Owens Not Participating (1 Viewer)

[fatness]

From the Star-Telegram:

Cowboys want more show from T.O.

By CLARENCE E. HILL JR.

Star-Telegram Staff Writer

IRVING - Is controversial receiver Terrell Owens getting off on the right foot in Dallas?

Several sources have noted that Owens has not been a regular participant in Cowboys coach Bill Parcells' off-season program.

His initial absences were understood because of a prior commitment, but Owens in the past has preferred to work with his own trainer.

Owens, who signed a three-year, $25 million contract with the Cowboys in March, was present at a Thursday workout.

His publicist, Kim Etheredge, said, "He is here when he is required to be here just like every other player on the team" and added that Parcells has expressed no concern about Owens' regimen.

The Cowboys are not concerned about Owens' conditioning. He always has stayed in good shape and his training methods have served him well.

However, Parcells' feelings on the subject are clear. The "voluntary" program requires players to work out four times a week and get in 40 workouts during the off-season.

"To [Parcells], it's about chemistry," a source said. "He wants you here."

 

[Cunning Linguist]

To does what he wants. It has served him well to this point. Why change that?

Besides, they are voluntary.

 

[Sinrman]

From the Star-Telegram:

Cowboys want more show from T.O.

By CLARENCE E. HILL JR.

Star-Telegram Staff Writer

IRVING - Is controversial receiver Terrell Owens getting off on the right foot in Dallas?

Several sources have noted that Owens has not been a regular participant in Cowboys coach Bill Parcells' off-season program.

His initial absences were understood because of a prior commitment, but Owens in the past has preferred to work with his own trainer.

Owens, who signed a three-year, $25 million contract with the Cowboys in March, was present at a Thursday workout.

His publicist, Kim Etheredge, said, "He is here when he is required to be here just like every other player on the team" and added that Parcells has expressed no concern about Owens' regimen.

The Cowboys are not concerned about Owens' conditioning. He always has stayed in good shape and his training methods have served him well.

However, Parcells' feelings on the subject are clear. The "voluntary" program requires players to work out four times a week and get in 40 workouts during the off-season.

"To [Parcells], it's about chemistry," a source said. "He wants you here."

Hasn't he always done this in the past? Just curious...But yeah, if it's voluntary, it's exactly that -- VOLUNTARY. I'm sure there are other players that aren't, either. Just not big names, and drama queens like TO.

 

[BlueOnion]

These incidents were expected, which is the foundation of the case made by others, "Parcells can handle T.O.". We'll see how good Parcells is when it comes to handle diverse player personalities.

Again, I don't expect there to be an boat-rocking in year one. Parcells will say what is on his mind, T.O. will say what is on his mind and the two parties will go from there. The thing about T.O. is he is grading and this is grade one. It is the compilation of incidents that make T.O. difficult.

What I really want to know is if Vanderjagt will publically call out T.O.

 

[BigRed]

We'll see how good Parcells is when it comes to handle diverse player personalities.

Remember, diversity is good. Always. GB another Owens thread

 

[Texasmouth]

This is a non story. Bledsoe hasn't been there either. He is a caddy in some golf tourny. These guys are veterans, this is more for the younger players. I am sure Owens will show up ready to play when the mandatory workouts start.

These workouts aren't like team workouts, they are individual workouts where players come into the facility and workout, I am sure TO is taking care of TO like usual.

 

[ChampBailey24]

TO has its own program and obviously it's a good one so I don't see why'd he go to the Cowboys' program.

 

[Joe Bryant]

TO showing up in great shape is a given. Parcells knows this.

I wouldn't read anything at all into this.

If I'm Parcells, I'd send all my guys to workout with Owens.

J

 

[Gigantomachia]

If I'm Parcells, I'd send all my guys to workout with Owens.

J

 

[Bri]

These incidents were expected, which is the foundation of the case made by others, "Parcells can handle T.O.".  We'll see how good Parcells is when it comes to handle diverse player personalities.

Again, I don't expect there to be an boat-rocking in year one.  Parcells will say what is on his mind, T.O. will say what is on his mind and the two parties will go from there.  The thing about T.O. is he is grading and this is grade one.  It is the compilation of incidents that make T.O. difficult.

What I really want to know is if Vanderjagt will publically call out T.O.

Parcells has had his share with Meshawn and LT.I thought I just read that he attended the ones he was required to but didn't attend the other voluntary ones.

I saw his publicist spoke not him. BP is very particular about people speaking to the press and apparently this big mouth obliged. Similarly if BP has his way, you'll never know what Vandy thinks. In previous interviews, TO has been kind(far kinder than Bills fans here) when talking about Bledsoe.

He's following BPs system as far as I can tell, granted there's not much to go on yet.

 

[Bevo]

If I'm Parcells, I'd send all my guys to workout with Owens.

J

I don't know that I would go quite THAT far, but I would sure wish that all of my players showed up for training camp in as good of condition as TO. Non-story.

 

[CalBear]

To does what he wants. It has served him well to this point. Why change that?

Really, getting thrown off of two teams and suspended has served him well?There is more to being a member of a football team than running and catching the ball.

 

[slayer666]

Chalk this story up to the lull between the end of the big free agency signings and the NFL draft.

 

[Fla\/\/ed]

To does what he wants. It has served him well to this point.

 

[BassNBrew]

TO showing up in great shape is a given. Parcells knows this.

I wouldn't read anything at all into this.

If I'm Parcells, I'd send all my guys to workout with Owens.

J

That's exactly the point and the problem with TO. A team player would show up and help the rest of his teammates achieve a similair peak condition. That could be the difference between a ring and whining about your QB puking on the field.

 

[Texasmouth]

TO showing up in great shape is a given. Parcells knows this.

I wouldn't read anything at all into this.

If I'm Parcells, I'd send all my guys to workout with Owens.

J

That's exactly the point and the problem with TO. A team player would show up and help the rest of his teammates achieve a similair peak condition. That could be the difference between a ring and whining about your QB puking on the field.

Wrong. There are so many people who aren't showing up this that it isn't funny. Like I stated earlier, Bledsoe isn't there either. It is only a story because it is T.O.

 

[CalBear]

Wrong. There are so many people who aren't showing up this that it isn't funny. Like I stated earlier, Bledsoe isn't there either. It is only a story because it is T.O.

You're right that it's only a story because it is TO. Bledsoe isn't someone who has to get acquainted with a whole new team and convince them that he's going to be helping them out, rather than acting like a prima donna and slagging them in the press.

 

[Texasmouth]

Wrong. There are so many people who aren't showing up this that it isn't funny. Like I stated earlier, Bledsoe isn't there either. It is only a story because it is T.O.

You're right that it's only a story because it is TO. Bledsoe isn't someone who has to get acquainted with a whole new team and convince them that he's going to be helping them out, rather than acting like a prima donna and slagging them in the press.

No but he is a veteran and the leader of this team, if this was so important he would be there making a statement that it is important.

 

[Bankerguy]

Typical BS type of story from the "Mediots".

==================================

This would contradict the first story.

Cowboys | Terrell Owens in camp

Thu, 13 Apr 2006 18:22:10 -0700

Mickey Spagnola, of DallasCowboys.com, reports Dallas Cowboys WR Terrell Owens was at Cowboys camp working out in the weight room and was scheduled for a throwing session with QB Drew Bledsoe in the afternoon Thursday, April 13.

 

[Texasmouth]

Typical BS type of story from the "Mediots".

==================================

This would contradict the first story.

Cowboys | Terrell Owens in camp

Thu, 13 Apr 2006 18:22:10 -0700

Mickey Spagnola, of DallasCowboys.com, reports Dallas Cowboys WR Terrell Owens was at Cowboys camp working out in the weight room and was scheduled for a throwing session with QB Drew Bledsoe in the afternoon Thursday, April 13.

Basically the workouts he is supposidly missing are voluntary workouts where the players basically show up when they want and do their workout. They have a certain amount of time to do a certain amount of workouts. He isn't behind schedule anyway.

 

[glock]

Typical BS type of story from the "Mediots".

==================================

This would contradict the first story.

Cowboys | Terrell Owens in camp

Thu, 13 Apr 2006 18:22:10 -0700

Mickey Spagnola, of DallasCowboys.com, reports Dallas Cowboys WR Terrell Owens was at Cowboys camp working out in the weight room and was scheduled for a throwing session with QB Drew Bledsoe in the afternoon Thursday, April 13.

Basically the workouts he is supposidly missing are voluntary workouts where the players basically show up when they want and do their workout. They have a certain amount of time to do a certain amount of workouts. He isn't behind schedule anyway.

 

[BlueOnion]

T.O., the problem, is a compilation of little things. T.O. did not 'step over' some line in San Francisco or in Philly; T.O. just graded on his teams one little piece at a time. And again, this really doesn't make T.O. that different from other superstars. What does make T.O. unique is that he doesn't accept responsibility for his little pieces of actions that accumulate over time.

Arbitrarily speaking, this is just piece [1/15], 14 little pieces to go. Once T.O. gets to [15/15], it will be the same thing we have seen in San Francisco and Philladelphia.

Dallas - "We have had enough"

T.O. - "What did I do? I didn't show up for 1 voluntary workout? PUH-leeze, I love me for me!"

 

[ruelvis]

TO showing up in great shape is a given. Parcells knows this.

I wouldn't read anything at all into this.

If I'm Parcells, I'd send all my guys to workout with Owens.

J

 

[Texasmouth]

T.O., the problem, is a compilation of little things. T.O. did not 'step over' some line in San Francisco or in Philly; T.O. just graded on his teams one little piece at a time. And again, this really doesn't make T.O. that different from other superstars. What does make T.O. unique is that he doesn't accept responsibility for his little pieces of actions that accumulate over time.

Arbitrarily speaking, this is just piece [1/15], 14 little pieces to go. Once T.O. gets to [15/15], it will be the same thing we have seen in San Francisco and Philladelphia.

Dallas - "We have had enough"

T.O. - "What did I do? I didn't show up for 1 voluntary workout? PUH-leeze, I love me for me!"

As long as he produces on the field for one season, I am ok with the aftermath.

 

[trader jake]

i agree with the "it's only a story because it's TO" camp

is ANYONE concerned that TO won't be in shape? even the most active TO bashers will admit that the guy is a workout machine

as long as every player attends minicamps (TO, bledsoe, etc) there isn't a real story here

 

[fatness]

Followup from Dallascowboys.com

Mike Pridgen, Washington D.C.: I've heard a lot of talk about Terrell Owens lately, negative talk. I've read how Bill Parcells didn't want T.O. I've also read how T.O. is not going to the voluntary workouts and people are making a big deal out of this. I've read things from sources, but it's all speculation. I won't believe it until I read about it on or hear it from someone on here. Can you shed some light into all of the T.O. accusations as of late?

Mickey: Here is my understanding of the workout situation with Owens. He showed up the first day of the team workouts after he signed, but over the next couple of weeks, he was not attending regularly, for whatever reason, and my understanding again is that he had some previous commitments before he signed with the Cowboys. I can tell you this: He was there working out with the team on Thursday. Guys are asked to get in 40 workouts - four a week - and if they do, then they get a workout stipend. Not bad, eh, getting a little chump change for working out, which you should be doing anyway? If you miss, you can make them up at some point over the spring and summer.

John Burgess, Sedan, N.M.: Can you give us your expert insight to how well T.O. is fitting in to the off-season workouts, such as is Drew Bledsoe throwing to him and his rapport with those that are at off-season conditioning?

Mickey: I can tell you this: Bledsoe's dad, on a local Dallas TV morning show, being interviewed for a parenting seminar he was giving, said Drew and T.O. were scheduled to have their first throwing session on Thursday. As for his rapport with teammates, if he hadn't been attending the off-season workouts regularly, I'd imagine there wasn't much. But remember this. Conditioning has never been Owens' problem.

Doesn't sound like a big deal.

 

[CA_7]

There is only one person to blame for the large bullseye on TO's back....

 

[Ditkaless Wonders]

Owens' conditioning is not the issue. That he will be in great condition is a given. The issue is his respect for Parcells' program, wants, and philosophies. Is this a little thing, yes, and that is the point. Owens can't even give Parcells this little thing. Knowing that he is under a microscope he has already let an issue arise. Little or no this is indicitive of a man placing himself above his team, which is Owens' ongoing self destructive pattern.

 

[BlueOnion]

T.O., the problem, is a compilation of little things.  T.O. did not 'step over' some line in San Francisco or in Philly; T.O. just graded on his teams one little piece at a time.  And again, this really doesn't make T.O. that different from other superstars.  What does make T.O. unique is that he doesn't accept responsibility for his little pieces of actions that accumulate over time.

Arbitrarily speaking, this is just piece [1/15], 14 little pieces to go.  Once T.O. gets to [15/15], it will be the same thing we have seen in San Francisco and Philladelphia.

Dallas - "We have had enough"

T.O. - "What did I do?  I didn't show up for 1 voluntary workout?  PUH-leeze, I love me for me!"

There is a serious misconception of patience, tolerance and action here (see Antonio Bryant)...while the media would definitely like to stick TO strictly between Parcells butthairs, it will not happen. A Parcells regime operates far differently from an Andy Reid regime...call it experience, patience, whatever...call it what you will. But make no mistake, Owens is on this team with Parcells blessing. When there is a problem, it will be taken care of inhouse...not within the media, ala Philly's proactive commentary on players such as Duce Staley, Hugh Douglas and TO.It is what it is...

Let me get this straight, T.O. has always gone to the media when we has a complaint about a team. Now when he has a complaint, you expect him to run it by Parcells or Jerry Jones first?You cannot be that blind.

 

[Banger]

non-story

 

[BigJim®]

To does what he wants. It has served him well to this point.

It has? TO has never been an integrated member of teams and generally pulls BS like this so that half the locker room can chant "free TO" in support while the other half questions his absence and why he should be different than the rest of the team. I don't see anything in his past as "serving him right." Some things transcend numeric performance. Like everyone already knows, T.O. does not and will never truly 'get it' and it wouldn;t surprise me one bit if he's setting up a confrontation already.

 

[BlueOnion]

Did I say anything about Jerry Jones in my post? I don't believe I did.

Parcells is not going to get into a pissing match within the media involving his players...unlike Reid and Philadelphia who did just that with Staley, Douglas and Owens.

You make it sound like Parcells has complete autonomy over who goes to the media and who doesn't. This is what I am disputing.Maybe we should back up to square one; tell me in your own words, what you think Parcells is going to do when the following situation comes up:

T.O. goes to the media to piss and moan about Parcells. T.O. also refusses to discuss things privately with Parcells instead of the through the media? T.O. continues to go through the media to discuss Parcells.

 

[Sabertooth]

I'd love to see T.O. show up at about 260 lookin like a taller, darker Jermain Wiggins. That would rock.

He is going to show up looking like he's carved out of titanium. No story here.

 

[blkgolf23]

Owens' conditioning is not the issue. That he will be in great condition is a given. The issue is his respect for Parcells' program, wants, and philosophies. Is this a little thing, yes, and that is the point. Owens can't even give Parcells this little thing. Knowing that he is under a microscope he has already let an issue arise. Little or no this is indicitive of a man placing himself above his team, which is Owens' ongoing self destructive pattern.

Where is Bledsoe? This is a non-issue.

 

[BlueOnion]

Owens' conditioning is not the issue.  That he will be in great condition is a given.  The issue is his respect for Parcells' program, wants, and philosophies.  Is this a little thing, yes, and that is the point.  Owens can't even give Parcells this little thing.  Knowing that he is under a microscope he has already let an issue arise.  Little or no this is indicitive of a man placing himself above his team, which is Owens' ongoing self destructive pattern.

Where is Bledsoe? This is a non-issue.

Valid point. Here is my general assumption on it."Bledsoe, where were you during the voluntary workouts?"

"I was doing X, Y and Z. I wanted to be here at the voluntary workouts but I also wanted to do X, Y and Z. I hope my decision didn't bother anyone, but if they did I apologize.

"T.O., where were you during the voluntary workouts?"

"I love me for me. Why don't you mind your own business, because if we look at resumes I am clearly a better player than you and out perform everybody. You should apologize to me for insulting me.



Again, I have never critized T.O. for being a bad guy, I happen to believe the man has no respect for anyone else and until the CBA requires a player to respect his teammates, he sees no reason to change his behavior."

 

[blkgolf23]

Owens' conditioning is not the issue.  That he will be in great condition is a given.  The issue is his respect for Parcells' program, wants, and philosophies.  Is this a little thing, yes, and that is the point.  Owens can't even give Parcells this little thing.  Knowing that he is under a microscope he has already let an issue arise.  Little or no this is indicitive of a man placing himself above his team, which is Owens' ongoing self destructive pattern.

Where is Bledsoe? This is a non-issue.

Valid point. Here is my general assumption on it."Bledsoe, where were you during the voluntary workouts?"

"I was doing X, Y and Z. I wanted to be here at the voluntary workouts but I also wanted to do X, Y and Z. I hope my decision didn't bother anyone, but if they did I apologize.

"T.O., where were you during the voluntary workouts?"

"I love me for me. Why don't you mind your own business, because if we look at resumes I am clearly a better player than you and out perform everybody. You should apologize to me for insulting me.



Again, I have never critized T.O. for being a bad guy, I happen to believe the man has no respect for anyone else and until the CBA requires a player to respect his teammates, he sees no reason to change his behavior."

I won't fight you over if TO is right or not, but the point is these are voluntary workouts. TO only cares about "TO", and I think think he is a butt-hole for all the things he has said and done over the last 4 yrs. But, he isn't required to attend the workout. My point was that Bledsoe never attends any "voluntary workouts", so why is every going off on TO.Give him a change to mess-up we all know he will.

 

[BlueOnion]

Did I say anything about Jerry Jones in my post? I don't believe I did.

Parcells is not going to get into a pissing match within the media involving his players...unlike Reid and Philadelphia who did just that with Staley, Douglas and Owens.

You make it sound like Parcells has complete autonomy over who goes to the media and who doesn't. This is what I am disputing.Maybe we should back up to square one; tell me in your own words, what you think Parcells is going to do when the following situation comes up:

T.O. goes to the media to piss and moan about Parcells. T.O. also refusses to discuss things privately with Parcells instead of the through the media? T.O. continues to go through the media to discuss Parcells.

Parcells track record coaching players in the NFL already answers all of your questions...TO would be committing career suicide to piss and moan about arguably the best coach in NFL history. Won't happen, trust me...This isn't about playing for a Steve Mariucci, this isn't about a poorly handled contract issue with Philadelphia. TO will learn more about the game of Football playing for Bill Parcells than all of his previous coaches combined = RESPECT. There are those within the NFL who Owens has shown respect for...just ask Jerry Rice, Steve Young and George Seifert to name a few.

I love Parcells too, I think he is one of best coaches ever. But the greatest coach in the World cannot control a player who is dead-set on being disruptive.You keep referencing Bill Parcells when trying to calm the fire which is knows as T.O. and I am saying Bill Parcells really has nothing to do with T.O.. T.O. will be T.O. and it is my opinion that until you acknowledge what T.O. is, you are going to continue to be blind to the actual problem.

 

[suchislife]

The story on the surface is a non-issue - player skips "voluntary" workout (debate all you want about how "voluntary" the workouts are). But it is a story because the media chose to make it a story. Yes, its because its T.O. And its a story *because* its T.O.

The "selfish player" label has followed him for years now. Going to Dallas is his (last?) chance to prove he's not such a bad guy. So how does he start? By skipping workouts?? Nice way to prove you're a team guy and eveyone's wrong about ya. True, Bledsoe's not there so why isn't that a story? Maybe because he already knows his team mates. Owens is the one that needs to gel with the team. Owens is the one that has to prove himself.

If the media is making an issue about this, how are they going to react when something bigger comes up? How about after a tough loss? Do we really think TO won't throw someone under the bus? Maybe its the O-lines fault for not giving Drew enough time to throw? Coach has to learn who the playmaker is?

Hmmmm...what are the odds?

 

[BlueOnion]

The story on the surface is a non-issue - player skips "voluntary" workout (debate all you want about how "voluntary" the workouts are). But it is a story because the media chose to make it a story. Yes, its because its T.O. And its a story *because* its T.O.

The "selfish player" label has followed him for years now. Going to Dallas is his (last?) chance to prove he's not such a bad guy. So how does he start? By skipping workouts?? Nice way to prove you're a team guy and eveyone's wrong about ya. True, Bledsoe's not there so why isn't that a story? Maybe because he already knows his team mates. Owens is the one that needs to gel with the team. Owens is the one that has to prove himself.

If the media is making an issue about this, how are they going to react when something bigger comes up? How about after a tough loss? Do we really think TO won't throw someone under the bus? Maybe its the O-lines fault for not giving Drew enough time to throw? Coach has to learn who the playmaker is?

Hmmmm...what are the odds?

Interesting scope here, really made me think.Possibly those who are defending T.O. in this situation have a genuine fear that their is limit to what Parcells will accept and that T.O. could really come close to pushing this line.

 

[Joe Bryant]

This is just like Shockey and Coughlin. It's a big deal and we all talk about it mainly because we don't have a lot to talk about but as soon as he shows up in great shape, it's over.

J

 

[zoonation]

This is just like Shockey and Coughlin. It's a big deal and we all talk about it mainly because we don't have a lot to talk about but as soon as he shows up in great shape, it's over.

J

Agreed...nothing to see here. TO will be in the best shape of anyone at camp when he shows up, and the only thing Dallas fans should worry about is how his relationship with Bledsoe develops over the course of the off-season. IIRC, TO and McNabb were spending all of their time together feeling each other out in the first off-season. I imagine it will be the same for TO and Drew.

 

[BlueOnion]

This is just like Shockey and Coughlin. It's a big deal and we all talk about it mainly because we don't have a lot to talk about but as soon as he shows up in great shape, it's over.

J

Joe -Your position here at FBG is comparable to that of Bill Parcells; being open-minded and toleratent of a variety of people who contribute to the whole. I think you are very tolerant of some trolls around here (I fear I walk this line on occasion myself), but you have certainly encountered some FBGers who genuinely just want to create problems for others (or specifically you); and (I assume) you have supported IP Bans of some of these individuals (who most likely deserved it).

But I am genuinely interested in what you think of individuals who genuinely feel being difficult and disruptive is not subject to review when deciding what is and is not for the betterment of the team (or message board) or the whole?

 

[glock]

This is still bouncing around? I thought this b.s. was already squashed when all the other "no shows" like Bledsoe were outed.

 

[BlueOnion]

This is still bouncing around? I thought this b.s. was already squashed when all the other "no shows" like Bledsoe were outed.

Well the media is making a big deal of it, so the scope of the thread has shifted to how much will media-attention will it take for T.O. to blow something up.

 

[Banger]

Typical BS type of story from the "Mediots".

==================================

This would contradict the first story.

Cowboys | Terrell Owens in camp

Thu, 13 Apr 2006 18:22:10 -0700

Mickey Spagnola, of DallasCowboys.com, reports Dallas Cowboys WR Terrell Owens was at Cowboys camp working out in the weight room and was scheduled for a throwing session with QB Drew Bledsoe in the afternoon Thursday, April 13.

Blue, you must have missed this post. I know people love to hate TO but this thread goes far beyond much ado about nothing.....

 

[dickey moe]

After reading this thread yesterday, I had a dream last night involving T.O. and Parcells getting into a spat. Somehow T.O. ended up with the Raiders. Check that, it was a ####### nightmare.

 

[BlueOnion]

Typical BS type of story from the "Mediots". 

==================================

This would contradict the first story.

Cowboys | Terrell Owens in camp

Thu, 13 Apr 2006 18:22:10 -0700

Mickey Spagnola, of DallasCowboys.com, reports Dallas Cowboys WR Terrell Owens was at Cowboys camp working out in the weight room and was scheduled for a throwing session with QB Drew Bledsoe in the afternoon Thursday, April 13.

Blue, you must have missed this post. I know people love to hate TO but this thread goes far beyond much ado about nothing.....

Don't get me wrong, I love T.O.. He is bar-none the best wide receiver in the game and the one wide receiver in the game I would pay big money to watch.I will also acknowledge that I find what T.O. intentionally does outside of the scope of football very entertaining as well, so I cannot wait until he submarines the Cowboys; the question is not 'if', it is 'when'.

I am sure some people want to discredit me because I actually buy into what T.O. is selling, but I I don't know why.

 

[redman]

If I'm Parcells, I'd send all my guys to workout with Owens.

J

Is his driveway big enough?

 

[ruelvis]

I just thought I'd make this thread even longer to keep the heat on that nasty man and away from my son.

signed,

Mrs. McNabb

 

[Joe Bryant]

This is just like Shockey and Coughlin. It's a big deal and we all talk about it mainly because we don't have a lot to talk about but as soon as he shows up in great shape, it's over.

J

Joe -Your position here at FBG is comparable to that of Bill Parcells; being open-minded and toleratent of a variety of people who contribute to the whole. I think you are very tolerant of some trolls around here (I fear I walk this line on occasion myself), but you have certainly encountered some FBGers who genuinely just want to create problems for others (or specifically you); and (I assume) you have supported IP Bans of some of these individuals (who most likely deserved it).

But I am genuinely interested in what you think of individuals who genuinely feel being difficult and disruptive is not subject to review when deciding what is and is not for the betterment of the team (or message board) or the whole?

Hi Blue,I guess it's a matter of degree. In my opinion, TO working out at home is about like what I would equate the best poster on the board here having a sig that is too long but was really passionate about letting folks know whatever it was in the sig. Just not a really big deal.

But then I guess purpose figures into it. I don't think TO is trying to purposefully be disrpuptive with the workouts. The goal is to get in shape and he feels he can get in the best shape by working out with his own people.

Purposefully being disruptive would be a different thing in my opinion.

J