QB Lamar Jackson, BAL (5 Viewers)

[menobrown]

The speculation is that Lamar wants the Watson 230M guaranteed deal. Per Stephen A. Smith via someone in Lamar’s camp, the most guaranteed money the Ravens offered was 133M. So they are 97M apart in guaranteed money.

Come Monday I don’t see why see some team doesn’t come up with an offer that has more guaranteed money than Kyler Murray got (189M) but less than the 230.

I would encourage you to browse back in this thread or just try and google the difference between guaranteed and fully guaranteed. None of these numbers are what you think they are.

Yes I am aware of the differences
I am also aware that the other owners are upset with Haslem and don’t want to give out guaranteed deals.

Allegedly Lamar is looking for a 100% guaranteed contract worth about 230M
The Ravens have allegedly offered 57% of the 230M guaranteed.

Maybe Lamar is willing to accept 80% to 90% guaranteed.
Who knows? It doesn’t hurt to talk to the guy and find out if you are a QB needy team.

Then you know Kyler did not get $189m guaranteed. He got $103m fully guaranteed and $160m in total "guarantees"

The bolded does not at all jive with what I view as highly credible reports on what Baltimore offered Lamar last off season. Joel Corry wrote it was believed his guarantees exceeded those given to Wilson and Kyler in both perecentage of the contract and total, which I think was in the 67-69% range. Josina Anderson was reporting last week that total was $180M.

The Ravens did NOT offer Lamar an inferior contract in any shape form or way to what Kyler or Wilson signed last year. People need to stop trying to put that spin out.

 

[Yenrub]

If you give up 2 first round picks for a QB (or anybody), you are usually doing it for more than a 3 year plan.

I wouldn't give up two early firsts like the Bronkies did (plus two 2nds and three marketable active players).

But two late firsts, if you have an offense ready to drop Lamar into to make a run for the next three years, I think I'd do it. Two teams that would come to mind here would be Miami and Vegas, using their '24/25 1sts, not Vegas' #7 overall in 2023. Not all 1st round picks are the same, obviously. Late 1sts are worth A LOT less than early 1sts. Future 1sts are worth a lot less than current 1sts.

Would both picks be high 1st rounders? Sure the 2023 pick will be high but the 2024 could be (should be) in the 20's.

 

[-OZ-]

If you give up 2 first round picks for a QB (or anybody), you are usually doing it for more than a 3 year plan.

I wouldn't give up two early firsts like the Bronkies did (plus two 2nds and three marketable active players).

But two late firsts, if you have an offense ready to drop Lamar into to make a run for the next three years, I think I'd do it. Two teams that would come to mind here would be Miami and Vegas, using their '24/25 1sts, not Vegas' #7 overall in 2023. Not all 1st round picks are the same, obviously. Late 1sts are worth A LOT less than early 1sts. Future 1sts are worth a lot less than current 1sts.

How fun would it have been to see the giants not re-sign Daniel Jones and use that money for Lamar? Pick 1.25 and next year’s first would be easy to give.

Has Tampa allegedly said they wouldn’t be interested? 1.19 and next year’s first isn’t bad either.

 

[Yenrub]

The speculation is that Lamar wants the Watson 230M guaranteed deal. Per Stephen A. Smith via someone in Lamar’s camp, the most guaranteed money the Ravens offered was 133M. So they are 97M apart in guaranteed money.

Come Monday I don’t see why see some team doesn’t come up with an offer that has more guaranteed money than Kyler Murray got (189M) but less than the 230.

I would encourage you to browse back in this thread or just try and google the difference between guaranteed and fully guaranteed. None of these numbers are what you think they are.

Yes I am aware of the differences
I am also aware that the other owners are upset with Haslem and don’t want to give out guaranteed deals.

Allegedly Lamar is looking for a 100% guaranteed contract worth about 230M
The Ravens have allegedly offered 57% of the 230M guaranteed.

Maybe Lamar is willing to accept 80% to 90% guaranteed.
Who knows? It doesn’t hurt to talk to the guy and find out if you are a QB needy team.

Then you know Kyler did not get $189m guaranteed. He got $103m fully guaranteed and $160m in total "guarantees"

The bolded does not at all jive with what I view as highly credible reports on what Baltimore offered Lamar last off season. Joel Corry wrote it was believed his guarantees exceeded those given to Wilson and Kyler in both perecentage of the contract and total, which I think was in the 67-69% range. Josina Anderson was reporting last week that total was $180M.

The Ravens did NOT offer Lamar an inferior contract in any shape form or way to what Kyler or Wilson signed last year. People need to stop trying to put that spin out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMSWq_GeJcw

 

[menobrown]

Has Tampa allegedly said they wouldn’t be interested?

No I don't think they got word out and but they are taking it in the shorts this year on the cap and currently are showing as the least cap space in the league, needing to trim like over $50m just go get compliant. I know some people say the cap is not real, but I really don't see a way they could possibly put a deal together for Lamar that Baltimore did not want to match.

 

[menobrown]

The speculation is that Lamar wants the Watson 230M guaranteed deal. Per Stephen A. Smith via someone in Lamar’s camp, the most guaranteed money the Ravens offered was 133M. So they are 97M apart in guaranteed money.

Come Monday I don’t see why see some team doesn’t come up with an offer that has more guaranteed money than Kyler Murray got (189M) but less than the 230.

I would encourage you to browse back in this thread or just try and google the difference between guaranteed and fully guaranteed. None of these numbers are what you think they are.

Yes I am aware of the differences
I am also aware that the other owners are upset with Haslem and don’t want to give out guaranteed deals.

Allegedly Lamar is looking for a 100% guaranteed contract worth about 230M
The Ravens have allegedly offered 57% of the 230M guaranteed.

Maybe Lamar is willing to accept 80% to 90% guaranteed.
Who knows? It doesn’t hurt to talk to the guy and find out if you are a QB needy team.

Then you know Kyler did not get $189m guaranteed. He got $103m fully guaranteed and $160m in total "guarantees"

The bolded does not at all jive with what I view as highly credible reports on what Baltimore offered Lamar last off season. Joel Corry wrote it was believed his guarantees exceeded those given to Wilson and Kyler in both perecentage of the contract and total, which I think was in the 67-69% range. Josina Anderson was reporting last week that total was $180M.

The Ravens did NOT offer Lamar an inferior contract in any shape form or way to what Kyler or Wilson signed last year. People need to stop trying to put that spin out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMSWq_GeJcw

Ok, you can believe Stephen A's in depth reporting.

 

[ghostguy123]

Who is in Lamar Jackson's "camp"??

 

[ghostguy123]

Is Watsons contract fully guaranteed?

 

[Yenrub]

The speculation is that Lamar wants the Watson 230M guaranteed deal. Per Stephen A. Smith via someone in Lamar’s camp, the most guaranteed money the Ravens offered was 133M. So they are 97M apart in guaranteed money.

Come Monday I don’t see why see some team doesn’t come up with an offer that has more guaranteed money than Kyler Murray got (189M) but less than the 230.

I would encourage you to browse back in this thread or just try and google the difference between guaranteed and fully guaranteed. None of these numbers are what you think they are.

Yes I am aware of the differences
I am also aware that the other owners are upset with Haslem and don’t want to give out guaranteed deals.

Allegedly Lamar is looking for a 100% guaranteed contract worth about 230M
The Ravens have allegedly offered 57% of the 230M guaranteed.

Maybe Lamar is willing to accept 80% to 90% guaranteed.
Who knows? It doesn’t hurt to talk to the guy and find out if you are a QB needy team.

Then you know Kyler did not get $189m guaranteed. He got $103m fully guaranteed and $160m in total "guarantees"

The bolded does not at all jive with what I view as highly credible reports on what Baltimore offered Lamar last off season. Joel Corry wrote it was believed his guarantees exceeded those given to Wilson and Kyler in both perecentage of the contract and total, which I think was in the 67-69% range. Josina Anderson was reporting last week that total was $180M.

The Ravens did NOT offer Lamar an inferior contract in any shape form or way to what Kyler or Wilson signed last year. People need to stop trying to put that spin out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMSWq_GeJcw

Ok, you can believe Stephen A's in depth reporting.

Did you not notice that I used the word “allegedly” in my original post? TWICE!

 

[menobrown]

Is Watsons contract fully guaranteed?

Yes, real guarantees like how we think of a real guarantee. Fully guaranteed. Like he could show up looking and playing like Jamarcus Russell, blow out both knees and both arms, etc,etc. Nothing can touch his money.

 

[ghostguy123]

Is Watsons contract fully guaranteed?

Yes, real guarantees like how we think of a real guarantee. Fully guaranteed. Like he could show up looking and playing like Jamarcus Russell, blow out both knees and both arms, etc,etc. Nothing can touch his money.

Honestly, it would be kinda funny if he pulled a Ben Stiller at the end of Dodgeball, gained 200 pounds, and just never played again. As long as he kept "trying" to play he would get paid I would think.

 

[menobrown]

Is Watsons contract fully guaranteed?

Yes, real guarantees like how we think of a real guarantee. Fully guaranteed. Like he could show up looking and playing like Jamarcus Russell, blow out both knees and both arms, etc,etc. Nothing can touch his money.

Honestly, it would be kinda funny if he pulled a Ben Stiller at the end of Dodgeball, gained 200 pounds, and just never played again. As long as he kept "trying" to play he would get paid I would think.

It would be awesome.....and end any talk of totally guaranteed contracts for a long time.

 

[Bracie Smathers]

Lamar Jackson
@Lj_era8
Great Company
Quote Tweet
Hard Rock Sportsbook
@HardRockSB
QBs in NFL history with a 96+ passer rating and 100+ pass TD in their first 61 starts:

LAMAR JACKSON
Patrick Mahomes
Dan Marino
Aaron Rodgers
Deshaun Watson

Lamar isn't a running QB. He's a great QB who can run.
------------------------
Mina Kimes
@minakimes
Fun fact: Last year, Lamar Jackson finished with a higher passer rating from inside the pocket than Cousins, Rodgers, and Brady.
Ryan Burns
@FtblSickness
With a beat-up OL and nonsense for weaponry. The dude is a serious problem. Please get him out of my division.

 

[Raging weasel]

One of the guys on Sirius radio said there is another problem with a fully guaranteed contract- you have to have the cash in hand at signing. Yes all the owners are billionaires but can they fork over $200mil+ in cash next month?

 

[GroveDiesel]

I think the data actually indicates that QBs are more likely to get hurt in the pocket than scrambling/running.

Getting hurt and wearing down are two different things. See Cam Newton and every feature RB who has ever played this game. I LOVE Lamar's game, but he is probably the last of the elite QBs that's I'd consider for a fully guaranteed deal. That said, he's only 26, and if feature RBs are my gauge, then guaranteeing the first three years of a five year deal might be a good way to bridge the gap.

Can Newton’s career got derailed by his messed up AC joint which he injured tackling a guy after he threw an INT.

The idea that running QBs don’t last has plenty of examples that disprove that. John Elway, Steve McNair, Fran Tarkenton, Steve Young, Donovan McNabb. Roethlisberger wasn’t a running QB but scrambled all the time.

 

[STEADYMOBBIN 22]

Lamar Jackson
@Lj_era8
Great CompanyView attachment 3516
Quote Tweet
Hard Rock Sportsbook
@HardRockSB
QBs in NFL history with a 96+ passer rating and 100+ pass TD in their first 61 starts:

LAMAR JACKSON
Patrick Mahomes
Dan Marino
Aaron Rodgers
Deshaun Watson

Lamar isn't a running QB. He's a great QB who can run.
------------------------
Mina Kimes
@minakimes
Fun fact: Last year, Lamar Jackson finished with a higher passer rating from inside the pocket than Cousins, Rodgers, and Brady.
Ryan Burns
@FtblSickness
With a beat-up OL and nonsense for weaponry. The dude is a serious problem. Please get him out of my division.

LMAO Hes a athlete, not a quarterback. He will never win anything unless he has a team built like the Eagles last year.

 

[ghostguy123]

One of the guys on Sirius radio said there is another problem with a fully guaranteed contract- you have to have the cash in hand at signing. Yes all the owners are billionaires but can they fork over $200mil+ in cash next month?

This sounds like a post from a year ago. Has that guy been living under a rock?

Edit......I wonder what the most guarantees ever given out at once was, and the most ever held in escrow. It's not like the QB is the only one getting guaranteed money.
And what do MLB owners do since it's all guaranteed? First world problems I guess.

 

[massraider]

And what do MLB owners do since it's all guaranteed?

Same thing NBA/Soccer/hockey does I think.

 

[ghostguy123]

And what do MLB owners do since it's all guaranteed?

Same thing NBA/Soccer/hockey does I think.

I don't know what they do.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

And what do MLB owners do since it's all guaranteed?

Same thing NBA/Soccer/hockey does I think.

I don't know what they do.

They keep the money in an escrow account. If they’re not liquid they borrow the money and pay large sums in interest.

 

[ghostguy123]

And what do MLB owners do since it's all guaranteed?

Same thing NBA/Soccer/hockey does I think.

I don't know what they do.

They keep the money in an escrow account. If they’re not liquid they borrow the money and pay large sums in interest.

Oh dear. Some of these owners must have close to a billion in escrow.

 

[massraider]

Oh dear. Some of these owners must have close to a billion in escrow

How dire could the situation be? Leagues don't have trouble finding owners. Eventually, these nightmare guarantee contracts would push owners away wouldn't it? Doesn't seem to happen.

Also: They probably definitely get excellent terms on interest, as they are as safe a loan as one could make.

 

[Grahamburn]

If you give up 2 first round picks for a QB (or anybody), you are usually doing it for more than a 3 year plan.

I wouldn't give up two early firsts like the Bronkies did (plus two 2nds and three marketable active players).

But two late firsts, if you have an offense ready to drop Lamar into to make a run for the next three years, I think I'd do it. Two teams that would come to mind here would be Miami and Vegas, using their '24/25 1sts, not Vegas' #7 overall in 2023. Not all 1st round picks are the same, obviously. Late 1sts are worth A LOT less than early 1sts. Future 1sts are worth a lot less than current 1sts.

How fun would it have been to see the giants not re-sign Daniel Jones and use that money for Lamar? Pick 1.25 and next year’s first would be easy to give.

Has Tampa allegedly said they wouldn’t be interested? 1.19 and next year’s first isn’t bad either.

Tampa has no money. I'm sure it can be worked out, but they're seriously hamstrung as it is with just Kyle Trask rostered and his $1.4M cap hit.

 

[humpback]

I think the data actually indicates that QBs are more likely to get hurt in the pocket than scrambling/running.

Getting hurt and wearing down are two different things. See Cam Newton and every feature RB who has ever played this game. I LOVE Lamar's game, but he is probably the last of the elite QBs that's I'd consider for a fully guaranteed deal. That said, he's only 26, and if feature RBs are my gauge, then guaranteeing the first three years of a five year deal might be a good way to bridge the gap.

Can Newton’s career got derailed by his messed up AC joint which he injured tackling a guy after he threw an INT.

The idea that running QBs don’t last has plenty of examples that disprove that. John Elway, Steve McNair, Fran Tarkenton, Steve Young, Donovan McNabb. Roethlisberger wasn’t a running QB but scrambled all the time.

None of those guys ran anywhere near as much as Lamar, not even close.

Why is it so difficult to admit that taking hits is bad for a QB? It's why pretty much every team tries to minimize the hits they take, and also why RB careers are so short.

Clearly it's bad, and no QB takes more hits than Lamar.

 

[massraider]

Why is it so difficult to admit that taking hits is bad for a QB

It was pointed out that these guys get hurt in the pocket not on the run. This isn't the same thing as denying getting hurt is bad.

Also, I don't have to believe mobile QBs have a shorter shelf life because someone on the internet says "running backs amirite???"

 

[Anarchy99]

Why is it so difficult to admit that taking hits is bad for a QB

It was pointed out that these guys get hurt in the pocket not on the run. This isn't the same thing as denying getting hurt is bad.

Also, I don't have to believe mobile QBs have a shorter shelf life because someone on the internet says "running backs amirite???"

I don’t want to get into a whizzing contest with anyone, but IIRC, there are usually more arm, shoulder, and hand injuries from getting hit in the pocket and more leg, knee, and ankle issues from running out of the pocket.

That being said, a fluke injury could happen on any play, but it stands to reason a QB with a better OL should get hit less than one that can’t block. Also, a team with better OL play and receivers would be more conducive to throwing the ball than a QB feeling compelled to have to run all the time to move the football. Also, there’s nothing etched in stone that QBs over time can’t start running less and start to hang in the pocket more.

Bottom line, to conclude much about Lamar when there haven’t been a ton of QBs like him (based on how other QBs have done) doesn’t seem like a great idea. Sure, no predominantly running QB has won a SB. But how many have them been? Not that many. Teams will play who they think they can win with, and we’ve seen more mobile QBs recently compared to other eras. IMO, it’s just a matter of time for a QB that runs a lot will win a title. We just haven’t seen it happen yet.

 

[ghostguy123]

Lamar has missed a lot of time, and for several different things. Does it matter why?

 

[menobrown]

I do think Lamar's style of play has a greater chance of leading to injury but that's beat to death here and even if you disagree his style of play is more prone to injuries I would hope you would agree his level of play suffers far greater when he's dinged up then most QB's, especially if the injury impacts is movement ability.

In terms of forecasting his future we are seeing RB's and WR's age out at a faster clip then we used to see them. A lot faster. 27 is more like the new 30 for RB's and 30 more like the new 33 for WR's. Age and wear and tear are both at play here and Lamar's wear and tear and not quite up to feature RB's but it's heavy. Since Lamar got the starting job he's averaged 11 carries a game, less then 2 from what Kamara averages. He's not taking hits blocking or receiving and that on the whole is probably better for his body with respect to wear and tear then the hits he's taking in the pocket plus he generally does a good job of not taking massive shots. But if he continues his current pace, stays healthy the next two years, he'll have 561 rushing attempts the next 3 seasons. I think the odds of him significantly showing signs of wear and tear at that point and a hindrance to his game is extremely strong.

So yea there is no way I'd ever give him a contract with guarantees past the 3 year mark.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

Dolphins restructured WR Tyreek Hill's contract.​

The Dolphins have spent the last few hours clearing massive amounts of cap space. According to ESPN's Adam Schefter, Hill's restructured deal will free up nearly $18 million in cap space. The Dolphins also restructured the contract of left tackle Terron Armstead which freed up $11.876 million of cap space. This may or may not be an attempt to make an eventual run at a disgruntled quarterback in Baltimore, although if the Dolphins were to pursue Lamar Jackson, they'd have to wait until after the draft, as they don't have a 2023 draft pick to give the Ravens in return.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

Sure, no predominantly running QB has won a SB.

Not sure what we consider Hurts, but he came damn close
I know I cut you sentence short and you weren't really making that point.

 

[Anarchy99]

Lamar has missed a lot of time, and for several different things. Does it matter why?

I don't know what the definition of "a lot" is. Jackson has missed 12 games over the past 4 seasons (one was for testing positive for COVID). That's not ideal, but is that really "a lot"? Deshaun Watson missed a ton of games not being injured . . . do people hold that against him? Prescott, Jimmy G., Tua, Daniel Jones, Matthew Stafford, and some other QBs have missed as much or more time than Lamar has. My general point is, multiple players have gotten hurt multiple times. Some run more than others do. I am not sure this is just a Lamar issue.

 

[Anarchy99]

In terms of forecasting his future we are seeing RB's and WR's age out at a faster clip then we used to see them. A lot faster. 27 is more like the new 30 for RB's and 30 more like the new 33 for WR's.

I can't comment on the facts about this, but I would point out that the older generation of productive RB and WR seemingly all left the game at close to the same time. Their replacements were all guys 10 years younger. It's hard to conclude that the age when they start getting less productive or phased out has changed any, as there haven't been many guys in that age group lately. Five years from now when there are a bunch of guys doing well in their 30s (I suspect more at WR than RB), does that mean there was some magic elixir that guys started drinking to play longer? I think it's cyclical, and for now, there aren't as many old guys out there. But I doubt it's because teams suddenly thing only young guys can play.

 

[menobrown]

In terms of forecasting his future we are seeing RB's and WR's age out at a faster clip then we used to see them. A lot faster. 27 is more like the new 30 for RB's and 30 more like the new 33 for WR's.

I can't comment on the facts about this, but I would point out that the older generation of productive RB and WR seemingly all left the game at close to the same time. Their replacements were all guys 10 years younger. It's hard to conclude that the age when they start getting less productive or phased out has changed any, as there haven't been many guys in that age group lately. Five years from now when there are a bunch of guys doing well in their 30s (I suspect more at WR than RB), does that mean there was some magic elixir that guys started drinking to play longer? I think it's cyclical, and for now, there aren't as many old guys out there. But I doubt it's because teams suddenly thing only young guys can play.

I'd spend some time studying this in more depth if I were you.

 

[Bracie Smathers]

Injury proneness of running QBs like Russell Wilson, Lamar Jackson is overstated
...The bias against the running quarterback has endured from Bobby Douglass nearly posting 1,000 rushing yards in 1972 through Randall Cunningham’s four Pro Bowls in the 1080s and ‘90s, from Michael Vick’s dazzling (though abbreviated) stay in Atlanta to Cam Newton's MVP season in 2015.
Any injury to a quarterback with genuine running talent is treated as proof of his fragility — even if it occurs while he is performing the acceptable quarterbacking task of throwing from the pocket. Any injury to a pocket-based quarterback while he is in the pocket is summarily ignored...
...Research on NFL quarterback injuries compiled by injury coordinator John Verros at Sports Info Solutions shows the risk of a quarterback being injured on a designed run is remote — only one for every 236 plays.
The risk for a scrambling quarterback is almost equal to the quarterback who is sacked: once every 91.7 plays for the scrambler, once every 92.5 plays for the guy getting sacked.
The most dangerous play category Verros discovered is the knockdown; the quarterback who is taken to the ground while unleashing a pass, as when the Jaguars’ Nick Foles suffered a broken clavicle after being struck while releasing a pass against the Chiefs. That player is hurt once every 67.3 plays...

 

[Anarchy99]

In terms of forecasting his future we are seeing RB's and WR's age out at a faster clip then we used to see them. A lot faster. 27 is more like the new 30 for RB's and 30 more like the new 33 for WR's.

I can't comment on the facts about this, but I would point out that the older generation of productive RB and WR seemingly all left the game at close to the same time. Their replacements were all guys 10 years younger. It's hard to conclude that the age when they start getting less productive or phased out has changed any, as there haven't been many guys in that age group lately. Five years from now when there are a bunch of guys doing well in their 30s (I suspect more at WR than RB), does that mean there was some magic elixir that guys started drinking to play longer? I think it's cyclical, and for now, there aren't as many old guys out there. But I doubt it's because teams suddenly thing only young guys can play.

I'd spend some time studying this in more depth if I were you.

Of the Top 12 WR in receiving yards from the past 10 seasons, 11 of them played this season. The only one that didn't was Antonio Brown, and that had more to do with him being cray-cray than anything else. The two players on that list that are clearly on the 18th green are AJ Green and Julio Jones.

There are still guys 30+ at WR that are still viable options . . . Adams, Lockett, Allen, Hopkins, Thielen. Next year, Diggs, Evans, Cupp, and Cooks will all be 30. That's 10 receivers that will be 30+. Running backs are different, but there weren't really any starters that were 29 or 30 last season (so there won't be any this season either). The landscape and usage rate for RBs has changed a ton from 10-20 years ago, and that also plays into it. But I still think we will see some WRs in their 30s still being contributors.

 

[menobrown]

There are still guys 30+ at WR that are still viable options . . . Adams, Lockett, Allen, Hopkins, Thielen. Next year, Diggs, Evans, Cupp, and Cooks will all be 30. That's 10 receivers that will be 30+

Will be. Please do some research on this. And please try and see the difference between "contributing" and clearly serious decline. I don't have time to post everything I've been studying on this topic for the last few years.

 

[Bracie Smathers]

Not even talking, see what he might be willing to do in a contract? No discussions?

I don't think any team is allowed to do so yet. It would be tampering if it's done before the legal tampering period, wouldn't it?

Brent Sobleski
@brentsobleski
"You tamper,” one agent said. “You meet with as many teams as you can [at the NFL combine] and you tamper like a motherf—er." Refreshing to hear an agent actually say this out loud.

Dan Wetzel@DanWetzel
Excellent, insightful and well-reported column by @CharlesRobinsonon on Lamar Jackson and the realities (not the hysterics) of what's happened and what's to come.
--------------------------------------------
Lying, tampering and compromise: NFL agents sound off on Lamar Jackson mess
“Don’t believe what any teams are saying about their interest in Lamar Jackson right now. There’s a lot of bulls*** that goes on in our football business. It’s a business of liars.”

 

[Anarchy99]

There are still guys 30+ at WR that are still viable options . . . Adams, Lockett, Allen, Hopkins, Thielen. Next year, Diggs, Evans, Cupp, and Cooks will all be 30. That's 10 receivers that will be 30+

Will be. Please do some research on this. And please try and see the difference between "contributing" and clearly serious decline. I don't have time to post everything I've been studying on this topic for the last few years.

I will, but don't have time now.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

Not even talking, see what he might be willing to do in a contract? No discussions?

I don't think any team is allowed to do so yet. It would be tampering if it's done before the legal tampering period, wouldn't it?

Brent Sobleski
@brentsobleski
"You tamper,” one agent said. “You meet with as many teams as you can [at the NFL combine] and you tamper like a motherf—er." Refreshing to hear an agent actually say this out loud.

Dan Wetzel@DanWetzel
Excellent, insightful and well-reported column by @CharlesRobinsonon on Lamar Jackson and the realities (not the hysterics) of what's happened and what's to come.
--------------------------------------------
Lying, tampering and compromise: NFL agents sound off on Lamar Jackson mess
“Don’t believe what any teams are saying about their interest in Lamar Jackson right now. There’s a lot of bulls*** that goes on in our football business. It’s a business of liars.”

"Underground" meetings with agents, circumventing the rules, is a lot different then the GM from the Falcons saying "Yeah, we plan to go after Jackson hard and pay him more than Baltimore is willing to!"

Miami lost a first round pick for meeting with Brady before it was allowed.

 

[menobrown]

There are still guys 30+ at WR that are still viable options . . . Adams, Lockett, Allen, Hopkins, Thielen. Next year, Diggs, Evans, Cupp, and Cooks will all be 30. That's 10 receivers that will be 30+

Will be. Please do some research on this. And please try and see the difference between "contributing" and clearly serious decline. I don't have time to post everything I've been studying on this topic for the last few years.

I will, but don't have time now.

Thank you and I'd be happy to discuss this later in it's own thread. Like preferably in June when we got nothing else to talk about.

 

[LawFitz]

I don't have time to post everything I've been studying on this topic for the last few years.

How about a quick cliffs notes?

 

[Anarchy99]

There are still guys 30+ at WR that are still viable options . . . Adams, Lockett, Allen, Hopkins, Thielen. Next year, Diggs, Evans, Cupp, and Cooks will all be 30. That's 10 receivers that will be 30+

Will be. Please do some research on this. And please try and see the difference between "contributing" and clearly serious decline. I don't have time to post everything I've been studying on this topic for the last few years.

I will, but don't have time now.

Thank you and I'd be happy to discuss this later in it's own thread. Like preferably in June when we got nothing else to talk about.

You probably are better educated and more up to date on this than than I am. I kept tabs on this pretty in depth back in the day for 10+ years when I worked at FBG. But that's been 10 years already.

 

[massraider]

https://open.spotify.com/episode/0Q...FKlDERiyNXv6tFJjSJQ&app_destination=copy-link

Andrew Brandt on the QBs, tags, Lamar, and guarantees

 

[massraider]

From Pro Football Reference:

Lamar Jackson and Patrick Mahomes are the only players in NFL history to record at least 100 touchdown passes and fewer than 40 interceptions over their first five seasons

 

[Tau837]

Lamar has missed a lot of time, and for several different things. Does it matter why?

I don't know what the definition of "a lot" is. Jackson has missed 12 games over the past 4 seasons (one was for testing positive for COVID). That's not ideal, but is that really "a lot"? Deshaun Watson missed a ton of games not being injured . . . do people hold that against him? Prescott, Jimmy G., Tua, Daniel Jones, Matthew Stafford, and some other QBs have missed as much or more time than Lamar has. My general point is, multiple players have gotten hurt multiple times. Some run more than others do. I am not sure this is just a Lamar issue.

You ignored that he missed the Ravens playoff game this year. Including playoff games since 2019, he has missed 13 of 71 games (18%).

IMO it isn't just about the number or percentage of games Jackson has missed. He missed the final 4+ games of the regular season in each of the past two seasons, which hurt his team's ability to compete in the playoffs. It is probably fair to view that as a fluke/coincidence... but it happened in each of the last two seasons, making it a significant issue in his contract negotiations.

 

[Da Guru]

Baltimore drafted Jackson, the GM, HC, the coaching staff, owner all know him well

But they seem very willing to let him walk. Very interesting situation.

Jackson will play somewhere next season be in in Baltimore or wherever, and he will make more $$$$ than he ever dreamed about.

Comparison is the thief of joy. Jackson is too concerned about Watsons contract to enjoy this ride of his own.

 

[massraider]

I think he plays on the tag.

If I was the NFLPA advising him, I would say hang tough on the fully guaranteed, even if you have to play on the tag. My main reason for this, is that if he waits to sign long term until AFTER Burrow, Hurts, Herbert, he'll get a better deal, guarantees or not.

 

[Ilov80s]

Baltimore drafted Jackson, the GM, HC, the coaching staff, owner all know him well

But they seem very willing to let him walk. Very interesting situation.

Jackson will play somewhere next season be in in Baltimore or wherever, and he will make more $$$$ than he ever dreamed about.

Comparison is the thief of joy. Jackson is too concerned about Watsons contract to enjoy this ride of his own.

I think it's really bigger than Lamar and is entirely about the precedent of fully guaranteed deals.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

But they seem very willing to let him walk. Very interesting situation.

I think they’re just letting other teams negotiate for them for a while - I’d expect they’d match any reasonable offer.

 

[Ilov80s]

But they seem very willing to let him walk. Very interesting situation.

I think they’re just letting other teams negotiate for them for a while - I’d expect they’d match any reasonable offer.

Yep, I assume they are hoping to show Lamar nobody else is willing to offer the guaranteed money he wants.