QB Daniel Jones, IND (3 Viewers)

[The Frankman]

I don't even get the sentiment that someone will pay Jones $40 million... PFF rates the teams most needy at QB:

1. Houston Texans - Will draft a QB
2. Indianapolis Colts - Will draft a QB
3. Carolina Panthers - Will draft a QB
4. New York Jets - 'Rumored' to go after Lamar Jackson/Aaron Rodgers
5. Las Vegas Raiders - ?
6. Washington Commanders - Seem to like Sam Howell?
7. New Orleans Saints - Jameis under contract, may stick with Dalton?
8. Atlanta Falcons - They like Desmond Ridder
9. Tennessee Titans - Ryan Tannehill + Malik Willis
10. New England Patriots - Mac Jones
11. Chicago Bears - Justin Fields (or Stroud?)
12. Miami Dolphins - Tua Tagovailoa
13. Tampa Bay Buccaneers - KYLE TRASK FUTURE!
14. Los Angeles Rams - Matthew Stafford
15. Green Bay Packers - Rodgers or Jordan Love
16. Baltimore Ravens - Tyler Huntley if Lamar doesn't resign?

What team is going to start a bidding war to pay Jones that money?

 

[IHEARTFF]

I dont think any NFC South team particularly likes what they currently have at QB, but no I don't think there will be a strong bidding war for DJ

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

I don't even get the sentiment that someone will pay Jones $40 million... PFF rates the teams most needy at QB:

New Orleans Saints - Jameis under contract, may stick with Dalton?

They’re interviewing Carr, so I think they’re not satisfied with Dalton/Jameis.

1. Atlanta Falcons - They like Desmond Ridde

I’m not sure they saw enough of him to make that determination.

1. Tennessee Titans - Ryan Tannehill + Malik Willis

Undecided IMO

Miami Dolphins - Tua Tagovailoa

The concussions are a significant concern. I don’t care what flowery answers they give - this is a problem.

1. Tampa Bay Buccaneers - KYLE TRASK FUTURE!

They could use DJ

Baltimore Ravens - Tyler Huntley if Lamar doesn't resign?

I think LJax stays a Raven, but Huntley isn’t great.

What team is going to start a bidding war to pay Jones that money?

I’d say most of the ones I replied about. Should be interesting. Whoever pays him $35M+ is making a mistake IMO.

But then, that’s the current landscape.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

Carolina Panthers - Will draft a QB

That's not a lock - I could surely see them go after a veteran.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

1. Indianapolis Colts - Will draft a QB
2. Carolina Panthers - Will draft a QB
3. Washington Commanders - Seem to like Sam Howell?
4. New Orleans Saints - Jameis under contract, may stick with Dalton?
5. Atlanta Falcons - They like Desmond Ridder
6. Miami Dolphins - Tua Tagovailoa
7. Tampa Bay Buccaneers - KYLE TRASK FUTURE!
8. Los Angeles Rams - Matthew Stafford
9. Baltimore Ravens - Tyler Huntley if Lamar doesn't resign?

Actually I don't think these teams are not necessarily accurate. Not saying they'll be willing to over-pay Daniel Jones but all of the above are likely looking to upgrade at QB and may add a veteran.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

That's not a lock - I could surely see them go after a veteran.

They've said they don't anticipate spending big on a FA.

Which kinda doesn't mean much. I'd be surprised if they don't draft a QB.

 

[Yenrub]

I don’t think DJ has played well enough to be paid 40M per year and I don’t think he will get that.

However I don’t see how his agent settles for anything less than the franchise tag price from the Giants which is about 32M

 

[Dr. Octopus]

They've said they don't anticipate spending big on a FA.

Which kinda doesn't mean much. I'd be surprised if they don't draft a QB.

Well, Carr is visiting the Panthers after the Saints, so I don't think its set in stone they go that route.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

They've said they don't anticipate spending big on a FA.

Which kinda doesn't mean much. I'd be surprised if they don't draft a QB.

Well, Carr is visiting the Panthers after the Saints, so I don't think its set in stone they go that route.

Agreed - right now it's "GM-speak" season.

Unless they trade up, they're going to need a bridge guy regardless because Levis or Richardson seem like projects. Some have described Richardson as a 2-year project, and well, yikes. But in that light, bringing in a Carr or DJ might make sense.

 

[The Frankman]

@Hot Sauce Guy - If that's the current landscape, then it's more than time for some landscape destruction. Average QBs who can't win games have been getting stupid money for years... we've seen those bad contracts again and again and again. I draw a hard line at the idea of Daniel Jones getting paid $40 million.

It's funny, Brady Quinn was on a Fox Sports podcast with Lavarr Arrington a few weeks ago brought up an odd point... he insinuated that Dak Prescott right now due to his record in the playoffs is starting to be questioned if he should be in that Kirk Cousins/Jimmy Garoppolo tier of QBs who play OK in the regular season but can't win a game by themselves. Personally, I think that's ludicrous because he's won regular season games by himself and he's definitely not hidden on O; he just has had a REALLY hard time in the playoffs in his career. So then I asked myself this: if people are actually starting to question a guy like Dak Prescott (as we have seen on this board oddly enough), is Daniel Jones as good a QB as Dak Prescott/close to his level? No, and I don't think he's even better than Kirk Cousins or Jimmy Garoppolo.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

@Hot Sauce Guy - If that's the current landscape, then it's more than time for some landscape destruction. Average QBs who can't win games have been getting stupid money for years... we've seen those bad contracts again and again and again. I draw a hard line at the idea of Daniel Jones getting paid $40 million.

I couldn't agree more, as you've seen in my posts in this very topic.

 

[ghostguy123]

Seems like a huge mistake if Jones were to get that kind of money. They'd be better off trading him (if they can) and just drafting someone. Pay the rook the few million and sign several more good players.
It's just a bad idea. Very little upside if any. Oof.
I can't see it. I would be shocked if he got 30 million per year.

 

[Yenrub]

My guess on a contract for Jones is 5 years in the 170 to 180 million range. With 100 million guaranteed.

 

[tribe]

I agree that $40MM seems nutty for Jones.
I also don’t see how people can say he has no upside. He made mass improvements this year. People say they hid him, but they also fail to mention he has played behind consistently one of the worst Olines in football and a receiving core of PS players. He also spent years developing with Jason freaking Garrett as his OC, not to mention Judge and MacaDooDoo. To say he can’t progress with this staff (who he’s only had for a year) with a better supporting cast is unfair.

 

[ghostguy123]

I agree that $40MM seems nutty for Jones.
I also don’t see how people can say he has no upside. He made mass improvements this year. People say they hid him, but they also fail to mention he has played behind consistently one of the worst Olines in football and a receiving core of PS players. He also spent years developing with Jason freaking Garrett as his OC, not to mention Judge and MacaDooDoo. To say he can’t progress with this staff (who he’s only had for a year) with a better supporting cast is unfair.

There's no upside if they sign him to a big deal. His upside probably can't match that dollar amount.
That and if they sign him to a big deal then there's even less chance of improving that roster around him.
I think if they sign him for 30+ million per year they basically be assuring they don't win much of anything the next 5 years.

 

[ghostguy123]

My guess on a contract for Jones is 5 years in the 170 to 180 million range. With 100 million guaranteed.

Total OOF it that happens

 

[The Frankman]

My guess on a contract for Jones is 5 years in the 170 to 180 million range. With 100 million guaranteed.

Total OOF it that happens

... you wanna know what my reaction will be if that happens?

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

My guess on a contract for Jones is 5 years in the 170 to 180 million range. With 100 million guaranteed.

Total OOF it that happens

... you wanna know what my reaction will be if that happens?

I miss that show.

 

[Harry Frogfish]

I don't even get the sentiment that someone will pay Jones $40 million... PFF rates the teams most needy at QB:

New Orleans Saints - Jameis under contract, may stick with Dalton?

They’re interviewing Carr, so I think they’re not satisfied with Dalton/Jameis.

1. Atlanta Falcons - They like Desmond Ridde

I’m not sure they saw enough of him to make that determination.

1. Tennessee Titans - Ryan Tannehill + Malik Willis

Undecided IMO

Miami Dolphins - Tua Tagovailoa

The concussions are a significant concern. I don’t care what flowery answers they give - this is a problem.

1. Tampa Bay Buccaneers - KYLE TRASK FUTURE!

They could use DJ

Baltimore Ravens - Tyler Huntley if Lamar doesn't resign?

I think LJax stays a Raven, but Huntley isn’t great.

What team is going to start a bidding war to pay Jones that money?

I’d say most of the ones I replied about. Should be interesting. Whoever pays him $35M+ is making a mistake IMO.

But then, that’s the current landscape.

WOW.

 

[Faust]

ESPN's Jordan Raanan confirms the "expectation" is that impending free agent Daniel Jones will average more than $35 million per season under his new contract.​

It is not breaking news, though it is now a trend. No fewer than three reports have pegged Jones earning at least $35 million per season, and perhaps as much as $40 million. That's due in part to the fact that the franchise tag for quarterbacks is a cool $32.4 million. Raanan reports the tag is the Giants' "backup option," as they don't want that entire salary on the books for the upcoming year. It's far too much money to be paying Daniel Jones per season, but the Giants seem to want to compete now after looking ahead of schedule with first-year head coach Brian Daboll in 2022.
SOURCE: ESPN
Feb 16, 2023, 6:22 PM ET

 

[The Frankman]

That ESPN report makes me sick.

 

[JAK Straw]

Just feels like reporters speculating, and no actual facts. The only "expectation" is that some reporter said it, so it must be true, and duly retold by another reporter.

 

[The Big Donkey]

That ESPN report makes me sick.

who is your NYG QB next year? roll with Tyrod and a 14-16mm barkley?

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

That ESPN report makes me sick.

who is your NYG QB next year? roll with Tyrod and a 14-16mm barkley?

That’s what I would do if I were Dabol.

He had this much success with Jones, he could probably get as much out of Tyrod.

 

[The Big Donkey]

That ESPN report makes me sick.

who is your NYG QB next year? roll with Tyrod and a 14-16mm barkley?

That’s what I would do if I were Dabol.

He had this much success with Jones, he could probably get as much out of Tyrod.

Tyrod has thrown less than 300 passes after 2017. If you are going with Tyrod why would Schoen bother paying a premium on a RB.

edit: other than face of the franchise, need to keep him for ticket sales.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

That ESPN report makes me sick.

who is your NYG QB next year? roll with Tyrod and a 14-16mm barkley?

That’s what I would do if I were Dabol.

He had this much success with Jones, he could probably get as much out of Tyrod.

Tyrod has thrown less than 300 passes after 2017. If you are going with Tyrod why would Schoen bother paying a premium on a RB.

edit: other than face of the franchise, need to keep him for ticket sales.

Ticket sales, jersey sales, but also winning football.

Taylor may well be able to make a 5 yard dump off to Barkley better than Jones.

If not Taylor, there are plenty of journeymen who might be able to get the job done.

I’m just saying what I think they should do. NYG got a taste of winning & it might be the worst thing for them if they decide they’re a competitive team, and not a team with a ton of holes.

Paying Jones north of $32M or whatever seems like a bad investment to me.

 

[Yenrub]

Kafka coming back should be a good thing for Jones. A second year under Daboll & Kafka has to be better for him than two years under Judge & Garrett.
Obviously assuming he is back with the Giants.

 

[The Big Donkey]

https://twitter.com/JordanRaanan/status/1627422913191108608?cxt=HHwWgICzgYyh4pUtAAAA

"Giants QB Daniel Jones is in the process of making an agent change with new contract + free agency on the horizon, per sources. He was being represented by CAA. Expectation is he’ll be joining Athletes First. Not sure how much impact it will have, but it’s at least interesting."

 

[The Frankman]

https://twitter.com/JordanRaanan/status/1627422913191108608?cxt=HHwWgICzgYyh4pUtAAAA

"Giants QB Daniel Jones is in the process of making an agent change with new contract + free agency on the horizon, per sources. He was being represented by CAA. Expectation is he’ll be joining Athletes First. Not sure how much impact it will have, but it’s at least interesting."

.... well this is getting better every day!

Jones getting paid Top 10 QB money reminds me of the precursors in the early 1920s leading up to the Stock Market Crash of 1929.

 

[Faust]

ProFootballTalk reports that the Giants are likely to franchise tag QB Daniel Jones.​

ProFootballTalk has confirmed that Jones switched agents, which indicates that he is not satisfied with how negotiations have been going with the Giants on a new contract. If Jones is ultimately seeking more than the Giants are willing to pay, that would set up the fifth-year quarterback to receive the franchise tag. The franchise tag would cost the Giants just over $32 million but doesn't require a commitment beyond 2023. One downside of using the tag on Jones is that the option would not be available for Saquon Barkley, who is also an impending free agent. As a result, Barkley could hit the open market, potentially creating a huge payday for the sixth-year running back.
RELATED:

• Saquon Barkley

SOURCE: ProFootballTalk
Feb 20, 2023, 11:12 AM ET

 

[The Frankman]

https://twitter.com/NFL_DovKleiman/status/1627683276881010688

Dov Kleiman

@NFL_DovKleiman

Update: #Giants QB Daniel Jones wants more than New York has offered him. Possibly as much as $45 million per year, or more. A source tells Mike Florio. Jones has recently switched agents, from CAA to Athletes First.

Daniel Jones get the ****ITTY **** off my team.

I legit thought it was a fake tweet when I read this. This clown wants over $40 million a year... You know the worst part of this? Not only will the Gaints lose important parts of their D if they cave in; even tagging Jones means Saquon, his "best friend" who has been supporting Jones and is the only real elite offensive player the Giants have... would walk. The whole point was to let go of sign Jones for cheap and tag Saquon.

 

[travdogg]

https://twitter.com/NFL_DovKleiman/status/1627683276881010688

Dov Kleiman

@NFL_DovKleiman

Update: #Giants QB Daniel Jones wants more than New York has offered him. Possibly as much as $45 million per year, or more. A source tells Mike Florio. Jones has recently switched agents, from CAA to Athletes First.

Daniel Jones get the ****ITTY **** off my team.

I legit thought it was a fake tweet when I read this. This clown wants over $40 million a year... You know the worst part of this? Not only will the Gaints lose important parts of their D if they cave in; even tagging Jones means Saquon, his "best friend" who has been supporting Jones and is the only real elite offensive player the Giants have... would walk. The whole point was to let go of sign Jones for cheap and tag Saquon.

That's crazy. Just sign Jacoby Brissett for 20-25% of that, and possibly have a better QB, and/or draft a rookie. There are arguably 5 rookie QBs in this class who might be better long term investments than Jones.

 

[Mitchie]

Giants about to wreck their franchise.

 

[zamboni]

Giants about to wreck their franchise.

Hearing mixed reports. Some seem to be saying that they'll tag Jones and let Barkley seek FA offers, which is probably the smarter move IMO.

 

[Boston]

I am getting confused...everyone seems to have anointed Daboll as a QB Whisperer...so if after a year with Jones wouldn't the fact he wants to keep him (at least for one more year) means he either believes in him long-term or at least enough to see what the growth is in year 2 of his system?

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Seems like a huge mistake if Jones were to get that kind of money. They'd be better off trading him (if they can) and just drafting someone. Pay the rook the few million and sign several more good players.
It's just a bad idea. Very little upside if any. Oof.
I can't see it. I would be shocked if he got 30 million per year.

Ding! Ding! Ding!

-I cannot wrap my head around a $40M projected salary for Daniel Jones when you likely could not trade him for anything close that would equate to a $40M QB in the NFL.
-Would a team part with multiple 1st round picks for Daniel Jones? I highly doubt it.

It's like suddenly every QB in the NFL, good, bad or just plain average is being slotted for $40M-$50M annual salaries.
We've already seen how bad Arizona is shaping up after crippling the franchise with Murray's new contract. Huge payday, $190M guaranteed and he gets his HC fired, one of his biggest fans from the time he entered the NFL.

 

[zamboni]

I am getting confused...everyone seems to have anointed Daboll as a QB Whisperer...so if after a year with Jones wouldn't the fact he wants to keep him (at least for one more year) means he either believes in him long-term or at least enough to see what the growth is in year 2 of his system?

Agreed. Which is why I think the best move would be to tag Jones and let him play it out one more year to make sure he does grow as a QB, and that last year was not a fluke. If he fails, they have no more commitment to him. Tagging him means Barkley may leave via FA, but as good as Barkley is, they can replace him cheaper in the draft, free agency or both.

 

[zamboni]

It's like suddenly every QB in the NFL, good, bad or just plain average is being slotted for $40M-$50M annual salaries.

Yup - it's gross, but that's the market. And when you see the big turnover in QBs, with a lot of the old guard retiring/past their prime, the number of quality QBs has shrunk. Which drives up the price of any QB showing some semblance of capability, even if not that great.

 

[Boston]

I am getting confused...everyone seems to have anointed Daboll as a QB Whisperer...so if after a year with Jones wouldn't the fact he wants to keep him (at least for one more year) means he either believes in him long-term or at least enough to see what the growth is in year 2 of his system?

Agreed. Which is why I think the best move would be to tag Jones and let him play it out one more year to make sure he does grow as a QB, and that last year was not a fluke. If he fails, they have no more commitment to him. Tagging him means Barkley may leave via FA, but as good as Barkley is, they can replace him cheaper in the draft, free agency or both.

Agreed...said it before but not picking-up the 5th year really backfired on them (although I do understand why they didn't)...last year was the first year Jones received legit coaching in the NFL...gotta believe they want to see him with another year in the system...that being said it is a risk giving him a longer deal with the going rate for QBs...best bet is to tag him, use a decent pick on a rookie and let his play on the field dictate the future.

 

[travdogg]

Seems like a huge mistake if Jones were to get that kind of money. They'd be better off trading him (if they can) and just drafting someone. Pay the rook the few million and sign several more good players.
It's just a bad idea. Very little upside if any. Oof.
I can't see it. I would be shocked if he got 30 million per year.

Ding! Ding! Ding!

-I cannot wrap my head around a $40M projected salary for Daniel Jones when you likely could not trade him for anything close that would equate to a $40M QB in the NFL.
-Would a team part with multiple 1st round picks for Daniel Jones? I highly doubt it.

It's like suddenly every QB in the NFL, good, bad or just plain average is being slotted for $40M-$50M annual salaries.
We've already seen how bad Arizona is shaping up after crippling the franchise with Murray's new contract. Huge payday, $190M guaranteed and he gets his HC fired, one of his biggest fans from the time he entered the NFL.

Slightly off topic, but I think that's unfair to Kyler Murray. His contract had nothing to do with the problems on that team. They got old in too many key spots and had an incompetent HC. Murray was a top-5 QB in 2020-2021. The second he stopped being at that level, the team picking #2 says more about the team than him.

I am getting confused...everyone seems to have anointed Daboll as a QB Whisperer...so if after a year with Jones wouldn't the fact he wants to keep him (at least for one more year) means he either believes in him long-term or at least enough to see what the growth is in year 2 of his system?

Agreed. Which is why I think the best move would be to tag Jones and let him play it out one more year to make sure he does grow as a QB, and that last year was not a fluke. If he fails, they have no more commitment to him. Tagging him means Barkley may leave via FA, but as good as Barkley is, they can replace him cheaper in the draft, free agency or both.

Agreed...said it before but not picking-up the 5th year really backfired on them (although I do understand why they didn't)...last year was the first year Jones received legit coaching in the NFL...gotta believe they want to see him with another year in the system...that being said it is a risk giving him a longer deal with the going rate for QBs...best bet is to tag him, use a decent pick on a rookie and let his play on the field dictate the future.

The interesting thing about Daniel Jones, is I think he's been pretty much the same guy the last 3 seasons. I don't really see any real development, he was just put in far better situations this year, and the OL played better and Barkley was healthy.

 

[Boston]

Seems like a huge mistake if Jones were to get that kind of money. They'd be better off trading him (if they can) and just drafting someone. Pay the rook the few million and sign several more good players.
It's just a bad idea. Very little upside if any. Oof.
I can't see it. I would be shocked if he got 30 million per year.

Ding! Ding! Ding!

-I cannot wrap my head around a $40M projected salary for Daniel Jones when you likely could not trade him for anything close that would equate to a $40M QB in the NFL.
-Would a team part with multiple 1st round picks for Daniel Jones? I highly doubt it.

It's like suddenly every QB in the NFL, good, bad or just plain average is being slotted for $40M-$50M annual salaries.
We've already seen how bad Arizona is shaping up after crippling the franchise with Murray's new contract. Huge payday, $190M guaranteed and he gets his HC fired, one of his biggest fans from the time he entered the NFL.

Slightly off topic, but I think that's unfair to Kyler Murray. His contract had nothing to do with the problems on that team. They got old in too many key spots and had an incompetent HC. Murray was a top-5 QB in 2020-2021. The second he stopped being at that level, the team picking #2 says more about the team than him.

I am getting confused...everyone seems to have anointed Daboll as a QB Whisperer...so if after a year with Jones wouldn't the fact he wants to keep him (at least for one more year) means he either believes in him long-term or at least enough to see what the growth is in year 2 of his system?

Agreed. Which is why I think the best move would be to tag Jones and let him play it out one more year to make sure he does grow as a QB, and that last year was not a fluke. If he fails, they have no more commitment to him. Tagging him means Barkley may leave via FA, but as good as Barkley is, they can replace him cheaper in the draft, free agency or both.

Agreed...said it before but not picking-up the 5th year really backfired on them (although I do understand why they didn't)...last year was the first year Jones received legit coaching in the NFL...gotta believe they want to see him with another year in the system...that being said it is a risk giving him a longer deal with the going rate for QBs...best bet is to tag him, use a decent pick on a rookie and let his play on the field dictate the future.

The interesting thing about Daniel Jones, is I think he's been pretty much the same guy the last 3 seasons. I don't really see any real development, he was just put in far better situations this year, and the OL played better and Barkley was healthy.

Gotta disagree with that...he looked far more composed and had a clue what he was doing...unfortunately for him he had such bad coaches he is a couple of years behind where he should be...that is the rub with Jones...he is not where he should be going into year 5 but he has legit physical tools and with good coaching he has the ability to develop the right way now...year 5 will be very telling...playing like last year is not good enough, he needs to take another big leap if he is going to be worthy of a long term contract...that is why a franchise tag is probably the smart thing for the Giants...gives you one more year to evaluate Jones while also gaining time to plan for plan B should they realize he is not the future.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Seems like a huge mistake if Jones were to get that kind of money. They'd be better off trading him (if they can) and just drafting someone. Pay the rook the few million and sign several more good players.
It's just a bad idea. Very little upside if any. Oof.
I can't see it. I would be shocked if he got 30 million per year.

Ding! Ding! Ding!

-I cannot wrap my head around a $40M projected salary for Daniel Jones when you likely could not trade him for anything close that would equate to a $40M QB in the NFL.
-Would a team part with multiple 1st round picks for Daniel Jones? I highly doubt it.

It's like suddenly every QB in the NFL, good, bad or just plain average is being slotted for $40M-$50M annual salaries.
We've already seen how bad Arizona is shaping up after crippling the franchise with Murray's new contract. Huge payday, $190M guaranteed and he gets his HC fired, one of his biggest fans from the time he entered the NFL.

Slightly off topic, but I think that's unfair to Kyler Murray. His contract had nothing to do with the problems on that team. They got old in too many key spots and had an incompetent HC. Murray was a top-5 QB in 2020-2021. The second he stopped being at that level, the team picking #2 says more about the team than him.

I am getting confused...everyone seems to have anointed Daboll as a QB Whisperer...so if after a year with Jones wouldn't the fact he wants to keep him (at least for one more year) means he either believes in him long-term or at least enough to see what the growth is in year 2 of his system?

Agreed. Which is why I think the best move would be to tag Jones and let him play it out one more year to make sure he does grow as a QB, and that last year was not a fluke. If he fails, they have no more commitment to him. Tagging him means Barkley may leave via FA, but as good as Barkley is, they can replace him cheaper in the draft, free agency or both.

Agreed...said it before but not picking-up the 5th year really backfired on them (although I do understand why they didn't)...last year was the first year Jones received legit coaching in the NFL...gotta believe they want to see him with another year in the system...that being said it is a risk giving him a longer deal with the going rate for QBs...best bet is to tag him, use a decent pick on a rookie and let his play on the field dictate the future.

The interesting thing about Daniel Jones, is I think he's been pretty much the same guy the last 3 seasons. I don't really see any real development, he was just put in far better situations this year, and the OL played better and Barkley was healthy.

Wholeheartedly disagree, Murray acted like a little baby about having the 5th Year option used, went off AZ social media, acted like he was not wanting to discuss anything with them unless they paid him huge money and it sent a bad psychological message to the rest of the team, he absolutely is a contributing factor to their demise and his attitude is atrocious IMO.

Nothing personal Trav, love your posts and threads, not a fan of Murray at all and haven't been since Day 1
You are correct that Murray's salary($47M, cough) isn't the whole story.

 

[Terpman22]

Regardless of how the Giants handle this, I think doubling down after taking a guy 6th overall to now extend him into a tier of contracts he is not worthy of is not great decision making. If you are confident in your coaching/system, what ceiling do they see with Daniel Jones? Sure he improved from a turnover machine to a decent/OK guy, but surely not someone that is winning games "bc of your QB" type of guy.

Also writing on the wall that Quon is gonna be somewhere else next year. As an Eagles fan can't hate on all this.

 

[menobrown]

Gotta disagree with that...he looked far more composed and had a clue what he was doing...unfortunately for him he had such bad coaches he is a couple of years behind where he should be...that is the rub with Jones...he is not where he should be going into year 5 but he has legit physical tools and with good coaching he has the ability to develop the right way now...year 5 will be very telling...playing like last year is not good enough, he needs to take another big leap if he is going to be worthy of a long term contract...that is why a franchise tag is probably the smart thing for the Giants...gives you one more year to evaluate Jones while also gaining time to plan for plan B should they realize he is not the future.

I'm pretty much in agreement except a little off on the bolded.

To me, relative to what he had to work with, I felt that was good enough play to warrant an extension. I really struggle to think of a worst group of pass catchers someone has had to work and I mean even if I go back multiple years.

The guy won a playoff game on the road with Isiah Hodgins as his #1WR. He played really smart football all year, that group of pass catchers does not allow for big passing numbers but 67% completion with a 3 to 1 TD to int ratio while playing winning football is impressive. Obviously mix in what he brings with his athleticism and I think as long as he can play like that, assuming more statistical growth and passing numbers with more help, that's worth an extension to me.

I'm not trying to say this as a knock on Jalen Hurts but if they were on opposite teams last year, with the enourmous difference in supporting cast/OL, that the off-season discussion on their extensions would not also be opposite.

 

[zamboni]

Giants have the 4th highest cap space - I think they’ll find a way to pay both Jones and Barkley to try to run it back another year.

 

[DocHolliday]

Seems like a huge mistake if Jones were to get that kind of money. They'd be better off trading him (if they can) and just drafting someone. Pay the rook the few million and sign several more good players.
It's just a bad idea. Very little upside if any. Oof.
I can't see it. I would be shocked if he got 30 million per year.

Ding! Ding! Ding!

-I cannot wrap my head around a $40M projected salary for Daniel Jones when you likely could not trade him for anything close that would equate to a $40M QB in the NFL.
-Would a team part with multiple 1st round picks for Daniel Jones? I highly doubt it.

It's like suddenly every QB in the NFL, good, bad or just plain average is being slotted for $40M-$50M annual salaries.
We've already seen how bad Arizona is shaping up after crippling the franchise with Murray's new contract. Huge payday, $190M guaranteed and he gets his HC fired, one of his biggest fans from the time he entered the NFL.

Slightly off topic, but I think that's unfair to Kyler Murray. His contract had nothing to do with the problems on that team. They got old in too many key spots and had an incompetent HC. Murray was a top-5 QB in 2020-2021. The second he stopped being at that level, the team picking #2 says more about the team than him.

I am getting confused...everyone seems to have anointed Daboll as a QB Whisperer...so if after a year with Jones wouldn't the fact he wants to keep him (at least for one more year) means he either believes in him long-term or at least enough to see what the growth is in year 2 of his system?

Agreed. Which is why I think the best move would be to tag Jones and let him play it out one more year to make sure he does grow as a QB, and that last year was not a fluke. If he fails, they have no more commitment to him. Tagging him means Barkley may leave via FA, but as good as Barkley is, they can replace him cheaper in the draft, free agency or both.

Agreed...said it before but not picking-up the 5th year really backfired on them (although I do understand why they didn't)...last year was the first year Jones received legit coaching in the NFL...gotta believe they want to see him with another year in the system...that being said it is a risk giving him a longer deal with the going rate for QBs...best bet is to tag him, use a decent pick on a rookie and let his play on the field dictate the future.

The interesting thing about Daniel Jones, is I think he's been pretty much the same guy the last 3 seasons. I don't really see any real development, he was just put in far better situations this year, and the OL played better and Barkley was healthy.

Daniel Jones is not worth $40M a year. He is probably asking for an inflated price but knows he needs to settle for a good amount less.

 

[Boston]

Gotta disagree with that...he looked far more composed and had a clue what he was doing...unfortunately for him he had such bad coaches he is a couple of years behind where he should be...that is the rub with Jones...he is not where he should be going into year 5 but he has legit physical tools and with good coaching he has the ability to develop the right way now...year 5 will be very telling...playing like last year is not good enough, he needs to take another big leap if he is going to be worthy of a long term contract...that is why a franchise tag is probably the smart thing for the Giants...gives you one more year to evaluate Jones while also gaining time to plan for plan B should they realize he is not the future.

I'm pretty much in agreement except a little off on the bolded.

To me, relative to what he had to work with, I felt that was good enough play to warrant an extension. I really struggle to think of a worst group of pass catchers someone has had to work and I mean even if I go back multiple years.

The guy won a playoff game on the road with Isiah Hodgins as his #1WR. He played really smart football all year, that group of pass catchers does not allow for big passing numbers but 67% completion with a 3 to 1 TD to int ratio while playing winning football is impressive. Obviously mix in what he brings with his athleticism and I think as long as he can play like that, assuming more statistical growth and passing numbers with more help, that's worth an extension to me.

I'm not trying to say this as a knock on Jalen Hurts but if they were on opposite teams last year, with the enourmous difference in supporting cast/OL, that the off-season discussion on their extensions would not also be opposite.

i can’t get onboard with that and I am someone who thinks they should stick with him in 2023…I do agree that growth will come from weapons which the Giants need in a big way…but he also needs to continue to develop if your goal is to win a championship and not just be competitive…that means he needs to take a jump from being a QB you can win with to a QB that can win games for you…he took a big step forward last year but if you are saying that his personal development is at it’s peak than he is not worth extending.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Seems like a huge mistake if Jones were to get that kind of money. They'd be better off trading him (if they can) and just drafting someone. Pay the rook the few million and sign several more good players.
It's just a bad idea. Very little upside if any. Oof.
I can't see it. I would be shocked if he got 30 million per year.

Ding! Ding! Ding!

-I cannot wrap my head around a $40M projected salary for Daniel Jones when you likely could not trade him for anything close that would equate to a $40M QB in the NFL.
-Would a team part with multiple 1st round picks for Daniel Jones? I highly doubt it.

It's like suddenly every QB in the NFL, good, bad or just plain average is being slotted for $40M-$50M annual salaries.
We've already seen how bad Arizona is shaping up after crippling the franchise with Murray's new contract. Huge payday, $190M guaranteed and he gets his HC fired, one of his biggest fans from the time he entered the NFL.

Slightly off topic, but I think that's unfair to Kyler Murray. His contract had nothing to do with the problems on that team. They got old in too many key spots and had an incompetent HC. Murray was a top-5 QB in 2020-2021. The second he stopped being at that level, the team picking #2 says more about the team than him.

I am getting confused...everyone seems to have anointed Daboll as a QB Whisperer...so if after a year with Jones wouldn't the fact he wants to keep him (at least for one more year) means he either believes in him long-term or at least enough to see what the growth is in year 2 of his system?

Agreed. Which is why I think the best move would be to tag Jones and let him play it out one more year to make sure he does grow as a QB, and that last year was not a fluke. If he fails, they have no more commitment to him. Tagging him means Barkley may leave via FA, but as good as Barkley is, they can replace him cheaper in the draft, free agency or both.

Agreed...said it before but not picking-up the 5th year really backfired on them (although I do understand why they didn't)...last year was the first year Jones received legit coaching in the NFL...gotta believe they want to see him with another year in the system...that being said it is a risk giving him a longer deal with the going rate for QBs...best bet is to tag him, use a decent pick on a rookie and let his play on the field dictate the future.

The interesting thing about Daniel Jones, is I think he's been pretty much the same guy the last 3 seasons. I don't really see any real development, he was just put in far better situations this year, and the OL played better and Barkley was healthy.

Daniel Jones is not worth $40M a year. He is probably asking for an inflated price but knows he needs to settle for a good amount less.

If there was ever a "Middle Class" in the NFL for Quarterbacks, this would be one of the "Exhibit A" types. If the top QBs get $40M+ and its looking more like $50M annually very soon, that should create a large market of $25M-$30M per year arms that clearly have limitations and are not the same as Mahomes, Burrow and Josh Allen. And many of them are not as good as young arms on rookie contracts like Lawrence and Fields. There has to be some prevailing wisdom by the owners at their meetings to try and persuade others to not pay top dollar for QBs that rarely win Playoff games.

And these middle of the road QBs should be happy to find an 8 figure pay check and thank their lucky stars. Greedy agents and surrounding media is what drives a lot of it IMHO.

 

[menobrown]

to a QB that can win games for you

I thought he did that

if you are saying that his personal development is at it’s peak

No I am not saying that.

 

[travdogg]

Gotta disagree with that...he looked far more composed and had a clue what he was doing...unfortunately for him he had such bad coaches he is a couple of years behind where he should be...that is the rub with Jones...he is not where he should be going into year 5 but he has legit physical tools and with good coaching he has the ability to develop the right way now...year 5 will be very telling...playing like last year is not good enough, he needs to take another big leap if he is going to be worthy of a long term contract...that is why a franchise tag is probably the smart thing for the Giants...gives you one more year to evaluate Jones while also gaining time to plan for plan B should they realize he is not the future.

I 100% agree with the bolded, but I don't think that was Jones playing better, I think that was being better coached. His stats were pretty much in-line with his career, except for fewer turnovers, and more utilization of his legs. I guess what I'm trying to say is, I don't see any reason to think that Jones can improve from what he was this year. I think this is what he is, which is ok, but probably not a guy who should be paid in the top 10-12 of QBs.

Wholeheartedly disagree, Murray acted like a little baby about having the 5th Year option used, went off AZ social media, acted like he was not wanting to discuss anything with them unless they paid him huge money and it sent a bad psychological message to the rest of the team, he absolutely is a contributing factor to their demise and his attitude is atrocious IMO.

Nothing personal Trav, love your posts and threads, not a fan of Murray at all and haven't been since Day 1
You are correct that Murray's salary($47M, cough) isn't the whole story.

I do agree Murray could have certainly handled some things better. But dude also got almost no help at all, between awful playcalling, and horrible injury luck (including his own) for example:

Conner-missed 4 games, and chunks of others
Hopkins-missed roughly half the season
Hollywood-missed 5 games
Moore-missed over half the season
Ertz-missed half the season
3 of their 5 starting OL (the top-3 Humphries, Pugh, Hudson) all missed at least half the season.

I wouldn't have paid Murray what he got, but I bring it up, because I think he's a lot more deserving of it than Jones is. I would easily prefer Murray to Jones. Not that you are making the opposite point (at least I don't think you are?) but Jones wanting 40+ million is crazy. If I were the Giants GM, I'd just laugh for 10 minutes and hang up, and make no counter offer.