QB Sam Darnold, SEA (4 Viewers)

[menobrown]

As hes an unknown quantity they still should be able to recoup at least a 2d rder for him

I think if they made him available they would get a top 5 pick in this years draft, surely no worse then a top 10. My guess is he'd be QB1 on most teams boards, not majority, most. Would be my clear cut QB1.

Looked like the real deal in so much as someone can look like the real deal in preseason games. Super young, I think still about a year younger then any first round QB candidate. His injury recover is not expected to be an issue and despite not playing this year having a lot of training camp and being around KOC for a year has probably progressed his development. The only thing IMO that makes his stock lower then it was when he went 10th in a stocked blue chip draft last year was you lose a season of his rookie contract.

What the Vikings do at QB is to me the most interesting storyline of the off-season and how Darnold does these next few weeks will impact a lot of those decisons. We are now at a point we have to start considering what happens if he gets to or wins a SB.

 

[Golden Gopher]

I think the piece that some people are forgetting (or at least not putting enough weight on/into) is the KOC factor. Darnold isn't just winning because KOC helped him progress/develop faster. He's winning because KOC is putting him in a position where he can win. There's a difference between the two, and as we've seen with Cousins, it's not so easy to just take that development and assume it will translate elsewhere. Pretty much every QB that KOC has worked with has a night-and-day better record with KOC than without.... Darnold, Cousins, Dobbs, etc. And, it's not just barely better with KOC. It's significant. Dobbs... 2-2 with KOC, 1-9 elsewhere. Cousins 50-37-1 with KOC, 33-37-1 elsewhere. Darnold 14-2 with KOC, 21-35 elsewhere.

As a MIN fan, I hope they can somehow figure out a way to keep Darnold around, even if it's just for one more year. Not sure what that looks like financially, or if it's truly even possible/realistic. And, if it's not, I wish the best for Sam, no matter how the rest of this season goes. What I would hate to see happen is something like what's happened to Cousins, who went from being a top-ten QB in the NFL to a shell of his former self, losing his job, etc.

The question becomes how much of a discount would Sam be willing to take to stay somewhere where he's proven he can win. Only he can answer that question. But, considering that he's seen some of the absolute lowest of low moments from a top QB prospect's point of view, to now being one of the greatest stories of this NFL season, I would think that he will think long and hard about just how much that is worth. We've all seen that, in most cases, money trumps everything else when it comes to these situations. But, Darnold has seen both sides.... What it's like to win, and what it's like to be considered the biggest of busts. Would he rather play where he can win for $30M versus start over for double that? And, for how long? The length of whatever deal he gets might be what makes the difference. Not sure anybody would take a discount for one year when they can potentially sign elsewhere for 4-5.

No matter what, as a MIN fan or just an NFL fan, it's going to be interesting to watch it all unfold.

 

[VikingFrog]

I think the piece that some people are forgetting (or at least not putting enough weight on/into) is the KOC factor. Darnold isn't just winning because KOC helped him progress/develop faster. He's winning because KOC is putting him in a position where he can win. There's a difference between the two, and as we've seen with Cousins, it's not so easy to just take that development and assume it will translate elsewhere. Pretty much every QB that KOC has worked with has a night-and-day better record with KOC than without.... Darnold, Cousins, Dobbs, etc. And, it's not just barely better with KOC. It's significant. Dobbs... 2-2 with KOC, 1-9 elsewhere. Cousins 50-37-1 with KOC, 33-37-1 elsewhere. Darnold 14-2 with KOC, 21-35 elsewhere.

As a MIN fan, I hope they can somehow figure out a way to keep Darnold around, even if it's just for one more year. Not sure what that looks like financially, or if it's truly even possible/realistic. And, if it's not, I wish the best for Sam, no matter how the rest of this season goes. What I would hate to see happen is something like what's happened to Cousins, who went from being a top-ten QB in the NFL to a shell of his former self, losing his job, etc.

The question becomes how much of a discount would Sam be willing to take to stay somewhere where he's proven he can win. Only he can answer that question. But, considering that he's seen some of the absolute lowest of low moments from a top QB prospect's point of view, to now being one of the greatest stories of this NFL season, I would think that he will think long and hard about just how much that is worth. We've all seen that, in most cases, money trumps everything else when it comes to these situations. But, Darnold has seen both sides.... What it's like to win, and what it's like to be considered the biggest of busts. Would he rather play where he can win for $30M versus start over for double that? And, for how long? The length of whatever deal he gets might be what makes the difference. Not sure anybody would take a discount for one year when they can potentially sign elsewhere for 4-5.

No matter what, as a MIN fan or just an NFL fan, it's going to be interesting to watch it all unfold.

I don’t disagree with your main point, but… This is KOC’s third season… so applying Cousin’s record of 50-37-1 to that is not apples to apples.

 

[Golden Gopher]

I think the piece that some people are forgetting (or at least not putting enough weight on/into) is the KOC factor. Darnold isn't just winning because KOC helped him progress/develop faster. He's winning because KOC is putting him in a position where he can win. There's a difference between the two, and as we've seen with Cousins, it's not so easy to just take that development and assume it will translate elsewhere. Pretty much every QB that KOC has worked with has a night-and-day better record with KOC than without.... Darnold, Cousins, Dobbs, etc. And, it's not just barely better with KOC. It's significant. Dobbs... 2-2 with KOC, 1-9 elsewhere. Cousins 50-37-1 with KOC, 33-37-1 elsewhere. Darnold 14-2 with KOC, 21-35 elsewhere.

As a MIN fan, I hope they can somehow figure out a way to keep Darnold around, even if it's just for one more year. Not sure what that looks like financially, or if it's truly even possible/realistic. And, if it's not, I wish the best for Sam, no matter how the rest of this season goes. What I would hate to see happen is something like what's happened to Cousins, who went from being a top-ten QB in the NFL to a shell of his former self, losing his job, etc.

The question becomes how much of a discount would Sam be willing to take to stay somewhere where he's proven he can win. Only he can answer that question. But, considering that he's seen some of the absolute lowest of low moments from a top QB prospect's point of view, to now being one of the greatest stories of this NFL season, I would think that he will think long and hard about just how much that is worth. We've all seen that, in most cases, money trumps everything else when it comes to these situations. But, Darnold has seen both sides.... What it's like to win, and what it's like to be considered the biggest of busts. Would he rather play where he can win for $30M versus start over for double that? And, for how long? The length of whatever deal he gets might be what makes the difference. Not sure anybody would take a discount for one year when they can potentially sign elsewhere for 4-5.

No matter what, as a MIN fan or just an NFL fan, it's going to be interesting to watch it all unfold.

I don’t disagree with your main point, but… This is KOC’s third season… so applying Cousin’s record of 50-37-1 to that is not apples to apples.

Good point.... What I posted was Cousins' record in MIN. Under KOC, the difference is even more apparent. He was 17-8 with KOC, and I believe exactly .500 (66-66-2) elsewhere (including time spent under Zimmer in MIN).

Breaking it down into percentages....

Cousins .500 elsewhere, almost .680 under KOC.
Darnold .375 elsewhere, almost .900 under KOC.
Dobbs .100 elsewhere, and .500 under KOC.

I will add one more comment that I think is important to factor in. The Vikings' best off-season acquisition, this season or last, has been Brian Flores. By a mile, in my opinion. How much that weighs into the numbers above is hard to say, but it has certainly made an impact in MIN being able to win games that they couldn't quite win in the past. So, it's definitely been a combination of offense and defense. That said, having the right guy running the defense is still part of "KOC putting QB's in a position to win games."

 

[InDitkaWeTrust]

I think the piece that some people are forgetting (or at least not putting enough weight on/into) is the KOC factor. Darnold isn't just winning because KOC helped him progress/develop faster. He's winning because KOC is putting him in a position where he can win. There's a difference between the two, and as we've seen with Cousins, it's not so easy to just take that development and assume it will translate elsewhere. Pretty much every QB that KOC has worked with has a night-and-day better record with KOC than without.... Darnold, Cousins, Dobbs, etc. And, it's not just barely better with KOC. It's significant. Dobbs... 2-2 with KOC, 1-9 elsewhere. Cousins 50-37-1 with KOC, 33-37-1 elsewhere. Darnold 14-2 with KOC, 21-35 elsewhere.

As a MIN fan, I hope they can somehow figure out a way to keep Darnold around, even if it's just for one more year. Not sure what that looks like financially, or if it's truly even possible/realistic. And, if it's not, I wish the best for Sam, no matter how the rest of this season goes. What I would hate to see happen is something like what's happened to Cousins, who went from being a top-ten QB in the NFL to a shell of his former self, losing his job, etc.

The question becomes how much of a discount would Sam be willing to take to stay somewhere where he's proven he can win. Only he can answer that question. But, considering that he's seen some of the absolute lowest of low moments from a top QB prospect's point of view, to now being one of the greatest stories of this NFL season, I would think that he will think long and hard about just how much that is worth. We've all seen that, in most cases, money trumps everything else when it comes to these situations. But, Darnold has seen both sides.... What it's like to win, and what it's like to be considered the biggest of busts. Would he rather play where he can win for $30M versus start over for double that? And, for how long? The length of whatever deal he gets might be what makes the difference. Not sure anybody would take a discount for one year when they can potentially sign elsewhere for 4-5.

No matter what, as a MIN fan or just an NFL fan, it's going to be interesting to watch it all unfold.

I don’t disagree with your main point, but… This is KOC’s third season… so applying Cousin’s record of 50-37-1 to that is not apples to apples.

It's also distinctly purple-colored glasses (No offense, Gopher). If Darnold gets a >40mil/year multi year deal somewhere else, he's going. You don't pass up legacy money to run it back unless you have...legacy money.

 

[VikingFrog]

I think the piece that some people are forgetting (or at least not putting enough weight on/into) is the KOC factor. Darnold isn't just winning because KOC helped him progress/develop faster. He's winning because KOC is putting him in a position where he can win. There's a difference between the two, and as we've seen with Cousins, it's not so easy to just take that development and assume it will translate elsewhere. Pretty much every QB that KOC has worked with has a night-and-day better record with KOC than without.... Darnold, Cousins, Dobbs, etc. And, it's not just barely better with KOC. It's significant. Dobbs... 2-2 with KOC, 1-9 elsewhere. Cousins 50-37-1 with KOC, 33-37-1 elsewhere. Darnold 14-2 with KOC, 21-35 elsewhere.

As a MIN fan, I hope they can somehow figure out a way to keep Darnold around, even if it's just for one more year. Not sure what that looks like financially, or if it's truly even possible/realistic. And, if it's not, I wish the best for Sam, no matter how the rest of this season goes. What I would hate to see happen is something like what's happened to Cousins, who went from being a top-ten QB in the NFL to a shell of his former self, losing his job, etc.

The question becomes how much of a discount would Sam be willing to take to stay somewhere where he's proven he can win. Only he can answer that question. But, considering that he's seen some of the absolute lowest of low moments from a top QB prospect's point of view, to now being one of the greatest stories of this NFL season, I would think that he will think long and hard about just how much that is worth. We've all seen that, in most cases, money trumps everything else when it comes to these situations. But, Darnold has seen both sides.... What it's like to win, and what it's like to be considered the biggest of busts. Would he rather play where he can win for $30M versus start over for double that? And, for how long? The length of whatever deal he gets might be what makes the difference. Not sure anybody would take a discount for one year when they can potentially sign elsewhere for 4-5.

No matter what, as a MIN fan or just an NFL fan, it's going to be interesting to watch it all unfold.

I don’t disagree with your main point, but… This is KOC’s third season… so applying Cousin’s record of 50-37-1 to that is not apples to apples.

It's also distinctly purple-colored glasses (No offense, Gopher). If Darnold gets a >40mil/year multi year deal somewhere else, he's going. You don't pass up legacy money to run it back unless you have...legacy money.

Franchise tag is expected to be about $40M for QBs next year.

I wonder what Kwesi, Darnold, McCarthy and message board members would think about that as an option.

 

[Brunell4MVP]

Feel like you re-sign Sam for 4 years. You can't let a QB that looks this good walk. Then offer up McCarthy on the trade block for a significant return. He's likely better than the #3 QB in the 2025 draft. Maybe someone will give up a couple of mid #1s for him. Imagine adding a couple more #1 picks to this team. If there isn't a good offer, keep McCarthy as medical insurance.

 

[InDitkaWeTrust]

I think the piece that some people are forgetting (or at least not putting enough weight on/into) is the KOC factor. Darnold isn't just winning because KOC helped him progress/develop faster. He's winning because KOC is putting him in a position where he can win. There's a difference between the two, and as we've seen with Cousins, it's not so easy to just take that development and assume it will translate elsewhere. Pretty much every QB that KOC has worked with has a night-and-day better record with KOC than without.... Darnold, Cousins, Dobbs, etc. And, it's not just barely better with KOC. It's significant. Dobbs... 2-2 with KOC, 1-9 elsewhere. Cousins 50-37-1 with KOC, 33-37-1 elsewhere. Darnold 14-2 with KOC, 21-35 elsewhere.

As a MIN fan, I hope they can somehow figure out a way to keep Darnold around, even if it's just for one more year. Not sure what that looks like financially, or if it's truly even possible/realistic. And, if it's not, I wish the best for Sam, no matter how the rest of this season goes. What I would hate to see happen is something like what's happened to Cousins, who went from being a top-ten QB in the NFL to a shell of his former self, losing his job, etc.

The question becomes how much of a discount would Sam be willing to take to stay somewhere where he's proven he can win. Only he can answer that question. But, considering that he's seen some of the absolute lowest of low moments from a top QB prospect's point of view, to now being one of the greatest stories of this NFL season, I would think that he will think long and hard about just how much that is worth. We've all seen that, in most cases, money trumps everything else when it comes to these situations. But, Darnold has seen both sides.... What it's like to win, and what it's like to be considered the biggest of busts. Would he rather play where he can win for $30M versus start over for double that? And, for how long? The length of whatever deal he gets might be what makes the difference. Not sure anybody would take a discount for one year when they can potentially sign elsewhere for 4-5.

No matter what, as a MIN fan or just an NFL fan, it's going to be interesting to watch it all unfold.

I don’t disagree with your main point, but… This is KOC’s third season… so applying Cousin’s record of 50-37-1 to that is not apples to apples.

It's also distinctly purple-colored glasses (No offense, Gopher). If Darnold gets a >40mil/year multi year deal somewhere else, he's going. You don't pass up legacy money to run it back unless you have...legacy money.

Franchise tag is expected to be about $40M for QBs next year.

I wonder what Kwesi, Darnold, McCarthy and message board members would think about that as an option.

That's the front office move, for sure and I don't think Darnold passes it up. I don't know the Vikes cap situation, but $40mil for your starter with a highly talented 2nd year QB backup on a rookie deal seems like a nice place to be. It does make things more interesting for year 3, though. I would think Darnold would want a longer deal in 2026 assuming his production stays high.

 

[Golden Gopher]

I think the piece that some people are forgetting (or at least not putting enough weight on/into) is the KOC factor. Darnold isn't just winning because KOC helped him progress/develop faster. He's winning because KOC is putting him in a position where he can win. There's a difference between the two, and as we've seen with Cousins, it's not so easy to just take that development and assume it will translate elsewhere. Pretty much every QB that KOC has worked with has a night-and-day better record with KOC than without.... Darnold, Cousins, Dobbs, etc. And, it's not just barely better with KOC. It's significant. Dobbs... 2-2 with KOC, 1-9 elsewhere. Cousins 50-37-1 with KOC, 33-37-1 elsewhere. Darnold 14-2 with KOC, 21-35 elsewhere.

As a MIN fan, I hope they can somehow figure out a way to keep Darnold around, even if it's just for one more year. Not sure what that looks like financially, or if it's truly even possible/realistic. And, if it's not, I wish the best for Sam, no matter how the rest of this season goes. What I would hate to see happen is something like what's happened to Cousins, who went from being a top-ten QB in the NFL to a shell of his former self, losing his job, etc.

The question becomes how much of a discount would Sam be willing to take to stay somewhere where he's proven he can win. Only he can answer that question. But, considering that he's seen some of the absolute lowest of low moments from a top QB prospect's point of view, to now being one of the greatest stories of this NFL season, I would think that he will think long and hard about just how much that is worth. We've all seen that, in most cases, money trumps everything else when it comes to these situations. But, Darnold has seen both sides.... What it's like to win, and what it's like to be considered the biggest of busts. Would he rather play where he can win for $30M versus start over for double that? And, for how long? The length of whatever deal he gets might be what makes the difference. Not sure anybody would take a discount for one year when they can potentially sign elsewhere for 4-5.

No matter what, as a MIN fan or just an NFL fan, it's going to be interesting to watch it all unfold.

I don’t disagree with your main point, but… This is KOC’s third season… so applying Cousin’s record of 50-37-1 to that is not apples to apples.

It's also distinctly purple-colored glasses (No offense, Gopher). If Darnold gets a >40mil/year multi year deal somewhere else, he's going. You don't pass up legacy money to run it back unless you have...legacy money.

No offense taken. I just threw those numbers out of nowhere. Obviously, if we're talking $40M for one year to stay in MIN versus $40M+ for 3-5 years to go somewhere else, I would agree that he's leaving. Couldn't blame him for that. So, I guess maybe the better question would be what if MIN can/decides to offer him something longer than a year. 3-5 years at 80% of what he might get elsewhere. To me, that's a no-brainer to stay. But, I get it... it's easy to tell someone else to take a pay cut. And most humans tend to spend within/up to their means. So, asking him to take 20% less would be the equivalent of asking someone making six figures to take $20K less. Not exactly the same, certainly, but it's a big ask, speaking strictly financially.

 

[jobarules]

I don't see how Minn doesn't give him a 4 year extension at 40m a year and then trade JJ. You can't possibly convince me that JJs upside will ever be what Darnold did this year.

 

[Judge Smails]

Darnold and Mayfield are perfect examples of why we shouldn't be so quick to label QB's as busts or as backup journeymen. Young QB's in bad situations are no bueno. Coaches, systems and line play matter. Put them in a good situation and all of a sudden they are franchise QB's. Darnold deserves to get paid. $40M a year sounds right.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

Boy, looking at top 10 contracts, which he just may have earned, that's $50m+/year. Someone may pay him that but I'm less sure now that that's the Vikings.

 

[VikingFrog]

Boy, looking at top 10 contracts, which he just may have earned, that's $50m+/year. Someone may pay him that but I'm less sure now that that's the Vikings.

If you franchise tag him for $40m and someone REALLY wants to pay him, you can get two first rounders and keep McCarthy.

It’s a win win win.

 

[Deamon]

Darnold and Mayfield are perfect examples of why we shouldn't be so quick to label QB's as busts or as backup journeymen. Young QB's in bad situations are no bueno. Coaches, systems and line play matter. Put them in a good situation and all of a sudden they are franchise QB's. Darnold deserves to get paid. $40M a year sounds right.

On the flip side, QBs in great situations are also amped up a bit. Darnold sees this type of success on maybe 5 teams in the league. If Minny decides to let him go, there's a good chance he ends up in a inferior situation and is back to average.

 

[BINGBING]

So now that J.J. McCarthy is out for the year, what do we think? Darnold has never been good, but he's never been in a decent situation either. MIN has great receivers and solid coaching. I'm thinking strong QB2, but maybe late QB1. But I have no idea.

I wouldn't say Darnold has never had a DECENT situation. He an ok OL, CMC, and DJ Moore in Carolina. The current Vikings are probably better than that, especially when Hockenson gets back, but its not like Darnold's whole career was just terrible supporting casts.

HC is a big part of the supporting cast.

That's where Darnold really started behind the 8-Ball. I like Todd Bowles but his staff was bad with the Jets. OC Jeremey Bates has been out of the league since 2018. Then Adam Gase followed by Matt Ruhl. Those are HCs, and the most important parts of their offensive coaching staff (Ben MacAdoo was Darnold's OC at one point) who were woefully in over their head.

At this point, I don't see much hope for Darnold suddenly turning it around because I think he is probably broken mentally. But I have learned not to doubt Kevin O'Connell's ability to get the most out of a QB. It would be a bummer if Addison misses time but with JJ as the WR1 you don't need much more to be successful as a QB.

thats the thing. playing under a bad coach can sometimes break a player. QB is tough enough as it is without having to deal with that.

future coaches likely have to make him unlearn all the stuff he learned in that bad situation. not an easy task.

his success is by no means a guarantee. but if he was to turn it around, this is the place to do it. its here, or never.

Thats true and that's very apparent. Some of my hope and faith is pinned on him having spent a year in Shanhanan's room. Remember before last year there seemed to be quite a bit of smoke they wanted him to start and if Purdy didn't start hot he might well have gotten in the rotation last year.

The Vikes knew they had they had the 5 pick and still went out and got Darnold.

This gets even more interesting when you consider that once Hock is back Darnold will have weapons that will be a lite version of the Niners talent.

JJ > Aiyuk By a good margin

Addison < Deebo, but it's much closer than what current ranking show when it becomes obvious Addison won't be suspended.

Hock = Kittle

Aaron Jones < CMC by a good margin

I was ridiculed by this take. Hock coming off injury doesn't equal Kittle, but I was soft on just how much help Darnold had around him. I failed to mention the injury history of the 49ers skill position players, which did weigh in to my take at the time. I've had enough of them on my rosters to know their health isn't a sure thing.

That being said, in a dynasty league where I already had Lamar, Herbert, and Love, I sold Darnold early in the season for the 2025 1.03 and Xavier Worthy. I got Darnold for free in offseason waivers (along with Dowdle and Jonnu) and won the league back-to-back.

 

[3 hour lunch]

I get the vibe from him that he served his time in worse situations and is really happy here. I think he would take less to stay. Not insanely less, but…..

 

[Uncle Leo]

I get the vibe from him that he served his time in worse situations and is really happy here. I think he would take less to stay. Not insanely less, but…..

That’s great. Giants should see if JJ McCarthy is available then. Not sure they would do that, but someone needs to try. That kid can play and we saw a bit during preseason prior to the injury.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Darnold and Mayfield are perfect examples of why we shouldn't be so quick to label QB's as busts or as backup journeymen. Young QB's in bad situations are no bueno. Coaches, systems and line play matter. Put them in a good situation and all of a sudden they are franchise QB's. Darnold deserves to get paid. $40M a year sounds right.

Agreed. Guys like Darnold and Mayfield were drafted super high for a reason, and sometimes you just need the right team and coaching staff to get them to realize their full potential.

 

[nyg350]

I get the vibe from him that he served his time in worse situations and is really happy here. I think he would take less to stay. Not insanely less, but…..

That’s great. Giants should see if JJ McCarthy is available then. Not sure they would do that, but someone needs to try. That kid can play and we saw a bit during preseason prior to the injury.

What does it take for the giants to get him? I see some people saying a second. I don't think Minnesota takes that. I see some people saying he would be the best qb if he was in this draft class and some people saying Minnesota would only get a second for him. That doesn't seem to jive to me.

Would this year's second plus next year's second do it? If so, I would do that.

This years first, which should be top 5. If you have him as the best qb if he was in THIS draft class, that makes sense and I imagine Minnesota jumps all over that if they sign Darnold long term. Imagine adding another elite talent to this team?

 

[Andy Dufresne]

Very doubtful the Vikings would take a 2nd for JJM. Better to just keep him on the roster.

 

[IHEARTFF]

I get the vibe from him that he served his time in worse situations and is really happy here. I think he would take less to stay. Not insanely less, but…..

That’s great. Giants should see if JJ McCarthy is available then. Not sure they would do that, but someone needs to try. That kid can play and we saw a bit during preseason prior to the injury.

What does it take for the giants to get him? I see some people saying a second. I don't think Minnesota takes that. I see some people saying he would be the best qb if he was in this draft class and some people saying Minnesota would only get a second for him. That doesn't seem to jive to me.

Would this year's second plus next year's second do it? If so, I would do that.

This years first, which should be top 5. If you have him as the best qb if he was in THIS draft class, that makes sense and I imagine Minnesota jumps all over that if they sign Darnold long term. Imagine adding another elite talent to this team?

Probably like 1.05 for JJM and Vikes late 2nd

 

[Andy Dufresne]

If the Vikings could get Travis Hunter for JJM, I think they'd have to consider it.

 

[Donnybrook]

Call me crazy but I wonder if San Fran is the team that could have an interest in Darnold. Maybe Purdy's less than inspiring play yesterday may have something to do with it. Purdy is under contract for 2025 so they are in unique position that they could pivot to Darnold. I guess that seems disloyal but LA Rams traded Goff after his less than impressive super bowl run.

For Darnold, he goes back to Cali and to a team that is a contender.

 

[King of the Jungle]

Call me crazy but I wonder if San Fran is the team that could have an interest in Darnold. Maybe Purdy's less than inspiring play yesterday may have something to do with it. Purdy is under contract for 2025 so they are in unique position that they could pivot to Darnold. I guess that seems disloyal but LA Rams traded Goff after his less than impressive super bowl run.

For Darnold, he goes back to Cali and to a team that is a contender.

Not crazy at all since Shanny has familiarity with Darnold. I think SF makes Purdy prove it next year versus replacing him however.

 

[Chemical X]

I get the vibe from him that he served his time in worse situations and is really happy here. I think he would take less to stay. Not insanely less, but…..

That’s great. Giants should see if JJ McCarthy is available then. Not sure they would do that, but someone needs to try. That kid can play and we saw a bit during preseason prior to the injury.

What does it take for the giants to get him? I see some people saying a second. I don't think Minnesota takes that. I see some people saying he would be the best qb if he was in this draft class and some people saying Minnesota would only get a second for him. That doesn't seem to jive to me.

Would this year's second plus next year's second do it? If so, I would do that.

This years first, which should be top 5. If you have him as the best qb if he was in THIS draft class, that makes sense and I imagine Minnesota jumps all over that if they sign Darnold long term. Imagine adding another elite talent to this team?

as a ny jet fan, darnold is an interesting study for me. i remember his jet time not fondly, but i went back to watch some games and check drafts. the big failing here, as always, was the nyj inability to find anything remotely decent in the drafts of 2019 and 2020 to help darnold. those drafts are a microcosm of why this team has been so poor for so long. they always miss in round 1, 2022 being an outlier (i figure someone drafted for douglas). the 2019 version of darnold was functional. he was 7-6 and completed about 60%, but the roster was bereft of offensive talent. somehow in the 3 games he missed the jets played someone named luke falk at qb and went 0-3. he stunk with carolina and sf preferred purdy. i wonder if he has matured or playing in a dome with guys like jefferson, hockenson, jones has jumped him forward. he still has thrown a pick in 9 games this year. i wonder if he is having a geno type year with UFA coming up. my opinion, somewhat biased, is that someone will sign him for 3/100 or so and ask him to do too much and the regression will return.

he was awful in 2020, but the team was awful. but he could’ve elevated the team somehow. in retrospect, if the nyj stuck with him, drafted decently in 2021 and then had the 2022 draft, what would darnold have become? of course i don’t thin gase and saleh are bringing the best out of anyone however…….

 

[King of the Jungle]

Darnold is a talented enough quarterback to succeed with the right surroundings. I do not have confidence in him doing so without those conditions. It will be fascinating to see how MIN handles this in the offseason.

 

[Donnybrook]

Call me crazy but I wonder if San Fran is the team that could have an interest in Darnold. Maybe Purdy's less than inspiring play yesterday may have something to do with it. Purdy is under contract for 2025 so they are in unique position that they could pivot to Darnold. I guess that seems disloyal but LA Rams traded Goff after his less than impressive super bowl run.

For Darnold, he goes back to Cali and to a team that is a contender.

Not crazy at all since Shanny has familiarity with Darnold. I think SF makes Purdy prove it next year versus replacing him however.

Well Darnold will sign long term somewhere so there is no next year. Purdy should probably hold out rather than play his final year on his rookie contract.

 

[nyg350]

Darnold is a talented enough quarterback to succeed with the right surroundings. I do not have confidence in him doing so without those conditions. It will be fascinating to see how MIN handles this in the offseason.

Agreed. He has the talent and seems to be a good study to succeed in the right situation. However, he seems to be able to step up in the right situation as well, which not everyone can do. 14-2 and a shot at the number 1 seed is not only situation lifting him up, but also him maximizing the situation.

Someone else mentioned SF and I think that would work. I do think out of potential landing spots, staying with MIN and SF would lead him to continued success. If McVay wanted him, I could see that working out as well.

For his sake, I hope he doesn't just go for the most money this contract and picks a good situation for him. This will likely lead him to making more money long term even if he gives up a good chunk of change this offseason. He has to know continued success will lead to more money in future contracts as well as endorsements. He is only 27. If successful, this will not be his last big contract. If he is paid a lot and fails, it will likely be his last big contract.

After he has had failure, which was in large part due to a poor situation, I think he is more likely than other FAs to not just go for the most money, but to take his chance of success into account when choosing a destination.

 

[IHEARTFF]

Vikings should stick with him and give him a 3 year 135 type deal if he’ll stay which he should. They may decide to just pivot to JJM and save the $ for other FAs. In which case his options are not ideal. I think he needs to land with a good offensive coach and talent for him to succeed. Maybe Stafford hangs em up?

 

[VikingFrog]

Call me crazy but I wonder if San Fran is the team that could have an interest in Darnold. Maybe Purdy's less than inspiring play yesterday may have something to do with it. Purdy is under contract for 2025 so they are in unique position that they could pivot to Darnold. I guess that seems disloyal but LA Rams traded Goff after his less than impressive super bowl run.

For Darnold, he goes back to Cali and to a team that is a contender.

Not crazy at all since Shanny has familiarity with Darnold. I think SF makes Purdy prove it next year versus replacing him however.

If I’m Purdy making scraps… no way I walk on that field next year if I’m not extended. Even if you don’t believe he’s great, he’s good enough to be making more than the bare minimum at a position that is so highly valued.

 

[King of the Jungle]

Call me crazy but I wonder if San Fran is the team that could have an interest in Darnold. Maybe Purdy's less than inspiring play yesterday may have something to do with it. Purdy is under contract for 2025 so they are in unique position that they could pivot to Darnold. I guess that seems disloyal but LA Rams traded Goff after his less than impressive super bowl run.

For Darnold, he goes back to Cali and to a team that is a contender.

Not crazy at all since Shanny has familiarity with Darnold. I think SF makes Purdy prove it next year versus replacing him however.

If I’m Purdy making scraps… no way I walk on that field next year if I’m not extended. Even if you don’t believe he’s great, he’s good enough to be making more than the bare minimum at a position that is so highly valued.

Understand that standpoint, however he is under contract. It will be interesting to see how it will be handled.

 

[Gally]

I think the piece that some people are forgetting (or at least not putting enough weight on/into) is the KOC factor. Darnold isn't just winning because KOC helped him progress/develop faster. He's winning because KOC is putting him in a position where he can win. There's a difference between the two, and as we've seen with Cousins, it's not so easy to just take that development and assume it will translate elsewhere. Pretty much every QB that KOC has worked with has a night-and-day better record with KOC than without.... Darnold, Cousins, Dobbs, etc. And, it's not just barely better with KOC. It's significant. Dobbs... 2-2 with KOC, 1-9 elsewhere. Cousins 50-37-1 with KOC, 33-37-1 elsewhere. Darnold 14-2 with KOC, 21-35 elsewhere.

As a MIN fan, I hope they can somehow figure out a way to keep Darnold around, even if it's just for one more year. Not sure what that looks like financially, or if it's truly even possible/realistic. And, if it's not, I wish the best for Sam, no matter how the rest of this season goes. What I would hate to see happen is something like what's happened to Cousins, who went from being a top-ten QB in the NFL to a shell of his former self, losing his job, etc.

The question becomes how much of a discount would Sam be willing to take to stay somewhere where he's proven he can win. Only he can answer that question. But, considering that he's seen some of the absolute lowest of low moments from a top QB prospect's point of view, to now being one of the greatest stories of this NFL season, I would think that he will think long and hard about just how much that is worth. We've all seen that, in most cases, money trumps everything else when it comes to these situations. But, Darnold has seen both sides.... What it's like to win, and what it's like to be considered the biggest of busts. Would he rather play where he can win for $30M versus start over for double that? And, for how long? The length of whatever deal he gets might be what makes the difference. Not sure anybody would take a discount for one year when they can potentially sign elsewhere for 4-5.

No matter what, as a MIN fan or just an NFL fan, it's going to be interesting to watch it all unfold.

I don’t disagree with your main point, but… This is KOC’s third season… so applying Cousin’s record of 50-37-1 to that is not apples to apples.

It's also distinctly purple-colored glasses (No offense, Gopher). If Darnold gets a >40mil/year multi year deal somewhere else, he's going. You don't pass up legacy money to run it back unless you have...legacy money.

Franchise tag is expected to be about $40M for QBs next year.

I wonder what Kwesi, Darnold, McCarthy and message board members would think about that as an option.

To me this is the smartest decision for the Vikings. This was a wasted year for JJM. They still don't really know what they got in him even if he showed promise in his one pre-season game. They signed Darnold going into this year as a bridge guy to JJM. Why not run that plan back another year and decide from there? Great spot for Darnold. He can prove that this year wasn't a fluke. Vikes get to bring JJM back slowly and see what they have while making sure the injury doesn't have any long term affects. Then re-visit next year.

If it's me in the front office this is what I am doing (unless Darnold is willing to take a discount to stay long term).

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Hope he is going to be picky where he goes to avoid another garbage fire organization like New York.

I have no doubt that experience shaped him.

Vikings should stick with him and give him a 3 year 135 type deal if he’ll stay which he should. They may decide to just pivot to JJM and save the $ for other FAs. In which case his options are not ideal. I think he needs to land with a good offensive coach and talent for him to succeed. Maybe Stafford hangs em up?

Rams are almost a perfect landing spot for him.

 

[Golden Gopher]

I think the piece that some people are forgetting (or at least not putting enough weight on/into) is the KOC factor. Darnold isn't just winning because KOC helped him progress/develop faster. He's winning because KOC is putting him in a position where he can win. There's a difference between the two, and as we've seen with Cousins, it's not so easy to just take that development and assume it will translate elsewhere. Pretty much every QB that KOC has worked with has a night-and-day better record with KOC than without.... Darnold, Cousins, Dobbs, etc. And, it's not just barely better with KOC. It's significant. Dobbs... 2-2 with KOC, 1-9 elsewhere. Cousins 50-37-1 with KOC, 33-37-1 elsewhere. Darnold 14-2 with KOC, 21-35 elsewhere.

As a MIN fan, I hope they can somehow figure out a way to keep Darnold around, even if it's just for one more year. Not sure what that looks like financially, or if it's truly even possible/realistic. And, if it's not, I wish the best for Sam, no matter how the rest of this season goes. What I would hate to see happen is something like what's happened to Cousins, who went from being a top-ten QB in the NFL to a shell of his former self, losing his job, etc.

The question becomes how much of a discount would Sam be willing to take to stay somewhere where he's proven he can win. Only he can answer that question. But, considering that he's seen some of the absolute lowest of low moments from a top QB prospect's point of view, to now being one of the greatest stories of this NFL season, I would think that he will think long and hard about just how much that is worth. We've all seen that, in most cases, money trumps everything else when it comes to these situations. But, Darnold has seen both sides.... What it's like to win, and what it's like to be considered the biggest of busts. Would he rather play where he can win for $30M versus start over for double that? And, for how long? The length of whatever deal he gets might be what makes the difference. Not sure anybody would take a discount for one year when they can potentially sign elsewhere for 4-5.

No matter what, as a MIN fan or just an NFL fan, it's going to be interesting to watch it all unfold.

I don’t disagree with your main point, but… This is KOC’s third season… so applying Cousin’s record of 50-37-1 to that is not apples to apples.

It's also distinctly purple-colored glasses (No offense, Gopher). If Darnold gets a >40mil/year multi year deal somewhere else, he's going. You don't pass up legacy money to run it back unless you have...legacy money.

Franchise tag is expected to be about $40M for QBs next year.

I wonder what Kwesi, Darnold, McCarthy and message board members would think about that as an option.

To me this is the smartest decision for the Vikings. This was a wasted year for JJM. They still don't really know what they got in him even if he showed promise in his one pre-season game. They signed Darnold going into this year as a bridge guy to JJM. Why not run that plan back another year and decide from there? Great spot for Darnold. He can prove that this year wasn't a fluke. Vikes get to bring JJM back slowly and see what they have while making sure the injury doesn't have any long term affects. Then re-visit next year.

If it's me in the front office this is what I am doing (unless Darnold is willing to take a discount to stay long term).

Agreed. The other option would be to trade one of them. Which wouldn't be terrible for the Vikings. If they could sign Sam to a longer deal and get a pick (or picks) for McCarthy, that seems like a no-brainer as well.

 

[MAC_32]

Very doubtful the Vikings would take a 2nd for JJM. Better to just keep him on the roster.

They should be able to recoup most of the purchase price, something I implore the Browns to pursue unless they're going full blown reset in '25 and trading Myles.

 

[sheerterror]

I get the vibe from him that he served his time in worse situations and is really happy here. I think he would take less to stay. Not insanely less, but…..

That’s great. Giants should see if JJ McCarthy is available then. Not sure they would do that, but someone needs to try. That kid can play and we saw a bit during preseason prior to the injury.

What does it take for the giants to get him? I see some people saying a second. I don't think Minnesota takes that. I see some people saying he would be the best qb if he was in this draft class and some people saying Minnesota would only get a second for him. That doesn't seem to jive to me.

Would this year's second plus next year's second do it? If so, I would do that.

This years first, which should be top 5. If you have him as the best qb if he was in THIS draft class, that makes sense and I imagine Minnesota jumps all over that if they sign Darnold long term. Imagine adding another elite talent to this team?

I think whoever is saying a second for him is a delusional Giants fan who plays too much fantasy football (and I'd say this about a Jet fans (as one) if they thought the same thing). I said in the NYJ thread they can have our top 10 pick for him in a heartbeat.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Very doubtful the Vikings would take a 2nd for JJM. Better to just keep him on the roster.

They should be able to recoup most of the purchase price, something I implore the Browns to pursue unless they're going full blown reset in '25 and trading Myles.

They should be able to get a profit on him considering how good he looked in that preseason game.

He tore a ligament, he didn’t have his leg amputated.

I still believe there’s a strong possibility that they let Darnold walk and take advantage of JJM’s rookie contract.

You can get an awful lot of talent around him for what Darnold’s franchise $ will be. And they already have a ton of talent.

 

[MAC_32]

Very doubtful the Vikings would take a 2nd for JJM. Better to just keep him on the roster.

They should be able to recoup most of the purchase price, something I implore the Browns to pursue unless they're going full blown reset in '25 and trading Myles.

They should be able to get a profit on him considering how good he looked in that preseason game.

He tore a ligament, he didn’t have his leg amputated.

I still believe there’s a strong possibility that they let Darnold walk and take advantage of JJM’s rookie contract.

You can get an awful lot of talent around him for what Darnold’s franchise $ will be. And they already have a ton of talent.

A lot of NFL teams are run very poorly so you may be right, but it doesn't change how laughably stupid it'd be if the price went up based on part of a preseason game

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

A lot of NFL teams are run very poorly so you may be right, but it doesn't change how laughably stupid it'd be if the price went up based on part of a preseason game

He was a high 1st.

Why would they get anything less after he showed out well in the preseason?

I don’t see them moving him so this is all a moot point regardless.

 

[menobrown]

A lot of NFL teams are run very poorly so you may be right, but it doesn't change how laughably stupid it'd be if the price went up based on part of a preseason game

He was a high 1st.

Why would they get anything less after he showed out well in the preseason?

I don’t see them moving him so this is all a moot point regardless.

Agree with 100% of everything you are saying.

I think he'd draw back two decent first, a top 5 overall pick-as high as 1.1. It has close to zero with how he did in the preseason game.

I'm not expecting we will find out. But I do think if Vikings make the SB things get more interesting as it becomes that much more difficult to let Darnold walk. If it does end up they extend Darnold on a contract that really locks him in for a least the next 2 years, especially if he requests any type of no-trade provisions, I think the return the Vikings could get for JJ combined with KOC's abilty to groom QB's might be to hard to resist. This draft class is perfect timing for the Vikings if they get to point of moving JJ. So not expecting it, but believe it should not be ruled out yet.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

This draft class is perfect timing for the Vikings if they get to point of moving JJ

Yeah that’s absolutely part of the equation - most of the viable QBs came out last year.

This is expected to be a bad QB class, helping JJM’s value.

Also IIRC he didn’t play part of a good game - he played the entire game, and played at an extremely high level making difficult throws - accurate and with touch. Had a nice deep ball, too.

The injury report about his knee came out a couple of days later.

 

[menobrown]

This is expected to be a bad QB class, helping JJM’s value.

To highlight this:

x.com

x.com

@BrettKollmann

22h


Could very easily argue that QB1 this year would have been QB7 last year

@dpbrugler

Yep, easily. At best, QB4 last year for a few teams, but much more likely closer to QB7 for most teams.

 

[rockaction]

If im the Jets I would consider that....

If I’m the Jets I give my first round pick. The Vikings would want nothing less.

In fact, he might bring more than the current 1.07.

I’d do it. I like McCarthy.

 

[BigJim®]

As well as Darnold has played, I’d oppose any plan that trades JJM. I’m just glad we get to see how 2024 season concludes - good or bad - before the front office has to do anything at all.

 

[FarFromHome]

Just noticed he was only 27. Surprised me.

 

[Donnybrook]

Honestly thought JJ McCarthey was #2 QB in the 2024 draft. Second only to this years OROY. I wouldn't trade him straight across for Travis Hunter. I would not trade him period.

Love what Sam Darnold has done this year but to me he is no different than 2017 Alex Smith on the Chiefs.

It feels like bad karma to franchise and trade him but Vikings should take solace that did right by him this season.

 

[Kiddnets]

Honestly thought JJ McCarthey was #2 QB in the 2024 draft. Second only to this years OROY. I wouldn't trade him straight across for Travis Hunter. I would not trade him period.

Love what Sam Darnold has done this year but to me he is no different than 2017 Alex Smith on the Chiefs.

It feels like bad karma to franchise and trade him but Vikings should take solace that did right by him this season.

its definitely a good problem to have - but this isnt a aging QB with Darnold - he could be their QB #1 for over a decade. This draft would prob be the max value they could get for McCarthy combining draft value, contract and mystery. If Minny wants to go with Darnold now would be the time to cash in IMO.

If Darnold leads them to NFCCG I just dont see how they can move on from him - obviously they can franchise - Sam doesnt seem like the type that would be too upset at it as the tag is likel as much $ as hes made in his entire career - but agent will be whispering for him to cash in so never know.,

Will be a fascinating offseason story

 

[Faust]

Sam Darnold's Evolution This Season, Winning Tight Games, Keys To Winning Sunday Night vs. Lions | X's and O's with Kevin O'Connell

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Clicks on topic hesitantly, wondering if anyone’s talking bad about my boo.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Honestly thought JJ McCarthey was #2 QB in the 2024 draft. Second only to this years OROY. I wouldn't trade him straight across for Travis Hunter. I would not trade him period.

Love what Sam Darnold has done this year but to me he is no different than 2017 Alex Smith on the Chiefs.

It feels like bad karma to franchise and trade him but Vikings should take solace that did right by him this season.

Added to this JJM looked fantastic in the game he got hurt in.

And played through it.

He threw to all levels of the field & IIRC unleashed a bomb to JJ for a TD.

Vikes would be foolish not to franchise & trade Darnold. If they wanna do him a solid, they can let him go to FA.

But JJM should be their future. He’s solid and he’s inexpensive. It’s why you draft a rookie QB.