QB Jameis Winston, NYG (3 Viewers)

[davearm]

The civil case is against FSU, not Winston. Sure it will certainly hang over him while it's ongoing, but his case is closed. He was found not guilty. We could argue about that decision being reached because a lack of evidence or mishandling of the situation until we're blue in the face, but the system has spoken and he was cleared.

His case is not closed. The DA could bring criminal charges against Winston at any time.He was most certainly not found not guilty, nor was he cleared. There wasn't even a trial.

And none of the above have any bearing on a potential civil suit against Winston.

 

[werdnoynek]

The civil case is against FSU, not Winston. Sure it will certainly hang over him while it's ongoing, but his case is closed. He was found not guilty. We could argue about that decision being reached because a lack of evidence or mishandling of the situation until we're blue in the face, but the system has spoken and he was cleared.

His case is not closed. The DA could bring criminal charges against Winston at any time.He was most certainly not found not guilty, nor was he cleared. There wasn't even a trial.

And none of the above have any bearing on a potential civil suit against Winston.

Alright, so he could be guilty he could be not guilty, I guess misworded that.

There wasn't enough evidence to prosecute. Do you see that changing 3 years later?

 

[davearm]

The civil case is against FSU, not Winston. Sure it will certainly hang over him while it's ongoing, but his case is closed. He was found not guilty. We could argue about that decision being reached because a lack of evidence or mishandling of the situation until we're blue in the face, but the system has spoken and he was cleared.

His case is not closed. The DA could bring criminal charges against Winston at any time.He was most certainly not found not guilty, nor was he cleared. There wasn't even a trial.

And none of the above have any bearing on a potential civil suit against Winston.

Alright, so he could be guilty he could be not guilty, I guess misworded that.

There wasn't enough evidence to prosecute. Do you see that changing 3 years later?

Nope. Not in the absence of new info coming out.I think there is zero question that the accuser feels she was raped. Doesn't make it true of course. Ultimately what it boils down to is, what happened and what a prosecutor can prove happened are very different things. Just don't equate that with him being exonerated. He wasn't.

Go Badgers!

 

[cstu]

Why Rose Bowl tape, not score, shows Winston is superior NFL QB to Mariota

This is what Cardinals coach Bruce Arians said at the combine about the quarterbacks coming out of college now: "So many times, you're evaluating a quarterback who has never called a play in the huddle, never used a snap count. They hold up a card on he sideline, he kicks his foot and throws the ball. That ain't playing quarterback. There's no leadership involved there. There might be leadership on the bench, but you get them and they have to use verbiage and they have to spit the verbiage out and change the snap count, they are light years behind."

It's almost as if he was talking specifically about Mariota.

But yet he prefers Mariota.

 

[cstu]

Russ Lande thinks he'll be a bust.

 

[gump]

I've talked to at least 50 coaches and personnel people about these two quarterbacks, and, almost to a man, they prefer Winston. They are intrigued with Mariota, although a handful of them think he could be a bust.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/writer/pete-prisco/25133258/why-rose-bowl-tape-not-score-shows-winston-is-superior-nfl-qb-to-mariota

 

[jurb26]

I've talked to at least 50 coaches and personnel people about these two quarterbacks, and, almost to a man, they prefer Winston. They are intrigued with Mariota, although a handful of them think he could be a bust.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/writer/pete-prisco/25133258/why-rose-bowl-tape-not-score-shows-winston-is-superior-nfl-qb-to-mariota

But Oregon won the game and Mariota had better stats. He must have played better.

 

[werdnoynek]

Russ Lande thinks he'll be a bust.

Lande thought Ryan Nassib was the best QB in the 2013 draft too. While it an historically bad year at QB, I'd have a hard time putting a lot of faith his in QB evaluations.

 

[Faust]

Rotoworld:

Jameis Winston - QB - Seminoles

Tampa Bay Times beat writer Greg Auman said of Florida State QB Jameis Winston: "He's the guy. He's the No. 1 pick."

Auman made the comment during an appearance on CBS Sports Radio. At this point, assertions like these almost aren't even blurb worthy. Winston is absolutely going No. 1 to the Bucs unless something crazy happens over the next three-plus weeks. This is the way ESPN's Todd McShay put it: "The only way Jameis Winston is not the first pick is if ... information gets gathered from his past that has not yet been found. Or if Jameis does something off the field that makes Tampa Bay reconsider."

Source: Damon Amendolara on Twitter

Apr 2 - 10:26 PM

 

[lod01]

Russ Lande thinks he'll be a bust.

Because he will be a bust. He screams bust but these so called analysts are afraid to come out and say it. Of course, no one ever gets fired for being wrong about a franchise QB except the guy who actually listened to these so-called analysts and picked the bum.

 

[lod01]

Russ Lande thinks he'll be a bust.

Lande thought Ryan Nassib was the best QB in the 2013 draft too. While it an historically bad year at QB, I'd have a hard time putting a lot of faith his in QB evaluations.

He's correct on this also. Nassib is stuck behind Gomer. Not that it will take much to be considered the best of the group but he certainly has a shot.

 

[cstu]

I've talked to at least 50 coaches and personnel people about these two quarterbacks, and, almost to a man, they prefer Winston. They are intrigued with Mariota, although a handful of them think he could be a bust.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/writer/pete-prisco/25133258/why-rose-bowl-tape-not-score-shows-winston-is-superior-nfl-qb-to-mariota

Someone is getting misinformation - who do you think it getting more accurate information - beat writer Prisco or scout Chris Landry?

Listened to an interview with scout Chris Landry and he had a lot of interesting things to say:- Bucs are not decided on Winston or Mariota (this was before they spent 3 days with him). He's been told by Bucs personnel where they are leaning but refused to say anything because it might be misinformation. Also if true he didn't want to hurt his insider access by revealing it.

- Said he verified that Winston was 252 during the championship game, 262 after his ankle injury last year, quickly got down to 242, and then got down to 231 for the combine.

- Said the following people preferred Mariota over Winston (tape only): Sean Payton, Kubiak, Bill O'Brien (preferred Petty over both), Pep Hamilton, Doug Peterson, Darrel Bevell, Bill Lazor, Tom Clements and Mike McCarthy, Norv Turner, Josh McDaniels, and Arians.

- 6 coaches and 4 GM's preferred Winston - Mike Shula, Marty Mornhinweg, Joe Philbin, Hue Jackson, Jed Finch, Frank Reich, GM's Doug Whaley, Scot McCloughan, Ryan Grigson, Dave Caldwell.

- Said he was more concerned about Winston's coachability than Mariota's adjustment to the NFL but he felt better about it after talking to Winston.

- Said he didn't care what the Mayock's and McShay's have to say, they're not scouts and don't do what we do.

 

[cstu]

The civil case is against FSU, not Winston. Sure it will certainly hang over him while it's ongoing, but his case is closed. He was found not guilty. We could argue about that decision being reached because a lack of evidence or mishandling of the situation until we're blue in the face, but the system has spoken and he was cleared.

His case is not closed. The DA could bring criminal charges against Winston at any time.He was most certainly not found not guilty, nor was he cleared. There wasn't even a trial.

And none of the above have any bearing on a potential civil suit against Winston.

Alright, so he could be guilty he could be not guilty, I guess misworded that.

There wasn't enough evidence to prosecute. Do you see that changing 3 years later?

He's not going to be criminally charged - FSU did their job there. However, there's still the case against FSU and he is about to be hit with a civil suit.

 

[lod01]

- Said the following people preferred Mariota over Winston (tape only): Sean Payton, Kubiak, Bill O'Brien (preferred Petty over both), Pep Hamilton, Doug Peterson, Darrel Bevell, Bill Lazor, Tom Clements and Mike McCarthy, Norv Turner, Josh McDaniels, and Arians.

- 6 coaches and 4 GM's preferred Winston - Mike Shula, Marty Mornhinweg, Joe Philbin, Hue Jackson, Jed Finch, Frank Reich, GM's Doug Whaley, Scot McCloughan, Ryan Grigson, Dave Caldwell.

So a crew of real losers favor Winston and guys that have actually been winners prefer Mariota.

 

[massraider]

I've talked to at least 50 coaches and personnel people about these two quarterbacks, and, almost to a man, they prefer Winston. They are intrigued with Mariota, although a handful of them think he could be a bust.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/writer/pete-prisco/25133258/why-rose-bowl-tape-not-score-shows-winston-is-superior-nfl-qb-to-mariota

Someone is getting misinformation - who do you think it getting more accurate information - beat writer Prisco or scout Chris Landry?

Landry is a writer, with a website (only 99.99 a year). He has been a scout before.

He and Prisco are in the same business. Read my stuff, and I get paid.

 

[jurb26]

If cloud think cstu hadnt lost all credibility when it comes to Winston months ago, you simply haven't been paying attention.

Really it's been nice comic relief for the thread, though. So I say carry on.

Letting it go, enjoy your stud QB.

I don't think you let it go.

 

[massraider]

If cloud think cstu hadnt lost all credibility when it comes to Winston months ago, you simply haven't been paying attention.

Really it's been nice comic relief for the thread, though. So I say carry on.

Letting it go, enjoy your stud QB.

I don't think you let it go.

 

[Freelove]

- Said the following people preferred Mariota over Winston (tape only): Sean Payton, Kubiak, Bill O'Brien (preferred Petty over both), Pep Hamilton, Doug Peterson, Darrel Bevell, Bill Lazor, Tom Clements and Mike McCarthy, Norv Turner, Josh McDaniels, and Arians.

- 6 coaches and 4 GM's preferred Winston - Mike Shula, Marty Mornhinweg, Joe Philbin, Hue Jackson, Jed Finch, Frank Reich, GM's Doug Whaley, Scot McCloughan, Ryan Grigson, Dave Caldwell.

So a crew of real losers favor Winston and guys that have actually been winners prefer Mariota.

People who are good at practically anything understand the value of safe, incremental improvement, understanding that over the long run, the multiplying effects of good, safe, sensible decisions tend to outrace the rash.People who aren't good at things tend to buy lottery tickets and chase get-rich-quick dreams.

You don't need to get the best player in the draft with the first pick. You just need to be as certain as possible that you get a damn good one. Maximizing that certainty, rather than rolling the dice on the upside of any individual player, is what separates the good franchises from the bad ones.

 

[werdnoynek]

The civil case is against FSU, not Winston. Sure it will certainly hang over him while it's ongoing, but his case is closed. He was found not guilty. We could argue about that decision being reached because a lack of evidence or mishandling of the situation until we're blue in the face, but the system has spoken and he was cleared.

His case is not closed. The DA could bring criminal charges against Winston at any time.He was most certainly not found not guilty, nor was he cleared. There wasn't even a trial.

And none of the above have any bearing on a potential civil suit against Winston.

Alright, so he could be guilty he could be not guilty, I guess misworded that.

There wasn't enough evidence to prosecute. Do you see that changing 3 years later?

He's not going to be criminally charged - FSU did their job there. However, there's still the case against FSU and he is about to be hit with a civil suit.

IF he is hit with a civil suit, it will be settled outside of court with little to no publicity... as I said before, see Roethlisberger.

 

[Biabreakable]

Is Jameis Winston the Next Ben Roethlisberger?

 

[gump]

I've talked to at least 50 coaches and personnel people about these two quarterbacks, and, almost to a man, they prefer Winston. They are intrigued with Mariota, although a handful of them think he could be a bust.http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/writer/pete-prisco/25133258/why-rose-bowl-tape-not-score-shows-winston-is-superior-nfl-qb-to-mariota

Someone is getting misinformation - who do you think it getting more accurate information - beat writer Prisco or scout Chris Landry?

Landry is a writer, with a website (only 99.99 a year). He has been a scout before.

He and Prisco are in the same business. Read my stuff, and I get paid.

Tweedle dee and dum think the Bucs answer for the most important decision in sports is only one they would make, along with losers and Floridians. All the smart people would answer differently.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

Is Jameis Winston the Next Ben Roethlisberger?

thought that was going to be about the raping

 

[cstu]

I've talked to at least 50 coaches and personnel people about these two quarterbacks, and, almost to a man, they prefer Winston. They are intrigued with Mariota, although a handful of them think he could be a bust.http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/writer/pete-prisco/25133258/why-rose-bowl-tape-not-score-shows-winston-is-superior-nfl-qb-to-mariota

Someone is getting misinformation - who do you think it getting more accurate information - beat writer Prisco or scout Chris Landry?

Landry is a writer, with a website (only 99.99 a year). He has been a scout before.

He and Prisco are in the same business. Read my stuff, and I get paid.

Tweedle dee and dum think the Bucs answer for the most important decision in sports is only one they would make, along with losers and Floridians. All the smart people would answer differently.

Chris Landry has spent a lifetime in football, having served as Coach, Scout and Administrator at the College Football and NFL levels.

Currently, Chris operates his own Coaching and Scouting Consulting business serving both NFL organizations and College Football programs in the areas of pro and college personnel, recruiting, advance scouting as well as coaching assessment, development and searches.

Prior to venturing out on his own, he served as both a Pro and College Scout for the Houston Oilers and Tennessee Titans while also serving as the Coordinator of their Scouting department.

Landry was selected to serve as the Coordinator of the NFL Scouting Combine in 1993 where he oversaw the selection and operation process of the top draft prospects.

Chris began his NFL career with the Cleveland Browns working on the coaching staff as well as in both pro personnel and college scouting.

Landry began his coaching career as a student assistant at LSU in the mid 1980’s, working his way up to a full time position before being hired by Bill Belichick and the Browns in 1992.

While working as a young coach at LSU, Landry also maintained a part time scouting position with one of the NFL’s scouting arms, BLESTO.

Pete Prisco has covered the NFL for three decades, including working as a beat reporter in Jacksonville for the Jaguars. He hosted his own radio show for seven years, and can be seen throughout the week on CBS Sports' NFL shows.

 

[Faust]

Rotoworld:

Jameis Winston - QB - Seminoles

ESPN's Kevin Weidl cites Ben Roethlisberger and Matt Ryan as Florida State QB Jameis Winston's two best scouting comparisons.

The company's Stats & Information Group department offered Ryan, Chad Henne and Blake Bortles as statistically similar prospects. "The size and athleticism aspect is the only thing I see in common with Bortles and Henne," Weidl wrote. "Winston is far more advanced than both of those players were when they were coming out. He is similar to Ryan from a mental aspect and in their confidence to take risks and throw with anticipation. Remember, Ryan had 19 interceptions in his last season at Boston College, which is similar to Winston's 18 in 2014. There is not an ideal comparison for Winston. In terms of his ability to deliver in a crowd, there is some Roethlisberger in his tape." Winston (6-foot-4, 231 pounds) has a very similar build to both Bortles (6-5, 232) and Ryan (6-5, 228).

Source: ESPN Insider

Apr 3 - 10:44 PM

 

[cstu]

Writer-director Kirby ****, whose new documentary examining campus sexual assaults is getting national attention, says Erica Kinsman "wanted her side told."

Kinsman, 20, of Zephyrhills makes her first public comments in The Hunting Ground as she describes a violent, possibly drug-impaired encounter with a man she later identified as Florida State Seminoles quarterback Jameis Winston.

"What struck me about Erica is how sort of consistent her story has been, and how level-headed her presentation has been. She's been very precise and thoughtful," **** said in a telephone interview. "I've done hundreds of interviews with survivors, and I didn't see any attempt to sort of exaggerate or anything like that."

No charges were filed against Winston due to a lack of evidence.

The Oscar-nominated filmmaker, who challenges that decision in The Hunting Ground, recently visited Tallahassee to speak at the film's screenings. "One person said this was the first time she'd ever been in a public situation where the name Erica Kinsman was discussed in a positive light," he said.

Kinsman's story occupies the third act of the film, which opens locally Sunday exclusively at Tampa Theatre. The documentary includes segments from women and one man who recount how they were raped by classmates at their universities and then brushed off by administrators and investigators. Some were publicly criticized for speaking out, none more than Kinsman, due to the high profile and popularity of Winston, 21, who is expected to be taken No. 1 in this month's NFL draft by the Tampa Bay Buccaneers.

Soon after her identity was revealed online, FSU football fans began discrediting, insulting, even threatening Kinsman on social media sites and in public. Kinsman withdrew from FSU within a few days of her accusation becoming public.

Reliving that experience for the camera wasn't an easy decision, **** said.

"Certainly Erica experienced a great deal of vitriol. Also I think she's a very private person to start with. She took some time before she said yes. … But so much was being heard — the other side of the story — and she wanted her side told," he said.

**** said no money was paid to Kinsman or any interview subject in The Hunting Ground. He also spoke to a claim by FSU president John Thrasher that his office wasn't allowed enough time to respond to the film's charges of neglect in handling Kinsman's case.

"They were given two months to respond before we completed the film," **** said. "They didn't contact us until just several days before it would be theatrically released (Feb. 27 in New York and Los Angeles). We reached out to several dozen presidents and very few of them responded at all. Or if they did respond it was to decline interviews.

"A part of the problem is that you don't see college presidents willing to speak out on this issue … because then people will say, oh, that must be 'the rape campus.' "

At least one disputed part of Kinsman's narrative passes without **** providing all the facts. She recalls drinking a shot at a Tallahassee nightclub. "I'm fairly certain there was something in that drink," she says in the movie. However, no drugs were found in her system, a point The Hunting Ground never mentions.

"We spoke to an expert at the FBI who deals with these cases all the time," **** said. "He pointed out that in many of these (cases) they don't test for all the drugs that are out there. Obviously there are new drugs coming on the market all the time."

The Hunting Ground completes ****'s unofficial trilogy of documentaries on sexual abuse in trusted institutions. He earned Academy Award nominations for The Invisible War (rape in the military) and Twist of Faith (molestation by a Catholic priest).

 

[TwinTurbo]

I just can't get past his personal fitness issues. He looks like he's cornered the market on baby fat. I realize you don't need to be shredded to play the QB position and a bigger QB can hold up to more hits. But he's only 21 and has zero muscle tone and doesn't appear to even be trying to take his fitness to the next level prior to the draft.

Of course, everybody's favorite fat QB Jared Lorezen thinks its a plus and said "He's only 21 and he doesn't even have his grown man body yet. He's gonna get bigger and faster." Unfortunately, I think the opposite is true. If he looks like this now, just imagine when he's 30 if he manages to make it that far in this career.

 

[bucsbaby]

Still think we'll look back and say in hindsight that all the signs were there that he would be a bust

 

[massraider]

Still think we'll look back and say in hindsight that all the signs were there that he would be a bust

It's possible. I'd be scared, he's obviously not a sure thing, and there's no way of knowing if his immaturity is a real thing that's going to hinder him.

It's also scary that Mariota hasn't made a ton of NFL throws, but you could talk about the offenses of a TON of college QBs, including Cam Newton, Sam Bradford, Derek Carr, Aaron Rodgers, and on and on.

I think there's enough questions for both that as a fan, the only thing to do is get on board, and hope for the best. NOT taking a QB is really not an option. Taking a Leo Williams or whoever might be a great pick, but if he and Gerald McCoy aren't on a team with a legit QB, they may just wind up being Lee Roy Selmon. You go and get QBs until you get the right one. Seattle went and got a bunch of QBs, then drafted Wilson. Hell, Cleveland should go after Mariota if they think he's the goods, Manziel or not.

A first round bust doesn't set a team back ten years, half the teams in the first round bust on their top pick. But missing out on a ten year starter at QB can contribute to spinning your wheels for ten more years.

 

[werdnoynek]

Still think we'll look back and say in hindsight that all the signs were there that he would be a bust

It's possible. I'd be scared, he's obviously not a sure thing, and there's no way of knowing if his immaturity is a real thing that's going to hinder him.

It's also scary that Mariota hasn't made a ton of NFL throws, but you could talk about the offenses of a TON of college QBs, including Cam Newton, Sam Bradford, Derek Carr, Aaron Rodgers, and on and on.

I think there's enough questions for both that as a fan, the only thing to do is get on board, and hope for the best. NOT taking a QB is really not an option. Taking a Leo Williams or whoever might be a great pick, but if he and Gerald McCoy aren't on a team with a legit QB, they may just wind up being Lee Roy Selmon. You go and get QBs until you get the right one. Seattle went and got a bunch of QBs, then drafted Wilson. Hell, Cleveland should go after Mariota if they think he's the goods, Manziel or not.

A first round bust doesn't set a team back ten years, half the teams in the first round bust on their top pick. But missing out on a ten year starter at QB can contribute to spinning your wheels for ten more years.

Yep. Before, when the contracts for first rounders and top 10 picks were ridiculously huge, teams would have a hard time recovering from misses and busts... but now with the rookie contracts being much more economical, teams can miss and recover pretty easily from year to year.

 

[werdnoynek]

Writer-director Kirby ****, whose new documentary examining campus sexual assaults is getting national attention, says Erica Kinsman "wanted her side told."

"What struck me about Erica is how sort of consistent her story has been...

 

[Capella]

It's very important with a rape allegation to be kind of, maybe, sorta consistent.

 

[bucsbaby]

Still think we'll look back and say in hindsight that all the signs were there that he would be a bust

It's possible. I'd be scared, he's obviously not a sure thing, and there's no way of knowing if his immaturity is a real thing that's going to hinder him.

It's also scary that Mariota hasn't made a ton of NFL throws, but you could talk about the offenses of a TON of college QBs, including Cam Newton, Sam Bradford, Derek Carr, Aaron Rodgers, and on and on.

I think there's enough questions for both that as a fan, the only thing to do is get on board, and hope for the best. NOT taking a QB is really not an option. Taking a Leo Williams or whoever might be a great pick, but if he and Gerald McCoy aren't on a team with a legit QB, they may just wind up being Lee Roy Selmon. You go and get QBs until you get the right one. Seattle went and got a bunch of QBs, then drafted Wilson. Hell, Cleveland should go after Mariota if they think he's the goods, Manziel or not.

A first round bust doesn't set a team back ten years, half the teams in the first round bust on their top pick. But missing out on a ten year starter at QB can contribute to spinning your wheels for ten more years.

Not opposed to taking a QB, but put me in the Mariota camp.

 

[cstu]

I just can't get past his personal fitness issues. He looks like he's cornered the market on baby fat. I realize you don't need to be shredded to play the QB position and a bigger QB can hold up to more hits. But he's only 21 and has zero muscle tone and doesn't appear to even be trying to take his fitness to the next level prior to the draft.

Of course, everybody's favorite fat QB Jared Lorezen thinks its a plus and said "He's only 21 and he doesn't even have his grown man body yet. He's gonna get bigger and faster." Unfortunately, I think the opposite is true. If he looks like this now, just imagine when he's 30 if he manages to make it that far in this career.

There's issue after issue - rape allegation, overweight (Chris Landry confirmed that he was 266 last year), shooting out windows with a bb gun, crab legs theft, shouting obscenities in public, shoving a referee, coachability questions (Fisher had to tell him he was calling the plays and threatened to bench him if he didn't calm down), 18 INT's last year (28 the past two years), problems with accuracy on the run, elongated throwing motion, poor decision making.

He can throw the ball well in the pocket, has football intelligence, and played under center in college. That's not enough to make up for the above IMO.

 

[jurb26]

Not sure why he would stay. He's got nothing left to prove in school unless he's trying to prove it in baseball, which isn't good.

His past isn't going away if he goes back. He'll still have to answer those same questions, just further down the road.

I never thought he would go back but he was never going to be the #1 pick this year and has a better chance next year.

Update?

 

[cstu]

Not sure why he would stay. He's got nothing left to prove in school unless he's trying to prove it in baseball, which isn't good.

His past isn't going away if he goes back. He'll still have to answer those same questions, just further down the road.

I never thought he would go back but he was never going to be the #1 pick this year and has a better chance next year.

Update?

It's insane for him to be the #1 pick right now with everything swirling about his character and his poor play last year.

Amazing that after a 18 interception season, rape allegation unsettled, #### her right in the #####, shoving a ref, getting yelled at by his coach you think he has nothing left to prove.

 

[werdnoynek]

Not sure why he would stay. He's got nothing left to prove in school unless he's trying to prove it in baseball, which isn't good.

His past isn't going away if he goes back. He'll still have to answer those same questions, just further down the road.

I never thought he would go back but he was never going to be the #1 pick this year and has a better chance next year.

Update?

It's insane for him to be the #1 pick right now with everything swirling about his character and his poor play last year.

Amazing that after a 18 interception season, rape allegation unsettled, #### her right in the #####, shoving a ref, getting yelled at by his coach you think he has nothing left to prove.

Nothing left to prove?? I don't think jurb or anyone in here honestly feels that way. Every prospect has to prove themselves in the NFL. Some are more prepared than others. I don't think it's crazy at all to say Winston is one of the most NFL ready quarterback prospects there has been in the past few years, off-field antics aside. You're right his character issues are there... they aren't going to just go away. He does have to prove himself on and off the field, but so does everyone else.

For me, in make believe football, the risk involved in drafting him in the late first early second is worth it. I'd take him over Mariota all day every day in fantasy drafts because I believe he has the ability to be great and is clearly the superior talent. For an NFL team, there is obviously more risk, but these days first rounders aren't getting paid ridiculous sums of money before proving themselves. Taking a kid like Winston isn't going to put a team out of the running for a half decade if he busts like it would have years ago. To me, an NFL team would consider him an good if not great investment and they'll do what they can to keep his nose clean and on the right path. No that doesn't always work, but it can.

The "negatives" around him don't just wipe away the positives. The rape allegation is a big deal, but it's still an allegation. The immaturity and passion on the field... meh. To me his positives far outweigh his negatives.... to me.

 

[gump]

'The gap between the two is quite large.'

'Your cornerstone NFL things....are very apparent.'

'He's aggressive. He will fight you. He's going to figure the defense out.'

'He has the type of charisma that will lead people to walk across a bed of coals.'

'He's by far the #1 guy.'

Opinions of losers or Floridians? No...the guys who run this website.

http://podcast.footballguys.com/2015/Footballguys-Audible-2015-Vol19a.mp3

 

[Proust Loves Cake]

Not sure why he would stay. He's got nothing left to prove in school unless he's trying to prove it in baseball, which isn't good.

His past isn't going away if he goes back. He'll still have to answer those same questions, just further down the road.

I never thought he would go back but he was never going to be the #1 pick this year and has a better chance next year.

Update?

It's insane for him to be the #1 pick right now with everything swirling about his character and his poor play last year.

Amazing that after a 18 interception season, rape allegation unsettled, #### her right in the #####, shoving a ref, getting yelled at by his coach you think he has nothing left to prove.

This is so spot on. Bucs fans will be so happy to get this guy and will be so ready to kick him to the curb by the end of 2016. He is Leaf and Jamarcus Russell all over again. Can't miss, pro-ready my ###. He is a pedestrian talent, at best, and that's not even factoring the likelihood that he's a rapist and an otherwise overall bad seed.

Enjoy, Tampa. Go ahead and wast your number one pick away on this guy.

 

[lod01]

Not sure why he would stay. He's got nothing left to prove in school unless he's trying to prove it in baseball, which isn't good.

His past isn't going away if he goes back. He'll still have to answer those same questions, just further down the road.

I never thought he would go back but he was never going to be the #1 pick this year and has a better chance next year.

Update?

He underestimated the stupidity of the Tampa Bay Bucs FO.

 

[jurb26]

Not sure why he would stay. He's got nothing left to prove in school unless he's trying to prove it in baseball, which isn't good.

His past isn't going away if he goes back. He'll still have to answer those same questions, just further down the road.

I never thought he would go back but he was never going to be the #1 pick this year and has a better chance next year.

Update?

He underestimated the stupidity of the Tampa Bay Bucs FO.

Not really. He was also trying to make bets on it, saying Winston had no chance, Mariota was for sure the guy. Oh the difference a month makes.

 

[Soulfly3]

Mike Evans is going to make Jameis look much better than he is.

Then again, I'm sure Evans will still think Jameis is an upgrade.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

Still think we'll look back and say in hindsight that all the signs were there that he would be a bust

It's possible. I'd be scared, he's obviously not a sure thing, and there's no way of knowing if his immaturity is a real thing that's going to hinder him.

It's also scary that Mariota hasn't made a ton of NFL throws, but you could talk about the offenses of a TON of college QBs, including Cam Newton, Sam Bradford, Derek Carr, Aaron Rodgers, and on and on.

I think there's enough questions for both that as a fan, the only thing to do is get on board, and hope for the best. NOT taking a QB is really not an option. Taking a Leo Williams or whoever might be a great pick, but if he and Gerald McCoy aren't on a team with a legit QB, they may just wind up being Lee Roy Selmon. You go and get QBs until you get the right one. Seattle went and got a bunch of QBs, then drafted Wilson. Hell, Cleveland should go after Mariota if they think he's the goods, Manziel or not.

A first round bust doesn't set a team back ten years, half the teams in the first round bust on their top pick. But missing out on a ten year starter at QB can contribute to spinning your wheels for ten more years.

Yep. Before, when the contracts for first rounders and top 10 picks were ridiculously huge, teams would have a hard time recovering from misses and busts... but now with the rookie contracts being much more economical, teams can miss and recover pretty easily from year to year.

we're worried about tampa 'recovering'?

 

[gump]

Not sure why he would stay. He's got nothing left to prove in school unless he's trying to prove it in baseball, which isn't good.

His past isn't going away if he goes back. He'll still have to answer those same questions, just further down the road.

I never thought he would go back but he was never going to be the #1 pick this year and has a better chance next year.

Update?

He underestimated the stupidity of the Tampa Bay Bucs FO.

'The gap between the two is quite large.'

'Your cornerstone NFL things....are very apparent.'

'He's aggressive. He will fight you. He's going to figure the defense out.'

'He has the type of charisma that will lead people to walk across a bed of coals.'

'He's by far the #1 guy.'

Opinions of losers or Floridians? No...the guys who run this website.

http://podcast.footballguys.com/2015/Footballguys-Audible-2015-Vol19a.mp3

 

[Freelove]

Not sure why he would stay. He's got nothing left to prove in school unless he's trying to prove it in baseball, which isn't good.

His past isn't going away if he goes back. He'll still have to answer those same questions, just further down the road.

I never thought he would go back but he was never going to be the #1 pick this year and has a better chance next year.

Update?

He underestimated the stupidity of the Tampa Bay Bucs FO.

'The gap between the two is quite large.'

'Your cornerstone NFL things....are very apparent.'

'He's aggressive. He will fight you. He's going to figure the defense out.'

'He has the type of charisma that will lead people to walk across a bed of coals.'

'He's by far the #1 guy.'

Opinions of losers or Floridians? No...the guys who run this website.

http://podcast.footballguys.com/2015/Footballguys-Audible-2015-Vol19a.mp3

Well, if people who know a little HTML say so, I can think of no higher authority.

 

[lod01]

Not sure why he would stay. He's got nothing left to prove in school unless he's trying to prove it in baseball, which isn't good.

His past isn't going away if he goes back. He'll still have to answer those same questions, just further down the road.

I never thought he would go back but he was never going to be the #1 pick this year and has a better chance next year.

Update?

He underestimated the stupidity of the Tampa Bay Bucs FO.

'The gap between the two is quite large.'

'Your cornerstone NFL things....are very apparent.'

'He's aggressive. He will fight you. He's going to figure the defense out.'

'He has the type of charisma that will lead people to walk across a bed of coals.'

'He's by far the #1 guy.'

Opinions of losers or Floridians? No...the guys who run this website.

http://podcast.footballguys.com/2015/Footballguys-Audible-2015-Vol19a.mp3

Yeah, well they are wrong.

 

[massraider]

Still think we'll look back and say in hindsight that all the signs were there that he would be a bust

It's possible. I'd be scared, he's obviously not a sure thing, and there's no way of knowing if his immaturity is a real thing that's going to hinder him.

It's also scary that Mariota hasn't made a ton of NFL throws, but you could talk about the offenses of a TON of college QBs, including Cam Newton, Sam Bradford, Derek Carr, Aaron Rodgers, and on and on.

I think there's enough questions for both that as a fan, the only thing to do is get on board, and hope for the best. NOT taking a QB is really not an option. Taking a Leo Williams or whoever might be a great pick, but if he and Gerald McCoy aren't on a team with a legit QB, they may just wind up being Lee Roy Selmon. You go and get QBs until you get the right one. Seattle went and got a bunch of QBs, then drafted Wilson. Hell, Cleveland should go after Mariota if they think he's the goods, Manziel or not.

A first round bust doesn't set a team back ten years, half the teams in the first round bust on their top pick. But missing out on a ten year starter at QB can contribute to spinning your wheels for ten more years.

Yep. Before, when the contracts for first rounders and top 10 picks were ridiculously huge, teams would have a hard time recovering from misses and busts... but now with the rookie contracts being much more economical, teams can miss and recover pretty easily from year to year.

we're worried about tampa 'recovering'?

Kind of a bummer what has happened to you.

 

[gump]

Not sure why he would stay. He's got nothing left to prove in school unless he's trying to prove it in baseball, which isn't good.

His past isn't going away if he goes back. He'll still have to answer those same questions, just further down the road.

I never thought he would go back but he was never going to be the #1 pick this year and has a better chance next year.

Update?

He underestimated the stupidity of the Tampa Bay Bucs FO.

'The gap between the two is quite large.''Your cornerstone NFL things....are very apparent.'

'He's aggressive. He will fight you. He's going to figure the defense out.'

'He has the type of charisma that will lead people to walk across a bed of coals.'

'He's by far the #1 guy.'

Opinions of losers or Floridians? No...the guys who run this website.http://podcast.footballguys.com/2015/Footballguys-Audible-2015-Vol19a.mp3

Well, if people who know a little HTML say so, I can think of no higher authority.

We already know how the Higher Authority feels.

 

[cstu]

Not sure why he would stay. He's got nothing left to prove in school unless he's trying to prove it in baseball, which isn't good.

His past isn't going away if he goes back. He'll still have to answer those same questions, just further down the road.

I never thought he would go back but he was never going to be the #1 pick this year and has a better chance next year.

Update?

He underestimated the stupidity of the Tampa Bay Bucs FO.

Not really. He was also trying to make bets on it, saying Winston had no chance, Mariota was for sure the guy.Oh the difference a month makes.

It's mind-boggling to me but at least Bucs fans are getting what they want. It will be a fun ride watching you guys turn on him.

 

[jurb26]

Not sure why he would stay. He's got nothing left to prove in school unless he's trying to prove it in baseball, which isn't good.

His past isn't going away if he goes back. He'll still have to answer those same questions, just further down the road.

I never thought he would go back but he was never going to be the #1 pick this year and has a better chance next year.

Update?

He underestimated the stupidity of the Tampa Bay Bucs FO.

Not really. He was also trying to make bets on it, saying Winston had no chance, Mariota was for sure the guy.Oh the difference a month makes.

It's mind-boggling to me but at least Bucs fans are getting what they want. It will be a fun ride watching you guys turn on him.

Nobody cares that much but you and a few others who have continually done nothing but try and tear Winston down. Most everyone realizes that at the end of the day these guys are prospects and some will hit and others will miss. It's about constructive debate and information sharing. It's only mind boggling to you because you can't be objective about Winston.

 

[KellysHeroes]

So this is going to be the way of the future, top picks not going to the draft