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Patriots looking for a 1st and 4th for Garoppolo (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter JohnnyU
- Start date
Riversco
Footballguy
This browns front office was incapable of correctly evaluating wentz. People look at his work in his rookie year and are flummoxed at what the browns could possibly have seen to scare them off. Wentz is really talented. So its confirmed the browns brass are not smart. This trade makes sense for that reason. I wouldnt do that trade, id take kizer first overall. And the browns are dumb for not taking kiser first overall.
Anarchy99
Footballguy
If the information is erroneous or fabricated propaganda, Zolak will look like an idiot if JG gets traded for a late second.
If other teams might have thought about trading for Garoppolo but wouldn't pony up this much, them he is driving away potential trade partners.
I still think some people are not fully getting on board with the fact that there are several teams out there who want JG and will pony up a lot to get him. He may not be worth it, but there appears to be teams really interested in him.
BigSteelThrill
Footballguy
Because he is pushing propaganda to the teams benefit. He doesn't care what it looks like (neither does Curran) as long as it keeps him in good graces and allows him to keep access and stay employed as he cheers on "his" team. He's been a Patriot his entire career.
Outside of people from NE, I doubt many want to get on board with the idea that the Pats could get a motherload.
Cleveland's 12 and 33 would probably end up being 7 picks down the road.
The rich get richer.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
FUBAR
Footballguy
ghostguy123
Footballguy
Kiser #1? Yeesh
flapgreen
Footballguy
flapgreen
Footballguy
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Riversco
Footballguy
Pats fans are pretty funny. Zolak has 0 connections to Cleveland and their new management, but he's got the scoop on what they are offering. That is more believable than him being a lackey for NE and is floating news to help drive up a market for JG to get favors since he covers NE. So funny. I have no clue how well JG will do somewhere else and if/what they'll receive in trade, but seriously, making it seem like sports reporters are afraid of being wrong over being first/getting noticed. LOL, sure, they have lots of integrity.
FUBAR
Footballguy
If you mean his plea to Dallas, yeah that's just you. If it's something else I missed it.
Probably because they don't perceive the risk you are referencing. I can't recall a single writer (maybe Dan Rather?) that lost a job over reporting unsubstantiated rumors that turned out to be false. I doubt most people a month from now would remember who predicted which crazy offseason trades that never happened, so reputation isn't likely to be a factor outside of the handful of top, best-known names in the business,
FUBAR
Footballguy
Right. These guys are in the entertainment business. These types of stories get people talking more about their team. With no real risk, why wouldn't you speculate? Maybe he'll end up being right and look like a genius "in the know", if he's wrong nobody will really care.
Bossman
Footballguy
Chris Mortensen still has his job:
still present in the story and not removed: “The investigation found the footballs were inflated 2 pounds per square inch below what’s required by NFL regulations ..."
But as it turns out, Mortensen’s report was very wrong. The Wells Report made clear that either one or zero balls were under inflated by two pounds, not 11. Mortensen reported false information that went unchallenged and uncorrected for months, that significantly affected public perception of the scandal as well as how ferociously the NFL decided to investigate and eventually mete out punishment.
Link: http://deadspin.com/chris-mortensen-unsatisfyingly-explains-his-erroneous-p-1721919476?utm_campaign=socialflow_deadspin_twitter&utm_source=deadspin_twitter&utm_medium=socialflow
still present in the story and not removed: “The investigation found the footballs were inflated 2 pounds per square inch below what’s required by NFL regulations ..."
But as it turns out, Mortensen’s report was very wrong. The Wells Report made clear that either one or zero balls were under inflated by two pounds, not 11. Mortensen reported false information that went unchallenged and uncorrected for months, that significantly affected public perception of the scandal as well as how ferociously the NFL decided to investigate and eventually mete out punishment.
Link: http://deadspin.com/chris-mortensen-unsatisfyingly-explains-his-erroneous-p-1721919476?utm_campaign=socialflow_deadspin_twitter&utm_source=deadspin_twitter&utm_medium=socialflow
Bronco Billy
Footballguy
Oh for Pete's sake. Now evidence has to be provided to show sportswriters regularly float unsubstantiated balloons for teams and face no consequences? Seriously? Did someone just arrive here from another universe?
March 9 can't come soon enough.
March 9 can't come soon enough.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
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Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
I've been mostly on your side, but you are reading waaaaaayyyyyy more into this than you should. "Homers" on the radio say plenty of dumb stuff. If you listened to Greg Buttle on ESPN radio talking about the Jets, you'd be surprised to learn that they ever lost a game.
massraider
Footballguy
Freaking Zolak.
Laugh out loud.
Laugh out loud.
Hankmoody
Footballguy
Bossman
Footballguy
Johnny Football Manziel is in need of another pay-day.
That party train isn't going to fund itself.
Hankmoody
Footballguy
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Riversco
Footballguy
I thought manziel was a disasterous pick when selected. I drew a lot of criticism for that. I thought it was a disasterous move to not pick wentz and drew critcism for that. I thought it was terrible to not pick khalil mack and drew criticism for that. I know ill draw more for saying to take kizer instead of garrett and that trading 12 & 33 is terrible to get jg but hey one of these times i will be wrong.Bossman said:
Bossman
Footballguy
I think people way overvalue the draft picks. Too many looking at it from a fantasy football angle.
Look at the recent history and see if these players taken at 12 and 33 out-weigh a potential franchise QB.
2013
#12 DJ Hayden CB
#33 John Cyprien FS
2104
#12 Odell Beckam WR
#33 Xavier Sua'-Filo OG
2015
#12 Danny Shelton NT
#33 Landon Collins S
2016
#12 Sheldon Rankins DT
#33 Emmanuel Ogbah DE
BigSteelThrill
Footballguy
Those are some damn fine players in Bossmans list.
Lets look at JGs #62 draft slot and QBs from #50 to #130 (two round after #62) in the past decade...
Lets look at JGs #62 draft slot and QBs from #50 to #130 (two round after #62) in the past decade...
- Brad Smith
- Tavaris Jackson
- Brodie Croyle
- Trent Edwards
- Isiah Stanback
- Brian Brohm
- Kevin O'Connell
- Stephen McGee
- Colt McCoy
- Ryan Mallett
- TJYates
- Brock Osweiler
- Kirk Cousins
- Mike Glennon
- Ryan Nassib
- Garrett Grayson
- Sean Mannion
- Bryce Petty
- Cody Kessler
- Connor Cook
- Cardale Jones
BigSteelThrill
Footballguy
Would you consider trading #12 and #33 for Mike Glennon?
A guy with 4100 yards and a 84.6 qbr for TAMPA BAY in his career.
A guy with 4100 yards and a 84.6 qbr for TAMPA BAY in his career.
Bossman
Footballguy
A fair question.
Glennon was not as good a QB in college and was not as coveted at the draft as the second round pick Garopollo.
Glennon has already showed what he is capable of and his flaws ... his upside is limited.
Which guy you banking your next 5 years on?
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Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
Garoppolo propaganda churning out steaming piles at Joseph Goebbels levels.
I hope that other QB-desperate teams fall for the Bellichick crapaganda with Garoppolo and I also hope a few of them fall in love with this rookie class because that means top talent to fall so I could fills holes on my team with top talent with cheap rookie contracts.
I sign Glennon and don't pay any draft picks and also save cap space by not committing myself to a long-term extension. Glennon acts as a bridge because I am realistic and know my team sucks and we not winning anytime soon. Unfortunately for Patriots propaganda machine I am not desperate enough to cloud my judgement to the point I force a guy who isn't a franchise QB into that role. .
I like my chances with the 2018 draft class. Good luck finding a buyer for Goroppolo.
I hope that other QB-desperate teams fall for the Bellichick crapaganda with Garoppolo and I also hope a few of them fall in love with this rookie class because that means top talent to fall so I could fills holes on my team with top talent with cheap rookie contracts.
I sign Glennon and don't pay any draft picks and also save cap space by not committing myself to a long-term extension. Glennon acts as a bridge because I am realistic and know my team sucks and we not winning anytime soon. Unfortunately for Patriots propaganda machine I am not desperate enough to cloud my judgement to the point I force a guy who isn't a franchise QB into that role. .
I like my chances with the 2018 draft class. Good luck finding a buyer for Goroppolo.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
Bossman
Footballguy
Completely understand.
If you don't have faith that Garopollo is equal to a Mariota or Dak Prescott.
but from what I've seen, Garopollo is capable of being as much the QB as those guys. JG has given people no reason to think otherwise.
Teams in need of a QB aren't going to waste a year waiting for a 2018 drafted college kid to come in ....when they can have a guy that is ready to "plug and play" right now.
-OZ-
Footballguy
I'm a Titans fan so biased but it's laughable to me that anyone would call him equal to Mariota. Or dak for that matter, but anything is possible.
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
Teams are desperate at equal levels?
They aren't.
Some teams know they suck so trading high picks for a Jimmy Garoppolo isn't enough to make any difference and hurts the chance to fill other holes but the biggest issues is when a legit franchise QB comes around, i.e., next year's rookie QB class, they don't want to be married to JG to the point they bypass a far better opportunity to land a long term answer at quarterback..
A better opportunity IMHO is a team that is closer is a better match if they think JG is good-nuff to push them over the top or into the playoffs. That possibility is a better match and I think exists where a team like that would package future picks based on performance that would satisfy the Patriots but they would game a mid-range pick this year because they are going to have to eat his contract extension on the books.
That scenario makes the most sense, not only to the Patriots.
Not like Patriot fans counting chickens they don't and won't ever have.
Bossman
Footballguy
What have you seen from Garoppolo that makes you feel he is not CAPABLE of being what Mariota is?
Comparing their stats in the last year of college:
Mariota ....2014 // Games 15 // Comp 304 // Attmpt 445 // Pct 68.3 // YDS 4454 // TD 42 // INT 4
Garopollo 2013 // Games 14 // Comp 375 // Attmpt 568 // Pct 66.0 // YDS 5050 // TD 53 // INT 9
Garoppolo stats are comparable to Mariotas ... and with one less game.
-OZ-
Footballguy
college stats don't mean a whole lot.
It's not what I've seen from jimmy it's that we haven't seen much.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
What have you read from people saying he isn't "capable"?? Lot of unproven guys have the ability to be good, but that doesn't mean they will be obviously.
Simply put, JG hasn't done anything to prove he is worth much more than what he was when he was drafted. Not really his fault. He just hasn't had the opportunity.
If you want to say he did ok in a few quarters this year fine, but when you are on the best organization in football for a couple years it wouldn't be very surprising that a QB would do fairly well at the beginning of the season when the teams he is facing are nowhere near as prepared as your team. Even below average talent at QB could fair well in that situation.
Hence, JG hasn't showed much of anything. Again, not his fault, but those are the facts.
edit.................I quoted the wrong thing, mean to quote where you talked about JG being capable
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BigSteelThrill
Footballguy
The #12 and #33 are horrible price point for either -- even with Glennon having shown much more (on a far worse team) and JG having some intriguing unknowns.
-OZ-
Footballguy
I'll take Glennon and the picks. Glennon/Kessler and a better o line will be better than jimmy and not improving elsewhere. (Imo of course)
Riversco
Footballguy
If I'm the Browns and I want JG, I trade down from the 12, maybe with Seattle and grab the 1.26 and Seattle's 2018 first rounder. Then I might trade the 1.26 and 1.33 for JG. That way you are effectively just trading a second round pick for JG. That's fine. I might ask for a 4th rouder from the pats as well. Seattle might do that to get Fournette or Cook. But the only way I give a first for JG is if I get a 1st in return. I wouldn't surrender 1.12 and 1.33 straight up for JG. Way too high a price.
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Dinsy Ejotuz
Footballguy
This seems more realistic to me. Talk of a 2nd or a 2nd and a 3rd is way off the mark IMO. If they move him at all.
Dinsy Ejotuz
Footballguy
He's more than a little inaccurate by today's standards and he's got a weak arm. I suspect he'd be found out if he were a full-time starter and asked to do full-time starter stuff game in and game out. No way to prove that, but it won't surprise me if NFL teams are reluctant to pull the trigger on him as a starter.
BigSteelThrill
Footballguy
Jimmys college accuracy was about the same as Glennon. (One in the ACC and one in the Ohio Valley Conf).
No way you can compare TB and NE though, one is a high completion short passing game and one is decidedly not. With vastly different support staffs as mentioned.
LOL, comparing a guy who played at Oregon and competed for the National Championship. Garoppolo was tearing up Southern Illinois, Tennessee State, Tennessee Tech, Eastern Kentucky, Murray State, Austin Peay and the like. Not really comparable, which is why comparing college stats to assert that Garoppolo is as good as Mariota is terrible analysis. There are zillions of college QBs at lessor levels that put up great stats and didn't do anything in the pros.
By the way, you might want to spell his name right if you are trying to say how good he is. Or heck, if you spell it wrong, just be consistent.
bostonfred
Footballguy
12 and 33 would be a gift.
Then again, after 17.years as a franchise they've spent first round picks on Tim Couch, Brady Quinn, Brandon Weeden, and Johnny Manziel, and started RG3, Cody Kessler, Josh McCown, Austin Davis, Connor shaw, Jason Campbell, Brian hoyer, Derek Anderson, Jake Delhomme, Bruce Gradkowski, Thad Lewis, Seneca Wallace, colt Mccoy, Ken Dorsey, Charlie Frye, Trent Dilfer, Luke McCown, Kelly Holcomb, Spergon Wynn, Doug Pederson and Ty Detmer,
Maybe adding one more scrub to that list is a mistake. Maybe making an aggressive move is their best option. It really comes down to what they think they can get from him
Then again, after 17.years as a franchise they've spent first round picks on Tim Couch, Brady Quinn, Brandon Weeden, and Johnny Manziel, and started RG3, Cody Kessler, Josh McCown, Austin Davis, Connor shaw, Jason Campbell, Brian hoyer, Derek Anderson, Jake Delhomme, Bruce Gradkowski, Thad Lewis, Seneca Wallace, colt Mccoy, Ken Dorsey, Charlie Frye, Trent Dilfer, Luke McCown, Kelly Holcomb, Spergon Wynn, Doug Pederson and Ty Detmer,
Maybe adding one more scrub to that list is a mistake. Maybe making an aggressive move is their best option. It really comes down to what they think they can get from him
