rockaction
Footballguy
otb_lifer was a real friend to me here. I'll miss him. Purging all the threads was a dumb move and a bad one. I'm not sure what else to say.
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Please Read - "Who's Hottest?" Type Threads - And An Apology (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Joe Bryant
- Start date
Thanks @comfortably numb . Can you elaborate in way more detail and specifics on
1. The direction you think the community is being steered.
And much more importantly,
2. Specific examples of why you think this.
Thanks.
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Dedfin
Footballguy
rockaction
Footballguy
That's what EG said and I believe it. He might have posted in the triple crown thread. I don't go in there every day because I don't play the horses, but if that's what EG says, well, EG has his pulse on the place.
I sure hope he didn't leave. otb_lifer was a guy who offered to meet up for drinks when he thought I was in NY. No troll. Quality guy, IMO. I also liked his posts, and thought he was diligent and a genius, in a weird way. The lovely ladies and ponies thread were labors of love, and we appreciated them when we checked in.
rockaction
Footballguy
-OZ-
Footballguy
This I completely agree with. I'm not going to post our disagreements on Facebook or discuss with some friends we share in common (I should be to trust the dudes to not talk to their wives and have it get back to mine, but not always). This should be a good place for adult conversation.
Can we agree that even if posting and judging pictures of other women is disallowed, that we should be able to have conversations about real #### here?
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Thanks @flranger
I'm trying to understand you here. Can you elaborate in detail with the specific things we've done here that are a 180 degree change?
El Floppo
Footballguy
culdeus
Footballguy
It is for things like this that I spend 80% of my forum type time at reddit now. The up down type moderation has flaws but in general you get better content and more diverse interactions.
I had already really dialed back my time here after the horrible way the dodds stuff was handled, but I figure the way this is headed I'm 99% out the door.
Was a good run.
I had already really dialed back my time here after the horrible way the dodds stuff was handled, but I figure the way this is headed I'm 99% out the door.
Was a good run.
rockaction
Footballguy
EvilGrin said he was leaving. I'm doing more research as we speak. I'm trying to figure out where he's getting that.
@Evilgrin 72where do you get that from? The ponies thread?
Capella
Footballguy
Dedfin
Footballguy
That sucks.That's what EG said and I believe it. He might have posted in the triple crown thread. I don't go in there every day because I don't play the horses, but if that's what EG says, well, EG has his pulse on the place.
I sure hope he didn't leave. otb_lifer was a guy who offered to meet up for drinks when he thought I was in NY. No troll. Quality guy, IMO. I also liked his posts, and thought he was diligent and a genius, in a weird way. The lovely ladies and ponies thread were labors of love, and we appreciated them when we checked in.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
I can't answer for him, but I am sure some are wondering why the constant crap storms in the political forum are allowed and now commenting on pretty girls is not. Sure, the FFA and the P/R are now different subforums, but they both fall under the Football Guys umbrella.
Good example of a crap storm: https://forums.footballguys.com/forum/topic/766434-things-which-makes-one-a-racist/
culdeus
Footballguy
Honestly, I think I've come to the conclusion Dodds has had some mental breakdown. Sometimes really smart people just crack and the end result is they go from doing good to harm. It happens.
I mainly feel bad for the guy and hope he gets better or seeks help.
IC FBGCav
Footballguy
https://forums.footballguys.com/forum/topic/764201-road-to-the-2018-triple-crown-510-justy-back-on-the-track-ruis-will-ship-boltyduck-the-rain/?do=findComment&comment=21046109
wikkidpissah 6,356
Members
15,736 posts
Posted yesterday at 10:48 AM ·
Alas, we must continue down the Triple Crown Trail without our founder, leader and guardian angel. @otb_lifer has left the FFA in response to Bryant's latest purge. He told me he would even have done so if those ridiculous actions had taken place the week before the Derby - that's how strongly he's feels. Were not so many of my efforts to make the world a brighter place officed in this community, i would be right behind him. I will miss his passion, his care, his thoroughgoing enthusiasm, and the bi-polar energies which made his contributions to this site ever so much more valuable than the administration will ever understand. Continue to say nothing as greed dulls our senses to match its own, but do not then wonder where went the flavors of life. Best wishes for a 58.2 breeze thru life, my friend.
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comfortably numb
Footballguy
The community is being steered (and always has been) in a direction you feel is morally/religiously acceptable to what you feel this place should be. We've all fallen in line for the most part some barking more than others.
In this latest case you happen to bring in the #metoo movement...which i think you used to over correct what you feel is an issue but seemingly no one or not many here have expressed there was an issue.
Removing all these threads makes me feel like you are trying to do your part by not allowing your members to discuss random conversations they would have with their friends sitting around over a few drinks. Ironically this seems like the school not allowing yoga pants because they are too distracting. It's just an over correcting brush that makes people feel like they are children...even if we want to act as such at times.
This is what lead people to start making crazy comparrisons about objectifying NFL players or gambling via FBG.
You own this place but we give it a reason to own. We (for the most part) have treated you with respect as an owner and an individual human despite many differences.
Im not asking for you to change anything back but just to realize you are making adults feel like children who want to openly speak about random life situations. Some juvenile and some meaningful that being able to openly discuss may help a persons situation.
I'm not declaring im leaving or anything but in many ways i feel this place is leaving me
Dedfin
Footballguy
The most charitable way to describe it is inconsistent. A more accurate description is probably off limits according to Joe.
NotSmart
Footballguy
Reddit is great for its astounding breadth of subreddits and shear number of people.
I spend way too much time on Reddit and learn a ton from it and enjoy it.
But the FFA* is different... it's mostly guys (more women would be great and the ones that are here are awesome, but it is mostly guys), and I'd say we fit into a fairly well defined demographic.
The real difference here is the sheer length of posting for many of us... I'd guess the longevity of posters on this board is fairly unusual in the message board world.
We've seen each other grow up, navigate through life's cycles, and survive and grow through an incredible range of situations.
There are 20+ year old inside jokes here.
There's a comfort with this message board that's like a pipe and an old pair of slippers.
(I don't smoke a pipe - I mean who does?... and I don't wear slippers... but you know exactly what I mean).
So I guess I'm saying, IMO, this board offers things that Reddit will never be able to.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
It's obviously not, but one is allowed while the other is not.
It's not a very dramatic answer but if the question is what about David's posts, I asked David to not be controversial in the forums and he did what I asked. Do David and I have different views on things? Absolutely. Sometimes very different. But I also have the advantage most of you don't in knowing him in real life and being his friend for 20 years.
IC FBGCav
Footballguy
Uruk-Hai
Footballguy
You guys asking for consistency are missing the point completely (plus, you're being hypocrites). It's entirely possible for a person to be put off by sexual themes and have no problem with, say, movie violence. Y'all keep trying for a "gotcha" moment. I doubt you'll get one here.
rockaction
Footballguy
Come back, friend.
One of my few unconditional friends on the board. Always there with a kind word unless under the flash of caffeine. I'll miss him.
This sucks eggs.
Well, ultimately many threads in the past, particularly the long time ongoing threads like Over 50, Oddly, YogaPants, involve some level of the "objectification of women", which, is something I, and I'd suggest most here, enjoy reading and now they will no longer be allowed. Especially if it goes into threads like AZRon, Dot threads, idating, NRJ, and others which many live vicariously through.
If it was just the rating threads....I get it, and clearly by the comments most do, but I think many here probably have no idea what the new rules are, and will probably resist posting what would otherwise be entertaining content.
We are used to AC/DC and will get Lionel Richie. Or at least that's probably the fear.
ETA: Can we get the spelling changed in the thread title for the Cialas thread to Cialis?
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culdeus
Footballguy
Yeah. I get that. I just don't really see the value in driving traffic to a site which is run so haphazardly.
Thanks for the answer @comfortably numb
My thought would be it's more like this:
I don't know it's "moral" or "religious" as much as it's just what I think is the right way.
You wrote:
I think we may be not communicating properly here. Nobody that I know of is removing random conversations. What we're removing is the who's hottest type polls where guys have their "locker room talk" in public posting pictures (often without the woman's consent) then make often crude comments that the moderators have to remove. That may be "real life" but that's not something we're going to have here.
Talking about "random real life" situations is the majority of what happens on this board. But that's very different from what I wrote above.
Correct.
I think what we disagree on is not allowing those threads being a 180 degree change from where we've been.
NotSmart
Footballguy
Capella
Footballguy
His pizzagate comments weren’t the standard “different views on things”, but ok. I know you’re going to take the corporate PC approach here.
Da Guru
Fair & Balanced
Most of the pictures that are posted were taken off Instagram and out there on the world wide web for everyone to see.
When they post pictures working out or in yoga pants it is for one reason..... to draw attention to themselves.
comfortably numb
Footballguy
Joe, were all grown men and have to have a secret code of colored dots on here to discuss our sex lives mostly with our spouses and that got snipped.
Thanks for the notice there. Agreed that was over the line and I locked it. That's a good point though - I think there's some sort of idea that every single one of the thousand posts a day are looked at and approved. That's obviously not remotely close to reality. But that's how it seems when it goes to the "they allow _______ but not _________" In most cases, it's not allowing. It's not seeing it. It's why we ask people to report things they see that are over the line. Thanks.
Sorry. That's not corporate PC. The opposite. It's my answer as someone who's known him in real life for 20 years and his close friend.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
I was unfamiliar with what the clinical term for Objectification of Women meant so I looked it up. I was surprised to see that there are new breed of feminists who are trying to make it more positive.
However, a rising form of new third-waver feminist groups have also taken the increased objectification of women as an opportunity to use the female body as a mode of power.
culdeus
Footballguy
Yes. Remember these are all pics in the public domain. But that's not ok.
An owner pushing racist propaganda and conspiracy daily is fine though.
The hypocrisy is pretty astounding.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
That was not meant to be a notice or a report, but merely an example of the kind of chatter that happens in P/R all the time. Even in threads that have more innocuous titles, the convos often devolve into similar kind of talk. But let's face it, expecting posters to report every single post that is over the line or unacceptable is simply unreasonable, and unrealistic. All a mod has to do is go to Page 1 of P/R and read the first few pages of every single thread there. If one can read all of that and think, "This is acceptable, but commenting on pretty girls is not," well, I would simply be at a loss for words.
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I don't think either are things we want. If you see something over the line, any help you can give with reporting is appreciated. Thanks.That was not meant to be a notice or a report, but merely an example of the kind of chatter that happens in P/R all the time. Even in threads that have more innocuous titles, the convos often devolve into similar kind of talk. But let's face it, expecting posters to report every single post that is over the line or unacceptable is simply unreasonable, and unrealistic. All a mod has to do is go to Page 1 of P/R and read the first few pages of every single thread there. If one can read all of that and think, "This is acceptable, but commenting on pretty girls is not," well, I would simply be at a loss for words.
shuke
Black Ice Skeptic
Joe,
I’ve come to peace with the decision. But for you to not understand how this is 180 degrees from what you have allowed for 20 years (and even encouraged through a moderator-ran babe bracket) is baffling to me.
bostonfred
Footballguy
A lot of us have been here for 20 years. These are your servers, but in a very real sense this is our community.
I've always supported the changes you've made here because it is your site, and beside I believed that you've always made decisions from a generally good place and you've consistently tried to communicate that to the board. The enforcement might not always have been "same as day one", but you've always been here to explain what you're doing, why you think it's right and discuss it openly and I have always respected that.
But this is a community where people have developed friendships, networked, contributed money when people were in need, supported people after tragedies, and spent two decades with each other. When you make significant changes to it without discussion and tell people that they can leave if they don't like it, it's not a small thing.
As a thought exercise, what kinds of changes do you think would be overstepping your rights as owner of the site? Are there any? Would you be ok banning posters and deleting threads because they don't agree with your political or religious views? What about taking badly about a stock you own? Or promoting gambling, drinking, or eating fatty foods?
Does the community have a voice in these changes? I know you're here answering comments and like i said i have always respected that. But is the decision final?
There's a big difference between announcing the policy change and then discussing it, and discussing it to see what the community wants and making a decision afterwards.
And while i haven't even opened the yoga pants thread in ages, why specifically is that on the block? Is it because were talking about women's attractiveness at all? Or is It because it objectives women who maybe didn't agree to it? I get that using pictures from Facebook from people who didn't want to share them crosses a line that I don't want to cross. I don't really mind if those threads go away, but what about talking about public figures? Can we talk about Ashley Judd vs Sarah Michelle Gellar? Can we use pictures to make our point? Can we post pictures of models from their Instagram pages?
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
I think you are missing the general point.
You have an entire forum that seems to be devoted to hateful, argumentative and awful levels of excellence and yet instead of fixing that deplorable part of your forum you instead chose to decide that women over 50 would be insulted because they were considered attractive.
I hope you can see why that has quite a few people in here scratching their heads.
Thanks. I'm not sure what to say there. I see this as "steering" or a correction in the same general direction. It's one part of a pretty big thing. I don't see this at all as moving the whole station from Rock and Roll to Easy Listening.
Juxtatarot
Footballguy
I honesty think all this complaining about rules and moderating is one day going to result in Joe and David deciding to shut down the whole FFA.
I’m grateful it exists and I try to follow the rules.
I’m grateful it exists and I try to follow the rules.
Thanks NR. I do understand what you're saying there. And we'll try to raise the level of civility there. If you've got ideas on how to make political discussion more civil, I'd love to hear them. It's a challenge. It's one of the bigger reasons we made the decision to separate the Political Forum from this forum.
Nah, it's just the initial backlash. I compare it to Target. Some never came back after they supported the whole gender/bathroom issue. Most did.
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
NotSmart
Footballguy
I respectfully disagree that it will ever be shut down.
I think Joe will keep changing it to fit his preference of what should and shouldn't be allowed.
And whoever wishes to stay will stay, and vice versa.
I mean, I think that's pretty clear in what Joe has said.
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