guitarmonkiy
Footballguy
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Nope, he ties that scrub guy who ruined New York's season this year. Some dude named Favre.He's the first with three, correct?
Sorry, brainfart. Was thinking Favre had 2 for some reason. New Year's Eve alcohol still affecting the brain.Nope, he ties that scrub guy who ruined New York's season this year. Some dude named Favre.He's the first with three, correct?![]()
You don't really man that. If he ever deserved an MVP, this was the year.cough...bull####.....cough
In 2006 I would agree with you, but Sanders has missed more time than you know, and when he did play he hasn't made that big of a difference this year.Brees isn't on there because you've got to be amongst the top NFL teams to get the award.
Honestly though, I think the Colts mid/late season success is more directly linked to the return of Bob Sanders than Peyton doing his usual thing but what Sanders contributes on the field is more difficult to measure with statistics. He just makes plays when plays need to be made.
I agree, why is he any more deserving than Rivers?cough...bull####.....cough
What do you guys think about Chad tying for second in the voting? I know it's a null point because Peyton won in a landslide, but does he deserve this much recognition? I realize he was great as a game manager and all but didn't the defense play a large part in their turnaround as well? I don't follow the Dolphins at all so I don't know much about how deserving he is, just curious.Here is how the voting went:
Peyton Manning 32
Michael Turner 4
Chad Pennington 4
James Harrison 3
Adrian Peterson 3
Philip Rivers 2
Kurt Warner 1
Chris Johnson 1
The team threw alot more than you'd realize based on personnel. They actually seemed to get away from pounding the ball, and even the whole wildcat thing in favor of letting Pennington make plays with his arm. He actually threw for a career high in yardage, and posted the 2nd best passer rating of his career. Also, you consider his team was 1-15 a year ago, and now they're in the playoffs, and he's definitely a major factor in that. It's not completely undeserved he got that many votes.I know Warner had 2 bad games, and at the wrong time, but I was surprised he didn't do better in the voting. 4500 Yards and 30 TDs, while leading a Cardinals team that wasn't exactly a playoff regular back to the post season was worth more recognition IMO.What do you guys think about Chad tying for second in the voting? I know it's a null point because Peyton won in a landslide, but does he deserve this much recognition? I realize he was great as a game manager and all but didn't the defense play a large part in their turnaround as well? I don't follow the Dolphins at all so I don't know much about how deserving he is, just curious.Here is how the voting went:
Peyton Manning 32
Michael Turner 4
Chad Pennington 4
James Harrison 3
Adrian Peterson 3
Philip Rivers 2
Kurt Warner 1
Chris Johnson 1
At least two voters were able to see past the ESPN highlight reels and vote for the player who had the best year and led his team to the playoffs almost singlehandedly....Here is how the voting wenteyton Manning 32Michael Turner 4Chad Pennington 4James Harrison 3Adrian Peterson 3Philip Rivers 2Kurt Warner 1Chris Johnson 1
Please. Go find a codepink rally.At least two voters were able to see past the ESPN highlight reels and vote for the player who had the best year and led his team to the playoffs almost singlehandedly....Here is how the voting wenteyton Manning 32Michael Turner 4Chad Pennington 4James Harrison 3Adrian Peterson 3Philip Rivers 2Kurt Warner 1Chris Johnson 1
I agree that Peyton Manning is a better player than Philip Rivers. But Rivers had a better season in 2008 than Peyton Manning did. Period.Please. Go find a codepink rally.At least two voters were able to see past the ESPN highlight reels and vote for the player who had the best year and led his team to the playoffs almost singlehandedly....Here is how the voting wenteyton Manning 32Michael Turner 4Chad Pennington 4James Harrison 3Adrian Peterson 3Philip Rivers 2Kurt Warner 1Chris Johnson 1
This gets back to debating who you think SHOULD win the MVP versus acknowledging as fans what players usually DO win. I can understand arguing that Manning didn't have the best year, but the AP MVP award almost always goes to a top player [usually QB] on one of the top offenses on one of the best teams. Is that fair since it's an individual award? Probably not, but it's always been that way. The Chargers were a sub-.500 team until the last game of the year, a QB from that kind of team has no shot at winning the MVP award.I agree, why is he any more deserving than Rivers?cough...bull####.....cough
1) The MVP award isn't a reward for star power2) Peyton Manning is about as big a star as the NFL has [name another guy with his endorsement deals]3) Manning was one of the best QBs on one of the best teams in the league, of course he would be considered every year. The only QBs that were on part with him played for 2nd tier or non-contending teams [Rivers included], what's the surprise here?If people really think this was the best option, then the NFL was devoid of stars this year. In any normal year, Manning wouldn't have been considered.
Statistically?Consider, Rivers team is 8-8, in the AFC West. Peyton's is 12-4--in the AFC South. That says alot.I agree that Peyton Manning is a better player than Philip Rivers. But Rivers had a better season in 2008 than Peyton Manning did. Period.Please. Go find a codepink rally.At least two voters were able to see past the ESPN highlight reels and vote for the player who had the best year and led his team to the playoffs almost singlehandedly....Here is how the voting wenteyton Manning 32Michael Turner 4Chad Pennington 4James Harrison 3Adrian Peterson 3Philip Rivers 2Kurt Warner 1Chris Johnson 1
Posted this a few days ago:Statistically?Consider, Rivers team is 8-8, in the AFC West. Peyton's is 12-4--in the AFC South. That says alot.I agree that Peyton Manning is a better player than Philip Rivers. But Rivers had a better season in 2008 than Peyton Manning did. Period.Please. Go find a codepink rally.At least two voters were able to see past the ESPN highlight reels and vote for the player who had the best year and led his team to the playoffs almost singlehandedly....Here is how the voting wenteyton Manning 32Michael Turner 4Chad Pennington 4James Harrison 3Adrian Peterson 3Philip Rivers 2Kurt Warner 1Chris Johnson 1
Look, I don't think Rivers will win MVP. Heck, if he isn't voted into the Pro Bowl as one of the top 3 QBs in the AFC, despite leading the league in TDs and QB rating, it's quite obvious that he won't get any MVP votes. But he deserves strong consideration....LOFL at saying Rivers was good and Manning was great this season. Why, because Manning had a better defense? The Colts are #11 in yards allowed and #7 in points allowed, compared to #25 and #15, respectively, for San Diego.And about the "inferior competition"... the Colts played 10 games against teams that finished .500 or better... San Diego played 11. The Colts played 7 games against teams that finished with winning records... San Diego played 8. The cumulative record of the Colts' opponents, not including their games against the Colts, is 123-116-1. The cumulative record of the Chargers' opponents, not including their games against the Chargers, is 124-116.
Here is how the voting went:
Peyton Manning 32
Michael Turner 4
Chad Pennington 4
James Harrison 3
Adrian Peterson 3
Philip Rivers 2
Kurt Warner 1
Chris Johnson 1
I thought Pennington's MVP chances were overrated, so the fact that he got any votes, to me, seems a little crazy, but a lot of people were on his bandwagon and ready to give him most of the credit for the Dolphins turnaround, so I was not at all surprised that he got a few votes.What do you guys think about Chad tying for second in the voting? I know it's a null point because Peyton won in a landslide, but does he deserve this much recognition? I realize he was great as a game manager and all but didn't the defense play a large part in their turnaround as well? I don't follow the Dolphins at all so I don't know much about how deserving he is, just curious.Here is how the voting went:
Peyton Manning 32
Michael Turner 4
Chad Pennington 4
James Harrison 3
Adrian Peterson 3
Philip Rivers 2
Kurt Warner 1
Chris Johnson 1
How was this not a normal year? More to the point, what is a normal NFL year?If people really think this was the best option, then the NFL was devoid of stars this year. In any normal year, Manning wouldn't have been considered.
At least two voters were able to see past the ESPN highlight reels and vote for the player who had the best year and led his team to the playoffs almost singlehandedly....Here is how the voting went:
Peyton Manning 32
Michael Turner 4
Chad Pennington 4
James Harrison 3
Adrian Peterson 3
Philip Rivers 2
Kurt Warner 1
Chris Johnson 1
Manning split the one with McNair so it's really like 2.5.2nd with 3...Favre has 3 also.
Favre split one of his with Sanders...Manning split the one with McNair so it's really like 2.5.2nd with 3...Favre has 3 also.![]()
How could I forget Sanders 1997 season? Good catch, it's tied at 2.5.Favre split one of his with Sanders...Manning split the one with McNair so it's really like 2.5.2nd with 3...Favre has 3 also.![]()
I agree. The person that voted for Johnson should not be allowed to vote again, EVER.I can't believe that Chris Johnson got a vote. Guy had a great rookie season and was an exciting player on a great team, but he's not even close to being an MVP candidate. Heck, the defensive line deserved a vote more than Johnson.
Love Manning, can't stand Rivers, but I can't see how any of those claims in bold don't fit Phillip Rivers. Top player? check. QB? check. Top offense? check. Top team? check. (hey, they won their division and have just about as good a shot at the super bowl as Peyton's team does!)This gets back to debating who you think SHOULD win the MVP versus acknowledging as fans what players usually DO win. I can understand arguing that Manning didn't have the best year, but the AP MVP award almost always goes to a top player [usually QB] on one of the top offenses on one of the best teams. Is that fair since it's an individual award? Probably not, but it's always been that way. The Chargers were a sub-.500 team until the last game of the year, a QB from that kind of team has no shot at winning the MVP award.I agree, why is he any more deserving than Rivers?cough...bull####.....cough1) The MVP award isn't a reward for star power2) Peyton Manning is about as big a star as the NFL has [name another guy with his endorsement deals]If people really think this was the best option, then the NFL was devoid of stars this year. In any normal year, Manning wouldn't have been considered.
3) Manning was one of the best QBs on one of the best teams in the league, of course he would be considered every year. The only QBs that were on part with him played for 2nd tier or non-contending teams [Rivers included], what's the surprise here?
I thought Pennington being tied for second was ridiculous. That team won without individual stars.Warner, Brees or Turner should have been higher.What do you guys think about Chad tying for second in the voting? I know it's a null point because Peyton won in a landslide, but does he deserve this much recognition? I realize he was great as a game manager and all but didn't the defense play a large part in their turnaround as well? I don't follow the Dolphins at all so I don't know much about how deserving he is, just curious.Here is how the voting went:
Peyton Manning 32
Michael Turner 4
Chad Pennington 4
James Harrison 3
Adrian Peterson 3
Philip Rivers 2
Kurt Warner 1
Chris Johnson 1
They are top 12 and no one can argue that. Put it another way - take the 34 writers who voted for either manning or rivers, and ask them who's going to win this weekend. You think 32 pick the colts? So, if all else is even (and it isn't), and it just comes down to who is on a better team (which it shouldn't) I'm not certain these guys picked the right one.Top team?Not in '08 anyhow.
Who's better that isn't in the playoffs?I can. They may be one of the 12 playoff teams, but that doesnt make them top 12.Just as if Denver had made the playoffs at 8-8, they wouldnt be top 12, they would just be one of the 12 playoff teams. They certainly were NOT a 'top team' when it came to discussing MVP merit. No way, no how. He gets merit for them being playoff team, thats about it on that scale.They are top 12 and no one can argue that.Top team?Not in '08 anyhow.
Actually, that is the definition I would go by, since the top 12 make the playoffs. What's your criteria?Who's "equal" is a better question. And furthermore... when you say you are a 'top team', that never means #12.Who's better that isn't in the playoffs?I can. They may be one of the 12 playoff teams, but that doesnt make them top 12.Just as if Denver had made the playoffs at 8-8, they wouldnt be top 12, they would just be one of the 12 playoff teams. They certainly were NOT a 'top team' when it came to discussing MVP merit. No way, no how. He gets merit for them being playoff team, thats about it on that scale.They are top 12 and no one can argue that.Top team?Not in '08 anyhow.
A 'top team' is a handfull of representatives. SD is a borderline playoff team on the right side of the border.
I think both of your statements above are true, if you say specifically that Rivers had a better season statistically. Manning was not a stat monster this year, there is no question about it, but the guy had no pre-season and was clearly far from the normal Peyton Manning during that first month of so of the season. He still somehow kept that team afloat. I am not sure that what he did under the circumstances is not a more impressive season that Rivers even given the stats, but obviously it is a highly subjective thing (which the stats are not).I agree that Peyton Manning is a better player than Philip Rivers. But Rivers had a better season in 2008 than Peyton Manning did. Period.
It will all be clear after tomorrow night.I think both of your statements above are true, if you say specifically that Rivers had a better season statistically. Manning was not a stat monster this year, there is no question about it, but the guy had no pre-season and was clearly far from the normal Peyton Manning during that first month of so of the season. He still somehow kept that team afloat. I am not sure that what he did under the circumstances is not a more impressive season that Rivers even given the stats, but obviously it is a highly subjective thing (which the stats are not).I agree that Peyton Manning is a better player than Philip Rivers. But Rivers had a better season in 2008 than Peyton Manning did. Period.
They made the playoffs & won their division what more do you want? Is it really necessary to look beyond these facts when the whole point in the argument revolves around deciding an MVP - not who is truly the best team. Should we compare where the colts and chargers offenses and defenses rank leaguewide? Should we compare common opponents or SOS? Should we compare the 08 Chargers to the teams of previous MVP candidates? If I had the vote, I wouldn't have cast it for Rivers. But given the criterion posted previously, there is NO reason that he should have been crossed off the list.Bro... bill5... the #16/17 teams are the very definition of average/mediocre in the NFL.SD sits at #12. They are much closer to mediocre then to being the top team in the regular season.... for the purposes of the MVP award. Im not saying anything in regards to winning the Lombardi, they certainly at least have a chance. But as far the regular season MVP award, no. Their record/finish in the regular season does NOT equal a "top team" and does not add anything to Rivers MVP merit. His stats do, though.Actually, that is the definition I would go by, since the top 12 make the playoffs. What's your criteria?Who's "equal" is a better question. And furthermore... when you say you are a 'top team', that never means #12.Who's better that isn't in the playoffs?I can. They may be one of the 12 playoff teams, but that doesnt make them top 12.Just as if Denver had made the playoffs at 8-8, they wouldnt be top 12, they would just be one of the 12 playoff teams. They certainly were NOT a 'top team' when it came to discussing MVP merit. No way, no how. He gets merit for them being playoff team, thats about it on that scale.They are top 12 and no one can argue that.Top team?Not in '08 anyhow.
A 'top team' is a handfull of representatives. SD is a borderline playoff team on the right side of the border.