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QB Jameis Winston, NYG (4 Viewers)

rdrouyn said:
cstu said:
Jamarcus Winston
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Lol nice try. Having a belly is not the same as being out of shape. Also possible photoshop shenanigans.
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I checked in with QB guru George Whitfield, who is currently coaching the Florida State QB, to see if a) it was Winston, and b) if it was recent.

“The photo of Jameis was taken in early-mid January,” Whitfield said by phone. “If people are saying he looks out of shape – well, did they notice he had the leash tight around his waist? That may have had something to do with it,” he laughed. “Jameis is in shape and doing great. Anyone saying he’s out of shape, they can check him out at the Combine this week.”
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Seems real, you be the judge if he's fat or not.

 
Rotoworld:

Jameis Winston - QB - Seminoles

CBS Sports' Rob Rang believes FSU QB Jameis Winston "is the most mercurial prospect we've seen in five years with franchise quarterback ability but a series of missteps off the field that remind of past busts at his position."

"In a sink-or-swim situation, does a team trust his mental and emotional toughness to persevere when times are tough?" Rang wondered. You're probably aware of Winston's laundry list of off-the-field issues: He has a felony sexual assault charge, an incident in which he yelled an obscenity in a crowded university building, another where he shot a BB gun on campus, and another where he shoplifted crab legs. Many still grade Winston as the class' best prospect.

Source: CBS Sports

Feb 16 - 9:22 PM
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This is not a rhetorical question:

Can anyone think of a player drafted in the first round with glaring off the field concerns who has been successful in the NFL recently? Say, last 5 years? Dez is the only one coming to mind, and he had his bumps in the road.

I don't think there's ever been one at the QB position.

 
Grahamburn said:
This is not a rhetorical question:

Can anyone think of a player drafted in the first round with glaring off the field concerns who has been successful in the NFL recently? Say, last 5 years? Dez is the only one coming to mind, and he had his bumps in the road.

I don't think there's ever been one at the QB position.
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Cam.
 
Get ready for all kinds of Winston interview headlines this week. ESPN & the NFL want this to be a 2 QB draft no matter how low Mariotas stock is dropping. The way to do this is to continue to pile on Winston. There will likely be terms like "undraftable" & "off teams board" thrown around.

 
Grahamburn said:
This is not a rhetorical question:

Can anyone think of a player drafted in the first round with glaring off the field concerns who has been successful in the NFL recently? Say, last 5 years? Dez is the only one coming to mind, and he had his bumps in the road.

I don't think there's ever been one at the QB position.
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He's never been in handcuffs. :shrug:

I get that people think he raped that girl. And if you believe that then you should definitely not want him on your team and instead in jail.

I have a little bit of a legal background. I have read most of the documents. I don't think he raped her. The rape kit is key to me. I do think she had some kind of immediate regrets. JMO

 
Capella said:
Grahamburn said:
This is not a rhetorical question:

Can anyone think of a player drafted in the first round with glaring off the field concerns who has been successful in the NFL recently? Say, last 5 years? Dez is the only one coming to mind, and he had his bumps in the road.

I don't think there's ever been one at the QB position.
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He's never been in handcuffs. :shrug:

I get that people think he raped that girl. And if you believe that then you should definitely not want him on your team and instead in jail.

I have a little bit of a legal background. I have read most of the documents. I don't think he raped her. The rape kit is key to me. I do think she had some kind of immediate regrets. JMO
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I get that and realize it's the standard argument, but we know the authorities botched any chances to indict him for anything. She filed the report without even knowing his identity, so it's not like it was some giant money grab from the beginning. I realize it's possible she made it up, but hers also wasn't the only allegation against this kid.

Throw in the other stuff, yelling at Jimbo on the sideline, etc. He just seems like a headcase. With the nightlife in Tampa I think he's a ticking time bomb.

When he was just playing football as a freshman he was amazing. No doubt about it. Once the off the field stuff started surrounding him his play deteriorated. I don't see how anyone can argue differently. He regressed, big time. The spotlight doesn't get smaller in the NFL.

At best he's kind of a scumbag and a knucklehead. At worst he's a rapist. Should the Bucs really entertain using the #1 pick on him because he played in a pro style offense and made some throws? Scary.

 
Rotoworld:

Fox Sports' Joel Klatt says there would "be no place" for FSU QB Jameis Winston on his team, if he were an NFL decision maker.
"It doesn't matter where the value is," Klatt begins. "If he is on the board in the sixth round, I'd be looking in a different direction for my quarterback..." Klatt says he has spoken with a few GMs who share his mindset, despite Winston being "a wonderful player." Klatt concludes by saying "I would be politely out on the Jameis Winston sweepstakes." Winston is generally considered the top quarterback in this class, and has been mostly associated with the No. 1 pick.

Source: Fox Sports
Feb 17 - 1:22 PM
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Quez said:
Get ready for all kinds of Winston interview headlines this week. ESPN & the NFL want this to be a 2 QB draft no matter how low Mariotas stock is dropping. The way to do this is to continue to pile on Winston. There will likely be terms like "undraftable" & "off teams board" thrown around.
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Faust said:
Rotoworld:

Fox Sports' Joel Klatt says there would "be no place" for FSU QB Jameis Winston on his team, if he were an NFL decision maker.
"It doesn't matter where the value is," Klatt begins. "If he is on the board in the sixth round, I'd be looking in a different direction for my quarterback..." Klatt says he has spoken with a few GMs who share his mindset, despite Winston being "a wonderful player." Klatt concludes by saying "I would be politely out on the Jameis Winston sweepstakes." Winston is generally considered the top quarterback in this class, and has been mostly associated with the No. 1 pick.

Source: Fox Sports
Feb 17 - 1:22 PM
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Faust said:
Rotoworld:

Fox Sports' Joel Klatt says there would "be no place" for FSU QB Jameis Winston on his team, if he were an NFL decision maker.

"It doesn't matter where the value is," Klatt begins. "If he is on the board in the sixth round, I'd be looking in a different direction for my quarterback..." Klatt says he has spoken with a few GMs who share his mindset, despite Winston being "a wonderful player." Klatt concludes by saying "I would be politely out on the Jameis Winston sweepstakes." Winston is generally considered the top quarterback in this class, and has been mostly associated with the No. 1 pick.

Source: Fox Sports

Feb 17 - 1:22 PM
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Sounds like a real moron.

 
Rotoworld:

Jameis Winston - QB - Seminoles

FSU QB Jameis Winston plans on throwing at the NFL Combine, according to Ian Rapoport.

Like with Mariota, do not read into a poor throwing performance. Keep your sanity. Either way, Winston will try to show off improvements in his throwing mechanics, specifically his motion. But, in most cases we have seen quarterbacks revert to bad habits once pressured. It is not as critical as made out to be anyways. It is refreshing to see both Winston and Mariota throw at the event.

Source: Ian Rapoport on Twitter

Feb 17 - 11:09 PM
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Capella said:
Faust said:
Rotoworld:

Fox Sports' Joel Klatt says there would "be no place" for FSU QB Jameis Winston on his team, if he were an NFL decision maker.

"It doesn't matter where the value is," Klatt begins. "If he is on the board in the sixth round, I'd be looking in a different direction for my quarterback..." Klatt says he has spoken with a few GMs who share his mindset, despite Winston being "a wonderful player." Klatt concludes by saying "I would be politely out on the Jameis Winston sweepstakes." Winston is generally considered the top quarterback in this class, and has been mostly associated with the No. 1 pick.

Source: Fox Sports

Feb 17 - 1:22 PM
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Sounds like a real moron.
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Sure.. If Winston was available for a sixth round pick, he'd pass. Right. What a blow hard. When I read a statement like that I just ignore anything else said because clearly the person is full of it.

 
Grahamburn said:
Most media outlets in Tampa are talking like it's Winston and it isn't close.
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If they are comfortable with Winston, the person. Then this is the right call. He's a better prospect than Mariota. For TB sake, assuming they are telling the truth, I hope they are right.

 
Not for nothing because I have no dog in this fight, but if Winston were available in the sixth, it's because nobody else believed in him, so his trade value would be zilch unless you started him. It's not easy to trade nfl players in the first place, and a good offseason would mean nothing to a team that already passed on him. A good preseason game or two would mean nothing, and a good regular season game wouldn't mean much either.

What you really need is time. He has to not so anything knuckle headed for a couple years. He needs to survive a signing bonus, and a losing streak, and a winning streak, and a first offseason. He needs to show up first and leave last and be a film guy. He needs to give good interviews and be the gave of a franchise for a while. He needs to hit an open receiver, have them drop the ball, or run the wrong route, and take the blame in the past game press conference. And on top of all that, he has to play good, too.

That's a lot to ask, which is why if you see a guy who can do some or even most of that stuff you take him first overall when you could literally take anyone else coming out of college or get a ton of picks instead.

But if you don't think he can do all that, you just plain can't take him. because even at a discount, the real gamble you take with a guy like that isn't just the pick you have to spend on him, but the fact you have to start him for an extended period of time to find out what you've got. You're investing the franchise direction for a year or more in the guy, on top of whichever pick he costs.

So if you wouldn't take him 1.1, it's because you aren't willing to make that investment, which means you probably shouldn't take him at 2.1 or 3.1 or 6.1 either.

I haven't formed that strong of am opinion on him either way, but it's perfectly valid to take him off your board.

 
I believe that Glennon is the future

teach him well and let him lead the way

show him that receivers can run outside

Give him a sense of pride when he throws easy routes

let the corners' laughter remind us that there's a whole field

Mike decided long ago

never to throw a post or a fade route

if I fail or I succeed

at least I'll have a high completion

They can't take it away if I don't throw deep

because the greatest schlub of all

Is already on your team

I found the greatest schlub of all

In round number three

 
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Grahamburn said:
Capella said:
Grahamburn said:
This is not a rhetorical question:

Can anyone think of a player drafted in the first round with glaring off the field concerns who has been successful in the NFL recently? Say, last 5 years? Dez is the only one coming to mind, and he had his bumps in the road.

I don't think there's ever been one at the QB position.
Click to expand...
He's never been in handcuffs. :shrug:

I get that people think he raped that girl. And if you believe that then you should definitely not want him on your team and instead in jail.

I have a little bit of a legal background. I have read most of the documents. I don't think he raped her. The rape kit is key to me. I do think she had some kind of immediate regrets. JMO
Click to expand...
I get that and realize it's the standard argument, but we know the authorities botched any chances to indict him for anything. She filed the report without even knowing his identity, so it's not like it was some giant money grab from the beginning. I realize it's possible she made it up, but hers also wasn't the only allegation against this kid.

Throw in the other stuff, yelling at Jimbo on the sideline, etc. He just seems like a headcase. With the nightlife in Tampa I think he's a ticking time bomb.

When he was just playing football as a freshman he was amazing. No doubt about it. Once the off the field stuff started surrounding him his play deteriorated. I don't see how anyone can argue differently. He regressed, big time. The spotlight doesn't get smaller in the NFL.

At best he's kind of a scumbag and a knucklehead. At worst he's a rapist. Should the Bucs really entertain using the #1 pick on him because he played in a pro style offense and made some throws? Scary.
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How many tickets and jerseys will he sell? And for how long?

The front office is also involved in the decision.

 
bostonfred said:
Not for nothing because I have no dog in this fight, but if Winston were available in the sixth, it's because nobody else believed in him, so his trade value would be zilch unless you started him. It's not easy to trade nfl players in the first place, and a good offseason would mean nothing to a team that already passed on him. A good preseason game or two would mean nothing, and a good regular season game wouldn't mean much either.

What you really need is time. He has to not so anything knuckle headed for a couple years. He needs to survive a signing bonus, and a losing streak, and a winning streak, and a first offseason. He needs to show up first and leave last and be a film guy. He needs to give good interviews and be the gave of a franchise for a while. He needs to hit an open receiver, have them drop the ball, or run the wrong route, and take the blame in the past game press conference. And on top of all that, he has to play good, too.

That's a lot to ask, which is why if you see a guy who can do some or even most of that stuff you take him first overall when you could literally take anyone else coming out of college or get a ton of picks instead.

But if you don't think he can do all that, you just plain can't take him. because even at a discount, the real gamble you take with a guy like that isn't just the pick you have to spend on him, but the fact you have to start him for an extended period of time to find out what you've got. You're investing the franchise direction for a year or more in the guy, on top of whichever pick he costs.

So if you wouldn't take him 1.1, it's because you aren't willing to make that investment, which means you probably shouldn't take him at 2.1 or 3.1 or 6.1 either.

I haven't formed that strong of am opinion on him either way, but it's perfectly valid to take him off your board.
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You thought about it 10 layers deeper than the guy who made the actual statement.

 
Rotoworld:

Ryan Flaherty, who has helped FSU QB Jameis Winston prepare for the Combine, says the QB played the 2014 season around 248 pounds.
Flaherty says Winston has lost around 15 pounds since he began training for Indianapolis and currently weighs 231. Jameis was listed at 6'4/230 pounds, so this might be the first time a non-nose tackle was listed at a smaller size. Regardless, we would not read too much into Winston's weight.

Source: Josh Norris on Twitter
Feb 18 - 10:19 AM
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msommer said:
How many tickets and jerseys will he sell? And for how long?

The front office is also involved in the decision.
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I don't think this matters in this case. This isn't Tebow/Jax or Manziel/Cowboys.

Winston would typically sell more as a Nole, but he's so polarizing with the Gators around here...that is negated.

It'll all be about performance.

 
Honestly it's not a terrible thing for a big QB to be a tad overweight. I can't imagine Ben or Stafford would look terrific without their shirts on.

 
gump said:
msommer said:
How many tickets and jerseys will he sell? And for how long?

The front office is also involved in the decision.
Click to expand...
I don't think this matters in this case. This isn't Tebow/Jax or Manziel/Cowboys.

Winston would typically sell more as a Nole, but he's so polarizing with the Gators around here...that is negated.

It'll all be about performance.
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Fans want wins and an entertaining product. Polarizing is an understatement. There's an anti-Jameis petition circulating with plenty of Bucs' fans signing it.

If he's the pick and turns out to be a stud all of this stuff will be a whisper, but if he's getting spotted out partying at Mons and 2001 and then playing poorly on Sunday this will not end well.

 
Grahamburn said:
gump said:
msommer said:
How many tickets and jerseys will he sell? And for how long?

The front office is also involved in the decision.
Click to expand...
I don't think this matters in this case. This isn't Tebow/Jax or Manziel/Cowboys.

Winston would typically sell more as a Nole, but he's so polarizing with the Gators around here...that is negated.

It'll all be about performance.
Click to expand...
Fans want wins and an entertaining product. Polarizing is an understatement. There's an anti-Jameis petition circulating with plenty of Bucs' fans signing it.

If he's the pick and turns out to be a stud all of this stuff will be a whisper, but if he's getting spotted out partying at Mons and 2001 and then playing poorly on Sunday this will not end well.
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With what just happened with Manziel, teams should want nothing to do with this guy.

 
cstu said:
Grahamburn said:
gump said:
msommer said:
How many tickets and jerseys will he sell? And for how long?

The front office is also involved in the decision.
Click to expand...
I don't think this matters in this case. This isn't Tebow/Jax or Manziel/Cowboys.

Winston would typically sell more as a Nole, but he's so polarizing with the Gators around here...that is negated.

It'll all be about performance.
Click to expand...
Fans want wins and an entertaining product. Polarizing is an understatement. There's an anti-Jameis petition circulating with plenty of Bucs' fans signing it.

If he's the pick and turns out to be a stud all of this stuff will be a whisper, but if he's getting spotted out partying at Mons and 2001 and then playing poorly on Sunday this will not end well.
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With what just happened with Manziel, teams should want nothing to do with this guy.
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I agree with you. Especially at the #1 pick where there is a perfectly capable alternative. Mariota's "flaws" can be improved with coaching, hard work, and dedication. I'm terrified they're going to take Jameis and he's going to make this franchise more of a laughing stock. If that's possible.

 
mr roboto said:
Grahamburn said:
mr roboto said:
I'm reticent of Winston but the Manziel comps are a bit overblown iMO.
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It's been a while since Winston has really done anything significantly negative.
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He's a knucklehead but is he know as a full blown alcoholic with questionable work ethic? He's also the prototypical size and skill combo. Johnny isn't.
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From what I've read he was a model citizen this season other than the eff her right in the P thing.

 
Capella said:
Light and Lovie were practically gushing today. It's obvious to everyone except Cstu who the pick is.
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Luckily I'm not a Bucs fan. If you guys are happy with it that's all that matters.

The Titans will be thrilled to have him.

 
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Lovie Smith: Marcus Mariota remains in picture

February, 18, 2015

By Pat Yasinskas | ESPN.com

INDIANAPOLIS -- There's a growing school of thought that the Tampa Bay Buccaneers have already zeroed in on Florida State quarterback Jameis Winston with the first overall pick in the NFL draft.

But coach Lovie Smith made it clear several times at the scouting combine Wednesday that Oregon quarterback Marcus Mariota remains in the picture. For that matter, Smith and general manager Jason Licht wouldn't say with certainty that the Bucs will draft a quarterback. But all indications are they will.

Although the majority of questions asked of Smith were about Winston, the coach made it clear he likes Mariota.

"He's big, he's strong, he's got a strong arm, all of the throws that a quarterback is to make, we've seen him make those throws," Smith said. "He's athletic, he can buy time with his feet. The amount of interceptions he's thrown, I know a lot of the passes he's thrown are screens. But you can't blame him for the system. That's where he is and they won a lot of games with that system. But a part of that system is throwing the ball also."

Some of those already drawing conclusions that Winston will be the pick are citing that he played in a pro-style offense in college. Mariota played in a spread system. But Smith said he thinks Mariota can be a successful NFL quarterback.

"I've heard a lot about this pro-style system in college," Smith said. "But I think if you look at a quarterback, yeah, I think there are some offenses you can run in college that maybe will get you more ready to make that transition. But it's a transition for any college player coming into the NFL.

"In Marcus' case, yeah, he ran an offense that most teams in the league don't run. But I see him scrambling around, I see him making decisions, I see him -- for the most part -- making most of the throws that he'll be making in the league. If you look in our league right now, there are different quarterbacks. There are some mobile quarterbacks. There are some more drop-back pocket quarterbacks. There are guys having success doing it a lot of different ways."
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cstu said:
Capella said:
Light and Lovie were practically gushing today. It's obvious to everyone except Cstu who the pick is.
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Luckily I'm not a Bucs fan. If you guys are happy with it that's all that matters.

The Titans will be thrilled to have him.
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I still think it's crazy to imagine it's clear to anyone -- inside the organization or out -- who the pick is. :shrug:

Everything about Winston that might drive people away is going to either be magnified or go away once teams start grilling him in one-on-one time. I think QB's really need to impress the brass if they're going to merit a very top pick. And I'm not sure either QB here can pull it off. Mariotta seems like a major introvert, and Winston just doesn't seem to have much on the ball. I expect both guys to shine in throwing/performance drills.

 
"I see him making decisions, I see him -- for the most part -- making most of the throws that he'll be making in the league."

I hear people saying the opposite -- saying they haven't seen that. He throws bubble screens and five-yard, first-read passes. He's not asked to go through progressions. There's a lot of stuff he'll need to do that nobody has seen him do. Mainly this is Cosell. But I just heard Matt Waldman say he would pass on both these two top guys if he was in the top six pickers.

I don't know, myself. I just like watching the argument/debate at this time of year. Lots of fun.

 
mr roboto said:
Grahamburn said:
mr roboto said:
I'm reticent of Winston but the Manziel comps are a bit overblown iMO.
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It's been a while since Winston has really done anything significantly negative.
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He's a knucklehead but is he know as a full blown alcoholic with questionable work ethic? He's also the prototypical size and skill combo. Johnny isn't.
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My comparison was to point out that this decision will not be made because Jameis will drive sales...like Manziel did or would have as a Cowboy even more. CSTU took that and ran with it.

 
Jameis Winston: Trying to avoid doing something dumb for 4 months

Well, getting drafted by the Bucs would certainly end that streak.

 
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