FarFromHome
Footballguy
Bingo. Outside of Mahomes being obviously awesome, Kelce is the reason they get by throwing out Walmart workers at wr. No offense to the lack of athletic ability to Walmart workers.
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QB Patrick Mahomes II, KC (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Faust
- Start date
LawFitz
Footballguy
You are speaking with nothing more than guesses about what the Chiefs' cap situation and possibilities with and without Tyreek were when they chose to move on from him. Mahomes is the true and biggest star here and he's only 28 years old. Tyreek's cap figure balloons to $31 MM next year. Chiefs could've played games with the cap to afford that, but they would've ended up with some nasty dead money years during Mahomes early 30s. They chose not to go that route, already have won a Superbowl without him, and are arguably the favorite again this year *because* of their suddenly elite defense to compliment their GOAT prime-age QB. Seems odd that you are so adamantly claiming they've made a mistake when their real-world results have been so positive.
FarFromHome
Footballguy
Ya, but money aside, Tyreek still catching passes from Mahomes would be sweet for all.
LawFitz
Footballguy
Titans did not have a 26-yr-old SB champ Mahomes when they dumped AJB. Also, AJB was three years younger, signed a much more manageable deal than did Tyreek, and returned much less in trade compensation. Also the Titans did not win the Superbowl the year after trading him. Other than both being elite WRs, the situations couldn't differ more.
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LawFitz
Footballguy
Agreed from a fantasy perspective, but the Chiefs were operating from a real-world perspective, where you can't just say, ya, but money aside...
Football Jones
Footballguy
The problem for me is I’ll never be proven exactly right, but could be proven wrong with more Super Bowl wins. All I’ll say about that is they would’ve won last year WITH Tyreek, too.
I’ll give them all the props they have coming if they can pull off another Super Bowl win in the next few years. They SHOULD be able to do that with Mahomes, but I can’t see it happening unless they find a dawg. Paying big money for one in FA is a net loss because they could’ve had a better one.
The decision was inexcusable given today’s NFL. I guess they thought they could hit on a WR. Just a bad gamble all the way around.
Football Jones
Footballguy
And Kelce’s age is a monumental factor in this.
It’s like they forgot how old he is.
It’s like they forgot how old he is.
Football Jones
Footballguy
Not much else to say now. Just going back & forth about the same things.
Time to let the season play out.
Time to let the season play out.
LawFitz
Footballguy
They won a Superbowl without him already and are on track to compete for several more. Your logic is way off, but I agree, let's move on.
Football Jones
Footballguy
BTW, I’ll be easy to find if they win another one without a dawg at WR. I pay my debts.
I’m confident nobody will come looking for me, though.
I’m confident nobody will come looking for me, though.
FarFromHome
Footballguy
We have covered this. Mahomes is the best QB in the league and when all is said and done top 2 QB all time. Agreed. We all agree. What most of us are saying is they could have kept Tyreek if they wanted to and it would have been wonderful. It wasn't about the salary cap. They turn 25% of Mahomes salary into signing bonus and pay Tyreek. Presto. NFL soft cap is silly. I think they just wanted to move on and they thought Mahomes is so good we would just make another Tyreek. The problem is you can't. Dudes amazing. I think most just want Mahomes to have a little help at the wr position. Imo
Football Jones
Footballguy
I haven’t touched on that yet. Good point. Yeah, they could’ve easily paid Tyreek, but like you said, it had to be more about just moving on.We have covered this. Mahomes is the best QB in the league and when all is said and done top 2 QB all time. Agreed. We all agree. What most of us are saying is they could have kept Tyreek if they wanted to and it would have been wonderful. It wasn't about the salary cap. They turn 25% of Mahomes salary into signing bonus and pay Tyreek. Presto. NFL soft cap is silly. I think they just wanted to move on and they thought Mahomes is so good we would just make another Tyreek. The problem is you can't. Dudes amazing. I think most just want Mahomes to have a little help at the wr position. Imo
Maybe they had the upmost confidence they could replace him (he was like a 5th-rounder, after all) or maybe they were thinking he wouldn’t be elite that much longer.
Again, that’s why I said earlier I would’ve loved to have been a fly on the wall.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
This is silliness. Tyreek is awesome, but the Chiefs showed last year that they could win without him (after winning it with him once in four years once Mahomes became the starter). There really isn't much else to say.
LawFitz
Footballguy
BTW, I’ll be easy to find if they win another one without a dawg at WR. I pay my debts.
I’m confident nobody will come looking for me, though.
They already proved you wrong. Last year when they won it all without him.
Yeah, it was in very great part. The cap is silly until it isn't - watch what happens to the Saints this coming offseason. The Chiefs could've kicked the can for 2 more years of manageable Tyreek dollars at most, then pipers would've come calling big time during Mahomes' age 29-31 seasons. If Mahomes had been 36 instead of 26 when they made this call, I'd agree with you. But they chose the flexibility of building around their GOAT QB in his prime years, rather than top-load with Tyreek in tow. So far, they've looked not just brave in doing so, but wise. Their Tyreek-less Lombardi and latest odds for the 2023 trophy prove it beyond any further discussion.
Football Jones
Footballguy
To be fair, winning it one year when you have Mahomes doesn’t mean it was a good long-term move. Far from it.
We’re talking about Pat Mahomes. He should win more Super Bowls, but some of us think they screwed the pooch. This will be decided down the road with the caveat that if they swallow their pride & sign a high-priced FA WR after passing on Tyreek, it’s a net loss.
Football Jones
Footballguy
Check my previous post. Anybody who thinks it was a good long-term move by winning one Super Bowl without Tyreek doesn’t quite realize the importance of having a generational-type QB.BTW, I’ll be easy to find if they win another one without a dawg at WR. I pay my debts.
I’m confident nobody will come looking for me, though.
They already proved you wrong. Last year when they won it all without him.
Yeah, it was in very great part. The cap is silly until it isn't - watch what happens to the Saints this coming offseason. The Chiefs could've kicked the can for 2 more years of manageable Tyreek dollars at most, then pipers would've come calling big time during Mahomes' age 29-31 seasons. If Mahomes had been 36 instead of 26 when they made this call, I'd agree with you. But they chose the flexibility of building around their GOAT QB in his prime years, rather than top-load with Tyreek in tow. So far, they've looked not just brave in doing so, but wise. Their Tyreek-less Lombardi and latest odds for the 2023 trophy prove it beyond any further discussion.
Way too early to say it’s a good long-term move, but you know that already. It’s not something that’s negotiable. And if KC folds & pays a guy in FA, anyway, the people like me who thought they made a bad move were right.
Lots to be determined yet. So much so that it’s just all talk right now. Might take several years to make a determination.
Stinkin Ref
IBL Representative
Bolded is 100% wrong.....it was 100% about the salary cap.....if it wasn't he would still be on the Chiefs team !!!!!.....what team WOULD'NT keep him if it wasn't about money.....We have covered this. Mahomes is the best QB in the league and when all is said and done top 2 QB all time. Agreed. We all agree. What most of us are saying is they could have kept Tyreek if they wanted to and it would have been wonderful. It wasn't about the salary cap. They turn 25% of Mahomes salary into signing bonus and pay Tyreek. Presto. NFL soft cap is silly. I think they just wanted to move on and they thought Mahomes is so good we would just make another Tyreek. The problem is you can't. Dudes amazing. I think most just want Mahomes to have a little help at the wr position. Imo
this is so stupid...LawFitz is saying it so better then me...I'm out...
Football Jones
Footballguy
LOL. It wasn’t just about the salary cap.Bolded is 100% wrong.....it was 100% about the salary cap.....if it wasn't he would still be on the Chiefs team !!!!!.....what team WOULD'NT keep him if it wasn't about money.....We have covered this. Mahomes is the best QB in the league and when all is said and done top 2 QB all time. Agreed. We all agree. What most of us are saying is they could have kept Tyreek if they wanted to and it would have been wonderful. It wasn't about the salary cap. They turn 25% of Mahomes salary into signing bonus and pay Tyreek. Presto. NFL soft cap is silly. I think they just wanted to move on and they thought Mahomes is so good we would just make another Tyreek. The problem is you can't. Dudes amazing. I think most just want Mahomes to have a little help at the wr position. Imo
this is so stupid...LawFitz is saying it so better then me...I'm out...
Lots of things went into it. One of them being they thought they could do a decent job replacing Tyreek. Taking 2 day-2 WRs in 2 years tells us they had a plan.
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Football Jones
Footballguy
The bottom line is we need to see how everything shakes out. Just the fact they might have to deal with Tyreek with Miami is a factor nobody has mentioned. The Fins are going to be very hard to beat if they can get Achane, Armstead, Ramsey, & Howard back.
The first clue we’ll get is if KC changes course & goes after a big-time FA WR this offseason. Or will they spend draft capital on another WR?
Moving a future HOFer in their prime is a potential franchise-altering decision. Veach has some balls…I’ll give him that.
The first clue we’ll get is if KC changes course & goes after a big-time FA WR this offseason. Or will they spend draft capital on another WR?
Moving a future HOFer in their prime is a potential franchise-altering decision. Veach has some balls…I’ll give him that.
ILUVBEER99
Footballguy
Chiefs are 23-4 since moving on from reke.
They seem to be doing just fine without him.
They seem to be doing just fine without him.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
It's just one poster, and I feel like he is talking to himself and trying to convince himself that what he is saying is correct, when everyone else can see the reality.
I can see it now: the Chiefs will win the Super Bowl in February by a score of 27-17, and he will be in here going, "Yeah, but with Tyreek, it could have been 41-17!"
FarFromHome
Footballguy
In the end this seems to be the case closing evidence. It still would be wonderful watching Tyreek catching Mahomes bombs. At least we got old clips. Ha ha
Judge Smails
Footballguy
Added to the injury report this morning with an illness. Still expected to play
Football Jones
Footballguy
LOL. The problem is they aren’t likely to win another one unless they fix their WR corps. Not with the competition in the league now, not to mention Miami, who looks to be building a monster (& with Tyreek).It's just one poster, and I feel like he is talking to himself and trying to convince himself that what he is saying is correct, when everyone else can see the reality.
I can see it now: the Chiefs will win the Super Bowl in February by a score of 27-17, and he will be in here going, "Yeah, but with Tyreek, it could have been 41-17!"
If they don’t win another Super Bowl with a generational talent like Mahomes, then it was an epic fail. They can drop their plan & sign or trade for a big-time (& expensive) WR, but if they do that, they should’ve just kept the best one in the world. Or they keep trying in the draft..
It’s not like this is rocket science, but we don’t know how this is going to turn out long-term yet. I’m sure the Chiefs organization & their fans would be disappointed if it was the last Lombardi Trophy for awhile.
The bottom line is this move could be AJ Brown-level bad. Those types of guys are like finding needles in haystacks.
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irish eyes
Footballguy
He's had 1 good week, that's it.
Guy above had the nerve to say I TOLD YA SO after one good game in 7 weeks. Today he looked AWFUL.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
This kind of dishonest posting is the essence of taking a leak into the Shark Pool.
You have to have your head wedged pretty far up your backside to say that Mahomes has had only one good game so far this year.
He has ONE top 3 finish ALL season and THREE weeks where he hasnt even been a QB1. He's beat his projection TWO weeks all season.
You're the one being dishonest.
crushedspirit
Footballguy
Easy now, yes he had a bad week and was obviously not at his best. Maybe the flu played a part as well, who knows. The guy was 3rd in pts per game coming in with nothing but Kelce, so I'm not sure what the point is. Many had Allen and Hurts ranked above for the draft, and I agreed fully since they both are dual threats at times and have much better weapons overall.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
Oh, so you have to finish top 3 to have a good week?
When you're drafted as the top QB off the board of courseOh, so you have to finish top 3 to have a good week?
Stat Correction
Footballguy
KC seemingly can't properly scout WR talent. They got nothing....
rockaction
Footballguy
Skyy Moore's inability to bring that dime in is all on Moore. That was atrocious. You're a pro. Catch the ball.
ProstheticRGK
Footballguy
That's the curse of Big Red.
Faust
MVP
Next Gen Stats
Patrick Mahomes is the only QB to throw past the sticks on a majority of his 3rd & long attempts since 2018. He has gained +128.0 EPA in these situations, more than double any other QB.
: @MiamiDolphins at @Chiefs
: Sunday at 9:30am ET, exclusively on @nflnetwork & #NFLPlus
Stinkin Ref
IBL Representative
https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/Br2...image/image/72820767/usa_today_21771302.0.jpg
two handed catch would have had to be one handed....
rockaction
Footballguy
Maybe, homer. He has tiny arms, too. Check Player Profiler.
Terrible receiver. Nowhere near a 1A.
Catch the ball.
Stinkin Ref
IBL Representative
never said he is great....1A....anything.....homer has nothing to do with it....it wasn't an "atrocious" drop...one of his arms was being pulled down as the ball arrives....
he is an average WR....nothing special....
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Drake Hater
Footballguy
Yeah this has me hoping the Kyler stash pays off.
D-Day
Footballguy
I'm picking the gun
Jacob's Ladder
Footballguy
This team is in trouble this year. Their WRs can't catch. Mahomes did Mahomes things last night but his WRs let him down, again. Does anyone really think this is going to change? Rice may be their best WR but he needs reps. This team may need to spend a first rounder on a WR next season and should aggressively pursue someone like Tee Higgins in FA.
crushedspirit
Footballguy
As another poster smartly pointed out in the game thread, this is circa 2006 when Hoodie left Brady to figure things out with Reche Caldwell being hi
Reid and Veach failed to address it, and the results are obvious. They have a top D and it's going to be wasted by this dreadful decision.
