he was on a hot tear for Newcastle. In retrospect, it was kind of insane to pay that much for such an unproven player. Torres, at least, had a record of EPL success. Of course, he might have been a bigger bust.
Click to expand...
Somewhat interestingly, I think Carrol's fee is still the second highest paid for an English player, with Rio's transfer to United still top even after a dozen or more years have passed. I think Beckham to Madrid is third. Perhaps all will shift down a peg if Sterling moves this summer.
Click to expand...
I guess Carroll was 35 million pounds. Was Torres 54 million? My memory blows.
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I had to look it up. Carroll was 41m Euros, Torres was 58m Euros.

Torres' transfer to Chelsea is the highest fee ever paid for a Spanish player. His transfer to LFC is the sixth highest. The second most expensive transfer of a Spanish player in history is Gaizka Mendieta to Lazio in 2002 for 48m Euro, probably an even worse disaster than Torres or Carroll under the circumstances.

 
wdcrob said:
So people who'd heard of Firmino before last week... can he play? The Brazil clips looked good, mostly because he was in a side that seemed to have most of the first-choice starters. But I can't claim to know anything about the guy.
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He was very, very good in 2013/14 for Hoffenheim. 16 goals and 12 assists. Last year, he had 7 goals and 10 assists. He's a very good dribbler. Apparently only Hazard and Messi had more successful take-ons. The 16 goals seems like a bit of an outlier, but Hazard seems like a pretty fair upside comp just looking at the numbers. One big difference, from what I can see in Hoffenheim clips, is that Firmino appears to play through the middle a lot more. If LFC were looking for a Sterling replacement, he's a good choice. Don't think he really solves their biggest problem which is lack of goals unless Sturridge gets hamstring replacements, though.

 
Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
wdcrob said:
So people who'd heard of Firmino before last week... can he play? The Brazil clips looked good, mostly because he was in a side that seemed to have most of the first-choice starters. But I can't claim to know anything about the guy.
Click to expand...
He was very, very good in 2013/14 for Hoffenheim. 16 goals and 12 assists. Last year, he had 7 goals and 10 assists. He's a very good dribbler. Apparently only Hazard and Messi had more successful take-ons. The 16 goals seems like a bit of an outlier, but Hazard seems like a pretty fair upside comp just looking at the numbers. One big difference, from what I can see in Hoffenheim clips, is that Firmino appears to play through the middle a lot more. If LFC were looking for a Sterling replacement, he's a good choice. Don't think he really solves their biggest problem which is lack of goals unless Sturridge gets hamstring replacements, though.
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I thought he was more of a 10, a player who might challenge for Oscar's position for Brazil or Coutinho for LFC. From what I've seen in the Copa, he seems to be playing a more forward role this summer, which might be of necessity more than anything.

 
Yeah... something like Coutinho, Firmino and, uh, someone else might be a nice front three from the sound of things.

 
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Here's the 2013/14 Scout Nation video for Firmino. These make everyone look like Pele, but you can kind of see where I'm coming from. He tends to create off the dribble or run in behind the back four. Obviously, what we mean by a #10 changes with the times, but I don't see him as a guy who floats into space between the lines and distributes from there.

 
He's a Sterling replacement with a strong leg. I imagine he gives up some pace, but I think he more than makes up for it with his scoring ability, which I don't feel Sterling really has. Some really impressive stats being thrown around the internet for the guy, mostly being thrown around by Liverpool fans. But still, he looks really good. Two starting forwards for Brazil is a good way to start.

I think he could fill in at striker if needed, but it looks as if Liverpool is still looking for another striker. Carlos Bacca being the biggest rumor I've seen, and supposedly Ian Ayre is still in Chile trying to close another deal.

 
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Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
Here's the 2013/14 Scout Nation video for Firmino. These make everyone look like Pele, but you can kind of see where I'm coming from. He tends to create off the dribble or run in behind the back four. Obviously, what we mean by a #10 changes with the times, but I don't see him as a guy who floats into space between the lines and distributes from there.
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Seems like a good fit for an attacking, up-tempo offense. I know it's not a tangible "ability", but in those clips he looks really "hungry" and fiery. I think that is a quality missing in Liverpool last year, and one that I think they lost with Suarez. He obviously is no Suarez, but has that passion that I think this team needs.

 
not the only american there, apparently... research dug up Stephen McCarthy (d) and the mighty canadian Charlie Trafford (leading scorer). play in front of 5k capacity (looks sim to my college stadium, minus the ice floes ringing the city.

Adu has a mountain to climb... to get time with a Finnish first team. He can't play reserve squad here in the US? wtf is he doing in Finland? can't exactly be banking muy duccats playing over there. I wonder if they have him working part time at the owner's house, like as a man-servant.... to make ends meet.

 
El Floppo said:
not the only american there, apparently... research dug up Stephen McCarthy (d) and the mighty canadian Charlie Trafford (leading scorer). play in front of 5k capacity (looks sim to my college stadium, minus the ice floes ringing the city.

Adu has a mountain to climb... to get time with a Finnish first team. He can't play reserve squad here in the US? wtf is he doing in Finland? can't exactly be banking muy duccats playing over there. I wonder if they have him working part time at the owner's house, like as a man-servant.... to make ends meet.
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I don't think any team here would touch him and foreign teams keep signing and dropping him...

Wage demands, stigma, practice field work, entitlement? Who knows the reason.

I feel bad for the guy too. I dont believe its entirely his fault but to be put under that media pressure as the American Pele and Savior, drafted to a pro league and given $1M with endorsements, all at age 14? Put him in a no win situation

 
Chile vs. Uruguay tonight in Copa America; host nation against defending champs. Uruguay has looked invigorated & surprisingly imaginative (at times), I really like Lodero, pulling the strings as trequartista/CAM...Godin leading the back line against the formidable Chilean front. It should be a good one.

 
Italy and England were knocked out of the U21 Euro Championship today. Group winners Denmark and Portugal will play runners up Sweden and Germany on Saturday, final on June 30.

Interesting side note - The Germany side that beat England 4-0 in the 2009 U21 Euro final featured such future stars as Neuer, Oezil, Boeteng, Hoewedes, Hummels, Khedira and, starting at RM, Fabian Johnson!

 
CletiusMaximus said:
Italy and England were knocked out of the U21 Euro Championship today. Group winners Denmark and Portugal will play runners up Sweden and Germany on Saturday, final on June 30.

Interesting side note - The Germany side that beat England 4-0 in the 2009 U21 Euro final featured such future stars as Neuer, Oezil, Boeteng, Hoewedes, Hummels, Khedira and, starting at RM, Fabian Johnson!
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The Azzurini beat England 3-1 but lost out when Sweden scored an 89th min. equalizer vs. Portugal...its a shame, they had a very good squad, with many starters also starting in Serie A. Starting Italian youth in Serie A is a rarity, so maybe a promising precursor...
 
Chile leads the tournament with 10 goals. Almost everyone else is tied for second with 4. That is pretty crazy.

Sanchez hasn't had much of the ball yet. He needs to start driving this game. He has looked worthy of top 5 player in the world talk.

 
Sebowski said:
Chile leads the tournament with 10 goals. Almost everyone else is tied for second with 4. That is pretty crazy.

Sanchez hasn't had much of the ball yet. He needs to start driving this game. He has looked worthy of top 5 player in the world talk.
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Valdivia has looked to be Chile's most influential player, with Sanchez just waiting in the wing(s), so to speak. I cant believe Arsenal got him that cheap. You just wait for Sanchez to happen...
 
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